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Author Topic: Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?  (Read 1702 times)

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Offline Turork

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Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?
« on: December 28, 2013, 09:32:14 PM »
So reading around it seems that there are 3 ways to do ladz..

Foot slogga squads o' 30.

Trukk Boyz

Battle wagon boyz..

I love tha idea of KOS Trukk boyz but the small unit size and low AV are putting me off. 

If you have one of my previous posts you will see that I cant get the idea of using the spare sluggas and choppas to make Savage Ork Slugga boyz.  I see that everyone is running Shootas atm.  Am I completely mad to want to put 20 savage slugga lads in a Battle wagon? 

I am also trying to be clever here.. When a new book arrives they mix up what good so you buy new models.  If everyone is running shootas maybe I should have a few sluggas on the side.. no point in getting them shootas if the rules change soon.  Orks need some more combat punch.. its highly likely they will mix up sluggas to be besster!

So maybe 30 Shoota lads and 20 Sluggas in a Battle wagon is a good way to start?  Call me mental but is it worth making the sluggas hard boyz? 



"and while it is possible to engage them in CC, as Orks we should try and give them a wide birth."   Jesus bring on that new book! Strike first on the charge would be nice! :P

Offline Spectral Arbor

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Re: Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2013, 10:12:33 PM »
Well... Shootas are kind of the way to go right now, because you want to soften your target before you assault. You'll probably do more damage over the course of the game with shootas than sluggas.

That's a 6th edition thing, and unless they massively rework choppas a-la-4+ and that's it... I'm thinking Shootas will be a safe bet for several years, and probably into 7th.

Offline AXEBLADE

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Re: Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2013, 03:05:18 AM »
I generally run my boyz as follows
If in trukks I will run the first 2 squads with sluggas and the third with shootaz.
Recently I have been running the trukk nobz with big choppas to save points. It seems to be working alright given that marines will just challenge and kill me before I get to strike regardless of what I do.

In battlewagons I always run mine as sluggas. I will normally upgrade a squad to be ard boys.

On foot I run mine the opposite of my trukk boyz. So the first 2 will be shoota boyz and the third will be sluggas.


The basic logic is that the guys in transports want to be in combat and can get there fast while the guys on foot want to be in combat but can't get there fast so they might as well spend a turn or 2 shooting on the way.

I use a mixed list (normally 2 slugga trukk boyz and 2 shoota foot boyz)
Generally i run my trukk boyz straight into combat. Eventually they will either be wiped out (which is bad) or will run away (voluntarily or otherwise) to hide on objectives (or sometimes get back in their trukk and wreck things off the boarding plank)
Meanwhile my foot orks have gotten close and started shooting things, which means soon they will charge things. This means that my opponent can't really afford to finish off the slugga boy squads.

A quick note on the ard boyz. In my experience their armour is either completely useless or its made from terminator armour. That just seems to be my luck with it. Its also a great thing to use against an opponent with lots of flamers as the overwatch doesn't just kill them outright (heavy flamers are still a problem though)

Also ork boyz are always going to be a safe bet regardless of how they are armed. And you will never have enough.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2013, 03:08:38 AM by AXEBLADE »

Offline Turork

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Re: Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2013, 12:17:49 AM »
ahh ok.  :) I feel much better.  and that really explains sluggas vs choppas nice n logically. 

also I don't know why but I was thinking the trukks were completely useless these days :/ 
"and while it is possible to engage them in CC, as Orks we should try and give them a wide birth."   Jesus bring on that new book! Strike first on the charge would be nice! :P

Offline OD from TV

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Re: Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2013, 02:57:21 AM »
Its been a good while since I saw a Shoota v. Slugga conundrum.  6th really pushes the balance more towards the Shoota side, what with the benefits of Overwatch, loss of bonus attacks and Furious Charge when charging multiple units, and a de-emphasis of Assault in general across the board.

But that doesn't mean the Sluggaboy is out of the running completely.  At the moment they both cost the same amount of points, but I'll bet 20 Teef that in the new codex swapping for the Shoota will cost a point or two OR that Shoota and Slugga boyz will return to being two different unit entrees.  (Its most likely the first will be the case, but as it goes Orkz have the smallest variety of Troops in the game, hence why Ork HQs allowed some variance with the Troop slots, which started a trend for armies that didn't really need that bonus)

I used to swear by a 2 to 1 mix of Sluggas to Shootas, but times do change.  Before Run came about, I had each Slugga mob with 3 Rokkits, and frankly they were my best footslogger anti-tank.  But for me I learned that closing the gap between the enemy to allow an earlier Assault with the Sluggas is more important than a couple Rokkit shots.  In a similar fashion, with Overwatch in the mix I'd rather have Shootas, and while it may just be my area, I've noticed a stark decrease of Transport vehicles which again make Shootas a bit more viable with their longer threat range.

When it comes to Trukk Boyz, it's a real hard call.  Shootas allow for drive by shooting, a tactic greatly loved by Skeetergod (one of the big posters here), but with such a small size and the Assault bound nature of a Trukk mob the extra attack is really attractive. 

With Boyz on a Battlewagon, I think it really depends on how you have your wagon laid out. If your going for a real Dakkawagon with lots of Big Shootas, than I think Shoota boyz are your prime choice.  In the same fashion if your going for pure Transport into Assault, than Sluggas are your best bet.  It's all about what your main plan of strategy is.

also I don't know why but I was thinking the trukks were completely useless these days :/ 
Trukks are still viable after the Hull Points rules, but in my opinion that's only because of Ramshackle.  Of course should Skeetergod make a reply here, he'd likely make a number of good points as to how Trukkboyz are amazing.  When it comes to the old school Kult of Speed, I was always more on the side of Buggies and Bikers than Trukks.

Peace
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Offline Ork E Nuff

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Re: Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?
« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2013, 01:10:52 PM »
Ok...I'm gonna toss my two teef in here...

To start with, I'm an old foot slogger...my time in service and with this game have been foot slogging.  It's the way I am.  Vehicles are great, but I just can't bring myself to put all my eggs in the AV 10 baskets that we have available to us at present.  Shootas are not that bad.  The last time I played, I took a 30 ork unit of shootas with 3 big shootas.  They held up in a piece of terrain and made short work of a demon prince or whatever they call themselves these days...Overwatch is wonderful, even at BS 1...strength in numbers; the more dice you roll, the more your chances of rolling those 6's...But I digress...I have always run at least 1 vehicle, now with a unit of burnas and a big mek.  I always run 30 'ard boyz (love 'em or hate 'em, I have always had success with 'em).  They have more than paid for themselves over the long run...I haven't seen much action with trukks, they usually get blown up by turn 2 and then you have an under-strength squad standing there looking all embarrassed...I guess orks use the trukks now more for mobility and strikeability, rather than survivability.   In the old days, before HPs, you could drive up, jump out, fight, and remount to look for someone else.  I suppose with massed vehicles, it would be different from what I've done in the past. 

Bottom line:  You adapt your resources to your style of play...there's not a real "right" answer, just opinions of what coulda/shoulda worked in any given situation.  If you want to run 20 'ard boyz in a battlewagon up the middle and deposit them right into the enemy's front line, go for it!  Because to quote on of our bosses here, "Orks never LOSE!"  We win at varying degrees... :o
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Offline SKEETERGOD

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Re: Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?
« Reply #6 on: January 1, 2014, 02:04:40 PM »
Ahhhh! The Trucks...

Like all things ork, take lots of them. You have to give your opponent too much to shoot at. My normal army nowdays has six truck boy squads, three shoota boys and three slugga boys. The slugga boys have a nob with PK and boss pole, and the shoota boys the nob has the big shoota and a big choppa as well as the boss pole. All of them are a full 12 orks (including the nob)

All trucks have red paint, rams, and boarding planks. The extra inch really pays off as you can now move 26" with the turbo boost to get around fast, not to mention the 7" move, a 6" disembark with 2D6 charge really increases your threat range. The rams allow you to go through terrain instead of around it, making for some spectacular sneaky moves to get into your opponents army as fast as possible.

A separate paragraph on the plank is in order. It allows the nob to attack vehicles without the rest of the squad getting out to get shot up. So that land raider full of terminators can get killed, and the boys are not subject to reprisal as the now dismounted terminators have to attack the truck instead of the boys. The great thing I like about the plank is it allows you to attack dreadnoughts without having to loose most of the squad. Not to mention that the dreadnought does not get to fight back. It is a great piece of kit for dealing with those pesky death company dreads. Makes BA players cry and in a few games made them move their DCDs away from my truck boys (using the excuse that they had better targets elsewhere.   :D Not to mention other things like no overwatch fire from troops inside vehicles, no flechet launchers from tau, etc, etc, etc.

As OD mentioned earlier, you cannot attack with only one squad, you have to combine your attacks, at least two truck boy squads need to attack. I pair them one shoota squad and one choppa squad. the shoota boys will of course declare first so that they suffer the overwatch and this leaves the choppa boys at full strength to do their damage (44 attacks plus nob is a good thing).

Of course there are other things in the army, like a battle wagon full of burna boys, a battle wagon full of tank bustas, a few trios of rockit buggies, and a green baron or even a full squad of coptas (depending on points). All led by a single big mek with  KFF and boss pole riding with the burna boys. I don't spend the points on a war boss unless I am running biker nobs, so there is hardly any points spent in the HQ part of my army as it is all in trucks, buggies and battle wagons.

A note on the battle wagon, I have gone to four rockits on each lately, leaving the off the death roller from the tank busta boys wagon as I don't want them in combat, just shooting at stuff. I also give them the red paint as the extra inch always comes in handy. The four rockits make for some semi effective anti air capacity. (The LGS where I play are IA-phobic)

A sneaky but effective tactic for the tank bustas is to move their BW and then dismount the bustas so that their own BW is blocking line of sight so they can shoot at the purifier squad instead of at the rhino.

In one game about a month ago I ran a unit of lootas in the BW instead of the tank bustas (as I knew I was going against a flyer heavy SM army) and it worked rather well clearing the skys of pesky flyers, as well as gunning down a whole squad of DA bikers in one turn. Of course I am still torn between lootas, flash gits, and the tank bustas, so I alternate just to keep things interesting.

As for set up, I always use the football line formation. BW with KFF mek in the quarterback position, a unit of rockit buggies as the center, trucks on either side but within the KFF range. The other BW on a flank, and a squadron of rockit buggies on the other flank in the receiver positions. The green baron usually in reserve or on the far outside edge of the board.  This way if I go first, all is well and I am in position to do damage to my opponents army very quickly. If my opponent goes first or steals the initiative, then my army has a bit of protection from the KFF. Then it is off to the races to divide and conquer as fast as possible. A key point to make is to take on half of his army with most of yours, then go after the other half once the first half is decimated. Imaging the letter "L" where the short leg is where you start your army, and advance across the board, basically broadsiding their army so that your whole ork mob is taking on just an edge of his army and he has to turn and line feed you his units. Works most of the time, and when it doesn't, well lets just say there are seldom any witnesses left in my army and those marines are such story tellers....

If you are worried about casualties, you are playing the wrong army. Orks and all their kit are expendable. That is why we take so many, as we will just grow more. So go out there and krump; kill the enemy, see them flee before you, and hear the lamentation of their players.
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Offline Turork

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Re: Shotgun Ladz! How to sort out da boyz?
« Reply #7 on: January 1, 2014, 05:31:09 PM »
Got a few questions but just thought id post a quick one before bed. 

'see them flee before you, and hear the lamentation of their players.'  Your using the Konan wording, but did you know that it was adapted from a Ghengis Khan quotation?  Truth be told I don't know why the changed it the Ghengis one is better!! ;)
"and while it is possible to engage them in CC, as Orks we should try and give them a wide birth."   Jesus bring on that new book! Strike first on the charge would be nice! :P

 


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