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The Armies of 40k => Tau Empire => Topic started by: Wyddr on September 16, 2015, 04:30:04 PM

Title: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on September 16, 2015, 04:30:04 PM
So, you gents seen the new Tau pics yet? Anybody excited to get an ultra-missile-Riptide-splosion happening? Thoughts on the new suit or FW models?
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on September 16, 2015, 04:59:36 PM
The Riptide/Stormsurge with the huge beslubber off gun on its shoulder? Looks very nice indeed.

Edit: Bad marketing for an October release when Sept-ember would have worked better.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on September 16, 2015, 06:19:47 PM
I think it will be interesting to see what they do to the army as a whole. They really don't need very much other than access to D weaponry and their flyers are underwhelming.

Oh, and Vespid. Three damn editions and you'd think they'd get them right, but no...
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on September 16, 2015, 06:57:27 PM
From the Stormsurge it appears GUNS GUNS GUNS is the call of the day. You can identify at least four different weapons systems (three if the different missile pods are the same except for artistic license). The new Stealth Suit looks to be up scaled so perhaps new support systems involved.

The Vespid I suspect were someone's pet project and they got bored and/or transferred. Not a whole lot has ever happened with them except being slaughtered in the BL stories.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on September 17, 2015, 09:07:57 AM
Given the new Riptide model and that forgeworld monstrosity, I worry a little bit about the design aesthetic going into the Tau these days. They just seem to be bolting on giant guns for the sake of it, and I don't know if that's a good look for them. They're straying towards "orky."
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on September 17, 2015, 06:35:16 PM
Very true. While I know it's a fool's errand to look at 40K with an engineering eye with some of these new Tau designs you take a glance and can't help thinking there's no way that could function without magic.
no Arthur C Clark quotes, please
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on October 3, 2015, 01:02:26 PM
Preorders have begun including the Stormsurge.
KV128 Stormsurge | Games Workshop Webstore (http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/KV128-Stormsurge)

The tiny support braces behind the Stormsurge's legs just look ridiculous.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Grizzlykin on October 3, 2015, 05:24:08 PM
150 box ...  omg I will not buy something like that before long but i gotta admnit it looks pretty details for the model :D  looking sweet even if i don't judge it to be particulary appealing to the eye compared to normal tau suit that are much more elegant ^^
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on October 4, 2015, 09:38:13 AM
Honestly, the Ghostkeel looks much more interesting to me. A big, stealthy super-suit? Sign me up!

If I had time  (I don't), I could see myself building an entirely stealth-themed army. Stealth suits, ghostkeels, pathfinders, and kroot would be cool.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on October 4, 2015, 02:54:05 PM
The Ghostkeel does sound interesting and seems you can kit it up to be a tank hunter or infantry scythe like other stealths. I've been reading the potential for plenty of cover save shenanigans as well.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: kaldolaf on October 6, 2015, 12:17:00 PM
I'm actually starting to warm up to the Stormsurge.  After reading the most recent White Dwarf, I see some good potential for it with the Pulse Blast Cannon (I'm thinking we should just call this the Pulse shotgun).

Rather than using the stabilizers and giving up mobility, I see using a unit of two or three Stormsurges aggressively.  As GCs they can keep up with the rest of our army just fine and so set them to hunting enemy super heavies and GCs, or if none available vehicles and MCs.  The nice thing is that again as a GC, the Stormsurge can use the rest of its many weapons to harass nearby infantry.  That's a large amount of fire coming from the cluster rocket system and SMS.  I'd even say in this role it would be worth upgrading to the twin-linked AFP for more great anti infantry.

And, if there aren't any SHs, GC, MCs, or vehicles to target just keep farther back from infantry you want to disappear and use the main guns large blast.

Even one Stormsurge by itself used this way can put out a lot of firepower and is fairly survivable given its number of wounds.

So what do others think of using the Stormsurge this way?
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on October 6, 2015, 04:51:15 PM
I haven't seen the stats, so I can't comment precisely, but the theory sounds good to me. Being able to shoot at multiple targets is quite the benefit for a platform mounting that many guns.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on October 10, 2015, 01:24:42 PM
The Ghostkeel is *quite* large now that I've seen the official pictures.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on October 10, 2015, 04:24:49 PM
The Tau Breacher Squad sounds quite interesting, if you're of a short-range firefight bent (such as myself). Pulse Blasters sound sweet, though that extra-short high-power shot is going to be hard to manage with a larger squad.

Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on October 17, 2015, 02:46:28 PM
A mobile defence line, that sounds kind of silly. Apparently all sold out as well.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on October 17, 2015, 06:09:11 PM
Earth caste tech: You see, it's a *wall* that *floats!*
Fire caste commander: How is this different than a tank without a roof?
Earth caste tech: But...this is a *wall.*
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on October 17, 2015, 06:13:22 PM
With force fields. It just looks so flimsy, so open, so not defensive. Well within the usual from GW for defence structures, or course, which is the problem. Come on design crew, think about it.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Ebon Star on October 18, 2015, 06:14:21 AM
A mobile defence line, that sounds kind of silly. Apparently all sold out as well.

At least it's not the overdesigned piece of tin that is the Stormsurge?
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on October 18, 2015, 09:20:38 AM
At least it's not the overdesigned piece of tin that is the Stormsurge?

Earth Caste Tech: Sir, there's still a few square meters of the Stormsurge not currently covered with missiles?

Earth Caste Supervisor: WHAT? (hits big red button) Emergency! Emergency! To stations everyone! We NEED MORE MISSILES!
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on October 18, 2015, 04:45:31 PM
"Sir, we've lost another Stormsurge pilot. Just like the others, after firing all their weapons they die from a massive erection."

Edit: The Codex has finally dropped. For those not wanting the same text at the start every time you can get the Warzone book which includes all the new rules and rule changes.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Slick Samos on October 24, 2015, 03:08:57 PM
I'm really liking the new XV8's (with variants) and Drone sprue but less so the XV95...

Having the new rules in the War Zone Damocles - Kauyon is really smart as it also means that Imperial Armour 3 - Taros Campaign are still current.

However £45 ... I'm not going to buy it any time soon.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on October 24, 2015, 05:23:39 PM
I just went for the new Codex at this point, as I'm fancy. May pick up the Warzone book at a later date if a sassy moment strikes. Am hoping they move away from Damocles at some point as they're really locking the Tau into one moment in time rather than developing them with future prospects.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on November 4, 2015, 08:15:44 PM
Interesting. Definitely potential for shenanigans with the Ghostkeels and Stormsurges + markerlight support. Only flicked through so far and haven't read any of the fluff to see if there are changes.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Calamity on November 5, 2015, 08:44:44 AM
I always wanted to collect tau but I was concerned that they're too similar to the IG in play style.  Even though they are probably in no actual way like the IG at all and it's just me. :P

Now might be a good time to do it though.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: kaldolaf on November 5, 2015, 11:17:13 AM
Here are my initial thoughts on the "new" Codex.

I'm a little disappointed with next to zero unit tweaks.  We get Crisis teams up to 9 now which means crisis bombs no longer require Farsight.  I do like the support turret that Firewarrior Stikers can now take.  However, I don't like that Striker squads are 5-12 but the new Stiker/Breacher box only makes 10 models.  And Riptides, HHs, and Skyrays in teams of 1-3 is nice.  Oh and the fire team rule that gives units with the rule and at least 3 MCs or 3 vehicles increased BS.  And CIB and AFP no longer signature opens up some interesting crisis builds.

As for new units I love the Ghostkeel and I am staying open minded on the Stormsurge.  I really like the idea of Breachers in 'Fish for very aggressive play.  Not a big fan of the Coldstar Commander but I do like the new Crisis and Commander boxes with more pose options.

And now for the really great part: Tau Decurion and Formations!

First our Core formation, Hunter Cadre.  I really like this setup as there really isn't any tax to it as it is basically just a CAD Force Org that adds an extra mandatory Elite, Troop, FA, and Heavy so it really isn't much different from lists we already have.  For that almost CAD list we gain Supporting fire at double the distance between units and a bubble around the cabre's commander and fire blade that lets us run or flat out and then shoot.  This is especially nice for the fireblade as volley fire only mentions remaining stationary in the movement phase letting us have some mobility with strikers pairs with fireblade and still get the extra pulse shots.

This leads us nicely into our Decurion, the Hunter Contingent.  We have to take at least one Hunter Cadre and have the option of taking up to 1 Command formation (the only spot to include an ethereal in the Contingent), and have to take 1+ auxiliary formations (more on these later).  For the Contingent we lose ObjSec and gain Coordinated firepower.  Tau can now properly MSU!  Getting to combine the shooting of any number of units and resolving their fire as a single unit (which includes marker light usage) means we no longer need large squads to achieve ML efficiency and gives us very good tools to use against deathstars and other big nasties.  Now, hopefully this rule gets FAQd because there is already a great amount of debate as to whether the resolving the combined shooting attack "as if" a single unit means the participating units share USRs and if Target Locks also work and let such equipped units fire at different targets from the combined "metaunit".  Obviously, shared USRs is huge as a buffmander with command and control, multi spectrum, and puretide engram spreading twinlinked, ignore cover, and tank/monster hunter to everything is amazing.  Personally, I am of the belief that USR do spread and Target Locks do work.  It's really no different from our old codex's with vehicle multitrackers letting our tanks fire "as though it were a fast vehicle".  Since they resolve their shooting as a single unit then they follow all other rules for a unit at that time.  But further discussion of this can move to the Rules board until there is a FAQ.

For our formations we get:

Retaliation cadre: another commander, some more crisis units, broadsides, and riptides.  The entire formation gets relentless (yay mobile broadsides!) and the entire formations can arrive via deepstrike on turn two and get improved BS on the turn it does so.  Pair this with units with homing beacons and this becomes a accurate deadly assault.

Heavy retribution cadre: a unit of ghostkeels and a pair of stormsurge units.  Giving stormsurges essentially twinlinked as long as the ghostkeels are close to the target is very powerful for units that put out as much firepower as Stormsurges do.  They also limit target movement and charge range if two or more of the formations units fire at the same target.  The only downside is point cost (not to mention money).  You're looking at a bare minimum 850 points to field the formation.

Infiltration cadre:  3 pathfinders, 2 stealth, and a piranha unit.  If any unit in the formation is destroyed ALL of the rest of your reserves come on at the start of your next turn.  And each unit that gets 3 or more marker hits gets a free seeker hit on that target.

Optimized stealth cadre:  2 stealth and 1 ghostkeel unit.  when shooting, you can have the ghostkeels and any stealths close enough use wall of mirrors.  They get ignore cover, +1 BS, and hit any vehicles on rear armor!  Note, if part of a contingent and you have them combine fire they also get the BS bonus from coordinated firepower as well!

Firebase Support Cadre:  2 broadside and 1 riptide unit.  They can choose to shoot as a single unit (note - different from contingent rule) and gain tank and monster hunter.

Armoured interdiction cadre:  3 HH and 1 Skyray units.  Note, this is the only way to take a skyray in a hunter contingent.  In your shooting phase, you pick a point and the formation re-rolls misses against targets close to that point.

Air Caste Support cadre:  1 Sun shark and 2 Razorsharks.  They can regain lost hull points on a roll and can ignore penetrating results of shaken or stunned on a roll.

Allied advance cadre:  4 kroot and 2 vespid units.  The vespids gain infiltrate and stealth.  The kroot carnivores close to the vespids get shrouded instead of stealth and increased BS.  They also gain supporting fire but only with units in the formation.

Drone Network:  a unit of drones.  no special rules

Command (Contingent Headquarters): 1 Commander, up to 1 ethereal, and 1 or 2 bodyguard units.  no special rules.

Personally, I really like the Hunter Contingent.  The detachment doesn't really have a tax as it really isn't much different from a regular Force Org.  I like the idea of taking a single Hunter Cadre and an Optimised Stealth Cadre.  Maybe add a retaliation cadre for larger games.  Sadly, you have to use a Contingent Headquarters to include an ethereal and darkstrider and farsight cannot be including in a hunter contingent at all.  I'm toying around with including a CAD with ethereal, darkstrider, and 2 squads of kroot and joining darkstrider and the ethereal to squads of breachers for some very aggressive mobile firepower.  There are so many good synergies here.  Even just with a single breacher squad in a devilfish.  Move the fish, disembark the breachers and the drones, then have all 3 combine fire for increased BS all form a single breacher squad and it's transport.  That's just a simple example of what can be done with the contingent.

What do others think of the codex so far?
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on November 5, 2015, 02:01:45 PM
I'm warming to the Stormsurge as even though the little supports look silly their special rule certainly isn't. That and destroyer missiles with ML support are just nasty.

The Fire Warrior support turret is something I've been looking forward to. Aerial deployed support for the lads on the ground provides some added fire power that seeker missiles alone weren't going to do in the past. Added incentive for your opponent to get in your face though.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Halollet on November 6, 2015, 09:40:52 PM
Retaliation cadre is what I'm excited about. Just MSU with fusion blasters and surround an enemy knight, have a HH and the Retaliation cadre fire at it and you're looking at bs 5 for everything when it drops in, bs 7 for the commander if he joins in. The knight can only put its shield up on one side and you just need to pop 2 Mlights on it if need be for everything to ignore any cover that it's in, if any.

Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on December 1, 2015, 03:51:15 PM
Farsight gets an update in the new Damocles book. The Farsight bomb is made canon and used to great extent in the narrative. The Enclaves also seem to have access to most of the new toys as well which doesn't hurt. He's still wanted for treason but him and Shadowsun have mostly made up.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: Wyddr on December 1, 2015, 05:11:44 PM
The Optimised Stealth Carde is pretty amazing. Wall of Mirrors is just insane. I don't quite remember the rear armor of Imperial Knights, but I believe the OSC would be killing a knight a round without too much trouble. Well, unless they all keep orienting their shields backwards.
Title: Re: New Tau!
Post by: The GrimSqueaker on December 1, 2015, 05:39:57 PM
The Drone Net in Mont'ka is also very interesting. Especially as one of the special rules gets to apply to *all* drones on the battlefield, whether they're part of the formation or not.