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Author Topic: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army  (Read 3060 times)

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Offline Lord of Winter and War

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1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« on: September 5, 2010, 11:32:09 AM »
So, going to be in a tournament soon enough. I have sent in my list already to the Tourny head's, but I guess I have until the 10th to possibly change it.

HQ (345

Chaos Lord-190
-Mark of Slaanesh, Steed of Slaanesh, Plasma Pistol, Meltabomb, Blissgiver, Icon.

Daemon Prince-155
Mark of Slaanesh, Wings, lash of submission

Troops

Chaos Marines-225
X10
X1 meltaguns
X1 Lascannon
Icon of chaos glory
Rhino

Chaos Marines-225
X10
X1 meltaguns
X1 Lascannon
Icon of chaos glory
Rhino

Chaos Daemons-91
X7

Chaos Daemons-91
x7

Fast Attack

Chaos Spawn-120
X3
Chaos Spawn-120
x3
Chaos Spawn-120
x3
Chaos Spawn-120
x3
Chaos Spawn-80
x2
Chaos Spawn-80
X2

Heavy Support

Obliterators-225
X3

My plan is to send the spawn, prince and lord forward to get stuck in, summon daemons off the Lord. The marines will sit back in their rhinos and snipe with the lascannons, to claim objectives later on, or just be hard to kill, while the obliterators give fire support.

Not fully sure how it'd do, but should be fun either way.

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Edit, I am thinking of changing my list to the following, in order to add in more spawn.


Codex Chaos Space Marines

HQ

Chaos Lord-190
Mark of Slaanesh
Steed of Slaanesh
Plasma Pistol
Meltabomb
Blissgiver Daemon Weapon
Personal Icon

Daemon Prince-155
Mark of Slaanesh
Wings
Lash of submission

Troops (632

Chaos Marines-220
X10 marines-
X1 flamer
X1 Lascannon
Icon of chaos glory
Rhino

Chaos Marines-220
X10 marines-
X1 flamer
X1 Lascannon
Icon of chaos glory
Rhino

Fast Attack (840)
Spawn-120
X3
Spawn-120
X3
Spawn-120
X3
Spawn-120
x3
Spawn-120
X3
Spawn-120
X3
Spawn-120
X3

Heavy Support (225)

Obliterators-225
X3
« Last Edit: September 5, 2010, 06:08:54 PM by Killersquid »
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Offline Khulric

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #1 on: September 6, 2010, 06:22:13 AM »
I really don't know what to say in regards to how this list will work out, as I have never used spawn in the recent 'dex.

However, I am very interested to see how it plays out, please let us know.

Also, I don't have the book on me at the moment.  I'm sure you've already given the thought of using special weapons on your marine squads instead of the lascannon.  I would still consider using meltaguns (they haven't disappointed over the last 7-8 years), and sending the rhinos on the outskirts of your main assault force.

I just see the only rear guard firebase that you need is the obliterators.  The spawn will be a fun and wonderful distraction.  the marines are best at medium to close range, as opposed to long range sniping (using one guy out of 11 models seems a waste to me).



Either way, other than my random rambling at the end, I still would like to hear how the tournament goes.  Also, do you have 16 spawn assembled and painted?

Offline Lord of Winter and War

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #2 on: September 6, 2010, 10:08:04 AM »
I am leaning towards the second list, which has flamers as I was over by ten points. However, if I drop the personal Icon off the Lord (Which becomes useless) and the meltabombs I'll have enough to upgrade both the squads flamers to meltaguns. But, your suggesting I use no lascannons, and just duel special weapons? My main concern was a lack of long ranged fire, which additional lascannons can help with. Though, I can see the benefits of keeping the force together. I might as well do that.

I have 19 spawn finished, and I have another six I am finishing up now. Only six are of the plastic set, the others are all conversions I made off varying things and spare parts.

So, edited list.
« Last Edit: September 6, 2010, 10:41:16 AM by Killersquid »
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Offline Khulric

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #3 on: September 6, 2010, 10:19:48 AM »
Obliterators, if deployed on table in the rear, as opposed to DS, will be able to harass enemy armour well enough for your short ranged anti armour to do its job.  If not, then I suppose you can stab me later for it.

Lascannons in squads may not be bad, but you would be, in my eyes, wasting two full mounted marine squads for most of the game.  If you want a couple of units to pop out of nowhere to claim objectives, then I would recommend lesser daemons, which you have taken in the first list.  Troops are never underrated.


Offline Wyrmnax

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #4 on: September 6, 2010, 10:23:09 AM »
Ok... since these are tourney lists i will pick them apart. Both of the lists have the same problems.

1st off, why the lord? He costs more than a DP, and does less.

- Heavy weapons on chaos marines are bad. Like, really bad. Chaos marines are good at rapid fire range and on CC. HEavy weapons means that you are either wasting 9 bolters or wasting the heavy weapon. The only Heavy weapons that might be justifiable are the ones who have the same targets as bolter - AKA: Heavy bolter, maybe autocannon or missile launcher. Even then, Chaos Marines do not outshoot other marines, but they out CC them.

- Mixing lascannons with flamers is the pinnacle of making sure one of the weapons you are carrying useless against whatever you are shooting at.

- 2 Troop choices on a 1850 points game. Dont expect to have any troop left at the end of a objective game. The Demons cant claim objectives if i remember correctly ( Dont have the book with me @ work)

- Way too many KPs. And the demons, spawns and Rhinos are really easy to get. They will hurt you a lot on KP missions.

Offline Khulric

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #5 on: September 6, 2010, 10:30:10 AM »
The lesser daemons can infact claim objectives.  That's one of the good uses of those hidden gems, they are ninjas, ables to DS and act without restriction (for the most part) that turn.

I understand his list is a tournament one, but it is different than the norm, and has a bit of flavor to it, something to be respected, as long as he knows what he is doing, and since KS has been here longer than I have, I'm sure he has an idea.

On a note of the Lord, I like it.  I am shifting towards using Lords over the other two options. They may not be as killy as a Prince, but they are an independant character that are very killy themselves (especially a Blissgiver, I've toyed around with using one lately).  I just noticed that the Lord is mounted, now I cannot remember if that blocks him from joining with the regular marines, but as an independant, I would push the idea of him joining a squad pretty hard.  Ablative wounds are never frowned upon with Chaos.


Offline Lord of Winter and War

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #6 on: September 6, 2010, 10:44:44 AM »
The lord is mounted so he can join with a unit of spawn, steed means he moves as calvary. Blissgiver means that tyranids, characters, and Ork Nobs will die really quickly to him. I figure the chaos spawn could use the extra punch, and they need a character who is calvary to keep up with them.

I am not too concerned about having only two troops. If my opponent is shooting the troops, hes not worrying about the hordes of spawn barreling down on him. I can always keep the Rhinos in reserve anyway.

I posted an edited list back in my last post. Re-thinking about the Lesser Daemons, as opposed to spawn, however It's far easier to paint the six spawn I need to do right now, then re-paint the fourteen lesser Daemons. Also, never assume I know what I am doing.

Here is what I am thinking now.

HQ (340

Chaos Lord-185
Mark of Slaanesh
Steed of Slaanesh
Plasma Pistol
Meltabomb
Blissgiver, Daemon Weapon


Daemon Prince-155
Mark of Slaanesh
Wings
Lash of submission

Troops (440

Chaos Marines-230
X10 marines
X1 meltagun
X1 flamer
Icon of Slaanesh
Rhino

Chaos Marines-230
X10 marines
X1 meltagun
X1 flamer
Icon of Slaanesh
Rhino


Fast Attack (840)

Chaos Spawn-120
X3
Chaos Spawn-120
x3
Chaos Spawn-120
x3
Chaos Spawn-120
X3
Chaos Spawn-120
x3
Chaos Spawn-120
x3
Chaos Spawn-120
x3

Heavy Support (225)

Obliterators-225
X3


I can keep the rhinos behind the spawn for possible cover (maybe), Prince lures things towards the spawn/lord, Lord/spawn charge things and kill them. I've found that spawn are not the easiest thing to kill in the past few games I've use with them. Especially in large numbers. Also thinking of maybe dropping a unit of spawn and adding a vindicator or something like that, or a dreadnaught, or I guess lesser Daemons again.

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Offline Khulric

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #7 on: September 6, 2010, 11:08:04 AM »
I support the idea of dropping one unit of spawn for some variety. 

Do you have any defilers?  Well that might be out of the price range, but it can still 'run with the pack' so to speak, while providing support fire.  So one big super/mechanical spawn with three units of regular spawn on each side, supported by rhinos to the rear or flanks would be an intimidating line.  Oh and the obliterators doing...whatever it is that they do.

Offline Lord of Winter and War

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #8 on: September 6, 2010, 11:14:03 AM »
I don't have a Defiler anymore, but I could always go out and purchase one, however it is quite expensive. The event is on the 18/19th, so I'll need to be able to finish everything quite. Also, armylists are due on the 10th.
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Offline Khulric

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #9 on: September 6, 2010, 12:49:25 PM »
Well I wouldn't tell you to go out and purchase a model.  What options do you have available to you?

Offline Lord of Winter and War

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #10 on: September 6, 2010, 02:24:30 PM »
I have a third Rhino I could convert into a Vindicator, a dread or two I can convert up, A whole bunch of lesser Daemons. I could also give the marine squads champions with power weapons of some variety.

As spawn are really able to deal with a huge variety of opponents, I do feel that having a lot of them wont hurt. What I have right now is 63 wounds of Toughness 5 gribbly, that all have D6 attacks and move as calvary.

I think what I might do is one of the three.

1. Keep the list as it is.
2. Drop two marines and the flamers from the marines squads, drop one squad of spawn, add Personal Icon to lord, add a unit of 13 lesser Daemons (or two units of 6)
3.Drop a unit of spawn, and maybe a couple of marines/flamers to get a Demonically possessed Vindicator.

My chaos collection is in terrible shape, and I am in the process of re-building most of it. Thus, A lot of what would actually be a good idea to add, may take too much time to get ready.
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Offline Khulric

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #11 on: September 6, 2010, 02:38:40 PM »
Well, depending on how confident you are in keeping your troops alive for objective matches (it definitely looks as though you can contest and at least draw easily enough), then I would consider converting a Vindicator.

I have never used a vindicator, I used to never use vehicles (Alpha Legion and their infiltrate), but you could use the heavy hitting template that a DP Vindicator will bring for you.

Offline enlg

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #12 on: September 6, 2010, 02:59:16 PM »
I might drop 3 spawn and purchase/convert 2 more obliterators and give the rhinos havoc launchers and give the squads lascannon/plasma gun. I think the greater range of the plasma gun and its ability to compliment the lascannon's anti-tank (against transports/light vehicles) and high strength and low ap would be the best choice for the troop squads.

also, I think I noticed how your lord was modeled with a plasma pistol, looks nice, but according to the spawn rules don't they NEED to move as far towards enemies as possible? Does that not mean that they must run in the shooting phase, making your lord unable to fire his gun?

Also I might not take icons of slaanesh, while its maybe a theme for you, I think that IoCG would be better suited for units on objectives that are inside rhinos

so anyways, the general list I would end up wanting (with this theme) would be.

HQ: 325

(170) Chaos Lord, MoS, steed, meltabombs, blissgiver
(155) Daemon Prince, MoS, wings, Lash

Troops: 470

(235) Chaos Marines x10, plasma gun, lascannon, IoCG, Rhino, havoc launcher
(235) Chaos Marines x10, plasma gun, lascannon, IoCG, Rhino, havoc launcher

Fast Attack: 680

(120) Chaos Spawn x3
(120) Chaos Spawn x3
(120) Chaos Spawn x3
(120) Chaos Spawn x3
(120) Chaos Spawn x3
(80) Chaos Spawn x2

Heavy Support: 375

(225) Obliterators x3
(150) Obliterators x2

1850 exactly. Its relatively similar to your other lists, yet it has 4 units that can target vehicles at long-medium distances and take them out. Also the havoc launchers help kill light infantry (which can be useful, as your only other long-ranged anti-infantry are plasma cannons, which may not want to fire at GEQ, and with lash of submission, you can take advantage of it and havoc launchers has 12" more range than plasma cannons and are more accurate.)

Not to mention it has 7 lascannons, nurgle loves your army now and will strike down all enemy tanks

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #13 on: September 6, 2010, 06:41:18 PM »
Wow, that is actually a fantastic army-list suggestion, Enlarging Cloud. Not 100% sure if I have two plasma guns, but I really like the Havoc Launcher idea, and I've always wanted to convert up more Obliterators.

Got a bit of work ahead of me. Finish the army up, make a display board, and work on my background book. I added the MoS, as it helped kill points before, changing banners is just a paint-job away.

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Offline enlg

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #14 on: September 6, 2010, 09:16:04 PM »
well if you don't have plasma you could downgrade to meltas. Low range but it could come in handy, and it gives you 10pts to use if you wanted to then swap 3 spawn (120pts+10pts just saved) to get 10 lesser daemons

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #15 on: September 7, 2010, 10:28:53 PM »
So, converted another obliterator, and some havoc launchers on the Rhinos. My list will be like this.

HQ

Daemon Prince-155
wings
Lash of submission
Mark of Slaanesh

Lord-190
Mark of Slaanesh
Steed of Slaanesh
Blissgiver
Plasma Pistol
Meltabombs
Personal Icon

Chaos Marines-245
x10 marines
lascannon
Plasmagun
Icon of Chaos Glory
Rhino
Havoc Launcher

Chaos Marines-240
x10 marines
lascannon
Meltagun
Icon of Chaos Glory
Rhino
Havoc Launcher

Spawn-720pts
x18 (in six squads)

Obliterators-150
x2
Obliterators-150
x2

I feel this should work well. Just need to do some painting now.
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Offline Grumpy Kwi

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #16 on: September 8, 2010, 05:50:22 PM »
I will put in a small vote for at least 1 squad of lesser daemons in even though it looks like you made up your mind. I think a squad of 6 (slaanesh's number) is only the cost of 2 spawn and would make a good objective camper in a list like this. I think instead of keeping one of the chaos marine squads back to babysit you could just have the LD's head straight for the closest objective and have them hide in cover for a fearless 4+ save.

It's just that as I imagine this huge line of howling daemons running at enemy along with the lord and prince with the oblits pounding away who will have time or resources to mess with 6 non-threatening daemons in the backfield? Even the chaos marines are more threatening and they are mobile enough to support the daemons if something gets in the backfield.

Just a thought I guess, I used to use the LD's more aggressively but they are un-impressive in that role - stubborn, cheap objective sitters, yes please! (I wish DE had a unit like this, grotesques come close but they are neither stubborn or scoring and cost more!).

Offline Lazarisreborn

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #17 on: September 9, 2010, 12:59:23 AM »
I don't like the lascannons on the chaos space marines.  I've fooled around with a lot of options and believe melta is really the only way to go even over flamers...My line of logic is this : flamer is good for horde control right?  Well you don't need much horde control with CSM because of the number of attacks they bring into assault on the charge.  You should always be charging with them too since they are in rhinos.  Meltas helps add anti-tank (especially with the majority of mech lists in tournies) or knocking out nob squads and such who are threats to CSM in cc.

I agree about having at least 1 more troop choice at 1850.  LDs could solve this problem cheaply.

I used havoc launchers against orcs in my last game for the first time and they do WONDERS imho.  Unless the opposing list is real heavy on anti-mech.

A vindicator might not be a good idea.  24" range with all the spawn bodies in the way?  It might be hard to get a solid shot off without hurting your own guys I would think.

My two cents...

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Offline Kuma

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #18 on: September 9, 2010, 12:37:00 PM »
Killersquid, how are you doing buddy. Tournament, eh? Sounds like good times to me.

You are bringing a spawn heavy list.
Everything should complement that.

I like the idea of a fast lord or prince getting into cc.
I like having a vindicator or defiler, functioning like a soul grinder in this list.
LDs fit the list build, spawn assault, but will only be there to scrum.
The troop choices need assault weps as well.
How about some 5 man icon squads for summoning if you go that route.
More troops perhaps smaller squads in rhinos.
I like oblits for most lists.
How about a 6 man havoc squad with mLs or Acannons?
the blaeth eye

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Re: 1850 Chaos Marine Tourney Army
« Reply #19 on: September 9, 2010, 11:36:56 PM »
Right, so I am now thinking of this. I have until the 10th to send in changes to my list.

1850 on the nose. Added a lesser Daemon squad for extra troops, as well as splitting the marines into three separate squads in rhinos. Now I have four scoring units.

HQ (345)
Daemon Prince-155
Wings
Lash of submission
Mark of Slaanesh

Lord-190
Mark of Slaanesh-5
Steed of Slaanesh
Blissgiver
Plasma Pistol
Meltabombs
Personal Icon

(605)
Marines-155
Plasmagun
X7
Rhino

Marines-160
Meltagun
Icon of Chaos Glory
X7
Rhino

Marines-160
Meltagun
Icon of Chaos Glory
X7
Rhino

Lesser Daemons-130
X10

Fast Attack (600)
Spawn-120
x3
Spawn-120
X3
Spawn-120
X3
Spawn-120
X3
Spawn-120
X3

Obliterators-150
x2
Obliterators-150
X2
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