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Author Topic: Corsair POC: Scions of the Void  (Read 40014 times)

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Offline elpana01

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #80 on: May 5, 2012, 03:32:17 PM »
Yup 2 small squads of 3 bikes.  1 Cannon, 1 Felarch with fusion and pw, and 1 plain.  Cheap enough to keep them expendable, yet cause lots of pain under the right circumstances.

Offline Zilverscale

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #81 on: May 5, 2012, 08:04:13 PM »
Ok so been a while since I posted anything here  :-[

But got time again for a bit of 40k work these days so went back to corsairs and what I have and whats in the mail at the moment  ;D
Bold denotes what I have and underscored denotes what is in the mail at the moment.

HQ
Void Dreamer                                                                            130 (joins Corsairs A)
- Witchblade, Jetpack, Gyrinx, Spirit Stones

Elites
Shadow Specters   6x                                                                 247
- Exarch: Prism Blaster, Cynosure

Troops
CorsairsA 10x                                                                            165
- Jetpacks, Fusion Gun 2x, Shuri Cannon 2x
CorsairsB 10x                                                                            165
- Jetpacks, EML 2x, Felarch: Shuri Pist, P. Weap
Corsair Jetbikes 3x                                                                      85
- Shuri Cannon
Corsair Jetbikes 3x                                                                      85
- Shuri Cannon
Wasps 2x                                                                                  160
- Shuri Cannon 2x, EML 2x

Fast Attack
Nightwing                                                                                  145

Heavy Support
Phoenix                                                                                     225
Warp Hunter                                                                              170
- Holo-fields, Spirit Stones
Warp Hunter                                                                              170
- Holo-fields, Spirit Stones


Total Points: 1747
KP: 11
Scoring: 4

(As to the Phoenix I needed to order another one...yes I already have 1 lol but thats the Void Dragon Phoenix and didn't want to go chopping of his starcannons)
« Last Edit: May 6, 2012, 07:04:25 PM by Zilverscale »

PAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Offline Khorne25

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #82 on: May 6, 2012, 05:08:04 PM »
Yup 2 small squads of 3 bikes.  1 Cannon, 1 Felarch with fusion and pw, and 1 plain.  Cheap enough to keep them expendable, yet cause lots of pain under the right circumstances.

Interesting... Im going to have a think on this

Troops
CorsairsA 10x                                                                            165
- Jetpacks, Fusion Gun 2x, Shuri Cannon 2x
CorsairsB 10x                                                                            165
- Jetpacks, EML 2x, Felarch: Shuri Pist, P. Weap
Corsair Jetbikes 3x                                                                      85
- Shuri Cannon
Corsair Jetbikes 3x                                                                      85
- Shuri Cannon
Wasps 2x                                                                                  160
- Shuri Cannon 2x, EML 2x

Fast Attack
Nightwing                                                                                  145

Heavy Support
Phoenix                                                                                     225
Warp Hunter                                                                              170
- Holo-fields, Spirit Stones
Warp Hunter                                                                              170
- Holo-fields, Spirit Stones


Total Points: 1747
KP: 11
Scoring: 4

(As to the Phoenix I needed to order another one...yes I already have 1 lol but thats the Void Dragon Phoenix and didn't want to go chopping of his starcannons)

Yo, good to see youre back!

I think the Felarch should be in the close range Corsairs squad. I wouldnt bother with a power weapon though

Dont mix weapons on the Wasps and keep their squadrons with matching weapons.

I am looking forward to seeing an army picture ;)


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Offline Zilverscale

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #83 on: May 6, 2012, 07:07:20 PM »
Ok did some redoctering with above comment in mind.

Dropped the Wasps in favour of 2 more scoring units

The Felarch is in the long range unit for Ld purpossess only so indeed dropped the Pistol and P. Weap from him.

Bold denotes what I have and underscored denotes what is in the mail at the moment.

HQ
Void Dreamer                                                                            130 (joins Corsairs A)
- Witchblade, Jetpack, Gyrinx, Spirit Stones

Elites
Shadow Specters   6x                                                                 247
- Exarch: Prism Blaster, Cynosure

Troops
CorsairsA 10x                                                                            165
- Jetpacks, Fusion Gun 2x, Shuri Cannon 2x
CorsairsB 10x                                                                            155
- Jetpacks, EML 2x, Felarch
Corsair Jetbikes 3x                                                                      85
- Shuri Cannon
Corsair Jetbikes 3x                                                                      85
- Shuri Cannon
Corsair Jetbikes 3x                                                                      85
- Shuri Cannon
Corsair Jetbikes 3x                                                                      85
- Shuri Cannon


Fast Attack
Nightwing                                                                                  145

Heavy Support
Phoenix                                                                                     225
Warp Hunter                                                                              170
- Holo-fields, Spirit Stones
Warp Hunter                                                                              170
- Holo-fields, Spirit Stones


Total Points: 1747
KP: 12
Scoring: 6

(As to the Phoenix I needed to order another one...yes I already have 1 lol but thats the Void Dragon Phoenix and didn't want to go chopping of his starcannons)

PAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Offline elpana01

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #84 on: May 7, 2012, 11:34:30 AM »
I'm planning on playing a few more games this Thursday with my Corsair list.  I'll keep you guys updated on the battle reports!  ;D

I'm curious to see how Corsairs are doing against other armies so keep the battle reports coming guys!!

Offline Arquarian

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #85 on: May 7, 2012, 01:23:30 PM »
I'm curious to see how Corsairs are doing against other armies so keep the battle reports coming guys!!

hmmm... this is a good comcept. can include a page in the Corsair POC project thread. We can keep a running commentary of whos won what and against who.

Good idea?

As an aside. I've had a bit of bad luck with my laptop and have deleted all my Corsair files. :(
so all we have is what is already posted on the projects page so more than ever we all need to pull up our socks and get writting.

Oh and, Welcome elplana01!



Offline greenmtvince

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #86 on: May 13, 2012, 10:10:08 AM »
So I did a 2500 point, single FOC doubles tournament yesterday running mech corsairs with my friend's mech craftworlders.  My first time running a lot of the units and there were some surprises for me.  Here's what our lists looked like:

Me:
VoidDreamer

5x Corsairs, Fusion Gun
-Falcon, Scatter Laser, Holofield

5x Corsairs, Fusion Gun
-Falcon, Scatter Laser, Holofield

5x Corsairs, Fusion Gun
-Falcon, EML, Holofield

Nightspinner

Warp Hunter, Holofield

Warp Hunter, Holofield


Him:
Eldrad

5x Fire Dragons
-Wave Serpent, TL Scatter, Stones

5x Fire Dragons
-Wave Serpent, TL Scatter, Stones

10x Storm Guardians, 2x Flamers
-Warlock, Enhance
-Wave Serpent, TL EML, Stones

Hornet, 2x Pulse Laser
Hornet, 2x Pulse Laser

Nightspinner, Holofield

The Tournament Summary Highlights:

Game 1:
Win vs Foot Grey Knights
-Does an Eversor Assassin get 4D6 AP vs a Serpent or only 1D6?
-Don't deep strike Grey Knights within 36" of Warp Hunters. 
-Tank shocking paladins on objectives is a good idea...that can go horribly bad if the game doesn't end.  (we went to turn 7 or 8)

Game 2:
Loss vs Necron Wraith swarm and Sisters
-Not sure if the necron player was lucky with the dice or we didn't have enough volume of fire, but we could shut the wraiths down before they started tearing through the tanks.
-Nightspinners did a great job supressing the sisters' Rhinos which were bunched up early on.

Game 3:
Buy (win with 0 points?) due to odd number of teams.  Corsairs turned on their Craftworld allies, Eldrad put them in their place. 


Surprises
-Nightspinners: I think 2 might have been overkill, but 1 was really effective at supression of enemy units.  Forcing dangerous terrain tests accounted for some wounds and immobilized vehicles even against some of the nastiest stuff.  I think we need to consider these more.

Other performance thoughts:
-I'm not sure about the Hornets...They either didn't do much or died quickly.  Still need more analysis, or consideration with SCs or SLs but I'm leaning towards Nightwings.
-Warp Hunters perform as expected.  They tend to get one or two good shots in before an opponent realizes how scary they are and then tend to soak up a lot of fire but are otherwise a 160 point bullet sponge.  I didn't think they were the end all be all of Eldar weapons.

Overall, I don't think pure mech corsairs have enough firepower to play offensively.  The tanks are too easy to shut down even if they are tough to kill.  I would have loved to have some of my jetpack infantry staples, so hybrid may be the way to go.  I'm also getting this feeling that despite my initial thoughts that corsairs are a pure shooting list, having some offensive close combat abilities in the mix from scorpions or Harlequins may be the way forward.

Expect to see some hybrid, broad spectrum of units lists from me in the future.  This however is the last dirstside action my corsairs will fight for a good while.  Now I'm shifting my focus to Zone mortalis boarding actions the next few months, and I'll be working on some Tau during August and September while I'm away learning to fly the Army's EC-145.   

Offline Irisado

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #87 on: May 13, 2012, 10:24:39 AM »
Does an Eversor Assassin get 4D6 AP vs a Serpent or only 1D6?

See this thread and the Grey Knight FAQ (link available from that thread).  If neither of those help, I suggest that you ask in a new thread in the rules board.

Quote
Surprises
-Nightspinners: I think 2 might have been overkill, but 1 was really effective at supression of enemy units.  Forcing dangerous terrain tests accounted for some wounds and immobilized vehicles even against some of the nastiest stuff.  I think we need to consider these more.

I'm not surprised by this at all.  Nightspinners are superb when it comes to suppression, so regardless of whether you're playing Craftworld Eldar or Corsairs, I think that they're always worth considering, particularly if you want fire support for fully mechanised Eldar armies.
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Offline Khorne25

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #88 on: May 13, 2012, 05:02:48 PM »
The Tournament Summary Highlights:

Game 1:
Win vs Foot Grey Knights
-Does an Eversor Assassin get 4D6 AP vs a Serpent or only 1D6?
-Don't deep strike Grey Knights within 36" of Warp Hunters. 
-Tank shocking paladins on objectives is a good idea...that can go horribly bad if the game doesn't end.  (we went to turn 7 or 8)

Game 2:
Loss vs Necron Wraith swarm and Sisters
-Not sure if the necron player was lucky with the dice or we didn't have enough volume of fire, but we could shut the wraiths down before they started tearing through the tanks.
-Nightspinners did a great job supressing the sisters' Rhinos which were bunched up early on.

Surprises
-Nightspinners: I think 2 might have been overkill, but 1 was really effective at supression of enemy units.  Forcing dangerous terrain tests accounted for some wounds and immobilized vehicles even against some of the nastiest stuff.  I think we need to consider these more.

Other performance thoughts:
-I'm not sure about the Hornets...They either didn't do much or died quickly.  Still need more analysis, or consideration with SCs or SLs but I'm leaning towards Nightwings.
-Warp Hunters perform as expected.  They tend to get one or two good shots in before an opponent realizes how scary they are and then tend to soak up a lot of fire but are otherwise a 160 point bullet sponge.  I didn't think they were the end all be all of Eldar weapons.

Overall, I don't think pure mech corsairs have enough firepower to play offensively.  The tanks are too easy to shut down even if they are tough to kill.  I would have loved to have some of my jetpack infantry staples, so hybrid may be the way to go.  I'm also getting this feeling that despite my initial thoughts that corsairs are a pure shooting list, having some offensive close combat abilities in the mix from scorpions or Harlequins may be the way forward.

Expect to see some hybrid, broad spectrum of units lists from me in the future.  This however is the last dirstside action my corsairs will fight for a good while.  Now I'm shifting my focus to Zone mortalis boarding actions the next few months, and I'll be working on some Tau during August and September while I'm away learning to fly the Army's EC-145.


I have often thought that ZM was the Corsairs time to shine. I will look forward to hearing of your boarding adventures.

My inclination with Corsairs is actually not a close and engage list but a stand off gun line list with counter asssault. While good mobility and dakkas seems to suggest running rings shooting I am beginning to incline towards gunline with two Nightspinners, three Warp Hunters and jetpack corsairs. Single unit cheese perhaps but the amount of points sunken into mech seems to decrease the dakka enormously.


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Former armies:
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Offline Arquarian

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #89 on: May 14, 2012, 06:00:04 AM »
Quote
Single unit cheese perhaps but the amount of points sunken into mech seems to decrease the dakka enormously.

There are other options for vehicle dakka. Firestorm, splinter racked raiders, Phoenix bombers.....

Offline Khorne25

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #90 on: May 14, 2012, 07:41:00 AM »
Quote
Single unit cheese perhaps but the amount of points sunken into mech seems to decrease the dakka enormously.

There are other options for vehicle dakka. Firestorm, splinter racked raiders, Phoenix bombers.....


Well okay heres my problem:

- Falcons are durable but cost a lot
- Falcons do not provide dakka point for point
- All lists need scoring units

The alternative, Venoms:

- No flickerfield
- Lots of killpoints from paper airplanes
- Perhaps theyd have enough dakka if there were underslung shuriken cannon as well as scatter lasers
- The only defensive upgrade, holofields is dispproportionate

The alternative, mixed infantry-vehicle:

- Jetpack infantry with Warp Hunters etc, while solid it still means there are GEQ out in the open
- One or two Falcons will be either ignored or eliminated without much trouble.
- A cover save is not as useful as hiding in a solid hull
- Firestorms are heavy choices and perhaps one might be fielded (its an option for sure)
- Phoenix Bombers I have no experience with yet so I cant comment but I anticipate good things
- Only can take one Raider but I nearly always take a DE Raider or DE Venom

The alternative, Saim-Hamm

- CJBs are more expensive than GJBs but only have an extra CCW (is this meant to encourage more aggressive play? see: CJBs with Fusion pistols)
- Lack of Seer Jet Council will mean the previous anvil strategy will just not work
- There will likely have to be one or two Falcons in the troop section along with CJB support. Not necessarily a bad thing but this goes to the problems of fielding one or two Falcons

The potential of the Falcon Mech:

- The capability to put all your scoring units in many Falcon hulls that are durable with holo fields
- Pulse lasers all over the place probably with EMLs or SLs
- Having no vulnerable infantry left hanging around and supreme gunship mobility

Problem:

- Point for point, the dakka a Falcon with Pulse Laser + SL provides is inferior to alternatives (eg, Wasps or Hornets)
- Disembarking its cargo is tantamount to suicide if engaged. Only perhaps to deposit one flame/FG shot or on backfield VPs.



My Voidborn Eldar Corsairs

OLD Eldar Corsair Blog

Former armies:
Tau, SM, CSM, 3rd Ed DE (updating to 5th Ed)

Offline Arquarian

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #91 on: May 14, 2012, 09:48:19 AM »
Firstly I think we should be moving away from equivacating Corsair units to either Dark Eldar or Craftworld Eldar units.
A Corsair Venom does not have flickerfeilds becuase it is a Corsair Venom. It also doesn't have 'Aerial Assault', 'Power of the Machine Spirit' or 'Go Fasta Stripes'. None of these is a valid reason for not taking the Venom. Not taking them because they are made of paper, will die and give kill points is a valid point.
 
Similarily CJBs are not GJBs and should not be likened to one another. (you did miss out quite an important point Khorne that the CJBs can scout  8) )


You are right Khorne that the Falcon is not as dakkery as other options. And No, you should not be disembarking a unit of 5 corsairs from the back of it into combat. You'd think that was obvious  ???

So our tactics have to change. Corsairs do not have any real Close Combat punch. AT BEST I believe we have credible mop up units. Therefore the over bearing stratgy is for fire power. We have lots of stand off units which can poor Dakka, both AT and AI, from afar.

The Falcons, I would say fall into the long range AT category and with a bare mimimum squad of 5 nakid Corsairs forms your classic (C)DAVU Falcon sitting on your home objective. Firestorms although expensive fill a similar role but in the AI bracket and also have transport capacity.

I'm very tempted to start putting together a more detailed run down of of the units availible to us. Who would be interested in such a mini project?

Offline Khorne25

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #92 on: May 14, 2012, 10:25:56 AM »
I'm very tempted to start putting together a more detailed run down of of the units availible to us. Who would be interested in such a mini project?

I think that will be almost a central pillar of the corsair community, the other one will actually be batreps.


My Voidborn Eldar Corsairs

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Former armies:
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Offline Arquarian

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #93 on: May 14, 2012, 10:39:42 AM »
Great Lets sort it!

I'll add pages to the Corsair Project board and provisionally make some rules for how to critique each unit and how to report.

I also get the feeling this board is getting a little cluttered with tactics / armylists. What say we start abnother thread purely for such things and leave this thread purely for the POC, background and such... ?

PS we also REALLY need to settle on a name.  I'll get the last eselction of favourites and look into a poll.




Offline Khorne25

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #94 on: May 14, 2012, 10:48:16 AM »
Great Lets sort it!

I'll add pages to the Corsair Project board and provisionally make some rules for how to critique each unit and how to report.

I also get the feeling this board is getting a little cluttered with tactics / armylists. What say we start abnother thread purely for such things and leave this thread purely for the POC, background and such... ?

PS we also REALLY need to settle on a name.  I'll get the last eselction of favourites and look into a poll.

my opinion is that specific army lists should be posted in the strategy board. The Corsair PoC is for unorganised discussion about tactics, fluff and modelling, anything specific and focused should have its own thread. But something like a discussion on Void Sabre vs PW shouldnt warrant its own thread.

Yes it would be good to get this PoC finalised, we have so much corsair traffic, it is very encouraging.

We can do a Corsair project much akin to the redux project, someone proposes a unit entry following a certain format. Any missing points or criticisms will be aired (or counter proposals made) and the best one will earn its place on the encyclopedia.

Set up a poll for the name and send a round robin, I can give you an updated list of Corsairs.


My Voidborn Eldar Corsairs

OLD Eldar Corsair Blog

Former armies:
Tau, SM, CSM, 3rd Ed DE (updating to 5th Ed)

Offline Arquarian

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #95 on: May 15, 2012, 11:15:32 AM »
Ok Khorne25 Propodsed it and I agree.

All Corsair Armylists should be posted and discussed in the Eldar Armylists board found here.
This thread should be confined to the discussion of the POC the Corsiar List in General and any Corsair Fluff.

Offline Zilverscale

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #96 on: May 15, 2012, 05:29:57 PM »
Ok Khorne25 Propodsed it and I agree.

All Corsair Armylists should be posted and discussed in the Eldar Armylists board found here.
This thread should be confined to the discussion of the POC the Corsiar List in General and any Corsair Fluff.

I'll 3rd this, seeing as an army list might easily become buried in discussion about other stuff and as such will not be commented upon.


Back to trivial corsair stuff.
Got a big boost in points for my corsairs, besides the Phoenix, Nightwing, Warphunters and Wasps that came in the mail, I also got 3 titans from Rasmus :)
So now my Corsairs also have a Armour Cast Phantom, AC Revenant and an AC Knight Titan (have to work up a datasheet for that)

PAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Offline Arquarian

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #97 on: May 15, 2012, 06:18:48 PM »
Ok Khorne25 Propodsed it and I agree.

All Corsair Armylists should be posted and discussed in the Eldar Armylists board found here.
This thread should be confined to the discussion of the POC the Corsiar List in General and any Corsair Fluff.

I'll 3rd this, seeing as an army list might easily become buried in discussion about other stuff and as such will not be commented upon.


Back to trivial corsair stuff.
Got a big boost in points for my corsairs, besides the Phoenix, Nightwing, Warphunters and Wasps that came in the mail, I also got 3 titans from Rasmus :)
So now my Corsairs also have a Armour Cast Phantom, AC Revenant and an AC Knight Titan (have to work up a datasheet for that)

I think I speak for al or us in that we can't wait for pictures...

Are you going to put any kind of Corsair stamp on them??

Offline Zilverscale

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #98 on: May 15, 2012, 06:44:03 PM »
Corsair stamp...thats alway my problem...I keep grinding in my thoughts what the colour scheme will be (hence my 5k nids are still unpainted after 7 years -.- )

Any ideas as to corsair stampyness?

PAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Offline Arquarian

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Re: Corsair POC
« Reply #99 on: May 16, 2012, 06:41:16 AM »
You have the IA11 book? there are three colour schemes in there for the Sunblitz brotherhood, Void Dragons and SKy Raiders. Alternatively there are more warband colour schemes out there.

Cavilier or GreenMTVince passed me a link to an old rouge trader doc. I'll see if I can find it.....

FYI the void dragons scheme is very easy and very quick to do which is a boon if your not an enthusuiastic painter like me  ;)

 


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