Topic: :o Army of guardians???

[Kilian]

hello there.

I was wondering whether the venerable farseer's out there think and army mostly made up of guardians is competive??

This is my list (i am a newbie so any advice would be helpful, I've check out the tactia on this site and learnt heaps already.)

On a side note im waiting, for the new strike force Ulthwe. And only plan on buying models which will be allowed on that list to begin with.

Seer council @233

Farseer
fortune ,witnessing and a singing spear and pistol

Farseer
mindwar, witch blade and pistol

2 warlocks  
augment, and close combat weapons.

1 warlock with Enhance, pistol and witch blade.

       Avatar @ 80

16 Guardians @161
Warlock Conceal ccw pistol

       12 storm Guardians (black) @144
        2 flamers
        Warlock enhance, witch blade, pistol.

5 guardians @95
2 support crew
Eldar missle launcher

        5 guardians (black) @90
        2 support crew
        Bright Lance

5 guardians @90
2 support crew
Starcannon

         5 guardians @90
         2 support crew
         Starcannon

3 Vypers @195
starcannon

          4 Dark reapers @233
          Exarch  missle launcher, fast shot

Comes to a nice plump total of 1411... I can think of what to fill the gap with Dcannon?

Yeah so tell me what you think. I think it could work. However those with experience may see it differently.

I plan to use this army at clubs as well as with my friends. I know it also looks like i wanna melt fancy poer armour, However i cant think of what to do against horde army, rangers for pinning maybe???

Also i plann to go to GT's with it (in australia it 1500 points still not 1850) so that why its 1500.

So i d like to be competive against all comers.

Thanx

Maechu

[riles]

Well, I'm a newbie too, and I'm playing my first game(s) tonight.

I have a very similar guardian based list, except for a full seer council which I'll be purchasing along with some wave serpents when they're released for the EOT campaign.

Here's what I'll be playing tonight (don't remember the total points cost, but it's around 1300):

Farseer
   Singing Spear + pistol
   Ghost Helm
   Runes of Witnessing
   Spirit Stones
   Guide
   Fortune
   MindWar

12 Guradians
   2 man Missile Launcher platform
   Warlock
        witchblade + pistol
        Conceal

12 Guradians
   2 man Starcannon platform
   Warlock
        witchblade + pistol
        Conceal

12 Guradians
   2 man Starcannon platform
   Warlock
        witchblade + pistol
        Conceal

6 Rangers

Vyper
   Starcannon

Vyper
   ScatterLaser

Falcon
   ScatterLaser
   Holo-Field
   Spirit Stone

WarWalker
   ScatterLaser + BrightLance

I know I'm incredibly vulnerable to assault, but I'll just have to try and avoid it until I can get my waveserpents and Storm Guardians or Banshees.

I'll let you know how I fared tomorrow. Hopefully I won't do too bad, but will come out of it will some valuable lessons.

[riles]

Ok!

Turned out my army was 1298pts. I played 2 battles, I won the first battle, although I'm not really going to count it as a victory because it was my full force vs. Colonel Shaffer's last chancers (very fun though).

The second battle was screwy from the start, it was me and a Khorne army (I know, I know, I wanted to get some play time though) vs. Blood Angels and Space Wolves 3000pts per side. We lost!!

The Angels and Wolves had the following (I don't remember all of it, so this is just a glimpse):
    3 dreads (1 ven SW, 1 BA, and some special BA one)
    Land Raider
    2 predator tanks
    2 tact squads
    5+ rhinos with tact squads and a death company
There was little to no cover, and those damn rhinos were able to deploy on turn 2 because the board was 8' x 4'  

An all guardian force is definately doable. I'm going to be adding the following units to my list to get it to 1500pts.
    another WarWalker w/Bright Lance and Scatter Laser
    another of each of the vypers listed above.

<b>Lessons learned:</b>
starcannons are great at tearing marines up, unless they're in a rhino, or are in CC with you!

My vypers and falcon were spectacular. Very hard for them to be taken down. My Falcon lasted the entire game!

Take at least one BrightLances!!!!

You cannot Mind War a Dreadnaught (they had to call the GW rules department for that one, because I argued that fluff-wise it made sense)

ALWAYS use Conceal on your units. You'd be amazed at how many times it saved me from some seriously heavy fire

5 man guard units (7 with the weap platform) is too small. You'll get creamed pretty quickly, and have to take a morale test after 3 guys get toasted in the first round of shooting.

ALWAYS move your vypers and falcons at least 6 inches!!

Rangers suck if all they have to shoot at are vehichles!

Don't be afraid to use Singing Spears on the enemy's rhinos. You should have seen the look on his face when I rolled a penetrating hit, and he only saved 3 marines (what a horrible roll that was ).

Mind War is a beautiful thing. Don't leave the craftworld without it!!!!

And last but not least ...... spread your guardians out. They're as good as dead if you get assaulted. I had mine fairly close together, so after he hosed a squad, he was sweeping in to the next squad (i.e. another tied up - good as dead squad).


     

[Kilian]

come on ppl

[Gilligan]

First off, I wouldn't make stormies black guardians.  The 1 addes WS won't really make a difference, and they're already enhanced, so they're good at CC anyways.  Make your ELM squad black.  An ELM that actually hits more than half the time rocks.

Don't get the D-Cannon.  They're not very useful, except on defense.

Which brings me to my next point: your army is slow.  Reaaaaly slow.  You can't even FoF with most of your guys.  The only way for an Eldar player to win is to use tactical superiority, ie, flanking with our speed.  Foot sloggers can't really do that, and tend to get chewed up.  I know this doesn't go along with your play, but I almost always suggest a squad of Striking Scorpions or Banshees mounted in a Wave Serpent to any army that lacks them.  They can do wonders.  If you don't want to do that, at least get some warp spiders.  They can flank your enemy and get around the back of tanks to do some real damage.

[-Aragorn-]

i am with giligan get a Wave Serpent and load it up with Scorps of Banshees depending on ur enemy.    Use them to mop up survivors from shot down transports and taking objectives ect.

Plus u really do need a combat ancor for your army so that when you Stormies fail u can trow in the specialists.

[Shadow Lord]

I am a warhammer vet after about five years of playing
Howver i am a 40K newb and it is radically different and a lot faster.
But here is my Biel tan list 1500pts

HQ
Avatar 80
Farseer Witchblade, Ghosthelm, spirit stone. Guide, Mind War. 135
Warlock Conceal 31
Warlock Enhance 26

Elites
20 Guardians 160

Troops
4 Banshees + Exarch Acrobatic 104
4 Fire Dragons + Exarch 134
4 Dark Reapers + Exarch fast shot 223

Fast Attack
3 Jetbikes 105
1 Vyper Shruiken cannon 50

Heavy Support
Falcon Grav Tank: Starcannon, Holo Field and Spitit Stones 190
Fire Prism: CTM, Holo field, Spirit stone. 180
Wraithlord: Star cannon 110

Total 1528

I play mostly Marines and Chaos Marines. So I will appreciate any input for tactics against them.
At my club you are allowed 50pts over spill. So 1500 points with 28 over spill. is okay at my club.

[Farseer-Hills]

Well, this is for the originator of the topic.

As a Biel-Tan player i apreciate speed. I think that you deffinetly need more speed!!!

[Vice]

HQ
Avatar 80
Farseer Witchblade, Ghosthelm, spirit stone. Guide, Mind War. 135
Warlock Conceal 31
Warlock Enhance 26

Give the Farseer a SP, Get rid of the spirit stone, and then get rid of Guide, it wont help much in a biel tan army. i recommend you ditch the Warlocks as well, then give your farseer Fortune to cast on the banshees

Elites
20 Guardians 160

Thats a rather large squad. i recommend toning it down to 14 + Brightlance and crew

Troops
4 Banshees + Exarch Acrobatic 104
4 Fire Dragons + Exarch 134
4 Dark Reapers + Exarch fast shot 223

oh my..... ok first off 4 banshees and an exarch isnt going to do much, so ditch the fire dragons and fill the squad up to 8 + Exarch + Farseer, and put them all in a Wave Serpent w/ TL Brightlances and a spirit stone.

Fast Attack
3 Jetbikes 105
1 Vyper Shruiken cannon 50

ditch the jetbikes they are tying up waaaaay too many points, and either ditch the vyper all together, or give him a CTM and Brightlance/Starcannon. Probably a Brightlance, just for more anti tank power, your falcon can handle the other guys

Heavy Support
Falcon Grav Tank: Starcannon, Holo Field and Spitit Stones 190
Fire Prism: CTM, Holo field, Spirit stone. 180
Wraithlord: Star cannon 110

ditch the fire prism. its taking up too many points and i wouldnt consider it very useful unless you actually want to get another farseer with the job of sitting back and guiding it (big waste in 1.5k games). You should have alot of free points. You might want to Consider a Harlequin Wraithlord, Due to its survivability.

[Rhòanin]

You might want to Consider a Harlequin Wraithlord, Due to its survivability.

whats the difference between a harlequin WL and a craftworld WL?

ive always thought that Iyanden wraiths should be better in some way than regular wraiths .... not to change the subject

[Vice]

Harle Wraithlords cost 95 pt, can have D-cannons, and have holo fields

[Rhòanin]

They [harlequin Wraithlords] have 3 wounds, toughness 8 and 3+ save and with a holofield get a 4+ invulnerable save on top of that and halve the enemies WS! They also soak up lots more firepower than your regular Wraithlord.

I got this from the harlequin tactics section ... whats this nonesense about an invulnerable save and halving WS (can they take Harle wargear?)? Im interested in taking a few harlequins in my Alaitoc army, does the almighty Vice think that fits fluff-wise? ::grin::

[biztheclown]

I think the mass guardian army can work.  You can fleet of foot the stormies.  Give them conceal instead of enhance if you're making them black guardians.  If you keep enhance, get plasma grenades, so you can charge trees.  

[fortune]

Ive been wondering this for a long time, and sience we were on the subject and all I thought I wold ask.

Where in the rules does it say you can take a Harlie wraithlord in an Eldar army? Is this just a idea someone had, or is it legal in game terms?

Sorry if I sound ignorant, but it would be cool if I could take one!

[supercar12]

my army stands at 3100pts and has 72 defender guardians on foot and i can tell you that big squads can win fights (with a little support). they pump out heaps of fire and are extremly resiliant. warlocks and farseers help maximise the damage or give protection  with powers and a squad of aspect worriers or a wraith lord help out in assult. great combination.

[supercar12]

 If you keep enhance, get plasma grenades, so you can charge trees.  


  you can assult trees now?

[riles]

  you can assult trees now?

Deamon Hunter armies can! In the new chapter approved, DH armies need worthy opponents, and since GW doesn't really want to invest any time in armies other than SMurfs, trees are considered opponents now. Each tree that a Grey Knight chops up, can be used as victory points!

Actually, I suppose if your units were in amongst the trees, you would be driven by duty to destroy any trees that looked chaotic.

[fortune]

If you keep enhance, get plasma grenades, so you can charge trees.  


  you can assult trees now?

you must be s***ing me! assulting and killing trees?