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Author Topic: 1500pts Space marines for League  (Read 1026 times)

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Offline Shade, Bankai King

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1500pts Space marines for League
« on: August 29, 2005, 04:15:16 PM »
At my local store there is going to be a 40k league and I need help revising my list.

Master-Lightning claws,jump pack,termie honors,melta bombs-175pts.
Master-Power Weaapon,plasma pistol,artificer armor,iron halo,termie honors,Furious charge,infultrate-171pts.
Command squad-Infultrate,furious charge
Sarge-power fist,termie honors,tele homer
Apothecary-termie honors
Company Champion-termie honors
Standard bearer-termie honors
total for squad-235pts.
Chaplin-power fist,artificer armor,termie honors,furious charge,infultrate-166pts.

5 Terminators-2 assault cannons-240pts.

8 Tactical marines-missle launcher,plasma gun-155pts.
   Sargent-Termie honors,plasma pistol-40pts.
5 Tactical marines-75pts.

Land Raider-pintle storm bolter,hunter killer missle-275pts.

Any suggestions on the list or tactical advise will be appreciated
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Offline Jester (Hadn't Changed His Profile Recently)

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2005, 05:11:27 PM »
you need a few more normal marines if you dont want to get swarmed
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Offline Squirrelloid

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2005, 05:33:52 PM »
At my local store there is going to be a 40k league and I need help revising my list.

Master-Lightning claws,jump pack,termie honors,melta bombs-175pts.
Master-Power Weaapon,plasma pistol,artificer armor,iron halo,termie honors,Furious charge,infultrate-171pts.

*boggle*

*has a heart attack*

Your first Master is horribly miscalculated - he's worth 145 points

Your second Master has way too much gear.  Plasma pistols are never worth it on command characters - a bolt pistol will still give him the extra attack, and is much cheaper.  Artificer armor is *never* worth its points - if you play him well, he will always die to pws, pfs, or monstrous creatures, making the points spent on the armor totally wasted.  And a 3+ should be good enough for anyone!  He cannot have both infiltrate and furious charge (nor can the command squad) - reread your codex entry, command squads may have *one* of the listed skills, not multiple.  Ditch furious charge and keep infiltrate, if you must.

2 Masters is sort of pointless - you gain no additional benefit from the second one.  I would keep the first master and give him the iron halo, and field a Master of Sanctity (w/ bp, TH, infiltrate) with the squad, or swap their positions and give the chaplain the jpack.  This will save you loads of points, and the chaplain is *better*.

Both of them need frag grenades.  And i do mean *need*

Quote
Command squad-Infultrate,furious charge
Sarge-power fist,termie honors,tele homer
Apothecary-termie honors
Company Champion-termie honors
Standard bearer-termie honors
total for squad-235pts.
Chaplin-power fist,artificer armor,termie honors,furious charge,infultrate-166pts.

Assuming you fielded everything right, i get 250 for the squad (including TH for the 1 normal marine).  But you didnt, you can't field that many veteran skills.  Read the entry again.  Basically, its impossible for any marine squad to have more than one veteran skill.

The squad needs frag grenades.

Well, if you field the Master with the command squad, you can still keep the attached chaplain (with another chaplain elsewhere... heh), or you could make one a librarian.  Again, artificer armor is a waste of points.  (Fielding artificer armor is basically inviting someone to make fun of you - here we'll kindly correct you and tell you its a bad idea, in a game your opponent will be laughing at you behind his face).  However, with 2 HQ choices and an attached character, thats a lot of points for a 1500 point game tied up in characters.  I'd drop at least one (probably the attached chaplain), and consider only playing one (your choice of Master or Chaplain).  You need more marines in this list.

If you give termie honors to the special characters, you have to give them to the whole squad.  Needless to say, this is almost never worth it.  Don't bother, just field more men.  Especially since this squad is too small for close combat.

I'd field it as follows:

Command Squad x10 w/ 7x bp+ccw, 2x melta, infiltrate, champion, frag grenades, searg w/ TH, pf, bp - 260 pts

I've doubled the squad size, dropped the standard bearer because he's less than useless, and dropped the apothecary because he's not very useful in a cc squad, for only slightly more (+20) points than your squad.  This gets more attacks in cc than your squad did, because each additional marine adds more than TH does (2 or 3 when charging vs 1 more from TH), and makes the unit more resistant to casualties (plus increases chance of penalties to opponent's Ld for being outnumbered).  I've also added some meltas to deal with incidental armor, just in case, and theyre also good marine killers.  If you must, the apothecary isn't an awful addition to that.  You'll find the points from all those points we've saved on the command characters.  (Ive dropped the tele homer because i would drop the terminators, see below).

Quote
5 Terminators-2 assault cannons-240pts.

With a large command squad, also fielding terminators gets a little questionable in 1500 points.  But if you're going to field them, add a 6th.  Even numbered squads work better if you play for VPs.  The point savings from characters should make this more palatable.  But if you're keeping "3" HQs (counting attached character), there is no way you can afford to field termies.

Quote
8 Tactical marines-missle launcher,plasma gun-155pts.
   Sargent-Termie honors,plasma pistol-40pts.
5 Tactical marines-75pts.

You need more troops than this.  You should have more points in troops than any other category, and about 40% of your points in troops.

Again, remember even numbered squads work better for VPs.

What do you expect a squad of 5 tactical marines with no upgrades to do anyway?  Thats just silly.

The searg should have a pf and not a plasma pistol.  If he's close enough to use the pistol, he should be charging.  Plasma pistols are never worthwhile when taken as wargear (and are only worthwhile when fielded as a unit weapon option on assault marines - they need the armor pen).

Quote
Land Raider-pintle storm bolter,hunter killer missle-275pts.

Any suggestions on the list or tactical advise will be appreciated

*heart attack returns*

LR is never worth it in a list under 2000 points.  It also has *no* purpose in this list - the only reason to field a LR is to deliver a valuable cc squad directly into combat, to prevent the opponent from shooting at it.  You could field *2* predators for those points, which would be much more effective, or a well-kitted devastator squad *and* a Land speeder tornado!  Further, with all the other huge point sinks in this list, this just makes you weaker.

Also, a LR should never be upgraded beyond xarmor.  Its expensive enough as it is, there's no reason to make it more of a target for meltas, bright lances, and other weapons which will shred it.

Total models: 27!  I've seen Deathwing field more in 1500 points.  At 1500 points you should have around/at least 50 models on the table to have any hope of doing well.  Otherwise you just don't have the man power, and they can overwhelm you with shooting - even heavily armored terminators can and will go down to massed bolter fire, not to mention plasma, lascannons, meltas, and all the other nasty weapons another marine list can bring to bear.

I would field 1-2 command characters, a large command squad if you must have one, and another 30+ marines in tact squads, plus a devastator company as a good place to start.  After that, you can start thinking about terminators or predators.  Leave the LR at home unless the command squad is going to ride in it, or you're going to play assault terminators, and even then only in games of 2000+ points.  

I would also keep command characters fairly minimal - eg, cc weapon(s) of choice, TH, mode of delivery (jpack or infiltrate or in a squad w/ transport), an inv save of some sort (halo or cc shield or rosarius), and maybe melta bombs.  Thats it.  Nothing else is worth its points, unless you field a librarian, in which case a familiar and a good power are worthwhile (but he comes with his cc weapon).
« Last Edit: August 29, 2005, 05:37:00 PM by Squirrelloid »
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Offline Shade, Bankai King

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2005, 05:51:10 PM »
Would it be a good idea if I drop the second commaner and used your command squad with the Chaplin and boosted the terminators to ten
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Offline Squirrelloid

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2005, 07:30:50 PM »
Would it be a good idea if I drop the second commaner and used your command squad with the Chaplin and boosted the terminators to ten

10 termies is too many.  I'd never field a squad bigger than 6, because they just become too much of a point sink otherwise.

You need more tactical squads.  Dont be afraid of them - they are good.  Really.
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Offline Jester (Hadn't Changed His Profile Recently)

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2005, 07:37:34 PM »
he doesnt own anymore
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Offline Squirrelloid

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2005, 12:12:44 AM »
he doesnt own anymore

That sounds like a strong argument to get more ;)
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Unusual SM armies

Angband Code:
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C-- S+ I- So- B- ac !GHB SQ RQ++ V- F: multipage inventory

Offline Shade, Bankai King

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2005, 03:37:23 PM »
Heres the list I have come up with  so far.

Master-jump pack,lightning claws,melta bombs,terminator honors-145pts.
Captain-storm bolter,power sword,termie honorsauspex,frag and krak grenades-100pts.
Command squad-2xbolt pistol+ccw,1 bolter,2xmelta gun,5xfrag,company champion
Sarge-powerfist,ccw
165pts.
Chaplin-ccw,frags-102pts.

Terminators-8xstorm bolters,8xpowerfist,chain fist,power sword, 2x assault cannons-440pts.

5 tactical marines-missle launcher-95pts.
5 tactical marines-75pts.
10 tactical marines-missle launcher,plasma gun-110pts.

Land raider-250pts.
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Offline Squirrelloid

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2005, 03:41:14 PM »
If you're not going to listen to my advice, i can't help you.
The ignorant shall fall to the squirrels - Chip 4:2

Unusual SM armies

Angband Code:
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S(ToME) W H- D+ !c f- PV+ !s d !P M+
C-- S+ I- So- B- ac !GHB SQ RQ++ V- F: multipage inventory

Offline Shade, Bankai King

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2005, 03:45:51 PM »
its not that i'm not listening its that i don't have the money for more marines.
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Offline Doom-Hammer

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2005, 11:44:50 PM »
Wow - what's the point in posting a list for evaluation then? Seriously - your command squad is a huge point sink and obviously you don't understand that you CANNOT have 3 HQ choices (a master, captain, and chaplain?)!!! Read your rules and either heed some of the advice on here or don't bother posting. Your army would not be able to stand up in a match against any type of decent force.

Offline Squirrelloid

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2005, 01:19:23 AM »
Wow - what's the point in posting a list for evaluation then? Seriously - your command squad is a huge point sink and obviously you don't understand that you CANNOT have 3 HQ choices (a master, captain, and chaplain?)!!! Read your rules and either heed some of the advice on here or don't bother posting. Your army would not be able to stand up in a match against any type of decent force.

Thats a little harsh.

And he doesnt have 3 HQ choices.  He has 2, 1 with a command squad and an attached character.  Read the SM codex page 21 "Space Marine Characters" point 3.  I recommend you read the rules before insulting other people's ability to understand the rules.

That said, i can't help but agree that without more basic marines, he isnt going to do well against a well-fielded army.
The ignorant shall fall to the squirrels - Chip 4:2

Unusual SM armies

Angband Code:
S WI(x) !Xok ht->ho !C P88 DL:5000' A++ R+++ Sp+ w: mjolnir or wrestling
S(ToME) W H- D+ !c f- PV+ !s d !P M+
C-- S+ I- So- B- ac !GHB SQ RQ++ V- F: multipage inventory

Offline Doom-Hammer

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2005, 05:25:03 PM »
Hmmm... I didn't know that. I stand corrected and apologize.

Offline Shade, Bankai King

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #13 on: September 3, 2005, 02:34:48 PM »
How about this

Master-jump pack,lightning claws,melta bombs,terminator honors-145pts.
Captain-storm bolter,power sword,termie honors,auspex,frag and krak grenades, iron halo-125pts.
Command squad-2xbolt pistol+ccw,1 bolter,2xmelta gun,5xfrag,company champion
Sarge-powerfist,ccw
165pts.
Chaplin-ccw,frags,termie honors-117pts.

Terminators-8xstorm bolters,7xpowerfist,chain fist,power sword, 2x assault cannons-440pts.

5 tactical marines-missle launcher-95pts.
5 tactical marines-missle launcher-95pts.
10 tactical marines-missle launcher,plasma gun-110pts.
5 Tactical marines-Plasma Cannon,Plamsa gun-105pts.
5 Tactical marines-missle launcher,flamer-101pts.
[CENTER

Offline Wuestenfux

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Re: 1500pts Space marines for League
« Reply #14 on: September 4, 2005, 04:47:05 AM »
If you want a list like this, pick 5 or 6 tactical squads each of which 6 Marines w/ heavy weapon, plasma gun.
Then fill the rest with counter-strike units. For this, I suggest to take
- 1 or 2 Terminator squads each of which 6 Termies w/ 2 assault cannons,
- 1 Assault squad of 8 Marines incl. Vet Serg w/ power fist.
- Master as given.
Throw some Tornados into the mix.

I wouldn't suggest a Command squad here as it's footslogging and so too slow and too vulnerable to shooting.

 


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