Topic: Quick notes on Corsairs IA11v2

[magenb]

Basic Balistic weapons.
 -Shuriken catapult - Is short range but gets multiple shots. Brace of pistols, you get the same range, same S, same number of shots, same special rule and AP. Not sure why this is really an option.
 -Lasblaster - Is not a bad option if you are up against low T armies or want to keep your distance.
 -Splinter rifle - Great poison weapon, nice single shot long range, but you need to get close to maximize firepower, in which case brace of pistols kicks in.
 -Brace of pistols - You get both Shuriken and Splinter, as well as increasing CC effectiveness.

Brace of pistols seems to be the winner here for a General list.


Corsair Jetpack
 -Same price as the armour upgrade, but comes with an armour upgrade of the same value, why would you ever take the armour upgrade?
 -Dedicated transport is expensive and can only move a small number of them.
   Allied notes:
    -If you want splinter rifles, then DE with a raider and splinter racks seems to be the same point cost.
    -Cheaper than Guardian's with a WaveS, better armour and still highly mobile.

Jetpack seems like another default option here.


Melee options
Troop - Reavar Band with Bracers of Pistols, Jetpacks, Combat drugs. 10 models 165 points 30 attacks on charge, 20 after.
Troop - Ghostwalker with Bracers of Pistols, Jetpacks, Combat drugs, extra special rules. 10 models 185 points 30 attacks on charge, 20 after.
Troop - Cloud Dancer with Bracers of Pistols, Combat Drugs, higher T and better saves. 10 models 215 points 30 attacks on charge, 20 after.

Elite - Voidstorm with Bracers of Pistols, Jetpacks, Combat drugs. 10 models 205 points 40 attacks on charge, 30 after.
   NOTES:
    - Seems FW may have made a mistake here, the first 5 are cheaper than the additional 5. This may have been done to make them slightly cheaper than Malevolent
    - Points per attack wise, these work out cheaper than a Reavar band.
    - The entire unit can take special CC weapons, but they become super expensive.

Elite - Malevolent with Bracers of Pistols, Jetpacks, Combat drugs, Extra Wound, Great on charge, FNP. 10 models 215 points 40 attacks on charge, 20 after.
   NOTES:
    - Has a special rule that really just means, these guys are going to be played agressively..


Anti-Infantry
Troop - Reavar Band, you can make them a harassing unit with Lasblasters and jetpacks.
Troop - Ghostwalker, basically just a sniper unit.
Troop - Cloud Dancer, Best option when taken with splinter cannons, great point value, fantastic rate of fire at long range and on Jet bikes.

Elite - WASP, Twin splinter cannon is a nice option here, but the WASP unit is expensive

Fast  - Vyper, Twin Splinter cannons is nice, same price as two Cloud Dancers with same guns.
Fast  - Phoenix Bomber, Expensive and rather situational.
Fast  - Hornets, for standard troops you get more firepower out of vypers for the points. Best suited to long range medium armour, Terminators and MC.

Heavy - Balestrike, you could kit them out for anti-troop, but much better as anti-tank.
Heavy - WARP Hunter, Melts everything, but better to go after heavy armour etc
Heavy - Lynx, WARP hunter on roids, really should be a LOW choice.


Anti-tank.
Troop - Cloud Dancer with Dark lances - Less poitns than Falcon.
Elite - WASP with Either Lances - same points cost as Cloud Dancers.
Fast  - Vyper, sub-par, can only take 1 long range anti-tank, seems to fit better as an anti-troop
Fast  - Hornets, taking 2 lances feels like a waste here as it is the same points cost as WASP and Cloud Dancers.
        NOTES: Best option appears to be Pulse laser.

Heavy - Balestrike, cheapest way to field highly mobile mass Dark Lances.
Heavy - WARP Hunter, Melts everything
Heavy - Lynx, giddity

NOTE: Only 1 heavy slot per Cotorie

[Fenris]

Hornets with dual pulse lasers are a no-brainer, against anything not AV13-14 they do double damage compared to bright/dark -lances, they even have som extra range.

I think they can give both the scatter laser and the bright/dark -lances a run for their money against vehicles, while they excel against heavy infantry.

[Aurics Pride]

Is there any interest in me doing some detailed unit breakdowns for the Corsairs? There doesn't seem to be all that much around.

[Irisado]

It depends what you mean by a breakdown.  Do you mean a unit by unit analysis?  If so, my suggestion is that you just go for it .  Do please remember to avoid posting anything that would breach GW's copyright rules though (see forum rule 1 for an explanation).

[Garion]

Is there any interest in me doing some detailed unit breakdowns for the Corsairs? There doesn't seem to be all that much around.

Yes please!

Your notes were really helpfull, looking forward to a complete analysis

[Aurics Pride]

It depends what you mean by a breakdown.  Do you mean a unit by unit analysis?  If so, my suggestion is that you just go for it .  Do please remember to avoid posting anything that would breach GW's copyright rules though (see forum rule 1 for an explanation).

Awesome, I didn't want to step on any toes just incase the OP was planning on doing the same.

[magenb]

Is there any interest in me doing some detailed unit breakdowns for the Corsairs? There doesn't seem to be all that much around.

Yes please

[magenb]

A few more quick notes.

Traveller of Forgotten Paths
I thought this was golden when I first read it, then I hit me.. the sequence of events means the portal is open and nothing happening for 1 turn before it can be used.

Reaper of the Outer Dark
A great option when you're low on points, it gives the Prince a serious buff and a nice little bump to the most of the infantry (one already has the special rule) for very few points. The problem here is almost everything is better for all of your infantry units using Seeker of Forbidden Pleasures.

DE drugs vs Corsair Drugs.
I keep hearing how much better the Corsairs are but when I look at my DE codex only a roll of 6 is different, sure its awesome if you are a Corsair, but most of the time you are going to be running the same effect.

The hunt for cheesy shenanigans continues.

[Ibushi]

Alright Magenb, i'll bite at cheesy shenanigans, bringing you this straight from Switzerland:

First off, Reckless Abandon is NOT a Run move, so you can use Reckless Abandon and then Charge.

Secondly, Reckless Abandon restricts your unit to "not move closer" to any unit targeted by shooting attacks, so it is perfectly reasonable to work out the precise difference, closest model to closest model, between the targeted and shooting unit, and so long as you do not breach that threshold, you can skirt around them. This potentially gives you a double-movement PAST the targeted unit into the enemy backfield, or at least sideways for sure. If the targeted unit was somehow wiped out, then you can literally go wherever you like, thanks suckas!

Thirdly, Reaper of the Outer Dark requires that any Corsair Faction unit upgraded with Rage MUST assault an enemy unit within 8", and if there are multiples, you get to choose which unit you assault (even if you shot one of them), which is just too amazing to me. Plus you get RAGE, because why not!?

OK cheesy shenanigans = move up as close as possible to target unit #1, shoot with all your pistols, special weapons, and grenades (love those Blind grenades, hah!), then use Reckless Abandon (ideally with Path Ward thrown in for maximum effect) to move as far as you can around and *past* the unit you just shot up a million times with your pistols, and proceed to get within 8" of one or more enemy units, then declare an assault on enemy unit OF YOUR CHOICE, aka target #2, with Rage thrown in for good measure, and proceed to hammer of wrath the crap out of them! Notice that Corsair Princes on Cloud Dancers DO NOT lose Fleet, so that is a pretty big bonus when doing this with your Rampage Prince, as an 8" charge on jetbike is super reliable.

This is unofficially known as the Rum Slingshot.

This is particularly amazing for targeting infantry with many bladestorm pistol shots, then catapulting your unit backfield into a supporting vehicle and blowing it up in assault with plasma grenades, void sabre hits, and possibly melta bombs. Absolutely 100% not something a First-Time opponent is going to expect, and for seasoned opponents, it will still present lots of issues, as the sheer movement options available to the Corsairs are ABSURD.

OK cheese #2, a slight variation = Outflank with Cloud Dancers exactly 12" away from their intended target, then use Reckless Abandon plus jetbike Thrust move to scoot an equally absurd amount of inches away, behind cover, onto an objective, into the enemy DZ, whatever you want. They potentially move further AFTER shooting than they do before, it is truly insane, and clearly fueled by Eldritch Rum. Let's call this the Dark and Stormy.

Lastly, Cheese #3, for the super cheese = take a Corsair Fleet Raiding Party and max out 1-2 Coteries with whatever you like, hopefully some bikes and malevolents or something that can operate up close plus a Warp Hunter, then add in a CAD or Allied Detachment of Corsairs with minimum Prince + Ghostwalkers + Warp Hunter. Ghostwalkers so that they don't interfere with the role of the Cloud Dancers and cause One Eye Open checks, Warp Hunter because it is the Corsair Cheese Factory and NOW YOU HAVE TWO. Most importantly, for the ultimate cheesy shenanigans, equip your Corsair Fleet Prince with Seeker of Forbidden Pleasures for maximum combat effectiveness, passing Combat Drugs to all your skirmishing units, then pick up Reaper of the Outer Dark for your Allied Prince (he kind of wants to be on his own anyway...), which allows you to then upgrade ALL Corsair Faction Units with RAGE for free, and gets you that nasty "must assault" ability. OUCH, now you have drugged-up, kiting Corsairs running around shooting and assaulting separate targets, with TWO warp hunters casting cheese blasts from the back. Just make sure that the two Corsair detachments do not come within 12" of each other, as that causes unfortunate tests. On the one hand, allowing Rampage Prince to give his Rage ability to ANY Corsairs (not just his detachment) is kind of amazing, but at the same time it seems pretty fluffy, because if that guy shows up to your party, you gonna party HARD!

Ibushi out

[magenb]

hmm that's some nice cheesy stuff right there, thanks Ibushi.

I think I have found something else as well.

Corsair Dedicated transports get scout.
Now the Scout rule states units WIth the scout special rule can not assault first turn.

The scout special rule is explicit in stating that a unit with scout gives the transport the Scout rule, but not the other way around. As in, the transport still keeps the Scout rule, but does not give it to the unit inside it.

So scout with a venom, drop some poison/shuriken lovin' on them, disembark and charge!

[Ibushi]

Yeah there was a big debate about that one when IA11 v2 came out, and most people decided it was too "rule bendy" to exploit, but certainly based on absolute unwavering RAW you could do it if your opponent didn't mind.

Those ones above are pretty hammered out, in that nobody can dispute that you are altering the intent of the rule. Rum Slingshot "around" a target unit is probably the closest you get, but it's perfectly clear.

One other thing my friend pointed out yesterday is that FW apparently clarified that ANY FW Eldar units can be taken as Harlequins, so the Eldar vehicles (cough-warp hunter-cough-lynx-cough) can be taken as Harlequin choices, particularly in the Masque detachment which is pretty nasty. Not Corsair cheese, but still.

[magenb]

Yeah there was a big debate about that one when IA11 v2 came out, and most people decided it was too "rule bendy" to exploit, but certainly based on absolute unwavering RAW you could do it if your opponent didn't mind.

fair enough, I'm not sure why they gave it scout then, seems they could have just given it outflank.

[Ibushi]

Oh you can definitely still Scout the vehicle, just saying that people typically don't let the unit onboard assault first turn.

[magenb]

Oh you can definitely still Scout the vehicle, just saying that people typically don't let the unit onboard assault first turn.

I meant I'm not sure why Forgewolrd would give a low AV opentop, low volume transport the "Scout" rule in this list. I can see "outflank" still being useful.

I could see a point to say a Scout Venom carrying Fire Dragons, or something else very short range that hits hard. High risk, as the unit will get smashed if you don't get first turn, but high reward if you do.

I guess you could do it with Voidstorms, but man, that is alot more points to risk.

[Ibushi]

Yeah true, I'm definitely more likely to use Outflank versus Scout, although by giving it Scout you effectively get both so that's nice.

If you're going first then it's useful to Scout up closer, hopefully get the troops out and do some shoot 'n' scoot with Reckless Abandon. Also if you load up on Shuriken weapons having that extra range, or Fire Dragons getting in close, could be pretty clutch with first turn.

My other thinking is Scout is super useful in Hammer & Anvil -- either getting closer to get in range to back table edge, or being able to Outflank like a bawse.

Love Corsairs!

[Garion]

The Venom is a dedicated transport so no scouting Fire Dragons