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Author Topic: Inquistion an allies.  (Read 755 times)

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Offline Gal'rgae Neverborne

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Inquistion an allies.
« on: February 15, 2009, 03:09:00 PM »
Just a quick Q.

In the DH and WH dex's in the explation on Allies on pages 21 and 25 respectively it states.  "Allied Space Marines may not be used if any (Adepta Sororitas/Grey Knights) are present withing the (Witch Hunters/ Daemon Hunters) Force.

OK thats clear to me, if you taking a Daemon Hunters / Witch Hunters Force you can't take Any Marines if you have anything with the Grey Knights or Adepta Sororitas notes in its Profile.

I allways Assumed this meant if a player was using Grey Knights or Adepta Sororitas then no Marines could be present in the same force.

However on pages 33 and 62 of the respective dex's it shows Grey Knights and Adepta Sororitas allied with Marines. And it doesn't specifically state in the "using (Witch hunters/ Daemon Hunters) sections that if you are using a Marine Army and using Daemon Hunters or Witch hunter as allies that you can't take any Grey Knights or Adepta Sororitas.

Then i noticed this post http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172398.0 - Nobody said it was an illegal list.

Now I'm not sure any more.

Can Someone clear this up for me.

Offline -Dark Fire-

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2009, 03:44:43 PM »
It is fine for a regular Space Marine force to include WH/DH allies including Adept. Sor. units/GK units, but illegal for WH/DH armies, that have units with the Adept. Sor./GK rule in them, to ally with Space Marine units. Bit of a weird rule but hey, hope that helps. The difference is that the basic Force Organisation slots (HQ and 2 Troop choices) must be fulfilled by the original army before allies are added.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2009, 03:48:51 PM by Cleansing Flame »
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Offline Elemental_Elf

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2009, 05:03:42 AM »
Its perfectly legal to play a Space Marine army and have allied Grey Knight army and/or a Sisters Of Battle.

The fluff reason for why the reverse cannot occur is because, at least with the Daemonhunters, any Grey Knight Hero with half a brain would realize that any battle requiring the fully force of the Grey Knights would most assuridly mean that all other forces would need to be executed lest the taint of Chaos spread. There would be much hell to pay if an entire Company of Space Marines had to be executed... Its a massive waste of a finite resource, thus a Grey Knight Hero would never willingly allow such an event to occur and must subsist on the strength of his own Knights and the (expendible) Guardsmen.

Where I think the point that's eluding you is that there are 2 ways to have do this, you either have the Inquisition main or the Space Marines. If your Space Marines are your main force (i.e. fill the 2 Troop Choices & 1 HQ requirement) then you may include as many Grey Knight and/or SOB models you desire persuant to the restriction on the overleaf. The other way is to have one of the Inquisition as your main, in that case you may not have any Space marines if your list includes any Grey Knights and/or SOB models.

I hope that cleared the issue up for you!

Offline Fafnir

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2009, 05:48:26 AM »
Grey Knights: executing uninformed space marines and guardsmen since the 31st millenium.

Offline Gornon

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2009, 01:09:33 PM »
Quote
Company of Space Marines had to be executed... Its a massive waste of a finite resource, thus a Grey Knight Hero would never willingly allow such an event to occur and must subsist on the strength of his own Knights and the (expendible) Guardsmen.

Actually, the Marines get mind wiped.  I don't think there is any 'fluff' justification for this situation.  If Grey Knights are out, there is a big daemonic problem.  They will use any resource they can to fight the problem.  Thus, Marines nearby might be called on to fight the incursion, as represented by the Allies rules.

I think the funky rules comes from some sort of in- game balance issue then fluff.
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Offline Elemental_Elf

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2009, 03:01:26 PM »
Death of Personality is tantamount to murder, IMO, but thanks for the correction :)

Offline Gornon

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2009, 03:21:19 PM »
I don't think it's a complete mind wipe.  That would be pointless.  All of the Marine's training and experience would go out the door.  More importantly, the person that became the Marine, the most essential part, would be gone.  After all, Space Marines are individually chosen.  I think they just lose the 'bad parts' of the times they served with the Inquisition.  They remember mowing down cultists, smiting a few daemons, but that part about that glowing book containing the secrets of the universe gets edited out.
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Offline Fafnir

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2009, 12:11:54 AM »
If they deem a single soul corrupted, be it space marine or imperial guard, the entire group that took part in the battle is executed. You can mindwipe as much as you want, a corrupted soul is a corrupted soul.

Offline Draza

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2009, 02:21:43 AM »
The reason that SOB/GK cannot induct space marines is mainly a game play issue.

*SM would help cover the weakness of the codex, by providing cheap heavy/special weapons. Back in 4th edition, las/plas SM squads were very popular

*They didnt want the DH/WH books to effectively become another variant space marine army.  At least if you try it now, you have to take storm troopers

Offline Gornon

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2009, 09:29:11 PM »
If they deem a single soul corrupted, be it space marine or imperial guard, the entire group that took part in the battle is executed. You can mindwipe as much as you want, a corrupted soul is a corrupted soul.

Sure, once corrupted, it's forever.  However, people, even Marines, can simply be driven insane by what they have seen.  Or, perhaps, they have started to doubt their faith.  They are not corrupted yet, but they are on the path to corruption.  While it is just simpler to kill Guard off, Marines are too valuable for that, thus, mind-wiped, saving them from insanity or corruption. 
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Offline Fafnir

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2009, 01:41:37 AM »
Yeah, well... My Grey Knights are really really diligent in their work!

Offline Wombats

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2009, 08:59:48 AM »
Why does the idea of summarily executing Space Marines seem so familiar?

Oh, yeah!  Thats what I built my list for :)

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Offline Gornon

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Re: Inquistion an allies.
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2009, 09:07:35 PM »
Quote
Yeah, well... My Grey Knights are really really diligent in their work!

 ;D

And Draza makes some excellent points.  We feel like a separate codex, not a Marine supplement.  It's hard enough convincing players that we are not wimpy Marines. 
« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 09:10:10 PM by Gornon »
"Lift not my head from bloody ground,
Bear not my body home,
For all the earth is Roman earth
And I shall die in Rome."
-G.K. Chesterton, The Ballad Of The White Horse

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-Carl von Clausewitz, Prussian Military Theorist

Background Board Poster of the Year, '09

 


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