Topic: 1500 Eldar No Aspect "Ranger" List.

[Nemo vas Varya]

Looking to create a zero aspect, "Ranger" List. It is supposed to be a fast list. I don't need it to be top tier, but I want it to be viable.

Illiac Nightspear

5x Pathfinder
5x Pathfinder

10 Guardians +ShruiCan Plat +Wave Serpent (Scatter, ShuriCan, Ghostwalk, Spirit, Holo.)
10 Guardians +Scatter Plat +Wave Serpent (Bright Lance, ShuriCan, Ghostwalk, Spirit, Holo.)

War Walker Brightlance, EML (Flakk), Ghostwalk, Holo, Spirit.
War Walker Scatter, Star, Ghostwalk, Holo, Spirit

Vyper Brightlance, ShuriCan, Ghostwalk, Holo, Spirit
Vyper Scatter, ShuriCan, Ghostwalk, Holo, Spirit

Night Spinner, Ghostwalk Holo

The Serpents are used as tanks not transports. Tables played on are pretty dense terrain wise, often times city fights.

[volatilegaz]

Too many toys in my opinion

I would:
-Replace the serpent brightlance with scatter (unless it' for fluff reasons, you should never put anything other than scatter on a serpent -the laser lock rule is just too good with the shield)
-Make both Vypers Scatter & shuricannon (they have the speed to get to side/rear armour, so little need for the lance special rule)
-Make both War walkers double bright lance (best place for BLs, IMO)
-Drop all the ghost walk & spirit tones from all vehicles/walkers, and spend the saved points on eithe beefing up your pathfinders or (my preference) jetbikes -haven't done the maths, but it feels like about 6 JBs worth of toys there that you don't need. JBs are excellent in city-fight type terrain, since they can shoot & duck out of LOS so easily. They suit the fast non-aspect theme you are going for
-I'm not sure Holos are needed on anything but the waveserpent, but that's more of a judgment call. Peronally I prefer minimal upgrades, and more models on the field.
-If you face a lot of AT, might be worth swapping one of the defender units for fusion storm & warlock with spear, for close up AT.

My $0.02

[Grizzlykin]

I agree with volatilegaz on the change he propose, too man toys as he say.
I would personally go with warlock in your units rather than jetbikes. They sure are great but eldar are know for there psichic power so it would be a waist not to have some. I'm a fluff lover and runes of battle are pretty good in my opinion. One unit of jetbikes should be enough to zip across the field and get some point.
Buffing the pathfinder unit could be a good idea aswell as i believe they would work better as bigger unit but i haven't test them so i can't say much.

[davethemadorc]

if youve got the models 3 walkers is far superior to the vypers. [just count the shots !] and they get a powerfield save
imo holofields on walkers are expensive and ghostwalk isnt going to do you much good [walkers dont need to take dangerous terrain tests]
if you go scatlaz and BL on the walkers you can change all your other platforms over to scatlaz for extra firepower

at 1500pts three BL should be enough

you shouldnt need the holofields on a ghostwalk tank. just keep it OOs.

as another poster said id stick a warlock in each guard squad with a spear just for extra anti-tank and some utility against high T opponent
im also a fan of the 'cheap fusion gun ' - but you have to sacrifice the platform so its always a toss up.

at 1500pts your scatlaz cover should be enough anti-air so you can trim some points off the anti-air missile system

much as i love the models and do run them occasionally rangers and pathfinders generally convert so few hits into kills and are so immobile its hard to do more than skulk with them. [imo they should have 60" range - they still get outshot by orc big shootas !] [or tankbustas in trukks !]

tbh illic is probably better with a guard squad than the pathfinders - his void rifle is your heaviest weapon - even if he only gets a mega hit one game out of five !

back on the vypers - if you run 9 or more they can compete for cover and cause saturation problems - but in your army a wavz with some crew is just as fast and has more survivability.  i think id look at squeezing an extra one in there - the pathfinders can always jump on board an empty one.

[Cavalier]

Definitley drop all the upgrades except the holos on the Serpents. You wont need them... and IMO you gotta buff the size of those Ranger squads to really call it a "Ranger Army". BTW if you are playing city fight check the Sniper Alley mission that was featured in the White Dwarf for the new Cities of Death Missions... re-roll to hit, re-roll to wound and AP2 on all sniper weapons when targeting units outside of cover. Nasty!

[Nemo vas Varya]

I was under the impression that Farseers and Warlocks were both aspects, hence I did not include them. If I am wrong, I will glady stick some Warlocks in.

So changes:

Illiac

10x Pathfinder
10x Rangers

Guardian, ShuriCan, Waveserpent Shuricann Scatter, Holofields
Guardian, ScatterLast, Waveserpent, Shurican, Scatter, Holofields
3x Jetbike

War Walker BL/EML (Flakk) (This model is a special conversion and is the only fixed point that can not change.)
War Walker BL/Scatter

Vyper: Scatter, Shurican
Vyper: Scatter, Shurican

Night Spinner

[Cavalier]

I like this list a lot better. I think this could be very fun to play and still has some thump. I think you will need a little anti-tank, 2 brightlances is pretty light. A wraithknight would solve that problem but I don't know if you can fit into your list/army concept.

[Nemo vas Varya]

I could switch the spinner out for a Fire Prism, not as good at the anti-infantry, but is more versatile.

[volatilegaz]

Much better. More bodies, more firepower, more scoring units.

Farseers and Warlocks are definitely not Aspects, so feel free to include them.

I agree you are a little light on anti tank -I think swapping one of the defender units for fusion storm & spearlock would solve this nicely.

I'm personally not a fan of the BL / scatter combo on war walkers, but I know others are. I'd go for double BL if it were me.

I have found a single fire prism to be quite underwhelming. I'd stick with the spinner -especially since you'll be firing into cover an awful lot with the kind of terrain you've described.

[Nemo vas Varya]

Is more anti-tank really needed... I have a LOT of strength 6 shooting in there, all of it pretty accurate... plus mobility to grab flanks and side/rear arcs easy enough...  I should be able to glance everything but land raiders to death easy enough.

[volatilegaz]

Depends on your meta. You do have a good amount of S6/7 shots on fast platforms, but glancing say a waveserpent or Hammerhead to death still takes a lot of shooting, particularly if your opponent is good at protecting his weaker armour facings.
A bit of dedicated anti-tank can free up the scatters and serpent shields for anti-infantry duty.

You have a lot of anti-infantry in this list already, so I don't think you'll miss the extra shooting from one of the defender squads. You might miss a bit of melta, though.

It's not a fatal flaw or anything, just a minor tweak.

[Cavalier]

Strength 6 is okay but where you run into problems is 36/24" range. Chances are you are going to have to go out of cover to start hitting your opponents armor and this creates 2 problems.

1. Any smart player will keep his best armor facing you at all times. If you play Imperial Guard with any regularity Leman Russ are brutal to deal with with anything less than a Wraithcannon.

2. By having to ride out in the open you are exposing your AV 10 vehicles to a lot of fire power.

Hornets with Pulse Lasers would fit beautifully in this list and give you volume of fire, high strength anti-tank, more outflankers, and 48" range. Might want to try proxying them... they are indispensable unit in the Eldar arsenal. Definitely check them out.   

[Partninja]

Fire Prism instead of the Night Spinner is a good swap. Play test with that and see how the list fairs.

[davethemadorc]

avoiding aspects is great for a bit of fun and fluff.

but without the fraggon waggons you really need some anti-tank to deal with A13+ - any number of bright lances should do -

im always torn about running walkers scatlaz/BL  or BL/BL  the general difference is an almost guaranteed pen v all armour versus losing anti infantry/light vehicle firepower a bit of trial and error will decide you one way or the other [i like the scatlaz/BL as it does some service as anti-air]

so if you double the BL on the walkers you can run scatz on the wavz and stick the night spinner in over the prism [the spinner just needs GWM so it can hide until its up to frying temperature]; prisms need the extra points on bits and pieces to keep it in action [unless youre pretty sure you can outrange most opponents.]

good luck and enjoy !

[Marsyas]

As others have already said, this list really needs some anti-tank added to the mix. It feels like a list that would have done well in 6E, but will struggle now that tanks are back.  Against, say, an adamantium lance, there is basically nothing it could do.  But we don't need to go that extreme.  Really any heavily mechanized list that isn't Dark Eldar or Harlequins will stomp it flat.

Hornets would help.  A crimson hunter would help. Swapping out the vypers for two hornets or a crimson hunter seems like a good call, though you'd probably have to free up some points elsewhere as well.

[davethemadorc]

if you like the 'sneak-dar' style you could swap out guardians for scorpions for some protection for the snipers

freeing points up if you dont take the serpents would let you expand your fire support - walkers / vypers / hornets etc

im not a fan of the glass hunter - but its pretty good anti tank if it gets on the table !

[Partninja]

if you like the 'sneak-dar' style you could swap out guardians for scorpions for some protection for the snipers

freeing points up if you dont take the serpents would let you expand your fire support - walkers / vypers / hornets etc

im not a fan of the glass hunter - but its pretty good anti tank if it gets on the table !

This would A) go against his "no aspects" theme and B) Make this list unbound as there would be no troops.

Harlequins could work as a counter assault unit though.

[Rx8Speed]

The rangers are still troops.

If you can find 320 points or so you could take "The Heroes Path" formation and get a death jester, shadowseer and solitaire who all have infiltrate, stealth and shrouded (but can't join units). To me they would fit nicely with your theme. It also gives you access to some nice things like psychic powers and combat, which are 2 phases of the game that you would be otherwise be skipping which makes your list too static. Also they'd be fun to play!

In fact this would actually be a good list for that formation because you can infiltrate the 3 characters near a ranger or path finder unit to give them 'look out sir' which is a 2+ due to their flip belts. So even though they are only T3 which is the most common argument against the formation, shots have to get through a 2+ LOS and probably a 2+ cover. Also if you give all 3 of them haywire grenades then you are gaining some anti tank as well.

Double post merged - Iris.

[Geometer]

Only downside: you can't attach them to the ranger squads due to formation restrictions.

[Rx8Speed]

ah dang! I've been playing too much fantasy where you can look out sir to a nearby unit if they are the same troop type. No such luck in 40k