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Author Topic: "Through a mirror cracked" (Spoilers)  (Read 2197 times)

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Offline ShasO Kodel

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"Through a mirror cracked" (Spoilers)
« on: August 1, 2012, 07:53:27 PM »
So apparently, at the end of the 1st story in "the Primarchs" Fulgrim is revealed to have escaped the confines of his pastel prison, reconquered his body, expelled the daemon influence, and proceeded to start down the path of princedom.

...What? First off, Fulgrim was contrite and ashamed of his actions at the end of Fulgrim. He wanted to redeem himself, and tried to commit suicide. Second, how would one learn the ways of Chaos magic to the extent it would take to will your soul into a new vessel? And push out a daemon in the process? And agruably one of the most powerful daemons ever at that, as it managed to hide itself from Eldrad Ulthuan from seven feet away.

Can anyone find any other fluff that's even remotely broken on the deus ex machina to this degree? I'm just bothered by the "I wanted out so I broke out" motif. I liked fulgrim as a tragic character who wanted more than anything to be like dear old dad, and they've changed that into another trite 'I've embraced evil' transformation

Offline Lachdonin

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Re: "Through a mirror cracked" (Spoilers)
« Reply #1 on: August 1, 2012, 08:06:52 PM »
Well, we do know that a mortal shaking off Daemonic possession is technicly possible, though extremely rare. Those who have acomplished it are one of the few human groups (known as the Illuminati) permitted, on occation to enter the Black Library. They haven't been mentioned, to my knowlege, for several editions however, so they may not even exist any more.

As for Fulgrim's prompt about face, i don't really have anything to add, since i haven't read much of the HH books (though i really should) and don't know much about his character. From what i do know, however, repentance doesn't seem like his thing.
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Offline Koval, Master Verispex

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Re: "Through a mirror cracked" (Spoilers)
« Reply #2 on: August 2, 2012, 01:24:53 AM »
So apparently, at the end of the 1st story in "the Primarchs" Fulgrim is revealed to have escaped the confines of his pastel prison, reconquered his body, expelled the daemon influence, and proceeded to start down the path of princedom.

...What? First off, Fulgrim was contrite and ashamed of his actions at the end of Fulgrim. He wanted to redeem himself, and tried to commit suicide. Second, how would one learn the ways of Chaos magic to the extent it would take to will your soul into a new vessel? And push out a daemon in the process? And agruably one of the most powerful daemons ever at that, as it managed to hide itself from Eldrad Ulthuan from seven feet away.

Can anyone find any other fluff that's even remotely broken on the deus ex machina to this degree? I'm just bothered by the "I wanted out so I broke out" motif. I liked fulgrim as a tragic character who wanted more than anything to be like dear old dad, and they've changed that into another trite 'I've embraced evil' transformation
Well, we know that daemons trapped in physical objects have a hard time not going barmy, so I imagine it's even harder for mortals, even a Primarch. I've yet to read the Primarchs book but I'm not quite as incredulous as you are.

Offline Underhand

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Re: "Through a mirror cracked" (Spoilers)
« Reply #3 on: August 2, 2012, 05:38:54 AM »
It's plausible.

Humans have broken daemonic possession before.  Fulgrim was/is a Primarch, and seemingly regarded as pretty remarkable even compared to his brother Primarchs, so if anyone could break daemonic possession, he'd probably be up near the top of the list.  He is repeatedly described as being able to quickly master a variety of disciplines, and there is no reason to think that the finer points of chaos sorcery/daemonology would be any different.  It's not like he had a hell of a lot else to do.

As to the power of the Daemon who possessed him in the first place - we don't have a really clear idea of how powerful it really was in terms of it's ability to take possession of people.  It only managed to take possession of Fulgrim because he was dumb enough to allow it to possess him after it asked him nicely.

Similarly, as to his change of personality - the novel Fulgrim was the story of Fulgrim's descent into madness.  He, (and most of his legion) had been pretty much batamphetamine parrot for a long time before the end of the book, to the point that he was murdering people for pretty much no reason, so the fact that it turns out a few books later that he's still an rather unsavoury chap, what-ho old bean?, isn't a huge big surprise.

He might have had a moment where he experienced some regret at the end there, but it was only a moment.  The fact that that moment of contrition lead directly to him being possessed by a daemon might also have shifted his perspective a bit too.

Offline Bumbles

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Re: "Through a mirror cracked" (Spoilers)
« Reply #4 on: August 4, 2012, 12:15:25 AM »
the impression I got was that Fulgrim trapped the daemon in the painting in the first place. The daemon say what Fulgrim was going to become and basically wet itself.

 


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