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Author Topic: Relic blade and storm shield possible?  (Read 1935 times)

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Offline pudd

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Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« on: January 8, 2009, 07:34:03 AM »
Move this to the Rules and questions section if its in the wrong part, I just thought that as its a marine question that this would be the place for it. Also, I couldn't find a question like this one but that doesn't mean there isn't one there.

A few of the members of my local gaming club have told me that I cant take a captain or master with both a relic blade and a storm shield. They say that as the storm shield uses up an arm then they cant use it to use a relic blade but I disagree. They can take 2 2-handed weapons (storm bolter and combi bolter, though I dont know why anyone would) so why not a 2-handed and a 1-handed weapon. I've checked the rules for both and both say that the model cant get an extra attack for having an additional close combat weapon which is fine. Also checked the big rulebook in the weapons section and it didn't say otherwise.

Just wondering if this was right or not so I can either change my army list or rub it in their faces ;p

Offline SMVaughn

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #1 on: January 8, 2009, 07:59:48 AM »
OK I am currently going through my SM Codex and I do see why you could not.

You would end up giving up the Relic blade since it is an option in power armour weapon upgrades. However you loose those weapons to get Terminator armour and access to the storm shield.

Ie CODEX pg 132 Point stats
"Replace bolt pistol and or chainsword with - relic blade"

So you would have a power armour Bolt pistol or Chainsword and Relic blade.

Then further down same page

"Replace power armour, bolt pistol, cahinsword, frag and krak grenades, with Terminator armour with storm bolter and power sword"

Now you have a Terminator Capt.

Down a little more and

"Replace the power sword with power fist or storm shield"

Therefore my interpretation is no. A relic blade and storm shield combo though looks F'n fantastic. Is a non legal combo.

Now I am new to this and that is what I see reading my codex. That does not mean I am clearly right on it. So I hope this helps. Sorry it is not in oru favor as a fellow Space Marine player.

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Offline Mr Draken

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #2 on: January 8, 2009, 08:32:30 AM »
First off, go down ur list.... in the wargear for power armour u can get a storm shield, the reason u cant use a storm shield and relic blade is simple, the storm shield takes up a hand, and the relic blade requires 2 hands to use, it says this in the rules, so no u cant use a relic blade and storm shield.
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Offline SMVaughn

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #3 on: January 8, 2009, 08:38:03 AM »
Which makes sence.

However a bolt pistol and relic blade are legal as you only need to choose "and/or"... bolt pistol and chainsword... bolt pistol or chainsword ... take relic blade remove chain sword. Or keep the chain sword and remove the bolt pistol.

so would those two options contradict the two handed portion of a relic blade?

Offline YuenglingDragon

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #4 on: January 8, 2009, 09:31:29 AM »
The very first set of options answers this.  Replace the bolt pistol with a Storm shield and the chain sword with a relic blade.

The people in your group are either very stuck in the old ways of 40k or borderline retarded.  Nothing in the codex prevents you from this setup.
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Offline SMVaughn

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #5 on: January 8, 2009, 09:52:59 AM »
Really? Hmmm...

Because the codex does not give it an option for shield until you are switched up for Termie armor and to do that you need to give up all starting gear for it.

Most interesting... I wonder what kind of twisted set up I could make. LOL

Time to ponder this revelation.

Offline Locarno

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #6 on: January 8, 2009, 10:08:04 AM »
Quote
First off, go down ur list.... in the wargear for power armour u can get a storm shield, the reason u cant use a storm shield and relic blade is simple, the storm shield takes up a hand, and the relic blade requires 2 hands to use, it says this in the rules, so no u cant use a relic blade and storm shield.


Actually, it says you may never gain the bonus attack for using two close combat weapons when using a storm shield. Nowhere does it forbid you from using two-handed weapons.
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Offline YuenglingDragon

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #7 on: January 8, 2009, 10:37:41 AM »
Because the codex does not give it an option for shield until you are switched up for Termie armor and to do that you need to give up all starting gear for it.
Look again, Vaughn.  It's one of the options in the 4th dash down of the first set of options.
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Offline SMVaughn

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #8 on: January 8, 2009, 10:42:55 AM »
Whoops.... LOL

I missed that. Well now I stand corrected and very pleased at the new options before me for my Captain.

Thanks YuenglingDragon.

And to correct or change my beginnign statement as to no. To an agreeable yes you can.

Offline YuenglingDragon

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #9 on: January 8, 2009, 11:01:04 AM »
Whoops.... LOL
Don't feel too bad.  I couldn't find it for like a solid minute when I looked to tell you where to find it.

Anyway, I'm happy to help.  The Relic Blade would definitely be a good option for you since it will make wounding Necrons of all stripes a lot easier to kill.  If you have spare points, digital weapons will make smashing up Destroyers or the Necron Lord even easier.  And, of course, the 3++ from the shield is a godsend if you're going Lord hunting.
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Offline Locarno

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #10 on: January 8, 2009, 11:08:05 AM »
Not really - almost every lord comes packing a warscythe. "Storm shield, you say?"

That said it is a very nice combination; S6 and a 3++ save makes the captain almost a baby monstrous creature...
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Offline SMVaughn

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #11 on: January 8, 2009, 11:18:47 AM »
Hmmm....

I feel a new Captain being built coming on. And Hmmmm.... Necron dust does sound quite appealing at this time in my Vaughn chapter carreer. Oh what joys I will have.

Now to stop rolling so many GD 1's. LOL

Thanks again YuenlingDragon. And Thank you for that warning Locarno

Offline YuenglingDragon

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #12 on: January 8, 2009, 11:26:00 AM »
Thus far, I think all we've seen from Moc's Necrons are a Lord with a Res Orb and the standard staff of light.
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Offline Lorizael

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #13 on: January 8, 2009, 11:29:17 AM »
In this sort of situation, you really need to ask these people to find the rules that agree with them.
They won't be able to because they don't exist!

Show them pages 99 (relic blade), 101 (storm shield) and 132 (captain).
There is no restriction at all on using both of these items apart from the expensive point cost. :D

Offline Sanctjud

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #14 on: January 8, 2009, 11:32:48 AM »
Moc065 is more dakka, and less like Gutsy's CC necrons.

Anyway, I personally can't decide between the Twin LC's and the Relic Blade/Storm Shield.

Both are useful and look bad ass.

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Offline Lucky_Jackal

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #15 on: January 8, 2009, 03:39:43 PM »
Moc065 is more dakka, and less like Gutsy's CC necrons.

Anyway, I personally can't decide between the Twin LC's and the Relic Blade/Storm Shield.

Both are useful and look bad ass.


My 7 Cents.

I would lean towards to Relic Blade and Storm Shield. Less Wolverine, More Knights of the round table.

 :D
« Last Edit: January 8, 2009, 03:46:17 PM by Lucky_Jackal »

Offline Sanctjud

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #16 on: January 8, 2009, 03:42:34 PM »
I had the same feeling, but LC's havn't failed me yet, and I stick by: "re-rolls win games".

Plus my captain is already 165 points, no need to bump him up to 180...gawd how I hate expensive HQ's.

My 7 Cents.
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Offline Lucky_Jackal

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #17 on: January 8, 2009, 03:50:00 PM »
I had the same feeling, but LC's havn't failed me yet, and I stick by: "re-rolls win games".

Plus my captain is already 165 points, no need to bump him up to 180...gawd how I hate expensive HQ's.

My 7 Cents.

hhhhmmmmmm. That is true. Luckily I can think of other weapons that could easily "Count as" Lighting Claws....
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« Last Edit: January 8, 2009, 06:07:08 PM by Lucky_Jackal »

Offline YuenglingDragon

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #18 on: January 8, 2009, 04:25:25 PM »
Holy damn, that's a sweet idea.  I wonder if I have a bunch of swords lying around to chop up.

*Wanders off to find his old high elves.*
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Offline Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof)

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Re: Relic blade and storm shield possible?
« Reply #19 on: January 8, 2009, 08:09:03 PM »
Look at the page in the Space Marine Codex that defines what "and/or" means.  Fake edit: Page 128 under "options."  Translation: you don't have to replace either weapon, which isn't consistent with other entries in the very same Codex.  Things like Sergeants must replace the Bolt Pistol or the Boltgun, and so on depending on what option is being taken, the Captain is not obliged to replace anything.

Two-handed weapons simply can't be combined with a close combat weapon in order to gain a bonus attack.  It's a very common convention for a model with a two-handed weapon (a Howling Banshee Exarch with Executioner, a Sister Superior with Eviscerator and Bolt Pistol) to also have a one-handed weapon.

In other Codex books, it also prohibited the model from taking two two-handed weapons.  However, that is a Codex-specific prohibition, usually spelled out in the wargear section or above the HQ heading.  That restriction is also gone, so the Master can even take a Storm Bolter and Relic Blade.  Finally, the limit on how many weapons he can take is gone.  If you're taking a Relic Blade and Storm Shield, you may as well get a Storm Bolter too if you have points to spare.
« Last Edit: January 8, 2009, 08:10:08 PM by Mr.Peanut »
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