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Offline Faeluchu

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Dealing with negativity
« on: February 7, 2016, 02:59:41 PM »
I think what we all love about the hobby is the human-to-human interaction - the fact that not only are you moving around miniatures that you like and have lovingly put together to form an army, but that there is also a fellow nerd on the other side of the table who's just as weirdly enthusiastic about all this stuff as you are.

Yeah, but what if that other person is not as enthusiastic? What do to when your fellow gamer seems intent on ruining your fun for some reasons of his own?

In my own gaming group there's a Necron guy just like that - he would never smile or joke about anything, all he does is complain that "his Warriors are overpriced and useless, Wraiths are only decent and much worse than other stuff, Immortals are awful" etc etc, ad nauseam. What adds insult to injury is that I've had occasions where his Wraiths would massacre my entire unit in a single turn while he would still complain how bad they are.

Personally, I've found that a relatively good way of handling that is to just ignore most of such talk - while it may seem a bit rude, I think it works out best for everyone around. I mean, sometimes if you ignore a comment that Unit X is so awful for its point cost and concentrate on planning your next move, the other person may be discouraged enough to actually shut up. If you're good at this kind of stuff you could try to convince them otherwise (the "Hey man, your guys just killed half my army, guess they ain't so bad, eh?"), but that requires much too much patience than I'm willing to sacrifice (especially since it's so tedious after 4 or 5 games of same stuff over and over again). For me it's a bit insulting that I devote my time and effort in painting an army, thinking about how to make it the most efficient and then pitting my tactical acumen against my opponent only to have all those efforts destroyed because someone does not believe in his own army. I mean, hell, I don't think Guardians are as good a Troops choice as the Tactical Squad, but I celebrate every successful unit kill or passed Leadership test because they're the ordinary guys of my army - not to mention that I think it makes for much funnier games when a squad of Guardians refuses to die or even retreat despite being under heavy fire throughout half of the game, while at the same time an elite unit of Warp Spiders may decide to call it a day after one of them is consumed by the Warp when they use their generators.

What ways of dealing with negativity from other gamers do you have? What are the sources of negative hobby feelings around you (eg. personal problems, outdated Codexes, rules lawyering, whatever)? And do you think that this is an issue in the hobby, generally speaking? Thank God our community is not as toxic as the online ones (I'm looking at you, League of Legends), but there are rotten apples in every barrel.
Also, do you think that negative players can be convinced to change their ways? Most of the time you can just refuse to play some random dude in the hobby store, but when it's a member of your regular gaming group that's usually not really an option.
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Offline Wyddr

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #1 on: February 7, 2016, 03:10:02 PM »
I *hate* playing against somebody negative. I'm in this for the fun, and if the other guy isn't having fun, neither am I.

Typically, the negative folks I run into talk a mean, mean game about how awesome they are and how wise their tactics are and then spend a good piece of time talking about how unfair the game is for them specifically and everybody in general. Then I usually beat them with something asinine, like pure Thousand Sons or something. They then talk as though such an outcome were preordained by God.

In short, they're morons.

Generally, I just stop playing against such people. Either that, or I leave it to them to initiate a game. I figure if *they* are the ones who are asking me to play, they can't plausibly complain. If they do, I call them out on it: why do you insist on complaining about something that is supposed to be fun? Are you having fun? If not, why are you doing this to yourself?

Does that change their ways? No, never has. But it has got them to stop playing with me and, to be perfectly honest, I'd rather not play at all than play and have a miserable time.

Offline Spectral Arbor

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #2 on: February 7, 2016, 03:10:32 PM »
Well, you don't have to play them. If they're not fun to play against, then don't.

Yeah, hard feelings. So I guess the question is whether or not putting up with that is worth it. I'm fortunate to have a large group of regular opponents. In the past, it was larger, and I faced a guy that was a dice thrower, of all things. He'd get pissed off because it wasn't working out to his plan, and he'd be griping, whining, eventually throwing dice to express his frustration.

Now I'm kind of a cold hard bastard, so I made fun of him when he was doing that, which did nothing to improve the situation immediately, but he did eventually stop throwing dice after repeated mocking sessions by yours truly. He still did it with other people, I guess he thought he could get away with it, but not around me, so I had a better game and he didn't have to spend a half-hour crawling on the floor.

So my cold, hard, bastardly self suggests mocking him if he's going to be a... unfun opponent. Either he'll move on, improve, or you'll get to practice your mockery skills. It can be a sub-game for you, if you like.

And I'm not being sarcastic, I genuinely suggest not putting up with his bullamphetamine parrot.

Offline Irisado

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #3 on: February 7, 2016, 03:23:18 PM »
My advice is to ignore the comments, as you have been, assuming that circumstances require you to play against this person from time-to-time.  The best approach is to avoid playing them completely though if this is feasible.  It's just not worth having the fun sapped from your game by a person who makes comments like that.

One thing to definitely avoid is to fight fire with fire.  In my experience the approach of antagonising them, mocking them, or otherwise trying to get under their skin only makes things worse and reflects badly on you as an individual.  It's much better to just stay calm, ignore it, and remember to avoid playing against said individual in the future.
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Offline Spectral Arbor

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #4 on: February 7, 2016, 03:56:42 PM »
You could also just say nothing, look at the floor, and hope the bad man doesn't talk mean to you again. I mean, that's a perfectly self-respecting manner of dealing with confrontation. There's no shame in it. Not everyone likes confrontation. You'll be a better person for it. And when the bad man says sorry, and he'll never do it again, you can believe him. For sure!

Offline The GrimSqueaker

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #5 on: February 7, 2016, 04:07:57 PM »
What he said.

That's the way of it. No one likes the always negative guy. It's like a broken record that's set on autoplay. Don't engage when ever possible and they'll either move on or get the hint. If not, they're their own best advertisment and others in your group will know to avoid engaging as well.
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Offline Grand Master Lomandalis

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #6 on: February 7, 2016, 04:53:18 PM »
I can say that I am very fortunate in that I rarely encounter negative people that throw fits about their stuff being bad; though it does happen.  We had one guy who played for years, and every special rule any other army had was "cheesy" or "overpowered."  Now, he stopped playing back in 4th edition, so this was really before the rise of the super power-creeped codices *coughEldarcough*.

If someone has their heart set on being negative about the game, there really is nothing you can do to change that.  Yeah, you can be an ass about it, but where does that really get you?  Sure, they may have stopped that one act that is frustrating you, but you are now frustrated and annoyed while they sit across from you clearly not into the game.  Woo.  But hey, you got to tell them to shut the beslubber up about their whining!  That sounds like a win, right?  Right?

In all honesty, I will usually ignore their antics and try to enjoy my game.  If it gets to a point where their attitude is bringing my enjoyment of the game down, then I may simply say, "Really dude?"  If it keeps going to the point where I am actively counting the minutes until the game is over, then I would simply pack up and say that they are clearly not in the mood for a game and maybe we could try it again when they aren't in such a foul mood.

If it keeps happening, then the simple answer is to just not play them anymore.  They will get the idea that their attitude is bringing down the enjoyment of others when they lose people to play against.

People at my LGS know that I am a guy who has a lot of fun during my games, and that it takes a lot for me to be pushed to the point where I walk away from a game.  In almost twenty years, I have packed up during a game twice.  Once during a campaign in 4th edition against Alaitoc Eldar (using the Craftworld supplement) where I found out he was using an extra 400pts; and once on a regular gaming night in 6th where the guy failed a morale check on a hill and fled on an angle so he could still have LOS to my unit, and also shifted a blast template 2" to the side to center the circle on a model and give him a favourable result by having less models hit.  In both instances, I don't think they lasted more than 6 months after that as people started picking up on their crap and called them on it.
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Offline khaine

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #7 on: February 7, 2016, 05:22:31 PM »
We tend to see it a lot on the internet, you get “that guy” who moans on and on about how his army isn’t competitive, how things aren’t fair and how everybody else has better toys. Luckily they are pretty easy to deal with in that you can just stop reading what they type, unfortunately “that guy” also exists in the real world and isn’t as easy to ignore when you’re stood across the table from him.

“I see negative people, and sometimes they don’t even realise they are negative…”

Thing is quite often they don’t know how they come across and just a gentle “Do you realise how negative you sound?” is enough to at least shut them up for a while. Others of course enjoy the moaning and will just throw a tantrum if anybody even suggests they are wrong.

Keep in mind that gaming is meant to be an enjoyable social interaction, if you’re not having fun there is little point in playing that opponent.

If the problem is with one guy in a regular group chances are you’re not the only person who feels this way, the house rule “Preferred Enemy: Complaining opponents” may help if enough people are having the same issue.

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Offline The GrimSqueaker

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #8 on: February 7, 2016, 05:31:39 PM »
If the problem is with one guy in a regular group chances are you’re not the only person who feels this way, the house rule “Preferred Enemy: Complaining opponents” may help if enough people are having the same issue.

I liked that. I've heard people have also used a special model called something like "Captain Buzzkill" which the opponent gets if the group decide the person has just been a rain cloud the whole time.
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Offline Calamity

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #9 on: February 8, 2016, 11:23:18 AM »
Preferred Enemy: Complaining Opponents and a Captain Buzzkill sound like great ideas to me!

What about the other kind of negativity?  The guy who's winning and who's not being a good sport about it?

Offline Wyddr

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #10 on: February 8, 2016, 11:39:35 AM »
Denying that person games is a simple tactic.

You can also list tailor to beat him. Play something stupid and Unbound. Throw a coffee table up there and say "I'm proxying a Warlord Titan, cool?" See what happens.

Offline Irisado

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #11 on: February 8, 2016, 11:49:38 AM »
Denying him games would definitely be my approach. In my experience, such people thrive on winning and bragging about it, so if they cannot play they start to get frustrated.  I have found that they either change their ways or end up no longer wanting to play the game.  The former is preferable, but while the latter outcome is unfortunate for the individual concerned, it does make harmony between any other players in the gaming group much better.
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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #12 on: February 8, 2016, 12:00:42 PM »
They could always say though that you're just afraid to lose (y'know, because miniature wargames are life and death) and that you're the one being negative.  I've been on the receiving end of this.  :P

Offline Irisado

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Re: Dealing with negativity
« Reply #13 on: February 8, 2016, 12:06:28 PM »
Let them think that if they wish.  They cannot read your mind, and so are unaware of the true reasons for your refusal to play against them.

If they accuse you of being afraid, what's really going on is that they are projecting their own fears and insecurities onto you, in order to absolve themselves of responsibility for their own state of mind.
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