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Author Topic: Help against orc + chaos  (Read 1109 times)

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Offline magenb

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Help against orc + chaos
« on: February 28, 2015, 05:52:29 PM »
Went up against a 2k list minor chaos marines with helldrake, battlewagon with a lot of shooters, orc flyer and mass orcs on bikes.

Is the agis defence line with an exarch on the gun the best way to take out the Helldrake? That thing just ripped through my infantry.

The mass orcs on bikes was a problem, my DAs could only pick off 1 a turn thanks to FNP. War walkers dropped some pain on them thanks to the starcannon but got smashed from twin linked s5. WaveS helped a bit, warp spiders got smashed from return fire. Any other ideas on countering this?




Offline Fenris

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Re: Help against orc + chaos
« Reply #1 on: February 28, 2015, 07:52:20 PM »
Against 2 flyers, a crimson hunter is better than the ADL. However, since you are troubled by bikes, maybe some dark reapers could help you, and they do work well with the ADL.
Fast shot+flakk on the exarch and then a trooper to run the quad-gun should be trouble even for helldrakes (thats 6S7 shots that hits on about 2+) their range finder helmets are also quite good against bikes as well as skimmers and flyers.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2015, 07:53:51 PM by Fenris »
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Offline magenb

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Re: Help against orc + chaos
« Reply #2 on: March 1, 2015, 01:39:05 AM »
Against 2 flyers, a crimson hunter is better than the ADL. However, since you are troubled by bikes, maybe some dark reapers could help you, and they do work well with the ADL.
Fast shot+flakk on the exarch and then a trooper to run the quad-gun should be trouble even for helldrakes (thats 6S7 shots that hits on about 2+) their range finder helmets are also quite good against bikes as well as skimmers and flyers.

The low Armour of the crimson means it rather easy to take down.

So after tinkering with an army builder here's what I'm thinking for 2k.

2 x Imperial bunkers with Quad-Guns each with DR as Fenris described. (possibly swap one of these out for a Crimson Hunter).

Autarch (Shard+Avenger) with 10 x DA in WaveS (Scat, + Cannon + Holo)
10 x Guardians

5 x FD with WaveS (Scat, + Cannon + Holo)

7 x warp spiders

3 x War walkers (Scat+ SC or  BL)

--------------------------------

Allied with Dark Eldar.

Archon Shadow Field, Parasite's kiss, Web portal) + 6 x Kabalite warriors. These all get friendly with the FD in the WaveS.

10  x Kabalite warriors in Raider with Nightshields and splinter racks.

or Allied with Tau.

Commander with Command and Control + Multi-spectrum + Iridium armour, maybe a fusion blaster?? That should give one FW squad To Hit re-rolls and ignore cover saves.

2 full FW squads.



Offline Fenris

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Re: Help against orc + chaos
« Reply #3 on: March 1, 2015, 06:43:08 AM »
Yes, the CH is easy to shoot down if you have AA guns, however the helldrake can't do much against the CH as it's focus is on ground targets, so you should focus on downing that ork flyers first if it is a fighter, if it's a bomber then the CH will be quite safe. The autarch will also be great help to the CH, since you will want it to have the first blood in the airfight.

If you do not take the CH I would recommend taking lances on the walkers, just in case there is a landraider or similar around.

concerning DE:
I wonder how you are going to fit the kabalites in the FD-serpent as they cannot start in it, since it's a dedicated transport.

However may I suggest that you use the archon to deepstrike the firedragons, and then give the serpent to the guardians, granting OS to the serpent. the 6 kabalites would have to be on foot or maybe you can fit something else in.
3 reavers could be a great swap, I've use reavers as a good bodyguard for a bikeseer, it grants the farseer hit & run and with the right drugs the unit is T5.

Those kabalites in the raider are really good against MC, and with splinter racks quite ok against FMC.

concerning Tau:
The FW are awesome behind cover, to bad tau are not BB anymore, otherwise you could take a "batman" with the reapers for special rules goodies. So unless you are taking a larger TAU allies I'd suggest the fireblade or an ethereal.

You could use Tau for AA though, either by taking an AA riptide or AA unit of broadsides with missile drones.

Another good tactic is to try to match-up the warp spiders against chaos soulgrinders, due to the soulgrinders low Initiative.

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Offline davethemadorc

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Re: Help against orc + chaos
« Reply #4 on: March 1, 2015, 08:02:46 PM »
seems awkward but three walkers with scat-laz / shurikan are a very effective AA unit, just hide them from everything else if you can until the pesky flyer is down

equally if they get lucky a large group of warp spiderz can do the same job

this saves you paying huge numbers of points for dedicated AA that might be wasted


ive had some success with largish [7-8-9] groups of mini reapers [st5 x 2 shots each] stick an AA exarch in there or not they still deliver a 48" splot that has the benefit of 'ignores jink' - they are also awesome against bikes and all A3 infantry. start them off in a wavz so you can move them safely to fire positions. just dont get them charged as they have no overwatch !

if youre going to think about tau allies a riptide is about as good as it gets for AA !  and its versatile . just dont trusts its nova charge !

Offline magenb

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Re: Help against orc + chaos
« Reply #5 on: March 1, 2015, 11:15:57 PM »
seems awkward but three walkers with scat-laz / shurikan are a very effective AA unit, just hide them from everything else if you can until the pesky flyer is down

equally if they get lucky a large group of warp spiderz can do the same job

this saves you paying huge numbers of points for dedicated AA that might be wasted


ive had some success with largish [7-8-9] groups of mini reapers [st5 x 2 shots each] stick an AA exarch in there or not they still deliver a 48" splot that has the benefit of 'ignores jink' - they are also awesome against bikes and all A3 infantry. start them off in a wavz so you can move them safely to fire positions. just dont get them charged as they have no overwatch !

if youre going to think about tau allies a riptide is about as good as it gets for AA !  and its versatile . just dont trusts its nova charge !

Yeah most fliers will go down against WS, WW, even WaveS, but its not so easy when its AV12 :( It also drops a high S AP3 template, so having the reapers in a building is rather attractive for me right now :)

You should try the Starcannon instead of the shuriken, less shots but extra range and better AP.

 


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