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Author Topic: Back Field Synapse - Warriors vs Zoanthropes  (Read 1614 times)

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Offline Halollet

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Back Field Synapse - Warriors vs Zoanthropes
« on: February 2, 2014, 09:35:01 PM »
I always scratched my head that people are dumping on warriors calling them fragile while then taking zoans instead.  So I did a little math and here's what I found out

Bolters
vs Zoans
4 wounds inflicted is 12 wounds dealt is 24 hits which is 36 shots
vs Warriors
9 wounds inflicted  is 18 wounds dealt is 36 hits which is 54 shots

Warriors hold up a lot better when it comes to small arms fire, having more then double the wounds actually makes them more durable, imagine that!

Krak Missiles
vs Zoans
2 wounds inflicted is 6 wounds dealt which is 7.2 hits is 10.8 shots
vs Warriors (4+ cover)
3 wounds inflicted is 6 wounds dealt which is 7.2 hits is 10.8 shots
vs Warriors (5+ cover)
3 wounds inflicted is 4.5 wounds dealt which is 5.4 hits is 8.1 shots

Yes, the dreaded krak missile!  So warriors take the exact same amount of shots to take down when in ruins.  Huh.... So who doesn't play a game of 40k with a single piece of ruins in their deployment zone?  Seriously, anybody?

!!!Nova Charged Heavy Burst Cannon that ignores cover and hits on a 2+!!!
vs Zoans
4 wounds inflicted is 12 wounds dealt is 14.4 hits which is 17.28 shots
vs Warriors
9 wounds inflicted is 9 wounds dealt is 10.8 hits which is 12.96 shots

So here's a big evil gun and yes, the Zoans hold up better.  Yes, Tau is able to use 300+ points to decimate 100 points.  Still, unless the riptide rolls above average it still has to use its secondary to finish off the brood.

Now against this, and evening the points a bit, this is where I suggest taking a Broodlord to pin those pathfinders and remove markerlights from play.  So let's roll that again

Nova Charged Heavy Burst Cannon
vs Zoans
4 wounds inflicted is 12 wounds dealt is 14.4 hits which is 28.8 shots
vs Warriors (4+ cover)
9 wounds inflicted is 18 wounds dealt is 21.6 hits which is 43.2 shots

Well look at that.... Warriors are still more durable.

But, I'll be humble, my 40k knowledge isn't what it used to be, but I can't come up with a gun in my head that makes 4 wounds better then 9.


Also, warriors have a 36" gun which means that can actually do something from your table edge. And are scoring. And are better in assault should it come to that.
« Last Edit: February 2, 2014, 09:44:14 PM by Halollet »
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Offline Killing Time

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Re: Back Field Synapse - Warriors vs Zoanthropes
« Reply #1 on: February 3, 2014, 06:45:35 AM »
Your entire method of doing maths seems odd.
I don't disagree with your statistics, I just question whether the method you've presented them has any value...

For example.
Bolters
vs Zoans
4 wounds inflicted is 12 wounds dealt is 24 hits which is 36 shots
vs Warriors
9 wounds inflicted  is 18 wounds dealt is 36 hits which is 54 shots

Of course you're going to cause more wounds if you fire 50% more shots.
It's far more informative to use the same number of shots, and then determine how many wounds you will cause against a particular unit.

Why not take 20 shots (ie a full tac squad rapid firing their bolters)?

= 13.3 hits
= 6.6 wounds
= 3.3 wounds v Warriors
= 2.2 wounds against Zoans

How this pans out in terms of proportion of a unit destroyed in a single volley of fire, or how it might vary with cover, or more powerful weapons, is up to you to decide.
But generally it's more useful to compare how two units will fare against the same amount of shooting.

Offline Halollet

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Re: Back Field Synapse - Warriors vs Zoanthropes
« Reply #2 on: February 3, 2014, 09:20:11 AM »
Your entire method of doing maths seems odd.
I don't disagree with your statistics, I just question whether the method you've presented them has any value...

This is true, but they do have value because of the goal.  Your goal is to keep synapse in your back field, your opponents goal is to remove them completely.  With this in mind, I wanted to know how much firepower is required to wipe the unit.  Because anything less then a wipe then Tyranids achieve their goal!

Knowing that it takes around 18 more bolter shots to knock out my synapse means those 18 shots aren't going somewhere else.  Knowing that it would take a devastator squad with 4 missile launchers 3 turns to take out one warrior brood, means I don't have to worry about them.  Especially if they dedicated that kind of fire power then my TMCs are laughing!



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Re: Back Field Synapse - Warriors vs Zoanthropes
« Reply #3 on: February 3, 2014, 09:38:54 AM »
Ah, I see.

In the case how do the two units stack up in terms of points? Why not compare equal (or similar) points worth of models rather than just assuming a full brood.

Offline Halollet

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Re: Back Field Synapse - Warriors vs Zoanthropes
« Reply #4 on: February 3, 2014, 04:00:02 PM »
Ah, I see.

In the case how do the two units stack up in terms of points? Why not compare equal (or similar) points worth of models rather than just assuming a full brood.

That is equal points. 2 Zoans = 3 Warriors with a barbed strangler.

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Offline bebe

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Re: Back Field Synapse - Warriors vs Zoanthropes
« Reply #5 on: February 6, 2014, 11:38:36 PM »

That is just part of the equation. Warp Blast is better than a Barbed Strangler. Zoans can get Dominion or another power if you roll it. Two Zoans are in different units so it takes two squads not one to shoot them down. Zoand can also hide in ruins ... seriously. My big question is ... do you need backfield synapse or synapse moving up? And you know you can take warriors as troops as still take a Zoan. Why limit yourself to one or the other? Warp Blast might be only 18"but what do we have that is ST10 AP2?
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