40K Online
The Armies of 40k => Necrons => Topic started by: the_mighty_brain on July 12, 2002, 02:50:16 AM
-
Now please correct me if I'm wrong....but.
If you had an entire 1,500pts army almost consisiting purely of necron warriors....would you EVER be able to kill them all with a standard tournament designed force?
-
Of course. Simply bring some leman russ tanks or a handful of starcannons, plasmacannons....
I really don't think that necrons are invincible, in fact, they're one of the "weaker" armies in 40k. They never lost a game in the White Dwarf (at least in the german WD) you might say now, but can you think of any army loosing a battle in WD when they first came out ::)
-
They are certainly not the weakest. But they arn't invincible. I've defeated Necrons 3 out of 4 games now.
As for an army that consists entirely of Necron warriors. Never seen it actually.
Consider that he can have about 75 warriors in a 1500 point army I wouldn't consider it unbeatable. They arn't as bad as spacemarines. Ok, so they CAN comeback. But they don't have the "They shall know no fear" rule. Bring a squad to less than 50% and break it and it stays broken...and I believe I have the firepower to take out 40-50 necron warriors.
-
And if you take the phase out rule, lower the army to 25% of its original size, and you automatically win. And not all Necrons can come back and not alwasy will they come back. Power weapons and weapons with AP better than their save destroy their ability to self-repair. So they ain't all that hard to beat.
-
You just have to remember the simple stuff:
Power weapons and double strength weapons will keep them down. The only thing that can stop that is a Resurrection Orb and the Lords can't be EVERYWHERE, now can they?
Played them many times and beat them back every time with IG.
They're like Space Marines on Paper... BUT THEY'RE SLOW! My my.... An army I'd LIKE to Assault with IG!
If you have no vehicles in your army, then you've just taken away 50% of their coolness factor (glance on a six) and since none of the IG have super high toughness, you simply leave them with WBB.
They're so easy to outshoot, it's sad.
Especially with the army list you've suggested.
-
You all seem to totally misunderstand me.
I'm talking about if Necorns were intered in a tournament.
Now think of a tournament army. An army that will be geared to attempt to cover every eventuality and will not be specialised to deal with necrons.
What about that?
And what if you had 2 lords, each leading a squad of 20 necron warriors?
-
I play black templars and I can never outshoot them so i always go charge them with my champion. Maybe you could get your scorpions and banshees to charge them, put them into a wave serpent so they could get into battle faster. Treat them as marines that come back. You have many weapons which are instant kill. Brightlance,star cannon, banshee's power weapons etc.
-
thats an easy one just put a howling banshee exarch down in front of him nock him on his arse then chop him into little bitty peices then let the other girls do there work!
-
yea i think those necrons are a little TOO good - in some games they are invincible, yet in some others they are hopeless...
grim
-
I basically, treat them like SMurfs. They are pretty much SMurfs with the WBB rule instead on transports. Based on that I don't find them all that intimidating.
-
yea i think those necrons are a little TOO good - in some games they are invincible, yet in some others they are hopeless...
grim
Like every army in 40k. In some games my army gets shot to piece before it reached the enemy, and sometimes I get there without a scratch on a Rhino and unload right up on them -- and often times I get both results against the same army. The Necrons look interesting to play, as you must protect your troop ranks with something other than an APC.
-
scarabs are pretty fast and good at holding up units.
How would you guys overcome and army of 2 squads of 20 warriors, each led by a lord with warscythe and resurrection orbs. Another squad of 10 necrons and then 15 bases of scarabs?
-
3 Ravagers w/ 3 Disintegrators each.
Archon w/ Punisher and 5 Incubi.
Wyches w/ Agonizer-wielding Succubus.
The usual, really. :)
Archon Xanath
-
There really isn't much difference between the SMs an Necrons. On one side you have WBB, on the other "TSKNF". The only real difference is higher ld and better gun vs higher initiative..all at a 3 points difference.
Treat Necrons as Chaos marines and you should be fine.
-
A biel-tan force, balanced but slanted towards killing mutated monkeys, can take out a necron army without a real big problem, especially if you take a firepower variant. A couple squads of reapers, some warwalkers and banshees hiding in a serpent.
-
Well dark reepers come to mind since the only thing they get then is the WBB rule. personally i like it when my oppent deep strike things into my back yard. Oh you cant move?? oh thats to bad??? oh whats that u scatered off the table edge oh what was the 225 points down the drain i feel so bad for you? Oh its turn 4 on half your army still hasn't come in oh i feel sooooooo sorry for ya ;D. So go ahead and use deep strikers, give me the advantage for a couple of turns!
-
They may not be able to move when they deep strike, but what do ncrons care they don't want to move, they just open fire. Necrons just like to shoot. You might have the advantage for a couple of turns, and its not very often that someone deep strikes off the table.
-
well, in terms of tournies, i'd say DE armies, tau armies, and eldar armies could handle them with no problems, since all three are pretty shooty.
Tau just have pure firepower and should phase out necrons before they even come close enough to hurt them.
Dark Eldar have speed and one of the deadliest HQ squads out of all the armies.
Eldar have dark reapers. Need I say more? =P If i do, then howling banshees.
For the other armies, i'd say IG shouldn't have a problem. A tank or three will take care of anything.
SM and Chaos should be fine, it would just be like fighting themselves, except their necron counterparts would get back up.
Right now, necrons are slow. When the monolith comes out, that could be a problem, since that will give alot of speed to necrons. In theory anyway.
-
the monolith does give them some speed, but they do have some fast units already, the wraiths, swarms, and both kinds of destroyers. Those seem to have good speed, and the swarms, are just anoying. Get those swarms up there and let them harass them till you get like flayed ones in there or your wraiths. But I do agree on the DE HQ, I hate that thing when Im playing the Eldar, and they arent nice, I'm still yet the pleasure to go against them as the Necrons.
-
yes you could do that
-
Of course. Simply bring some leman russ tanks or a handful of starcannons, plasmacannons....
I really don't think that necrons are invincible, in fact, they're one of the "weaker" armies in 40k. They never lost a game in the White Dwarf (at least in the german WD) you might say now, but can you think of any army loosing a battle in WD when they first came out ::)
Dark Eldar didn't win any battle in WD, not even the one when they came out! That one was actually about table quarters and used the nightfight rules, something where DE are the best at. How outrageous! >:(
-
Any large unit with an intiative higher than 2 with a decent number of attacks will work wonders against the Necrons. True, their guns are powerful, their armor is hard, the "We'll be Back" rule is incredibly powerful, AND they have Leadership 10 to boot, but a large unit of say...Kroot would beat them with a reasonable chance. Providing that they are charging.
It's a gamble, hoping that you'll inflict enough casualties to make the Necrons fail their morale check, and run them off or wipe them out in pursuit.
Suprisingly, it works most of the time.
-
I am just beginning to put a larger Necron force together. You seem to forget that Necrons were designed so that having a unified force to make it stronger. When a Necron player has learnt how to master their force they (apparently. Read WD when the necrons came out) can be come nigh unstopable. The fact the Necron Lord can take Veil Of Darkness, Ressurection Orb. He can start to move whole units from one side of the board to the other. Place a Monolith down out comes a 10 man Immortal squad (20shots Str5 AP4), f#*k. With the units that don't benefit from WBB, use them as the punching bag of the enemy. Say you have 2 Tomb Spiders instead of them hiding at the back of your army use them as spearheads for your force, T6 W2 add a particle projector for free, with 2 damn, they are very anoying to normal troops. Flayed ones, can make a mockery of a SM squad with ease, and their guys don't get back up. Also when using Necron warriors keep them out of reach of Battlecannons and AP3 weapons, power weapons etc. Always take 12+ Size squads, and use cover to attack back. When facing a Close Combat army stay just out of reach and hammer them with Gauss rounds, for Shooty armies, close in as quick as possible, and assualt.
Remember every army has it's weakness and strengths.
-
Agreed! Necron has it's strengths and it's weaknesses, but it all comes down to how you play them. It also depends on who you're playing, if they're a very shooty army like tau per se, then you'll want to get up close to them to chop them up to pieces! This helps especially if you have an army who can deep strike or veil right beside them. Or when you've encounter an assault army, then you'll do something else that'll ensure you have the upper hand and not them! (warscythe at this point seems so much better when it comes to assault)
-
Necrons are just like marines, their stats are the same excluding the iniative.
Necron warriors - 18 pts
Space Marines - 15 pts
For only 3 points more they get a WBB rule! Sometimes We have to watch where we veil. Depending on who you play against sometimes veiling into the opponent is pretty dangerous. Warscythe! That weapon is so powerful against leaders with invulnerable saves.
-
Air: They win the WBB but lose initative and "They shall have no fear".
Which means that they are definitly weaker than regular spacemarines in close combat.
-
Yeah I agree. Whenever I play space marines I have to be stuck with them attacking me first :( But I believe necrons are one of the slowest in the 40k universe
-
You'll definitely need to plan a more balanced army Brain. The Tyranid solution to an 'all warriors' army comes in the form of monstrous creatures. To a tyrant or carnifex, your warriors are essentially marines armed with bolters only. It would take, on average, over 200 shots with gauss flayers to kill a 4 wound, T6 creature with a 2+ armor save. Even the lord only wounds once every 2 assault phases, on average against a Tyrant.
My strategy using my standard 1500 pt army against an all warrior army would be to march my tyrants straight at the large warrior squads and engage them in CC. Once they were engaged I could bring up genestealers to assist and make the battle go more quickly. For the smaller group of warriors, hormagaunts backed by raveners could do the job. My biovores and zoanthropes would have to focus on the scarabs.
Work on more maneuverability with something like a Veil of Darkness or Monolith, and add some heavy hitting power with some heavy destroyers.
-
they are not invincible but they can be VERY hard to beat if they are used right. a lord with staff of light can wipe out a tactical squad with ease and give him a destroyer body to get him there faster and he can be instant killed cause he now has T 6 and with phylactery with the we'll be back he can stand up with 3 wounds again ;D (gotta luv it) and last but not least the resurrection orb. we'll be back no matter not.
-
Slow yes in physical movement terms but when a great deal of your army can deep strike (flayed ones, monoltih, warriors coming out of monolith), and the Veil of Darkness, Phase Shifting, Destroyers (both types). They aint that slow.
-
You all seem to totally misunderstand me.
I'm talking about if Necorns were intered in a tournament.
Now think of a tournament army. An army that will be geared to attempt to cover every eventuality and will not be specialised to deal with necrons.
What about that?
And what if you had 2 lords, each leading a squad of 20 necron warriors?
I have yet to encounter the 'mighty' necrons. But as every commander knows no army is unbeatable. Just have to use advantages and expoit his/her weaknesses.
And we all know that superior firepower always helps no matter who you go against.
-
1000pt games.
Eldar: 30 Banshees in Wave Serpents
Dark Eldar: 2 Lord's 18 Incubi in Raiders
Blood Angels: High Priest and Librarinan and 18 Honour Guard in Rhino's.
Take the main strengths of the 3 best armies in 40K and exploit the main weakness of necrons. Power weapons slaughter necrons; the Lord with res orb, what lord with res orb after turn 2.