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Author Topic: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)  (Read 6821 times)

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Offline Ambience 327

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Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« on: January 3, 2014, 04:28:57 PM »
So I have finally finished updating my Exodite Codex for 6th Edition. Lots of minor tweaks from the previous version, mostly bringing things in line with 6th Edition conventions, new special rules and the 6th Edition Eldar Codex. The biggest change was a complete overhaul to Spiritsingers and their Melodies/Harmonies. I have created a somewhat unique system whereby the Spiritsinger casts a primary power (the Melodies) and then addes one or more secondary powers to it (the Harmonies) that either enhance the primary power or give it a minor additional effect that is independent of the primary power.

[COLOR="#FF0000"]* UPDATED 03/04/2014 *[/COLOR]

You can download the latest version of the Codex via this link to box.com or via this link to scribd.com.

As always, comments and constructive criticism are encouraged, as they help me make my works the best they can be!

Offline Chrysalis

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2014, 05:42:15 PM »
I quickly got a look at your homebrew codex. It's nice to see some stats for the exodite knights (Bright Stallions/Fire Gale/Towering Destroyer) since GW missed the opportunity to bring those on the table with the *cough cough* wraith knight (by the way, there is a problem with the layout of the exodite knights part).

There are also too many "dragon" titles to my mind, but that's an overall good job!

Offline Ambience 327

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2014, 09:17:47 AM »
Thanks for the comments. I had fun putting rules together for the Knights, and I think they represent what the Wraithknights could have been if GW had put a bit more thought into them.

What exactly is the layout problem? I looked, but didn't spot anything. If you could give me a page # and general description, that would be most helpful.

On the "Dragon" title, I guess that's up to personal preference. I like tying a good portion of the Eldar in the codex together with the title, and after all - dragons are very important to Exodite society. :D

Offline Chrysalis

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2014, 09:45:59 AM »
The layout problem is about the "Agile" skill paragraph. The begining on the left column is bold, as well as the "fluff" description of the skill - whereas this part is not bold in other parts of the codex. I'm not sure I'm clear, I hope it'll help.

The wraithknight thing was a huge disapointment for me. The kind of things I don't understand from GW: I mean, the fluff completely exists for eldar knights, through exodites AND titans clans. They didn't even need to talk about exodites, because it would need models that don't exist (and we know how it turned about tyranids). But at least titan clans! Especially when you think about GW and Forgeworld soon becoming one and only... Playing the "wraithknight" through eldar titans clans would have allowed an opening for titans selling. That's a badly missed opportunity to my mind...

Offline Ambience 327

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #4 on: March 4, 2014, 02:19:29 PM »
New version uploaded. (See the first post)

Update notes:

- Added a bit to the Heavy Cavalry rules granting Heavy Cavalry a +1 Strength Bonus for their Hammer of Wrath Attacks. I wanted them to be just a little more powerful on the charge, and this should help them get there.

- Added the new Storm Lance as an option for Dragon Knights, Noble Knights and Kindred Guard, to give them another option for dealing with vehicles. When I thought of the possibility of adding a haywire-based lance option, it just seemed to make sense, while still keeping them relatively simple and lance-based.

- Reduced the Range of Ballad of the Beast to 12".

- Reduced the cost of Raptors to 13 points per model, leaving a small premium built-in to the unit to account for the Pack Leader.

- Updated Mei'nly Kurim-We's Flaming Breath rule to clarify that the additional shooting attack is usable in both normal shooting and overwatch.



Big Change:

I have overhauled the Spiritsinger Psychic powers and many things related to them. I think the changes address many of the comments I've had so far, and add an interesting mechanic. They definitely enhance the overall fluff factor of music-based Psychic powers. However, I want to know if anyone thinks it is too complicated. Thoughts on this are espeically welcome. The below notes are all related to the Spritisinger overhaul:


- Changed how generating Melodies and Harmonies works. Now you choose one Melody and one Harmony for each Mastery Level, rather than simply knowing them all. Also, casting Harmonies requires other models in the unit, and has them take a Psychic Test on their own Leadership to do so, but they may only fire Snap Shots in the Shooting Phase if they do. Basically, now the Spiritsinger is leading the song, and others join in to improve them.

- Reduced the cost of upgrading a Kindred to a Spiritsinger by 5 points to reflect the new Melody and Harmony rules.

- Granted Spritisingers the ability to upgrade to Mastery 3.

- Clarified what happens in the rare event that a Harmony is successful, but incurs a Perils of the Warp attack.

- Changed the wording on Prelude of Fate so that each Fate Counter "allows the unit to re-roll a single die from any To Hit roll, To Wound roll, Armour Save or Leadership Test." This both clarifies the original intent, and makes it slightly less useful for Leadership Tests, since you would have to now spend two Fate Counters to re-roll both dice.

- Added an exception to the Refrain Harmony: "Refrain may only be added to a Melody that has already had at least one other Harmony added to it."

- Made it clear, in both unit entries and army list entries, the Psychic Disciplines used by the various Psykers.

Offline Wyldhunt

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #5 on: March 7, 2014, 08:42:41 PM »
Very cool! I'm looking forward to testing out a lot of your projects as I can.  At a glance, I do have a few concerns about the cost-effectiveness of a few units though.  Granted, I might be proven wrong about these after testing, but here are my thoughts:

* Drake Flights seem really scary for their points.  A squad with 4 bases can pretty reliably toss 3 flamer templates on an enemy after deepstriking, and that's only 75 pts. Their survivability isn't terrible, (13 wounds if you take a 4th base), but adding a few extra bases can really add to your chances of unfolding this deepstriking swarm and scorching away huge swaths of enemies. Really cool, but 15 points for a jump flamer is a little scary.

* The carnosaurus's price is right about where I'd expect it, but I'm not sure these things will ever make it across the battlefield. They feel right for the points, but what do you think of making them squad-able (up to 3 tops) or maybe giving them an upgrade that grants 5+ or even 4+ FNP? 300 points for 3 dinosaurs slogging across the table is terrifying at low points, but a squad of devastators could make short work of these things which tempts me to use different heavy support options in higher games.

*I like the Sailbacks, but a single shot apiece makes them feel very niche to me.  It's not cost-effective against light infantry, probably not even against marines, and rending is too unreliable for me to want to shoot them at Terminators.  It seems like it would work pretty well against light vehicles if you took firemouths, but there are probably better options for that as well.  Monstrous creatures are a great target for these guys, but I think I'd usually just take rangers instead. I can get 2.5 rangers for the cost of a sailback. Instead of 2 sailbacks (2 shots), I could take 5 rangers (5 shots).  Firemouths are possibly better against T5 MCs, but the extra shots from the rangers probably make them the better choice against anything T6 or higher. 

Maybe if one sailback could take an upgrade that let it weaken MCs' armor saves (softening it up for shooting from other units such as rangers)? Or maybe successful hits against MCs could cause 2 wounds instead of one representing the poisonous globule dripping down the creature's body after impact? 

I like barrage on them though. That's a nice touch.


Also, the word "dragonback" is misspelled in the right column of the herdmaster's entry as "adragonback."

Offline Ambience 327

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #6 on: March 9, 2014, 10:15:17 PM »
Thanks for the feedback. It is always appreciated. And of course, if you do get around to playing any games with my rules, please let me know how things go!

You have a lot to say about the Drakes, Carnosaurs and Sailbacks, and I am still taking it in. I haven't really had much of a chance to playtest my Exodites, so these rules are still a bit rough and unproven. Your comments on them will definitely be taken into account.

One thing I am not sure about is packs of Carnosaurs. I really want them to be solitary creatures who are apt to go after any other large creatures in the area, even one of their own kind. One thing I could see working, however, would be a mated pair hunting with a juvenile. (Shades of the second Jurassic Park movie here in this idea.) I am thinking that you either have them as single Carnosaurs, or add in a second Carnosaur and a young Carnosaur (with reduced stats, and some sort of "If he dies the other two freak out and try to kill anything in sight regardless of Dragonsingers nearby" rule). That way, if you wanted a group of them, you would have to take three, and only three, and there would be a risk if the youngling is killed before the other two.

I also really like your suggestion of the Sailbacks/Firemouths having the ability to weaken the enemy, and I may play with that idea a bit.

Oh, and "adragonback" isn't a misspelling, it is just fancy wording for "on the back of a dragon". It isn't even a phrase I came up with - I've read it in several books from my favorite Sci-Fi author.  ;D

Offline Wyldhunt

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2014, 01:18:34 AM »
Okay! Just got done with my first playtest of your exodites!  My notes got sort of sloppy towards the end, but here's what happened:

MY LIST:

HQ
75Dragon Prince: Drake Lance and Dragon Helm (Rage, Fear, and Furious Charge warlord trait)

ELITES
205- Kindred Guard X 8: 7 Laser Lances and a First Knight with a Drake Lance

TROOPS
125- Dragon Knight Kindred X 8: 1 storm lance
5-Chieftain with Laser Lance
20-Knight Singer with War Drum (all heavy cav within 12" have assault grenades)
125- Dragon Knight Kindred X 8: 1 storm lance
5-Chieftain with Laser Lance
20-Knight Singer with War Drum (all heavy cav within 12" have assault grenades)
125- Dragon Knight Kindred X 8: 1 storm lance
5-Chieftain with Laser Lance
25-Knight Singer with Prelude of Hope (3d6 pick 2 for morale, pinning, and reroup)
125- Dragon Knight Kindred X 8: 1 storm lance
5-Chieftain with Laser Lance
20-Knight Singer with War Drum (all heavy cav within 12" have assault grenades)
60-Rangers X 5
60-Rangers X 5

FAST ATTACK
75-Drake Flight X 4
170- Dragonwarden X 8: Drake Arrows, Swarm Arrows
Total: 1250

HIS LIST (Iron Fists + allied Marines, and Lots of Bikes)
Captain Hygelac's Steel Hands (1250pts)
Chapter Tactics
Iron Hands
HQ (250pts)
Chapter Master on Bike (250pts)
Troops (395pts)
2 Bike Squad (Troops) with
2x Grav-gun (Graviton), 4x Space Marine Biker
Biker Sergeant

Bike Squad (Troops)
2x Meltagun (20pts), 4x Space Marine Biker
Biker Sergeant
Bolt pistol

Heavy Support
Centurion Devastator Squad
3x Centurion, Centurion Sergeant, 4x Grav-cannon and grav-amp

Allied Detachment Chapter Tactics
Ultramarines
HQ (165pts)
Chief Librarian Tigurius (Bio,Div,Pyro,Telek,Telep), Warlord Trait: Storm of Fire
Troops (110pts)
X2 Scout Squads with
Scout Sergeant , 4x Scouts

DEPLOYMENT/OBJECTIVES
We had a fairly open middle ground, some forested areas on his side of the board, and some cliffs that block line of sight on the edges as well as some rocks on my side. We deployed along the short edges of the table.  There were 3 objectives worth 1 point each scattered along the center of the board, and a single point was rewarded for first blood, slaying the warlord, and line-breaking.

He deployed everything as far forward as he could except the scouts who infiltrated. The chapter master and Tigurius both joined the Centurions as buffers and bodyguards.

  I nestled my rangers into the rocks just close enough to the objectives to snipe anyone who dared take them, held my drakelings and wardens in reserve to deepstrike and outflank, and put the rest on the front lines.

TURN 1
I stole the initiative and ran forward.  He wiped out a squad of dragon knights with his centurions and orbital bombardment.

TURN 2
Wardens show up on the side of the board nearest to the centurions. I shoot at them for lack of a better target and kill a single centurion with a drake arrow. Two squads of dragon knights charge. The first one gets shot up so badly by enemy overwatch (I will grow to loath grav guns) that the assault failed. The other one charged some bikers and began whittling them down. This assault would last through turn 6 of the game with him having a single biker survive against 5 knights (including the singer and chieftain) for about 6 assault phases without either side making a wound stick.

On his turn, both squads of scouts arrive along the long board edges. One shows up near an objective behind my wardens. Another starts marching towards my rangers (going for a line-breaker, I think.) His centurions wipe out all but two wardens (the warden was the last to die in the volley). The scouts shot at them too, but did nothing.  Shooting from bikes saw him whittle down more of my dragon knights.  My kindred guard were safely behind my front lines, but frustratingly too far away to get good angles for assault this game.Oh, also, Tigurius got perils while doing his powers and suffered a wound.

TURN 3
Drakelings mishap while deepstriking. He places them near my rangers, and I suffer no wounds from dangerous terrain on the rocks. The rangers kill two scouts and pin down one unit while my wardens plink away at the other. My remaining knights and kindred guard charge. The prince alone should have gotten enough wounds to wipe out the entire squad, but bad positioning prevented him from killing more than 2. It was a good round for assault, but positioning sort of prevented me from capitalizing on it (as did ATSKNF) The remaining bikes from that assault fall back while the guys who assaulted Turn 2 remain locked in combat.  Oh, and the lone dragon to survive overwatch from the previous turn hides behind some cliffs.

On his turn, he overkills one of my remaining knight squadrons with his centurions, and his untouched biker squad kills off my prince and some kindred.  His scouts charge my remaining warden who kills two of them in overwatch(!) before being overrun. Props to those guys. They got their licks in.

TURNS 4-6
At this point, things were still tense, but not really close. My drakelings roasted only a single scout despite doing 8 wounds with their breath.  My lone-survivor from the unfortunate Turn 2 Overwatch Massacre snuck around a cliff to stab the last scout to death and claim an objective while the drakelings shielded him from the Centurions. He finished shooting up the kindred guard and turbo boosted to take 2 of the 3 objectives My rangers had his other scout squad scared, but said scouts just hid behind the edge of a cliff to get line breaker.

CONCLUSION
He had first blood, line breaker, slay the warlord, and 2 objectives for a total of 5 points.
I had 1 objective and line breaker for 2 points. 

COMMENTS
This was sort of an unofrtunate matchup in some ways. His lack of body count was helpful, but he matched me in speed, and his toughness was hard to deal with.  I couldn't really apply a lot of pressure to one area because my units were too clustered together, and he could scoot back to kite me slightly.  Still, there were a few moments where things were really tense.  The kindred guard and wardens worked really well, but I had them in bad positions. The drakelings were underwhelming, but that's largely due to bad luck.  For instance, I had 8 hits with their flamers against the scouts, only did 2 wounds, and he saved one of them.

The points costs for everything felt about right (though I"m still suspicious of the drakelings; I think they could devastate orks or tyranids).  A lot of my casualties are the result of grav-guns, which he had plenty of. If he'd been packing more meltas or flamers, I don't doubt I'd have had more of an edge.  My prince did amazingly well, getting 5 wounds on the one turn that he charged, but grav guns being ap 2 denied him some durability.

I might have done better if I'd squeezed a hunting horn into one of my knight squads, but I as paranoid about not having access to grenades, and I was tight on points. 

Any questions?

Offline Ambience 327

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2014, 11:20:12 AM »
Wow, thanks for that! Very informative. I guess at least the units you used couldn't be considered ridiculously OP, at least against Marines.  ;D

I thnk you definitely sufferred a bit from bad luck (especially where the poor Drakes were concerned!), and a bit from the fact that his army definitely poked at your weaknesses and mitigated your strengths.

One thing I would suggest (which may not have been very easy against such a fast moving opponent) would be to attempt to focus your charges - hit one enemy unit with two or even three units of Knights. Only one can possibly be shot up (unless you are facing Tau), and if you equip each unit with a different Dragonsong or Instrument, they will work as force multipliers, giving both units the benefits of both Dragonsingers. You could even use geared-up Kindred Guard or Noble Knights to "Tank" the Overwatch fire for the slightly squishier Knights by having them declare their charge first, if you are feeling particularly bold.

Another thing that might help would be to toss in one or two of the bigger beasties (Carnosaur, Great Drake, Megadon) or even a Knight Construct to act as a fire magnet so that your Heavy Cav don't take as much fire as they cross the field. Thought that might be a strategy better left to larger games.

One thing that probably really hampered you was the open nature of the terrain on your table. The Exodites fight best in dense jungle! Of course, we can't always expect the terrain setup to take that into account, nor should it. One thing I have considered though, is to add in a "fortification" option for Exodites to place a few small areas of jungle on their side of the table, representing the fact that they would typically at least hang close to such terrain if it is available, and strike from it if possible. I am also thinking of a "World Spirit Node" or something like that as another foritification option, though that would be more for enhancing the Spiritisingers' abilities.

Offline Wyldhunt

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2014, 08:52:18 PM »
I actually did charge multiple squads into targets when I could, but the tangled-up dragon knights form my turn 2 assault and the smallish footprint of his bike squads made it hard to position things well.  Against IG or something else with large squad sizes, I imagine I'd have an easier time getting the charge off.

In future lists, I plan to bring out more big guys.  This time 'round, I wanted to ensure I had enough bodies on the table to afford losing a squad or two before making contact with the enemy. Plus, I'm still getting the hang of 6th edition, so I didn't feel like using the Great Wyrm just yet. 

I think the thing that hurt me most were simply the number of gravity weapons he had. Meltaguns would have had a lower rate of fire. Flamers would have had difficulty overcoming my toughness and armor.  Even big guns like missile launchers or lascannons would have been somewhat wasted since I could close the gap so fast.  But those gravity guns were just perfect for crushing my heavily armored dino-riders. :(

One other thing to note is that it was a little confusing making the list due to the slightly repetitive names.  Having to separate out my various "dragon" units and "singer" models was a bit tricky. No worse that making a blood blood or woof woof list though.

Offline Wyldhunt

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2014, 05:35:39 PM »
Sorry for the double-post, but do you have any plans to update the codex for 7th edition?  If so, I'll probably wait until you update to run another test game with these rules.  If not, I can probably just keep using the rules as they are since the spirit singer largely uses its own rules for psychic powers anyway, and most of the other stuff shouldn't really need any tweaking.

Offline Ambience 327

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2014, 09:24:04 AM »
Yes, I do plan to update for 7th. I have finished digesting the rules changes, and I am working my way through my home brew works, starting with my Adeptus Arbites (as they are my first love). I may do Exodites after that, especially since there is interest in it. :)

Offline Wyldhunt

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2014, 08:37:27 PM »
Glad to hear it!

Offline Wyldhunt

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2014, 10:25:52 PM »
Sorry for the minor act of necromancy.  I hope the mods will allow it as this chunk of the forum is rather sleepy.

Quick question before I get into it: what counts as a "dragon singer?"  I see knight singers and spirit singers, but no "dragon singers."  I played anything non-psychic with the word "singer" in its name as being a dragonsinger, but I wasn't sure if this was correct.  Also, Nocturne of Shadow is still useful, but the second part of its rules are outdated since nightfighting has changed.

I got in another playtest tonight.  It was 2,000 points, and I took the following:


HQ
170-The Prince of Nine Worlds (Dragon King)*: Drake Lance, Shield of Vaul, Armour of Vaul, Hunting Drake, Vaul's Sigil
*Fluff is that this guy leads exodites to new maiden worlds when they become populous enough. Each time I win a battle, I'm going to considdder changing his title by increasing the number of worlds by one. :)

TROOPS
115-Dragon Knights X 5: Storm Lance, Knightsinger with Hunting Horn
5-Chieftain: Laser Lance
115-Dragon Knights X 5: Storm Lance, Knightsinger with Hunting Horn
5-Chieftain: Laser Lance
110-Dragon Knights X 5: Storm Lance, Knightsinger with War Drum
5-Chieftain: Laser Lance
110-Dragon Knights X 5: Storm Lance, Knightsinger with War Drum
5-Chieftain: Laser Lance
156-Raptors X 12

ELITES
245-Kindred Guard X 8: X 7 Drake Lances, First Knight has a Hunting Drake
25-Spiritsiner: Witch Lance, nocturne and lullaby for melodies, chorus and refrain for harmonies

FAST ATTACK
89-Dragonwarders X 5: Herwarden has Drake Arrows
105 Drake Flight X 6:
150-Great Dreak:

HEAVY SUPPORT
240-Knight COnstruct (Fire Gale): Jump Jets, Knight Lance, Scatter Laser
240-Knight COnstruct (Fire Gale): Jump Jets, Suncannon, Scatter Laser
100-Carnosaur
Total: 1990

He took an IG/Tau combo including:
... a 3 man squad of Russes with the tank commander guy
...A hammerhead with longstrike
...a priest, lord comissar, crisis commander, servitor
...2 chimeras with vets inside
...a squad of scions and a squad of rough riders
... A tau flyer of some sort (didn't do much)
...Pathfinders, fire warriors, and broadsides

THE GAME
We did crusade and dawn of war.  I won first turn and deployed with my raptors screening my kindred knights, my dragon knights on the sides, a construct on either flank, and the carnosaur on my right flank. My great drake chose to start off the board. My drake wing chose to deepstrike. My wardens outflanked.  His warlord trait let him outflank his veterans and their chimeras along with his rough riders.

TURN 1
On the first turn, everything rushes forward. My knight lance construct puts a glance on a russ, my suncannon knight evaporates a pathfinder squad, and everything else runs.  Oh! And I use the maiden's lullaby to put his fire warriors to sleep.  You *may* need to debuff the lullaby just a bit. Maybe make it just 2d6 or 3d6 take the two highest.  In combination with the refrain harmony (which I used), it's basically an auto-pin.

On his turn, his russes manage to mow through the entire raptor squad, and random other shooting kills a few dragon knights, but not much else.

TURN 2
My drake wing and great drake show up.  The former zooms along one flank hoping to have some juicy targets to roast next turn. The latter deepstrikes onto the middle of the board in hopes of reinforcing a flank later on.

I lullaby the fire warriors again while my kindred guard and dragon king smash into his russ squad.  My suncannon construct smashes into the hammerhead along with a dragon knight squad.  While my shooting fails to do much (I think I glanced a couple of things and failed to get past the crisis commander's invul), assault saw me destroying the hammerhead and demolishing the russ squadd (which exploded and killed both a kindred guard and the tech priest). 

In retaliation, all of his reserves but the flyer arrive.  Lucky snapshooting sees him killing my great drake and my carnosaur. The carnosaur, it's worth noting, died to regular shooting from a vet squad. One melta hit and two las weapons, to be precise. He was basically in the list to draw fire, which he did, but this guy seems rather fragile. The knight construct also took some wounds, and his rough riders killed a dragon knight or two. 

TURN 3
My warders show up to put a glance on one chimera. My sun cannon construct finished it off while my knight lance construct dealt with the other chimera.  He no longer had any tanks. Not bad for turn 3 from a melee army! My kindred guard and king killed off his fire warriors while the drake wing was busy roasting a handful of scions.

He shoots my spiritsinger and a kindred guard to death with his broadsides and commander. He also put a wound on the king, but only because I forgot I had a 2+ save and FNP. >.<  More dakka sees him down my knight lance construct, but the stunned survivors of his chimera fail to harm my warders. 

TURN 4
My suncannon construct blasts a veteran squad to oblivion.  My dragon knights catch up with the comissar as he struggles away from the front line and put a laser lance shot into his back.  The king broke off from the kindred guard who downed the broadsides with their lances. The king's lance failed to burn the commander in shooting, but he quickly finished said commander off in the assault phase.

Not much happened from there. His flyer showed up and failed to hit anything at which point we called game.  He had a good chance of claiming one objective if he could kill my drake wing, but I controlled every other objective on the board. Over the course of the game, he killed all but one of my monstrous creatures, and I think he wiped out a single dragon knight squad. Aside from that, casualties were minimal.  His outflanking gave him a nasty turn 2 punch, but it probably hurt him more than it helped. Protecting his russes for an extra turn would have let him do a lot of damage to me.

That said, the exodites worked very well. It would have been a very different game without the fire support of the knight constructs. Their fire power and durability were well worth the points.  I'll probably use the drakes to screen in the future as deepstriking a full squad leaves them too prone to being out of range, and 12" movement lets you cover a lot of ground fast. My great drake andd carnosaur were cheap enough that I didn't mind losing them.  The great drake is slightly awkward in that jinking with him leaves him without any weapons to use, but he's well worth the points.  The psychic powers ranged from awesome to sort of useless.  The anti-psyker one would be fine against some armies. Not helpful versus tau, but oh well.  The nocturne is a solid choice. The nova is potent, but my kindred guard don't seem like the type to need help killing things once they're within 6".  The lullaby is good to the point of being broken at shutting down a unit a turn. 

On that note, I was a little confused about how to use Refrain. Er, no "note" pun intended.  I played it that I did psychic tests to activate the melody, then did seperate tests to activate the harmony. How does chorus work with powers that would otherwise be out of range?  Do you just fail to use the power if you fail to activate the chorus? Should I have been rolling to use chorus before the power?  Slight confusion there.

One last thing.  What's the point of noble knight kindred?  They seem to be cheaper kindred guard but with fewer options.  Saving a couple points would be nice, but their presence seems redundant. 

It was fun using your 'dex! Let me know what you think of the feedback!

Offline Ambience 327

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #14 on: October 1, 2014, 03:37:50 PM »
Thank you for the continued feedback, and especially for the battle report. That kind of info is quite valuable. :)

Unfortunately, work on this 'Dex is temporarily stalled due to a death in the family, other real-life business, an upcoming vacation, and a bit of a conundrum as to how to reconcile my Spiritsinger psychic discipline with the new Psychic Power rules.

Rest assured, I plan to get back to work on this soon - hopefully in the next few weeks. Your input has been, and will continue to be very important when I do!

Offline Wyldhunt

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2015, 10:57:20 PM »
I've continued to play with your exodite rules, and I thought I'd share a few thoughts form my recent games.

*Carnosaurs are really underwhelming. Which isn't to say they're bad.  For their points, they're a pretty alright MC with a knack for ripping up enemy MCs.  That said, they are far from being the BAMF kings of the jungle your previous posts have lead me to believe you want them to be.  They're simply too squishy, and they tend to lag behind the rest of the army as well.  I recently had mine die from overwatch a pair of krak grenades after assaulting a marine squad.  He killed two or three marines, but average joes were able to bring him down easily. Haven't had a chance to send him up against other MCs, but it seems like most MCs out there would probably either slap him down if they get to swing or simply kill him before he crosses the board.  My large Megaladon worries my opponent a lot more than this guy, and he's proven to be an easy source of first blood on at least one occassion. Again, he doesn't seem bad for his points. Then again, for pretty much the exact same price tag, our dark eldar cousins can take a talos who has better toughness, feel no pain (boostable to 4+ with a cronos), a 3+ save, and a wider array of weapon options. 

I think a minor durability boost would make him really strong for his points. That said, I also kind of want to see this guy be much more expensive but also much more intimidating.  I sort of like the idea of "packages" of upgrades that let you make him some combination of tough, fast, or more versatile, but that's probably another discussion. I want this guy to be the king of his territory, able to smack down anything he comes across.  I want to feel like I'm bringing some sort of kaiju to the table. Instead, he's just sort of a cost-effective mini-MC. ^_^;  Maybe retain his current statline and give it to a new unit while also creating a "Demikaiju" or something that gets his Apex Predator status?  I may be biased since I've started using a godzilla toy for his model. <_<

*Megaladons seem pretty solid. I didn't use them much previously, so I thought I'd report on them now. I've only used the large variety, but its high wounds keep the Spooked rule from being too punishing while at the same time encouraging me to look at critter-related singer instruments.  Scatter lasers feel like a must-use on them as they really benefit from laser lock.  Flamers seem less useful to me than wraithbows. The latter can potentially help the megaladon take down vehicles and throw out a few more shots at a range.  Flamers require I get closer than I'd like to, and the things that are scared of flamers in overwtach are rarely the same things that want to assault a Toughness 8 beasty anyway.

*Hit & Run. The army needs more of it.  This army is all about winning on the charge, and that's cool. It makes me arrange waves of units and carefully avoid letting the enemy get off the charge.  That said, not getting the charge or failing to finish a unit off on the charge is really crippling to Exodites. On more than one occassion, I've had my kindred guard with drake lances dominate a fight only to be virtually helpless when they get assaulted in the following round. Even a lonely tac marine or terminator not being killed is sort of a threat as winning a sweeping advance means he simply stays where he's at to lock down my squad.  Plus, some very scarey units are also fast. Specifically the Thunderwolves that tore me apart today, but other examples abound.

What I'm getting at is that Hit & Run would do a lot to prevent this army from being countered as easily.  I think making it an instrument like the horn and drums would be perfect for this.  The singer can be sniped/challenged/otherwise killed to remove this advantage from the army, and the limited range of the instrument makes you stay in formation, but it would prevent tarpit units from being a hard counter to many of the exodite units. 

As a side note, I still have yet to be convinced that the creature-related instruments are worth taking over a horn or drum. 

*Dragon helms are weird.  They're hard to justify taking because they apply to such a niche group of threats. On the other hand, they're really nice to have, and semi-cheap.  I've found they're a good points filler.

*Great Drake has some issues.  His breath is nice against non-marines, but marines are likely to only lose a body or two to each blast of fire.  Flakk missiles and most other prevalent anti-air threats are almost too good against him, ignoring his armor and wounding on 3s.  Today, mine arrived from reserves, failed to kill anything with a vector strike, then promptly got shot down and assaulted. Losing access to his only weapon when jinking doesn't help matters either.  He needs... something. Not sure what.  Maybe a special rule to let him retain the flame attack or some other mode of offense?  He's really cool, but pretty niche in his application. Tau will shoot him down instantly. Eldar, will hide in tanks, have armor that protects against the breath, and/or shoot him down quickly.  Marines neutralize a lot of his threat by having 3+ armor.  I see him bullying IG effectively, but only if they don't bring anti-air. 

* Still not sure what the point of the Noble Knights is.  Am I missing something? What advantage do they have over kindred guard aside from not requiring a king or price to be taken?  As is, you could probably just remove them from the codex. 

*More unmounted units would be nice just for the sake of variety.  Slightly related: sundered knights are a unit I just can't bring myself to take.  They're too slow to keep up with cavalry/beasts, though infiltration could help with that.  Infiltrating means they'll be harder to buff with instruments though, and they'll probably die fairly easily to any enemy unit that wants them dead.  Their lack of shooting means I can't really take advantage of their infiltration either; a unit of dragon knights could probably be wherever they've infiltrated in a turn or two most of the time anyway.  The only use I really see for them is hunting non-flying monsters, but kindred guard or even rangers would probably be better at that. How did you intend for them to be used?

*Knight Constructs are nasty, but so are wraith knights.  Performance seems comparable, even when using the destroyer and steed variants.

*Pterasaur mounts appear to be pointless as of 7th edition. Maybe let them move as jetbikes and/or jink?
*An errata on the psychic powers would be nice, and I maintain that some of those powers are still ridiculously good. Looking at the sleepy-time power specifically.

Overall, I'm having fun with your rules, and I'd love to see them updated!

P.S. Those fortifications you mentioned a few posts up would be great.  Just make sure they somehow let you "infiltrate" the fortifications or otherwise make them usable to the exodites who so love running away from their deployment zone to stab things.  What would you think of a "fortification" that basically caused all Exodite-faction units to gain a +1 to cover saves and/or lowered maximum enemy movement by an inch or two to represent thick jungles, world-spirit-created blizzards, etc?  That way, the exodites don't require actual jungle/twisted copse terrain to still benefit from their familiarity with the local terrain.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2015, 11:11:34 PM by Wyldhunt »

Offline Ambience 327

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2015, 03:12:49 PM »
As always, you're feedback is greatly appreciated. I'm still chipping away at the Codex, and plan to release a new version sometime before Halflife 3 comes out... :)

That said, I am definitely waiting to get my hands on the Harlequin Codex and see if any rules/fluff from that need to be taken into account. Beyond that though, some of your concerns above have already had some work levied their way (most notably Psychic Powers - they are getting an overhaul and I think they are getting to a really interesting place.)

The Fortifications will be in, that much I can say for sure - and will tie in a bit with the new Psychic Power rules.

Offline Wyldhunt

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Re: Codex: Eldar Exodites for 6th Edition (Updated 03/04/2014)
« Reply #17 on: February 25, 2015, 01:48:42 PM »
Awesome! I look forward to seeing what you come up with.

 


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