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Author Topic: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control  (Read 726 times)

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Offline l33t

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Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« on: January 5, 2019, 04:31:47 AM »
Hi all, I have been getting a few games in this edition with my new Eldar and have been having a blast. My army struggles against Knights + loyal 32 but then again I am not playing a tournament list.

One thing I notice is that while I am able to clean up infantry, I struggle to threaten the Centre of the board once close combat mid phase of the game starts. Custodies jetbike captains, Bjorn, Knights etc tend to roll into the Centre and hold it in the games I lose, and I find that if I donít get doom off regularly (which I am tending not to even with rerolls), I canít shift these threats and the bounce from combat to combat shutting down my units.

So far I have tried wraithguard for a solid core but they are just too soft in most games.

I am thinking about building a core of 2x wraithlords (with 1 or 2 shiricannons only) @1500pts with a spiritseer as a Centre control unit, as I think they seem solid and in my list (2 crimson hunters, 2 wave serpents, shining spears, guardians and avengers), are likely to be ignored for what is perceived to be more deadly.

They will replace my reapers, because for me the rest of my army leaves the reapers because I have no resources at this points level to protect them.

Have any of you tried a wraith lord core for this purpose? I can even fit 3 in at 1500 and have solid support around them, while they can provide anti infantry firepower, a tough center and melee threat for heavier hitters.

Thanks as always for your experience and insight.

Post Merge: January  5, 2019, 04:35:21 AM
In the future, please use the modify button. Double posting is against the forum rules, and for that reason, the system merged your posts.

Here is an example list of what I am thinking of doing


++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [85 PL, 1499pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

Gametype: Matched

The Path of War

Treasures of the Craftworld (1 Relic)

+ HQ +

Farseer Skyrunner [7 PL, 132pts]: 2. Doom, 4. Executioner, Shuriken Pistol, Twin Shuriken Catapult, Witchblade

Spiritseer [3 PL, 65pts]: 4. Protect/Jinx, 6: Seer of the Shifting Vector, Craftworlds Warlord, Shuriken Pistol

Warlock [2 PL, 55pts]: 4. Protect/Jinx, Faolchu's Wing, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops +

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 58pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Two Avenger Shuriken Catapults

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 58pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Two Avenger Shuriken Catapults

Guardian Defenders [5 PL, 95pts]: 10x Guardian Defender
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform: Shuriken Cannon

+ Fast Attack +

Shining Spears [5 PL, 104pts]
. 2x Shining Spear: 2x Laser Lance, 2x Twin Shuriken Catapult
. Shining Spear Exarch: Star Lance, Twin Shuriken Catapult

Shining Spears [5 PL, 104pts]
. 2x Shining Spear: 2x Laser Lance, 2x Twin Shuriken Catapult
. Shining Spear Exarch: Star Lance, Twin Shuriken Catapult

+ Heavy Support +

Wraithlord [8 PL, 105pts]: 2x Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Catapult, Shuriken Catapult

Wraithlord [8 PL, 105pts]: 2x Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Catapult, Shuriken Catapult

+ Flyer +

Crimson Hunter Exarch [9 PL, 161pts]: Two Starcannons

Crimson Hunter Exarch [9 PL, 161pts]: Two Starcannons

+ Dedicated Transport +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 157pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Twin Shuriken Cannon

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 139pts]: Twin Shuriken Cannon, Twin Shuriken Catapult

++ Total: [85 PL, 1499pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe
« Last Edit: January 5, 2019, 04:37:29 AM by l33t »

Offline Blazinghand

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Re: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« Reply #1 on: January 5, 2019, 08:34:56 AM »
I haven't played much with Wraithlords since the price reduction, but I find in 8e keeping them cheap, as you're doing, is the way to go. They lack the anti-tank punch of Wraithguard, sadly. If you're going up against Knights, I highly recommend taking swords on your Wraithlord, as they have trouble wounding knights in melee without the swords.

One thing that concerns me with your ability to defeat knights is the lack of high strength weaponry in your list. You have a couple Star Lances, the two Pulse Lasers on your CH Exarchs, and that's it. Everything else will be leaning heavily on Doom to wound successfully, and most of your stuff doesn't deal a lot of damage. Giving your Wraithlords swords will let them threaten a knight.

If you're really concerned about top-end anti-knight firepower, I'd change out the Starcannons on your CH Exarchs for Bright Lances. With their high strength and on the accurate CH Exarch platform, Bright Lances are a great weapon, capable of threatening Knights even if Doom whiffs.

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Offline l33t

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Re: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« Reply #2 on: January 6, 2019, 03:29:55 AM »
Thanks Blazinghand. I agree RE the brightlance upgrades but I also find that the difference in performance is small when upgrading and only shines when facing knights/Armour  etc... the star cannons are better against most other targets.

I am going to try the Wraithlord blob and will report back, I hope it will be similar in performance to Dark Eldar Talos blobs, just tougher.

Offline Partninja

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Re: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« Reply #3 on: January 6, 2019, 10:34:18 AM »
Talos blobs are stronger in that you can take a lot more of them, they can get an invul save and a Feel no pain roll.

If you want to run Lords I would double down and just go Iyanden. This would give the most staying power that you're looking for. Take 3 Lord's, a guardian blob and some in serpents. They'll be quite durable due to the craftworld trait and stratagems. Also run the wraith host specialty detachment to beef up the lords more.

Offline magenb

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Re: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« Reply #4 on: January 6, 2019, 05:26:07 PM »
Jinx is nice, but set one of your seers up to use Empower on a unit of spears, especially if you merge the two units. Wraithlords against knights... you might find they get blown off the table before getting into close combat.

Custodies have a solid armour and invul saves, so they are a right pain to deal with, but sheer volume of firepower is what will remove them, so the conventional wisdom would be Dark Reapers, you can also get away with mass scatterlasers, some thing like jetbikes or war walkers.



Talos blobs are stronger in that you can take a lot more of them, they can get an invul save and a Feel no pain roll.

Yeah Talos have much better staying power over the wraithlords, it is kind of surprising that wraith constructs don't get feel no pain and that the wraithlord doesn't get an invul option.

Offline Partninja

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Re: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« Reply #5 on: January 6, 2019, 06:01:48 PM »
Lords have a higher toughness compared to Talos. So there's that. They also get more weapon options for what it's worth, even if they're not exactly better. If they could also be taken in squads of three, that'd be just fine. As it is being limited to three is what really hurts their use.

Offline l33t

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Re: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« Reply #6 on: January 7, 2019, 05:27:54 AM »
Some great ideas all, I like the wraithhost idea for a Spearhead of Iyanden wraith lords with seer and the psytronome. I also like the idea of empower on the spears.

This thread has given me some good ideas thank you.

I really wish more of the runes of battle worked on wraithlords, but then again the negative effects work on their targets.

Offline admironheart

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Re: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2019, 11:35:07 PM »
I find Wraithlords can fall quite fast. To protect them I try to keep them as non threats.
1 Shuriken Canon + Ghost Glaive. That one rushes forward with Banshees or a Banshee mask Autarch. He wont take down a Knight but usally 1 good hit will get thru and with a reroll you can peel off some wounds and then will get shot up...This will allow your Wraith units or Fire Dragons, etc to finish your target off.
"Battles are decided by slaughter and maneuver.  The greater the general, the more he contributes in manuever, the less he demands in slaughter"...Winston Churchill

Offline l33t

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Re: Craftworld counter assault for Centre control
« Reply #8 on: April 3, 2019, 03:21:03 AM »
Hi everyone, here is the list I have been using for games locally which has seen a decent result for me. Yes I still struggle with knights, if I get lucky I can take one down 20 wounds in a turn using only fliers, smite and the spears, while the rest of the army targets infantry.

I find the Armour saturation in this list helps my wraithlords survive regularly, as my opponent tends to fixate on the hemlock, serpents and hunters in the first turn. I use the hemlock and bikes to assassinate or shut down targets I am afraid of, and the serpents to block melee units and vehicles while my crimson hunters and psykers go after the hard targets.

When my wraithlords hit, they have really surprised my opponents, especially if they arrive semi intact (Iyanden) and I can get Enervate off on their opponent.

Let me know what you think, the list is super fun to play with, I have struggled recently against snipers who take out my squishy warlocks and spiritseer and also with the fact that I have a very minimal back field presence (windriders only)


++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [59 PL, 1117pts, 8CP] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

Detachment CP [5CP]

Gametype: Matched

The Path of War

+ HQ +

Farseer Skyrunner [7 PL, 132pts]: 2. Doom, 4. Executioner, Shuriken Pistol, Twin Shuriken Catapult, Witchblade

Warlock [2 PL, 55pts]: 5. Quicken/Restrain, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

Warlock [2 PL, 55pts]: 4. Protect/Jinx, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops +

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 58pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Two Avenger Shuriken Catapults

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 58pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Two Avenger Shuriken Catapults

Dire Avengers [6 PL, 121pts]
. 9x Dire Avenger: 9x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Shimmershield & Power Glaive

+ Fast Attack +

Shining Spears [10 PL, 206pts]
. 5x Shining Spear: 5x Laser Lance, 5x Twin Shuriken Catapult
. Shining Spear Exarch: Star Lance, Twin Shuriken Catapult

Windriders [4 PL, 69pts]
. 3x Windrider - Scatter Laser: 3x Scatter Laser

Windriders [4 PL, 69pts]
. 3x Windrider - Scatter Laser: 3x Scatter Laser

+ Dedicated Transport +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 147pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Twin Shuriken Cannon

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 147pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Twin Shuriken Cannon

++ Air Wing Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [28 PL, 532pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

+ Flyer +

Crimson Hunter Exarch [9 PL, 161pts]: Two Starcannons

Crimson Hunter Exarch [9 PL, 161pts]: Two Starcannons

Hemlock Wraithfighter [10 PL, 210pts]: 4. Protect/Jinx, Spirit Stones

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [27 PL, 350pts, -1CP] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Iyanden: Stoic Endurance

Specialist Detachment [-1CP]: Wraith Host

+ HQ +

Spiritseer [3 PL, 65pts]: 6. Empower/Enervate, Craftworlds Warlord, Psytronome of Iyanden, Revered By The Dead, Shuriken Pistol

+ Heavy Support +

Wraithlord [8 PL, 95pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Catapult, Shuriken Catapult

Wraithlord [8 PL, 95pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Catapult, Shuriken Catapult

Wraithlord [8 PL, 95pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Catapult, Shuriken Catapult

++ Total: [114 PL, 1999pts, 7CP] ++

Created with BattleScribe


 


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