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Author Topic: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C  (Read 3172 times)

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Offline FarseerPhil

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1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« on: January 21, 2009, 12:24:20 AM »
Evenin all,
 I have a list that i am sure is going to make some of you go crazzy. Love it or hate it Tear it to shreds. I am planning on playing in the Adepticon 2009 40k Championships this year. Here is my initial List. I may eventually go to a flying council and smaller

This army rests well with the reserve option.comming in on turn 2 3+ or holding out in annihilation missions and being able to split the enemy in half with a fortuned vyper squad giving cover to one half of the board, or just out flanking the enemy from first turn- turbo boost away.

This list resides on VP denile. The embolden will help the 2 squads stick around. I really like the 9 man unit. its big enough to pack a punch while able to stretch into cover providing a cover save for everyone in the squad. There is more than enough fire power to handle all horde lists. The nob biker sqauds are going to be tough to catch off gaurd, a roadblock and some shining spears autarch and farseer might be enough to stop them. withdraw rinse and repeat.

without further adieu.

1850 Pts - Eldar Roster - 1850 Saim Hann All Air.

HQ: Autarch (1#, 140 Pts)
   1 Autarch @ 140 Pts
      Mandiblaster (Mb); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Laser Lance (LL); Fusion Gun (Fg); (x1); Haywire Grenades (HayG); Plasma Grenades (PG)

HQ: Farseer (1#, 178 Pts)
   1 Farseer @ 178 Pts
      Doom ;Fortune Runes of Warding (RofWard); Spirit Stones (P:SpStn); Eldar Jetbike (EJB); Singing Spear (SSpr)

Troops: Guardian Jetbike Squadron (11#, 300 Pts)
   10 Guardian Jetbike Squadron @ 300 Pts
       Shuriken Cannon (SCan) (x3);
      1 Warlock @ [50] Pts
          Embolden Witchblade (WB)

Troops: Guardian Jetbike Squadron (8#, 224 Pts)
   7 Guardian Jetbike Squadron @ 224 Pts
     (x2); TL Shuriken Catapult (TL-Scat) (x5)
      1 Warlock @ [50] Pts
        Embolden ; Witchblade (WB)

Fast Attack: Vyper Squadron (3#, 225 Pts)
      3 Vyper @ [75] Pts
         Missile Launcher (ML); Shuriken Cannon (SCan)

Fast Attack: Vyper Squadron (3#, 225 Pts)
      3 Vyper @ [75] Pts
         Missile Launcher (ML); Shuriken Cannon (SCan)

Fast Attack: Shining Spears (5#, 237 Pts)
   4 Shining Spears @ 237 Pts
      1 Shining Spears Exarch @ [97] Pts
          Skilled Rider; WithDraw; Star Lance (SL);

Heavy Support: Fire Prism (1#, 160 Pts)
      Holo-Field (Vehicle) (H-F); Spirit Stone (V:SpStn);

Heavy Support: Fire Prism (1#, 160 Pts)
      Holo-Field (Vehicle) (H-F); Spirit Stone (V:SpStn);

Total Roster Cost: 1849


24 JBs
2 Scoring units
9 KP
25 STR6+ weaponry

Lots o Dakka

Offline Sandytrain

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Re: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2009, 12:51:45 AM »
To make this list more competitive you need more truup choices.  I recomend cutting out the vypers because they will not last.
Also take a small squad of jetbike guardians.
Ex: 4 jetbike w/ warlock
Im more for taking a council along with four squads for guardians.  They just wipe infantry out.

A strategy for these guys if you dont have one yet is to come in from reserves on turn two and kill everything in your path.  Then go for your objectives.

Offline madelmo

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Re: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2009, 03:12:55 AM »
i find avengers loaded inside wave serpents teamed up with pathfinders good for vp denial as it's usually pretty hard to take either of them out, especially compared to the more fragile guardians. even jetbikes tend to break easy unless you spend all the extra points to get a warlock. sure, taking wraithguard as a troops choice is super resilient as well but if you want a fast list, they simply don't fit in.

i've had awesome experience with 2 wave serpents filled with avengers and 1 doom farseer. doom upon a target and bladestorm the same turn and you have up to 64 bs4 shots, rerolling to-wound. that could decimate even a MEQ unit. (not to mention whatever armament the wave serpent has) you can then load your avengers back up and move on to your next target. don't forget your spirit stones!

Offline GoofyCommy

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Re: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2009, 04:55:32 PM »
Looks kind of good.  You're going to want to drop the Vypers and use the points for 8 warlocks on bikes.  What's with the odd number of jetbikes?  They should both be 9 + 1 warlock.


Offline Gutstikk

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Re: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2009, 10:29:06 PM »
Background: 1
You've covered this area completely, from the army theme to where it will be used, what you want to do with it and who you'll be fighting. You've also managed to do this with style and in a pretty short amount of space. Well done! This has been one of my favorite lists posted in the first few months of the year. The only hitch is the formatting for me; it looks like army builder and I have a hard time reading it [too much unnecessary info, like abbreviating upgrades immediately after it lists them]. Other than that, a nice read.

Composition: .5
You have a good spread of units across the FOC, but in each section the units selected are very similar. This tends towards an "Achilles heel" that may cause the army to suffer on the table, though the possibility for improved venue standings through theme might be worth the risk. The number of KPs is kept to a minimum, which is rather nice, but the scoring units are low. You may find the game becomes a matter of how well you can keep them alive rather than fighting on your terms in certain missions. Have care in this regard.

Utility: .5
The one thing I think that might serve this list well is perhaps losing one of the jetbikes from the larger squad as it doesn't affect regrouping or casualty LD tests, and investing in a possible third psychic power. Mindwar or Guide would be the obvious choices, though Eldritch Storm could have its uses. The increase in tactical options comes at the cost of a model who's absence the list probably won't feel. Aside from that, the list is pretty optimized for morale, and few unnecessary upgrades. You could improve the list by talking a little more about what you want each unit to accomplish as its primary objective. I have an idea as to how they'll work together, but I'm not certain since you didn't elaborate much.

Flexibility: .5
This is an army of elite shooting units primarily, with limited assault capabilities. As a result it has excellent role redundancy but lacks somewhat in regards to combat and numbers. A bad move will really mess this army up, whereas an enemy with more numbers may have greater room for mistakes. Additionally your mobility gets greatly compromised once you start getting bogged down in combat. With only one unit really capable of taking you out of bad assaults, it will be imperative that you don't get engaged except for on your own terms. It would be interesting to see how you address the secondary roles [combat] of your primarily shooting units [jetbikes], but there's no real discussion of that issue.

Ingenuity: .5
You have a rough and ready battle plan which could serve you well if you stick to the main premise of denial. More depth might make this go smoother in practice. Some of the synergies have been touched upon but not with enough clarity; there's a lot of things this list could do that you might not be aware of. Not much mention of your army's key vulnerability [combat] which is present in most of the units selected. Even if the enemy only assaults one of your units, it could deny you many shooting options. I give you lots of credit for your innovation with the vypers - it is both refreshing and novel. They may be over-equipped if you plan on performing such dangerous tactics with frequency.

Total score: 3
This is a solid list, which if played carefully should have a reasonable chance of success [though I have to add, I really do enjoy it, just for the madness with the vypers].
« Last Edit: May 14, 2009, 10:43:17 AM by Gutstikk »

Offline moc065

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Re: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2009, 06:34:12 AM »
1850 Pts - Eldar Roster - 1850 Saim Hann All Air.

HQ: Autarch (1#, 140 Pts)
   1 Autarch: (Mb); (EJB); (LL); (Fg)

HQ: Farseer (1#, 178 Pts)
   1 Farseer: Doom ;Fortune, (RofWard); (P:SpStn); (EJB); (SSpr)

Troops: Guardian Jetbike Squadron (11#, 300 Pts)
   10 Guardian Jetbike Squadron: (SCan) (x3); 1 Warlock, Embolden

Troops: Guardian Jetbike Squadron (8#, 224 Pts)
   7 Guardian Jetbike Squadron: (SCan) (x2);  1 Warlock, Embolden

Fast Attack: Vyper Squadron (3#, 225 Pts)
      3 Vyper: (EML) & (SCan)

Fast Attack: Vyper Squadron (3#, 225 Pts)
      3 Vyper: (EML) & (SCan)

Fast Attack: Shining Spears (5#, 237 Pts)
   4 Shining Spears: 1 Shining Spears Exarch, Skilled Rider; WithDraw; (SL).

Heavy Support: Fire Prism (1#, 160 Pts)
    1 Fire Prism (H-F) & (V:SpStn);

Heavy Support: Fire Prism (1#, 160 Pts)
    1 Fire Prism (H-F) & (V:SpStn);

Total Roster Cost: 1849

24 JBs
2 Scoring units
9 KP
25 STR6+ weaponry

Hey I see that you took this one out of the design stage and into the Rip stage... I love the way you developed it after our discussions, and I see it as having some turely unique and fun parts as well as being realitively competitive... I will add this to "The Big List of Eldar Lists" so on with the Critique.

I took the liberty to remove individual Point scores from your list (as they are not appreciated) and cleaned up the fomat a little (ofr the ease of reading)... sorry to have altered it in this way; but I do suggest that you do not copy and paste from the Army Builder as to much info is often shown.

Reservered for moc-score

1.. Anti-tank potential Not a lot of dedicated but decent for secondary AT, so its Above-Average 0.7
2.. Anti-MEQ potential Again not a lot of dedicated but it has numbers and some combo's, so its Above-Average 0.7
3.. Anti-Horde potential Dakka is certainly there, as well as some tactical combo's and speed, so its  Good 0.8
4.. Ranged Firepower potential A real nice and saturation fire potential as well, so its Good 0.8
5.. Assault potential Only one fragile unit with limited numbers and timing issues, so its well below Average 0.4
6.. Scoring Units / point level There big enough but 2 will hurt in many cases, so its slightly below Average 0.5
7.. Durability or Resilience Vypers may be soft; but their numbers and the other units will help the overall resilience, so its Average 0.6
8.. Flexability In most cases it will be able to do something, so its Above Average 0.7
9.. Mission Capabiliy Tricky for missions with multiple MO's but its KP denial might offset this, and its fast enough to contest in most cases as well, so overall its Above Average 0.7
10. Dynamics and/or Theme We discussed this one at length, and I think that it really does fit the Saim-Hann theme, and it certianly plays with brutal speed and saturation style, so overall I think its Very Very good 0.9

Rating = 7.0/10  Others will score it differently; but I see this as a list that needs the General to make it more than just a Fun List. And although I do see how it could be used to a potential above the rating I gave it, I also see how certain small errors could have it unravel in milli-seconds.

CaHG
« Last Edit: January 23, 2009, 11:30:04 AM by moc065 »
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Offline Chaplain Swordwind

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Re: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2009, 12:51:24 PM »
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Offline EldradUlthran

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Re: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2009, 08:36:07 PM »
I love the list...very fluffy. and i also just love vypers, yes they do die quickly sometimes, but they can dish out some pretty devestating firepower in a group like yours. Good Luck!
ElDrAd

Offline TheEldarGuy

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Re: 1850 All Air Saim Hann stylin' C&C
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2009, 03:53:53 AM »
I suppose I'd alter the Jetbike lists... You need Troop units to hold objectives and the like. So with VP denial is "Kill all the troops" tactics - I don't think you have enough firepower for that, or "Swarm them with units" and that's usually not the Eldar way (Guard and Nids are good at that).

I suppose I'd probably have a unit of Swoops to replace one of the Vypers. Swoops are very effective against all Vehicles and they will last that extra turn over a squad of Vypers with the same point value.

I love the speed of the list and unless you face an army of Turn 1 Deep Strikers... you ought to do well (What are the odds of that... honestly).

 


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