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Author Topic: Thoughts as to a different scale for 40k games  (Read 592 times)

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Offline Preceptor Teeth

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Thoughts as to a different scale for 40k games
« on: June 13, 2006, 04:47:24 PM »
I was reading through some of the other posts on this board, and noticed that everybody all seems to come to the same conclusions regarding the scale of a typical game of warhammer 40k- each round of shooting is only 1 bullet spent (2 if rapid fire), and game turns are only a few seconds. By comparison, even long range guns have pathetically short range. And this is accepted as part of the agreed-upon suspension of disbelief that makes 40k possible.

This got me thinking: when the heck are military engagements in a large scale conflict over in less than a minute? Imagine if the battles in WWII were that immediately decisive- the war would've been over in a week, rather than dragging on for years.

I also remembered a discussion I had a while back regarding the scale of the models- your average 6' tall imperial guardsman is about 1" tall on the board, yet his rifle has a maximum range of only 24"? I somehow doubt that most of the forces in the known universe would all be using weapons with a maximum range of 48 yards...

So I thought back to the scale in Battletech tabletop. The 'mechs took up an entire hex, but were only made that big for aesthetic purposes- in reality they'd have been no bigger than ants, and not very practical to use miniatures. The alternative would be to stretch out the battlefield horizontally to match the vertical height of the models, but that leads to battlefields that are hundreds of feet long. Thus, a compromise.

What if the same compromise were made in 40k? If your typical 24" range weapon is supposed to be the equivalent of an assault rifle, that would give the basis of a scale. Using the M16A2 as a basis, maximum effective range is ~600 yards. Therefor 24" = 600yds. Now, an infantryman in full field gear can move up to 12" and still have his opponent's turn to fight in an assault (which would constitute the same amount of time as his charge), so, assuming a person runs at ~12mph, he covers ground at 17.6 feet/second, thus will cover 600 yards in a little over 100 seconds. Assuming he runs 300 yards (his charging distance), then fights in melee during the opponent's turn, then each player turn is ~50 seconds. We can blur the line a bit for simplicity and just say 60 seconds for an even 1 minute.

As for shooting, watch any realistic war movie, or compare statistics- hits are surprisingly rare, and most fire is suppressive. Thus, each round of shooting would not represent a single bullet/bolt/energy blast, but rather a hail of fire at targets at very long range, often behind at least partial cover (even if they're not counted as being in cover for game terms). A single shooting roll would represent perhaps an entire magazine, with large magazine size contributing to some weapons being able to make multiple attack rolls within one turn. This also helps make things like ork ammo runts make a little sense- a grot carrying a box of clips for his master within easy reach would greatly cut the time needed to reload (especially for those heavily mechanized orks - I don't see them being able to carry out the delicate task of reloading with a power claw for a hand). Medical attention and vehicle repairs are similarly easier to accept.

It's already stated in the MRB that some of the attacks in assault are representative of short range shooting, so this fits well enough. Psychic powers could be explained as having to be summoned up with great difficult (fantasy movies with lengthy magic spells or channeling of energy come to mind) and harnessing the energies of the warp is tricky at best, so 2 minutes between powers might even be considered generous (or dangerous). It's also mentioned that a typical game of 40k is generally representative of a critical engagement in a much larger battle - imagine dozens of other 6'x4' battlefields stretching on in both directions, but the battle being played is the pivotal engagement- the scale I'm proposing more closely matches that analogy.

Morale would make a LOT more sense- I just don't see troops deciding to run away in terror for 5 seconds, then turn right back around and fight (and for space marines falling back - 5 seconds of movement doesn't really change your tactical position much). A unit with broken morale falling back for a couple minutes makes sense, especially if you consider that they're not moving at sprinting speed - perhaps their sergeant is giving them an inspiring speech on the matter of duty during their movement (or perhaps just threatening to have them all executed for cowardice).

Of course, this isn't without it's flaws. The scale of terrain becomes skewed (but then, it was in battletech for the same reason). Also, vehicle movement rates are a little odd- most vehicles don't top 6mph on the battlefield, and a fast vehicle at maximum speed is only ~12mph. Of course, even high speed vehicles would rarely be able to hit top speeds in typical battlefield conditions, so that could be accepted. It's also surprisingly difficult to hit a target moving at a mere 12mph if your typical range is ~300 yards, so the skimmers moving fast rule still makes sense. However, fast vehicles are too slow in comparison to troops on foot anyway, so changing the scale isn't going to fix that (not that it needs fixing anyway - skimmers and wartrukks are already fast enough in game terms).

And lastly, if one were to make models that matched this horizontal scale, a human being would only be about 2mm tall. That's even smaller than Epic 40k.  :-\

So, to summarize
1 player turn = ~50-60 seconds
1 full turn = less than 2 minutes
1 turn of shooting = a few dozen bullets
1" of movement/range = ~25 yards (25 meters)
Troops walk ~3mph (5kph) and charge ~12mph (19kph)
Jump troops and jetbikes move ~6mph (10kph) and charge ~18mph (29kph)
Tanks move ~3-6mph (5-10kph), fast and skimmers ~12mph (19kph)
Pro: Some things make a lot more sense
Con: Some things really don't look right, vehicle movement is a bit slow

Of course, none of this changes anything in-game, it's just a different way of viewing things that I'm sure will appeal to some and not to others.

Thoughts?

Offline Arcas

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Re: Thoughts as to a different scale for 40k games
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2006, 05:06:05 PM »
 
Quote
I was reading through some of the other posts on this board, and noticed that everybody all seems to come to the same conclusions regarding the scale of a typical game of warhammer 40k- each round of shooting is only 1 bullet spent (2 if rapid fire), and game turns are only a few seconds.
The shurikat fluff says that each shot in the game are actually dozens or even hundreds of shurikens flying towards the enemy.

Offline Preceptor Teeth

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Re: Thoughts as to a different scale for 40k games
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2006, 05:12:16 PM »
Okay, a single shot or single burst of shots - boltguns are supposed to fire bursts of 3 or 4 bullets at a time (depending on the pattern). I was making a generalization for ease of comparison. Besides, shuriken catapults firing dozens of shots per attack roll only supports my idea.  :D

 


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