Topic: Psychic questions

[MadEdric]

Hey hey,
I was just wondering. If I have two farseers in my seer council that have mindwar, do both have to target models in the same unit? Rulebook page 74 under psychic powers state "all attacks must be directed against a single target unit", but the codex states that the farseer can target "any enemy model within 18" of the Farseer". Since the codex supercedes the rulebook, I would say that my two farseers can target different units with mindwar.
Also, if attacked by perils of the warp, the wound, if taken allows no save, not even the invulnerable rune save, right?
Thankee in advance
Mad Edric

[Imrahil]

Well i think yes cause u are in a unit, and u use em in the shoot phase... For the devils attack It says no save throws allowed, but i think invulnerable ones may applied as normal... well see next post

[Prince of the laughing god]

I don't think you have to target models in the same unit, but I could be mistaken. but I do know that the only save you get from the perils of the warp are ghosthelms.

[warp_spider]

I read that they are independent characters, so they can shoot independently.

[Vhailior]

Tricky question....

They are independent characters.... the rules say that they can target any model...

but they are also in a unit...

D6

[Niran of Asha An]

the root of this question is; do models in a seer council still act  as independant characters: i personally don't think so.  please enlighten me.

[Imrahil]

Mmmm.... Ghosthelm affair its ok, ill assume its there for something but the seer council is a unit so they dont act as independent characters....

[Lord Calamir]

They're not independent characters, but then I think regular shooting rules shouldn't be applied to Mind War.

[warp_spider]

You have to do a psychic test for each correct?  Then I think they are they are a couple of independents acting together.

[Samurai]

Farseers in a Farseer council are not independant characters.  As for being able to use Mindwar from 2 Farseers onto 2 different units, I see nothing in the rules to control this, but I would personally avoid doing it just to avoid contention.

I will admit that Mindwar is supposed to follow the rules for shooting, so that leads some credit to my statement

[Ifrit321]

About the rune armour, stick with the idea that the demon starts to eat is brain from the inside out, some runes painted on his clothes really isn't going to help.

[Lonjon]

Actually, Mindwar does not follow the normal rules for shooting.  The only restriction for using Mindwar is that line of sight must exist between the Farseer and his target.  In fact, the Farseer can (and should) use Mindwar to single out characters and special weapon carriers.

Short answer:  Yes, you can choose to attack 2 different models in 2 different units.

[ChadTheBad]

Even though the Seer Council is a unit all the members are treated as characters. I hope that helps.

[dark_wind]

they are joined in a unit so in a sense they are no longer independant characters....so i think you would hafta use it on the same squad...

[Phoenix]

.... using them on the same squad would really take away the purpose of Mind War and the Seer Council for that matter.

Sure you can't kill them, but if all they can do is Mind War a lousy tactical squad or whatever, they're pretty expensive for just that.

Another question;

The though of a Demon eating someone's brain out and such and thus getting no save vs a warp attack when failing a psychic power sounds logical to me, although the rules don't mention inv saves.

In the same logic, wouldn'tit be logical then that an enemy wouldn't get his inv save against Mind War either? It seems to me that all the shadow, warp, power and whatever fields in the world won't be of much help against a mental attack.

The rules don't mention inv saves in this case either.

Input anyone?

Phoenix

[Kyndig Azhei]

I really have no rules to support this, but, I think that mind war, from a logical standpoint, should bypass pretty much everything, except maybe a ghosthelm or something that protects from psi damage.

[RedTwo]

I don't know the rules for daemons, and I don't have my codex in front of me right now, but I'm pretty sure mind war only ignores normal saves.  A character with an invulnerable save is allowed to make it.  In fact, it's my understanding that a unit or character is ALLWAYS allowed to attempt an invulnerable save if it has one.

I'll admit I'm new to 40K so if someone has info to the contrary I'd love to know it (and which rule book it comes from).

[Dangonblane]

Rulebook page 74 under psychic powers state "all attacks must be directed against a single target unit"

This rule was put in for powers which allow multiple hits, such as Doom Bolt.  It applies to attacks from a single model, not a unit, so your 2 Farseers can target different units.

As for the invunerable saves thing, if you have an invunerable save you may take it against psychic attacks.  This was cleared up in the GW FAQ.  Indeed, if you look at the fluff for some invunerable saves (such as a Marine Chaplin's Rosarius) you'll find these devices were created to counter attacks from deamons, and hence psychic attacks too.

[The-great-Farseer]

actuly agianst perils of the warp you still get invunrable saves think of the psyker oping a hole in the warp to draw energy from the warp and a great big filthy beast jumps out normaL armour it can move right through but an energy field might stop it. As about the farseers i dont really know but i do know that having a concil negernates them being idependant characters as it stats the so and so is an indepent character INLESS joined by a so and so. but then if mind war allows you to ignore targeting resatucxtions you shoul be ablke to shoot.
         Mike

P.s y dont you just have 2 farseers with 2 retunes lol