News: No news is good news...

Login  |  Register

Author Topic: How's Brexit been treating you?  (Read 416 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline PaxImperatrix

  • Staff Officer; Imperium Extraordinarius
  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4753
  • Country: nl
  • ATIA AMAT OMNES
How's Brexit been treating you?
« on: September 28, 2021, 03:34:43 PM »
With the end of the Brexit transition period now nearly nine months behind us, a discussion of the consequences of Brexit feels simultaneously premature and overdue. It’s not even been a year so we’re obviously still yet to see the full and long-term consequences of Brexit. At the same time a lot has happened since 1 Januari 2021. I’d like to use this thread to take stock of the consequences until now, see who has benefited from Brexit and who hasn’t, and perhaps speculate on what will happen next if we’re feeling adventurous. To get started, here’s my hot take:

Brexit has overwhelmingly hurt the UK:
* Brexit has greatly exacerbated a pre-existing HGV driver shortage in Britain. This has had numerous knock-on effects, including:
  - gaps on supermarket shelves;
  - fuel shortages at petrol stations;
  - UK waste water plants being told they may be allowed to discharge effluent that has not been properly treated due to chemical shortages caused by Brexit and the pandemic.
* Brexit has caused a shortage of workers in other industries as well, including hospitality and agriculture.
* Brexit has seriously reduced trade between Britain and the EU.
* Brexit has added fuel to the fire of separatism in Scotland.
* Brexit has created a border in the Irish Sea, loosening economic ties between Britain and Northern Ireland. This could potentially contribute to Northern Ireland leaving the UK.
* Brexit has arguably given Britain its sovereignty back. Caveats apply though. It no longer has any influence over EU lawmaking even though it will have to abide by EU laws if it wishes to trade with the EU. Any trade deal the UK signs with another third country will also force the UK to constrain its own sovereignty.

Brexit has been a mixed bag for the EU:
* The EU has lost a net contributor in the UK, so it will have to do less or convince its remaining member states to pay more.
* The EU has also had less trade with the UK, although this hasn't hurt it nearly as much as it has the UK.
* On the bright side, few if any national politicians are still campaigning for their country to leave the EU now that Europeans have seen what leaving the EU might be like.
* With Brexit done and the UK out, the EU can finally focus on other matters again, and this with one less member state making trouble, demanding special treatment, dragging its feet and generally sabotaging attempts to reform the EU.

For my own country, the Netherlands, Brexit has been mostly bad:
* The Netherlands will have to pick up some of the slack now that the UK is no longer contributing to the budget.
* The Netherlands has had less trade with the UK, although the UK isn't as large a trade partner for the Netherlands as is the EU for the UK.
* The Netherlands has lost an important ally within the EU and will now have to look elsewhere whenever France and Germany agree on something the Netherlands opposes.
* On the positive side, the Netherlands has benefited from UK companies moving some or all of their operations to EU countries. Case in point: certain financial firms.

On a more personal note, these past months I've been torn between disbelief at the UK's handling of Brexit and the tepid response from much of the UK public, schadenfreude at the expense of people who voted for Brexit and feeling sorry for all those that are now suffering the consequences. It's been quite a ride and it looks like it's not even nearly over yet.

So without further ado: What's your take on Brexit?

Offline Irisado

  • A Light in The Grim-Darkness ~ Guns Don't Kill People, Copyright Stats Do | Farseer | Reporting Live! from the Crime Scene | Somewhat behind the times
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11272
  • Country: gb
  • Soñando debajo del arco iris
  • Armies: Administrators must not play 40K
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2021, 07:36:23 AM »
First of all, kudos to you for being one of the few people who knows how to us the list bbcode correctly :).

Brexit has arguably given Britain its sovereignty back. Caveats apply though. It no longer has any influence over EU lawmaking even though it will have to abide by EU laws if it wishes to trade with the EU. Any trade deal the UK signs with another third country will also force the UK to constrain its own sovereignty.

It has not even arguably given the UK its sovereignty back.  This is because the UK never lots its sovereignty in the way in which the Leave campaigns outlined.  All countries across the word, irrespective of whether they are members of the EU, do not have the sovereignty that was outlined as far back at the Treaties of Westphalia.  It is arguable that they never did, but that is a separate discussion.  Sovereignty in the twentieth and twenty-first centuries has increasingly given way to globalisation and decision making has been made more and more at the supranational level not only within the EU, but also within other organisations or trade blocs (e.g. the WTO, the WHO, ASEAN, Mercosur, the UN, The Council of Europe, OPEC, NATO, and NAFTA to name just a few).

The idea put forward by the Leave campaigns that the UK would somehow gain back the sovereignty that it had when it was an imperial power with an empire was always completely fictitious.  A colleague of mine once described it as unicorn politics.  This notion that by being outside the EU the UK could take all its own decisions was and remains pure fantasy.  The caveats that you have outlined above are excellent illustrations of the UK's lack of sovereignty.

The arrogance of those who advocated leave is what really hurts in so many different ways.  One recent example is the furore over British expats potentially losing their luxurious homes in Spain, as well as those expats who live and work in the country who have integrated much more into the culture and society over there.  Many of them, particularly in the second group, did not get a vote in the referendum, but would have voted remain if they could have and now face the prospect of being thrown out, yet, the Brexiteers, of course, arrogantly claimed and assumed that the UK would get some kind of deal with the Spanish Government and all would be well.  Please also note that quite a few of these expats also could have taken steps to protect themselves from this happening, but did not do so and their fake outrage cuts no ice with me, but this is also a separate topic.

The arrogance of the Brexit brigade is also reflected by their persistent and ongoing denial that there is a problem.  All the problems that you have outlined above Pax are just dimissed as 'temporary issues', 'bumps in the road', or 'teething problems'.  They are anything but.  They are but the tip of a very sizeable and sharp iceberg that is inexorably moving towards this country, which are only now starting to emerge in the media because so much attention has previously been focused on covid-19.  Academics, such as myself, and other experts pointed out that all the current serious problems and others would occur as a result of Brexit all the way back when the debates were taking place in 2016, yet we were dismissed as 'project fear'.  Michael Gove went so far as to say that 'we've all had enough of experts'.  Well Mr. Gove, the tempation to tell you that we told you so is very high, at least for the expert writing this forum post.

The hypocrisy of Brexiteers is another major issue.  Tim Martin (Mr Weatherspoon himself) championed Brexit, yet now he has repeatedly complained that he does not have enough stuff to run his pubs.  This is because, of course, many of his staff came from the EU, especially Eastern Europe, and were paid at a cheap rate to staff the bar and serve the food.  Now, they no longer come to work in the UK because of Brexit and Martin cannot get British people to fill the gaps.  He is now demanding that the UK Government makes it much easier to get a visa!  The hypocrisy of the man!  It is outrageous duplicity, denial, and disrespect.  There is also a certain James Dyson, who championed Brexit, but moved his entire operation to Singapore and then did some kind of dodgy deal with Boris Johnson to supply ventilators for covid patients.  He is another duplicitous and mendacious individual.  There are plenty of others who have behaved in a similar way, but these two in particular stand out.

This brings me to the point of mendacity.  All politicians embellish, spin, and distort arguments to suit their own position.  What the Leave campaigns did went truly beyond any of this though.  They flat out lied and invented statistics, stories, and EU policies that were all untrue and in many cases never even existed.  I'm sure that I don't need to remind anyone about the £350 million for the NHS plastered all over the side of Johnson's red bus.  Dominic Cummings, who was the architect of that strategy told the BBC in a recent in-depth interview that he just made this up and that there was not basis in facts to support it, but that he knew that is was something that the remain campaign would have difficult arguing against.  This was disgraceful behaviour and it was far from the only example.  The claim that Turkey was about to join the EU was another lie that was put forward.  There was also Farage, the most mendacious, xenophobic, and racist of them all (and believe me there is some stiff competition for those dubious accolades in the UK these days) standing in front of a poster of Syrian refugees claiming that they were economic migrants from the EU coming to the UK.  These were all lies, yet many fell for them.

Brexit is not about sovereignty.  This narrative was constructed to evoke historical memory about the British Empire and to obtain a significant number of votes from older people (there is a high correlation between age and voting for Brexit, as well as education level and voting for Brexit).  What it is really about is ideology.  A majority of the Conservative Party is ideologically opposed to the European Union and diversity.  Many Conservatives are now so akin to the Republicans in the USA that they now perceive the world in a very similar way.  Boris Johnson's Government emulates the Trump administration in so many ways that it is disturbing.  One particular individual that resonates with me is Jacob Rees-Mogg, the current Leader of the House of Commons, who once gave a talk to the University of Oxford's student union in which he asserted that the EU was a threat to democracy.  That was clearly a serious case of projection because the only threat to democracy in this country comes from the current government that essentially wants to ban protests, eliminate protections for workers, roll back minority rights, restrict freedom of choice for women on abortion, interfer with university teaching, wage war against the BBC, and frame the EU as the guilty party for any problems attributable for Brexit.  It makes me ashamed and disgusted to be British.

Brexit has no benefits, there was never a case for it, and current events are proving that very starkly.  All Brexit has achieved to is make the poorest and those with the least access to opportunities and facilities even worse off than they were before (ironically many in these groups voted for Brexit) and to make the UK a far more polarised country than at any other time since I was born and probably even further back than that.  It has also seriously damaged the quality of debate and discourse.  There is a lot of anger, bitterness, and resentment and there has been serious damage done to the societal fabric of this country.  Brexit has legitimised xenophobia and racism, it has made segregration more likely and adversely affected integration and trust.

The truly sad thing about all of this though is that the people who took the country down this path are getting away with it and are going to keep getting away with it.  The majority of the media is owned by Brexiteers, so it does not scrutinise the Leave campaign or the current government effectively and so many people are so prejudiced about anything remotely associated with Europe that they refuse to admit that Brexit has been a disaster.  Let's see whether any of them start changing their tune when they cannot easily go to Spain on holiday, they receive massively high roaming charges for using their mobile phones abroad, or they cannot bring back their duty free from Calais via the Channel Tunnel.  Once covid subsides and the British public starts trying to travel to continental Europe more en masse maybe they will open their eyes.

For now though, all there is here is the immense pain, hurt, and, yes, in some cases anger, among those of us who fought valiantly to prevent Brexit from happening, but whose concerns were so dismissively cast aside by a very nasty bunch of ideologically driven politicians, media tycoons, businessmen, and a few very popular public figures (Ian Botham and John Cleese both immediately spring to mind).  For me personally, the morning of the result was still like a bereavement and having experienced a bereavement since I know that I am not exaggerating.  One day, I truly hope that these vile individuals are held accountable, especially Farage, who should be in court on charges of inciting racial hatred, and that the next generation will take this country back into the European Union.

United in diversity is a very poignant motto these days.  It is under threat not just in the UK, but also in Hungary and Poland, as well as in some other Central and Eastern European countries.  The populist far-right also has significant parliamentary representation across much of Western Europe too.  The EU may not be a perfect insitution, but no institution is and neither is any national government.  To be part of a project that was originally all about creating peace in Europe was a truly wonderful thing.  To have squandered that on the back of ideologically driven and mendacious fantasy politics is just soul destroying.  Whatever the Brexiteers say and do though, they cannot take my identity away from me.  I am European, I believe in the European project, and I will continue to dismantle with evidence all their mendacious arguments.
You haunt my in-box like an ex-girl friend could only dream of.

The Forum Rules - Please Read and Remember Them.

Soñando con una playa donde brilla el sol, un arco iris ilumina el cielo, y el mar espejea iridescentemente

Offline Calamity

  • Concussor Concussed Dice | Captain
  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3025
  • Country: gb
  • Cocking up miniatures since 1998
  • Armies: Kharadron Overlords, Bloodbound, Celestial Lions
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2021, 01:10:53 PM »
I just want to chime in here that in the past, the bastard brexiteers had me convinced of a lot of their arguments.  Call it naivety…or stupidity…or both. 

But the night before the referendum we all had a big talk here, and I’d been fighting with my family too, and after staring at the ballot for like, 5 minutes, I voted to remain.  The arguments made here (especially by Irisado) convinced me that it wasn’t the right thing to do.  Didn’t work out in the end but my conscience is clear.

As for how it’s affecting me, for a while there back in April, it looked like The Troubles were about to start up again, but in ‘reverse’.  That fizzled out but the DUP, the most hateful gullible idiots of them all, are still threatening to destroy the Northern Ireland executive and the peace process if the protocol isn’t overturned.

You want to know something ironic?  The EU actually guaranteed the safety of the Union between Northern Ireland and the rest of the UK.  It answered a lot of the questions republicans asked, and Sinn Fein themselves admitted this. 

But it just wasn’t enough for the DUP.  The fact that being in the EU meant that they couldn’t exclude immigrants, ban abortion or gay marriage or even close the boarder with the hated republic meant that they had to burn the whole thing down.  Only the only thing they burnt was themselves.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2021, 01:13:08 PM by Calamity »

Offline PaxImperatrix

  • Staff Officer; Imperium Extraordinarius
  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4753
  • Country: nl
  • ATIA AMAT OMNES
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2021, 02:40:39 PM »
First of all, kudos to you for being one of the few people who knows how to us the list bbcode correctly :).

Thanks for the compliment, but I must confess to not using the knowledge in this instance because it seemed like more trouble than it was worth! ;D

Also thank you for your well thought out reply. I stand corrected on the point of sovereignty.

In your reply you hold the Tories responsible for Brexit, and rightly so, but I must ask: what about Labour? It seems like they haven't been able to make up their minds about Brexit and have been sort of going along with it. What are they even thinking, not jumping into the vacuum of 48.11% (and growing) Remain voters who are currently as good as unrepresented in the UK's House of Commons? Is Labour waiting for the public to realise they've been duped and only then start opposing Brexit? I keep asking myself whether Labour's leaders are geniuses or idiots and I'm leaning more toward the latter by the week.

I wonder what will happen next. I assume the Tories will get rid of Johnson the instant they need a scapegoat to take the blame for the Brexit fallout. After that, who knows? If Labour keeps doing what they have been doing so far then I could see the Tories remaining in power and the SNP getting enough support to hold another independence referendum in Scotland.

I just want to chime in here that in the past, the bastard brexiteers had me convinced of a lot of their arguments.

Good on you for having the openmindedness to allow yourself to be persuaded! As you've said it's not changed the outcome of the referendum but there's immeasurable value in being able to look in the mirror and know you acted in the best interests of those you care about.

I'm glad the situation in Northern Ireland has been as stable as it has been. It could've been much worse, looking at recent history.

Offline Irisado

  • A Light in The Grim-Darkness ~ Guns Don't Kill People, Copyright Stats Do | Farseer | Reporting Live! from the Crime Scene | Somewhat behind the times
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11272
  • Country: gb
  • Soñando debajo del arco iris
  • Armies: Administrators must not play 40K
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2021, 03:55:40 PM »
The Labour leadership was very weak during the campaign itself.  Corbyn gave a very lacklustre and uninspiring speech in support of the EU and failed to connect with many of the party's working class voters, a significant number of whom opted to vote for Brexit after being seduced by Farage's anti-immigration arguments.  Corbyn was never a Europhile for various different reasons, notably being opposed to the neo-liberal economics of the EU.  While I have some empathy with that point, being in the EU forced UK Governments to improve workers' rights over the years, thus for the Labour leadership at the time to be so weak in supporting the remain campaign was, in my opinion, very poor.

The current leadership is weak about Brexit for different reasons.  Keir Starmer is trying to emulate Tony Blair in every conceivable way and is committed to gaining the support of the Murdoch press.  To thus push for the UK to rejoin the EU or be overly critical of Brexit would not help his cause.  I think that his policy is ill-conceived and based on an out of date concept of party systems and voter behaviour.  He is reverting to old arguments used during the 1990s and prior to the financial crash pertaining to the idea of catch-all parties and the centre ground.  Polarisation is much higher now than it was then and being on the centre-ground in the UK is no longer the guaranteed vote winner that it used to be.  Also, much of his supposed centrism is sounding very right wing, especially in his speech to the Labour Party conference today on law and order.

This is not to say that Labour supports the Johnson Government's deal or avoids blaming the Government for Brexit-related problems, such as the lorry driver shortage, but it stops short of offering any sort of plan to rejoin the EU or saying how it would do things differently.  Being in opposition in the majoritarian parliamentary system that we have does not foster policy making by the opposition, but the current Labour leadership seems so preoccupied by its media image that it does not want to talk about policy at all for the most part.  It's disappointing to say the least.

The biggest mistake of all was when most MPs from nearly all parties voted in favour of the referendum being held in the first place.  A referendum should never have been held on an issue of such magnitude that was almost impossible to reverse.  At least bad governments can be replaced every four or five years in most European countries.  Bad decisions in referendums are much less easily overcome.

Boris Johnson was the perfect tool for the Conservatives to 'get Brexit done', but he is not that popular within the party.  He is disorganised, not that smart, and is a liability in many respects.  He has no principles and shirks his responsibilities when it comes to taking unpopular decisions.  He always wants to be on the side that is popular with the people.  No prime minister worth their salt can be in that position that often and I have no doubt that his own party will get rid of him.  As much as his removal will please me, his replacement is likely to be even worse.  The Conservative Party is so right wing now that there are no Merkel style pragmatists to step into the leadership role.  This is a very worrying prospect.
You haunt my in-box like an ex-girl friend could only dream of.

The Forum Rules - Please Read and Remember Them.

Soñando con una playa donde brilla el sol, un arco iris ilumina el cielo, y el mar espejea iridescentemente

Offline Sir_Godspeed

  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Senior Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1943
  • Country: no
  • "Bees. My God" was an obscure Batman quote.
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2021, 08:01:16 PM »
I didn't know it was this bad. Sorry to hear about it.

Offline Kage2020

  • Knower of Things
  • Ancient
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6980
  • Country: us
  • Mar a tha, mar a bha, mar a bhitheas vyth go bragh
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #6 on: October 2, 2021, 12:19:44 AM »
Many Conservatives are now so akin to the Republicans in the USA that they now perceive the world in a very similar way.  Boris Johnson's Government emulates the Trump administration in so many ways that it is disturbing.
Speaking as a Brit that has lived in the U.S. for the past 15 years, the Conservative-Republican parallels are very notable as are, very broadly speaking, the demographics between the voting blocks. Your comments on polarisation also echo very strongly about the socio-political situation over at this end of the world.

Online Blazinghand

  • Warlock | Master of the Ravenwing
  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1226
  • Country: us
  • Die for the Emperor or die trying!
  • Armies: Eldar, Orks
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2021, 10:37:26 PM »
No big impact on me here in the States, but I've been organizing a Secret Santa in a community I'm in and we had to make UK a separate loop (we usually have north america as one loop, and europe+UK as another - we had to split EU from UK due to customs issues)
Quote from: Howard Zinn
There is no flag large enough to cover the shame of killing innocent people.

Offline PaxImperatrix

  • Staff Officer; Imperium Extraordinarius
  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4753
  • Country: nl
  • ATIA AMAT OMNES
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2021, 03:20:43 AM »
No big impact on me here in the States, but I've been organizing a Secret Santa in a community I'm in and we had to make UK a separate loop (we usually have north america as one loop, and europe+UK as another - we had to split EU from UK due to customs issues)

It never would have occurred to me that a Secret Santa would be affected by Brexit, but here we are. It makes sense now that I think about it. Thanks for sharing that.

In related news, the EU has offered to scrap 80% of Northern Ireland food checks. This is in response to the UK government continuously pushing for concessions from the EU and threatening to 'unilaterally  take  appropriate safeguard  measures' under Article 16 of the Northern Ireland Protocol. The reason is that, according to the UK government, the customs border in the Irish Sea between Great Britain and Northern Ireland is causing problems in Northern Ireland.

This is either a blunder or a stroke of genius on the part of the EU; I'm not yet sure which it is. On the face of it, the EU is giving the UK yet another finger. Before long they'll be taking the whole hand.

Alternatively this is a brilliant offer that, if accepted, will safeguard peace and stability in Northern Ireland and make the logistical situation in Great Britain look even worse in comparison. If the UK government does not accept what amounts to the full wish list of Northern Ireland citizens and business over European Court of Justice jurisdiction, it will reveal itself to be unreasonable and not actually serving the interests of UK citizens in Northern Ireland. That could bring Irish unification much closer.

As said, I'm not yet sure what to think of this. I'm not thrilled about the single market being compromised to meet the in my opinion unreasonable demands of the UK government, but I like how it effectively presents the UK government with a dilemma. I'd be interested to hear what you make of this.

Offline Irisado

  • A Light in The Grim-Darkness ~ Guns Don't Kill People, Copyright Stats Do | Farseer | Reporting Live! from the Crime Scene | Somewhat behind the times
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11272
  • Country: gb
  • Soñando debajo del arco iris
  • Armies: Administrators must not play 40K
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2021, 03:09:26 PM »
It is yet more sabre-rattling jingoism from Frost, who is unqualified to fulfil such a position of responsibility, and Johnson, who desperately needs to deflect all his failings and the failure of Brexit onto the EU as much as possible.  The EU cannot and will not allow the ECJ to be bypassed in the way in which Frost is demanding.  There is no way to do that without Northern Ireland being treated in the same way as the rest of the UK and that is not feasible within the parameters of the Good Friday Agreement, which I am sure that Johnson has never even read.

Northern Ireland has been doing better economically than the rest of the UK has since Brexit, so this idea that somehow the deal is bad for Northern Ireland is incorrect.  The only people who it is bad for in Northern Ireland are the DUP and some of its supporters who are just ideologically opposed to the EU irrespective of whether their opposition is based on evidence.  It is also worth remembering that the DUP did not sign the Good Friday Agreement and its members have only ever supported the peace reluctantly, as they essentially believe that Sinn Fein and the IRA were given too many concessions.  As such, I do not believe that the DUP is bothered about the Good Friday Agreement, while Johnson is far more preocuppied with being popular in England than in any of the regions because England is where the Conservative voter base is to be found.

The demands of the UK Government are unreasonable, the EU has bent over backwards with the latest offer, and if the UK Government does not accept it, there is going to be a significant problem.  The EU cannot make further concessions and peace on the island of Ireland could serious be undermined.  Combine all of this with the ongoing fiasco surrounding supply lines, HGV drivers, visas, and all sorts of other bits of paper work that are under reported, and this country is in a dire state.

I am seriously considering emigrating, but it's now so much harder for me to get a job in the EU than it was before because of, yes you've guessed it, Brexit!  I've never been much of a fan of the political culture of the UK, although it does still have some good qualities, but since Brexit it really has become a very unpleasant and divided country in which to live.  I do not see how anything is going to improve any time soon.
You haunt my in-box like an ex-girl friend could only dream of.

The Forum Rules - Please Read and Remember Them.

Soñando con una playa donde brilla el sol, un arco iris ilumina el cielo, y el mar espejea iridescentemente

Offline PaxImperatrix

  • Staff Officer; Imperium Extraordinarius
  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4753
  • Country: nl
  • ATIA AMAT OMNES
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2021, 01:47:19 AM »
I am seriously considering emigrating, but it's now so much harder for me to get a job in the EU than it was before because of, yes you've guessed it, Brexit!  I've never been much of a fan of the political culture of the UK, although it does still have some good qualities, but since Brexit it really has become a very unpleasant and divided country in which to live.  I do not see how anything is going to improve any time soon.

There's a job opening at my local university if you're interested. You'd be able to teach EU law in English. Because it's a part-time position you would have time to spare to learn Dutch to open up more career opportunities in the future. Not sure if this is exactly what you're looking for, but there are many more to choose from. Here's the Dutch Immigration and Naturalisation Service's website for more information on coming to the Netherlands as a UK citizen. I hope this helps. Feel free to PM me if there's more you'd like to know that goes beyond the topic of this thread.

Offline Kage2020

  • Knower of Things
  • Ancient
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6980
  • Country: us
  • Mar a tha, mar a bha, mar a bhitheas vyth go bragh
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2021, 02:28:25 PM »
Which raises the interesting question of whether "brain drain" is going to impact the UK? A lot of my former colleagues are miffed at Brexit and what the current status means for their research, so many seem to have been looking for other pastures.

Offline PaxImperatrix

  • Staff Officer; Imperium Extraordinarius
  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4753
  • Country: nl
  • ATIA AMAT OMNES
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2021, 02:51:53 PM »
This study from one year ago says yes.

'OECD figures and national government statistics have shown that the number has risen continuously since 2010 with an exaggerated spike since the Brexit referendum in 2016. The Oxford in Berlin/WZB British migration study interviewed UK citizens that have left the UK for Germany over the last 10 years, examining the reasons for their migration. The study data reveals the great sacrifices and risks many British citizens are taking in order to find some form of certainty in their lives after the Brexit vote. The results clearly show that for those Brits leaving the UK after 2016, Brexit was the main motivation.'
(Full text)

Similarly, a study by Adecco found that one in three 16-35-year-olds are considering leaving the UK to work elsewhere in Europe. That doesn't mean as many as one in three will leave, of course, but the writing is on the wall.

Offline Irisado

  • A Light in The Grim-Darkness ~ Guns Don't Kill People, Copyright Stats Do | Farseer | Reporting Live! from the Crime Scene | Somewhat behind the times
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11272
  • Country: gb
  • Soñando debajo del arco iris
  • Armies: Administrators must not play 40K
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2021, 07:25:40 PM »
There's a job opening at my local university if you're interested. You'd be able to teach EU law in English. Because it's a part-time position you would have time to spare to learn Dutch to open up more career opportunities in the future. Not sure if this is exactly what you're looking for, but there are many more to choose from. Here's the Dutch Immigration and Naturalisation Service's website for more information on coming to the Netherlands as a UK citizen. I hope this helps. Feel free to PM me if there's more you'd like to know that goes beyond the topic of this thread.

Thanks Pax :).  I really appreciate it.  In fact, The Netherlands is one of the countries that I am keeping an eye on because the universities there do deliver some degrees in English and British students used to attend quite a few Dutch universities prior to Brexit to avoid paying the ridiculous fees that they have to pay over here.  That particular job is not one I can do (I know nothing about law), but I am certainly looking out for Political Science/Politics posts abroad.

In further Brexit developments, the French Government has come out and stated what I suspect Macron's inner circle has been thinking for some time: Perfidious Albion: why French faith in Boris Johnson has nosedived | Brexit |.  France and the UK have had many diplomatic disputes in the past, most notably over the war in Iraq earlier this century, and repeatedly over reforming CAP in the EU, but this is going to a much higher level.  This is damning stuff and the criticisms of Johnson are entirely justified.

Outgoing Lord David Puttnam sums up the state of the UK post-Brexit: David Puttnam hits out at government as he quits House of Lords | House of Lords.  His analysis is spot on and combined with Brexit polarisation continuing to divide the country, the picture looks very bleak.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2021, 07:27:33 PM by Irisado »
You haunt my in-box like an ex-girl friend could only dream of.

The Forum Rules - Please Read and Remember Them.

Soñando con una playa donde brilla el sol, un arco iris ilumina el cielo, y el mar espejea iridescentemente

Offline PaxImperatrix

  • Staff Officer; Imperium Extraordinarius
  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4753
  • Country: nl
  • ATIA AMAT OMNES
Re: How's Brexit been treating you?
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2021, 05:03:41 AM »
Thanks Pax :).  I really appreciate it.  In fact, The Netherlands is one of the countries that I am keeping an eye on because the universities there do deliver some degrees in English and British students used to attend quite a few Dutch universities prior to Brexit to avoid paying the ridiculous fees that they have to pay over here.  That particular job is not one I can do (I know nothing about law), but I am certainly looking out for Political Science/Politics posts abroad.

You're welcome. Perhaps this one would be a better fit? I'll stop bombarding you with job openings now. :)

As for the articles you've shared, the word bleak about sums it up. It's amazing to me how many Brexit voters still stand by their decision after all that's happened since 1 January this year.

 


Powered by EzPortal