Topic: 1000 point khorne/ black legion

[shmee shmee]

blood thirstier                                                       205

berserkers *8                                                        164
talisman of BB
FREE champ with power weapon

berserkers *8                                                        164
talisman of BB
FREE champ with power weapon

Furies *8                                                              104


bloodletters *8                                                      208

predator                                                                          155
twinlinked las, las sponsons, mutated hull, tank hunters


This army list was made to fight Blood angels, I wondered if any1 could rate it and give me some advice on how to beat them

[CD]

Page 12

"Daemons will only manifest next to an Icon of Chaos Undivided or an Icon belonging to a squad with the same Mark as the Daemons themselves."

No excemption is made for Furies, so they can only be summoned at an Icon of Chaos Undivided, unfortunately. Unless it was changed in the later printings of the Codex..



-A Predator can't have Tank Hunters. Veteran Skills can't be given to vehicles.

-I'd suggest against the Bloodthirster. Take a Zerker Lord with Daemonic Speed, Daemonic Strength and an Axe of Khorne (plus whatever else you want to give him, like Daemonic Aura and such). Less unpredictable, saves you an AC, and a bunch of points. Without chains you'll find your Thirster getting shot more often than you'd think at first glance.

If you go with the Thirster change, make your ACs better. In almost all sizes of army, good ACs tend to make the game. Daemonic Strength is a must since it's so dirt cheap, and Daemonic Mutation can never hurt. I'd suggest at least one, if not both ACs getting Powerfists, since they've got the rest of the squad to protect them, and Khorne has the unfortunate problem of running into vehicles more often than you'd like. With just one predator (which can easily be destroyed early), no powerfists is no good.

That's all for now...

[shmee shmee]

so i should get rid of the bloodtirster?  but i hought he would wreak havoc amoung his marines, and take a chaos lord k

[Newtype]

Theres nothing wrong with the 'Thirster, but Creeping Death seems to be in the camp that doesnt like Greater Daemons. Nothing wrong with that either, perfectly viable way to play the game.

If you do keep the 'Thirster, put him in a Champion with chains, yeah theyre expensive but it gives you a little more control over when and where he summons, always a good thing.

You'll have to drop the furies as for some reason the Developers made them more restricted on what marks they can summon from, every other Daemon can summon from 2 different marks, Furies only form that of undivided. use the points to juice up your champions a bit. Buy chain axes for your berzerkers, for pocket change they'll make killing armored targets, like Space Marines and Terminators, much easier.

[CD]

I just noticed that you're trying to use furies... the Aspiring Champions arne't free. Of course, it's not incredibly relevant now that you're taking out the furies (in all likelihood), but just so you know, the free ACs are only for full-on World Eaters armies (can't believe we missed that first time around).

Greater Daemons are fine, but in games so small, it's too unpredictable. That, and you've only got two aspiring champions, and killing one of them isn't very good. If you underequip him, he can end up doing little in assualt for a turn or two, even with his strength bonus. If he's regularly equipped, you're wasting too many points in such a small point limit if he dies early. Chains would reduce the unpredictability of it, but just make him cost more again (If he kept the Power Sword, that's 254 points on just a 'Thirster, even more if you keep the list Black Legion instead of WE; still 1/4 of your list).

They're fine in 1500+ games. 1000 is just too small for the biggies though (same with statured DPs).

[shmee shmee]

eeerrrrmmmm you do get a free asp champ when you have a sqaud of besrks that are a multiple of 8
look in the codex

[Newtype]

eeerrrrmmmm you do get a free asp champ when you have a sqaud of besrks that are a multiple of 8
look in the codex

You should look in the codex yourself, you cant use furies with a world eaters army, so if you include the furies you cant use the world eaters rules, thus no free champions.

Page 48 "the only Daemons that can be used are those belonging to Khorne." (meaning bloodthirsters, bloodletters, and flesh hounds. thats it.)

IF however you drop the furies as has been suggested, (since you have no way to summon them anyway) there is nothing stopping you from using the world eaters rules with this list. 

[shmee shmee]

sorry i didnt actually say that, i av joint account, so has any1 got anymore good tactics to use?

[Tender Hands]

under all circumstances KEEP THE THRISTER!!!! in a small game like the one ur preping for, your opponent will be forced into the decision of what to shoot at: the big scary daemon with an axe the size of Rhode Island, or your precious squads. either way, something nasty is going to hit him. and the likely hood of ur high toughness daemon with a 3+ save getting killed quickly is ever so small.

pull the furies and beef up the champs. give em powerfist, rage, and mutation. this gets u a possiblity of 8 attacks on a charge with a powerfist. someone help the poor fool who is on the recieving end of that. its as much as 4 fricken terminators... anyways... yeah.

[CD]

What are you talking about, "one is going to hit him"? I've played against armies that small that use multiple big things (or even a single big monster model), and every time they've been completely obliterated. Plasma, friend. Plasma.

In a tournament of that size, I fought against two armies that used a Daemon Prince, and one of them was a WE army with a Thirster as well. The DP died my second turn to plasma, the Thirster got out and died again to plasma. Any defensive army with good anti-marine capabilities will completely destroy monsters; there's no tough decision involving which one to kill before they get your lines, as both are easily destroyed.

Cover. Plasma. Rapid Firing. Thirsters are terrible in small point games.

[Tender Hands]

ok, in a small points game, how many plasma is there going to be, save Dark Angels. honestly. and with a 4+ invun. on the thirster that just isnt too bad. with a marines who take that many plasma, one, they're gonna suck in assault cause they must be dark angels which means they arent Blood Angels, and will therefore be shredded by a thirster, who is hit on 5's and wounded on 6's by marines. another good thing about BT's is they fly. meaning as soon as he's out, unless you are really not thinking today, he's gonna be in CC, or out of plasma range (if you happen to be between 18 and 24 inches from the plasma when he pops out, just fly full speed to the side of the opponents force with the least ammount of plas.


P.S. creeping death, do u have some bias against monstrous creatures? ive never seen u say one good thing about them... maybe i just havent looked deep enough, but yeah.

[shmee shmee]

by the way everyone. the battle was fought 2day and i annihalated him, thanx alot for advice 

[CD]

Good to hear, schmee schmee. Any fine moments? Nice, gruesome details?

To answer the question of "how much plasma" in such a small point game... I've played 500 point games (keep in mind we're talking about 1K) where I've had 4 Plasmas. Death Guard. Lots of people play it, and Khorne dies against it unless they stay away from monstrous creatures. Every game I shoot the crap out of their HQs, and when their zerks arrive, plaguemarines eat them allive. It's a very consistant massacre. I occasionally lose 1 or 2 plaguemarines in the final assualt, but escaping unscathed is also common, and my army isn't even that shooting oriented. A shootier SM army will destroy WE before they even make it to assualt, and int he unlikely scenario that they do, AM HQs tend to be able to take care of them very easily. The only way that World Eaters have beaten these common tactics is by not using monstrous creatures. Modest HQs, fire support, a good core.. you know, that crazy thing called balance. It occasionally helps to win games against other balanced forces (of which there are many).

Monstrous creatures can be used in larger games. Wait, let me rephrase that: Greater Daemons can be used in larger games, if used with Chains.