Author Topic: Venom Cannon or Barbed Strangler?? (Read 3474 times)

2.0 · « **on:** June 23, 2005, 02:51:43 PM »

I'll have enhanced senses on my Carnifex, but a BS just seems like the Eldar Prism Cannon. BS 3, great strength shot, but you are at BS3 and you only get one shot per turn with it (and I'm not twinlinking it!). So whats the pros and cons between the two weapons for a carnifex and which do you prefer?

Black Widow DLS · « **Reply #1 on:** June 23, 2005, 07:46:41 PM »

Lets see, venom cannon - stronger, better range, more shots, but can only glance vehicles. BS - 1 big shot, can penetrate, scatters, smaller range.

It depends on who your fighting, but I think BS would be better on a carnifex

Battle-Brother-Manji · « **Reply #2 on:** June 23, 2005, 09:40:39 PM »

Quote from: kyle_the_third on June 23, 2005, 07:46:41 PM

BS - 1 big shot, can penetrate, scatters, smaller range.

I dont think a strangler scatters anymore. I think it's hit or miss much the same way as a space marine frag missile is....

2.0 · « **Reply #3 on:** June 23, 2005, 09:43:12 PM »

yeah, the Barbed Strangler is basically a Fire Prism cannon now, which is the point of the question on whether i should take it or the VC...

Battle-Brother-Manji · « **Reply #4 on:** June 23, 2005, 09:49:22 PM »

Quote from: 2.0 on June 23, 2005, 09:43:12 PM

yeah, the Barbed Strangler is basically a Fire Prism cannon now, which is the point of the question on whether i should take it or the VC...

I'd go ahead and take a Barbed strangler if you think you'll be facing large numbers of troops, with toxin sacks and enhanced senses it could be pretty useful against tanks as well. I can promise you'll be able to fit more than 2 models under the template

which is the most you'll hit from 1 VC shot.... So, I'd say the Strangler IMHO....

Black Widow DLS · « **Reply #5 on:** June 23, 2005, 11:04:25 PM »

O, i assumed it would be the same

It's a win lose sort of thing they changed with it, it would be good against vehicles, but not very good against troops $:-\$ At the moment I'd say BS is better.

Gray Rains · « **Reply #6 on:** June 24, 2005, 02:19:44 AM »

There are some horribly misinformed or straight lying idiots on this forum...

VC and BS both have 36" range. The BS on a Fex, with or without toxin sacks, will be s8. BS doesn't scatter.

For some people I will not mention by name, READ the new codex please. Thank you drive through.

bazraq · « **Reply #7 on:** June 24, 2005, 02:46:35 AM »

wow, glad gray rains said it before i did...

that was some crazy....or just straight messed up stuff right there....

bs doesn't, nor did it ever scatter.

also, if you want, you can always take both vc and the bs, and can in fact, fire both in the same turn.

Istaril · « **Reply #8 on:** June 24, 2005, 05:04:01 AM »

Why in gods name are people comparing a Barbed Strangler on a 'fex to a Prism Cannon on a Fire Prism?

Barbed Strangler: Lower Strength, WAY worse AP, Different Range, Larger Blast - the only thing they have in common is BS3. And even that - the 'fex can twin link his gun. There's NO comparison.

Anyway - if you really lack in tank killing capacity - a Venom Cannon is the better bet. STR10 and on average 1hit/turn - it's actually a fairly good gun for tank hunting and the lack of penetrating hits doesn't hurt as much as you'd think-especially since it is one of the only ways to reliably down Skimmers (who will be glancing hits only) in your army - while rending claws can take care of most other vehicles.

If you don't mind having skimmers whizz by you and tear you to peices (I play eldar - I'm biased

) or have gargoyles and/or many str6 deathspitters which can reliably hunt them down, a barbed strangler is the best choice, as it is far superior against most troops.

Bonne · « **Reply #9 on:** June 24, 2005, 09:18:30 AM »

I will us both BS and VC. That will be possible BIG death for the opponent. The fex will hit aboout 50% of the shots every round. big massacre on Imperial Guards=)

2.0 · « **Reply #10 on:** June 24, 2005, 11:54:15 AM »

Quote from: Istaril on June 24, 2005, 05:04:01 AM

Why in gods name are people comparing a Barbed Strangler on a 'fex to a Prism Cannon on a Fire Prism?

Barbed Strangler: Lower Strength, WAY worse AP, Different Range, Larger Blast - the only thing they have in common is BS3. And even that - the 'fex can twin link his gun. There's NO comparison.

dude, calm down, I'm not comparing actual stat to stat, but the two weapons are just extremely similar in how they work. BS3, great strength template weapon, but only one shot at BS3. That was the extent of my comparison if you actually read that far into it...

Battle-Brother-Manji · « **Reply #11 on:** June 24, 2005, 12:02:17 PM »

Quote from: Gray Rains on June 24, 2005, 02:19:44 AM

The BS on a Fex, with or without toxin sacks, will be s8.

Yeah I know I messed that one up. I'm still getting used to the max strength numbers and I keep getting a VC and BS max strength mixed up. Sorry that upset you soooooo much

bazraq · « **Reply #12 on:** June 24, 2005, 12:09:19 PM »

Quote

dude, calm down, I'm not comparing actual stat to stat, but the two weapons are just extremely similar in how they work. BS3, great strength template weapon, but only one shot at BS3. That was the extent of my comparison if you actually read that far into it...

except for the fact that they both tend to be high strength, and are guns (game mechanics wise)....i'm not sure where the association is made....but i'm glad to see you thinking outside the box on this one...

though it won't come up against most vehicles though, the vc has been made better, in that it CAN penetrate open topped vehicles, so now we rip through ork trukk's like there's no tomorrow.

the solitaire · « **Reply #13 on:** June 24, 2005, 12:23:16 PM »

still i think the barbed strangler would be more usefull with the new rules.
reasons for that have been pretty much summed up, but in short, it can penetrate armour, not just glance.
it's S8 which is still pretty much. basically it has decent range. 36" covers most of a gaming table
and then there is teh blast template making it usefull against troops. all in all for the same reason i like the missile launcher better then the lascannon i like teh barbed strangler better then the venom cannon. versatility.

Omnichron · « **Reply #14 on:** June 24, 2005, 10:27:16 PM »

Use both!

I've tried it, and it has worked great.
I've always felt that the carnifex didn't really do a good job when he only had barbed strangler or venomcannon. It's so few shots, and he always tends to miss. With both venom cannon and barbed strangler, I'm finally really satisfied. It has given my carnifex most of the anti-vehicle role.

Black Widow DLS · « **Reply #15 on:** June 25, 2005, 03:14:10 PM »

Quote from: Gray Rains on June 24, 2005, 02:19:44 AM

There are some horribly misinformed or straight lying idiots on this forum...

VC and BS both have 36" range. The BS on a Fex, with or without toxin sacks, will be s8. BS doesn't scatter.

For some people I will not mention by name, READ the new codex please. Thank you drive through.

You know the codex just came out, for some people (me being one of them) it takes a while to get used to the change in range

, and your making it sound like we're cheating big time to our advantage, but its to our disadvantage, but thanks for posting that. And ya, I guess I looked like a bit of an idiot saying that it scattered and had lower range.

Twistedstorytella (the 3rd) · « **Reply #16 on:** June 29, 2005, 11:01:29 AM »

Mmmm......try both...for mixed tank killing and infantry killing....to tell the truth theres no real "better" gun, they both have their pros and cons....its much like the "which ones better? banshees or scorpians" thread......which duly got locked....

.....wow loadsa dots......

Black Widow DLS · « **Reply #17 on:** June 29, 2005, 10:10:01 PM »

I'll tell you one thing, neither do good against chaos

The last game I played against my brother, like the game I was trying to destroy his predator with a venom cannon and a BS and the best the did was "crew shaken"

$:-\$

Twistedstorytella (the 3rd) · « **Reply #18 on:** June 30, 2005, 02:52:09 PM »

Lolol yeah, i dont think ill ever bother to use my tyranids against power armoured armies, they will just get thrashed too easily. Maybe when ive gained loads and loads of experience i might try...but then again...ive just realised that i would get more experience by playing SM type armies more often so i can build better lists to kill them all...hmmmm $:-\$

Ah well, i guess ill just take my eldar to crack open power armour

bazraq · « **Reply #19 on:** June 30, 2005, 03:14:52 PM »

um...truth be told...marine armies tend to be quite easy to beat with nids. we outnumber them (typically) and can outdo them in cc. so what if they have 3+ saves, swamp 'em with wounds! also, against marines, they tend to use up alot of points in things like dreads, predators, land raiders or land speeders. with a venom cannon at str 10, or a barbed strangler at str 8, those vehicles should quickly be toasted, leaving only about 2/3 of his points left, easily open for the slaughter. heck, with enough hormigaunts, terminators are easy enough to take down, and even if you don't take 'em out, that's probably 2-3 rounds of them not shooting.

just remember, out number, out innitiative, out attack.

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Author Topic: Venom Cannon or Barbed Strangler?? (Read 3474 times)