40K Online

EldarOnline => Eldar => Topic started by: Starrakatt on April 1, 2008, 11:25:53 AM

Title: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on April 1, 2008, 11:25:53 AM
Welcome to Iyanden


   Hi warriors of Craftworld Iyanden!

   Welcome to our very own POC (Path Of Command).

   This the thread where those (or anyone wanting to contribute, really) of Iyanden calling may post to discuss all thing Iyanden, be it Background (Fluff), Tactica, Army Lists, general advice and/or random questions Iyanden related.

   Mind you all that we aren't in a dictatorship and the PoC will/should be run by concensus between the highest authorities, i.e the Wraithlords, although any advice, comment and opinion from anyone is quite welcome. ;)

   Below is our PoC organisation, command structure and memberlist, which may (and will) be edited in time, as may be the ranking which isn't official yet.

   -For members, if you happens to have joined the Iyanden PoC but your name doesn't appear, please just PM me and I'll get it arranged.
   -For non-members, well, yes! There's lot of place to fill in our underpopulated Craftworld, be sure to check in, take a look and if what you see is at your taste, why not move in?

   You know you wanna to. Do it. DO IT!

   Starky


Command Structure and moving up the ranks:
(From f.desrochers, contributions from BrathaLir, Gwaihir and Starrakatt)

   Drawing on the schemes of the other POCs, I suggest we keep our schema relatively similar to the others. This will promote some legitimacy, even if the actual throughput of some of the members are not as vigorous as the other Craftworlds.

   * Farseer: Were a Moderator be part of the Iyanden PoC, such would be his ranking.

   * Spiritseer (in place of Autarch): As per other POCs, there should just be the one. This person would be the overall coordinator/project lead of all POC: Iyanden efforts.

   * Wraithlord (in place of Exarch): Have dedicated much of their time to the Craftworld, through posts on these boards and real-life games. Contributors of materially significant information, observations and write-ups. Players who have won/placed (proved) in RTT/GTs would qualify (though not a sole qualifier for this rank). There would probably be relatively few of these members, as befits the fluff. Their post-count should be reflective (750+).

   * Bonesinger (in place of Warlock): Contributors who actually step up and produce an article or posts that help materially advance the overall scheme of the projects being conducted (in-depth articles, icons, graphics, webspace, etc). There will be several who receive the notice and attention for their posts that will receive this rank. Their post-count should be reflective (500+).

   * Wraithguard (in place of Aspect Warrior): Normal contributors who participate in the discussions to add their weight to the wisdom collected (fluff, history, play guides, etc) but do not wish or have not the experience to produce significant articles. Their post-count should be reflective (200+).

   * Guardian: Those who have just started with the Craftworld and contribute their experiences and try to advance Iyanden's cause in their own way. Their post-count should be reflective (100+).

   * Civilian: Those that have vowed allegiance to Iyanden but still doesn't have the post count to get titled yet. Not a Custom Title as such but a way to list those in way of becoming full fledged Guardians or more (up to 100 posts).

Ranking within the Iyanden PoC:
(In alphabetical order)

 - Farseer: Vacant

 - Spiritseer: Starrakatt (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=32792)

 - Wraithlord: f.desrochers, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=568) Gwaihir (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=17163)

 - Bonesinger: BrathaLir,  (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=16128)Eothen, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=18241) Sapphon, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=19814) Valar, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=30996) Irandrura (Honorary:Former Spiritseer) (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=17103)

 - Wraithguard: Aislinn, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=40247) bebe, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=25727) BloatedToad, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=398) Brierton, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=27537)  Broono, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=13008) BudgieGuard, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=35584) kyle vp (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=34081), Lord_Drazhar, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=8561)
Mellchia, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=34361) Two Hawks, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=29608) Wraithlord Saunders, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=4738)

 - Guardian: BubbaMack, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=41647) cabie22, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=21029) Fir Dinillainn, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=43919) haunt, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=42293) mfostkd, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=19946) Sludge_City, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=44142) The-One-Tree, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=16570) 

 - Civilian:  Blue Corporaptor (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=38414), Candriel, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=43367) echo34, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=35871) Fireforce5, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=10835) Havoq, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=42328) Kubrick54, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=30736) madelmo, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=42031) Mon_Keigh, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=23920) PanzarDragon, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=42141) Roizo, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=36760) Simmoski, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=44056)  Spiritwarroir, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=41803) Wingzero,  (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=40610)Wraith, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=36723)  Zorb, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=profile;u=31830)


   Also, you may access the original Iyanden PoC thread by clicking Here (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=131614.0) and the transitory one Here. (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=157595.0)


   The general informations on the Eldar Path of Command can be found Here (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=114956.0), where you will find generic Avatars and banners for the Iyanden PoC, based or not on rankings, just check it out.

   Also, it is possible for the PoC members to show off with a pair of custom banners from Eothen (like the one in my sig):
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c30/Viatorian735/Eldar/Iyandenbanner3-1.jpg (http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c30/Viatorian735/Eldar/Iyandenbanner3-1.jpg)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi24.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc30%2FViatorian735%2FEldar%2FIyandenbanner3-1.jpg&hash=92fddf2ba5379cc066cd7e6eab15bebe01b752fb)
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c30/Viatorian735/Eldar/Iyandenbanner2.jpg (http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c30/Viatorian735/Eldar/Iyandenbanner2.jpg)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi24.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc30%2FViatorian735%2FEldar%2FIyandenbanner2.jpg&hash=36cc6a43f2a73df776bc5e297cf25ec1167092fd)
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/IyandenBannerStarky3-1-1.png (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/IyandenBannerStarky3-1-1.png)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2FIyandenBannerStarky3-1-1.png&hash=e4f96e32cacbe67a3a8b1579674d639ef3a5174b)
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/40KOnline/img44c051a90e91app5.gif (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/40KOnline/img44c051a90e91app5.gif)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2Fimg44c051a90e91app5.gif&hash=25e85e304136563a7733d767ff40849853657a1a)
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/40KOnline/A1548PGE.jpg (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/40KOnline/A1548PGE.jpg)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2FA1548PGE.jpg&hash=3b9d0d2eaaaf2110836201b8be3a10e08efad8df)
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/40KOnline/Iyanden.jpg (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/40KOnline/Iyanden.jpg)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2FIyanden.jpg&hash=a5c7691a210b33bccbc725912ea2afa330e3f94c)
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/40KOnline/iyanden1.jpg (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/40KOnline/iyanden1.jpg)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2Fiyanden1.jpg&hash=0d69f56bfdb01817d9b76e9577cccaff3751dc21)


Edit: Alaitoc dissaproves of your eye burning choice of yellow, I have changed it to a friendlier blue... and hope that those with the black theme can still see it... - oink
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Host of the Dead
Post by: Starrakatt on April 1, 2008, 11:26:15 AM
The Iyanden Great Library

   This is the Great Iyanden Library, rows and rows of mnemonic psycho crystals and time immune scrolls of ancient lore. Here you shall know the joys of uncovering veiled secrets, mysteries unknown or long forgotten as well as ancient legends and history.
   Also easily accessible by simple psychic linking are to be accessed depictions of great armies, strategic history and epic tales of battles, great and small ones, be they righteous victories or lamentations of defeat.
   Access knowledge and sharpen your mind as keen as a blade for knowledge is the first step on the Path to victory.

The Legendary Iyanden
Fluff, Histories, Legends and Discussions (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1919039#msg1919039)

Tales of Heroic Iyanden Battles
A Compilation of All Iyanden Related 40konline Battle Reports (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1919354#msg1919354)

The Iyanden Autarch's Guide to War
A Collection of Tactics Articles for the Iyanden Commander (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1920187#msg1920187)

Selecting a Victorious Wraith Host
A Compilation of Successful Iyanden Lists (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1920188#msg1920188)

Converting, Painting and Showing off your Ghost armies
The Convertion, Painting tips and Picture Section (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1920762#msg1920762)

Gutstikk's PoC Campaign: The Walk of the Dead
The Iyanden side of the Campaign (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=152157.0)
Gutstikk's Extended Campaign (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?board=107.0)

Links to Various Tactica & Army List Threads (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1930923#msg1930923)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Host of the Dead
Post by: Starrakatt on April 1, 2008, 11:26:24 AM
Legends of Iyanden
Fluff, Histories and Discussions


An introduction to Iyanden

    Your footsteps echo as you pass along the crystalline bridge. It sparkles in the starlight, reflected radiance gently twinkling in the cavernous chamber. Not a sound mars the still beauty of the moment, until the serenity is broken by another step. The wind created by your passage swirls in your wake, mingling with the flow of air from the craftworld’s recirculation systems. Once you leave here, the momentary discordance will fade away and the hall will be empty once more. The craftworld will live still, but for whom?
    You shake off these despondent thoughts as you reach the end of this stage of the journey, and enter the Dome of Crystal Seers itself. Here, ancient and sacred trees send probing fronds above, biological memory telling them to reach for a sky that does not exist in space. Through the branches, you see the motionless silhouette of a farseer. He will not move – he has not for centuries, his body slowly transmuted to stone over a lifetime of drawing upon fell energies.
    Leaving him in respectful peace, you continue through to the inner chambers, slowly, careful to avoid treading on the spirit stones set in the Dome’s floor. There are too many now, each one representing the departed soul of a brave eldar of Iyanden. It is for them that you and every other survivor must continue to survive, for the galaxy cannot afford to lose a place of such sublime transcendence as the craftworld.
    The others are already present, each bearing a translucent waystone. They glow with an inner radiance, and flicker in recognition as you raise the stone in your own hands. No words need to be said, each eldar’s imperceptible psychic aura in tune with your own, telling you all that you need to know. In perfect synchronicity, each eldar in the circle lowers their waystone into the circuit node, communing with the beloved ancestors.
    In but a moment, it is done, and you raise your head, leaving the cool tranquillity of the Infinity Circuit and tearing yourself back to reality. However painful it may be for you, though, you know that it is a thousand times worse for the warrior whose soul you have just conjured back from beyond. You offer a short prayer that this were not necessary and join the procession of seers leaving the chamber.
    You know your wraith well. Over centuries of service, you have come to recognise its wraithbone form, its subtle imperfections, its strengths, patterns, and you can even feel the residual memories of those who have overseen it before. Reverently, you place the waystone within its armoured shell.
    As it comes to life, blind eyes focusing anew, you feel a momentary twinge of pity for those poor fools who must stand in its way.

                                                     
From Irandrura, excerpt from the first PoC


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Host of the Dead
Post by: Gwaihir on April 2, 2008, 09:41:30 AM
Tales of Heroic Iyanden Battles
A Compilation of All Iyanden Related 40konline Battle Reports

The following is a collection of links and descriptions of battles fought by the powerful wraith hosts of Iyanden and other craftworlds.  When new batreps are written, the link is added to the top of the list.  Please PM me with a link to any Iyanden related batreps not included in this list and I will try to add them in quickly.  Please remember that some of these reports are very old and should not be posted in.  Check the date before responding to any of these batreps.

Starky has added a 5th edition batrep--the first full 5th batrep to be added to the list!
Wingzero has contributed a psuedo 5th edition batrep.


Commisar Hall, Gwaihir, Sapphon, small_furry_spider, Starrakatt and Suithapp have contributed 4th Edition batreps. 


And now for something a little more old school--3rd edition batreps from Biel-Tan, Culeagh/Halberd-Blue, f.desrochers, Gwaihir, Hybrid-9, Killersquid and Korakae.


Special thanks to Starrakatt for compiling the original list![/list]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Host of the Dead
Post by: Gwaihir on April 3, 2008, 12:06:28 PM
The Iyanden Autarch's Guide to War
A Collection of Tactics Articles for the Iyanden Commander

Below are links to threads and in some cases to posts within threads which contain good tactical advince related to Iyanden armies.  The Iyanden in 4th edition links are only accessible to 40konline members with 100+ posts--Sorry.  Hopefully when Iyanden POC members have their threads edited and completed, they will transfer the content into a thread in the Eldar tactics board so that newer members can link to the tactics.

Now for the start of the list:

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Host of the Dead
Post by: Gwaihir on April 3, 2008, 12:08:38 PM
Selecting a Victorious Wraith Host
A Compilation of Successful Iyanden Lists

This post is under construction and is to include links to army lists that Iyanden POC members have agreed are solid builds.  Eventually there should be several lists from the ranges of 1000 to 2000 points for those who want a starting point for their Iyanden lists. 

If you want your list added please ensure that it is in final form and that you have used it successfully more than once or twice against more than one or two opponents.  I will add lists that I think are good or that are recommended by a Iyanden POC wraithlord, or the spiritseer.  Also, lists most likely won't be added if they are substantially similar to a list from that point level which is already posted.

There is a link to each list.  If the list has been rated for the Big List of Eldar lists there is a link to the rating and the scores given by Gutstikk, Moc and Chaplain Swordwind are shown.  A "No" under the "Rated?" column indicates that the list hasn't been rated.  Lists that haven't been rated are still solid lists.

1000 Point Lists:
To be added

1250 Point Lists:
To be added

1500 Point Lists:
To be added

1700 Point Lists:
Link & Author**********Rated?******GS x/5******MS x/10******CSS x/10***
List by (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=123856.msg1713181#msg1713181) f.desrochers.
Yes.

1750 Point Lists:
To be added

1850 Point Lists:
Link & Author**********Rated?******GS x/5******MS x/10******CSS x/10***
List by (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=861&topic=141309.0) Starrakatt.
Yes (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159588.0).
4/5
8/10
?/10
List by (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159316.0) Gwaihir.
Yes (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159588.0).
4.5/5
8.2/10
6.5/10
 

2000 Point Lists:
Link & Author**********Rated?******GS x/5******MS x/10******CSS x/10***
List by (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159316.msg1916412#msg1916412) Gwaihir.
Yes (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159588.msg1918065#msg1918065).
5/5
8.2/10
?/10.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Host of the Dead
Post by: Starrakatt on April 4, 2008, 09:36:10 AM
Converting, Painting and Showing Off your Ghost armies
The Convertion, Painting tips and Pictures Section
(Due credits to all works linked in here: Thank you all!)

   This post is always under reconstruction and regularly updated: It is to include new links on how to convert and/or paint your ghost armies. We'd like for members (or anyone else for that matter) to share their experience in modelling and painting or point us out to articles and guides so that we can add the link(s) to the Great Library.

The Painting Guide and Tips Compilation

Valar's Traditonal Iyanden Painting Guide:

The Convertion Compilation

Wraithlords:

Wraithguard:

Various Others:
The Picture Compilation

[/list]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on April 18, 2008, 09:36:15 AM
Links to Various Tactica & Army List Threads
Some may not be accessible for members under 100 posts

- Ghost Armies Tactica, by haunt (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=175630.0)
   Full Wraith Lists Tactica and 'How To'.
- For Those Starting out with Eldar, by moc065 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=157393.0)
   Analysis off every units in the eldar repertoire along with tacticas and army lists, a must read to help with unit selection.
- The Wall of Wraithbone, by Starrakatt (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=157393.msg2064039#msg2064039)
   Some Tacticas for using Wraithguard.
- Building Competitive Lists in Fifth Edition, by Gutstikk (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=168591.0)
   The Title say it all. There are also some sompetitive lists in there that are worth to be seen.
- Unconventional Tactics Articles, compiled by Gutstikk (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=145298.0)
   New points of view on how to use units, rarely used tactics, and more!
- Support Weapons in Wraith lists discussion (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=184146.0)
- Wraithguard Economics (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=183478.msg2257628#msg2257628)

Temporary Batrep Center

- Starrakatt's Campaign VS diverse opponents... (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=169308.0)
- haunt's Ghost army VS T'au - 2500 pts (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=176963.0;topicseen)
- Starrakatt's Tourney Report VS BA, IG & SM (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=176593.0;topicseen)
- Valar's First Batrep, VS Chaos Space Marines! (Sword of Heidar Part 1 - 2000 pts) (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=185110.0)
- Valar's Sword of Heidal batrep VS Chaos (Part 2 - 2000 pts) (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=185771.0)

- A hell of a lot of Lists! (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=175779.0) as compiled by Starky
- How to deal with Mcs (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=178774.0)

   Hi all, although there hasn't been much input from the PoC members so far I have confidence in you all people. ;)

   I'd like to thanks Gwaihir for the great work he's done so far and for all the contributor of the Articles, Pics, Treatises, Army Lists and others that have made their way to the Iyanden Great Library (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1919038#msg1919038).

   Now, I think it would be cool if we Iyanden could post pics of our Iyanden armies in the thread (painted or not) if you have the capacity.

   There are my Silver Ghosts at around a rough 2000 Pts, and these models are the ones that make their ways the most on the tabletop. (Right-click/show image to enlarge).
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2FSilverGhostsPics022.jpg&hash=28833a41076184a1f4e92d4831b73013ca7c9122)

   The Wraith Host:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2FSilverGhostsPics024a.jpg&hash=a0c3d783b02b511c8918befaab78d47877bece84)

The Living:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2FSilverGhostsPics026.jpg&hash=61f0cca0afd8190678ca4612c459b40a1edaa67d)

   Some units I throw in from time to time:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2FSilverGhostsPics029.jpg&hash=8a96c6e1bce95fdb5c83bdb776114bc169a7d1f5)

   Hmmm, I took the pics in the evening and that show. I'll try to come back soon with new ones with better lightning. :D

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Mellchia on April 18, 2008, 12:21:12 PM
I didn't realize we were allowed to post to this thread...

Looks good!

I think in the past I said I was going to provide a counterview to f.des' lists. I'll try to get on that on some point.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on April 18, 2008, 10:24:47 PM
   Hi Mellchia, and of course you are allowed!

   There may have been some confusion at the startup of the New PoC but that was only to get some kind of 'Front Page' in order before it became open to all.

   This thread stand here for members of the Iyanden PoC to ask questions related to our Craftworld, post Army Lists, Treatises of any sort, Fluff and/or just plain comments and opinions on something that the PoC may/could have an interest in.
   Or post pics of their own Iyanden forces just like I did. Or Art if you are good at drawing, really anything you feel may be a good contribution to our cause. ;)

   And we surely hope that more people will come in and make some contribution in any way they can to keep the thread 'alive'.

   Starky

EDIT: The Chronicle of Vaul editorial is now up and running at the Front Page (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1919036#msg1919036) and will be kept updated regularly (I hope) with news, events, new stuff making it's way on the PoC and welcome of new members/older ones but first posters in the Thread.

   Check it out! ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on April 19, 2008, 01:41:09 PM
I'll add some pictures of my army.  I am a ridiculously slow painter, so many things still have some work to be done.  This isn't my whole Eldar force, but is a bit more than what I field in my Iyanden type lists.

Here is a picture of the army as a whole (and a titan in the background on the upper left corner ;)):
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2FCAM_0722.jpg&hash=b7b10425388e624316a0a37a5786b679b0009da2)

A closer look at the left side:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2FCAM_0728.jpg&hash=99a9c8313db1d3f5b2ce982553d8bef600ba88d8)

I'm changing my Falcons.  The one on the left is on its way; the one on the right is the scheme I started with.  The one on the right has my waveserpent turret on top.  I made it out of a pencil sharpener.  The big jewel needs work as does the turret and the underside.  I just made a dragon's breath flamer for my Fire Dragon Exarch out of a brightlance.  I got the black wraithguard in a trade, and am in the process of repainting them.

A closer look at the right:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2FCAM_0730.jpg&hash=a372d7ecdf15a41305f075b441a54b34e5684d2c)

My two main wraithguard squads:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2FCAM_07262.jpg&hash=74686aca414e20dfe1c22ccd51dee1cad178541b)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2FCAM_0726.jpg&hash=4364a44aad25089fa2266747153f7bf469e65db3)

The white squad is a work in progress.  Like I said, I am really slow.  The green wraithguard with the gold loincloth is more or less what the rest of the squad will look like when done.

Here are some of the Avatar; probably my best work:

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2FCAM_07272.jpg&hash=e28d2cb14345bb59d2312e62d295b87eaff91caa)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2FCAM_0727.jpg&hash=f69d0b85aff8c7abe34a9d880cb07b37043fb10e)

The walker in the front is more or less done, though I still have to do the gems.  The wraithlord is also pretty much done, though at some point I'll paint up some of his gems also.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on April 25, 2008, 12:54:02 PM
gotta say, some of the paint jobs on the models above look super sic ie that avatar looks like he actually is hot to the touch.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on April 25, 2008, 02:02:09 PM
Hey Gwaihir, aside form the Primer parts... I like your army and think that your paint scheme is very Iyanden.. Bold and up front because you can,.... Nothing can take enemy fire/charge like a unit of 10 WG with concealing Warlocka nd Fortune.... unless there are two said units.

Ouch talk about resilient.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on May 4, 2008, 11:03:28 AM
   @Gwaihir: I understand what you mean with being slow on painting: With the kids an family, along with the fact that I can spend hours on few basic models before being satisfied mean that it take me forever to paint mine (That's why I decided to commission my Eldar).
   Hopefully, when we'll have moved I'll have space and more time to paint myself.
   The Avatar is indeed quite impressive, I like it. I agree with you that the new color pattern with the golden loincloth is better than the first squad. Did you consider that just painting the Wraithcannon on these and maybe some gems would make them better, since you don't seem too fond of the color pattern right now.
   Just a thought. ;)

@moc065: Yeah, they are so formidably resilient. I'm just back from a local Double Team Tourney at 1K each (Allied with: GK, T'au and Necron) and there's what happened to the Wraithguard in three matches:

1 st: With T'au VS the new Daemons/DE: The WG were caught by a second turn charge by a bike Archon and slaughtered to the Spiritseer (who got downed by a Darklance shot at the end) on the course of 5 CC turn before killing the bastard, that hurt! They had only one full Wraithcannon volley before that and that was on a Bloodthirster that just deepstriked near them: The beast saved all the 6 shots/wounds except one but it was finished by the T'au: Game won by Objective/VPs.

2nd: With Necrons VS double Mech Eldar: The Wraithguard were pounded from beginning to end by the mobile, shooty Eldar and reduced to 4 models at the end (excluding Spiritseer who got Mindwared, despite RoW): Game won by objectives.

3nd: With GK VS BT/Asscan Spam SMurfs: The Wraithguard were Asscanned from 2nd turn on by 4 Tornados and some random stuff along the game, finishing the match with 4 model left (including Spiritseer): Game won by Vps.

   I'll write a full account the tourney in the Batrep thread soon and come back to link it.

   I'd also want to welcome our latest member and link the thread on his own fledging fluff thread: BudgieGuard Thread (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=161525.0).

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Aislinn on May 7, 2008, 04:41:07 PM
I think that I'm starting to like Iyanden more than Alaitoc.  It's too over populated, and I think that once I get some wraithguard and am actually able to use my Farseers/Spiritseers, I'll appreciate Iyanden all the more.  Besides, as Yriel said, "The dead must join our ranks, lest we be forced to join theirs."
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on May 13, 2008, 09:13:27 AM
   Well Aislinn, here's your official welcome in the PoC thread.

   You've been quite active since you're here, so congrats on your new Guardian Title. ;) Continue like that and you'll reach the ranks of the Wraithguard soon enough.

   If you feel so inclined, you can add an Iyanden banner to your sig (check first page, that's free advertising!), also since you have reached the 100 post limit you now have acces to the Eldar Project (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?board=72.0) forums, where you may want to take a look.

   As for me people, sorry if I am not more active these time but real life interferences are keeping me busy elsewhere but be assured that I'll try to get some action in the thread as soon as I am finished outside (let's say that it involve moving soon and having my very own custom gaming room  ;D).

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Sanctjud on May 13, 2008, 09:49:33 AM
Wooooo a custom gaming room.... a labor of love.... too bad i live so far away... the only time I visit Canada would be Calgary, Alberta...even then the GW store there is quite far... and the airlines really don't like my metal models...

Ninja-back-flip out of the forum...  ;D

My 7 Cents.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 14, 2008, 11:16:07 AM
Well, I thought I would share yesterday's battle experience.  I hadn't lost with my wraith army since I stopped using three wraithlords about a year ago. I've played around 25 games in that span with about a 3:1 win:draw ratio.  I was using 2 wraithlords in the game I lost, I'll blame the loss on them. ;  Well not really, I'll get to that in a bit.

But first, the good news...well sort of.  I got a draw against a nidzilla army as well.  My [url-http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159316.0]list[/url] was one some of you have seen before and is in the list of lists a few posts back.  Basically it was Fa'alorath, Autarch, 2x Wraithguard squads, Dragons in Falcon, Harlies, Vyper, Walkers.

His list was 3 Sniper Fexes (venom cannon, barbed strangles, 2+sv), 3 Dakka Fexes (2x Twin linked devourers), Flyrant (2x Twin linked devourers), 2 6 man genestealer squads, 2 raveners, and a 10 man warrior squad with various guns.

The mission was one where you only start with the compulsory troops on the board and deploy in corners.  Despite my reserves coming in on 2s on the second turn (+1 to reserve roll for autarch, +1 for mission) I didn't get Eldrad or the Autarch until turn 4 so couldn't fortune the guard until turn 5. >:(

He mostly kept the big bugs in a tight group slowly advancing.  The stealers and raveners came at my force.  The stealers and one ravener got shot up.  One ravener assaulted the guard and kill 3 or 4 before dying.  That guard squad lost several more to shooting and was down to two or three members at the end of the game.  I also lost the vyper and a walker to some shooting.  The rest of my force was intact.  He lost both stealer squads, both raveners and a Dakkafex.  I was one wound short of dropping the warriors below half and didn't put enough wounds on any of the other big bugs to get points for them.  I was about 120 or so points ahead, but not quite enough for a victory.

I had a great mindwar which dropped 4 wounds from the fex that I killed.

This was a tricky fight because if I advanced on the big block of fexes, they and the nearby warriors and flyrant would tear my guard apart in cc.  If I worked the range just right, I maybe could kill one with a volley of wraithcannons, but the rest of the guard would be likely lost. 

I probably should have just hid the vyper and walkers since they didn't have real good targets to shoot at when I left them exposed.  That would have saved enough points to win, but would have been rather boring.

Things weren't much better for my opponent because nothing in the list could really do serious damage to the blocks of guard at range becuase there was no AP3 shooting.  He couldn't really force me to come to him, couldn't do much to me at range, and couldn't get the cc specialists engaged without having them shot up on the way in.

I am really thining about fireprisms.  They would give a much needed boost to my effectivenss at range.  I think they would fit nicely in place of the Falcon and Dragons.

I'll add a desciption of the other battle in a bit.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 14, 2008, 12:36:48 PM
So, like I said, I suffered my first loss in about a year with my wraith army.  My opponent is one of if not the best players in my area and usually wins the rogue trader missions in which he participates.  I think he said he is undefeated with his army.

I am a point with my wraith army though where I am seriously destroying most armies I face.  I have had a number of recent games where I destroy the entire enemy force down to the last model, don't lose any VPs and only lose a few models.  Opponents who don't know how to handle the list have a terrible time against it.  I want to play the better players and see how it does against them, but they tend to not hang around for the tuesday night pickup games, so I am trying to issue challenges.

Back to my opponent.  He was using an ork army.  It was more or less:

My list (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159316.msg1916412#msg1916412) is in the list of lists above and had:  2 farseers with fortune, 2 wraithguard squads, 2 wraithlords, 2 warwalkers, 2 vypers, 4 shining spears, 3 jetbikes, 8 harliquins.  If you follow the link to the list you'll notice my comments in the beginning that I deliberately avoided the "over-powered" stuff like Eldrad and Falcons.  I was setting myself up for quite a challenge facing one of the best players in the area with what I didn't see as being my best list.

In both lists above I didn't add obivous things like powerclaws for the orks or fortune for the farseers, but there were in there.

Anyway on to the battle.

I was hoping that I could sort set things up so I would only have to deal with part of his force at a time, destroy it then hit the next thing.  I made a mistake deploying I think, but I am not quite sure how I could have fixed it.  The problem though was that my units were often in my way and I had difficulty setting things up as desired as I prepared to meet his charge.  My two guard squads were more or less in the middle of the board.  A wraithlord with the bikes were out of sight on my right flank and everything else was bunched up out of sight on the left flank.  His shoota boys, the looted vehicle and the grots were more or less opposite the lord and bikes on the right flank.  The battle wagon, trukk and a squad of boyz were in the middle.  The jump troops, a squad of boyz and the Mech were on the left.

I won deployment and chose to go first in order to get fortune going so that the looted vehicle wouldn't have too easy a time killing off the guard who were in its line of sight.  Even so I failed most of the fortune rerolls that turn and lost 3 or so guard.  My main plan was to focus on a couple squads, soften them up and hope I could get them to run, then work on the next squads.  I didn't have that much to shoot with though and didn't want to expose other things to enemy fire so I didn't get too many kills.  The spears exarch used the jetbike slide to fire off the cannon and kill a few orks though.  There were some other scattered kills, but obviously with orks a few kills don't matter.

The main issue with this turn was attempting to position my forces to receive a charge and effectively counter.  I was worried about snickrot coming in and killing off my spears or harlies and removing my counter charge ability so I spent the first few rounds trying to set up a box which would protect my spears and harlies.

He basically advanced on his turns killing a few guard and immbilizing the walker.  The first two turns were about positioning.  Things got interesting in the third turn when snikrot came in.  By that time, I had managed to kill enough boyz to pay for the shuriken cannon on the spear exarch.  (Just had to throw that in there cause I like it.)  More importantly the battle wagon was immobilized by a guard volley.  I should also mention that I made a mistake with how I moved my bikes and it cost me the shuriken cannon. :P  My opponent is too good for me to make mistakes like that and not have it cost me.  Had that not happened I may have had a chance later in the game to kill off the looted vehicle.

Setting up for the charge was the key though. I pushed a guard squad against the board edge and bracketed it with vypers.  On the left the wraithlord and a walker completed the screen there.  Snickrot had no way to hit more forces effectively on that side.  On the right only the vyper impeded his movement, but he had to enter difficult terrain an move something like 14" total to get around the vyper to the guard.  Just engaging the vyper would be useless because it would die or not and leave them exposed to a full wraithcannon volley and a followup charge by the guard if necessary as well as fire from the wraithlord and bikes on the right.

So my rear was fairly effectively covered.  From the front I faced a likely charge from a large squad of boys with the bike boss attached.  (I should mention that the mission gave double points for killing off a certain squad.  This is the squad I would get the double points for.  My harlies were the squad he would get double points for.)  A wraithguard squad would take that charge.  He could possibly engage the harlies with the charge as well, but would only contact a couple while most of the harlie squad would get its swings.  They would probably kill enough so the boyz wouldn't get any return attacks.  The other boys squad on that side was bogged down in cover and the flying boys didn't move far enough forward for a charge.  The boys in the center were also slowed by cover and wouldn't be a factor on the third turn.

I had managed to make a box with my troops setting it up so the guard would be charged and the harlies and spears could counter.

In his turn 3 he brought in Snickrott on the right of the box hoping to get around the vyper.  He made a mistake in the shooting phase targeting the rear wraithguard squad with the ordinance and killing one.  I pulled the one closest to the vyper making the distance he needed to cover to engage the guard even greater.  He used his waaagh this turn and was able to assault both guard squads, the one in the rear with Snickrott and the one in the front with the hunted squad and boss.  The boyz were in the boss's way though so he didn't get to attack.  The boss and nob managed to kill off 4 or 5 of the guard in the front squad and I lost one guard in the back squad.  A few orks died.

At this point it is the start of turn 4.  I have the flying boyz approaching from the left.  They likely will be able to assault the next turn.  The shoota boys are advancing on the right and the lord and bikes are slowly whittling them down.  The center boys are advancing slowly through cover.  I only really have to worry about getting out of combat and preparing for the flying boys.

If I do things right, I can use my hit and run moves to move quickly to the right with much of the force leaving the flying boys out of range of the bulk of my force.  I also have a delay planned for them as well.  Unfortunatley, I don't do things right and lose the game for myself on this turn.

Snickrott isn't too scarry and the guard squad there can handle them in one or two rounds.  The boss and the orks attacking my front guard worry me.  I also don't want to be stuck there too long because it will make it easier for the other orks to get involved.  I set up a charge with the harlies on from the left and the spears from the right.  The harlies are positioned to limit the kill zone a bit so I don't face any or at least very few return attacks. 

Meanwhile my remaining walker (the other had been killed earlier) advances on the flying boys.  The powerclaw is far enough away from the closest model so that I don't have to worry about return attacks if I charge.  Yes, I am charging with the walker, and I'll pat myself on the back for that very good decision.  This will buy at least one more round of time to not worry about the flying boyz.

There isn't much shooting to discuss.  A few more boys die.  On the right side the shoota boys are close enough to the lord for him to flame them.  A poor difficult terrain check messes up that plan though and I only get two under the flamer.  The claw is the closest model so if I charge and get 3 kills, then it will die and the rest of the squad will be helpless.  That whole thing just didn't go well and I ended up getting charged and losing the lord in one round.

Back to the center, I charge the harlies and spears at the same squad.  The harlies kill around 12.  I only wasted 1 or 2 wounds.  The spear exarch killed a couple which then prevented my other spears from getting their attacks.  This allowed a claw to kill my last wraithguard in the squad.  The boss tries to squish the farseer, but fortune protects.  The squad is down to spiritseer with the farseer attached.

I won the combat handily and the boss and boys both break.  The boss had separated prior to the charge.  The boss gets away and the boys are killed.  Here is the problem.  My spears are now in the open, in charge range of the boys that had been advancing up the middle.  My harlies don't have to worry about a charge thanks to the walker holding up the flying boys, but the spears are hung out to dry with only a 3" consolidation and no hit and run.

I should have sent the spears into the snikrott cc.  I was worried that I wouldn't finish the boys and boss with the harlie charge, but that didn't really matter.  If I just charged with the harlies two things could have happened.  Either I could have won and made the boys and boss break or I could have won and hit and run away from the cc.  Either way, the boss and boys are running or stuck with a small squad that is probably going to die anyway and is too small to be effective anymore.  Also the spears wouldn't have been left exposed in the center of the board.  If the boss and boys are stuck in the cc and kill off the rest of the squad they are left in the open to be gunned down.  There really was nothing to gain by having the spears charge there.

In his turn he killed the spears with a charge.  I finally win the combat with snickrot making his squad run and killing them with the sweep.  The running boss was too close to the spears so he had to flee again.  The flying boys kill the walker which explodes killing 11 boys (5 or 6 in the flying squad and 5 or 6 in an adjacent squad). ;D  Mission accomplished there.

The harlies charge the squad that killed of the spears and make them run away.  They are below half and can't regroup.  My vyper speeds forward to usher the boss off the board.  Other stuff happens.

The boss comes up less than an inch from the board edge and the vyper is shot down.  In the last two rounds I get charged by the flyers and boys from the left.  One farseer gets instasquished on the last roll of the game.  The hariles get shot up and eventually are all killed.  They are sort of surrounded by orks and have no place to go.

In the end I have one bike and a spiritseer from a wraithguard squad left for around 230 points.  He has about 900 points left--battle wagon, grots, looted vehicle, flyers below half, mech, boss, shoot boys below half, regular boys at full strength.  I probably could have kept the harlies alive if I had pulled the troupe master instead of the shadow seer.  Since he got double points for that squad keeping the last model alive would have netted about a 300 point swing in vps putting me within about 400.  Still a loss, but a bit closer.

If I had done the right thing with the spears, I think I would have been able to sweep my force to the right keeping the flying squad and boys on the left out of most of the battle.  The harlies could have engaged the center boys, then my whole force could have moved toward the shoota boys and likely killed them off as well.  The flyers may have caught up eventually by I had a lord to leave behind to slow them down.  The other boys on the left never would have gotten involved.  If I hadn't lost the shuriken cannon bike, I likely could have run up and killed the looted vehicle with it once the shoota boys had advanced enough.  There was some cover to boost to and hide behind before hopping out to shoot the vehicle.  I think I could have kept both guard squads alive, one below half, the harlies alive, the bikes alive, the spears alives, and the farseers alive, losing the lords, walkers and vypers.  I probably could have killed all but the flyers, large boys squad, battle wagon, grots and looted vehicle and think I would have managed a win.

Oh yeah, one round of horrible shooting by the wraithlord deprived me of a chance to force a leadership check on the flyers at Ld7.  Thanks to some earlier softening fire and the exploding walker they were down to 5-7 (don't quite remember).  The lord fired scatter laser and plasma at them, but failed to record any kills.  They ended up charging and killing him instead.  Making them break may have made enough of a difference to pull out a draw.

Anyway, though I didn't win, it was a good game and I was glad for the challenge.  I think I could have one had I played it better.  Oh well, maybe next time.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 14, 2008, 02:10:21 PM
Wow, sounds like a seriously good game. I am not surprised at the speed and punch of the Orks though, as I have found that Eldar need to kill them before they charge... almost in every instance.

Spears are great; but as you said, your assault was ill placed and left them stranded...

Anyway, I wish you had some Pics as it always makes the BetRep better; but this was a very good BatRep and I too am horrible for actually pausing to get a picture of stuff.

Better luck on your next game, and I would love to hear how a re-match goes, as I think you could take his list.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 14, 2008, 07:16:13 PM
AAAAAAGGGGGGGHHHHHH H.  I typed out a long post and deleted it on accident.  Moc, I made some diagrams to help explain things a bit.  I'll add those and comment later.  I have to get the kids ready for bed now, so it'll have to wait.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 14, 2008, 07:18:41 PM
Wow you must be close to my Time zone, as I just got my 3 youngest off to bed... at 8pm.. Go do the Dad stuff, as its certainly more important than this stuff.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 14, 2008, 08:44:37 PM
Sounds like you are an hour ahead of me.  I shoot for and just got them all in bad at a little after 8:00 my time.

So 40k then.

Quote
Wow, sounds like a seriously good game. I am not surprised at the speed and punch of the Orks though, as I have found that Eldar need to kill them before they charge... almost in every instance

I think the guard can handle the charge though they will be cripled by it.  If it sets your army up for a more advantageous position, it can be worth it.  I think in this game, things were set up for me to win if I had done things right on the 4th turn.  One ork squad had advanced beyond the rest and could have been used to catapult most of my force away from the core of his force.  I could have taken on one squad at a time, the the two squads I was set to work on had been taking fire the first three rounds so were already getting smaller.

In the following diagrams the orks are green (even though my opponents orks are purple) and the Eldar are yellow.  W=walker.  L=wraithlord.  WG=wraithguard.  SS=shining spears.  V=vyper.  The boxes represent unit footprints and don't have anything to do with the actual size of squads.  The rightmost ork squad was a bunch of shoota boys.  The diagram isn't to scale so distances may be a bit off, it is close enough to convey the idea though.  I left out units which weren't too important to the immediate picture.  There was a wraithlord to the right with 2 bikes further right but neither are pictured.

After the ork charges on turn 3 the board looked something like this.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2Fevo1.png&hash=32c87b8a4ca26ff464769fe0ede2076b749f9231)

I then moved my harlies and spear in to attack the orks in the center.  The orks run and the spears are stranded.  The harlies are out of immediate assault danger, but risk ranged attacks.  The walker headed left to tie up the flyers and eventually blew up killing many orks in multiple squads.  So the board looked something like this.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2Fevo2.png&hash=1072386ca8da24a5134e3cab9b8749378a954bd2)

I think that my charge move should have been something like:

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2Fevo3.png&hash=b041e2730ee73a37317fc8c4abf80ef6d07b0aa3)

The harlies would have killed most of the orks, I would have won the combat, the orks would have run.  Even if the orks didn't run, the harlies could have hit and run out toward the right and gotten in position to charge either of the ork squads.  The lord and bikes on the right could have been used to keep the harlies from getting shot by the shootas if necessary.

Meanwhile the spears and guard likely would have finished the orks they were working on and been able to consolidate right and forward.

In the ork turn the guard squad in the center would be fininshed off if that cc was still going leaving the boss and few remaining orks exposed to shooting which had a good chance of finishing them.  Or the boss and boys would have been running.  Either way my position would have been good.  The harlies and spears could have charged if necessary though they more likely would have been moving right getting away from the boss.

The walker died in that ork turn killing off the flyers but leaving them far from the action.  My subsequent moving phase would have allowed me to move everything except possibly the wraithlord out of their charge range probably engaging one or both the ork squads on the right.  They were separated enough to be unable to provide support to each other so I could take down one at a time.  Both had also been taking steady casualties the whole game from the lord and bikes so they weren't full strength mobs that would be hard to kill.  In fact the squad nearer the center was actually charged by the harlies and remnants of the wraithguard squad and forced to run under half strength and unable to regroup.  The lord and/or vyper could be left behind to keep them further from the bulk of my force moving right.  By this time also they were down to 5 or 6 models so a good volley should have been able to destroy them.  I think if I had played it right things would have looked something like this going into turn 5.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq152%2Fgwaihir7%2Fevo4.png&hash=3b30f59e059176a7c4e634df585b9fe51347e280)

As I say above both the squads on the right were very killable as were the flying orks.  The orks on foot farthest from the action were probably beyond my ability to handle.  I think at this points I could keep one guard squad at full strength, one alive though badly mauled, the harlies alive (and their bonus VPs not going to the opponent), both farseers, one lord, one vyper and the bikes.  He would have the immobile battle wagon, looted vehicle, grots, boss, mech, trukk, full boys squad and maybe the flyers though under half strength, though I may well have been able to cut killed one or two of those things.  I think I would have had around 1400 points left to his 900 or so and also kept my hunted squad alive while killing his.

A loss is often worth more than a win though as there can be more to learn from, so I am actually fairly pleased with the game.

Quote
Better luck on your next game, and I would love to hear how a re-match goes, as I think you could take his list.

Yeah, I definately think the forces are fairly evenly matched and that the outcome is most dependant on how well the players play.  I really have to play my best game though as he is an exceptional player.  Even small mistakes can multiply creating big problems.

One example is the mistake with the bikes that cost me the shuriken cannon.  I could have made pop up attacks for four turns taking no return fire.  Shootas were steadily advancing on that side and by the time they entered the terrain piece covering the bikes, the bikes could have turboboosted past them to hide in cover near the looted vehicle then jumped out and shot at it once or twice with good odds of destroying it.  I messed up, lost the cannon and lost the stronger potential for success.

If I had played things better the bikes would have been boosting forward about the time my forces were engaging the shootas so the bikes would have had nothing threatening them as they advanced.  Also the vehicle lurched forward and would have been an easy target at that point as it would no longe be behing the partial cover it had.

Small mistakes can get big.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 14, 2008, 09:00:39 PM
Excelletn diagrams as they really helped me visualize things out... I seriously think that the SS move is what lost you the game, as you noted... their assault was a complete failure as they were killed too early. There are other options as well as what you posted; but terrain, etc are all factors... I know that personnaly, I avoid Ork CC as I don't use a lot of dedicated CC units.... I am actualy amazed at how many Wraithguard you lost... as I have seen them be a lot tougher, although when I shoot them, I tend to get all the right dice, so maybe your opponent had some luck as well as skill on his side.

PS... When exactly doen Withdraw take place... Before combat Resolution... So even if all the figures are dead, some would argue that you could still use the Withdraw feature... Just a thought, as I too run it the way you did; but soem argue for the other camp.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 14, 2008, 09:24:20 PM
Quote
I am actualy amazed at how many Wraithguard you lost...

I think he did a bit better than the averages would suggest.  I had lost a couple to shooting.  In one round the blast killed 3 or 4 as I did really bad with the cover saves.  Then I lost 3 or 4 more on the charge and the last in the next round all due to the claws.  Still I emerged from that cc with both seers unscathed.

The other guard squad held up fine when snickrot charged, but eventually were assaulted by the flyers and the other squad which had the Big Mech along.  There were enough claws and whatnot to kill them in 3 or 4 rounds of cc.  The spirit seer survived and the attached farseer only had one save to make, to live but failed it and the reroll. :-\  The game was lost at that point anyway though.

Quote
I know that personnaly, I avoid Ork CC as I don't use a lot of dedicated CC units....

My list just didn't have the volume of fire or templateyness to kill enough to avoid cc.  The guard as holders while spears and harlies hop in and out should have worked; I just didn't do it right.  The spears and harlies were quite capable of sweeping their kill zones on the initial charge and if I had managed to work on one squad at a time, I would have been able to suffer little damage on return attacks.

After the waaagh the orks should have lost enough initiative for me to capitalize on the position.

One thing I was thinking about though is that even though they are 400 points a pop, it was pretty much necessary to sacrifice the front guard squad just to set up a more advantageous postion.  Makes me have a lot less empathy (not that I ever had much) for those griping about harlies hopping out of the falcon and killing a 150-200 point squad.  Play it right and the sacrifice of that squad can be worth it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on May 14, 2008, 11:15:56 PM
   Good batreps here Gwaihir.

   Seems to me you had terrible luck with the reserve rolls in the game against Tyranids, makes me remember the last time I put my Spider in Deepstrike, only to get then come in only at the last turn, nevertheless the Autarch. :-\
   Good job at having pulled a win though, a both you and your opponent seems to have been into a kind of deadlock with all his MCs and your WG waiting for each other.

   That game against Orks was quite amazing I must say, even though you didn't get a Win. The multiple Klaws are what horrify me most with the new Orks, I just can't figure how not to take horrible (and expensive) casualties against these, as well shown in the batrep.
   The Spears: Like you said, little mistakes may grow out of proportions when facing a good opponent.
   You said that the Autarch cleared his Kill Zone and the remnant of the Spears ended up with no targets to kill, does a more spread charge would have changed the end result if your Aspects had earned some more kills?
   Also, that horrible Difficult Terrain roll for the Wraithlord didn't help your cause for sure. :D

   Thanks to have shared these with us.

   Oh, and by the way, to echo moc065 I'll say I also quite like the diagrams you make up for your batreps. Out of curiosity, how much time does it take you to do these?

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 15, 2008, 08:01:34 AM
The ones I just put up here were pretty quick.  I probably took about five minutes to do the first, the rest are faster as I just have to move the blocks around.

The diagrams I usually draw take much longer because of all the little circles and squares.  I have a background grid I made a while ago that keeps it in scale so that speeds things up a bit.

I am sure there are much better programs to use, but I use powerpoint to make the diagrams.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 15, 2008, 09:53:51 AM
In regarde to Diagrams, I actually use Paint, and most of mine only take 5-10 minutes.... as I build templates (copy & paste) etc.

You should consider it Starky.. its helps you out later when you re-read things as a Prep for tournies etc.

CaHG.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on May 15, 2008, 05:32:32 PM
   I'll probably try m hand on it as soon as I have some time to relax. The house is taking it's toll in stamina, I always feel tired these time around.
   I should be fine and in shape trough June though, then I should be able to come out with some full batreps that are taking dust somewhere...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 16, 2008, 01:44:35 PM

Here is a Template or two to get you started with Copy and Paste...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz251%2Fmoc065%2FBatReps%2FFalconpaint-3.jpg&hash=f2a31d0f418f05ff55795a615de03698443a4ddf)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz251%2Fmoc065%2FBatReps%2FNecronIcons.jpg&hash=459f7df193d33d2aa4c130912f92d6e1b01d1415)

Sorry about the Colours; but I made them for me, not the Iyanden.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on May 16, 2008, 03:11:12 PM
those are some pretty sweet templates, now what would i have to do to use them, get them into paint and then do some careful scissors cutting and what not? 

diagrams would make battle reports so much easier to explain, meaning i would probably actually post some reports in the future. (i type slowly so the less typing the better)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 16, 2008, 03:15:15 PM
Save pic as.
Open in Paint,
Copy and Paste as required,

Some cleanup around the edges may be required to hedge out any smudges due to jpg-bmp conversion; but that would probably only take you a few minutes (the first time, as after that you can save them as bmp's and never have to clean them up again)..

Hope that helps.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on May 18, 2008, 09:51:07 AM
   Thanks moc for the pics, I'll surely try these at some time in the future (With the right colors of course).

   As a side note: For all PoC members, join Gutstikk Summer Online Campaign (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=161635.0) if you can, the Eldar need every participant possible if we want to gain supremacy in the soon to be ongoing conflict.

   Don't forget: Eldar Rule, now let's prove it!

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 20, 2008, 07:42:49 AM
I found this fan video (http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/413026) which has some wraithguard and lords blasting apart some marines.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on May 20, 2008, 09:37:15 AM
   HA! Take that you SMurfies!

   Thanks Gwaihir for the video, it certainly belongs here. ;) (Now added to the Great Library, Fluff Section)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 20, 2008, 09:38:09 AM
I thought you might like it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Two Hawks on May 21, 2008, 11:18:53 AM
That vid was awesome :D!! Here everyone else think ELDAR are inferior..
Take that you other races!!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 21, 2008, 09:17:33 PM
Quote from: Gwaihir on May 20, 2008, 07:42:49 AM
I found this fan video (http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/413026) which has some wraithguard and lords blasting apart some marines.

Thank you Gwaihir, now were do I mail the check as that was certainly worth the price of admission.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Two Hawks on May 25, 2008, 05:50:05 PM
I was wondering what's the easiest way to get a 10 man wraithguard unit across the board? Considering we don't use a lot of terrain, too bad they don't all fit in a serpent. Is there a unit that's best to put in front of them to take the heat off of them? Sorry if it's been asked before I don't get to sit a the computeer all day to search. Thanks in advance and any ideas is appreciated.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: f.desrochers on May 26, 2008, 07:38:33 AM
Quote
I was wondering what's the easiest way to get a 10 man wraithguard unit across the board? Considering we don't use a lot of terrain, too bad they don't all fit in a serpent.

Well, really the only way across is to slug it forward.  That said, you mention you don;t use a lot of terrain.  Is this by choice?  Because typically with 25% of the board-worth of terrain to deploy, you should have no problems slipping a dfew larger pieces directly into the middle of the field, giving you a clear avenue of approach.  It also conveniently provides you with a target piece of cover to move for, allowing a 4+ cover save once within, creating a 12" bubble around which very few Elite infantry units and vehicles will likely wander.

As for the Serpent arguement, well you hit on one of the most contentious changes in the new Eldar Codex.  Prior to this, two units of 5 Wraithguard in a Wave Serpent and an equal number of Wraithlords counted as Troops.  There was no measure of glee to the number of games I played and won without even disembarking my Wraithguard.  Conversely, when we lost the option, I found myself playing my mon-keigh armies for some time.....  A unit of 5 in Wave Serpent does make for an effective Elite choice, though you may find those points better spent elsewhere - depending on the size of the army list.

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Aislinn on May 26, 2008, 09:39:11 AM
Considering they're T5 and have pretty kick-butt guns, they're going to make it w/few caualties.  I play a Slugging army, and the only thing that dies before getting to the enemy is my Autarch, and maybe a Warp Spider that got a double for the Warp Jump move.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on May 26, 2008, 09:42:42 AM
Hail! Hail! Listen to Wraithlord's wiseness! :)

Welcome to your first post in the thread ;françois! It's been some time.

@Two hawks: Note that 5th ed is at our door: Wraithguard will be able to Run, so that should somewhat alleviate one of the main problem of fielding the Wraithguard, namely slowness and range.
   How often footslogging squads ended up doing nothing except walking it toward the enemy until Turn 4 or 5? Seems that not everything will go bad for us Eldar with the new edition's coming.
   And we just got a boost to the Wraithlord's survivability since Cover improved and since units will provide 4+ Cover Saves, it may even be possible to advance our Lords behind the WG line, though I'm not sure they will grant that cover to MCs.
   We shall see, only 1 1/2 month to go.

@Aislinn: Pst! Add +1 to the Toughness you listed! ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 26, 2008, 02:23:16 PM
And now you all know why I am furiously painting my 15 Wraithguard, and actively seeking 5 more....  I will still play Saim-Hann for the most part; but WG will come into a whole new realm of effectiveness when they can "Run" (giving up their shooting and assaulting for that turn) and keep up to the rest of my army...

Oh and Skimmers will not be as bad as some have mentioned... But I will leave that until we all get to see the Fine Print.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on May 27, 2008, 09:56:08 AM
Quote
I was wondering what's the easiest way to get a 10 man wraithguard unit across the board?  Is there a unit that's best to put in front of them to take the heat off of them?

Yeah, another 10 wraithguard. ;D  I have found that few armies can kill off one unit of wraithguard with shooting.  Trying to kill off 2 is pretty much impossible.

The other thing is to consider trying to create a force which gives him nothing to shoot at with small arms.  Look at this list of units:
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on May 27, 2008, 10:35:47 AM
Yeah Gwaihir pretty well hit the nail right on the head... I play the very fast variant of Eldar.... and I do add WG from time to time... So in the end I generally end with a list something like this @ 2K.

Anvil
10 WG + Warlock and Conceal.
Farseer on JB, (plays a swing role in many cases using a 2nd power like MW or E-Storm)
I looks weird but having the option of a Fast Support Farseer, has worked very well for me... and I think that 1 Ground-pounder unit within a 2K list doesn't take too mauch away from my Saim-Hann flavour of play.

Hammer (or in my case --- Bag of Hammers)
Autarch on JB & Shining Spears --- Fast Assaults
Jetbikes & Spiders & Hawks --- Subversion and harrasment
Harlies in Falcon & Fire Dragons in Falcon --- Heavy Vehicle + Infantry control.

I use the 3 hammer elements to direct the enemy or limit the table, while the Anvil advances to secure the mission and asert dominence... By having very little for the enemy to use their small arms on, I can often dictate the pace of the battle and deal with things as I see fit.... WG are only going to be better in 5th Ed, and I don't see to much changing with this style of battle plan.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Aislinn on May 27, 2008, 05:12:36 PM
Quote
@Aislinn: Pst! Add +1 to the Toughness you listed!

   Starky  

Really T6... I really got to read my codex more often.  That would've helped immensely the other day against the Mechanized Tau that owned me utterly.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on June 3, 2008, 07:45:47 PM
   Hi people of Iyanden! I just updated our Iyanden picture bank (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.0) with these that I found on the web:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2Fimg44c051a90e91app5.gif&hash=25e85e304136563a7733d767ff40849853657a1a)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2FA1548PGE.jpg&hash=3b9d0d2eaaaf2110836201b8be3a10e08efad8df)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2FIyanden.jpg&hash=a5c7691a210b33bccbc725912ea2afa330e3f94c)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2Fiyanden1.jpg&hash=0d69f56bfdb01817d9b76e9577cccaff3751dc21)
   In the event that some of you are talented in drawing and/or have access to images that they would share pray post them here and I'll include them in the Front page for all to witness/use. ;)

   Oh and BTW, if some of you are interested (advertising, again) there's that nice little Campaign that will start tonight, yeah... ;)
   Just click on my sig to access the Thread and judge by yourselves.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Two Hawks on June 25, 2008, 06:38:16 AM
Woo-Hoo I'm liking 5th Ed. Running Wraithguard & Lords...SWEET! I just picked up 5 more guard for a total of ... 20. EBAY of course.

How's all Iyanden fairing in the Campaign? Just curious. I know I'm doing decent against the new Chaos.
 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Aislinn on June 27, 2008, 09:17:42 AM
How does %th edition HELP the eldar?  I mean I've done the tutorials at the local GW and I've only seen it hinder at least my Eldar.   I don't lnow, maybe I'm just not seeing the whole picture or something.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on June 27, 2008, 09:21:07 AM
We're not allowed to talk about that here until the release of the actual rules on the 12th.  We have to have that discussion in the rumors board.  There is a 29 or so page thread about eldar in 5th including scattered Iyanden related topics.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Aislinn on June 27, 2008, 09:22:06 AM
OK thanks!  I'll look in to that.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on June 29, 2008, 03:51:50 AM
   Hi all! For those interested there's   a TWO brand new batrep featuring an Iyanden force here: Comissar Hall's Orks vs the Iyanden Eldar  (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=164135.0)and my own Silver Ghosts taking the Grey Knights. (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=164812.0)

Also, two promotions for the Iyanden PoC:
 - Aislinn gets promoted to Wraithguard
 - Two Hawks gets promoted to Guardian

Congrats on both of you and your involvement in the forums! :)

   Starky

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Two Hawks on June 30, 2008, 10:16:44 AM
Thanks Starky!!

Guess that means I have to continue, huh?
I've gotta kick some CHAOS Arse tonight in sector II. :) and do a write up.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 4, 2008, 01:02:30 PM
Hey all.

I just thought I should let you all know that I am currently working away for the good of Iyanden (under Starkys orders) writing 2 tutorials on how to paint yellow.  Now these 2 tutorials show you how to paint yellow to a table top standard and the other shows how I paint Yellow to a display standard.

These tutorials are being done on 2 different models.  The table top quality is being done on a wraith guard and the display standard is being done on a Farseer.

Now as Im doing this for the benefit of all of you, I want to know if you all just want me to show you how I do the yellow parts, or do you want me to show you how I do all the other parts of the model such as wraithbone and power weapons and gems etc? and turn this into a full mini tutorial?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 4, 2008, 01:14:14 PM
Quote from: Valar
Now as Im doing this for the benefit of all of you, I want to know if you all just want me to show you how I do the yellow parts, or do you want me to show you how I do all the other parts of the model such as wraithbone and power weapons and gems etc? and turn this into a full mini tutorial?
   Well, thanks a lot Valar! :) If it was just for me I'd like to see the full tutorial but that is of course depending of your time and availability.
   Mind you, I have still half that Ulthwé force (I know, I know...) to paint yet, so paintips tips are always welcome. :D

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 4, 2008, 01:18:13 PM
Quote from: Godlike Starrakatt, the Slayer of Hubris on July  4, 2008, 01:14:14 PM
Quote from: Valar
Now as Im doing this for the benefit of all of you, I want to know if you all just want me to show you how I do the yellow parts, or do you want me to show you how I do all the other parts of the model such as wraithbone and power weapons and gems etc? and turn this into a full mini tutorial?
   Well, thanks a lot Valar! :) If it was just for me I'd like to see the full tutorial but that is of course depending of your time and availability.
   Mind you, I have still half that Ulthwé force (I know, I know...) to paint yet, so paintips tips are always welcome. :D

   Starky

Starky, I have so much time I dont know what to do with it, thats what you get for being a Student without a job.... No money, but sooo much spare time its ridiculous. 

I shall turn this into a full mini tutorial I think, with everything (well.... I will keep the table top quality one just about the yellow, but then the display one I shall go all out for.)

Expect it within the next week or two.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Wingzero on July 5, 2008, 11:11:29 AM
Out of all my years of playing, leaving, and playing again of 40k (since 3rd ed), I've only recently started up Eldar, what's funny though, is I've been collecting up Wraithguard's for about 10 years, now that I've got about 60-or so, it might be time for me to actually look at walking the path of the Ghost Warrior....

So with this post, I take my fist step into the spirit realm, and the hallowed halls of Iyanden.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 5, 2008, 11:41:40 AM
60 Wraithguard. :o :o :o  I'd say it is long past the point where you should have started playing Iyanden.

Greetings and welcome to the newer members of the Craftworld.  It is nice to see new members taking an active role in contributing.

I have the 2 batreps Starky mentions added to the list of batreps on the first page.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 5, 2008, 12:59:54 PM
   Thanks Gwaihir, and you'll probably have one more to add somewhere along the weekend. ;)

  @Wingzero: I agree with Gwaihir here, wow! Take the time to shuffle through the first PoC pages, you'll find a wealth of information on how you can get the best of your Wraith units, although we have nothing to to cover such large numbers.
   If that kind of game appeals to you, you are probably almost ready for some Apocalypse games. ;)
   What other Eldar models do you own out of curiosity?

   Oh, and I have registered your name on the PoC as Civilian. Once you get some more posts/contributions you'll progress in ranking. I hope you'll enjoy your stay here.

   Starky :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on July 7, 2008, 06:48:43 AM
@ Valar

In regard to your tutorial on Yellow.... I suggest that you go "Hog Wild" and actually do a Full tutorial on the figures (wraithbone, Yellows, etc)... as a lot of people would benenfit from this sort of thing.... I also suggest that you use the same background through the tutorial, and take as many pictures as possible to show each step....

Cheers.

@Wingzero

60 Wraithgaurd.... Noly Crap... add in 6 Spiritseers and a Farseer (or two) and you have a 2500pt+ force that near unkillable. 8)

@ The Ghost Walkers -- (thats all of you)

Good to see your POC is alive and well, I wish mine was getting more Batreps and such, and I may be borrowing some of your format styles to help me get things better organized in my own POC... Thanks.

Cheers and Happy Gaming.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 7, 2008, 08:06:08 AM
Quote from: The Red Savage
Good to see your POC is alive and well, I wish mine was getting more Batreps and such, and I may be borrowing some of your format styles to help me get things better organized in my own POC... Thanks.
   No problem moc, do as you will as I did for your own stuff, glad that we came up with something usefull. (Hey Gwaihir, your prediction has come true... 8))
   And your PoC will get a new life in time, it needs only some poster to bring some action in.

Quote
Cheers and Happy Gaming.
   Always!

   Starky :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 7, 2008, 10:33:16 AM
Fa'alorath, farseer of craftworld Fa'alnor, the fate weavers, had already seen it. ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Wingzero on July 7, 2008, 11:03:07 AM
wow, didn't think that collecting some of the best looking models in the game over the years, would give me such a huge army so fast...

Just need to get some far-seers and sprit-seers now....

As for the other units I've got, I've got a converted Asurmen (or how ever you spell his name), 22 Dire Avengers, 6 banshies. a wave serpent, 3 falcons, 8 jet bikes, two vypers, two Wraith Lords, that I've posed (one is walking, and the other is back-handing something), and something like 40 guardians.

Personaly, I like my games to be between 1500 - 3k points, just beacuse you get to see some of the more...... un-usual units, atleast where I am.

Thanks by the way, I'll be sure to read up, on the tactics for the Wraith Guards.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 8, 2008, 01:01:37 PM
I agree they are some of the best looking models in the game the problem though is their price tag. At about £9 per model its not cheap to play Iyanden.

Also guys Im working on a couple of 2000pt variant lists to post up, one true Iyanden List and an Iyanden list with a slight twist.  I shall post these up here for reference soon, with a bit of tactical discussion about the differences between the two forces in play style and tactics.

Also as a side note, I was able to start the tutorial today as the weather has been clear for long enough to get the model undercoated and the first few stages done and photographed.  Thanks for your patience
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Wingzero on July 8, 2008, 03:12:24 PM
Quote from: Valar on July  8, 2008, 01:01:37 PM
I agree they are some of the best looking models in the game the problem though is their price tag. At about £9 per model its not cheap to play Iyanden.

Also guys Im working on a couple of 2000pt variant lists to post up, one true Iyanden List and an Iyanden list with a slight twist.  I shall post these up here for reference soon, with a bit of tactical discussion about the differences between the two forces in play style and tactics.

Also as a side note, I was able to start the tutorial today as the weather has been clear for long enough to get the model undercoated and the first few stages done and photographed.  Thanks for your patience

Tell me about it, here in Canada, you get one guard per pack, for $18, I remeber when you could get 2 for $12, about 10 years back.

I think though to round out my Iyanden force, I just get thrid Wraith Lord (Love the new plastic ones), then some Far-seers and Sprit Seers, and I'll be good to go....

Thinking about it, that'd be one scary force to see on the table, 60 Wraith Guard, and 3 Wraith Lords....
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 8, 2008, 03:53:56 PM
Quote from: Wingzero on July  8, 2008, 03:12:24 PM
Quote from: Valar on July  8, 2008, 01:01:37 PM
I agree they are some of the best looking models in the game the problem though is their price tag. At about £9 per model its not cheap to play Iyanden.

Also guys Im working on a couple of 2000pt variant lists to post up, one true Iyanden List and an Iyanden list with a slight twist.  I shall post these up here for reference soon, with a bit of tactical discussion about the differences between the two forces in play style and tactics.

Also as a side note, I was able to start the tutorial today as the weather has been clear for long enough to get the model undercoated and the first few stages done and photographed.  Thanks for your patience

Tell me about it, here in Canada, you get one guard per pack, for $18, I remeber when you could get 2 for $12, about 10 years back.

I think though to round out my Iyanden force, I just get thrid Wraith Lord (Love the new plastic ones), then some Far-seers and Sprit Seers, and I'll be good to go....

Thinking about it, that'd be one scary force to see on the table, 60 Wraith Guard, and 3 Wraith Lords....

and it would be perfect for apocalypse, I should have got the spirit host splash release when it was available... dam it.  oh well, I intend on building up a sizeable force of these aswell over the next few years.  but I will always be waiting hopefully for plastic wraithguards.... who knows, with GW's new plans to release new releases for races regularly instead of only with a new dex..... it might be a longshot but im still hopeful.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on July 9, 2008, 06:53:50 AM
Even at $18.00 a figure, the Wraithguard are still a decent price (in comparison with some units) as they are worth a lot of points...

$200.00 gets you a Full squad and Concealing Warlock... 396pts...

Yes you can get 3 WL's for less cash and about the same points; but check out what the cost of Guardians would be.... 400pts = about 50 Guardians, thats 5 boxes, or $225.00 in Canada...

PS... I got 12 off of E-bay, Bartertown, etc.. over the past year at about $5.00-7.50 each... so there are options out ther (only 8 more to get to make me happy).

Cheers.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: f.desrochers on July 9, 2008, 07:13:56 AM
As far as points-per-miodel versus cash-per-model, Wraithguard come out shiny.  It could be much, much worse.  There are units out there that cost boat-loads of cash for 30 point bases and the like. Just look at the Killa Kans, or even the Eldar Heavy Weapon Platforms.  I actually laughed the last time I price-checked a Vibro-Cannon blister.

That said, given the proposed changes to the Scoring Unit rules, Wraithguard just became the Golden Troop choice, not only for Iyanden.  I think we'll see a lot of other players coming to our ranks looking for advice on how to field their Wraithguard and develop synergies with their other units.

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on July 9, 2008, 07:37:53 AM
Wraithguard will in fact be an even better troop choice; but their lack of Combat Punch may be their downfall too... check out the new Combat Rez and figure it out... WG will still be solid; but not the "holding" unit they were... as Fearless actually means they may take more casualties. Oh and they will block a lot of LOS where as Jetbikes wil be like a "Doorway" opening to allow LOS for you, and then closing to give Cover during the enemies turn... In the end though, WG should see more game time overall though, and rightly so... as they are wicked looking and they work well.

Cheers.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 9, 2008, 07:57:53 AM
Combat res isn't going to hurt the guard much unless you make a mistake.  With fortune you make about 5 saves for every 1 you fail, so if you lose by six wounds, you'll probably only lose one guard.   Lose by 12 and you only lose 2.

Wraithguard are very hard for just about any assault unit to kill.  Their high toughness and rerollable saves really helps minimize incoming wounds.  Inflicting 6-12 wounds on the guard themselves is an extreme rarity and if it happens the actual wounds inflicted will hurt the squad quite a bit more than the saves for combat res.

The best way to get the guard in trouble in cc may be to throw in a huge squad of guardians who can be easily killed and lead to a very high deficit of wounds inflicted.  Be careful about the units in a multiple combat with the guard and they will be fine.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 9, 2008, 08:10:13 AM
In my experience the Guard have been one of my strongest CC units, many times they have held out for an entire game or just long enough against all odds.  Here is just a list of units they have beaten or held out against to win me the game.

Skarabrand The Bloodthirster
10 Bloodletters and Skull Taker
1 home made uber character with Demon mount (which for all intents and purposes counted as a Ravener)
20 Chaos Space Marines.

only once have I had an entire unit of guard wiped out and that was against the Home made uber character which they reduced to one wound over 5 turns before my wraithlord made the killing blow against it, but without them holding my flank it would have chewed its way through my entire line within those 5 turns.... so undoubtedly they won me that game.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on July 9, 2008, 08:52:50 AM
Gwaihir figured out what I was getting at... the WG will need to be used more often as a single entity, where as in 4th, it was often better to mob in some extra units to pound on the enemy while the Guard "Hold" them.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 9, 2008, 11:09:18 AM
   I think that it is one instance where the Harlequins will still outshine the Banshees and Scorpions in 5th ed, even with them now arguably being slightly overpriced.
   The WG will need hard hitting CC specialists to get them out of melee, and what better than VoT & 4+ Cover saves for standing behind the Wraith Warriors to deter any viable shooting directed at them (the Harlies).

   The Wraithguard have become (if they weren't already) one of the best living wall in the game.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 9, 2008, 11:32:58 AM
I agree Starky.  The thing that I like most about harlies compared to banshees, scorpions and the like is that they are difficult to target and remove with shooting.  They also can make good use of hit and run to avoid too lengthy and damaging a combat.  In the first round a well planned charge can easily ensure that very few attacks are directed at the harlies.  It should be quite easy to win the initial combat handily.

Multiple unit combats are still going to be possible and effective, they will just require careful planning when executed.  The guard can be used to screen most engaged enemy forcing them to attack the guard instead of the harlies or whoever else is also charging in.  This becomes more difficult after the initial combat though so winning there or being able to leave with the second unit will be very important.

We aren't supposed to be having this conversation right now though are we.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 9, 2008, 11:39:35 AM
   What conversation? There's no conversation. Never heard of it.

   Besides, Yellow on Black is full of win. And so is Iyanden. You are probably right Gwaihir (again), more Eldar will start to join us soon, very soon...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 9, 2008, 11:55:31 AM
Ah but how many of those other Eldar players will turn to true Iyanden?? I find it hard to imagine that everyone will suddenly turn to a pure Iyanden force because it contains one of the best units available... I think that yes, we will see a rise in the amount of people using wraithguard units but integrating them somehow into their own craftworlds with one maybe two units at the most.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 9, 2008, 01:30:58 PM
What is a "pure" Iyanden force.  Really if you have 2 wraith units in the army then you have a force with Iyanden character.  In the old craftworld codex, all you needed was a 5 man wraithguard squad and a wraithlord with everything else in the army being non-wraith units.  That isn't a high threshold for an Iyanden army.

The main thing that really set Iyanden apart was that you could have up to 6 selections from the HS section of the main codex (3 of those selections being wraithlords who were in the troops slot).  Of course to do this you had to field a minimum of 3 wraithguard squads (15 guard).  This gave a total of 18 wraith models in the army.  Now with 10 man squads needed to field wraithguards as troops, with just 2 such squads you have more wraith models than many of the old Iyanden lists.

Really if you have a lord and a guard squad, you have a recognizably Iyanden force.  Even just 1 squad of 10 wraiths is Iyandenesque.  20-25% of you list is composed of the main Iyanden troop.

--

I am taking a new look at wraithlords, particularly with the sword as the added speed they will have makes them more useful in an assault role.  A 100 point model with the stats of the lord is not too shabby if it can get across the board to be useful.  Just standing by an objective should be enough to scare off many squads.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: f.desrochers on July 10, 2008, 10:22:11 AM
The question of "What is a true Iyanden force" is something that has cropped up from time to time.  We covered this in the macro-document collected from the Project Board, which I'm sitting on for 5th edition so we can re-discuss many of the points before posting it.

Really, it comes down to this:  "Do I need Wraith units to count as Iyanden?"

The quick and dirty answer in, No.

Although characterized by the Spirit Host (Wraithguard, Wraithlords and Spiritseers), the War Host forms the supporting elements to the army.  In this case, you could assume that an army with a sizeable Spirit Host is "from Iyanden."  You could just as easily use Yriel and a Guardian- and Avenger-heavy army as a pirate raiding force, or a 'last line of defence' type army, both of which Iyanden would field.  This is particularly applicable to smaller sized games (500 - 1250 points), where a unit of Wraithguard would be prohibitively expensive to field, dramatically limiting the support elements of the War Host.

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Wingzero on July 11, 2008, 10:48:07 AM
Well I did a battle the other night with my Sprit host, I'll post the battle rep. later, long story short, I kicked the crap out of the Necron force I played against.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 11, 2008, 10:51:20 AM
The craftworld of Iyanden delights in this glorious victory.  Cant wait to read the Bat rep, make sure to post a link here so that we can all read it when its done.  Necron Vs Eldar is usually, in my experience, a fun game
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 11, 2008, 10:54:11 AM
Quote
I kicked the crap out of the Necron force I played against.

Congrats.  Stomping necrons with guard is always lots of fun.  Gauss weapons are about useless, the monolith is laughably easy to destroy.  Good times. ;D

Quote
make sure to post a link here so that we can all read it when its done

I add a link to each Iyanden batrep on the front page so they are easy to find.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 11, 2008, 11:05:51 AM
   Excellent Wingzero! Can't wait to read that one. Do you happen to have taken pics of the battle?

   We are on the brink of 5th ascent right now, starting officially this Saturday: I just got hold of my own BRB, so Ill have a good read this weekend.
   Let's hope we will stay focused and that we shall soon master the new edition and get some victories and batreps in. There's a lot of work who will await us to get the Iyanden PoC up to date, so let us not linger and start reading/playing. ;)

   Gwaihir, I leave you PoC in your capable hands since I'll be gone for a couple of days. ;)

   Have fun all!

   Starky :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 11, 2008, 11:23:21 AM
On the note of the upcoming 5th edition and the various new ideas that we will all want to discuss.  I will start a thread about Iyanden in 5th edition, unless someone beats me to it, where we can discuss the changes and how they will effect us.  I think we should keep most of that discussion out of this thread, though I will add a link to it in the Iyanden tactic portion of the first page.

I think f.desrochers is thinking of starting up a similar Iyanden in 5th thread in the eldar projects forum.  The two may be a bit duplicative, but are useful because not everyone can read and contribute to the projects board.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Wingzero on July 11, 2008, 11:36:29 AM
No, I didn't grab any pics >.>, my camera was acting funny all day.

Anyways, I'll post it, when I get off work today.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 11, 2008, 05:56:13 PM
My shop is having midnight madness to usher in the 5th edition.  Part of this is an apoc battle that'll start with 4th rules until 9 and switch over to 5th rules at 12.  It presents and opportunity to go close to pure wraith.  I'll think I'll do something like this:

Fa'alorath (Eldrad)
Farseer, fortune, doom, stones
Farseer, fortune, doom, stones
Farseer, fortune, doom, stones
Farseer, fortune, doom, stones
Jain Zar
Avatar
10x Wraithguard, Spiritseer, Conceal
10x Wraithguard, Spiritseer, Conceal
5x Wraithguard, Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithlord, Sword, Shuriken Cannon
Wraithlord, EML, Starcannon
Wraithlord, EML, Scatter Laser

Don't have as much fortune as I would like, but I don't have enough farseers. :P  Obviously it isn't a super list or anything, and I'm not looking for ways to make it better.  I'm just using all my wraith stuff if possible.  I'll post how it goes.  Maybe I'll win the prize.  They won't say how to win the prize, just that there will be one.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 11, 2008, 06:07:08 PM
Now that is a warhost to be proud of, all those wraith units marching silently towards the enemy spreading fear and terror to those that dare doubt the might of the Eldar.  They shall rue the day.  Sounds awesome, I just wish I had a GW i could do to to celebrate the release of 5th edition im very jealous.  make sure to tell us how it goes.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Wingzero on July 11, 2008, 07:53:55 PM
Well here it is, I'm not the best at these things, but this was my best shot at it:

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=165549.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=165549.0)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 16, 2008, 12:02:11 PM
@Gwaihir: A fine Spirit Host indeed, but you do realise that your a mean, sadistic player, right?

Lets elaborate: Ever had that so ever slightest of smile when eyeing a player's frown and  sheer incredulity when you tell them what T are theses?
   Ever witnessed that almost imperceptible (or most perceptible in some cases) and so satisfying cringe in you opponent's expression when you deploy your Wraith units?
   Ever thoroughly enjoyed the knee jerk reaction when some opponents just pump shots after shots after shots on your units for about no noticeable effect?
   Ever had to suppress smirk at the sound of gnashing teeth when you succeed (again) that Fortune casting?
   Ever be secretly amused when noticing the clenching of fists and the underbreath mumbling when you tell them that yeah, you DO have a Conceal save?

   Now go stand before a mirror, remind yourself all of these instances, then look yourself in the eye and say without the hint of smile: I. Do. Not. Enjoy. This.

   Then you shall know. And you all out there, do the same and be honest with yourself: Are you sadistic player?

   Starky

Note: Oh, and please send me a PM, I'd sincerely like know if I'm not alone in this...)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Gwaihir on July 16, 2008, 01:10:30 PM
Quote
@Gwaihir: A fine Spirit Host indeed, but you do realise that your a mean, sadistic player, right?

Not as sadistic at the guy accross the table with a revenant shooting 2 D weapons with 2 5" blasts each.  My squads got trimmed down quite a bit.  Still managed to get some stuff into the lines of the guard in front of me before the game ended though.

Oh, and yes, I do get quite a kick at of all of the above.  I think my favorite though is when I fail 2 or 3 cover saves and then make all the rerolls.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: f.desrochers on July 16, 2008, 02:31:42 PM
Quote
I think f.desrochers is thinking of starting up a similar Iyanden in 5th thread in the eldar projects forum.

Actually, I'll just jump in with yours Gwaihir.  What I suggest is that we go over that 30-page Iyanden document and pare it down to 5th edition so it accurately reflects the current rule-set.   I'll be jumping into the conversation later on this week, once I get past some messiness at work.

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 18, 2008, 12:26:06 PM
   I'd be happy to contribute in any ways in can, although I have not that analytic tactical sense that you both seems to possess. I still have the original that you sent me a while ago ;françois. I'll read it again and see what I can come up with if you like.

   Also, I discovered this on the web and found it interesting.
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2FCraftworld.jpg&hash=cc9f7df2747ae09ba0a57ff41283ecece31b0d4f)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 18, 2008, 03:44:36 PM
Wow what a find Starky.  An actual model of Craftworld Iyanden.... I never thought I would see that ever..... awesome....

Anyways there is more reason for me posting here than to drool over that model and shower it with generic praises.  That is to say that the model I have been working on is finished, all I need to do now is to take the last few pics and get some Testors Dullcote to give it a matte finish... Then I have the last few stages to write up and my pics to download onto photobucket and then Im all done and can post it up. 

What I think I will do is post it in the painting forum with a link to it here.... and if Starky could kindly add the link into the PoC Library on the first few pages that would be much appreciated.

Thanks all for your patience.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 18, 2008, 04:45:21 PM
   I'll do just that, it's my job.  :) Just post the link to the article here when it is done so that anyone clicking in can have an immediate look (Free advertising).

   Thanks for having invested time in the PoC Valar, it well appreciated. I will congratulate you when I see the work. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 18, 2008, 05:09:04 PM
Quote from: Godlike Starrakatt, the Slayer of Hubris on July 18, 2008, 04:45:21 PM
   I'll do just that, it's my job.  :) Just post the link to the article here when it is done so that anyone clicking in can have an immediate look (Free advertising).

   Thanks for having invested time in the PoC Valar, it well appreciated. I will congratulate you when I see the work. ;)

   Starky

And Thankyou for running such a fine PoC, I have to say over the last coupole of weeks I have really enjoyed reading over its contents, discussing everything Iyanden so its a pleasure to contribute some more to it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 20, 2008, 04:28:25 PM
Here it is guys, the long awaited tutorial is all up and finished in the painting forum.  Here is the link, please comment as I am very interested in what you all think.

Click (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=166202.0)

Thanks everyone
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on July 23, 2008, 04:06:48 PM
Just to let you all know, Ive decided not to do my Harlequins, I dont think I will use them in my army for 5th and the last few lists that I have designed dont include them at all so it would be time poorly spent which I could use more productively.

My plan is to show you all how I paint a unit of 5 wraithguard to table top standard in the traditional Iyanden scheme.  This will likely use the new washes as I am interested to see how these work and what they look like so will also be a sort of review of the washes aswell.

So there you have it, expect that over the next few weeks, once I get the washes anyway. 

Oh and Starky can you add the initial tutorial onto the library at the front of this PoC as its not up there yet?  Thanks

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on July 25, 2008, 10:25:46 AM
   It is done Valar, now immortalised into the Great Library (Painting Section) Great work there, I wish I could paint like that! Can't wait to see what you'll come up with the Wraithguard. :)

   Also: Gutstikk Campaign has ended, but I am sorry to say that the Eldar didn't do that well (altough Iyanden did well enough by itself). :'( Lets hope our race will do better in the final of that tripartite Campaign.
   Special thanks for Two Hawks who participated actively on the Iyanden side, lets do better  still next time!

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on August 1, 2008, 04:00:09 PM
Hi guys.  I am working on something new now, I've got a blog up in the painting forum for my painting of a Wave serpent in traditional Iyanden colours.  I enjoyed writing the tutorial I did recently so I thought I would do something for the PoC again.  I would appreciate all of your comments and criticisms on this thread, and if you see fit Starky this could be added into the Library at the front of the PoC aswell.

Here is the link Enjoy (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=167082.0)

Hope you all enjoy this.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on August 1, 2008, 04:21:47 PM
   Sure it will be Valar! Glad to see you continue working extra hard for the just cause. :)

   For extra reassurance, find a place in the blog to link to your Farseer's painting Thread, so all is connected somehow. I'll take a look on it and find it a suitable place in the Great Library.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: azore24 on August 12, 2008, 12:15:09 AM
Linky (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=167461.0)

That link is to the PoC:EO's Arena of Champions.  We of the Council invite one representative from your Craftworld to join the games.  We will be inviting members of all CraftWorlds to compete for the title of greatest warrior.

If your craftworld is interested in this event, please choose from among your ranks a single warrior to do battle for honor, glory, and a place in the hall of the Eldar's greatest warriors.

Azore of Ath-Ron
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on August 13, 2008, 09:41:29 AM
   Okay guys, you heard Azore24. Anyone who'd want to champion Iyanden pray present yourself at the Arena of Champions' subscription board. You know that we can't have the others walk away with the Prize without making a try, right?

   So, voluntaries? :)

   Note: I overhauled the first few pages to give them a better look and easier access in general (like putting the Great Library almost at the top) and doing some (list) code like Gwaihir did. Much neater me think. Also added a pic of a small, easy convertion for the Wraithguard. (http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/All%20Eldar/?action=view&current=DSC00346.jpg)
   Also, look out for Valar's Iyanden Painting Guide (in progress), top of the Painting Section, (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1920762#msg1920762) it is worthy!

   If any of you have ideas about stuff or additional and/or different layout(s) that we could add in there, pray post or PM us your suggestions and we will see what we can do to better it all. ;)

   Be Happy

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on August 13, 2008, 04:13:29 PM
Thanks for the mention Starky.... Guess what arrived in the post today....?? 

Loads of the new washes and 6... yes 6 pots of Bad moon yellow... Ive stocked up since GW have discontinued this colour much to my annoyance.  But 6 pots should last a while hehe.

So that means that after I have finished with the waveserpent I can start on my planned wraithguard blog/tutorial yay!!!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on September 27, 2008, 02:02:34 PM
   Hi all, some news here -

Batreps: There's three new batreps available in the relevant forum, for the curious the links are here,
How NOT to:
- Iyanden VS Deathguard - 2000 Pts (Anhililation/Pitched Battle) (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=168798.0)
- Iyanden VS Tyranids - 2000 Pts (Anihilation/Pitched Battle) (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=168660.0)
And How TO:
- Silver Ghosts VS Imperial Guard - 1500 Pts (Anihilation/Spearhead) (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=168793.0)
- Silver Ghosts VS Imperial Guard - 800 Pts (Seize Ground/Dawn of War) (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=169308.0)


   Also, there is a little project to us all on a voluntary basis, but it would be much appreciated if many participated. :)

   I'd like if each of us (at least the active members, hoping that others may add themselves) could come up with one full 5th edition list that have actually been tested and found to work if possible, each one being of different formats: 1000, 1250, 1500, 1700/1750, 1850 and 2000 pts.

   The lists are to be added to be posted in this thread and once completed I'll make a special 'Member's Lists' on the Front Pages. What would be nice is also for you to post pictures of the assembled army if at all possible (painted or not).
   Of course, that will also make some nice additions to Gwaihir's compilation of Iyanden lists and each may be scored or not.

   So please I am waiting for voluntaries here - 6 of them -, putting no pressure but it would be nice to get some involvement. ;)

   I am sure Gwaihir would make himself a pleasure to come up with a 2000 pts list and I will myself contribute the missing Formats if need be.

   I know Two Hawks ran both a 1000 pts and a 1500 pts lists in Gutstikk's Campaign and that Valar is actually building himself a competitive list. Aislinn is also pretty active on the forums, so I'd expect him to come up with a good one.
   If BudgieGuard, f.desrochers or Sapphon (who all post from time to time - or any other for that matter) could come up with one list each we'd meet the 6 formats pretty easily.

   So, the ball is in your camp now...


   Okay, there's a 1500 pts list, adapted from my 4th edition list. While I designed it with fluff in mind, I ended up using it at local tourneys where it did perform well enough.
   As can be seen, it has a weakness versus Hordes but the Wraithguard are usually more than though enough to withstand a Hordish charge, giving the opportunity for the Harlies to pummel the charging unit(s) with what I call a Clipping Assault and defeat said hordes easily enough.

   The Wraithlords are there to provide the long ranged support. Unless your opponent haven't access to AP3 or lower weapons, try to keep the WLs in cover as much as possible, something that isn't necessarily always possible since they will need to keep pace with the Wraithguard as they advance toward the enemy if you doesn't want to risk a failed Wraithsight roll (Stupidity).

   Flamers from the Wraithlords come in handy too, and with the new 5th ed Template rules can devastate entire units factoring Doom, same ca be said for MCs and MEQs at range using Doom to boost up the Pathfinders' killiness.

   The Serpent borne WG aren't to be underestimated either and should be kept in Reserve were it have no LOS blocking terrain to hide the Serpent on deployment. Keep in mind that the Wave Serpent can well enough provide improvised taxis to either the Pathfinders, Harlies or even a much depleted unit of SCORING Wraithguard.

SILVER GHOSTS TASK FORCE

HQ: 145 PTS
 -Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, RoWarding, Fortune & Doom - 145 pts

ELITE: 525 PTS
 -Wraithguard  x 5 w/ Warlock & Destrutor - 210 pts
  +Wave Serpent w/ Twin Shurican, Spirit Stone & Star Engines - 125 pts

 -Harlequins X 7 w/ Shadowseer, Death Jester & 6 Kisses - 190 pts

TROOP: 540 PTS
 -Wraithguard x 10 w/ Spiritseer & Conceal - 396 pts

 -Pathfinders x 6 - 144 pts


HEAVY: 290 PTS
 -Wraithlord w/ Scatterlaser & EML - 135 pts

 -Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & EML - 155 pts

GRAND TOTAL: 1 500 PTS

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Draza on October 1, 2008, 07:49:00 AM
Well, don't know if this is the place to post, but here it goes. Basically a summary of how my Iyaden themed army went, using the advice and army list from this thread (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=170460.0)

I did have a wraithsword instead of a shuriken cannon. I think the sword looks cool.

Game 1
Up against the new SM codex. Expensive Chapter master on a Bike with a powerfist, a terminator squad, sniper squad, scout squad and 3 tactical squads. A Libarian was present as well.

Basically I left a Guardian squad on the objective and they stayed their all game. No firepower went into them and they just used their scatter laser. They blew up a rhino which was cool.

My Wave serpent was blow up turn 1 (I went first) and lost two models. They did survive some shooting, tied up a squad before eventually dieing.

Wraithlords did excellent, providing great supporting fire. EML plasma missiles are brilliant. I lost one to a powerfist, who was rolling pretty well. The other supported my big Guard squad, charging into the combat to save them, instant killing the Chapter master.
Farseer was brilliant. Even though a Librian cancelled my fortune for one turn, my runes of warding stopped his power as well.

My Big squad took more casualties than I would like, but did okay. Killed some Terminators and they fell back (off the table). Lost 3 guys to the Chapter master in assault (his orbital bombardment did nothing) before a Wraithlord killed him. I then finished off some bikes, and moved up the field, killing some more Marines, charging them and then waiting for back up. They were too tough to kill.

Harlequins were awesome. Wiped out 3 squads. Rangers did okay, but killed off by scouts turn 4 due to out-flanking.

I though the army played well. Many tough targets for the enemy to focus on. Wraithlords are hard to kill, Wraithguard are hard to kill, Harlequins are hard to see and Guardians seem to be largely ignored. My biggest lesson, spiritseers are awesome. That 12" range helps a lot.

Game 2
Basically the same lists. He replaced bikers and chapter master with a Chaplain and Land raider. I upgraded my Rangers to Pathfinders.

The psychological effect of my army was obvious on my opponent. Despite his heavy weapons and firepower, he just didnt believe he could stop my army. Wraithlords saved against lascannons on a 4+ (Guard screen). Wraithguard had fortune and were making plenty of saves. He did no damage with his shooting. I unfortunetly got too close to the Land raider and got charged by Terminators, losing the squad pretty much (7+ wounds, ouch). He knew it was a losing effort, as two Wraithlords and a Harlequin squad counter attacked.

Harlequins were once again devastating. My opponent wanted them gone whenever he got the change, which did cost one squad a round of shooting. I lost two before combat to a 12" moving TL-HB from Land raider, but they held leadership thankfully.

Kept my Wave serpent in reserve. It came in turn 2 and in turn three unloaded its cargo, destroying a Land raider. On turn 5 they killed a remnant squad.

I was worried about my objective, as they caught a lot of firepower on the left side. Embolden turned out to be awesome. I failed three leadership tests and passed them all with the re-roll.

Wraithlords were brutal. Any squad without a powerfist=epic win. Unfortunetly powerfists still get the better of it.

Runes of Warding are officially my favourite item after "Books of st.lucius". Librarian tried to teleport his squad, only to be stopped by the runes. The Librarian didnt get a power off all day.

Overall very happy with how the army played out. A little vulnerable on the home-objective holders which some armies could exploit, but otherwise I've got so many threatening units, attention can be diverted away from them
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: kyle vp on October 1, 2008, 08:40:20 AM
as soon as I get my 1500 pt list painted to a level I'm comfortable with not hiding, I'll get my run o' the mill list up for you.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on October 1, 2008, 08:45:37 AM
   Thank you kyle, waiting for this eagerly. If you get over or under the 1500 pts level it is okay too, we need list list from all range of points, so feel free to come up with any list you are actually comfortable with. ;)


   Hey Draza, glad that you did well. Now that you had a couple of games you may get the feeling of how the (Fortuned) Wraithguard are hated by many would be opponents - sure that mine are.
   As you witnessed, WG usually last most games, unless they get charged by multiples of high STR Power Weapons/MCs and well, they are supremely resilient against shooting, just be wary of multi pie plate throwers.

   Yes, staying out of Assault distance from a Terminator packed LR is annoying, especially if the other player is good at evaluating range since the LR/Termie pack actually outrange the move/shoot bubble of the Wraithguard, but hey, that's why you have the WG in the Serpent.

   The Runes of Warding are great, I never leave them home if I expect to face psychers (and especially NOT for a tourney) - Once in a tournament (4th ed) the RoW took two PotW wounds from a Doomed DP and one from a Sorcerer and that in only two Turns of casting. ;D

   I find that the Rangers/Pathfinders need extra attention with Deployment now, due to the proliferation of Outflanking units. Best way to keep them relatively safe is to try for a more central setup.

   Thanks to have shared the results of those matches, and keep us updated if you pursue in the Wraithbone ways. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: f.desrochers on October 3, 2008, 08:51:36 AM
Starky,

A couple of lists I have been playing with since 5th edition seem to be holding up well as an all-comers list.  I've included the 2 versions at 1700 and one at 2000.

List 1: 1700 points (3 Scoring Units, 9 Kill Points)

Headquarters
210 - Elder Farseer (Eldrad)

Elites
206 - 8 Harlies (all with Kisses) and Shadowseer

Troops
396 - Wraithguard x 10 w/ Spiritseer (Enhance)
292 - Dire Avengers x 10 w/ Exarch (shimmershield, Bladestorm), Wave Serpent (shuricans, vectored engines, spirit stones)
140 - Guardian Defenders x 10 w/ EML, Warlock (Conceal)

Fast Attack
174 - Warp Spiders x 6 w/ Exarch (deathspinners, powerblades, Withdraw)

Heavy Support
140 - Wraithlord (brightlance, wraithsword, twin flamers)
140 - Wraithlord (brightlance, wraithsword, twin flamers)

List 2: 1700 points (3 Scoring Units, 10 Kill Points)

Headquarters
125 - Farseer (Guide, Fortune, spirit stones)

Elites
206 - 8 Harlies (all with Kisses) and Shadowseer

Troops
396 - Wraithguard x 10 w/ Spiritseer (Enhance)
292 - Dire Avengers x 10 w/ Exarch (shimmershield, Bladestorm), Wave Serpent (shuricans, vectored engines, spirit stones)
140 - Guardian Defenders x 10 w/ EML, Warlock (Conceal)

Fast Attack
174 - Warp Spiders x 6 w/ Exarch (deathspinners, powerblades, Withdraw)
60 - Vyper (shurcan, spirit stones)

Heavy Support
140 - Wraithlord (brightlance, wraithsword, twin flamers)
140 - Wraithlord (brightlance, wraithsword, twin flamers)

List 3: 2000 points (3 Scoring Units, 12 Kill Points)

As List 2 plus the following:

Elites
Striking Scorpions x 10 w/ Exarch (biting blade, Shadowstalker), Wave Serpent (shuricans, vectored engines, spirit stones) (Note: Obvious Outflanking unit here...)

Comments: Overall I much prefer using Lists 2 and 3, partly because Eldrad is still a little new to me.  His ability to redeploy has helped immensely in a couple of games, where I deploy the Wraithlords out in the open to dictate enemy deployment (particularly vehicles) and then at the very least be able to move them out of danger.  Most notably, the Avenger Wave Serpent takes a beating every game and usually crashes, though not until turns 4+ and typically after depositing the Avengers into some snug terrain before going off the block LOS or help elsewhere.

So far after several games against a number of opponent (IG, DH (w/ IG), Sisters and Chaos) it holds out well.  Still getting some of the 5th edition kinks out of the way though. <sigh>

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: kyle vp on October 5, 2008, 03:35:49 AM
I'll repost this later with pictures once all the models are up to snuff.  In the meantime, here is my 2k pt list.
ELETES
Autarch (128)Reaper Launcher, Scorpion Chainsword, Banshee Mask, Warp Jump Generator.  (this could be a place where I'll trim some, cutting the chainsword)
Eldrad (210) (I've tried replacing him with a farseer, but they just don't have anywhere near his durability.  Though it WOULD almost pay for another troop unit alone to drop him down to one, which I may experiment with further.)
ELETES:
Wraith Guard (355) Guard X5, basic warlock + conceal, spirit stones + star engines.
TROOPS
Wraith Guard(396)10xguard, 1 spirit seer, conceal
pathfinders(120)5 pathfinders.
FAST ATTACK
Warp Spiders (174)5 spiders, + 1 Exarch, spinneret Rifle, Power blades (might ditch these), withdraw.
Swooping Hawks (173) 5 hawks, 1 exarch, intercept, skyleap, sunrifle.
HEAVY SUPPORT
Dark Reapers  (224)2 reapers, 1 exarch, tempest Launcher, Crack shot.
Wraith Lord   (120) Flamers, Wraithblade, Scatter Laser (really debating if I want to ditch the blade for a catapult... but it looks so freaking cool!)
D Cannons (100) 2x distort cannons 4 crew.

TOTAL: 2000 pts





There is definitely a shortage of models, but that is always true of Lists.  I'd also reeeeealy like to figure out a way to get another scoring unit.  (another 5 rangers would do fine, or a squad of defenders.)  I just don't want to cut back anymore on the hawks or warp spiders. 

well, like I said, there will be pictures later.

The autoarch goes with the warp spiders.  eldrad typicially runs with the foot sloggers.  The warp spiders use the wraith guard for cover, as does the wraith lord (as needed)  The use of the sunrifle is debatable as the hawks spend alot of time in the air, particularly against swarm armies.  I just really like the pinning.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on October 5, 2008, 05:50:07 AM
Hi guys, I'm late on posting here, sorry about that. Thanks for the lists - I'd ask for pics of the Armies but then I am myself guilty of laziness and lack of priorisation myself for my own, so I won't insist - for now. ;)

@françois: I tend to agree with you, I prefer list two over list one, but probably just because it looks more like my own preferences, each his own I guess. I like the Wraithblades, combined with the Harlies hitting power it makes a scary prospect for CC.
   That I there's some 3th ed lingering loathing of named characters at the LGC, so I don't usually push Eldrad down their collective throat, but the character is great - two Fortune a Turn is just too good, that and Divination. But since we do not lose our Farseers to PotW as easily now I feel they arevery good by themselves.

   List three is real nasty CC wise, I like that. That and the Contesting opportunities and capability to tie up a flank while the main force close that that fully kitted Scorpion unit gives. I didn't play Scorpions yet in 5th ed, surely a thing to look into.

@kyle vp: Thanks kyle for the list, it sure is different of what we are used to see for an Iyanden force, and certainly not my style but if it works for you I say go for it. I personally feel that a lot of small units are easy prey to KP games - except the Hawks and Pathfinders.
   Another thing: You forgot to add the Wave Serpent on the Elite Wraithguard entry. I like that unit, use it all the time myself, although it sure eat up a lot of points! The best way to use it that I found so far when working as a stand alone unit is to take an IC aboard with them, for CC goodness and/or for the capability to strike at different targets.

   For the Wraithlord I would keep the Blade since your force is weak in CC, so you need all possible support in that regard. I'd like if you could make a rundown of your usual tactics with the list what are your usual opponents, since frankly the combination of units in your force is out of my experience.

Thanks both of you.


   On another note, I just finished that small banner, trying to come up with a larger selection for our POC members, as not everyone are turned on by the Black & White we have actually.
   That's new for me and I'd apreciate for you to comment/make suggestions how it could be made better looking. Now that I've posted it, it seems a bit short for me, I may try to lenghten it...

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/IyandenBannerStarky3-1-1.png (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/IyandenBannerStarky3-1-1.png)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2FIyandenBannerStarky3-1-1.png&hash=e4f96e32cacbe67a3a8b1579674d639ef3a5174b)

   Starky
   
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: kyle vp on October 5, 2008, 08:20:31 AM
oops,  thanks. didn't notice that I left the wave serpent off, I'll add that in there.

as far as tactics:  yes, I don't like the smaller squads so much.  they get maxed if I go to a 2500 pt game, which is what we normally play. (fill out the missing spiders, and rangers, and add another unit of foot slogging wraith guard).

Most people run with a seer council, so I strike that from my list.  Same with harlies.  I do have the models for a seer council on bikes, but that is prohibitively expensive with wraith guard. 

Targets for small arms, are rangers,  the d cannons, the reapers, or the warp spiders.  And we all know how difficult it can be to get small arms to long range weapons.  The warp spiders hang out mostly nearby my wraithguard and use them for cover if there is no hard cover to be found.

The fast wraith guard, and the swooping hawks provide incredible mobility.  If I get out flanked, there are plenty of nasty options to deliver to the scene of the crime.  When my rangers, d cannons, or reapers draw enemy units away from their main force, these are the figures that clean them up.

The long ranged stuff, is as often used for bait as anything else. I put them in an obscure corner of the table (or two scenario permitting)  that lets them get some good shots off, and force the enemy to deploy forces in that direction, or just suck it up.  It takes a good sized force to close the distance to them though without getting too chewed up to be effective. As often as not they get outright ignored.  If someone DOES get close,  my swooping hawks pay a visit.

Eldrad stays with my main wraith guard squad(s) (2 if I'm running 2500)

The warp spiders provide fire support, and do a reasonable job of supporting in cc.

In general, my non wraith army focuses on the two biggest weaknesses of the guard.  Mobility, and range.

I may eventually combine the points in the d cannons with the points in the reapers one way or the other, as they serve the same purpose.  but whenever that reaper squad gets too big, people focus on it.

Killing off the hawks is a definate weakness.  If someone goes for the kill point on the reapers they are welcome to them.  Strategicly they have to split their army to do it, or they have to dedicate long range weapons (usually the only stuff capable of dealing with the ghosts).

I've been thinking of dropping the hawks down to a minimum squad and beefing up the warp spiders, as they spend more and more of their time in the air these days.  The only time they get much ground time is against horde armies, or tau.


My primary opponents are space marines, tau (one fire war. list, one mech list), and eldar.

If there are more specific strategic questions you have, perhaps I can give better answers.  So far this list has been working very well for me.  It isn't quite what I ran in 4th, the d cannons were a transport case decoration then.   Now days it is my ladies, council, dire avengers, guardian defenders, fire dragons, prism tanks, falcon, and vypers that are lining the bottom trays.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on October 5, 2008, 01:20:45 PM
   I wondered where was your CC might in the list, now that you say that you usually play at the 2500 pts range where you usually have a Council I understand better.
   I like the idea of long ranged bait unit, being just enough a threat to be dangerous but keeping them just small enough to wonder if they are worth the effort to be dealt with.

   So, I believe that once you are done with this one, your next task will be to eventually post that 2500 pts list of yours. I hereby and unilaterally declare that there will be a 2250 pts and 2500 pts lists to be added to the compilation.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: kyle vp on October 5, 2008, 09:55:41 PM
I really have had fine success with the warp spiders as a cc support.  I know they aren't what you'd normally want, but I make heavy use of withdraw, and make sure the enemy is tied up with the wraith guard before I let them lose.  Add to that, anything that gets to cc is going to have suffered some pretty heavy losses to firepower and it helps.  Lastly the wraith lord is no slouch.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: kyle vp on October 24, 2008, 11:55:27 AM
I know that we are not supposed to double post, but this is buried a bit and no one would see if I edited.

I promised my 2500 pt army once I got it close to painted, so here it is.
Eldrad
Farseer: doom, fortune, stones
Warlocks X3, jet bikes, destructor X3.

Harliequins : 5 regular, 1 shadowseer, 1 troop master: all with kiss.
wraithguard 5, 1 warlock w/ enhance.  wave serpent: stones and star engines. TL EML

Wraithguard 10, 1 spiritseer w/ conceal
Wraithguard 10, 1 spiritseer w/ embolden
Guardian Jet bikes X3

warp spiders X 7 + 1 exarch w/ dual spinners, withdraw
Swooping Hawks X4 + 1 exarch w/ sunrifle, skyleap

Wraith Lord w/ sword + scatter laser
Support weapon platforms X2 w/ d-cannons

I have made a couple changes to my list from what it used to be.  I added the harliquins, cut the warlocks in half and gave them bikes.   I have yet to see how this will play out, but I want to try it.  If it fails the warlock squad will be back to foot slogging.  the idea is to have two very difficult to crack nuts, and very mobile support to react to wherever the bulk of the opposing army heads.  The support weapons platform I beefed up to two, because I had two battles where they just handed away kill points.... and taking them out of my list isn't an option because I take them as my trademark. (if it weren't for that, they'd be gone and the warlocks / harlies would be beefed with the points... or perhaps another wraith lord. Hard to say!)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on October 25, 2008, 09:05:51 AM
Nice list Kyle, a crapload of deadly Wraith warriors, very themed, me likes, although I find it a bit light in CC but then the local LGC players tend to sports lots pf CC specialists, so I may be biaised.

I really need to update stuff for the Iyanden Big List Project... :-[  Will you be able to provide pics of your force(s) soon? I will do mine this weekend and update/edit the pics into my own posts of Lists.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: kyle vp on October 25, 2008, 10:58:24 AM
My camera battery had an accidental collision with the floor and failed its save... so no more pictures until I replace it.  (hopefully it is just the battery).  The fun money part of my next paycheck is already allocated, hopefully the one after that will allow for a new camera or camera battery as appropriate ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Sanctjud on October 25, 2008, 11:40:31 AM
Fool, you should look into a Camera with a FNP save, they rock!

Or a Wraithcamera with T6+.

-Sanct bringing the plague to the toughy dead Eldar.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on October 28, 2008, 07:32:11 PM
Sanctjud, Wraithguard are > than Deathguard, live with it.


Some news, there's those brand new batreps on the Batrep Board for those taht are interested:
Starrakatt VS moc065 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=171715.0)
Starky's Campaign (still in progress) (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=169308.0)

BTW, we are still waiting for your's Two Hawks! ;)

Also, we have a CHALLENGE: (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=171134.msg2099012#msg2099012) Come up with one or more Iyanden themed, competitive Top Tier List(s), as some people out there think we aren't competitive enough, so lets discuss and post suggestions here, right?

Quote from: Gutstikk
Some simply stuff to keep in mind.
Enemy in cover aren't gonna die to shooting easily, so ignore it where possible
-Enemy with good armor saves are best handled in combat
-You can't have too many KPs or you won't win big enough
-You have to have a strong showing in troops or you won't win big enough
-Given the choice of first or second it's probably easier to plan on going second
-Reserves are always available, but only our mobile units benefit from this
etc., etc.

   So we have to come up with a Iyanden flavored list(s), something easily recognisable by any opponent familiar with Craftworld Eldar but that can kick arses all over the place:
- Yriel is a good grab
- Wraithguard as Troops or at least two Elite choices
- Wraithlords are welcome, although not necessary
- Mass Guardians are a no-no
- Lists should be at the 1500pts, 1750pts and 1850pts, as per the different Official Tourney Lists.
   So lets do it guys, we have one (if not THE one) of the best Eldar Troop in the Codex, lets prove it!

   Starky


EDIT!

Next Monday, 6:00 PM East Time: Starrakatt VS Gutstikk game on Vassal, where we shall try underrated units from the Eldar Codex in a 1750 pts Epic Battle!

[cackle madly]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on October 29, 2008, 10:27:10 AM
I was pretty sure that you booked that time slot vs me... there Starky, or are you planning on taking a beating from two sides at once...

Hay, a 3 way or 4... could be cool too.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Spiritwarroir on October 29, 2008, 12:19:07 PM
One thing that I have been trying is Serpent full of Wraith Guard with enhance and a full unit of Spears with Autarch.  this is my fast flank unit.  Any one tried this?  The only game I have played was with a SM who did not understand consentation of fire and I went right thought him like the Blood Hands Spear tough an ork.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on October 29, 2008, 12:35:04 PM
   That's a combo I see working very well, that is if you can manage to keep these Spears alive: LOS blocking Cover need to be available, that or maybe a Fortuneseer in the Serpent as backup.

   I say that because an experimented player will see the threat coming and be extra careful about that setup.
   Ideally, I believe that another unit in either a Falcon (Dragons with Yriel or Fusion Gun Autarch) or a Serpent (maybe Avengers, Storm Guardians with flamers or a strong CC unit like Banshees or Scorpions) should accompany the Wraithguard and Spears to make a very hard hitting flank Hammer, while the remaining of your force pound the enemy with long range firepower.

   I think a pair of Wraithguard squads in Serpents can form the basis of a very Iyanden themed force, either mixed Mech/Infantry or Full mechanized.

   I would suggest you to try out different combinations on that them and tell us how it did came up in the end. Thanks for the suggestion, surely something worth to be investigated.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Two Hawks on October 30, 2008, 04:15:11 PM
Sorry it took so long, I've been looking for a job.

Anyway here's my 1000 pt. list I used against orks..

HQ-Farseer w/ Fortune & RoWard.       100
Troop-Wraithguard(10)                       350
          Spiritseer w/ Conceal                 46
Troop-Dire Avengers(6)                       72
          Ex. w/ Dual cats & B.S.              44
          W.S. w/ Shur. Cannons             100
Fast Attack-Warp Spiders(5)                110
          Ex. w/ Spinneret Rifle & WD       54
Heavy-Wraithlord w/ Starcan. & 2         120
          Flamers

Total: 996 pt.

I can't get my software to work right, I do have Pics. I'll post some when I get it working.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Spiritwarroir on October 31, 2008, 11:56:11 AM
Here Is the army I am looking at.
ARMY Base 1430 points
Anvil
399 Wraith Guard *10 Spiritseer with sining spear and conseal
60   Dire Avengers *5
60   Dire Avengers *5
120 Wraith Lord with Twin Flamers, Wraith Sword, and Scatter Laser
155 Wraith Lord with Twin Flamers, EML. Bight Lance
Hammer
374 Wraith Guard *5 Spiritseer with Sining Spear, Enhance
       Wave Serpent with Scatter Laser, Shrunken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Star Engines.
237 Shining Spears *5 Exarch with Star lance, Withdraw, Skilled rider.
133 Autarch on jetbike, Banshee mask, Laser lance, Fusion gun
At 1500
27 Upgrade Dire Avengers Exarch and Defend/Shimmershield
27 Upgrade Dire Avengers Exarch and Defend/Shimmershield
or
60 add 5 Dire Avengers
or
66 Jet Bikes *3
At 1850
262 Warp Spiders *10 Exarch with Death spinner, power blades, withdraw
51 Upgrade Dire Avengers Exarch, Defend/Shimmershield, and 2 Dire Avengers
or
270 Harlequins *10 with Kisses, one Fusion Gun, And Shadow Seer
27 Upgrade Dire Avengers Exarch and Defend/Shimmershield
27 Upgrade Dire Avengers Exarch and Defend/Shimmershield
or
320 Viper*3 Holo-fields*3, EML*3,Spirit Stones *2
or
100 Farseer Doom, Mind War
110 Jet Bike *5
110 Jet bike *5
At 2000
262 Warp Spiders *10 Exarch with Death spinner, power blades, withdraw
270 Harlequins *10 with Kisses, one Fusion Gun, And Shadow Seer
42   Upgrade Dire Avengers Exarch, Defend, and Shimmershield
or
399 Wraith Guard *10 Spiritseer with sining spear and conseal
160 FarSeer with fortune, doom, mind war, runes of witnessing, spirit stones.

I don't know how competitive it will be but the list works as a genrealist List
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Ltbob on November 1, 2008, 11:27:44 AM
Hello everyone. I have been on 40konline for sometime my old name is the-one-tree. I'm in the process of trying to retrieve my old password. Unfortunatley my email that was attached to that account no longer exists. Forgot my password to boot and I rebuilt my Pc so I'll use LTbob for now.

Here's a list i"m toying with fielding soon. Need to get my hands on 4 more wraithguard though. The theme is warp related paraphernalia with the Iyanden scope.

When I have everything together and painted I'll post a pic here.

HQ

Farseer with fortune , Eldritch storm , spirit stones  – 125
Farseer with fortune , Eldritch storm , spirit stones  - 125

250

Troop

10 Wraithguard with Spirit seer, conceal  – 396
10 Wraithguard with Spirit seer, conceal  – 396

792

Elites

5 Harlequins  with kisses 2 with fusion pistols - 130
1 Shadowseer with kisses 
1 troupe master with kisses (or power weapon not sure)
(220)

Fast

7 Warp Spiders with 1 exarch (12), powerblades (10), withdraw (15), dual death spinner (5),  – 218
7 Warp Spiders with 1 exarch (12), powerblades (10), withdraw (15), dual death spinner (5),  – 218

436

Heavy

3 D-cannons

1848
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 3, 2008, 12:07:37 AM
@Two Hawks: Interesting list, in the sense of seeing a lot of small units instead of bigger ones, although it should be expected at such low pts level. I found that at the 1000-1200 pts a full Wraithguard unit can make or break a battle, as there is few things that can take out these at low pots level.

Keep it up, waiting for the pics and batrep. ;)


@Spiritwarroir: Some interesting variations in there too. I didn't experiment wit small/naked squads yet, so I can't tell but it would/will need some LOS blocking Cover to keep them alive.
About the Singing Spear: I wouldn't give one to the 10 strong Wraithguard as any and all Witchblade attack is well need in case these will get in Assault (and it WILL happens), especially VS Walkers and other vehicles. The Spear in the Serpent borne unit is alright, although I myself prefer the Witchblade there too, but then you give them that Shinning Spear escort, so that extra attack is less necessary.
Pray give us some results on how you fared with these variant in future games.


@Ltbob/the-one-three: I PMed to you about your account problem, best is to PM a Global (try Mr.Peanut) and/or try to get Rasmus to take care of it. You could also post your problem in the Suggestions, Bugs and Comments forum (bottom of the main page), seems that it worked for some who had similar problems as yours. ;)

So.

Nice list, although a bit weak in the long range department for a take all comers approach. On the other hand, TWO bloody squad of Wraithguard Running around should get to Armor quite quickly.
Also, I would take the Power weapon for the Troupe Master, Rending is too unreliable to count on and you have all the anti-MC needed with the Wraithguard without need that extra Kiss.
Now get these Wraithguard, paint them and post away, can't seem to get enough of painted awesomeness for our Craftworld. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: madelmo on November 3, 2008, 01:49:28 AM
i personally love having a destructor-powered warlock in a serpent-borne unit. you'll be more likely to disembark close enough to use it soon after you get the unit on their feet

but you reallly can't go wrong with any! go IYANDEN powa
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 3, 2008, 08:26:58 AM
First of all, time for some Official Welcomes in there:
- For the-one-three/Ltbob: Welcome back to the forum dude.
- Spiritwarroir: Official welcome in the POC, it hasn't been done yet.
- madelmo: Welcome to both 40K Online AND the Iyanden POC. If you want me to confirm your affiliation to Iyanden pray PM me so that I can officially add your name.

Quote from: madelmo
I personally love having a destructor-powered warlock in a serpent-borne unit. You'll be more likely to disembark close enough to use it soon after you get the unit on their feet
   Oh, I do whenever I get the points. Quite efficient as a contesting unit too, and putting a cheap Fusion Gun/Power Sword Autarch, Yriel or Jain Zar in there too create a brand new definition of the word 'Pain' - for your opponent that is.

   The only thing is that to protect such an investment in points you have to hide the Serpent behind LOS blocking Cover, that or they stay in Reserve. Of course it is not a problem with a Dawn of War deployment. Just keep in mind that Star Emgines are a must if you keep that Serpent in Reserve due to the extra distance.

Quote
go IYANDEN powa
Indeed! We Rule!

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on November 3, 2008, 01:17:45 PM
Hey everyone, just want to let you all know that I'm not dead.  Jees its been so long since I posted on here, but I thought id say Hi and let you all know whats going on and why I havent been posting much anywhere.

At the moment I am training as a Police Officer which is pretty much a full time thing, then when im not doing that Im at university where ive just had 5 assessments piled onto me last week most of them due in the next few weeks.

Im also playing American football which takes up Thursdays and Sundays so I have absolutly no time to myself.  Right now id love nothing more than to play, paint and buy all things warhammer but Im just so tired and weighed down to do anything.  But I promise to be back and productive in the christmas hols when everything slows down and each day drags blissfully on. 

Starky, I havent forgotten about my waveserpent thread... that will be the first thing I get finished when I get back into the flow dont worry.  And I think I will also start up some other threads for this project board because that was good motivation last time.

See you all soon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Ltbob on November 3, 2008, 07:33:28 PM
Here are some picks of the amry in progress I havve to repair a dcannon and one of my harlies. I've also got 5 WG coming in the mail, and the old rouge trader farseer as well that i'm going to paint up for this list. I apologize if the picks aren't the best. I got think about the list I may max out the warp spider squad and put in a sniping wraithlord.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi290.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fll258%2FLt-bob%2Farmy.jpg&hash=18c22a8f258b14f4e9046fde4a79cd02bf93b49a)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi290.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fll258%2FLt-bob%2Fwarpspiders.jpg&hash=3f193ddd31f4de2ff907a2700f03f610b0c02526)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi290.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fll258%2FLt-bob%2Fwg.jpg&hash=0a2db60926152a29ad95300642e5913f3701c5eb)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: madelmo on November 3, 2008, 08:05:20 PM
awesome spiders there!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Ltbob on November 3, 2008, 08:12:02 PM
Thanks they still need a bit of work yet, I'm gonna be doing an image on the warp packs, but not sure what yet.

thanks LTbob, aka the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Sanctjud on November 3, 2008, 08:23:09 PM
Very nicely uniform.

Though the fallen harlies look like a WIP, but a bit too far to say.

My 7 Cents.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 3, 2008, 11:19:03 PM
Nice paint job there, I like the contrasting colors, interesting pattern there. I would like to have a closer look of the Support Batteries and of the Warlock if at all possible. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: madelmo on November 4, 2008, 04:00:13 AM
i'm adding a great deal of spiders in my upcoming army, they sure look awesome in nice numbers like that. are you planning on using them all in your army? how many points is that?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Ltbob on November 4, 2008, 06:39:31 AM
I'm using at least 10 of the spiders in my list. I'll get a couple more pics up tonight. I'll try and get some better shots of those support batteries.

thanks,
Ltbob, the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Spiritwarroir on November 4, 2008, 11:07:19 AM
I am going to to play an Apocalypse game with a Spirit Host.
Here is what I am have to play with max points is 2000
Wraith Lord with Sword Bright Lance           125
Wraith Lord with Sword Scatter Laser          120
Wraith Lord with Scatter Laser                    110
Wraith Lord with Scatter Laser EML             135
Wraith Lord with Scatter Laser EML             135
Wraith Lord with Scatter Laser Bright Lance 150
Wraith Lord with Bright Lance Star Cannon  160
Wrath Guard*10                                        399
         Spirit Seer Conceal Sining Spear
Wrath Guard*5                                         221
         Spirit Seer Enhance Witch Blade
Wrath Guard*5                                         221
         Spirit Seer Enhance Witch Blade
Wave Serpent with Cannon upgrade, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines, TL Bright Lances
                                                               175
Wave Serpent with Cannon upgrade, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines, TL Scatter Lasers
                                                               155
Spirit Seer *3 Sining Spears*3 Enhance, Conceal, Destructor
Now this cost 2268 points so I need some help trimming down, any Ideas?
It has to be ready by the 8th.
PS I also have a Kit-bashed Nightwing that I would love to play with at 285
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 5, 2008, 12:00:19 AM
Usually Apoc are 3000+, so I guess you'll play with allies.

   Do not forget that you still need 2 Troop and 1 HQ choice, so first step would be to make 2 Full Troop squads of Wraithguard (save 46 pts), which kinda make both Serpents obsolete (save 330 pts). With these pts you could buy a basic Fortuneseer (85 pts) which would get you at 1999 pts (if your numbers are correct).

   Any further adds are to start removing Wraithlords. Also, with the Advent of 5th ed Apoc changed quite a bit, needing Troops to hold objectives. Now full armored companies and horde os tanks and MCs aren't an auto-win button anymore. ;)


WE already have the Iyanden Big List project, but Gutstikk started a new Project: Make a Tourney Winner list from each Craftworld, there is the original post:
Quote from: Gutstikk on November  4, 2008, 10:52:08 AM
I'm starting the competitive craftworld project with the help of others. I'd like our part, as a POC of no specific craftworld, to be developing a list that can compete at top-tier tournament levels without regards to specific craftworld fluff. I know a lot of our members are not competitive players. However, having used our 1k list on a non-standard terrain environment, I feel it has potential, and I think we can rise to this challenge.

Follow this link to give me a hand:

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2104862#msg2104862 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2104862#msg2104862)

No need to discuss a single list here till we've come up with quite a few in that other thread, but we'll eventually discuss which list we want to see as the most competitive list possible within this thread.
   If any of you have experience in Tourney/Highly Competitive list building (or not but have ideas - Best way to take experience) here is what is our task: Try to come up with some easily recognisable as Iyanden and Top Tier tournament lists, the kind that can Win a GT.

So lets post and discuss lists and suggestions in the Thread for Competitive Lists - 1750 pts (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2104862#msg2104862). We are Iyanden, mean and nasty - Lets DO IT!

   Starky

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Ltbob on November 5, 2008, 06:35:35 PM
Here are those pics I promised. Figuered I'd toss some pics in of my finished skimmers. minus the turrests on some. I made up the prisms for the others in the back. I made up my own stands for the skimmers and magnatized them. Its great for clean up and they are nice and stable.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi290.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fll258%2FLt-bob%2FDSCN3745.jpg&hash=c213ca31e06c8b445bead125fd430966cd8e6fc8)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi290.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fll258%2FLt-bob%2FEarthHour002.jpg&hash=8568b13f6b21a82a4f40155fbf286390270ba1d2)

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: madelmo on November 5, 2008, 09:38:28 PM
wow i'm a big fan of those bases for your skimmers! is that wood?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Ltbob on November 5, 2008, 09:47:24 PM
Ya I built a dresser for my wife last year. I had some scrap Ash from the drawer boxes I used for the bases I used my miter saw to cut them to size then painted and flocked them. I used pine for the pegs and screwed it down rather then glueing it, put a screw in the bottom of the skimmer, then used a rare earth magnet to magnatize them.

thanks
the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: madelmo on November 5, 2008, 09:49:43 PM
yea good call on the magnets! i'm trying to outfit my skimmers/wraithlords with magnets so i can swap the weapons between games/army lists. any advice on places to get magnets that best work for this purpose?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Ltbob on November 5, 2008, 09:58:33 PM
The magnets I got were from princes auto they were a little large for magnatizing weapons. You could try ebay. A friend of mine found a seller in australia on there that had all kinds of sizes. I don't recall them name though. I'm sure you could do a search and find it though.

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on November 6, 2008, 10:23:36 PM
Ah excellent, I got my original account back. three cheers for Mr.Peanut

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 9, 2008, 03:58:01 PM
Mr. Peanut is excellent at his job, a (usually) polite fellow too - except in the Tavern, but that is another story. :)

And I wish to announce the nominations of kyle vp and Two Hawks that just joined the ranks of the mighty Wraithguard, may they enforce Iyanden's Rule everywhere they go.

Congrats for the promotion guys. :)

@Valar: You do know that I am waiting for you to finish those Iyanden Painting Guide to spank you with a promotion, right? Now get to work and make us proud! (I know, waiting for Christmas vacations...)

On another topic, who amongst us have participated to official GW Tourneys/events in 3th, 4th and 5th ed with Iyanden armies? By official I mean: Games Day, Golden Daemon, Grand Tournament, Rogue Trader, Hall of Heroes, things like that.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on November 9, 2008, 09:53:36 PM
I have participated in RTT and Hall of heroes tourneys, with Iyanden for a couple years now. Its an interesting army to play. Since the release of the latest codex people cringe when you field wraithguard. the added toughness makes them extremly hard to dislodge and Yriel as a special charcter in my opinion is one of the best in the game.

There have been interesting debates in the past as to what is a true Iyanden force. I haven't quite decided the exact critiria myself.

So far I haven't tried pure Iyanden in tourney play , but have been considering lists with 20 wraithguard for some time now, especially now that I have the models for it.

On a side note. Wraithguard are great for taking out or slowing down reaver titans in Apoc games.

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Spiritwarroir on November 10, 2008, 08:49:07 AM
Just had an Apocalypse game this weekend.  I ran a 7 Wraith Lord Spirit Host, flank marched right into a Big Mech Stommpa and killed it. Then went on a rampage in tho the space marines, sometimes know no fear bites you in the butt.  Will add more latter
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Two Hawks on November 10, 2008, 09:55:05 AM
Here's a pic of my 1000 pts doing battle with Greenskins.
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2722.jpg (http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2722.jpg)
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2705.jpg  (http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2705.jpg)
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2723.jpg (http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2723.jpg)
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2724.jpg (http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2724.jpg)
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2725.jpg (http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2725.jpg)
http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2726.jpg (http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll5/Two_Hawks/100_2726.jpg)
The game didn't go very well for me (outnumbered 3:1).
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 10, 2008, 10:53:02 AM
@the-one-tree: I believe that if at least any three of the specific Iyanden themes are featured you can begin to talk about of an Iyanden themed force, i.e Wraithguard (Troop/Elite), Wraithlords, Yriel and Spiritseers.
   Below 1750 pts I wouldn't even dream of fielding two WG units as Troops as you begin to throw competitiveness trough the window with so many pts tied into two units, but then it may depends of my own playstyle...

@Spiritwarroir: But did you WIN? And what about the Wraithguard? 8)

@Two Hawks: Ouch, I feel your pain even from here... Can you make a batrep of it, or at least a resume so that I can incorporate it to the Batrep List? And besides,  I am curious on how the game went, which units performed and so forth...

   Keep it up guys,

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on November 11, 2008, 09:10:37 PM
OK so ive been wanting to post some pics of my army for quite some time now, and ive been wanting to contribute to the Iyanden community. so this weekend i promise to do my best to find a camera and take some quality pictures of my quality models.  Maybe even Write up a battle report of when i used my entire eldar force to whoop up on some Grey knights and tyranids inan apocalypse sized battle - but that may be pushing it.

O yeah, and, not that any one missed me, I am back.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 11, 2008, 10:35:27 PM
Well, I did. Welcome back cabbie22, glad to have you around again. ;)

Also, can't wait to see these pics. Reminds me to do mine... (kick my own lazy arse... :-[]

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Spiritwarroir on November 11, 2008, 11:58:28 PM
Yes I won. Two objective had 5 Wraith Guard on them, one was taken by Singing Spears and one had the Spirit host take it.  Started out with a 10 wraith guard unit, but the orks Rock 'em Boyz killed them all.  That hurt. 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Spiritwarroir on November 15, 2008, 11:29:08 AM
OK for all those people who say that Wraith Lords are to slow, show them this
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi381.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo256%2FEule-Nashoba%2FIMG_0539.jpg&hash=c0d242984a5e8bc1d9ab83f47b6e1255b406736b)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi381.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Foo256%2FEule-Nashoba%2FIMG_0559.jpg&hash=b8d4d07bfe53e167cc7b326872768c3d18cd95a8)



Now I made this monster but need some Ideas of how to use It in a game.  Any Ideas on the stat line?  Or what to stand in for?  Or just what It should do/have in the game.  So give me some ideas.

PS I hope this is the right place for this, I could not think of a more knowable group on all things wraith.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Seraph Tenacious on November 16, 2008, 02:16:54 AM
The only thing it really COULD stand in for is a wraith lord, or perhaps a autarch or farseer, providing that you backed it up with the explanation that the spirit of a farseer or autarch was within the wraithlord body.

 To be honest I really doubt a wraithlord would be inclined to ride a jetbike. Jetbikes require reflexes and hand-eye coordination, and wraithlords... dont... have.. eyes.  :-\   But since you already have it, try to make a bit of fluff about it. Such an unlikely instance requires a unique circumstance, so have fun and create one.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on November 18, 2008, 01:12:57 AM
that wraithlord is awsome!
i never would have thought of doing that..... ever.

nice work, maybe use him as .... um.... nadhu fire heart, from the old craft world eldar codex.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 18, 2008, 07:54:11 AM
I concur, nice work there. :)

For 'official' gaming he may count as a standard Wraithlord, I see no problem with that. For 'friendly' gaming that allow some leeway/custom rules or units, it could look like this:

- Wraithlord's stats with Wraithblade (Spear) and Brightlance.
- 12" move, 6" charge, ignore Difficult Terrain but have to test for Dangerous Terrain (like any bike/jetbike).
- Add a hefty amount of pts (maybe 50-70 pts?) for the extra move - after all, that is a FUN unit and better for him to be too pricey than less for the sake of peace in the game.

My take on it. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on November 18, 2008, 09:34:26 AM
I like the conversion onto the Vyper, and he could use as a standard Wraithlord as far as I am concerned... simply state that the drive is so heavy, old, and battle worn, that the the Vyper works almost like a "WheelChair" to allow him normal WL movement... "Counts as" Wraithlord as its definately size appropriate, Weapons feel right, and has the right sized base too.

CaHG

PS.. that might be a good Rabbaddun conversion for you Starky, give him a real WheelChair...

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 18, 2008, 11:46:51 AM
Mmmm, nice idea there, a robed Wraithlord for a dead Seer... With some kind of big Witchblade/Wraithsword/Spear or whatever...

I'll surely look into this. :)

A wheelchair, really...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on November 18, 2008, 11:57:45 AM
Yes, Rabbaddun is so old that he should get a wheelchair, and maybe even a little trailer to tote his mangled body parts around in... Besides being un-killable, all characters of such legandary proportions really do need to be unique to the extreme. PS, WheelChair could confer a +1 Toughness like a Jetbike - LoL (only slower)

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 18, 2008, 12:40:13 PM
I am convinced, I shall do an ugly, disfigured, one legged, tattered Farseer to represent the idiot Rabbadun. Dunno when but I'll put that into the ASAP things list.

I also happens to own a third non-assembled metal Wraithlord... As soon I put together the gaming room I'll look into this.

Eh-eh-eh...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on November 18, 2008, 01:42:49 PM
I have a couple of bastardized Wraithlords, Farseer's etc laying around, maybe Rabbaddun will simply happen to appear on your doorstep one morning... You never know... could be fun... I do like the Vyper ide up top though, that was serioulsy cool.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on November 19, 2008, 07:48:16 PM
I just had a great deal of fun playing a 20,000 point apoc game / side, with my 5k of Eldar and 15k of marines, versus 20k of nids. Unfortunatly we only got 2 turns done in like 9 hours, damn massed bugs. Flank marching the spirit host is nasty :). no titans either, just a couple haradules on the nid side and 2 trygons.

I wish I had of brought my digital camera for that game.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on November 21, 2008, 08:35:36 PM
20k just sounds rediculous to me man.  was is it just oyu and your opponent? i cant immagine trying to finish a game that huge with only two players.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on November 21, 2008, 09:55:37 PM
No it was 3 players on my side and 2 on the other, we woulda had 3 on 3 but one of the guys had to cancel

the-one-tree

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 24, 2008, 01:56:25 PM
   The biggest Apocalypse game I organised at the LGC was around 17K each side with something like 4/5 players teams - Note that it was end of 4th ed and there was TWO Iyanden lists in there, me and Kubrick54 (who haven't posted for more than a year on 40KO) for around 5K of Iyanden goodness, allied with Blood Angels and Mech IG VS Drop IG, two Necrons, T'au and Orks.
Superheavies featured - Our side: Eldar Scorpion, Baneblade. Their side: Necron Pylon, 2 Baneblades.

   In the entire evening - Players arrival at 5:30, last Turn scheduled for around 12:00 we managed to A) having only two players who haven't made lists yet when they came in and B) start it only 30 minutes late. :o In the end, we managed to get entire 4 Turns and finished at 11:15. WE could have played another Turn but some players chickened out, so we had to wrap it.

   We ended up winning 3 Objective vs 1 and 1 contested: 25 Wraithguard entered from Reserve in Flank March along with 1 Wraithlord and 2 Fortuneseers - They ended up destroying the 2 Baneblades and the Pylon, all of them left with almost no protection at the back.

   The sole Superheavy left at the end was the engine damaged Scorpion. Great game overall. I am trying to work out another one before '08 end's but it may get reported to January. We shall see. In any case, I'll make sure to take pics and write a batrep. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on November 24, 2008, 07:13:48 PM
Where you from btw starky?

Just curious.

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on November 24, 2008, 07:48:40 PM
Canada, Quebec (making me an East timer) and also French speaking, so if you all wondered from where my Grammar quirks were coming from, well now you do know. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on November 24, 2008, 09:30:54 PM
Ah toronto Ontario for me. Well hour and a half east of there really.

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: BubbaMack on December 4, 2008, 06:18:54 PM
I wanted to throw a quick hello out there to you all.  I am new to the forum and even newer to the Iyanden POC.  I have been playing 40K for about two years.  I started with IG and got my army up to around 10k before deciding I really wanted to play Eldar.  No one at my LGS did so figured I'd be on my own.  That's when I found you all.  I have been amazed at the wealth of knowledge present here.

I will post pics of my ex-Iyanden corsair force once they have been properly painted and all conversions have been completed.  I just dropped a ton o' cash on WHF Elf/Dark Elf bits and could just about buy stock in Green Stuff.  Fluff also to follow.

I look forward to conversing with you all.

-Bubbamack
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on December 4, 2008, 10:22:22 PM
Welcome, Bubbamack!

Eldar will be a very different army then your IG especially because your playing Iyanden, but perhaps maybe thats what you were going for. Lower model count hehe  ;). Painting 10k of Guradsmen Shudders  ::). Anyhow Good luck with your conversions and painting.

By the way don't get to discouraged if you have trouble winning at first when playing Eldar. they tend to be unforgiving, but can be incredibally lethal if used properly. Pm me or post here if you would like any army list examples. Be glad to offer them. and others would likely as well. Wraithguard = ebay is your friend, if you don't have any at the moment. anyhow Gl again

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on December 5, 2008, 06:43:46 AM
Just throwing this out there... as I do lurk in here too and noticed the ebay = cheap Wraithguard comment...

Try these too... Bartertown, 40konline trading section, or even ask locally as a lot of people that got wraithguard didn't like them and do wish to dump them... as they are not very forgiving (as the-one-tree mentioned)....

Good luck to all my brethren Eldar players, and you might also find that the "Guide for those just starting out with Eldar" thread has some useful info too. And your all welcome to share anything that you would like added to that thread... as it is always under re-construction and update thanks to "Uber Starky" and myself.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on December 5, 2008, 09:13:36 AM
Hi again BubbaMack, and a warm official welcome to the Iyanden POC! :) Feel free to ask if questions come to mind, we're here for that. Also, you said you had an, I quote: An 'Ex-Iyanden Corsair force' on the workbench, I'm curious to see your concept.

So, cya around and keep posting. (Yes, fresh meat!!!) :o

Quote from: moc065
...or even ask locally as a lot of people that got wraithguard didn't like them and do wish to dump them... as they are not very forgiving (as the-one-tree mentioned)....
Thanks for the comment moc, for incidentally, you reminded me that the other local Iyanden player (all painted traditionnal Iyanden, good tabletop quality, Kubrick54 here by name) is selling his Eldar stuff, so for anyone interested I may act as intermediary for a trade. Here's the stuff (I know, I'll try to get pics):
Quote
- Yriel
- Farseer W/ singing spear
- 4 Warlocks (2 withcblades, 2 singing spears)
- 12 guardians defenders W/ 2 platforms (scatter laser & brightlance)
- 16 Storm guardians (including 2 W/  flamers and 2 W/ fusion guns)
- 15 Wraithguard
- 10 Warp spiders (including Exarch)
- 3 War walkers W/ shuriken cannon / scatter laser
- 3 D-Cannon weapon platforms W/ crew
- 2 Wave serpent W/ twin-linked shuriken cannon
- Wraithlord W/ Brightlance / missile launcher
- Wraithlord W/ scatter laser / shuriken cannon
He ask 400$ CAN, can't bother to make the conversion in USD, price can be discussed (after seeing pics).

Quote
...and you might also find that the "Guide for those just starting out with Eldar" thread has some useful info too. And your all welcome to share anything that you would like added to that thread... as it is always under re-construction and update thanks to "Uber Starky" and myself.
Uber indeed. Thanks moc for taking care of my natural modesty. You also remind Me that I should kick My own Uber arse and get some tacticas written...

   Starky, Uber in His very natural and in-built Humility ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: BubbaMack on December 5, 2008, 09:40:19 AM
Thanks for the warm welcome guys.  ;D

My army is being based around Yriel's Raiders who after rescuing Iyanden, and being bestowed great honor, choose to split off from Yriel to further his attempts to restore the One True Craftword to it's previous glory.  Yriel has been know to reunite with them from time to time to fight an extra worthy foe.
As they are in a state of pseudo exile, they don't adhere to the strict disciplines of the aspect paths.  As such they wear uniforms of their own color.  Also as this force is composed of more pirate then citizen, all of my guardians have been converted with dark elf corsair heads, capes from the wood elf line, as well as various other bits from other races. 
I am in the process of expanding my Wraithguard as I only have two right now which are in the process of multiplying if you know what I mean.  I am not one to normally complain about GW's prices, but $150+ for one squad of anything is insane, and I am looking to have 4+ squads.  Also to stay with the fluff, I am staying away from mech/bike units.  I have several serpents but that's about all for mech.  I didn't think Falcons or Prisms really fit. 

Thanks One-Tree any lists would be appreciated if you think they might fit with the strange army I have created  ;).
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on December 5, 2008, 09:47:16 AM
$168.00 (10WG + Warlock) is not really that bad if you look at the 396pt game cost that accompanies it... Considering some other units are way more expensive $/Pt wise... But, I still got my 15 Wraithguard as cheap as I could over the Internet, and so far have less that $75.00 Cdn invested into them.... Trade and shop wise, and take your time, as good deals are out there.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Seer13 on December 5, 2008, 06:29:26 PM
I have today two games:

-first game vs chaos
My army(1400):
-Farseer(doom, runes of warding)+10 wraithguard, spiritseer, conceal
-5xpathfinders
-10x guardian, scatter laser, embolden
-10x storm guardian +flamer +fusion gun +destructor +spear +serpent(SC ,SS) +Autarch (mandiblaster, fusion, PW)
-6striking Scorpions +fist, stalker
-3xwar walker (6x SL)

His Army:
-2x demon prince of lash, 2x10xberserkers (one team in land rider, and one in rhino), 10x nurgle marines

He deploy first (rally tide formation), I put to reserve walkers and stormies in serpent.

First turn I seize the initiative. Wraithguards move toward enemy (bad idea), shooting phase nothing happen.
-chaos: land rider full speed to my Wraiths first, lash failure but second take my ancestors to assault range of berserker's, in combat I lost 4 Wraiths and he 2 berserker's.
Second Turn: walkers pass reserve roll but they only stunt rhino with second berserker squad, Stormie's failure to destroy land rider, one prince get 1 wonud, and second 3 wound, scorpions charge berserker's to help Wraithguards, I lost one scorpion, and only two berserker's left.
Chaos:second squad berserker's and two princes join the fight, he lost rest of his first berserker's, 3 from second squad and on wind on prince, I lost 3 scorpions (with fist one but they pass morale on double 1), no wraith lost, no wounds on prines.
Third turn: Nurgle marines shot 2 Stormie's, walkers immobile one rhino, in 2 turns of combat he lost one prince, second stay only on one wound, and I lost farseer, wraithguards, and scorpions.
Fourth turn: my Stormie's and guardians killed all 8 berserker's from shooting, pathfinders killed second prince and walkers shaken rhino.
Then nurgle marines assault poor Stormie's and kill them without mercy.
Last turn: serpent jump to nurgle marins near objective, and pathfinders run to second objective. So 1:0 for me.

Second Game
My Forces(1700):
Farseer(doom,fortune,both runes, SS)+10 wraithguard, spiritseer, conceal
-7xpathfinders
-10x guardian, scatter laser, embolden
-10x storm guardian +flamer +fusion gun +destructor +spear +serpent(SC ,SS) +Autarch (mandiblaster, fusion, PW)
-9xStricking Scorpions +fist, stalker,shadowstrke
-3xwar walker (6x SL)
-3xjetbike with SC, Doom and Singing Spear

My Enemy SM:
-Lysander, 10xVanguard(fist, 8x combi melta) in drop pod, 2x10xThunder hammer terminators, 10 x marines (fist, las cannon, flamer)in drop pod, 5x marines (fist, flamer)
Mission: kill points.
I start the game but stay in reserve like my enemy.
First turn-nothing happen only scouts land and split in 2x5,
Second turn:I pass only reserve for Wraithguard, jetbike and guardians.
Veterans drop and split then kill 10 guardians (warlock only left and survive the game)
Third turn: Stormie's destroy veterans drop pod and burn 3 veterans, then scorpions charge veterans in my turn I won 2:1, and in his turn I 3:0, two my jetbikes lost from bolter and las cannon. My pathfinders enter the battle from right flank, and walkers roll one on reserve. In his turn lysander and ten terminators teleport near my Wraithguard.
Fourth turn: doom on terminators, my jetbikes wraithguard and pathfinders kill 4 terminator and wound Lysander, and my stupid move I doesn't charge Terminators with my Wraithguards,Stormie's burn 4 marines (only fist left). His turn I lost from shooting 2 Stormie's and serpent, scorpion finish vets, his second terminators land, and first squad charge wraiths and pathfinders, I lost 3 Wraithguard and he lost one terminator, pathfinders run from combat.
Fifth turn: Doom on second squad of terminators, path finders pass morale and stay on battle, walkers enter battlefield from left flank and kill 2 marines(one with lascannon).
My scorpions, Stormie's with autarch and jetbikes  shoot and charge second squad of terminators and the disappear (exarch with fist was to late ant dosen' attacks). His marine with fist charge on the walkers and die.Fight with Lysanders terminators in progress.
Sixth turn: My Stormie's destroy second drop pod, scorpions move to help with lysander, his turn no need for help Wraithguards and Farseer die leaving only Lysander with one wound (long live for DOOM), his marines (two in one team and 4 in second) charge my walkers and lost one brother with no effect.
Seventh Turn: Lysander gets head shot from my path finders and die, Stormie's and walkers in close combat killed all marines.
I killed whole his army losing only 3 units.

Tips:
-If you see that Wraithguards will stay in bloody close combat always take fist attacks on warlock (farseer with fortune is must a have)
-Is better to charge than to be charged (enemy doesn't get bonus attack and furious charge)
-doom+plus flamers+destructor+deep striking terminators =lots of wounds

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Eothen on December 14, 2008, 02:41:57 PM
Hello!
I just thought I should throw in a quick message to show I'm back on the board. Hopefully Ill have more time for 40k now.

This is a sweet thread. I really liked some of the lists. And they'll come handy now that Im in the progress of remodelling my army so my support units will work under 5th ed rules and make my Wraith units shine. Hopefully I can get the gang up and running for some x-mas battling. :)

I've posted a thread on painting Wraithguards in the painting forum. If it's good enough for the project feel free to include it.

Take care!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on December 14, 2008, 05:48:25 PM
@Seer13: Thanks for sharing your experiences. As you says, Wraithguard needs support in the form of a good anti-horde backup as well as a hard hitting CC unit to keep them in the game and efficient/scoring for as long as possible.

@Eothen: Glad to have you back dude, it's been a long time. The Painting Thread (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=174857.0) you are working on is already linked to the Painting board, thank you very much for the contribution. Do you intend to follow up with some Wraithlord, grav tanks, Guardians or whatnot? :)

And what are your projects concerning your comeback at 40K, expending on your actual army and/or getting things done at last? (Khaine knows I myself have stuff needing to be done for a long time now...)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Eothen on December 15, 2008, 02:12:42 AM
Thx for the warm welcome. :)

Well, my army colour is primary red with a yellow support colour. It's just recently that a lot of stuff have gotten more yellow so they fit the Iyanden theme. So I don't think my guardians would be appropriate. At the moment it's mostly aspect warriors that's standing in line for painting. But I guess I could try to follow up with airbrushing article for a grav tank or a Wraithlord in the near future.

My army is still a 4th ed force and suffers from that. I'm working on getting enough Dire Avengers painted to stop relying on guardians, get another Waveserpent to mobilise my force and invest in some of the new Wraithlords. I'm still working on getting back on the right mix of Wraithguard wall and fast supportive units now that I have to include more troops. On the painting table right now are my Swooping haws, that at last are getting their due, and I'll hopefully finish that War walker squadron that have been half finished since the release of the Eldar codex.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on December 15, 2008, 09:19:00 PM
I like your paint scheme, continue the good work Eothen, can't wait to see more. Once you get enough stuff painted, what about posting an army along with pics in there? ;)

Also:
Quote from: Gutstikk on December 15, 2008, 10:30:11 AM
http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.0)

That's the thread, as I'm sure you all know. Take a look and see if there's any there your POC would like to tweak [if you don't already have one of your own you'll be going with]. Some of the lists have pretty good ideas that may need better execution while some use solid units but may be in need of a plan.

I hope to have discussion on refining each list [one per POC] within the POC threads by members of the group.

All I want for Christmas from each of you is a single army list, something that will show a bit of fluff as it hoses the enemy of the Eldar [and hopefully doesn't fail on comp/sportsmanship too much, though this should be expected as an Eldar player].

Everyone, if some tactics need to be considered with the list a simple write-up would be helpful, as I don't necessarily know who'll be fielding them.
So there it is, the closure of the Project is almost on us, there are the links to the different Iyanden themed forces that have been presented in the thread:
- List1, from the-one-three (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2106047#msg2106047)
- Lists 2, 3, 4 & 5 from Starrakatt (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2107133#msg2107133)
- List 6, from Gutstikk (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2112416#msg2112416)
- List 7, from moc065 - Eldrad make it less themed but oh well... (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2114382#msg2114382)
- List 8 & 9, from Starrakatt - Less themed but still relevant (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2124067#msg2124067)

So there are the lists that have been submitted, thread now closed. I'd like for us all to have a look at these to decide on what seems the best competitive list(s) in there and if these can be bettered in any way while still keeping it Iyanden themed.
In the end, we need to get a single one list that will be used in competitive gaming by Iyanden players VS any and all kind of opposition for the next weeks/months, so we better come up with the best o' the best!

   So? Lets discuss! ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on December 16, 2008, 11:09:15 AM
Wow, I actually had a list that made it into the Iyanden Home page.... I will also add that I specifically assembled the figures (WG) for this sort of list,... as WG were a key element to tournie victories in 4th Ed... I now have 15 WG (10 and 5 for units) and I actually really like them... And I still class them as my all time favoured Footslogger figure in the Eldar range...

Paint on them will soon be done, and I will even show them here if Starky lets me (too bad for you starky, I know you want to see them - so they will go up)... and the list I showed does lack in the Troops section (a third would help) as I now find it going for Draws more often than not; but it does still work very well vs everything aside from specific Tourny builds.

Good luck to you guys in the all things Eldar, Merry Christmas, and don't worry about Eldrad being seen as Unfluffy, the Space Marines just change their codex and story to suit their needs, so us Eldar can slide a little in this regard too.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Eothen on December 16, 2008, 03:26:45 PM
Here are my first impressions from comparing the lists.

After viewing all lists I found two things:
1) they all were fairly similar, relying on more CC than shooting, and more resilience than killing potential
2) Lacking in clean up close combat specialists.
I will address these two aspects by discussing Close combat specialist, the role of the Farseer and fire power.

Close combat expertise:Nearly every list was focusing on Yriel or other HQ close combat specialists as the only close combat threat. 2 lists, Starkys, included harlequins on foot and one list suggested striking scorpions on foot. My experience says that lots of stuff sticks to Wraithguard. Just cause no one have the power to kill them quickly and the WG lacks the power to kill of enemies quickly. To get the WG unstuck is a priority, as they have good guns and a moving unit is more threatening than a stuck unit. Therefore I would suggest a rapid response unit. A HQ can do this Job. But with limited success, as they seldom have the punch to clear a enemy unit and escape retribution. I think a close combat specialist unit like Banshees, Scorps, Harlequins in a transport or shining spears would be a good way to support the close combat character that every list likes to include. We need more speed and a safer way to shield this unit until It is needed than running it on foot. And we quicker results than relying on warlocks. Wraithlords can act as close combat support. But they have the same disadvantage as the WG, a low number of attacks. I haven't experimented with using two of these together, that could clear the area, but I find my WL with other tasks than to clear the way for the WG:s.

Farseer support: Every list was focusing on the lone Farseer with Doom/Fortune combo. Nothing wrong with this. Its what makes the WG troop so resilient. A few lists suggested Eldrad, I will ignore this, as he isn't fluffy, and just skip ahead to what I like to do with my Farseers. I like to include Guide in my lits, as this makes my shooting more leathal, and I find short range shooting spam (Esp St6) one important strongpoint in Eldar armies. Experimentation with a additional Farseer could be usefull here. Lika a Doom/Guide Farseer accompanying a Squad in a Waveserpent, leaving the other, perhaps with only Fortune, to concentrate on supporting the WG or a Council. Such a Farseer could make a Vyper Starcannon Squadron with its price, and help the Averngers or Guardians in the Serpent kill more when they disembark. (Im under the impression that he can cast psychics on things outside the transport. Correct me If I'm wrong here.)

Fire power: A fire power shortage is evident in several of the list. Only long range power is on rangers, WL:s or in a few cases on tanks. I would like to expand the Dire Avenger presence and the amount of fast shooters, like hawks and spiders, and long range shooters, like Warwalkers and Dark Reapers. Dark Reapers might be a bit to far, as I don't like Eldar stuff that don't move. But you get the point. Eldar strength should be in the capacity to deal overwhelming damage to the chosen point of the battle field. Iyanden exchanges this to the strength to sustain heavy damage. But I still feel that we should strive towards more shooting and sharper close combat capacity. Lastly, fluff wise. I would like to see some D-cannons in the lists. If one weapon in the list is fitting for a WG:army it is the big brother of the weapon our preferred troop is carrying.

Just my firsts impressions to get the debate started. I'm aware that the pts have to come from somewhere and that It is hard to find them. But perhaps a little tweaking can be done. :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on December 24, 2008, 04:04:57 PM
Ok guys, I've been woefully inadequate and no good in posting for the whole week, sorry for that. I'll try to get back to the current project as soon as time permit.

Merry Christmas all! :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on December 24, 2008, 04:10:38 PM
Happy Christmas everyone, hope your all doing well...

I know I for one am very happy about the christmas Holidays I have time to myself once again so I can do things I want to do... and I have a christmas present for you all tomorrow....

The Waveserpent thread will be finished tomorrow (Gasp I Know) its about time huh? but I finished it tonight and Im delighted with it, pics and a last bit of discussion about how I did everything will be posted up tomorrow... and who knows what I will start next.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on December 24, 2008, 04:38:10 PM
Hi again all.

Over the holidays I will be playing a large Apoc game. 7500 points of my Eldar verses 7500 pts of Crons And chaos. I will post picks of the battle when I have them. May the Iyanden and Ulthwe Craftworlds be victorious. I know I will be facing a reaver titan and bloodthirster greater daemon of khorne.

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on December 25, 2008, 04:39:31 PM
Good news everyone...

The last pics and comments are up on the Waveserpent blog...

Starky thanks for your patience... and I hope all you Eldar players go over and take a look at it after its taken soo long to get finished haha im soo happy its all done.

Here is the link Please come take a look!!! (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=167082.20)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on December 26, 2008, 12:45:34 PM
HAHA following my recent spurt of productivity Ive got the next of my projects up and running in the painting forum.

Here it is fellas, enjoy, some of you may have already seen this but its going to be worth keeping an eye on I promise.

clicky (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=175548.0)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: BubbaMack on December 28, 2008, 04:13:32 PM
@ Valar, your work is amazing.  The wave serpent really shines, and I can't wait to see how the Wraith Lord turns out.  I actually just ordered and paid for my first two Lords at my LGS and am now eagerly awaiting there arrival.  My question to you, as I don't have one yet, is how hard are they to pose.  I have several great ideas I would like to try, including having one kneeling down and taking aim with a bright lance like a sniper.  Would it be possible with the kit to achieve that pose?  I am pretty good with conversions using GS so I'm not too worried, just looking for your opinion.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on December 28, 2008, 04:37:15 PM
You may want to look HERE (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1920762#msg1920762) BubbaMack, there's one around the middle of the list who could fit the description, although there's no guide to convert the Lord.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on December 28, 2008, 05:21:31 PM
Quote from: BubbaMack on December 28, 2008, 04:13:32 PM
@ Valar, your work is amazing.  The wave serpent really shines, and I can't wait to see how the Wraith Lord turns out.  I actually just ordered and paid for my first two Lords at my LGS and am now eagerly awaiting there arrival.  My question to you, as I don't have one yet, is how hard are they to pose.  I have several great ideas I would like to try, including having one kneeling down and taking aim with a bright lance like a sniper.  Would it be possible with the kit to achieve that pose?  I am pretty good with conversions using GS so I'm not too worried, just looking for your opinion.

They are deceptively easy to pose, as long as you have a clear idea of what you want it to look like and can visualise how to do it its a very easy and pleasing kit to work with.  Believe it or not I had that thing posed, built and converted within under 2 hours on Christmas day...  The longest bit was trimming the gun stock thin enough so it would fit without pushing the arm out too far.

You should enjoy working with this model and find it nice and easy, infact I enjoyed it soo much that I cant wait for the first opportunity i get to go to GW and get another one lol.. already got the poses for the next 2 figured out lol.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: BubbaMack on December 28, 2008, 08:53:11 PM
Quote from: Valar on December 28, 2008, 05:21:31 PM
Believe it or not I had that thing posed, built and converted within under 2 hours on Christmas day... 

There's no way my wife would have stood for that.  She is normally pretty understanding of my hidden 'nerd herd' tendencies, but 40k on Christmas would have crossed the line.  Although she is a little more forgiving seeing how the only reason I even heard of 40k was because her 14 yr old brother moved in with us, so I'm really playing for him ;)

Actually the only reason I even ordered the Wraith Lords is because of your conversion.  I have never given much thought to them as most the poses I've seen don't grab my attention. Yours is very unique and very inspiring.  Maybe I'll try to do a write up when I get mine and convert them (although to more I dig around on the POC thread , the more I worry about making something complete irrelevant or repetitive).  I want to do the other one with a 'chain gun' version of the scatter laser.  Does each kit come with two?  I would assume they would to allow for twin linking.  I wanted to convert 3 or 4 scatter lasers together to look like the Gatling gun from The Predator.  Doable?? 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on December 29, 2008, 02:14:47 AM
Is there room for a Farseer from another Craftworld, who uses Ghost Warriors Army as its first line of defenses? :)

My current Eldar collection runs around 42,ooo+; 20k+ of it are due to 5 Phantom Titans, 2 Warlock Titans, 2 Bright Stallions, 2 Revenants, 5 Towering Destroyer Knights.

50 Wraithguards, 14 Wraithlords are what I bolster for my Ghost Warriors.

We're Craftworld Mial'Wei (The Bright Hope), our craftworld along with its 2 smaller sister craftworlds roam between the Talismans of Vaul to the Shrine of Elronhir, destroying those who come and pester our Exodite Kins Worlds.

Our main colors are Regal Blue and Bleached Bone along with a few other colors to lighten the miniatures.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on December 29, 2008, 06:18:58 AM
Quote from: haunt on December 29, 2008, 02:14:47 AM
My current Eldar collection runs around 42,ooo+; 20k+ of it are due to 5 Phantom Titans, 2 Warlock Titans, 2 Bright Stallions, 2 Revenants, 5 Towering Destroyer Knights.

50 Wraithguards, 14 Wraithlords are what I bolster for my Ghost Warriors.
Ye gods. [shakes head] And me who thought I had mucho stuff with my 12K of Eldar. And... that... many... Titans... I am jealous.

We are always happy for fresh blood in our POC haunt, I'll add your name ASAP to the roster - Welcome to the Iyanden Council of War! ;)

I'd like to see pictures of your force if you can, I guess that rows upon rows of Wraithguard, Wraithlords, Titans and whatnot you own as supporting units would be quite impressive.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on December 29, 2008, 09:20:29 AM
Quote from: Starrakatt, Christmas Enforcer on December 29, 2008, 06:18:58 AM
Quote from: haunt on December 29, 2008, 02:14:47 AM
My current Eldar collection runs around 42,ooo+; 20k+ of it are due to 5 Phantom Titans, 2 Warlock Titans, 2 Bright Stallions, 2 Revenants, 5 Towering Destroyer Knights.

50 Wraithguards, 14 Wraithlords are what I bolster for my Ghost Warriors.
Ye gods. [shakes head] And me who thought I had mucho stuff with my 12K of Eldar. And... that... many... Titans... I am jealous.

We are always happy for fresh blood in our POC haunt, I'll add your name ASAP to the roster - Welcome to the Iyanden Council of War! ;)

I'd like to see pictures of your force if you can, I guess that rows upon rows of Wraithguard, Wraithlords, Titans and whatnot you own as supporting units would be quite impressive.

   Starky

The most amount of Wraithguards, I play is 30 lately. Most of the time it's actually 20 due to the size of the fight.

<Raise your virtual hand, if you bought the Craftworld: Iyanden box from long long ago.>
*Haunt raises both hands to count for 2.*

BTW, I also post on 40kforum as Valinor, and if you had played *V----L* can't say the site name. I playtest my armies and written armies from long ago there.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on December 29, 2008, 02:59:39 PM
Quote from: Starrakatt, Christmas Enforcer on December 15, 2008, 09:19:00 PM
Also:
Quote from: Gutstikk on December 15, 2008, 10:30:11 AM
http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.0)

That's the thread, as I'm sure you all know. Take a look and see if there's any there your POC would like to tweak [if you don't already have one of your own you'll be going with]. Some of the lists have pretty good ideas that may need better execution while some use solid units but may be in need of a plan.

I hope to have discussion on refining each list [one per POC] within the POC threads by members of the group.

All I want for Christmas from each of you is a single army list, something that will show a bit of fluff as it hoses the enemy of the Eldar [and hopefully doesn't fail on comp/sportsmanship too much, though this should be expected as an Eldar player].

Everyone, if some tactics need to be considered with the list a simple write-up would be helpful, as I don't necessarily know who'll be fielding them.
So there it is, the closure of the Project is almost on us, there are the links to the different Iyanden themed forces that have been presented in the thread:
- List1, from the-one-three (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2106047#msg2106047)
- Lists 2, 3, 4 & 5 from Starrakatt (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2107133#msg2107133)
- List 6, from Gutstikk (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2112416#msg2112416)
- List 7, from moc065 - Eldrad make it less themed but oh well... (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2114382#msg2114382)
- List 8 & 9, from Starrakatt - Less themed but still relevant (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=172795.msg2124067#msg2124067)

So there are the lists that have been submitted, thread now closed. I'd like for us all to have a look at these to decide on what seems the best competitive list(s) in there and if these can be bettered in any way while still keeping it Iyanden themed.
In the end, we need to get a single one list that will be used in competitive gaming by Iyanden players VS any and all kind of opposition for the next weeks/months, so we better come up with the best o' the best!

   So? Lets discuss! ;)
Quote from: Eothen on December 16, 2008, 03:26:45 PM
Here are my first impressions from comparing the lists.

After viewing all lists I found two things:
1) they all were fairly similar, relying on more CC than shooting, and more resilience than killing potential
2) Lacking in clean up close combat specialists.
I will address these two aspects by discussing Close combat specialist, the role of the Farseer and fire power.

Close combat expertise: Nearly every list was focusing on Yriel or other HQ close combat specialists as the only close combat threat. 2 lists, Starkys, included harlequins on foot and one list suggested striking scorpions on foot.
My experience says that lots of stuff sticks to Wraithguard. Just cause no one have the power to kill them quickly and the WG lacks the power to kill of enemies quickly. To get the WG unstuck is a priority, as they have good guns and a moving unit is more threatening than a stuck unit. Therefore I would suggest a rapid response unit.
A HQ can do this Job. But with limited success, as they seldom have the punch to clear a enemy unit and escape retribution. I think a close combat specialist unit like Banshees, Scorps, Harlequins in a transport or shining spears would be a good way to support the close combat character that every list likes to include. We need more speed and a safer way to shield this unit until It is needed than running it on foot. And we quicker results than relying on warlocks.
Wraithlords can act as close combat support. But they have the same disadvantage as the WG, a low number of attacks. I haven't experimented with using two of these together, that could clear the area, but I find my WL with other tasks than to clear the way for the WGs.
A bike Council or a Serpent Council coupled with a Powersword Autarch or Yriel could manage enough punch, although I haven't much experience with these builds.
I agree that a quick reaction CC unit (i.e: transported) should be the norm and could probably be done, but then we have to take the transport's cost into acount, and that's where it becomes difficult as the Wraithguard cost so much pts...

Quote
Farseer support: Every list was focusing on the lone Farseer with Doom/Fortune combo. Nothing wrong with this. Its what makes the WG troop so resilient. A few lists suggested Eldrad, I will ignore this, as he isn't fluffy, and just skip ahead to what I like to do with my Farseers.
I like to include Guide in my lits, as this makes my shooting more leathal, and I find short range shooting spam (Esp St6) one important strongpoint in Eldar armies. Experimentation with a additional Farseer could be usefull here. Lika a Doom/Guide Farseer accompanying a Squad in a Waveserpent, leaving the other, perhaps with only Fortune, to concentrate on supporting the WG or a Council.
Such a Farseer could make a Vyper Starcannon Squadron with its price, and help the Avengers or Guardians in the Serpent kill more when they disembark. (Im under the impression that he can cast psychics on things outside the transport. Correct me If I'm wrong here.)
You are right for casting outside a transport, FAQ cleared that.

I do not think that Vypers are competitive enough, too easy to kill, unless they are taken with EMLs for long range shooting or very cheap as a contesting unit. Problem is, for around the same cost as a Vyper you get a minimal squad of Jetbikes, thus another Scoring unit. Given the choice, I would take the Jetbikes over the Vyper, although I may be wrong...

A build that I thought of would be Farseer w/ Fortune & Guide backing up Warwalkers in cover, that could be pretty effective, but at the same time vulnerable to some armies (Drop Pods, massive Outflank, ect...)... But what isn't, bar a Reserve List?

Quote
Fire power: A fire power shortage is evident in several of the list. Only long range power is on rangers, WL:s or in a few cases on tanks. I would like to expand the Dire Avenger presence and the amount of fast shooters, like hawks and spiders, and long range shooters, like Warwalkers and Dark Reapers.
Dark Reapers might be a bit too far, as I don't like Eldar stuff that don't move. But you get the point. Eldar strength should be in the capacity to deal overwhelming damage to the chosen point of the battle field. Iyanden exchanges this to the strength to sustain heavy damage. But I still feel that we should strive towards more shooting and sharper close combat capacity.
Lastly, fluff wise. I would like to see some D-cannons in the lists. If one weapon in the list is fitting for a WG:army it is the big brother of the weapon our preferred troop is carrying.
I also like D-Cannons, but for competetiveness sake it seems that they haven't cut it in these lists so far...

I think our best bet to get massive firepower would be to drop a Wraithlord and go for a firepower unit, like Walkers, Spiders (sorry, Hawks doesn't cut it in 5th ed) or Avengers. Flaming Stormies can also do the trick I think.

Quote
Just my firsts impressions to get the debate started. I'm aware that the pts have to come from somewhere and that It is hard to find them. But perhaps a little tweaking can be done. :)
What are you waiting dude? Take one list and tweak away! I'll do the same on my side and lets see if we can squeeze some pots here or there to get (a) new unit(s) in there.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on December 29, 2008, 06:10:36 PM
Ah the Eldar were victorious today in a big Apoc Battle. I wish I had of had a camera. My wife needed ours for the day. Anyways it was a great deal of fun. Strategic redeployement pretty much won me the game. I was able to take the 2 objectives on the bridge that linked the 2 tables together. The majority of the fighting took place on the table I started on,  which left no mans land pretty well open. most of their units deep striked or flank marched into my deployment zone In hind sight I wish I had taken notes so I could do a proper battle report. Here are some highlights

Fire dragons pop out of tunnel next to reaver taking its remaining 4 structure points a couple turns later they remove the 3 remaning wounds off angrath and take him down, just after he tangled with the seer council.

The cobra takes out a pylon. Damn thing goes nuclear killing a unit of warriors glancing a monolith next to it. It then takes the remaing wound off my avatar, kills 8 out of ten scorpions in a squad, wipes out 10 out of 12 stormguardians, and kills 8 bloodletters.

Pylon destroys a revenant titan in one round of shooting.

My sunstorm Squadron kills 40 warriors 5 immortals and a lord in one combined volly. The lord fails his will be back roll so the unit disapears.

My avengers survive 5 rounds of combat with 3 wraiths and a destroyer lord

Over all this was a great game. it was close until about the last turn. I was able to clear their troops off of objectives in their deployment. and I manged to kill angrath, who was contesting one of the middle objectives. My Wraithguard unit that had  been tide up with a C'tan for 5 rounds of combat was able to finally kill it. (the avatar took the brunt of the damage prior to this). The six Wraiths that had been in contesting range of one of my objectives were finally downed by my Harlies. In the End I held 3 objectives and they held none. We started about 9 am managed to finish around 4:30 pm

Thanks,
The-one-tree

10k Eldar vs 5k cron and 5k Chaos

Eldar

I had a seer council, 3 seers eldrad, 5 locks

the mighty spirit host, 20 WG, 8 locks, Yriel, 1 Wraithlord, 3 seers

Sunstorm Squadron 6 prisms.

50 Guardians, 4 platforms, 10 were stormies with flame throwers

Avatar

10 Scorps
9 shes
7 harlies
4 shining spears
9 firs dragons

2 revenent titans
1 Cobra

the Crons

Destroyer lord
Normal Lord
100 warriors
15 immortals
6 Wraiths
2 Pylons
5 monoliths

Chaos

Angrath
30 Khorne Beserkers
2 Dreadnoughts
15 demonettes. The aspected big deamon that goes with them. Not sure her name
15 bloodletters
Reaver titan

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on December 29, 2008, 09:39:30 PM
Heya all,

I moved the Ghost Story to the BatReps, so it is easier to link to it.

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=176963.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=176963.0)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on December 31, 2008, 10:45:50 AM
@the-one-tree: Nice, big, impressive force, congrats on the Victory. How many Turns did you get? :) I am curious on how many Strategic Assets were used for each side. Also, how was the enmy Outflanking your force - From an Asset or standard Outflanking manoeuver?

@haunt: Interesting batrep and nice piece of story, I didn't realise at once you were fielding FOUR Wraithguard squads! Poor T'au didn't stand a chance to take that much, although I suppose that a Stealer Shock list or a Terminator heavy army could hurt (maybe even oblitarate) your own list pretty bad... I suppose that a Marine spam army could tarpit your's for the entire game too, but not much else can kill/beat that many Wraith units.

Anyway. congrat on the win. ;)


And now another variant list I came up with for the Competitive List Project. (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg2144777#msg2144777)

This particular list is based on comments I had previously HERE. (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg2144777#msg2144777)

I added a little bit of CC Ooomph, another Scoring Unit, more Anti-horde and better long range AT in exchange of a Wraithguard unit on Serpent. Now guys, that's one of my best shot as pure competetiveness goes and keeping with an Iyanden them - Now it's your turn for a try and/or then select the army you think is best in all of these, Fluffwise and Competitive wise.

HQ: 300 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Fortune & Doom - 145 pts

ELITE: 206 Pts
- Harlequins X 8 w/ 8 Kisses, Shadowseer - 206 pts

TROOP: 773 Pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
- Guardian Defenders X 10 w/ Scatter Laser, Warlock w/ Embolden & Singing Spear - 125 pts
- Storm Guardians X 10 w/ 2 Flamers, Warlock w/ Destructor – 127 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Shurican, Spirit Stone, Star Engines - 125 pts

HEAVY: 470 Pts
- Wraithlord w/ EML & Brightlance, 2 Flamers - 155 pts
- Wraithlord w/ EML & Brightlance, 2 Flamers – 155 pts
- Fire Prism w/ Holofield & Spirit Stone – 160 pts

FAST: 0 Pts
- NONE

TOTAL: 1749 Pts
- 3 Scoring Units, 10 KP, 47 models (including tanks/MCs)

- Wraithguard does their thing along with Farseer.
- Yriel can ride with the Stormies or just plod along with the WG.
- Defenders get in Cover, ready to Go to Ground if need be, backed up and bacing up (Wraithsight) the Wraithlords.
- Stormies can come in from Reserves for later Objective grab.
- Serpent can be used to lift depleted units, given over to the Harlies if need be - Yriel too - and be uesed to Tabk Shock/Ram where it is needed.
- Wraithlords can walk along the Wraithguard or just plain stand in/behind Cover as a firebase.
- Prism does it's thing, can also be used to Tank Shock/Ram stuff.
- Harlies can ride the Serpent or stay as backup in second line.

   Starky

EDIT: I have transported all the Lists in the Tactic & Startegies Board HERE. (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=175779.0)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on December 31, 2008, 12:47:16 PM
Sorry about that. I should have included the assets in my original post. Here they are. Unfortunatley for them they did not choose any formations that gave them additional assets. Although it was a pain having 2 pylons and 5 Liths deepstrike into the middle of my deployment zone 2nd and 3rd turn. We went to 4 turns. by 4th turn, it was just a matter of time before I had them completely wiped out. I still had about 4k or more on the board. The necron player maybe had 700 pts left. A lith and a couple small warrior squads, which were in combat with a wraithlord and Yriel with his locks and a seer. Chaos had nothing left really. I dispatched the last real threat angrath in turn 4.

The one thing I learned from this game is Eldar titans and superheavies are disgusting. Not only does the pulsar make short work of tanks because its heavy 2, but its excellent at killing infantry because its a blast weapon. The Cobra is just mean. Its the big big blast and its d strength. One thing I should mention was the titans and cobra were proxies only because the other eldar player that was going to come ended up having to back out. I was just shy of 8k. The other guys wanted to field 10k so I suggested a proxy. I had planned on purchasing a titan this year anyways. Now I know how well they work.

Eldar have been a specialist race for a long time and I think thats what makes them so lethal in Apoc games. The myriad of assets + unit combinations is key to Eldar victory in this venue. I'm beginning to enjoy apoc more then competitive play because its more fun. The abundance of assets and that I can field my whole force at once, makes it a great deal of fun. Not to mention it is more layed back. (For the most part). There is only one guys in my gaming group that can be a sore loser.

Eldar

Tunnels. This is what allowed my dragons to pop out and down the reaver titan. He had all but one tunnel blocked

Eldritch tempest (Cleared an objective for me. It hit the unit 38 times when I rolled the Barrage rolls. I definately plan on taking this again)

Because of the seer council:
Ambush
Strategic redeployent
Careful planning

Crons/Chaos

Flank March (this was univesal for them)
Scarab Reconstruction

Thanks,
The-one-tree

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on December 31, 2008, 12:49:20 PM
Quote from: Starrakatt, Drunkard Psychiatrist on December 31, 2008, 10:45:50 AM
@haunt: Interesting batrep and nice piece of story, I didn't realise at once you were fielding FOUR Wraithguard squads! Poor T'au didn't stand a chance to take that much, although I suppose that a Stealer Shock list or a Terminator heavy army could hurt (maybe even oblitarate) your own list pretty bad... I suppose that a Marine spam army could tarpit your's for the entire game too, but not much else can kill/beat that many Wraith units.

Anyway. congrat on the win. ;)
Fought the new SM hammer termies and had difficulties since he was manuevering to get out of the way from Wraithcannons.

I love Stealer Shock lists, although yes they will get into melee v my ghosts. Usually, we end up tied up due to Rends comes in not many successes unless it goes awry which it has. I do try to counter-charge a menacing unit coming in or we stay in difficult terrains, since most nids players most of the time don't buy hooks.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Eothen on January 1, 2009, 09:58:44 AM
Quote from: Starrakatt, Drunkard Psychiatrist on December 31, 2008, 10:45:50 AM

HQ: 300 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Fortune & Doom - 145 pts

ELITE: 206 Pts
- Harlequins X 8 w/ 8 Kisses, Shadowseer - 206 pts

TROOP: 773 Pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
- Guardian Defenders X 10 w/ Scatter Laser, Warlock w/ Embolden & Singing Spear - 125 pts
- Storm Guardians X 10 w/ 2 Flamers, Warlock w/ Destructor – 127 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Shurican, Spirit Stone - 125 pts

HEAVY: 470 Pts
- Wraithlord w/ EML & Brightlance, 2 Flamers - 155 pts
- Wraithlord w/ EML & Brightlance, 2 Flamers – 155 pts
- Fire Prism w/ Holofield & Spirit Stone – 160 pts

FAST: 0 Pts
- NONE

TOTAL: 1749 Pts
- 3 Scoring Units, 10 KP, 47 models (including tanks/MCs)


This is the list I prefer this far. I just have some minor pointers.
- The Waveserpent: have you missed to include some equipment or is it miss priced?
- I would either take these points, and redo the Guardian defender squad into a Dire Avenger squad with a Exarch with shuricen storm and additional shuricen catapult, or put them on and the points on the Guardian Defender Warlock to exchange the Fire prism to a Warwalker squadron. Probably with Star cannons (as I'm currently optimising my lists against tyranids) or EML/Scatter lasers depending on taste.

A suggestion could be like this:

HQ: 300 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts (or Avatar)
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Fortune & Doom - 145 pts

ELITE: 206 Pts
- Harlequins X 8 w/ 8 Kisses, Shadowseer - 206 pts

TROOP: 793 Pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
- Dire Avengers x 10 Exarch with Shuricen storm & Additional Shuriken Catapult - 152 pts
- Storm Guardians X 11 w/ 2 Flamers, Warlock w/ Destructor – 135 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Shurican, Spirit Stone - 110 pts

HEAVY: 450 Pts
- Wraithlord w/ Wraithsword & Brightlance, 2 Flamers - 140 pts
- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance, 2 Flamers – 130 pts
- Warwalker squadron X 3 Scatterlasers (x6) - 180 pts

FAST: 0 Pts

TOTAL: 1749 Pts
- 3 Scoring Units, 10 KP, 47 models (including tanks/MCs)

I could be missing something now that I'm just tweaking your army, and I'm mostly used to playing 2000 pts games, so the layout isn't really the same.

Now when I've been playing during the x-mas vacation (only against Tyranids I have to add) I've been using something like this:

HQ: 290 pts
- Avatar
- Farseer, Spiritstone, Guide, Fortune, Runes of Witnessing - 135 pts

ELITE: 346 pts
- Harlequins X 7 Shadowseer, 5 kisses, Death Jester - 186 pts
- Striking Scorpions X 8 Exarch, Scorpions Claw, Stalker - 160 pts

TROOP: 884 pts
- Wraithguard X10, Spiritseer, Enhance - 396 pts
- Dire Avengers X 10, Exarch Two Shuriken Catapults + Shuriken Storm - 152 pts
  + Wave Serpent Twinlinked Shuriken Cannons+Spiritstones - 110 pts
- Dire Avengers X 9 Exarch, Shimmersield & Power sword+Defend - 150 pts
- Guardian Jetbike Squadron X 3, Shuricen Cannon - 76 pts

FAST ATTACK: 127 pts
- Warp Spiders X 5, Exarch with Two Death Spinners - 127 pts

HEAVY SUPPORT: 350 pts
- Wraithlord 2 Flamers, Wraithswod & Shuriken Cannon - 110 pts
- Warwalker Squadron X 3, Starcannons (x6) - 240 pts

TOTAL: 1997 pts
4 Scoring units, 12 Killpoints, 60 models.

The Avatar and the Wraithlord will anchor the sides of the Wraithguards. The Jetbikes and the Spiders will jump over the wall and fire. The Farseer will stand between the Wraithguard and the Warwalkers to maximise both guide and fortune. The Avatar will lead the Scorpions and the footslogging Dire Avengers to try to push against the nids wile the Serpent mounted Dire Avengers try to make safe strafing runs with their Shuriken Storm skills.

I'm to paranoid to really play without runes of witnessing...  And some other things are there just cause I don't own larger units (like the Warp Spiders) or things depending on the opponent (like Enhance). I have to confess that this army have a total of Zero victories during the two games I've fought with them. Depending on the experience of my Tyranid opponent (the first game) and going for a all or nothing rather than tie in the second game.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 2, 2009, 04:05:28 AM
@the-one-tree: Some excellent Assets there, and I agree with you that had an upper hand from the start with your careful selection of Datasheets and Assets - Kudos for you for making it work, shame on your opponents NOT to come up with something.

Oh, and I like my Scorpion and Tempest... ;D

@haunt: Guess you didn't have to face 21" Land Raider assaults then, one of these can (and will) rampage through a unit of Wraithguard like there's no tommorrow, two would probably spell your doom. I have problem myself with these, the only way to stop the LR(s) from delivering cargo into the WG is either destroying/imobilising their ride (WG/Dragons on Serpent or some BL shots) and then forcing as many saves on them as possible (Doom/Avengers/WG/Harlies).

Quote from: Eothen
This is the list I prefer this far. I just have some minor pointers.
- The Waveserpent: have you missed to include some equipment or is it miss priced?
Forgot to write the Star Engines on the Serpent, these were invaluable in many a game I played, to put the transported unit at the right place and the right time.

Quote
- I would either take these points, and redo the Guardian defender squad into a Dire Avenger squad with a Exarch with shuricen storm and additional shuricen catapult, or put them on and the points on the Guardian Defender Warlock to exchange the Fire prism to a Warwalker squadron. Probably with Star cannons (as I'm currently optimising my lists against tyranids) or EML/Scatter lasers depending on taste.
Interesting suggestions, as I usually use Bladestorming unit of Avengers instead of the Stormies, but three Templates seems to have worked well for many Eldar players from lists I read, so I included them instead (also freed pts for another Harlequin) - I try to keep an open mind for units efficiency/competetiveness, as I am aware that some may be very worthy even if they don't necessarily fit my own style of play: After all, the idea is to come up with the most efficient and competitive list overall.

Quote
A suggestion could be like this:

HQ: 300 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts (or Avatar)
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Fortune & Doom - 145 pts

ELITE: 206 Pts
- Harlequins X 8 w/ 8 Kisses, Shadowseer - 206 pts

TROOP: 793 Pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
- Dire Avengers x 10 Exarch with Shuricen storm & Additional Shuriken Catapult - 152 pts
- Storm Guardians X 11 w/ 2 Flamers, Warlock w/ Destructor – 135 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Shurican, Spirit Stone - 110 pts

HEAVY: 450 Pts
- Wraithlord w/ Wraithsword & Brightlance, 2 Flamers - 140 pts
- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance, 2 Flamers – 130 pts
- Warwalker squadron X 3 Scatterlasers (x6) - 180 pts

FAST: 0 Pts

TOTAL: 1749 Pts
- 3 Scoring Units, 10 KP, 47 models (including tanks/MCs)
I like your variant, especially the War Walkers, but I would take Yriel and not the Avatar in this config, for Reserves bonus as you don't want these on table if you aren't beginning.
However I don't think the Avengers to be any good on foot in a ultra-competitive Tournament setting, so I'd drop a Wraithlord to get them a Wave Serpent instead, maybe even scraping pts here and there to get it a twin-Brightlance to compensate the Lord's loss.

I like your 2K list, although it may be a bit light in Fast units at that pts level, as some AT/anti MCs capabilities, but there's plenty of CC and anti-horde... ;)

How did you lose these games? Bested on Objectives or flatly beaten on the military side of the equation? Coz if the reasons are the same it should enlighten on where your force or tactics are lacking...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on January 2, 2009, 08:13:07 AM
Quote
HQ: 300 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts (or Avatar)
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Fortune & Doom - 145 pts

ELITE: 206 Pts
- Harlequins X 8 w/ 8 Kisses, Shadowseer - 206 pts

TROOP: 793 Pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
- Dire Avengers x 10 Exarch with Shuricen storm & Additional Shuriken Catapult - 152 pts
- Storm Guardians X 11 w/ 2 Flamers, Warlock w/ Destructor – 135 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Shurican, Spirit Stone - 110 pts

HEAVY: 450 Pts
- Wraithlord w/ Wraithsword & Brightlance, 2 Flamers - 140 pts
- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance, 2 Flamers – 130 pts
- Warwalker squadron X 3 Scatterlasers (x6) - 180 pts

FAST: 0 Pts

TOTAL: 1749 Pts
- 3 Scoring Units, 10 KP, 47 models (including tanks/MCs)

I like this list too and second the vote for Yriel.. I like to go with 2 flamers and Embolden on my Stormies if they are my only flamer squad though, as they can easiily turn into "one hit wonders" even with 3 flamers, so the added resilience can help.

I actually can see the DA on foot as an aset, as it gives you the points for that second WL, which scares the crap out of many people... you do loose on mobility; but 2 WL's can help a lot with CC especially with Harlies, Yriel, etc... The only sugetion I would make it so free up points for TL-BL's on that Serpent, so that you get one more crap at ranged AT... as if you shut down the enemies mobility, this list could be brutal.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Eothen on January 2, 2009, 09:08:19 AM

@Starrkatt:

I faced the same Tyranid army in both battles. My opponent both knows what he is doing and have been working on that list for some time. The reasons for the results were different. In the first battle I was way too rusty in gaming. The second one went much better and the end result wasn't set in stone until the last dice rolled. But still, I cant claim that my army would be the most optimal anti-tyranid or even 2000pts list.

I'm gonna do a short battle report just to show how the list worked. Perhaps I can get some good insight on how to beat him next time.

I don't know exactly what everything in the Tyranid list is called but I can sort of describe it:

HQ:
- Hive Tyrant, Wings. Every unsaved wounds = two unsaved wounds
- Hive Tyrant, 16 range 18" shots, reroll failed hits and wounds.

Elite:
- 4 Tyranid warriors, 3 small blast,
- 4 Tyranid warriors, 3 small blast,
- 4 Tyranid warriors, Shoots like the second tyrant but with lesser st

Troop:
- 8 Stealers, feeder tendrils
- 8 Stealers, feeder tendrils
- Lots of Hormagaunts
- Lots of Hormagaunts
- Lots of Termagaunts
- Lots of Termagaunts

Heavy Support:
- Carnifex, Large blast and small blast
- Carnifex, Large blast and small blast
- 2 Zoanthropes with warp blast.

about 80 - 100 models, 6 scoring and 15 KP

He used the Termagaunts to lead the way, following up with Hormagaunts on the flanks and Genestealers a bit behind. The Carnifexes and Warriors acted as infantry support and the Zoantropes targeted tougher opponents. The flying Tyrant hunted monsters and generally lurked behind terrain.

In battle One, we played the kill point scenario with the Cleanse deployment. I placed the Harlequins and the Wraithlord on the left flank to try keeping the troupe away from scattering blasts. The Wraithguard made up the centre with the Farseer. The rest deployed on the right flank. This game I didn't know how his army worked and how nasty his shooting would turn out to be. The loss was primary my own fault. I advanced the Avatar and Wraithlord a bit to far, witch made the WL into Genestealer dinner after it got caught up in a combat with Termagaunts. The Avatar got shoot to pieces by the shooty Hive Tyrant. The Harlequins were about to run up to the fallen Wraithlord but got blasted by a pie plate that killed half the troupe. At half strength they failed horribly to kill the closest Genestealer unit and avenge the Wraithlord. 
Even though the right flank with avengers, scorpions, War Walkers and spiders inflicted lots of horde casualties they eventually was worn down by the tyranid numbers and I lost the game.

In battle Two, I had a better grasp of both my army and my opponents. I decided to hold back the Avatar and the Wraithlord more. Play the spiders and jetbikes over the Wraithwall and changed the weapons on the War Walkers from EML to Starcannons. The Avatar would keep close to both the Scorpions and the Avengers with defend, as this detachment should be able to stare down any element of the tyranid army (counting on the Avengers to be brave against Genestealers).

This game went better. It was the two objective scenario with a normal 12" deployment zone. My right flank managed to bludgeon the enemy into a stalemate where there wasn't much left on either force. Going so far that the last unit of Tyranid warrior had to withdraw with the last hormagaunt to hold the home objective. The right flank went better. After the Wraithguard charged the center broods, blocking some elements from advancing they finally ending up in a close combat with the Flying Hive. The Wraithlord survived an assult from a battered Genestealer brood and my harlequins managed to save the WL and engage a Carnifex at the same time. At this point I still could have won but I played it wrong. One small Hormagaunt brood had circled my line and advanced on my objective. Now only defended by my bikes. When I got the WL unstuck from the Genestealers I should have advanced it home to save my objective. Instead I saw an opening to assault the Fying Hive and save the Wraithguard. Possibly enabling me to advance on his home objective. This path ended with the Tyrant killing the WL and any realistic hopes of victory. I still had a small hope left: at the same time as the WL fell, my Harlequins killed the Carnifex they were battling. I advanced them into combat with the flying Hive and managed to kill it it. Freeing the last Wraithguard and the Warlock. If the game hadn't ended here I could have advanced on his home objective and still get a draw from the game. But that was not to be...

If I'm to evaluate my army: Except from the Zoanthropes all my army had a save against all shooting attacks (this is why i choose Enhance instead of Conceal for the Wraithguard). He was shooty, but I was shootier. Mostly cause I had more range and/or move. I have to admit that the army is to slow. And It needs more high AP ranged shoots and/or anti tank. The Scorpions can easily be scrapped for this. Perhaps changing the footslugging avengers into a Guardian squad with flamers and a transport, and some more Heavy Weapons.

I prefer Avengers on foot to Guardian Defenders, as I've never gotten to shoot with their Catapults in a tournament. The Avengers should survive those things that easily kills guardians and manage to get away one volley at least. Perhaps...


@moc065:

I agree with Yriel probably being the right choice in this list. I included the Avatar option more as a choice pointer as they are really easy to switch. If, for example we were to exchange one of the WL:s for a Serpent, changing Yriel to a Avatar could be a valid option.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on January 2, 2009, 09:44:55 AM
Good point there Eothen, and thanks for sharing the Battle synopsis... it does help.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 2, 2009, 11:57:34 PM
Yup, thanks for the mini batrep Eothen, I guess that with some more games under the belt you'll get on your cruising speed and start kicking arses in 5th ed. ;)

@About Eothen's List Variant suggestion: I have a hard time with the footslogging Avengers' concept [cringe], although I grasp that other players seems to do well with these... However, with Yriel in there I can see them in Reserve to come in 2nd or 3th Turn in to mop up stuff and take a back Objective, or begin on table and wipe out a Inflitrating unit.
Another use could be to load them in the Serpent instead of the Stormies and use these to hold a back objective and keep the Wraithlords from Wraithsight if need be: Going to Ground will have them survive as well as a Defender unit, especially if given Embolden.

As moc pointed, the Serpent should definitely get Twin-Brightlance I think, so some pts are to be found.

I'll work on the maths and come back with something soon.

Thanks for the comments guys, kudos for the efforts and suggestions. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on January 3, 2009, 11:21:05 AM
I will be attending a doubles tourney at the end of the month 1500pts per player. My list will be very Wraith heavy for this tourney. My ally will be necrons. I know totally unfluffy. Just curious what peoples thoughts are at this points level. I can field any unit save hawks. I'll post what the Necron player will be fielding when I know. The only stipulation in the tourney is you can't have more then one extra unit then your ally in each FOC slot. So 2 heavies and 1 heavy is ok, but 3 heavies and 1 or 0 heavies is not.

2 Seers, fortune, ss, and another power not sure which yet
20WG
Harlies
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on January 3, 2009, 05:40:15 PM
Necrons often lack in CC or shock absorbing units, your wraithguard as serious for shock absorbers, so focus on CC unit with the rest.... This means 2 units of Harlies allows him up to three units of Immortals, (etc etc).... He will probably like a few HS too so get a couple WL's in there too.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on January 4, 2009, 10:48:09 PM
Here's the list I came up with. Now I will be hearing back soon from the cron player what he's taking. He already knows what I'm fielding roughly so He'll have a good idea what to bring. I'm having some issues as to whether or not I should drop a seer in favor of another cc squad. Unfortunately I don't have more harlies, or wraithlords and its not in the budget at the moment. I'm picking up an eldar titan in the next couple months. I do have scorpians shining spears and banshees. I'd also consider fielding a warlock squad. or perhaps replacing a seer with Yriel. I'm kinda at a loss as to which route to go with the last few points.

the-one-tree

HQ

Farseer with fortune , Doom , spirit stones , ROW – 145
Farseer with fortune , SS, ES– 125

270

Troops

10 Wraithguard with Spirit seer, conceal - 396
10 Wraithguard with Spirit seer, enhance - 396

792

Elite

5 Harlequins  with kisses 2 with fusion pistols - 130
1 Shadowseer with kisses
1 troupe master with power weapon
(220)

Heavy

1 Wraithlord (90),  EML, BL - 155

1437
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 5, 2009, 05:56:52 AM
Mmm, keeping in mind that you are allying with Necrons, the lack of CC power and anti-horde are indeed worrisome. My first counsel would have been to drop the Fusion Pistols and possibly the Troupe Master and upgrade the Harlequin units with more bodies but since you say it's not an option... So yes, probably taking Yriel instead of the second Farseer would help a lot.

Also, while I like the concept, do you feel obligated to field two Wraithguard units? I ask because a Troop choice in a Serpent would both really help for Objective taking/anti-horde duties, like Avengers or Stormies, free 100-150 pts to spend elsewhere and free up the dilemma of taking two Farseer (another 125 pts).

For example:
- Yriel - 155 pts
- Avengers X10, Exarch w/ Dual Catapult & Bladestorm - 152 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin Shuricans & Spirit Stone - 110 pts

Leave you with 167 pts to spend, enough for this:
- Scorpions X 7, Exarch w/ Claw & Shadowstrike (Inflitration?) - 159 pts

Leave you with 8 pts to spend, not much to buy something with, unless you could drop these Fusion Pistol for 20 pts more, or buy a Diresword to the Avenger Exarch.

Of course, there's many options point wise after you dropped a squad of Wraithguard but it is all speculative unless you do it. ;)

If you choose to keep the two WG squads, then I would really consider taking Yriel, his CC capabilities should prove invaluable, and a non Fortuned WG squad isn't that a big deal, especially if kept in the second line in 4+ Cover with the possibility of Going to Ground if sitting on an Objective.

If I was you, I'd really try to squeeze a 15 bucks to get another Harlequin blister with Kisses - at least to replace the Fusion Pistols - Huge point sink if you ask me, unless they be transported in a Falcon/Serpent.

   Hope it helped,

   Starky


Edit

Okay, I tweaked a bit the last list we came up with - I cut one Walker from the squadron to give Twin Brightlances to the Serpent, and with the points left I put back the EML on a Wraithlord.

I though about the footslogging avengers and just couldn't came up with a scheme that would justify the oints spent there considering the rate at which they would die VS the use of Stormies on a Serpent (the best horde killers).
With the add-on of the Walkers I felt they were less needed, and thought about remediating to the Wraithsight problem for the Lords, so I came back to Defenders to cower in Cover and babysit them. - What do you think?
Now There's 11 pts left, what should we take: Runes of Witnessing or another Guardian + Singing Spear for the Warlock? Thoughts?

About the deadline: I will be posting the list to Gutstikk tommorrow. ;)

HQ: 300 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts (or Avatar)
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Fortune & Doom - 145 pts

ELITE: 206 Pts
- Harlequins X 8 w/ 8 Kisses, Shadowseer - 206 pts

TROOP: 818 Pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
- Dire Avengers x 10 Exarch with Shuricen storm & Additional Shuriken Catapult - 152 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Brightlance, Spirit Stone - 145 pts
- Guardian Defenders X 10 w/ Scatter Laser, Warlock w/ Embolden – 125 pts

HEAVY: 415 Pts
- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & Wraithblade, 2 Flamers - 140 pts
- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & EML, 2 Flamers – 155 pts
- Warwalker squadron X 2 Scatterlasers (x4) - 120 pts

FAST: 0 Pts

TOTAL: 1739 Pts
- 3 Scoring Units, 10 KP, 47 models (including Vehicles/MCs)

    Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on January 5, 2009, 08:31:29 PM
Here's a revamp of the list, I was working on. Now I can't bring myself to pull one of the Wraithguard units for this tourney gonna stick with strait WG.  I have 50pts to spare with the changes. I was considering dropping doom in favor of a small storm guardian squad. Was just wondering what peoples thoughts are. here's the list with the guardians and without.

HQ

Farseer with fortune , Doom , spirit stones , ROW – 145 or Farseer with fortune, ROW - 100
Yriel - 155

300 or 255

Troops

10 Wraithguard with Spirit seer, conceal - 396
10 Wraithguard with Spirit seer, enhance - 396

or

12 storm Guardians, 2 flamers - 102

792 or 886

Elite

6 Harlequins  with kisses 2 with fusion pistols - 130
1 Shadowseer with kisses
(202)

Heavy

1 Wraithlord (90),  EML, BL - 155

1449 or 1495

As to the competitive list another guardian and the singing spear I think would be best.

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 5, 2009, 08:50:44 PM
Quote from: the-one-tree on January  5, 2009, 08:31:29 PM
Here's a revamp of the list, I was working on. Now I can't bring myself to pull one of the Wraithguard units for this tourney gonna stick with strait WG.  I have 50pts to spare with the changes. I was considering dropping doom in favor of a small storm guardian squad. Was just wondering what peoples thoughts are. here's the list with the guardians and without.
- Consider that Doom will help both you and your ally - And csince Necrons rely heavily on their Gauss Rifles for damage output I would consider keeping it, and any re-roll in CC is a blessing.

- I wouldn't spend pts on a Stormies unit unless they have a ride - However, a squad of 5 Rangers are a nice, small Scoring Unit that can survive to some firepower if they Go to Ground, a thing to consider.

- So, if you keep Doom you still have to spend these points. Do you have a Vyper or a Warwalker that could use these? A Scatter/Shurican Walker is 50 pts, a Shurican Vyper is 50 pts, a Distort/Cibro Cannon is 50 pts.

Alternatively and if you are really desperate for these points you could buy more powers to the Farseer, making him more versatile - Guide would be a very good choice to backup the WG, as are Eldritch Storm or Mind War in certain situations.

Quote
As to the competitive list another guardian and the singing spear I think would be best.
Thanks for the advice, the alternative who gets the more votes is the one picked. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on January 5, 2009, 09:09:38 PM
Hm I do have a D-cannon . Maybe I'll do that.

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 5, 2009, 09:49:49 PM
Quote from: the-one-tree
Hm I do have a D-cannon . Maybe I'll do that.
Heck! The best move you could do is to buy two Kiss Harlies for 44 pts! When is your Tourney? If there's time enough I'll mail you two of my OOC Harlies to convert for free!

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: the-one-tree on January 5, 2009, 10:01:11 PM
Its Jan 25th. Well your a very nice fellow I'll Pm you with my Address.

the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Eothen on January 6, 2009, 08:28:43 AM
I think we need a troop discussion.

It seems like we have a consensus on 10 Wraithguards for the base of a Iyanden force and that more might be going over the top as we have to cut back on other units.

Now is my question, what other troop support Wraithguards best?

First Dire Avengers or Guardian defenders: Here I prefer Avengers as they got better save and a better range. The support weapon on the Guardian squad rarely does enough damage to justify its existence, If it inst a brightlance. In that case the squad isn't competing with the Avengers, as they have other targets and the catapults problems aren't an issue. This is without any of the units are mounted in a Waveserpents. If they get a transport the issue is about points as Guardians can do the Avengers job, a bit worse and a bit cheaper. And Guardian assaults with their flamers aren't bad (They are really good, but a bit exposed after they fired).
But If I had to choose between Avengers and Guardians to support from the rear and hold terrain I would choose Avengers... probably.

Now it comes to the other two troop options, rangers and jetbikes.

For picking a piece of terrain and sticking to It Rangers seem to be the obvious answer. This depends on the amount of "ignore cover save" weapons in the other army. Those weapons would still take out Guardians... and perhaps Avengers too so I wouldn't really hold that problem against the Rangers. Rangers also got superior amount of shoots at long range compared to Avengers and Guardian defenders. Something that is needed in the slow and short ranged Iyanden army.

Last we have the Jetbikes. The troop choice that best complement the Wraithguards as this unit can move over the wall or shoot over it and then return to safety. More Iyanden lists should include these, as they provide more movement and light firepower combined with the ability to take objectives later in the game. Their problem is that the enemy realise that they should kill them and that bikes isn't really that hard to kill. But compared to other troops they can survive a few shots of light fire.

For some more tweaking (I know, I just go on and on and on and...):
- I haven't thought about having Guardian defenders in the rear, grabbing an objective, just to have a Warlock ready to support Wraithlords. Perhaps this is essential for the maximum fire power Wraithlord? And perhaps this Warlock should be a Spiritseer? I usually move my Wraithlords up with the Wraithguard so they can remain within the spiritseers bubble, and then perhaps make them follow the Farseer or the Harlequins. But If another Warlock is needed the Guardian defenders can be a viable choice. But then, why not give them a Brightlance and some responsibility for picking of tanks? BS3 is bad, I know, but a lonesome Scatterlaser isn't better... By removing the Wraithsword we could be able to change the Scatterlaser to a Brightlance and upgrade the Warlock to a Spiritseer. Do we need 4 Brightlances in this army, combined with all the close combat vehicle killing of the Wraithlords and the Wraithcannons on the Wraithguards? Perhaps we could redo one of the Wraithlord into a "warwalker", by giving him a Scatterlaser and a Shuricen Cannon?

- Can you manage with 3 jetbikes in this edition or do you need 6 for them to be worth the points? If you can manage with 3, It could be possibly to change the Guardian defenders to a Jetbike squadron and 5 normal rangers. We just need 25 - 35 points from somewhere.

- And still, 136pts, that another Dire Avenger squad. But perhaps we have enough shurikens in the list? If so, perhaps the guardian Brightlance isn't that bad? Or some more manoeuvrability with the jetbikes?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on January 6, 2009, 09:23:20 AM
Any of you do remember Craftworld Codex and that Wraithlords were also troops choice for Iyanden? 8)

What do you think of the idea of having the Wraithlord can be taken as a Troop Choice for each Wraithguard + Spiritseer Troop choice you have as part of the army?  ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 6, 2009, 10:30:19 AM
Quote from: haunt
Any of you do remember Craftworld Codex and that Wraithlords were also troops choice for Iyanden? 8)

What do you think of the idea of having the Wraithlord can be taken as a Troop Choice for each Wraithguard + Spiritseer Troop choice you have as part of the army?  ;D
I do, I played these lists for quite a while. They are gone in the wind now though...

Quote from: Eothen on January  6, 2009, 08:28:43 AM
It seems like we have a consensus on 10 Wraithguards for the base of a Iyanden force and that more might be going over the top as we have to cut back on other units.
That's for sure. :)

Quote
Now is my question, what other troop support Wraithguards best?

First Dire Avengers or Guardian defenders: Here I prefer Avengers as they got better save and a better range. The support weapon on the Guardian squad rarely does enough damage to justify its existence, if it isn't a brightlance. In that case the squad isn't competing with the Avengers, as they have other targets and the catapults problems aren't an issue.
Quote
But If I had to choose between Avengers and Guardians to support from the rear and hold terrain I would choose Avengers... probably.
Ok, I agree that footslogging Avengers are a better supporting advancing unit, right. However, as an Objective holder (in Cover) the Guardians are about equal in capabilities, and better when it come to LD (Embolden Warlock).
Another thing we need to take into consideration is the CC/anti AV capability the Guardian unit provides: The Warlock can take any AV in CC, very useful to dispose of contesting vehicles, making the Guardians an all rounder the Avengers aren't, the reason I feel they are the better choice of the two on foot.
That and the Wraithlord's baby sitting.

Also, it is in my opinion that we shouldn't rely on a BS 3 Weapon Platform to actually perform in the game, bur yes a Brightlance would be a nice addition.
BUT, the reason I prefer to go the Scatter Laser way is precisely related to their low BS: Sure the BL can score a solid hit in the game (did it once or twice) but if you begin to think at what kind of units that can/will try to get to a rear Objective - We usually think about fast and/or low AV units where the Scatter Laser is a better choice IMO (Ork Trukks, Raiders, Landspeeders, Vypers).
The BL may be a better choice though IF we downgrade one WL's weaponry to Anti-horde instead of Anti-Tank.

A last point Eothen: You yourself rendered the need from ranged footslogging support from the Avengers redundant by incorporating the Scatter Walkers, permitting the Wave Serpent squad to concentrate on Objective grabbing and flanking drive by... Kudos, that was a good idea. :)

Quote
This is without any of the units are mounted in a Waveserpents. If they get a transport the issue is about points as Guardians can do the Avengers job, a bit worse and a bit cheaper. And Guardian assaults with their flamers aren't bad (They are really good, but a bit exposed after they fired).
Stormies Flaming squad is very good, better than Avengers VS true hordes and also cheaper as you mentioned. However, I pondered about Terminators, Bikes and Meganobz and I think that in these instance forcing saves from a distance is better than a in-your-face shooting as you will have a chance to save the Avengers where Guardians will die.
Better, why? Because these are usually the dangerous ones to the Wraithguard and sometimes there is no choice but try to remove a bit of the threat from range before allowing the WG to enter the 12" CC bubble of say, Thunder Hammer Termies, thus the Avenger superior range.
The Avengers' better save is also superior in a drive by style of shooting, as you can disembark in relative open and still have a save against small arms.

Quote
Now it comes to the other two troop options, rangers and jetbikes.

For picking a piece of terrain and sticking to It Rangers seem to be the obvious answer. This depends on the amount of "ignore cover save" weapons in the other army. Those weapons would still take out Guardians... and perhaps Avengers too so I wouldn't really hold that problem against the Rangers. Rangers also got superior amount of shoots at long range compared to Avengers and Guardian defenders. Something that is needed in the slow and short ranged Iyanden army.
I didn't face Cover ignoring weapons yet (bar Flamers), but I believe that most of these only ignore 5+ Saves at most, so I wouldn't worry too much for the Avengers.

Now the Rangers/Pathfinders: I like these, very much, they are so annoying to our opponents to take out from range that they usually have to commit a unit to rapid fire range or CC to dispose of them, which usually play in our hand (bait unit). In that competitive list situation though I didn't include them for the very reason I believe that Guardians are superior to the Avengers in that role: WL's babysitting AND an AT capabilities.
Their Long Rifle is nice (special rule + Rending) but I think that a weapon platform in the Defenders is about as good to take out AV.

Quote
Last we have the Jetbikes. The troop choice that best complement the Wraithguards as this unit can move over the wall or shoot over it and then return to safety. More Iyanden lists should include these, as they provide more movement and light firepower combined with the ability to take objectives later in the game. Their problem is that the enemy realise that they should kill them and that bikes isn't really that hard to kill. But compared to other troops they can survive a few shots of light fire.
Agreed on all points, I am myself pulling my hairs out to find a way to convert mine into (Ghost Riders), and I think that a squad of 6 is needed if you want them to have a decent influence on the game, but that is more moc065's turf...

The points that held me off to propose them is again: WL's babysitting and the relative ease to kill their low numbers, whereas a unit of Guardians in Cover and Going to Ground will also get a 3+ Save...

Quote
For some more tweaking (I know, I just go on and on and on and...):
Not at all! I like long disgressions on tactics and units usefulness, and you seems to have a good grasp of what work and what doesn't, and more importantly, a different viewpoint. If everyone is thinking the same we'd become predictable, right?

Some more discussions like this and I am thinking of putting your ramblings thoughts together as article on unit synergy. ;)

Quote
- I haven't thought about having Guardian defenders in the rear, grabbing an objective, just to have a Warlock ready to support Wraithlords. Perhaps this is essential for the maximum fire power Wraithlord? And perhaps this Warlock should be a Spiritseer? I usually move my Wraithlords up with the Wraithguard so they can remain within the spiritseers bubble, and then perhaps make them follow the Farseer or the Harlequins. But If another Warlock is needed the Guardian defenders can be a viable choice. But then, why not give them a Brightlance and some responsibility for picking of tanks? BS3 is bad, I know, but a lonesome Scatterlaser isn't better... By removing the Wraithsword we could be able to change the Scatterlaser to a Brightlance and upgrade the Warlock to a Spiritseer. Do we need 4 Brightlances in this army, combined with all the close combat vehicle killing of the Wraithlords and the Wraithcannons on the Wraithguards? Perhaps we could redo one of the Wraithlord into a "warwalker", by giving him a Scatterlaser and a Shuriken Cannon?
I believe that the weapon given to the Guardians need to be a support option to our other units: Right now, we have a great many AT in the army (3 Brightlance already) and the Wraithguard, that's why I tried to diversify the anti-horde/amti-ligh AV firepower, as we can't expect the Walkers to last very long.

The problem I have with walking a (or both) Wraithlord with the Wraithguard is the lack of readily available Cover (MCs need to be half hidden), whereas a solid clump of Cover provide for a good defensive Firebase for both the Guardians and the Lord(s) as well as being an excellent place to put an Objective in.
If Cover is available, I agree that walking one (or even two) WL(s) with the Wraithguard my be a very good solution, especially VS weak CC armies where you actually want to have the Lords in close range.

Quote
- Can you manage with 3 jetbikes in this edition or do you need 6 for them to be worth the points? If you can manage with 3, It could be possibly to change the Guardian defenders to a Jetbike squadron and 5 normal rangers. We just need 25 - 35 points from somewhere.

- And still, 136pts, that another Dire Avenger squad. But perhaps we have enough shurikens in the list? If so, perhaps the guardian Brightlance isn't that bad? Or some more manoeuvrability with the jetbikes?
You have my arguments on these already, we need at least on Serpent borne Scoring Unit, and ideally one that can support the Lords if Cover isn't available - which tend to be the case in many Tourney events.

If we are to drop the gurdians for another unit, then I'd suggest we also drop one Wraithlord due to Wraithsight and Cover which can (and will) be problematic.

I suggest that you come up with your own variant(s) (Jetbike/Rangers) in this thread that we can examine and discuss it. I like your ideas and comments, they open diffrent perspectives. :)

Keep them coming,

   Starky

P.S. I can be long winded too. :D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Spiritwarroir on January 6, 2009, 02:05:48 PM
I have been hearing that all the superheavy are killing Apocalypse games.  Now as a Ghost worlders I have had little trouble with then.  WG and HH WL seen to solve my superheavy issues. Does any one else find that you end up killing the Super-heavies for your side in Apocalypse?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Eothen on January 6, 2009, 04:14:22 PM
@Starrakatt

Ok, you have me convinced for the guardian defenders in this actual army list.

It's just that I find the role of the Guardians a bit problematic. They cost heaps of points, especially with a Warlock, and tend both to not kill anything and die easy. But I guess that they should survive a bit more with a babysitter.

Now I started getting all kinds of weird ideas about units jumping over the Wraithwall. I wonder if there is a really good way to optimise this theme without dying the Pie-plate death or just getting swamped in cc... *thinking hard* :/
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Spiritwarroir on January 6, 2009, 04:28:09 PM
I tend to back up my 10 WG with 2 WL and 10 harlequins or 5 shining spears.  Flip belts mean anchoring terrain is nor a problem or jet bike go over the top.  Both are best an the assault and have Hit and run.  The furry of kiss than happen can kill storm shield termis just fine.  both are expensive and fragile so the WG/WL draw fire if at all posable.  I have also use Yrial.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: BubbaMack on January 6, 2009, 09:17:42 PM
Hello all. I just finished my first Wraithlord.  Please check it out here Clicky (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=176156.0) and let me know what you think.  It's only about 50% painted and I will updated it once it is truly complete.  Any ideas of how to make it better are appreciated.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on January 7, 2009, 12:02:03 AM
@ Bubba,

Great pic. I just need a digi-cam or camera for mine. :(
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on January 7, 2009, 11:38:28 AM
I'd like to post my default 1500 for you to critique:

Eldrad [***]
I use him instead of getting 2 farseers with subpar combat and gear qualifications. Eldrad can at least make up for CC v Big Guys or nasty lord load-outs.
Maugan Ra [***]
He's a key to CC support of my front line plus the shooty part of him is awesome.

Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
My front rank more than likely Fortuned.
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Second Rank also Fortuned.

(2) Wraithlord [150] Brightlance, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
My actual AV14 killers in CC or tie up CC opponents, if not doing that they're doing their actual role - Fire Support.

This list is yes Objective diminished, but the actual main objective is destroy the enemy line and kill troops choices. Any opponents would be more than glad to trade blow against them, unknowingly killing their own units against it. This list has proven itself W18/D4/L3. Horde armies tend to getaway from it in the end.

@Starky:

IMHO, the list is good, but I will insert my opinion on each squad area, if neccessary.

HQ: 300 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts (or Avatar)
Keep Yriel, since he can get inserted in a squad and benefit from Fortune saves. Although, the Avatar will probably take an amount of heat in the fight.

- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Fortune & Doom - 145 pts
It is in my opinion that this configuration should be a great default for any or most Eldar Army w/ Farseers.

ELITE: 206 Pts
- Harlequins X 8 w/ 8 Kisses, Shadowseer - 206 pts
You seem to have a few spare points and maybe gather a few more from other sources; can't you get a Troop Master w/ kiss or power weapon? OR you could just reduce some of it and give some upgrade to certain other units.

TROOP: 818 Pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
Great main Wraithbone Wall.

- Dire Avengers x 10 Exarch with Shuricen storm & Additional Shuriken Catapult - 152 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Brightlance, Spirit Stone - 145 pts
I usually take my DA like this giving them a tank hunting vehicle.

- Guardian Defenders X 10 w/ Scatter Laser, Warlock w/ Embolden – 125 pts
A funny feeling that this will just sit on an objective and pot shot a few squad, maybe cause minor damages. I would rather suggest take a Pathfinder x5 for 120 pts, and save it towards the Troop Master for the Harlies.

HEAVY: 415 Pts
- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & Wraithblade, 2 Flamers - 140 pts
Monster Hunter?? Having rerolls to hit in combat is unneccessary, if what you're fighting are either Terminators w/ SS/TH (which more than likely due to the 3++) awesome to tie up units, but I think he's better to be fire support and he does have A2 stat. I would spend the points on better equipment.

- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & EML, 2 Flamers – 155 pts
I see this as a Tank Hunting - Fire Support. Great asset.

- Warwalker squadron X 2 Scatterlasers (x4) - 120 pts
My guess is this is your answer to horde fronts? I would take a Fire Prism for S9 cup cake or S5 deep dish.


FAST: 0 Pts

TOTAL: 1739 Pts
- 3 Scoring Units, 10 KP, 47 models (including Vehicles/MCs)

Overall, I like the list and the suggestions, I embedded are probably MY only changes from it and it would make it more formidable to take on all-comers.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: moc065 on January 8, 2009, 01:29:49 PM
Please do not double post, OK... use the Modify post button..

Aside from that.. I really like the flavour of this last list... and with only the smallest tweeks I think it is more than playable and competitive.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 11, 2009, 10:41:21 AM
@haunt: Thanks for the comments. ;) I will answer your suggestions as well as I can, as they are all quite valid in mu view:
- Guardians VS Pathfinders: I also like Pathfinders, use them about as often as I use Guardians and sometomes together instead of the Avengers - Both worked well for me, but IMHO the Wraithsight negating is that very little thing that make the Guardians superior in that case.
Do not forget that they can G to Ground if they are shot at, thus gaining a +1 to their Cover Save, which should make them survive a good deal of firepower, especially with Embolden.

- Troupe Master: Yes he's a nice upgrade but that's a 20 pts I am not ready to spend in there. A worst, Yriel and the Sword armed WL are there to negate Saves in CC.

- Wraithsword: The brightlance is there in case tehre were a Demolisher or Land Raider, really. The Wraithblade is quite handy to deal with annoying MCs, Dreadnoughts, ICs, moving vehicles. Mosty that.
A) Once got a WL stuck in CC vs 5 GK for 7 friggin CC Turns, 15 attacks later I killed 3 of them (one with NO Retreat!) That was awful.
B) Once got 2 WLs assaulted by a Flyrant and a Fex: After three CC Turn I lost the one fighting the Tyrant, that one on it's last wound - Had I had the sword I'd have killed it.
After four Turns of CC the other killed the Fex, with the sword I'd have finished it in two...
C) Three weeks ago, couldn't hit that bloody Hellhound in CC.
D) Last week, couldn't hit that bloody Rhino in CC. The one full of SMurfs...

Yup, we lose a gun with the Sword, but the more I play 5th ed the more I find that games are often won by CC, that and everything is so friggin fast to get in said CC, best to have option - My thinking. ;)

- Warwalkers: First chocie was a prism, as you suggested, but Valar brought good arguments for the Walkers - Dunno, in my mind both are good, in their respective ways...
Ever tried the Walker Bombtm? Just throw the Walker(s) on an Ork mob with some Powerklaws and Doom the gits, you'll see what I mean. ;D

Now, your list:
Quote from: haunt on January  7, 2009, 11:38:28 AM
I'd like to post my default 1500 for you to critique:

Eldrad [***]
I use him instead of getting 2 farseers with subpar combat and gear qualifications. Eldrad can at least make up for CC v Big Guys or nasty lord load-outs.
Maugan Ra [***]
He's a key to CC support of my front line plus the shooty part of him is awesome.

Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
My front rank more than likely Fortuned.
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Second Rank also Fortuned.

(2) Wraithlord [150] Brightlance, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
My actual AV14 killers in CC or tie up CC opponents, if not doing that they're doing their actual role - Fire Support.

This list is yes Objective diminished, but the actual main objective is destroy the enemy line and kill troops choices. Any opponents would be more than glad to trade blow against them, unknowingly killing their own units against it. This list has proven itself W18/D4/L3. Horde armies tend to getaway from it in the end.
- I like Ra, he massacred his fair load of SMurfs last week VS the 20 December Tourney's winner I attended.
- Eldrad is very good from every point of view, I almost included him in some of my list but decided no in the end, for my gaming group is very fluff sticky. I'd reserve him for very competitive Tourney gaming.

- Both Wraithguard: Good choices in themselves. I would prefer to take more faster/anti horde units as Troop but I ubderstand that you play a Ghost Force, so I guess it's okay.

-Wraithlords: Frankly, I have problem with the armament you gave them. Sure the Scatter Laser and Brightlance are both good but both together? I would make a lord Brightlance/EML (or Starcannon for AP 2 goodness) and the other Scatter/EML for anti horde/light to medium AV duty.
Like this they both have a defined role instead of being jacks of all trade - Oh, and they still do excellent anti-horde with their Flamers.

The main weakness of the list is I think hevay duty anti horde and some heavy duty CC capabilities, but I agree that against unprepared opponents, or any opponent not geared with many high STR power weapon attacks the list can be quite dangerous.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on January 12, 2009, 12:16:45 AM
Thanks for input Starky, I was able to use it in a LGS and I happen to fight 3 IG Armies and mostly armored, or a Battle Cannon line w/ Lisk Supports. Little to say, I won all 3 due to Fortune and Wraithcannons.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 13, 2009, 09:58:02 AM
Hi guys, three things today:

1) I just remembered that BubbaMack (who just made Guardian) and haunt (still Civilian but on his way up!) hadn't had any official welcome yet, glad to have you aboard guys.
In the same stride, I'd like to congrats Valar for his promotion to Bonesinger for his dedicated work on his series of Painting Articles (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg1920762#msg1920762) and Tournament participation with Iyanden lists. I hope for battle reports one of these day.

2) Tourney's Batrep (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=176593.0) is up! Two actual games in the Tourney itself, followed by taking on the Tourney's winner (I got 4th place) at home. ;)

3) Tomorrow afternoon I get to try the Iyanden Competitive List against a SMurf player. He does know the list, so I asked him to tool up against me - He's not a bad player either, although he isn't very familiar with 5th ed yet, but we shall see... Batrep will follow.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on January 13, 2009, 11:28:08 AM
Quote
In the same stride, I'd like to congrats Valar for his promotion to Bonesinger for his dedicated work on his series of Painting Articles and Tournament participation with Iyanden lists. I hope for battle reports one of these day.

And thankyou for the promotion!

Haha good timiming Starky so you may get lucky actually, this Friday im going to Gamesworkshop with a mate (Koval) and we're going to get in a few games there, il take some pics record everything and make a few battle reports, specially for you lol.   Where would you like them posted?  On the PoC or in the battle report board? 

Il ask Koval if he wants to write up his half of the story aswell because I prefer the battle reports that are told in a narrative/comic tone rather than this happened and then this happened... so going back to the good old battle reports in WD of old.

EDIT:  Unfortunatly that plan will have to be scrapped, Koval can no longer make this Friday so I am stuck with no one to game... I may try and find someone else to play on Sunday, or failing that I may just show up at GW and play a stranger or member of staff, sorry about the undelivered promise but im sure myself and Koval can rearrange for another epic battle soon.  However I think to keep you all happy soon I will get a whole army pic as my army stands now so you can see my Iyanden warhost.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Draza on January 20, 2009, 02:28:08 AM
Well went to a friends tournament on the weekend and thought it be cool to test out my Wraith-themed army again (only used it twice). Didn't play the full amount of games (missed a weekend), so ended with an average that would've given me third place. Heres a quick run down [will be doing a story based off 3 of the games in the battle report section]. Many funky missions and used a combination of 4th/5th edition scoring rules

1200pts

Farseer
-ROWarding, SS, Doom, fortune

6 Harlequins
-All with kisses and a shadowseer upgrade

10 Wraithguard
-spiritseer with conceal

6 Pathfinders

4 Jetbikes
-shuriken cannon

Wraithlord
-EML
-SC

Wraithlord
-SC
-WS

Game One-vs Chaos Daemons and Chaos Marines
Started off with a doubles game and I was allied with a Tyranid player (fluffy I know :D). It was good, as I was able to use his friendly psykers to help my Wraithlords. I managed to get all my secret objectives complete, while my ally got got his secondary objective. Enemy was totally annihilated.
Wraithguard killed a soul grinder, 3 Blood letters, 5 Marines, 5 more marines and a Thousand son squad. A wraithlord also destroyed a Soul grinder. Harlequins held back, but eventually managed to kill a Plaguebearer squad and Masque. My Pathfinders did well, even managing to kill 2 charging Daemonettes in combat.
Highlight was when a flamer squad [with Blue scribes] deep struck near one of my Wraithlords. Another Horror squad almost mishapped into the flamer squad, but landed safely behind the flamers (1"). Flamers used their template and did one wound to the Lord. Scribes fired two Bolts into the Lord and did a single wound. With one wound left, the Horror squad decided not to attack my jetbikes and try to save themselves against the Lord. He wounded with the Bolt, but due to how close he was to the flamers, I got a save which I made. Both squads then died to my mass attack.

Game Two against Blood angels
Huge distance away from the Blood angels to start with (over 48" away I believe). He had a Chaplain, Death company, Tactical squad, Lascannon razorback, lascannon Dreadnoughts, Scouts (with heavy bolter), Assault squad and a Devastator squad [lascannon/missile launcher).
Essentially this game came down to neither army wanting to engage. I didn't want to get within range of his death company and he didn't want to get within range of my Harlequins/Wraithlords. So essentially I just stood there and took a lot of heavy weapon fire, that only resulted in 4 Dead Wraithguard and 1 jetbike. My return fire was pretty decent. Immobilized Dreadnought and Razorback, a destroyed Marine squad and assault squad.
My Pathfinders did well. They started the game by missing all 6 shots. In reply, the assault marine lost a guy jumping out of ruins, missed their pistol shots and failed a difficult terrain charge. Pathfinders then went on to have a better game, including pinning a Marine squad twice.
Game was a draw, we both got our secondary objectives (I didn't get my primary which was to get 75% casualties on his army). Surprisingly he didn't infiltrate to capture my objective with his scouts, which he needed to do. My Pathfinders ended up doing that.

Game Three vs Tyranids
Hive Tyrant with venom cannon, 2 Tyrant Guard, Carnifex with TL-barb strangler, squad of Termagaunts, squad of Hormagaunts, 3 Lictors, 8 Genestealers and 3 Zoanthropes [psychic scream].
Mission was timestorm, which involved rolling a D6 for each unit. On a roll of one, they were removed and had to deep strike back in that turn. Incredibly annoying for me, as it almost cost me my Harlequins, DS my WS-equipped Wraithlord twice and removed a Zoanthrope my Wraithlord was in combat with.
Quite simply, my army was too tough for him. His hormagaunts on the charge bounced off my Guard, failing to deliver a single kill. They got run down. Pathfinders delt 3 AP1 hits in a single turn of shooting to kill the Carnifex. Zoanthropes suffered perils every time they tried to take a psychic test and one even died because of it.
I sacrficed my jetbikes to save my Harlequins. The genestealers charged them and my counter-charge with Harlies wiped out the Stealers. Hive Tyrant got into combat, but did little. The Harlequins on the charge killed off his bodyguard and at the end of my turn 5 the Hive Tyrant was on 2 wounds.
With 5 Harlequins and Doom on the Hive Tyrant, I expected to kill it. It was my primary objective to do so. Instead the mission rules screwed me over, as the Tyrant deep striked out of combat and the game ended with random game length. Still managed to win through my secondary objective [table quarters].

Game Four vs Imperial Guard
Guard army with 2 Chimeras, Leman Russ, Missile launcher, autocannon, lascannon and grenade launchers. Storm troopers also present.
Only had to keep him out of my deployment zone and capture his objective (which was on my side of the table, which I captured with Harlequins). I decided to advance anyway, just to make it a fun game. In the end, I lost a total of 1 Wraithguard (in assault), 1 jetbike, 1 ranger and one Wraithlord. A direct battle cannon hit didnt even manage to kill a Wraithguard. I immobilized one of his Chimeras, stopping him from getting to his objective. He got extremely unlucky. Last turn, my Pathfinders killed 3 of his Command squad and they ran. His primary was to keep his HQ alive. I win via a massacre

Game 5 vs Chaos Marines
Chaos Sorcerer, Thousand Sons, 5 Marine squads, Rhino, Defiler and Dreadnought with extra CCW and a Predator.
Had some extreme bad luck, which resulted in me failing pretty much failing every difficult terrain charge or rolling really low with fleet.
Primary was to get a scoring troop off the enemies table edge (forgot to outflank Pathfinders to do this). I expected the jetbikes to do this. I delivered two glancing hits and two penetrating hits to a defiler with my Wraithcannons. It lost only a single DCCW. I failed a charge from what I believe was 4" away so the Defiler moved away, fleeted six inches and killed my Jetbikes.
I knew I had lost, since my opponent got rid of one of his troop choices off my table edge, so he achieved at least one objective. In the end, I only had a Farseer, two Pathfinders and a Farseer left. He only had a Predator and two Marines. I achieved my Secondary objective which was table quarters. His secondary was also table quarters, so I stopped him getting points for that. So ended the game with a minor loss.

Game 6 (vs Imperial Guard)
Another doubles game, against two Imperial Guard players. I teamed with a Daemons player. Second turn was intense, as I lost 7 Wraithguard and my opponent had a squad reduced to 3 Daemonettes. My Wraithguard managed to not get hurt the next turn (after destroying some Storm troopers). I then did a triple charge against an immobilized Leman Russ, Command squad and Platoon, effectively cutting off plenty of firepower. I lost two Wraithguard to a power fist, but destroyed the Leman Russ and both Platoons.
My Wraithlords and Harlequins chilled on my left flank practically unsupported. I killed two Sentinels and lost a Wraithlord. When some Screamers came down, I decided to charge everything towards the enemy. They aimed at the Screamers and Lord, killing just the Screamers. This left the Harlequins to kill storm troopers in some ruins and a Wraithlord to kill a Chimera. Return fire left the Lord on a single wound. He the double flamed a squad in ruins to cinders and the Harlequins destroyed a russ. My right flank was well held by mass Horrors. Horrors are scary good.
We both ended up getting both our objectives. I managed to get a troop choice off the enemies table edge by actually using outflank. The enemy lost everything except a Leman Russ and Chimera

Overall found the list extremely tough and did what it was suppose to do really well, which was to survive. It certainly caught a lot of people off Guard. May put the list away for a while to get some aspects back into it. Want to do a bit more killing next time and let my opponents kill more than 5 models in a game

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on January 20, 2009, 01:49:38 PM
@Valar: Mmm, well we of the Craftworld of the dead are a patient lot, jus take your time... ;)

@Draza: Wow, thanks for the Tourney's report Draza - It well prove that Wraith lists can work well enough in (relatively) low point games - Sheer toughness pays. ;D

You have your lot of Wins in there, congrats for pulling them out. About IG: The more I play them (with their actual obsolete Codex) the more I have it easy to net wins, I guess that they just don't have the what it take to really wipe the floor of Iyandenesque builds, firepower don't quite cut it and CC is a no-no for them...
And SM armies doesn't have the points to take Termies/LR, one of the rare real threat to the (Fortuned) Wraithguard, the others I reckon would be MCs, some ICs, Rending/Power weapons units and Nobz.

Thanks for sharing, can't wait for the batreps. :)


I've just realised I didn't get the finalised Competitive List up for all to see, so there it is:

HQ: 310 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Runes of Witnessing, Fortune & Doom - 155 pts

ELITE: 206 Pts
- Harlequins X 8 w/ 8 Kisses, Shadowseer - 206 pts

TROOP: 818 Pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
- Dire Avengers x 10, Exarch w/ Bladestorm & Dual Catapult - 152 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Brightlance, Spirit Stone - 145 pts
- Guardian Defenders X 10 w/ Scatter Laser, Warlock w/ Embolden – 125 pts

HEAVY: 415 Pts
- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & Wraithblade, 2 Flamers - 140 pts
- Wraithlord w/ Brightlance & EML, 2 Flamers – 155 pts
- Warwalker squadron X 2 Scatterlasers (x4) - 120 pts

FAST: 0 Pts

TOTAL: 1749 Pts
- 3 Scoring Units, 10 KP, 47 models (including Vehicles/MCs)

Okay, I've got to test it against an Ultramarine player - I asked him to tool up for my list and go for my throat, as I want the hardest, meanest armies thrown at the list for playtest.
Unsurpringly, he ended up fielding Thunder Hammer/Strom Shiled Termies, Calgar and a lot of heavy weapons, along with three Scoring Units (Sniper Scouts, 2 Tac squads).

I can tell you I've got a run for my money and some units really counterperformed in their designated roles while other shone with efficiency, dice rolling really wasn't complying as it should have that day...

Batrep coming soon. ;)

My impression so far is that I think a second tank would be very useful to Tank Shock enemy uni(s) out of an Objective, the single Serpent (as moc065 once said) is screaming 'SHOOT ME' all over the board but beside that the army functioned properly, although I could have come up with better tactical solutions in the game - But then, that goes too for my opponent.

So, the question is: Should we try to get that second tank in (Serpent/Prism) at the cost of the Walkers or a Wraithlord or should the army be tried further?

And yes, if at all possible it would be quite, VERY apreciated if the POC members could playtest the list themselves at home or at Tourneys, and I know some of you actually DO some gaming around. ;)

    Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: -V- on January 20, 2009, 04:58:16 PM
@ Starky, thanks for the patience, I actually have a couple of games coming up this thursday hopefully so I'l be sure to post bat reps about them.

In my oppinion I would substitute the Walkers out for a second serpent or a Fireprism, its about the same cost, and both are much much more survivable options than war walkers.  I currently run a 2 serpent army and let me tell you its sweet, its fast, reactive and tankshock and ramming works very well and I have found that most opponents never expect to be tankshocked, its a nasty tactic indeed.

Il post up how my 2 serpents do next game.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on January 21, 2009, 01:46:44 AM
Could any or all of you check my list for a week tourney:

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=177067.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=177067.0)

Would like your opinion about it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: f.desrochers on January 21, 2009, 08:19:11 AM
@haunt:  I took a look at the list and left some comments and in particular, a few questions on the list.

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: haunt on January 21, 2009, 12:01:07 PM
Thanks, I have modified it a little and left comments for understanding of the use of each unit.

------

I was able to test it a little and it is effective, the serpents do cause havok on both me and my enemies. Why me? I play aggressively and go Flat-out to my objectives.

-----------------

01/28/09

Getting all details in a nice BatRep (Fluffed) - Won a 1500 pts Army of my choosing. Woot!!!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: BubbaMack on February 5, 2009, 03:29:07 PM
Good day to you all.

I managed two games this last weekend and was inspired by the Eldrad Maugan combo.  The first was against Tau in which I squeaked out a win in the bottom of the 6th turn when I tank shocked a squad of fire warriors of an objective to win 2-1.  It was a rough win with his list including 13 crisis suits, broadsides and a rail-head.  The highlight was watching my CC Wraith Lord pimp slap his HQ (some IC who's name escapes me right now, but he's decent in CC)

The second game was a bit more exciting against Chaos Marines.  We both had similar setups with a solid fire base and an 'away' team.  We both deployed in opposite corners with our transport(s) in front of each others bases.  Mine was stocked with 5 reapers, 5 Pathfinders (holding the objective), 9 Scorpions (counter charge), 6 Dragons,  Eldrad, 15 Guardians w/scatter and warlock, and EML/BL Wraith Lord.  My away team consisted of 10 DA's in Wave Serpent(TL BL, S-Cannon) followed by 7 Harlies all kisses, troupe master and Shadow seer (both with PW) and a deathjester, Wraith Lord Scatter/WS, and my new best friend Maugan Ra. I used my Serpent as a shield moving 12, allowing the Lord/Maugan/DJ to shoot, then star engine move back in front to provide cover.  That  many S6 shots wreaked havoc on his base.  He deployed to tac squads in rhinos that only moved 12 his first turn then proceeded to get nailed on my first shooting phase, 1 wrecked and 1 immobilized.  He was then forced to foot slog his squads towards my reapers resulting in him loosing an average of 6 marines to each volley of fire from then.  The rest were quickly dispatched by the lord/pathfinders/scatter laser combos.  I thought I had it in the bag until he deep struck the most horrifying squad of chaos termies, all with power weapons led by a sorcerer in terminator armor right next to my harlequins.  He lashed them into range and murdered them in one turn.  Maugan managed to put two wounds on the sorcerer before getting pounded by warp time.  After that we called it a game seeing how he couldn't contest my objective, nor i his.   

It was by far the most fun I've had playing Eldar.  My opponent really makes sure having fun is the priority, which makes it a great game for both.  I informed him our next game I plan to take 3 troops full of wraith guard, to which he replied "awesome, I can't wait!"  We both agree taking units for the 'fun' factor is a blast.  I should be finished casting my guard by next week and I am really looking forward to seeing how they perform.  I might even manage to crank out 40 which would be a sight to see.  Till then.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden - The Ghost Warriors -
Post by: Starrakatt on February 6, 2009, 09:22:52 AM
Quote from: BubbaMack on February  5, 2009, 03:29:07 PM
Good day to you all.
And to you.

Thanks for sharing your experience... although it wasn't a wraithlist and thus of little relevance to the POC - But you had two Wraithlords, so lets say that you pass (barely). ;)
BTW, if you haven't experimented it yet, Wraithguard en masse do wonders vs non mech T'au - They (usually) just don't have the kind of firepower/cc power to kill many them, especially Fortuned ones.

Yes, Maugan Ra work very well with either Harlies, Pathfinders or Wraithguard, and most PLs (okay, NOT Baharroth) perform well enough with any size of Wraithguard unit, and I won't even comment on Eldrad - the ol' bastard is just great. You can see my last batrep HERE (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=176593.0) where I fielded Mr. Ra along with WGs on the third match - The star of the game, really.

Quote
It was by far the most fun I've had playing Eldar.  My opponent really makes sure having fun is the priority, which makes it a great game for both.  I informed him our next game I plan to take 3 troops full of wraith guard, to which he replied "awesome, I can't wait!"  We both agree taking units for the 'fun' factor is a blast.
Can't wait either. ;)

At what point level are you planning to play? 3 TROOP Wraithguard is an awful amount of points...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on February 21, 2009, 11:11:32 AM
Well, folks I won a $150 prize for model expenses, so I went ahead and bought more Wraithguards!!!

That places my Wraithguard tally to 60 models total now. 30 more and I have a full compliment of Troops and Elite, in truth I just need 5 more and I have the Elite compliment done and they're all in Wave Serpents too.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on February 23, 2009, 12:31:14 AM
You mean, the Tourney you got to with your Starcannon and Suicide Squadtm list? Well, congrats for the prize, but I also remember you saying that you were to bless us with a battle report to show us how you fared, right?

Or at least a resumé: What armies did you faced, scenarios, etc... ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on February 23, 2009, 02:56:06 PM
I am right beside Starky, waiting to see pics, or batreps, etc... what ever you can disclose.

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Spiritwarroir on February 25, 2009, 04:46:27 PM
I have been playing Apocalypse games.  I have been losing me 7 Wraith Lord Spirit host do to massed fire power.  The campaign has several old hands on the Imperial side.  So I am thinking of transports for my spirit host.  Has any one used Vampires for Wraithlords?  I am also thinking of building a super Vampire for the Spirit host.  I have use Strategic redeployment and flank march but the old hands just have the Titans fire on me even if they hit their own troops. So any one have options for transporting Wraithlords?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on February 25, 2009, 05:27:47 PM
You could look at Epic 40K for references: The Eldar have a nice Superheavy Tank variant of the Scorpion/Cobra called a Storm Serpent - Basically as Scorpion with a lowly Falcon turret but that sports a huge Wraithgate at the front from which you could possibly pour your Wraith Host through.

Not familiar with Epic though...
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KOnline%2Fm1250782_99060304042_EPICStormSerpe.jpg&hash=39551a86cac9ad31bbe9ae2c62a072e33e08d9a2)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on February 26, 2009, 12:33:10 AM
There's actually the Tempest which is similar to both the Scorpion/Cobra Chassis, although the best to use to pave through vehicles are Cobras and Sunstorm Squadrons (6 Fire Prisms preferably.)

Since you're asking for Transports, use the Vampire Raiders and you'd say you won't use anymore other transports.  ;D  I did took out Warhounds/Baneblades with 5 Wraithguard + guideseers strong units in a serpent.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on February 26, 2009, 08:53:39 AM
As haunt says, if you can manage to get a good number of Wraithguard/Wraithlords in range of superheavies they should die: Last game we had 25 Wraithguard and 2 Wraithlords enter behind a pair of Baneblades and a Necron Pylon - That was FUN, although the Pylon survived on it's last Structure Point...

Another thing to consider to take out these pesky Titans is Fire Dragons (if you have some). Load as many of the guys in Serpents/Falcons (maybe with Fuegan) and get in Melta Range - Just Tank Shock the opposition to make them room - BOOM.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Spiritwarroir on February 26, 2009, 09:46:40 AM
I have done the Wave Serpent charge, the old hands know me to well and they kill the transports as soon as they can.  The primary threat is a Reaver Class Titan and it's body guard of 2 baneblades and a White Scars Marines.  I have flanked marched 20 Wraith Guard behind it, now the Chapter Master and body Guard plus Bikers sit around it's feet every game.  Bad Dice I shook every weapon crew on it but only did 3 structure points of damage.  The next game the Reaver Class Titan spent the first two turns concentrating on me.  So I need another option.  Also I am Looking for a scratch build.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on February 26, 2009, 06:56:26 PM
Hello loyal servants of the spirit host... wow that was nerdy lol

I thought id give you all a sneak peek of Wraithlord number 3.  So far no one anywhere else on this site has seen these pics and I thought it most appropriate that I start by sharing with my fellow Iyanden comrades where else than on the PoC.

I will wait a while before posting this in more general threads such as path of the warrior and painting forum to give you a peek before anyone else...

See being in the PoC has its benefits no?

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FDSCF0097.jpg&hash=b73e3d95a4c40f7b59c1108e964665126451e5c3)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FDSCF0095.jpg&hash=c5946e804507b5473b61799dfad7c8fd4bab7043)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FDSCF0100.jpg&hash=139fc40d4aac4dc6731b940eab61dc680b24c842)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FDSCF0103.jpg&hash=5a10f377c1167dd4e467928c053641e1a5a0e47e)


Easily my favourite of the three so far!  what do you guys think?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on February 26, 2009, 11:40:01 PM
I have always liked Wraithlords and awesome pics.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on February 28, 2009, 09:13:38 AM
Quote from: Valar on February 26, 2009, 06:56:26 PM
Hello loyal servants of the spirit host... wow that was nerdy lol
I give you a special dispensation... ;)

That's a seriously good looking Wraithlord, definitely superior to the second one - I really like the running/rushing pose, looks natural and fluid (Links here for the FIRST (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=175548.0) and SECOND (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=175548.msg2156303#msg2156303) WLs for the curious) but I have my doubts if it surpass the first one... I shall reserve judgement until I see them both painted. ;)

Is the pose/model finished already or are you to add details/greenstuff works on it? Do you intend to build a handle/stock on the EML or is it supposed to be mounted on the shoulder and kinda held temporarily in the hand?

@Spiritwarroir: Do you actually have superheavies on your own? I found that the best ways of dealing with enemy legendary units is to bring your own...

Have you tried the Cloudstrike Squadron formation? Loading three with Fire Dragons, along with their Charged Pulse Laser speial rule should be able to take out the Reaver Titan, by far the nost threat to your Spirit Host (and yes, I realise it is many points).

Second: You talk about scratch building: What about building your own Superheavy orbital battery (and Titan killer), Eldar version? The Datafax (Imperial version) can be found on the GW site I believe.

You could also hit the gits in three waves: Get all you force in Reserve ) or out of LOS), blast the SM escort with Orbital Bombardment and Scheduled Bombardment (hopefully stripping the Reaver from it's Void Field), then blast the Titan/Baneblade from range with your own Superheavy, be it Pulsar armed Vampires or Scorpion(s)/Cobra(s) then get that Flank Marching Wave Serpents/Cloudstrike Squadrons in and finish off the formation.

From what I understand of the game, the main problem is the Reaver Titan (D weaponry), not the Baneblades. I found that my Scorpions moving behind Cover (big ruins) are VERY resilient with 2X 4+ Saves versus anything NOT 'D' weaponry, where the Pulsars chew through the Baneblades (ignore Cover).

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on February 28, 2009, 04:04:10 PM
Honestly, if you're playing Apoc never rely on covers v D-Weaponries, since it blasts right through it and it ignores all terrain covers (Am still waiting for an answer for Speed Cover and so far many says that's can't be affected by the D-Weapons ignore rule due to its not a terrain but actual speed.)  :'( My best suggestion is to use Fire Dragons and 1 Autarch in 3 Wave Serpent and don't forget to stick a fortune seer in it just move 24 inches and maybe an additional 12 inches if with a star engines.

After that you know what to do.  :D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Spiritwarroir on February 28, 2009, 08:51:52 PM
I do not have any super heavies.  So I am thinking of building one.  As such I what it to be of use with my 7 WL 20 WG spirit host.  SO I was thinking of a transport but other ideas are good.         
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 1, 2009, 12:03:35 AM
If you're to build 1 for APOC Eldar, build a Eldar Warlock Phantom Titan.

When you do make 1 and field 1 out v any opponent they will fear it more, since you're able to use your psyker powers for farseers with no rolls, you're Wraithsight is neglible. Equip it with a Heat Lance and a Distort Cannon and it is a veritable threat to anything.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on March 1, 2009, 03:57:50 AM
Quote
I give you a special dispensation...

That's a seriously good looking Wraithlord, definitely superior to the second one - I really like the running/rushing pose, looks natural and fluid (Links here for the FIRST and SECOND WLs for the curious) but I have my doubts if it surpass the first one... I shall reserve judgement until I see them both painted.

Is the pose/model finished already or are you to add details/greenstuff works on it? Do you intend to build a handle/stock on the EML or is it supposed to be mounted on the shoulder and kinda held temporarily in the hand?

I dont know I think it may  well surpass the first one if only because of its pose.  Im in love with the pose of this one.  Yeah there is still more to do.  The missile launcher will have a handle to it to make it look hand held because I really like this idea for wraithlords.  Also i have to make a strap to attach to the stock and barrel of the missile launcher to allow it to sling over his shoulder so it looks like its hanging there rather than actually held in his hand.  The way I imagine it is that it is slung down by his side and his hand is resting against it to stop it from banging in to his leg everytime he takes a runninbg step.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on March 2, 2009, 10:10:57 AM
That last one reminds me of the one I started work on over ayear ago... which I will be painting this month...

You did it better Valar, as that pose is truely dynamic **Clearly your best pose so far**

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 2, 2009, 10:19:48 AM
Quote from: Valar on March  1, 2009, 03:57:50 AM
Also i have to make a strap to attach to the stock and barrel of the missile launcher to allow it to sling over his shoulder so it looks like its hanging there rather than actually held in his hand.  The way I imagine it is that it is slung down by his side and his hand is resting against it to stop it from banging in to his leg everytime he takes a runninbg step.
That would be most excellent I think. What about capes and cloth? I remember there was mane and ribbons flowing back through wind, and since this one is running...

Also, I saw THIS (http://sidestreaker.multiply.com/photos/album/56/Wraithlord_Complete) in the Show Your Army thread, found it inspiring, may do the 'cape' thing on my first plastic WL, not sure yet - I have the project of replacing my oop WLs with the new ones over the course of the year, as soon as I finish my 'Ghost Warriors' project (soon in the Conversion Thread).

May I ask if the second Wraithlord is painted, and if so, pics please? ;)

@haunt & Spiritwarroir: As haunt says, relying on Cover Saves is a bad idea if the opponent is fielding any 'D' weapons, that's why the Titan is very top priority in my mind, while the Baneblades aren't that bad.
Also why my opponents hate my Scorpion, as I can skim behind cover and shoot stuff while being mostly impervious due to both Cover and Titan Holofields.

I have no experience with actual Eldar Titans, only Superheavy Tanks so far, but as a scratchbuild project I think that a Vampire variant may be easier to build than a Phantom or Warlock.
I personnally like that the Vampire Raider may be given a single Pulsar to replace the Twin-linked Pulse lasers, although you lose a bit on precision shots and lose a third of transport capabilities...

Lastly, there's the LINK (Lords of Battle.pdf (http://belloflostsouls.blogspot.com/search?q=phantom+titan) to get the various non-official Superheavies Datasheet (including Eldar ones) on BoLS.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on March 3, 2009, 05:59:08 AM
Quote from: moc065 on March  2, 2009, 10:10:57 AM

You did it better Valar, as that pose is truely dynamic **Clearly your best pose so far**

CaHG

Well thanks very much for that high praise Moc... really looking forward to painting this one up.  Soon hopefully

and @ Starky
Quote
May I ask if the second Wraithlord is painted, and if so, pics please?

No its not painted yet mate... still only undercoated but again I want to get this one painted up soon... how cool would it be to have 3 painted WLs on the table... just imagine
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on March 3, 2009, 03:39:43 PM
That is one of the coolest plastic Wraithlords I have ever seen.  very nicely done.

I initially hopped onto this thread to tell you guys about how my spirit host whooped up on some nids and grey knights in an apocalypse battle not long ago, but i saw that WL and forgot everything I had to say about the battle.

Just so I dont leave you guys hanging, Ill give you a brief description, 2 v 1 Nidzilla + Gknights against the majority of my Eldar, approx 4500 a side, (Still used victory points).  The basic story of the battle was that I used harrying tactics the whole game while gradually giving up my left flank. tried to reduce my losses as much as possible while i waited for the right moment to strike.  then on the bottom of the sixth turn, the hammer hit the anvil and squashed a butload of bugs.  turn six the following happened: My wraithguard on foot killed the hive tyrant, my two squads of wraithguard in serpents each killed a carnifex, one of my wraithlords killed a carnifex in close combat (fex was already wounded a little), and lastly, my seer council on bikes blew up a land raider and a few of the Gknight termies inside of it.  needless to say, my opponents were devastated as they went from what looked like a decisive win for them, to a spirit host victory.

just thought i would tell you guys about this, I thought it was pretty cool, but maybe you had to be there in order to understand its awsomeness. 

as a side note, just something to think about:  Do you guys find that your Wraithguard outlast the majority of your other "alive" squads?  I find it interesting that my dead warriors are more often than not, the last troops i have on the table.  roll that one around in your noggins for a while.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 3, 2009, 07:48:57 PM
The only way Wraithguards will disappear is fighting anything that has the following:

1 - MC
2 - Uber saves and/or rerollable saves + power weapons of any kind.
3 - Lots of AP1, AP2 and AP3 weapons in either multiple shots or direct hit blasts or large blasts.

Other than that they should be fine.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on March 9, 2009, 08:36:43 PM
lol i know what kills wraithguard! lol
i guess i should have phrased my question better.
Isnt it strange that in the fluff, wraithguard would be the ones to "die" first, seeing as they are already dead, and the other eldar units are still alive.
compare this to during play on the tabletop, where (for me atleast) my wraithguard are always my last units standing. 
does anybody actually use their wraithguard so that they really do die first, like in the fluff?

if you were referring to something completely different, my bad.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 9, 2009, 11:35:42 PM
Quote from: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on March  9, 2009, 08:36:43 PM
Isn't it strange that in the fluff, wraithguard would be the ones to "die" first, seeing as they are already dead, and the other Eldar units are still alive.
Technically and fluffwise, they are sent frontline to die instead of 'live' bodies yes, or at least to deal/stop the threat to reach the second line of live troops.

Gamewise, they are sent frontline to die instead of 'live' bodies, or at least to deal/Stop the threat to reach the second line of live troops.

Except that unless loading entirely in transports and long range heavy weapons, all live Eldar support have a crappy range - Catapult ammos that hit a wall after 12", then these Hormagaunts/Fleeting Jumpacker outrange and outfast Wraithcannon and shuriken fire alike, ruining the days of the poor Guardians/Avengers/Dragons/Spiders/Spears and whatnot.

No wonder we about lost the Craftworld against the Bugs, the beasties run faster and further than our guns.

Quote
compare this to during play on the tabletop, where (for me at least) my wraithguard are always my last units standing. 
does anybody actually use their wraithguard so that they really do die first, like in the fluff?
Wraithguard doesn't die first, period. Unless hit by Termies or a crapload of Rending or a flight of Bloodthirsters of course...

Game mechanics, that's what the GW dudes calls it. Note that none of them are mechanics - All these broken units and rules... ::)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: the-one-tree on March 10, 2009, 01:28:05 AM
Has anyone tried tunnels by any chance.

What I do is run guard and the Sunstorm Squadron. Use the sunstorm to clear the reavers body guard then bring a small spirit host through 20 guard 1 WL and the locks. You can shake the hell out of the reaver with the Guard then charge it with those witchblades next turn. Or you could bring up to 4 squads of fire dragons in right next to the reaver. I played a 10k per side apoc game with my eldar versus necrons and chaos. I had brought the reaver down to 4 structures with my titans then had just one fire dragon squad come through and vaporize the last 4 structures on the reaver in one turn. Also remember if you can remove the reaver's void shields and and hit it with the sunstorm you get are +2 on the damage table because its D strength and ap1.

my 2 cents
the-one-tree

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 10, 2009, 01:50:56 AM
Better check the new APOC Datasheets  (http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/articleCategory.jsp?community=&communityArticleCatId=900006&articleCatId=900006&catId=cat1090001) maybe you might like it.

This I posted in POC: Alaitoc (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=130499.msg2192698#new)

While this in POC: Swordwind (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=171915.40)

You know there's another way to clear out the fields of titans, if you have or can do it - Sunstorm Squadron x2 (Both 6 Prism Strong.)

1 - Does the Multi Barrage
2 - Does the 10 inch Uber Blast.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Candriel on March 10, 2009, 12:28:40 PM
Hey, new to the forums.  Started up 40k again after a 4 year hiatus and have began my very own Iyanden Army.  It's not true blue Iyanden, it's the concept of Yriel's former corsairs who were forced to serve Craftworld Iyanden after he was accepted back into Iyanden.  Would love to join the group, just can't PM because I haven't been on the forum long enough.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 10, 2009, 01:11:41 PM
@the-one-tree: I used Tunnels once with the Wraithguard and Farseer and got a good round of shooting of them, then got stuck in CC, then brought down part of a DC - Not bad for a first try...
However, I didn't have a CC character with them, something of a must if you use the WG with such a 'in your face' tactic. I think that a Fusion Gun/Powersword Autarch or Karandras or Fuegan would complement the unit just fine...

@Candriel: Welcome back to the hobby, to 40KO and to the Iyanden POC! And no worry, you will be able to PM as soon as you get three post under your belt. :)

Sporting an Iyanden style army is more than just a color scheme (my own army is silver and blue) but more of a concept over which units you select and for what reasons, and there's no problem at all altering or building over 'official' GW's fluff or completely striking it out and build your own background.

Basically, the POC is all about Wraithguard, Wraithlords and Spiritseers and how to build a themed army around these, a very personal choice since the Codex: Craftworld Eldar disappeared behind the horizon of 4th ed.

So, welcome again and don't be shy of asking questions and posting relevant stuff in the POC and/or on the Eldar Forums, as there's a lot of accumulated experience and wiseness out there.

I suggest that you get a quick read through the POC's front pages and follow any links of interest to you and if you have any question just ask.

  Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 10, 2009, 02:19:32 PM
Anyone still remember our Bonesingers?? I was thinking of placing an APOC formation like this with them.

Angels of Iyanden
Cost: 50 + models.

As the call to war became evident, Iyanden musters its psychic might by calling forth its Angels and wage war with their hosts..

Composition:
1 – 2 Farseer, 2+ Bonesingers and 2+ Spiritseers.

Special Rules:
This formation is Fearless and allows Wraith constructs to not roll for Wraithsight as long as that unit is within 24 inches from the Angels.

Any psychic test needed roll within the Angel's unit is automatically passed.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Roizo on March 10, 2009, 05:02:37 PM
Hello guys!

I've been lurking far too long on these forums and thought that I probably could actually post something to Iyanden thread as I am a big fan of the craftworld.

My Iyanden army is not very loyal to the "Iyanden way of war". I have no wraithguard and only two wraithlords but I use them in every army list as tank/MC hunters. The rest of my army is made of various aspect warriors and harlequins etc. so I can't really give any tactical advices concerning typical Iyanden tactics. What makes my eldar army Iyanden army is the way they are painted and using Yriel as my main HQ choice. I also love the backround of Iyanden as much as the color scheme. My camera is broken at the moment and therefore I will post pictures of my army later.

There's not many Iyanden players in Finland, at least I haven't seen any in tournaments. Eldar as an army are however very popular here, most use Ulthwe, Saim Hann or their own craftworld.

Hmm.. could also ask something from you: Has anyone of you made miniature of Iyanna Arienal or Farseer Kelmon? I've seen some pictures of Iyanna like this http://www.wyrd-games.net/photopost/data/500/iyanna.jpg but not as much as I thought as she's very interesting character and had own rules before. I think farseer Kelmon and Iyanna could be used with Eldrards' rules also.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: the-one-tree on March 10, 2009, 06:05:56 PM
This is not a typical Iyanden list. It's a simple themed list around Yriels Corsairs and I have had success with it the last 3 games I've played it so here goes. I will be attending a tourney this Sat. We will see how it does.

HQ

Prince Yriel
Farseer with fortune - 85

5 warlocks,  1 enhance, 2 embolden - 150 + wave serpent, Shurikan cannon – 250

490 -  27%

Troops

5 Pathfinders
10 storm guardians, 2 flamers, warlock, destructor + wave serpent EML – 247
9 dire avengers, Exarch, defend, bladestorm, Shimmershield, power weapon 177 + wave serpent, EML, 285

652- 35%

Elites

7 striking scorpions – , Exarch , Scorpions claw - 43 (139)+ wave serpent , shurikan cannon - 239
7 striking scorpions – , Exarch , Scorpions claw - 43 (139)+ wave serpent , shurikan cannon - 239

478 - 26%

Heavy support

Fire Prism
Fire Prism

230 - 12%

1850
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 10, 2009, 08:21:07 PM
@haunt: Interesting, although I do not remember Boneseers... Maybe you should edit your post to add the Boneseers' capabilities, cost and options - Is it an upgraded Warlock or something else?

@Roizo: We would be interested to see pics of your force (And that applies to every members of the POC: Pray post your army's pics if you can!) and as I stated earlier, Iyanden is more than just a colour scheme or army comp.
If you paint your models in Iyanden like colors, you can surely get the 'feel' of the Craftworld without necessarily loading in Wraithguard (although unusual) as Iyanden, despite being on the brink of extinction, can and would surely bring forth Wraithguardless armies if necessity called.

Also, an Iyanden Corsair theme built around Yriel can certainly be made by using GW's official fluff and that without infuriated fluff nazis trying to lynch you!

Finally, it is quite possible to simulate Wraith units in your force by resorting to modelling and count as rule - For example THIS (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/All%20Eldar/DSC00712.jpg) Spirit piloted Wave Serpent and THESE (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x187/Starrakatt/All%20Eldar/ghostwarriors006.jpg) wip Ghost Warriors...

@the-one-tree: Can you give us details about your games? What kind and level of opposition did you fight? Can you describe what units/combo worked well in your list over different games?

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: the-one-tree on March 10, 2009, 09:47:51 PM
All three games were against the same guy. Two were against his chaos. That list was bike heavy. About 15 bikes. Three squads, a predator, a couple noise marine squads, A land raider with a unit in it and another foot slogging unit

The third game we played he fielded gun line guard. 2 bassis, a russ demolisher, lots of guardsmen about 6 autocannons, 2 chimeras with special weapons squads (melta)

the basic gist of the list is to go balls to the walls with the three serpents that have cc squads in them. Go strait to the jugular. I tend to hang back more with the Avengers and stormies. Because A: they are troops and B: you need to make sure you do the most damage with them as possible when they hop out. (they may not get another shot at it)

All three games I massacred him. One thing I am gonna say scorpions are awesome. They are resilient, but posses the ability to ware down an opponent because of the shear number of attacks. they fared very well against the bikes, both winning combat against the respective squads they fought in both games. I kinda of felt sorry for my buddy game three because he failed to slow my serpents down in his first shooting phase. It cost him the game. All three combat squads assaulted turn 2 and my serpents shook every piece of ordinance he had.

Yriel was with the small council anything that he charged against them Or I charged with it, broke first round.

The stormies did well wiping out the guard special weapons squad that hopped out to down my serpent.

the second game I played I will never forget. I broke a marine unit on an objective by tank shocking., giving me 1 objective to his zero. Ironically when they broke they were so close to the table edge they ran off.

Perhaps the biggest thing against tank heavy guard is: shake the tank and move on

my 2 cents
the-one-tree
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 10, 2009, 10:55:03 PM
@Starky,

Thanks for catching that... it was supposed to be Bonesingers.  ;)

Bonesingers from what I remember are in between a Spiritseer and a Farseer. The MUST choose at least 1 power from list 1 (max 3) and may choose to pick up a minor power from list 2.

I'll try to dig it up sometime, and if I find it good, if not - oh well.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Candriel on March 12, 2009, 01:29:48 AM
Had a 1000 pt match versus an Alpha legion player today, he didnt mind allowing me taking 10 wraithguard as my only troop choice :P  So needless to say 3rd turn wipeout, not a single dead wraithguard thanks to conceal combined with his exploding rhino from a lucky wraith 6!  My tourney list for this coming saturday in Tenessee is as follows.  Mind you its not very Iyanden themed but I'm rocking the color scheme cause it follows my Fluff background. 

Yriel's Conscripted Corsairs

1x Eldrad Ulthuan (Named Candriel Astor, backstory for him is that he is one of Yriel's younger cousins and to atone for what he saw was his relative's sleight to the family he followed the path of a Seer.  Much to his surprise he was put in charge of the remnants of Yriel's corsairs after he was a hero once again in the eyes of Iyanden.)

1x Farseer (Stones of Witnessing, Spirit Stones, Witchblade + sp, Doom, Guide, Fortune)

4x Wave Serpent ( TL-EML, Vectored, Spirit Stones)

2x 10 Dire Avengers w/Exarch (SShield and PW w/ Bladestorm and Defend)

2x 5 Fire Dragons

2x 3 Guardian Jetbikes (1 w/ Shuriken Cannon per squad)

Should be pretty gnarly.  The whole backstory to my list is that they are the former members of Yriel's Corsairs who were hired by the Iyanden craftworld into military service after the Tyranid threat was removed. Feel free to leave feedback.

Mind you this isn't my normal Iyanden list, just for Tourney play :P
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Candriel on March 13, 2009, 04:40:51 AM
And if i posted that list in the wrong area sorry... new to 40k online :P
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 13, 2009, 08:49:30 AM
Quote from: Candriel on March 13, 2009, 04:40:51 AM
And if i posted that list in the wrong area sorry... new to 40k online :P
If it's an Iyanden (kinda) associated build then you can surely post it there to have it discussed, although we usually delve more into lists including Wraith units - Note that you would definitely have more input on any list you might sybmit if it was posted in the Eldar Startegies & Tactics Forum, especially for Tournament lists.
If you want to define your list as 'Iyanden' or 'Corsair' lists, just do so in the thread's title and you will have even more chances to get answers where list's theme is taken into account. :)

I feel that lists, if posted in the POC, should be built around one's particular fluff if any and the POC discussions serve to help refine such lists according to said background, or be project lists based on campaigns or POC related tournaments.
Or any other good reason you may have. ;)

Oh and Candriel, do not double post, as it is frowned upon on 40KO and it could get you in (mild) trouble, instead use the 'MODIFY' Button to insert changes in your posts.


Now, Wraithguard at 1000 pts are hard and nasty as hell as about nobody will have what it takes to kill them before biting the dust themselves, congrats on the Victory!

I will review the list later when I get more time, although I'd suggest you to move it into the Strategy and Tactic Forum where you will get more answers...

P.S. You have now the possibility to send PM, so if you have any question over the site handling, coding or just general help just PM me and we'll see what I can do.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: the-one-tree on March 15, 2009, 10:12:39 PM
Well the tournament went fairly well.

first opponent: blood angles (jump pack heavy). Had a solid victory against him
Second opponent: Nilla marines, (Holy termies with storm shields). Got massacred.
third opponent: inquisition, (holy storm troopers). Solid victory against him

the first 2 missions were Vp points, and specific scenarios. We also had a secret mission, which was worth 200 vp's if completed. The third mission we rolled out of the book.

My first opponent was a great chap to play against.

the mission: Victory points. hold the center (hamburger hill). (300 vps), I had kill his highest point HQ.

Essentially we both raced towards each other in the center first turn. second turn the assaults started to happen. From then on it was a slow grind till about turn four when I pushed him back and held the hill. Second turn one of my Prisms got shaken so I tank shocked one of his units and proceeded to chase him off the board keeping one of my skimmers within 6 inches. the Bonus Vp points is what pushed me up to a solid.

My second opponent was polite, but I did not enjoy this game at all. He had a plain mean list. He got 0 out of 5 for his comp scores by the judges. My rolling was terrible this game and his was excellent. Here's what he had:

2 tactical squads. 2 razor backs
2 land speeders, melta and heavy flamer on both
Heres the fun part: 2 crusaders 5 temies with storm shields in each and shrike
2 dakka preds

My Prisms waffled all game only shook a land raider oince in 6 turns. My seer council got mobbed after their transport was destroyed, by both termie squads. Yriel died in the first round of combat to a thunder hammer as did the farseer. after that happened the amphetamine parrot hit the fan. Not A fun list to play against. Needless to say he won best general.

Third game went better for me. My opponent was more fun to play against. once I got into his lines it was essentialy over. He couldn't deal with my close combat.

Well their you guys go. Unfortunately I was off by a couple points for winning best over overall.

the-one-tree




Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Seer13 on March 16, 2009, 08:43:54 AM
I have big problem with my Iynaden army, or maybe with my enemies. In my region most armies are fast close combat (nobz on bikes with mass of truks, blood angels on packs, land rider terminator catapult, rhino rush, fast tyranids). And I need a few tips how to build army and how to play (not whole tactics but tips), because I love my wraithguards (nobody field them and I love to be original), but most enemies have perfect armies to deal with them.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on March 16, 2009, 11:17:13 AM
Quote
I have big problem with my Iynaden army, or maybe with my enemies.

It really would depend on what you're fielding.  WG can be a powerhouse unit for you, but they can't do it alone.  They need some form of support and deterrent to allow them to accomplish their job; be it fire magnet, CC tarpit, what-have-you.  What do you have supporting them (ie. what's the rest of the list like)?

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 16, 2009, 12:01:04 PM
For you who are having problems with your Ghost Armies. Back them up with either Striking Scorpions (mass hitting power) or Howling Banshees (sure killing power), if without any of these our tough-as-nails unit will always stay entangled by units whom they're not meant to deal with, unless you are playing a PURELY THEMED Ghost Warrior Army (ALL Wraiths = ALL Troops, Elites and Heavies; while HQ is Psyckers only.)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 16, 2009, 07:39:15 PM
The problem with Wraithguard is that while they stand in the upper end of spectrum point wise, the new 5th uber fast assault units (Bike Councils, Nobz Bikers and Land Raider Terminator catapult) deal very easily with high T models, as Seer13 noticed.

There's no miracle solution, I have to deal with the same problem, but in my opinion if you play in that kind of competitive environment you may have to take the same way and build an Uber Council yourself to deal with these units - remedy to sickness so to speak.

I also always use Doom where possible.

Fast Bugs: WG are T6, Tyrants and Daemon Princes will need to hit the guys, 3+/4+ to wound them then you can always place the first wound on the Warlock/Spiritseer to swallow the wound (Fortune FW!) - Not that bad...

They can be dealt with (or softened) with ranged low AP firepower, Fire Dragons out of a transport (but they will die afterward), Snipers (just be wary of Lictors).
Countercharge units can also deal with them: Veiled Harlies, Banshees and Scorpions all rely on Doom to give the most of themselves:
- Point for point, Banshees can do the job as well as Harlequins versus most units up to T6.
- Harlies with a Shadowseer doesn't need a transport to protect them, an interesting option when you are short in points.
- Council will stand MC punishment and deal a lot of wounds, Saves will be failed eventually - Just don't count on the Council to live for very long from multiple Assault from hordes, unless they also sport a 3+ Save (Jetbikes).
- Surprisingly, Wraithlords do well enough versus MCs (including Tyrants), as various MCs have either low numbers of Attacks or will need 6s to wound a WL. The Wraithblade is a nice option if you are planning for this, although not necessary.

Land Raider Catapult: Never easy that one - You NEED to be able to get at the Termies inside with mass firepower, so you have to kill the LR ASAP.
- Fire Dragons again are the best tool for the job, but you will lose them afterward.
- Load in Brightlance on Wraithlords and Serpents and hope for the best.
- Have a cheap unit to feed them to, so they will stand ready for a good volley of firepower.
- Fortuned Seer Council can stand their punishment and force them many saves - some will fail.
- Same goes for Harlies, Banshees and Scorpions, but by the gods, use Doom.

Nobz (Mega and Bikers): Meganobz can be slowed by killing their ride, just make sure you kill that Trukk/Battlewagon. There's no easy way to deal with Nobz (either flavor) unless you bring your own super CC unit. At least, Meganobz can be shot down if you can get them out of Cover, much harder to do with Bikers with their smoke screen...

- I haven't faced the brutes yet (may change this week), so all my knowledge is theoretical.
- To feed them a cheap unit to munch will slow them and allow further shooting.
- Try to keep in or behind terrain to force Dangerous Terrain tests on the Bikers.
- Wraithlord with Wraithblade can hopefully kill an accompanying Warboss and maybe a Nob before going down.
- Wraithcannons bypass FNP, so you may shave off some wounds after Cover/++ Saves.
- Painboy is pain in the arse, essentially nullifying small arm fire and standard CC attacks: Eldrad, Yriel, Harlies (all Fortuned and the opponent Doomed) may work.
- Banshees and Scorpions to a lesser degree too I guess - Doom!

Rhino/Trukk Rush: If the transport is full of Death Company, Power weapons/Powerfists equiped Honor Guard or Nobz w/Powerklaws they aren't that big a threat to your Wraithguard, especially as you did take a nice Assault unit to deal with them, right?
-IF real bad guys ride the transports: Same goes as with teh Land Raider Catapult approach - Kill the bastard from afar, then shoot down the disembarked gitz.
- Unless they are Sisters with Rending Bolters/Flamers or some Chaos Sorcerer with Wind of Chaos, nobody in the game have reliable portable firepower to deal with Wraithguard, including Demo Charges if they keep to Cover.

I would suggest you to take a look at THIS (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=157393.msg2064039#msg2064039), its not much but it may (or not) helps.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Candriel on March 17, 2009, 12:57:53 AM
Well my very first Tourney ended poorly, couldn't have been more fun though!

First Round - Imperial Fists (Crushing Victory!)

Second - Green Tide w/ Ghazghkul and Mad Dok (Crushing Loss)

Third - Mech Ork w/ 6 x Killa Kanz Dread and ALOT of Lootaz (Crushing Loss)

Fourth - Sisters of Battle (Miscounted Victory points meant Crushing Loss)

Fifth - Dark Templar (Draw)

Well I learned a few things about Eldrad this weekend, Wraithlords rock! The guy who took first had 3x Wraithlords in his list :O  Being zoomy and fast dont mean much when lootas/exorcists blow you outta the sky! Also Eldar is the LaBreas Tar Pits of Units, help 5 man assault termie squad in melee for 5 turns in my last match against dark templar!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Seer13 on March 17, 2009, 05:46:39 AM
Ok about counter uunits:
-Scorpions good against hordes but weak against real dangerous units (DC, Nobz)
-Banshee and their PW but need transport and if I have only one tank its like screaming shoot me
-Harlies, I don't want to field them
-Wraithlords - combo bl/sword - can work or not ??

Those are my problems when fielding Iyanden.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on March 17, 2009, 08:47:48 AM
Quote
Ok about counter uunits:
-Scorpions good against hordes but weak against real dangerous units (DC, Nobz)
-Banshee and their PW but need transport and if I have only one tank its like screaming shoot me
-Harlies, I don't want to field them
-Wraithlords - combo bl/sword - can work or not ??

Those are my problems when fielding Iyanden.

I think you're discounting Scorps by saying they can't deal with some nasty units out there; though I grant against DCs it is a problem.  I don't field Scorps very often and never Banshees, so my input would be limited.   My two counter-units are a unit of Harlies and War Spiders.  Although you mention not liking Harlies, they are rather shiny when escorting your WG; when using VoT they can negate some incoming fire and there is still the mystique about them that many players will avoid getting too close.  As for the Spiders, with their movement and Assault 2 S6 weapons, they can make a dent in any unit before charging, and even though the Exarch requires 6s to wound, they have can use Withdraw.  I've done this a number of times against Nob Bikers with satisfactory results.

The BL/sword combo is what I run with; I have two of them in all lists 1000+ points.  Along with the WG and Harlies, they form the anvil of my army and one troublesome block to break.  With twin flamers, they initially concentrate on anti-tank (specifically countering LR-Catapults and transport-bound nastiness, like Death Company) and then likely to horde control.  Two WLs make for a significant mental impact on most, regardless of the threat other units pose - people still insist on destroying these guys asap....

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on March 17, 2009, 10:45:10 AM
As Desrochers said... You can take down Nob Bikers; but it generally takes as many points as the biker squad...

Starky took down my 800ish point nob bikers with about 1000pts of Eldar (full guard, Yriel, Farseer, Wraithlord and 8 Harlies)... and he was still lucky to do it (as I messed up the response - serioulsy)...

Your better off to insta kill Nob Bikers if you can with shooting, and then when their well softened up, you hit them with as much as you can...

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 17, 2009, 11:23:28 AM
Yeash, that fight was ugly (well, FUN) alright: Direct all the Instant Kill and AP2 or better shooting at them if at all possible before they assault your line - But I got a single Instant Kill hit home on the Nobz, NONE in the Second Turn, so I couldn't reduce them enough to help me in CC.

At least, the Wraithguard got some wounds on them with their Wraithcannons before moc hit me in CC... Never underestimate the capability of dealing the first wound on the Warlock first, he absorbed a whopping 4 Powerklaw wounds in the 4 rounds of CC we had!

Nobz are the very worst IMO, as they have it all (except low points): High T, 2 Wounds apiece (That's 20 wounds on the entire unit + Warboss!), ++ Saves, Cover Save, great wound allocation capabilities and FNP - Urrk!

Land Raider Catapults and Council are much more fragile to shooting/mass base CC attacks and are far easier to deal with I think, as mass basic weapon firepower will wound easier and they got only 1 wound each...

Wraithlord with Wraithblade in CC did marvels too, but as moc says he messed up the wound allocation, so it got a bit easier for me. :D

Too bad there weren't suitable cover to force some Dangerous Terrain tests on the Bikers...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on March 17, 2009, 02:10:44 PM
Face it Starky... even though you won in the end.. you got lucky... I botched a few things due to frustration,... as you should have been facing a lot more attacks than you did...

Anyway, you put your 1K vs my 800pts and won.. like you should have... so well done in that you didn't loose focus like I did....

Cheers, and I will work to make the rest of you army "Dead" (walking or not) as soon as possible.... hopefully the rest will go as easily as your Guardians and/or that first Wraithlord....

CaHG

 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 17, 2009, 03:31:57 PM
I like Wraithguards supported by Fire Dragons. :)

Since if I need T4 insta killers, dragons are the answer. Anything that has T5+, I have my Wraiths to deal with it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 17, 2009, 04:55:52 PM
Quote from: moc065 on March 17, 2009, 02:10:44 PM
Face it Starky... even though you won in the end.. you got lucky... I botched a few things due to frustration,... as you should have been facing a lot more attacks than you did...

Anyway, you put your 1K vs my 800pts and won.. like you should have... so well done in that you didn't loose focus like I did....
I accept some good dice anytime of the day, thank you - When I think to my disastrous AT shooting so far I call these dice: Divine Retribution. HA! :P

And face it: When you game, I expect that you will take advantage of the opponent's confusion or lack of focus - That's how you Win, nothing new there...

Quote
Cheers, and I will work to make the rest of you army "Dead" (walking or not) as soon as possible.... hopefully the rest will go as easily as your Guardians and/or that first Wraithlord....

CaHG
The more I play (second game with the List so far) and think about it, the more I believe that you and Eothen were right: A) A single Serpent just asks for getting shot and B) I need to be a bit faster to get Objectives, so maybe Stormies in a Serpent could replace the Defenders and Walkers...

Dunno...

@Haunt: The problem with the 5th ed's monster units is that they have either low and/or re-rollable INV/Cover Saves, greatly nullifying the Dragon's firepower, but against as squad of Nobz Bikers you could net around 3.5 kills with a full Dragon squad, maybe 4-5 if Guided, which is VERY nice if you have what it takes to lock the Nobz in CC afterward...

And btw, congrats on the promotion Haunt, Guardian Defender of Iyanden. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sanctjud on March 17, 2009, 06:23:29 PM
That should have been an epic fight, I wish you recorded it on film with all the cursing and bodily fluids spraying everywhere...

I praise Vassaline and our eventual fight.... of the Traffic Light Trio.

My 7 Cents.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on March 18, 2009, 09:37:57 AM
The fight is over, and I will let you know that Starkies single Serpent was spared... (I ignored it for the most part)... but I will also let you know that I recovered from my momentary loss of focus, and beat the amphetamine parrote of him when he fudged his turn 4...

Watching Rabaddan die (again) was great, and thats why I asked that we do that CC part last... Had to savour the pending "Squish" and only wish that I could have bagged the "Nob Jockey -AKA- Yriel" as well.

Great game Starky, and too bad you lost; but, the better Ork did win, so it was a good day.. oh and it was serioulsy bloody too, so poppa Khorne is no longer that thirsty.

Red-Yellow-Green three way game would be wickedly fun... Lets try and do that one...

CaHG
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on March 18, 2009, 11:20:39 AM
Quote from: moc065 on March 18, 2009, 09:37:57 AM
The fight is over, and I will let you know that Starkies single Serpent was spared... (I ignored it for the most part)... but I will also let you know that I recovered from my momentary loss of focus, and beat the amphetamine parrote of him when he fudged his turn 4...

Watching Rabaddan die (again) was great, and thats why I asked that we do that CC part last... Had to savour the pending "Squish" and only wish that I could have bagged the "Nob Jockey -AKA- Yriel" as well.
Yes, you did well and you capitalised on my mistake, best general indeed - Being too greedy was my loss...

Quote
Great game Starky, and too bad you lost; but, the better Ork did win, so it was a good day.. oh and it was serioulsy bloody too, so poppa Khorne is no longer that thirsty.
We agree on that then. ;D

Quote
Red-Yellow-Green three way game would be wickedly fun... Lets try and do that one...
Better work that one through PMs though, but wouldn't a three way battle be akward? Maybe a fourth, 'vanilla' color could be dragged in? (Gutsy maybe?)

@Sanct: Looking forward to play you Sanctjud, have a Tourney this Saturday but I should be available for the next one - Sharpen your knife!

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: CallumS on May 19, 2009, 11:46:40 PM
I hope this isn't an unnecessary thread revival, or something similar, but I'd like to request membership, if possible?
 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on May 20, 2009, 09:02:32 AM
Not threadomancy, no... Just an awakening for a prolonged sleep, things have been pretty slow lately and myself being less active than usual saw the POC sink down the pages... ;)

So Fir Dinillainn, of course you can join in, welcome aboard the Iyanden POC! I shall add your name to the ranks of the proud (though rare) warriors of our Craftworld. If you have any questions about background, army lists and/or tacticas just ask and we will try to answer as best as we can.
You may want to read the front pages to get an idea of the inside structure of the POC and members, as well as to a look at the assembled material that we cumulated over time.

If you have any personal fluff and material, plain Iyanden or of a similar Craftworld (mine are the Silver Ghosts), pictures of your forces and tacticas, this thread is the place to post them.

Anouncement: moc065 and Gutstikk have succeeded in dragging me into Army Scoring for the Big List of Eldar Lists (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159588.0) stickied thread and I'm currently studying which Scoring system I'll be using to do so, so if members of the POC have armies they want rated they will be quite welcome to it, just post the finished list here and it shall be done, or just plain post the list in the Eldar Army Lists & Tactics board and send me a PM with the relevant link so that I may get to work. (wow, long sentence...)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on May 20, 2009, 09:21:31 AM
Welcome Fir Dinillainn to the Iyanden POC its always good to have new members here so thanks for posting.  Yes it has been very quiet here since Starky, myself and some other prominant Iyanden posters have been quiet... I blame my absence on lots of Uni work and now getting my nise to the grinding stone in terms of painting. 

Im trying to finally get a thread up about how to paint wraithguard which Ive promised Starky for soo long now.  So im working on that whilst painting up a whole host of other Eldar goodies so Ive not had much time or much to contribute to this thread recently.

I hop you post up some interesting stuff here, maybe some painting articles, tacticas, battle reports army lists etc and im interested to see what you have to offer.

Welcome to the POC
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: CallumS on May 20, 2009, 12:15:57 PM
Quote from: Starrakatt on May 20, 2009, 09:02:32 AM
Not threadomancy, no... Just an awakening for a prolonged sleep, things have been pretty slow lately and myself being less active than usual saw the POC sink down the pages... ;)

So Fir Dinillainn, of course you can join in, welcome aboard the Iyanden POC! I shall add your name to the ranks of the proud (though rare) warriors of our Craftworld. If you have any questions about background, army lists and/or tacticas just ask and we will try to answer as best as we can.
You may want to read the front pages to get an idea of the inside structure of the POC and members, as well as to a look at the assembled material that we cumulated over time.

If you have any personal fluff and material, plain Iyanden or of a similar Craftworld (mine are the Silver Ghosts), pictures of your forces and tacticas, this thread is the place to post them.

Anouncement: moc065 and Gutstikk have succeeded in dragging me into Army Scoring for the Big List of Eldar Lists (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159588.0) stickied thread and I'm currently studying which Scoring system I'll be using to do so, so if members of the POC have armies they want rated they will be quite welcome to it, just post the finished list here and it shall be done, or just plain post the list in the Eldar Army Lists & Tactics board and send me a PM with the relevant link so that I may get to work. (wow, long sentence...)

   Starky

Well, I suppose around here we might say the same thing about the spirits of long dead Eldar, but it's still Necromancy of some form now isn't it.   ;D
Terrible joke, I know...

Thank you for the welcome, Starky! Once again, having scarce few warriors kinda suits this lovely Craftworld. Besides, it's always more fun to be unique. Who do you think has the most members in their POC? I've got my money on Biel-tan.

I certainly will have questions, I'm sure. I have settled on an Army List though, so they'll be more along the modeling aspect of the hobby. I'm in a reboot at the moment, I haven't touched a model for a few years, and I'm pretty happy about the idea of relaxing with a brush in hand (how different from my youth!). I've been involved, to one degree or another, in the hobby for about fourteen years now, but 5th edition's still a little fresh to me seeing as I'm so used to 4th.

I've read through a lot of what's on the front page, it was the inspiration for my membership request. Great work keeping all that together for so long. :)

I do have a fluff question, come to think of it. What was the deal with the Angel of Iyanden; remember her? That character seemed to have a little bit of potential to me but they just made it so bland and then ditched it. I suppose that's more of a lament than a question.  :-\

I just moved house so I'll picking up my first models in the next week or so. I'll be definately putting up some fluff for them next week too. I have it all in my head, I just have to decide how I want to format it. Any suggestions, or ways that it's usually done?

If you're scoring lists, I'd love to be a test dummy for your system. Let me know if you need a hand, or when you've decided. :)

Quote from: Valar on May 20, 2009, 09:21:31 AM
Welcome Fir Dinillainn to the Iyanden POC its always good to have new members here so thanks for posting.  Yes it has been very quiet here since Starky, myself and some other prominant Iyanden posters have been quiet... I blame my absence on lots of Uni work and now getting my nise to the grinding stone in terms of painting. 

Im trying to finally get a thread up about how to paint wraithguard which Ive promised Starky for soo long now.  So im working on that whilst painting up a whole host of other Eldar goodies so Ive not had much time or much to contribute to this thread recently.

I hop you post up some interesting stuff here, maybe some painting articles, tacticas, battle reports army lists etc and im interested to see what you have to offer.

Welcome to the POC

Thank you again for the welcome.  ;D

I just finished up my uni for the semester, so I'm all up for hangin' out in my new house with some brushes and Wraithguard. Which works well with this promised thread of yours...  ;)
Are you going for a more traditional scheme, or just general technique for the model?

I've found some great stuff, and I look forward to reading and contributing.


EDIT:

I thought I'd post a sans-fluff outline of where am I headed to 2'000 points. This is an exiles list with self-imposed restrictions built around a Farseer and her protegés who once belonged to Iyanden and still fight for it. The most notable restriction I have is: no Aspect Warriors. C&c is welcome, of course.

HQ:

Farseer with Runes of Warding, Spirit Stones, Doom and Fortune.

Troops:

10 Wraithguard and Spiritseer with Conceal.

10 Wraithguard and Spiritseer with Conceal.

5 Pathfinders.

5 Pathfinders.

5 Pathfinders.

Elites:

9 Harlequins with Harlequin's Kisses, and Shadowseer with Harlequin's Kiss.

Heavy Support:

Wraithlord with Bright Lance and Eldar Missile Launcher.

Wraithlord with Bright Lance and Eldar Missile Launcher.

Wraithlord with Scatter Laser and Shuriken Cannon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on May 20, 2009, 01:04:54 PM
Traditional Iyanden colours  ;D call me old fashioned but I love the colour scheme for Iyanden.  If you have a look at the links in my Sig you can see my previous work for this POC showing my colour scheme. 

I myself have just finished Uni for the semester aswell and have a nice long holiday so will be doing a lot of painting.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: CallumS on May 20, 2009, 01:10:10 PM
Excellent, perhaps we can egg each other on! I edited my above post with an army list, as an aside. :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on May 20, 2009, 01:15:10 PM
Nice list, very characterful... How does it play??

Im in the middle of a list crisis where I cant seem to find a list that I like and that works well for me.  How is your list to play?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: CallumS on May 20, 2009, 01:21:23 PM
No clue yet, Valar. I'm picking up the first models very soon! It's a little daunting now that I look at it all.  ;D

I'm glad you like it though, and, in theory, it should work quite nicely. I think the key will be support, fire concentration, timing and a big ol' refused flank. Does that give you an idea of the style?

I'll write some more in depth analysis eventually, but, of course, I'm hesitant to do so without playing the list first!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on May 20, 2009, 08:59:18 PM
Your list is really slow and really hard. Might work out okay as it is tough to take down twenty WG. I use fifteen at 1250 so it can work. I would however put enhance on the second squad as they will get cover from the first squad.I'm not that fond of fifteen pathfinders either. I would drop one squad and the scatterlaser WG and add one more squad of Harlies. That will scare your opponent for sure.
Good luck.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: CallumS on May 20, 2009, 09:17:54 PM
I'm worries people may not take kindly to that. I know this is not a cheesy army by any stretch, but, in my experience anyway, people tend to have their hands hovering over the cheese buttonas soon as they see an army that differs a lot from what they expect. What do you think; will people be calling foul on two Harlie units?

Also, does that change take away too much from the resilient core and objective taking options? Resilience is my key advantage in this force, and I want to maximise that as much as possible. Casting Fortune on one unit of Harlies is do-able, but two could be too fragile. Anyone use two units of Harlequins?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on May 20, 2009, 09:52:58 PM
Quote
I'm worries people may not take kindly to that.

Your current list has double WG and triple WL. I wouldn't worry about adding Harlies.

Quote
Also, does that change take away too much from the resilient core and objective taking options?

One unit of pathfinders will not upset your core at all.

Quote
Casting Fortune on one unit of Harlies is do-able, but two could be too fragile. Anyone use two units of Harlequins?

I have used two in large lists ( 1750+ ). They work fine. Do not fortune your Harlies. They have the Veil and can use cover and believe me your opponent will be worrying about those WGs and WLs. If he focuses on the Harlies you are golden. Use Doom for Harlies and Pathfinders. Fortune your WG.

Some cc punch is nice in Iyanden lists. Sure ypou can use Scorps or Banshees but I feel Harlies suit my fluff better ( note: MY fluff ). I have used Scorpians and Harlies and at 2000 used Kkarandras once with Scorps but really Harlies are fine ( I have fourteen Harlies, two Seers and two Jesters that often go in ).

Harlies are misunderstood in 5th. You cannot play them like the 4th Harlies in falcons and rush the lines. You need to advance behind your WG and WLs and then spring them into action, counter charging or initiating assaults. They really are not that bad at all in 5th despite changes to rending and consolidation. They just are not 'cheesy' any more.

Learn their subtleties and what they can take on and what they need to avoid and soften squads up with your spearhead before charging in. 

I use doom on occasion to reroll successful attacks so that I can remain in combat an extra turn - really.

Units behind a unit of Harlies that are under the power "Veil of Tears" still gain a 4+ cover save since the enemy is shooting through a unit.

Be aware of the range you need to get off a successful assault and know all the Harlie rules and use them well. Two squads are perfectly acceptable now.


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: CallumS on May 21, 2009, 01:25:55 AM
I expanded to 2'000 on a whim, I guess, with the Pathfinders and a Wraithlord. My original thoughts were for 1'500 points (much less daunting). The more I look at the 2k, the more it seems a little clunky and under-focused compared to the 1'500 version.

I agree with your Harlequin theory, on most fronts, though, I do think Fortune has it's place for Harlequins in Close Combat; dice get fluffed and it's a fail safe. I had planned to use them as a counter-attack support for the 'Guard block as well. I know people may not take kindly to the amount of Wraith's in this list, but that's why I didn't really want to exasperate it. ;)

Here's the original list before I started musing about 2k. I really only took it further because I was thinking about Pathfinders a little too much.

HQ:

Farseer with Runes of Warding, Spirit Stones, Doom and Fortune.

Troops:

10 Wraithguard and Spiritseer with Conceal.

10 Wraithguard and Spiritseer with Conceal.

Elites:

9 Harlequins with Harlequin's Kisses, and Shadowseer with Harlequin's Kiss.

Heavy Support:

Wraithlord with Bright Lance and Eldar Missile Launcher.

Wraithlord with Bright Lance and Eldar Missile Launcher.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on May 21, 2009, 10:05:04 AM
Quote from: Valar on May 20, 2009, 09:21:31 AM
Im trying to finally get a thread up about how to paint wraithguard which Ive promised Starky for soo long now.  So im working on that whilst painting up a whole host of other Eldar goodies so Ive not had much time or much to contribute to this thread recently.
I'm waiting for that! And how's the Revenant doing?

Quote from: Fir Dinillainn on May 20, 2009, 12:15:57 PM
Who do you think has the most members in their POC? I've got my money on Biel-tan.
A far as I know, the most active POC amongst the Big Five Craftworlds (active members that is) is actually the Saimm-Hann POC, although the Buannath Fhirin Craftworld (Eldar Online POC - 'Vanilla' Eldar) are the most numerous, as not everyone want to be associated to a single Craftworld and many prefers to create their own fluff and material.

Quote
...I haven't touched a model for a few years, and I'm pretty happy about the idea of relaxing with a brush in hand (how different from my youth!).

I've read through a lot of what's on the front page, it was the inspiration for my membership request. Great work keeping all that together for so long. :)

I do have a fluff question, come to think of it. What was the deal with the Angel of Iyanden; remember her?
I am not alone as a lot of people also helped me to keep the POC started and running, so I thank you in my and their behalf. :)

Also, we'll be happy to see some of your painting and modelling for sure. And for Iyanna Arienal, the famed 'Angel of Iyanden' well yes, we may lament it's loss... while everyone else is hating us a bit more for the Prince Yriel who replaced her in the Codex.
I guess a female Farseer could be made to represent her as leader of Iyanden though.

Quote
I'll be definately putting up some fluff for them next week too. I have it all in my head, I just have to decide how I want to format it. Any suggestions, or ways that it's usually done?
It is as you wish, we do not have a particular format, although you may want to divide the background in different 'chapters' with possibly titles if the material is extensive.

I never made a dedicated fluff section for the different members, now I think I'll build one with links inside the Great Library for easy references. (see, I just love it when you guys give me ideas).

Quote
If you're scoring lists, I'd love to be a test dummy for your system. Let me know if you need a hand, or when you've decided. :)
I'll surely rate your list a bit later, I am formidably busy these times and will get only an hour or so of internet a day for the next tendays, so bear with me as it may take a little time.
Meanwhile, you (we) could use this time to discuss and refine your list if you wish so.

bebe made some sound comments on your list, permit me to add some of my own. (bebe, I didn't forgot you, my rating of your list is coming up very soon :D )

Quote
I thought I'd post a sans-fluff outline of where am I headed to 2'000 points. This is an exiles list with self-imposed restrictions built around a Farseer and her protegés who once belonged to Iyanden and still fight for it. The most notable restriction I have is: no Aspect Warriors. C&c is welcome, of course.

HQ:

Farseer with Runes of Warding, Spirit Stones, Doom and Fortune.
A solid, well rounded choice considering the list, on I use on a regular basis and that still failed to fail me.

Quote
Troops:

10 Wraithguard and Spiritseer with Conceal.

10 Wraithguard and Spiritseer with Conceal.
I agree with bebe, I would give Enhance to one of the squad. While it can be problematic to get acceptable Cover when advancing or camping on a given Objective, with two Wraithguard unit getting the second one in or behind Cover shouldn't be a problem.
Also, think of the potential of Enhance if you decide to use these Wraithguard as a countercharge unit, you would be surprised of the slaughter a full, Enhanced WG squad can achieve against Hordes, especially in conjunction with Doom. ;D

Quote
5 Pathfinders.

5 Pathfinders.

5 Pathfinders.
Honestly, I am not too fond either of THREE Pathfinder units - At the 2K level, and especially with two squad of Scoring Wraithguard on the board, having five Scoring units is a bit redundant, IMHO an anti-horde unit would better suited instead of one of these.

Quote
Elites:

9 Harlequins with Harlequin's Kisses, and Shadowseer with Harlequin's Kiss.
Again a solid choice, especially with Doom, but I am tempted to suggest you to drop a single Harlequin to get a Troupe Master. Recent experimentation with the TM made me realise how usefull the man was, both as a LD upgrade and killing potential - Killing Marines on 4+ on the charge instead of praying for some 6s s invaluable.

Quote
Heavy Support:

Wraithlord with Bright Lance and Eldar Missile Launcher.

Wraithlord with Bright Lance and Eldar Missile Launcher.

Wraithlord with Scatter Laser and Shuriken Cannon.
All solid builds and would surely provide an excellent support.

Have you considered boosting your CC efficiency by gicing one of the Wraithlord a Wraithblade instead of a EML? Sure you'd lose an medium/light AT shot a Turn, but I wouldn't worry too much about that, especially with 20 Wraithcannons on the table. :D
However, the CC re-rolls may well make the difference when it come down to melee, I just can't remember how many times I kept failing to hit in CC against mere SM...
It also make the WL an excellent MC/AV/IC killer in CC, while keeping the Brightlance option for AV 14 hunting, and lest face it, 5th Edition made CC king, so a bit of a boost there can't be a bad thing.


Quote from: Fir Dinillainn on May 21, 2009, 01:25:55 AM
I expanded to 2'000 on a whim, I guess, with the Pathfinders and a Wraithlord. My original thoughts were for 1'500 points (much less daunting). The more I look at the 2k, the more it seems a little clunky and under-focused compared to the 1'500 version.
20 Wraitguard in a 1500 pts list is very hard to manage in my experience and should ideally be kept for bigger games, say 1750+ pts, but tehre's noting wrong in making experiences and who knows, it might even work with your gaming group! ;)

Quote
I agree with your Harlequin theory, on most fronts, though, I do think Fortune has it's place for Harlequins in Close Combat; dice get fluffed and it's a fail safe. I had planned to use them as a counter-attack support for the 'Guard block as well. I know people may not take kindly to the amount of Wraith's in this list, but that's why I didn't really want to exasperate it. ;)
Fortuning Harlies instead of Wraithguard may come into it's own from time to time, all circumstance's dependant, but it is nice to have to keep them alive, either in CC or after consolidating (in or behind cover preferably, possibly behind the Wraithguard themselves) to survive retaliation fire, but using multiple Fortunes may be worth it in big games, i.e 1750+ pts.

There's a thought: Having a second Farseer also sporting Fortune (and ideally a second power) to replace one of the Pathfinder unit could be an interesting choice.

Quote
Here's the original list before I started musing about 2k. I really only took it further because I was thinking about Pathfinders a little too much.
Both of your list are well balanced enough, although they could do with a bit more speed and especially some anti-horde firepower, but that's the price to pay for using two WG units.

But lets face it, it is not the hordes in themselves that are a problem for the Wraithguard, but the supporting killer ICs and MCs accompanying them in battle.

Alright, enough of this for this morning. [sleepy... :-[ ]

   Starky

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on May 24, 2009, 10:12:55 AM
Here you go Starky, I told you id do it soon.... guess what.... Ive started the wraithguard painting thread for you and the PoC and its available for you to have a look at here (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=183670.0) I hope you all approve and enjoy this thread and Id like to hear what all my fellow members of the PoC think.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on May 24, 2009, 10:27:59 AM
Starky - I PMed you - I would like to join your PoC.
Valor - I like your WG a lot.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on May 24, 2009, 11:26:47 AM
@Valar: Thank you, I'll take a look ASAP - After I get some sleep... :D

@bebe: Welcome to the POC! You are registered as a Guardian Defender of Iyanden (you have the post count to get Wraithguard but probation at Guardian status is standard procedure), it may be that you won't get your Title immediately, it all depends of Modly Operandy.

Feel free to post fluff, background and whatnot (yes, that means you too Valar if you have some), new material should make it's way to the POC soon (beginning with Valar's Paint Guide) and I am beginning to consider a new format to the POC, as as it is now my right hand (Wraithlord Gwaihir) has been in absentia for a while now and some of the front pages were his.

I'd like to get your ideas and suggestions on how the POC front pages should be structurated if you have some (brewing some ideas myself)...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: CallumS on May 24, 2009, 05:18:02 PM
Quote from: Starrakatt on May 21, 2009, 10:05:04 AM

Have you considered boosting your CC efficiency by gicing one of the Wraithlord a Wraithblade instead of a EML? Sure you'd lose an medium/light AT shot a Turn, but I wouldn't worry too much about that, especially with 20 Wraithcannons on the table. :D
However, the CC re-rolls may well make the difference when it come down to melee, I just can't remember how many times I kept failing to hit in CC against mere SM...
It also make the WL an excellent MC/AV/IC killer in CC, while keeping the Brightlance option for AV 14 hunting, and lest face it, 5th Edition made CC king, so a bit of a boost there can't be a bad thing.

Both of your list are well balanced enough, although they could do with a bit more speed and especially some anti-horde firepower, but that's the price to pay for using two WG units.

But lets face it, it is not the hordes in themselves that are a problem for the Wraithguard, but the supporting killer ICs and MCs accompanying them in battle.

I imagine it is, yes. Speed is an unfortunate downside, and, sometimes, I regret putting restrictions on my list!  ;)
I had considered the Blade for a Wraithguard, but was not convinced of its potency.

Quote from: Valar
Here you go Starky, I told you id do it soon.... guess what.... Ive started the wraithguard painting thread for you and the PoC and its available for you to have a look at here I hope you all approve and enjoy this thread and Id like to hear what all my fellow members of the PoC think.

I like what I see so far quite a lot!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Feresy on May 24, 2009, 05:25:15 PM
Hi,
I'm not sure if this is the right place for this, but has anyone had any experience with the Epic Wraithlords? I was just wondering if they would be suitable to convert into Wraithguard.
In the picture they look a bit small...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on May 24, 2009, 08:34:06 PM
Here is my forces fluff ...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Fr1_2.gif&hash=982da671974227b9c5ebf3ae90897cdee121e783)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Fr3_6.gif&hash=973b02587f21a82c617d46a713766848daba8b90)


The Chronicles - Craftworld Gro-Galdr

After the Tyranid invasion of their craftworld, the Iyanden gathered to seek revenge.Splinter groups of Iyanden formed their own craftworlds.  Some aspect warriors survived and joined their new craftworld augmented by the souls of the dead.  The Shrine of Asurmen, the Light in the Darkness was located on Iyanden. Many Dire Avengers joined their frigates as they fled their homeworld. Wandering groups of traveling Harlequins in the webway are also welcomed and often join the craftworld in battle.

Thus Craftworld Gro-Galdr came to be formed. Their homeworld craft is well suited to fly webway and their ties to their Iyanden culture remain steadfast. Their frigate ship flies the Warp on a two fold mission; restore the dead and destroy the Tyranids. The Farseer of Gro-Galdr will sit entanced in dream-like state, and then awaken clutching his bag of runes as if to cast some terrible spell. He searces  in deep meditation and then rises to direct his Craftworld on to their next task.

The Seer Chaeli was aware that the Children of Isha were engaged in conflict with mon-keigh in attempt to control passage into the webway. He would not lead his craftworld into this conflict. The path of the Spirit Seer was to rebuild the ghostly war host of Gro-Galdr and all his energy was spent sitting cross legged beneath the sacred dome gazing into the webway searching for fallen comrades.  His skin was cool and clear and and when he awoke from this state he would instruct his fellow Farseers in the casting of runes and the restoration spells.

The  Craftworld Gro-Galdr Farseer can sense the spirit of their dead warriors even within the Infinity Circuit and believes that he can restore an Eldar soul to a spiritstone pulling it from the depths of the Warp. So they search the Warp looking for fallen comrades but they also hunt their sworn enemy - The Hive Mind.

The Iyanden Spirit hosts avoid battle unless threatened but not these Ghost warriors. Whenever Tyranids are near they hurl themselves into battle. They do not abandon their goal of replenishing their ranks with retrieved souls. Their Farseers have developed a process to accomplish this and even from many miles away they can sense the dead souls and begin the restoration.   

Craftworld Gro-Galdr uses Avatars even at the cost of an Eldar life as the combat monster has his role when hunting Tyranids. Combat is something that an Iyanden army seeks to avoid. Not so this force. They will search and kill any Nid force they can find to revenge themselves on Hive Fleet Kraken. They trust their Farseers to restore the dead souls.

They slip through the eye of the stom silently, with as little direct involvement as possible. It is their resolve  brought on by their desperate situation to survive in hopes of one day restoring the Crafworld to its former glory. So the once mighty defenders of Iyanden bide their time and strengthen their ranks awaiting the rejuvenation of their Craftworld casting the arcane runes of their Seers.

So they replenish their numbers with the spirits of the dead.  Gro-Galdr makes heavy use of their undead warriors animated by the souls of their fallen kin and their necromantic Farseers are feared and revered at once.


Here are a few pictures ... more can be found on the 'your Eldar Army' thread. The colour scheme of the Craftworld is a ghostly grey-silver with purple highlites. 

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP5010014.jpg&hash=3e98c6cbf99a53caa347c5e02972f88dbac75b43)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP4220008.jpg&hash=76df1c85daf14a95ff79a92635acc0d2281db51d)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP4200031.jpg&hash=98280cff23ac13e22fe7274e8d9fef669467ffba)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2Fwraitthguiard1.jpg&hash=53cc69b2918f6c136342e661715d7b9d5b38e127)

Here are a few of the lists I use and my game philosophy ( I can play up to 2500 points quite comfotably as a unified list ).

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=183170.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=183170.0)

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on May 29, 2009, 08:57:41 AM
You have an interesting background there, Gro-Galdr being an Iyanden splinter Craftworld. I expect the Craftworld(s?) is itself quite small, probably more like a giant space station/spaceship than the slow, lumbering behemoths that are the ancient and gigantic Craftworlds of old...

I expect Gro-Galdr is nimble enough to travel the Webway, yes?

Interesting too that your main opponents are SM, CSM and T'au, since these three are known to haunt the galactic East, home sector of Iyanden.

Did you put thoughts over the possible political and social schism created between those Eldar who embraced this diaspora and those who would stay on Iyanden? Just curious, but there are interesting development possibilities there.

   Starky

P.S. Very good painting and models bebe, there's a ghostly feel to them that I find quite interesting. ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on May 29, 2009, 10:17:13 AM
Quote
I expect the Craftworld(s?) is itself quite small, probably more like a giant space station/spaceship than the slow, lumbering behemoths

This is how I envisage it. A large frigate ship wrapped in a ghostly aura striking fear into the hearts of their enemies.

Quote
I expect Gro-Galdr is nimble enough to travel the Webway, yes?

Absolutely. It is mentioned in the fluff.

Quote
[Did you put thoughts over the possible political and social schism created between those Eldar who embraced this diaspora and those who would stay on Iyanden? Just curious, but there are interesting development possibilities there.

There is no real schism. They consider themselves still to be true children of Iyanden, and our emissaries seeking to rebuild the forces of Iyanden and restore their former glory. Their rune casting is somewhat suspect as restoration through the casting of runes is considered a last resort but they feel these nour dire times still.

Quote
Very good painting and models bebe, there's a ghostly feel to them that I find quite interesting

Thank you. Appreciated.

The Song of Gro-Galdr
(Gro-Galdr Shelwe)

The dome above the spirtseer
Is crackling at the seams.
Upon the runes of death
The ghostlight brightly gleams.
When every IllMureead is squashed
With their nightmares and their fears,
The only sound in space to hear
Is silence as it drowns the screams.

Between the infinite circuit of fate,
The seeds of wrath are sown,
And watered by the deeds of those
Who know and who are known;
Wraithbone is a deadly friend
When one casts the runes.
The fate of all Iyanden rests
In in the hands of the  SpiritSeer.

Resurrection will be my epitaph.
As I sail a cracked and ghostly path
If we make it through the Warp
We laugh.
I fear tomorrow we will  weep,
Yes tomorrow we will weep.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 4, 2009, 01:37:24 AM
@Starky: I have a list for you to check and score.

Eldar: Mial' Wei 1750

HQ
Avatar [155]
Eldrad [210]

Troops
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Dire Avenger x10 [152] Exarch, ASC x2, Bladestorm, Defend
Wave Serpent [130] TL-Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stone, Vector Engine

Elite
Fire Dragon x8 [160] Exarch, DBF, Tank Hunter, Crack Shot
Wave Serpent [130] TL-Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stone, Vector Engine

Heavy
Wraithlord [120] Wraithsword, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
Wraithlord [120] Wraithsword, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
Fire Prism [160] Holo, Spirit Stone

Total = 1748

Hope its worthwhile, since this is the list I won with back in 2003 and last year 2008.

If one is to use this list and get into CC range:

1 - Remember Eldrad is used to Mind War special characters off w/ special weapons or abilities before CC.
2 - Spiritseer usually survives invul saves due to Fortune.
3 - Avatar and Bladelords x2 are actually nearby and should be able to obliterate any units that could try to get close to the Wraithguards.
4- NEVER FORGET to FORTUNE!!!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Spiritwarroir on June 4, 2009, 08:03:56 AM
Nice song.
The imagery is dark and fits with the Eldar at war
The last Stanza is a nice reminder of the loss of war for the Eldar
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 4, 2009, 08:22:38 AM
Quote from: Spiritwarroir on June  4, 2009, 08:03:56 AM
Nice song.
The imagery is dark and fits with the Eldar at war
The last Stanza is a nice reminder of the loss of war for the Eldar
He is right. ;)

To answer that comment in another thread, yes the song is appreciated bebe. In fact, unless you have some copyright on it, I think it would be a nice addition to the POC front pages for when I'll rebuild the POC at the end of Summer, with your leave.

@haunt: Hey... It's been some time haunt, glad to see you back. This list seems a nasty piece of deadly warmachine, I'll should rate it this weak at work - I hope nobody believes I spend my precious time at home reviewing lists, are you? :o

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on June 4, 2009, 09:55:56 PM
haunt - Things have changed in 5ed.

First I never use vectored engines now as an immobilized skimmer is a dead skimmer.
Second, troops are much more important in 5ed. Having just two scoring units at 1750 can be dicey.
Third, in 5ed cc is huge. You have very little if any. Sure defend will help but you need a counter charrge squad at 1750.

I'm not rating the list, btw, just giving you a head's up on how 5ed has altered the landscape. I'll let Starky go into detail. I would have gladly played that list in 4ed. It would have been very strong, I can see that. It needs a bit of tweaking for 5ed though.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 5, 2009, 01:46:41 AM
That list plays either w/ Yriel or the Avatar for 155 points. Although not many folks wanna charge that block of Wraithguards due to possibility of being blasted in the face w/ Wraithcannons. Maybe even a nearby Wraithlord too. :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on June 5, 2009, 08:34:50 AM
There is no question that Avatar/Eldrad is nasty and I like it. I also like Yriel/Eldard. You have a ton of experience haunt. I've played about thirty games in 5ed - that's all. I am still tweaking my Iyanden for 5ed. My proir experiences go back to 3ed and 4ed with Eldar. I know you have played a lot more Eldar then me in 4ed as they were not my main army. They are now. So I'm just going to reference my experiences playing 5ed with a Wraithwall. At lower point levels I just use two troops and rely on my Wraithwall as well but a savvy player will charge and try to tar pit that wall. WG are a lot less dangerous in cc then firing their guns. No doubt the Avatar, Eldrad and WL will bolster the wall but that leaves your Dragons and DA without any support. I think the list can be played in 5ed but it will not be forgiving at all. I find I need to play virtually mistake free (not an easy task for me!) and when I start to increase my point levels I always take Harlies or Scorps for that cc and always add Yriel (I don't take Eldrad good as he is as I do not see him in amn Iyanden list but that is a preference that is not game related). Even with Yriel and Harlies and Scorps I feel a little light on cc at times. But again - these are my experiences and they are limited. At 1750-2000 points I've played only a half a dozen games as most of my games are 1500 and less. 
I like your wall and your DA and your FD. I think they are well configured overall based on what I've experienced. Maybe your familiarity with Eldar will allow you to be consistent with this list.  I know I would be adding a third troop choice somehow and be looking for one dedicated cc squad. 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 5, 2009, 11:51:01 AM
Well, to play my list you must be able to think on the fly and be wary of the what's going on. Yes, I have plenty of game time during 4th ed although most of my playtime with my 40k were 2nd ed.

I have been collecting my armies for a while since RT days.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 6, 2009, 06:25:52 PM
Quote from: haunt on June  4, 2009, 01:37:24 AM
Eldar: Mial' Wei 1750

HQ: 365 pts
Avatar [155]
Eldrad [210]

TROOP: 693 pts
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Dire Avenger x10 [167] Exarch, ASC x2, Bladestorm, Defend
Wave Serpent [130] TL-Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stone, Vectored Engine

ELITE: 290 pts
Fire Dragon x8 [160] Exarch, DBF, Crack Shot, Tank Hunter
Wave Serpent [130] TL-Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stone, Vectored Engine

HEAVY: 400 pts
Wraithlord [120] Wraithsword, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
Wraithlord [120] Wraithsword, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
Fire Prism [160] Holo, Spirit Stone

TOTAL = 1748


If one is to use this list and get into CC range:

1 - Remember Eldrad is used to Mind War special characters off w/ special weapons or abilities before CC.
2 - Spiritseer usually survives invul saves due to Fortune.
3 - Avatar and Bladelords x2 are actually nearby and should be able to obliterate any units that could try to get close to the Wraithguards.
4- NEVER FORGET to FORTUNE!!!
Starky's moc-Score

1.. Anti-tank potential: It is very good throughout the list, with all units except Avengers able of some form of AT, either ranged or in CC or both. What hurt the list is the limited number of ranged AT but fast skimmers help alleviate this, although mechanised armies may spell trouble, thus Good 0.8
2.. Anti-MEQ potential: With over half the units able to easily enough kill MEQs, Doom, saturation firepower, 3 MCs, and the speed to bring it to bear this is very well covered, although some form of long ranged anti-MEQ would be desired it is Very Good 0.8
3.. Anti-Horde potential: Hordes will break like water on a shoreline against Fortuned Wraithguard and the list is full of Blasts and Templates and saturation firepower. Where the list can struggle is if the Wraithguard get locked by a horde since there is no significant counter-charge unit to relieve them, but overall Good 0.8
4.. Ranged Firepower potential: A good mix of short and medium firepower and a single lon ranged one, although some good mobility do help to get some of the weapons in range or in better position, I score this Above Average 0.7
5.. Assault potential: Three dedicated CC MCs, Eldrad, Doom, Fortune, extreme resilience and holding potential... I doesn't replace a good dedicated CC unit with it's usual fair number of attacks and so may struggle against numerous units but the list is good enough to deal with high priced elite armies and models, thus Above Average 0.7
6.. Scoring Units / point level: Two Scoring Units at that point level is low but there is some mobility, contesting capabilities and some very good resilience in there, so Slightly Below Average 0.5
7.. Durability or Resilience: There isn't much that could be done to improve the list in that regard, and most non dedicated lists wil break their teeth trying to bring down this force, the only weak parts being the Dragons and Avengers, Very Good 0.8
8.. Flexability: With three fast elements and the mainly footslogging nature of the CC part of the list, there is a limit to it's effectiveness at reacting to a broad range of opponents, so I rate it Average 0.6
9.. Mission Capabiliy: Multiple Objectives and Dawn of War missions may hurt this list, but the KP denial and capability to contest lessen these disavantages, so Above Average 0.7
10. Dynamics and/or Theme: A very good Wraith list theme, although the presence of Eldrad may be viewed as 'unfluffy' by some and three Heavy Support entries may hurt in Tourney's composition. Interaction with resilent and fast elements, CC might against anything Elite make and crowd control potential make for a good overall synergy, I score this at being Good 0.8

Rating = 7.2 Others may score it differently; I feel this list is a good, competitive list asking for some thinking before acting given the nature and vulnerabilities of some of the units. Some form of dedicated CC units could be a ncie add-on but three MCs and Eldrad can be quite nasty in themselves although their use is quite predictable and limited ranged firepower hurt quite a bit and could be made better. Overall, I would play this list with only slight modifications and probably do very well in local gaming and well enough in local and RT tournaments.

Quote from: bebe on June  4, 2009, 09:55:56 PM
First I never use vectored engines now as an immobilized skimmer is a dead skimmer.
Second, troops are much more important in 5ed. Having just two scoring units at 1750 can be dicey.
Third, in 5ed cc is huge. You have very little if any. Sure defend will help but you need a counter charrge squad at 1750.
My thoughts on Vectored Engines: They aren't a bad upgrade, they DO save the tank from a Wrecked! result when going Flat Out, surely a thing to consider if you plan to Tank Shock or try to hold/contest an Objective in the 5th Turn with Random game length and all.
However, since an Imobilised result isn't as catastrophic as it was in 4th ed for a Skimmer (especially transports) I find these much too overpriced for what they bring to the army, much preferring Star Engines for the formidable mobility offered.
That being said, if one have the points and nothing else to spend on, it may be a nice option to buy.

CC with that list: Yes, it lacks a dedicated assault unit for either frontal Assault or countercharge, but the way the list is built there's about no way to find the points... Nonetheless, Eldrad/Wraithguard + Avatar + 2 CC Wraithlord: Any single unit of these should plow through a SM Combat Squad in two round of CC (especially with Doom) and any combination of two should do the same against a full 10 man squad, so this army is actually good in CC when it comes to A) Face MEQs and B) Face weak CC armies like T'au, IG and SoB.
However, facing Hordes may prove problematic, as while the Avatar and WLs will kill their fair share it will take them foerever. The way to deal with hordes with this list is through firepower and timely countercharge with the Wraithguard, as 20 Attacks at STR 5 (+ Spiritseer/Eldrad/Doom) should rape most horde units into submission, especially since most of these are Fearless these days.

@haunt: I see some tweaks here and there that I feel could make the list even more deadly, but that at the cost of the Vectored Engines: Is this list the final product that you want rated (for consitancy's sake) or do you want a review and do some modifications?

What can also be done is that I Rate your list and THEN we discuss it and we make the modifications that we deem could make the list more efficient.

   Starky :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on June 7, 2009, 03:07:48 PM
Quote
Dire Avenger x10 [152] Exarch, ASC x2, Bladestorm, Defend

You did not cost in defend. Should be 167 points. No big deal as you can drop vectored fopr the points.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on June 8, 2009, 03:48:40 PM
I would have knocked it down a little bitmore, as the 2 scoring units is below Average for 1750 (0.4)... Had he had two resilient units I would say Average; but DA in a Serpent are hardly resilient when its one of the easier things to take down (and hence probablly an early target). Think of the bubble and whats outside of it.

Nice list overall, and Starky pretty well nailed the rest for use within my scoring system (good job)

Cheers.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 8, 2009, 04:00:34 PM
Thank you, although you have a point about the Scoring status... :-\ Probably because I never had that much problem with scoring myself, but that may have been a particularity of the opposition I usually face.

...Upon pondering, I think you are right, but I wouldn't score this at 0.4, as unless facing the CC monster units of 5th I've almost never lost the WG as a scoring entity (almost - yes moc, I remember how you killed mine - twice), thus I will revise the score to 0.5.

Thanks for the advice, I am supposed to be a meaner scorer than you after all... :P

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on June 10, 2009, 11:13:24 AM
That was the point though Starky....  Good Generals will know how to remove DA and/or Wraithguard and they will have the means to do it... Wraithguard are near impossible to remove at 1K; but at 1750 they are actually workable, and even if you can't kill them all you can "Pull" them off of objectives too.

Your overall score is fair though, as in general (local) that list could do very well vs almost anything it runs into.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 10, 2009, 05:28:45 PM
Calling on all members of the PoC

I NEED YOUR HELP

in making a 2000 point list to face off against a chaos army this coming tuesday.  I am expecting to face 6 Oblits a greater demon, Havoks, and plenty of CSMs.  Trouble is Ive never faced an army like this in 5th ed and I cant make a list that I am happy with out of what I have available, I cant seem to find an army list that I think will be competitive at the three mission types. 

What I am asking you to do is devise a 2000point army list out of what I list here for me, that will be competitive in any one of the 3 mission scenarios and against such a tough enemy.

Here we go with what I have available.

2 Farseers
Yriel
10 Howling Banshees
10 Fire Dragons
10 Wraithguard and spiritseer
10 Dire Avengers
10 Dire Avengers
5 Rangers
20 Guardian Defenders x2 Weapon platforms
1 Wraithlord with missile launcher and shuri cannon
1 Wraithlord with missile launcher and bright lance
1 wraithlord with starcannon and Wraithsword
3 Wave serpents (one of which is proxy from a falcon)
1 Fire Prism

I intend on turning this into a fully fledged battle report as Ive owed the PoC a bat rep for sooo long.  So please help me decide on a list... I cant decide on one myself right now which is annoying the crap out of me!!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Aislinn on June 11, 2009, 11:35:55 AM
how about this:
  Yriel for sure as the HQ
   the 10 Wraithguard and Seer(troops)
  Both squads of Dire avengers
  the Wraithlord with the Sword and Wraithlord with Lance
  the Fire Prism
  the Banshees and Fire Dragons (in transport)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 11, 2009, 12:24:46 PM
I had thought about that but I have never run Dire Avengers without a transport and I dont know if they can be effective without it?  This is the dilema I had... do I go with both squads but no transports or one squad with a transport??
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on June 11, 2009, 09:03:34 PM
I run DA at times without a transport. I use them to hold an objective on my side of the table coming in from reserves or I use them behind the Wraithwall to whittle down hordes so my WG do not get tar pitted. With run you can afford to give up a round of shooting to get them in position. And you can use the footsloggers as shimmershield/defend DA. They will work as both options. Another option is to give the FD and Banshees Wave Serpents, take one ten man squad of DA on foot behind the wall and DAVU (5 DA in a Falcon for objective grabbing). Then you could even add your Rangers for an extra troop choice.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 12, 2009, 11:39:18 AM
I'm sorry if I'm late on the subject, and I feel too tired to write comadable stuff today, more this weekend.

@Valar: I have a question - Will you face a Lash of Submission? That particular power may well change any counsel I/we may feel like giving you. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 12, 2009, 05:36:51 PM
youre not late Starky still a few days left to formulate the army.... and as far as I am aware no I will not be facing a lash... although I will be facing a Greater Demon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 14, 2009, 01:16:52 AM
Just a question? If you will be facing more 3+ saves, would it be more economical in firepower to use Dark Reapers x2 w/ Exarch + Tempest + Crack Shot? This way your taking out those MEQs even DPs down to invul saves or cover saves?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 14, 2009, 04:04:11 AM
I had thought of using Dark Reapers but I only have one squad of 5 of them, admittedly when I used them last they wrought destruction on turns one and two and by three there were all dead.... not as survivable as certain units im used to.  I only have one squad of them but Il have to give them some serious consideration.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: PanzarDragon on June 17, 2009, 02:39:45 PM
Hi guys, im finally going to throw my lot in here and apply for the PoC!

Gotten back into warhammer not so long ago and im building up my Iyanden army! Why Iyanden? The colour, fluff, attitude and the fresh air they have about them compared to the more popular craftworlds.

My first contact with this forum was with Valar, he taught me how to paint these bad boys up and has given me alot of help and tips since so much thanks to him!

So without further adue pics! Not much at the moment, only a Falcon, guardians and some objective markers but ive got the knack now so im pumping them out faster, nearly finished some DA's and after that farseer wraithguard and harlequinns!

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg7.imageshack.us%2Fimg7%2F8387%2F1245163002panzardragoni.jpg&hash=53e29542e7560a4862baca6fae4c657cdc47bd62)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg196.imageshack.us%2Fimg196%2F9243%2F1235472485panzardragonf.jpg&hash=76993965552ad010fc04033eaa7a911ed5d85384)

Hopefully Alot more to come and i look forward to contributing here!

Laters

Panzar
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 17, 2009, 05:27:54 PM
Hey Panzardragon.

Its great to see you on the PoC, welcome and many congrats on what are beautiful models.

I got your email and I have to say that I am dead impressed with ur guardians and their warlock.  Your yellow is very well painted and you have learned well from me  ;) I cant wait to see some pics of your wraithguard and then your army as a whole I think youve done the Iyanden scheme great justice and im sure many others will agree with me...

when they can see the pics that is.  Thats the only criticism, that your pictures arent working, if your using an image hosting site such as photobucket then when u copy and paste the image code (http://) you have to make sure the letters are in the lower case.

Again welcome to the PoC, I'm glad youve decided to join up, and I think you have a LOT of promise and will contribute alot to the PoC.  Enjoy and nicely done!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: PanzarDragon on June 17, 2009, 05:49:05 PM
Hey Valar, thanks again for all your help!

for the photos: that's really strange because I can still see them and I've checked the code, its all lower case :/

Edit: Ive changed Host so fingers crossed no probs now ^^
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 17, 2009, 06:38:35 PM
No problem at all mate, we're all here to help and learn from each other and its very rewarding to me to see that youve done so well from my tutorials and advice  ;D makes all the effort worthwhile.  So your welcome buddy, and if you ever need anything from me dont hesitate to ask and il see what i can do!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 18, 2009, 12:02:47 PM
Here you go fellow Iyanden players. The start to my battle report is up and running.  A little background info before the game kicks off.  Hope you enjoy, here is the link:

GO READ IT! (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=185110.0)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 18, 2009, 05:31:03 PM
Whoohoo! Thanks for the report Valar! [heading there to read] Hey-hey-hey, recruiting, well done Valar, more souls for the Craftworld! [rub hands]

@PanzarDragon: Welcome to 40KO and the PoC, new members are always welcome, fresh blood, new ideas, new painting, playstyle and whatnot. Thank you for sharing your painting with us, I agree that you made a very good job at blending the colors (especially/blue) Valar Styletm, congrats on that. :)

I will add your name to the POC roster, again welcome to Iyanden! If you have any questions, whatever the subject it may be, about the website in general, coding, or similarly POC irrelevant matter send me a PM and I'll be glad to help as much as I can. If matters are about the game and wraith armies in general, this place is where to ask.
Pics, game summaries, tacticas, army lists or any relevant contributions are welcome, though with army list you may get more answers to your post in the Eldar Tactics & Army lists for a wider range of answers.

Looking forward to your posting,

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on June 20, 2009, 09:48:02 AM
Hello guys!

I just got back into 40k after a 2-3 year break and what better way to restart than pledging my allegiance to the spirit host. I have some WIP harlequins that I'd like to post pics of, where is the best place to do this?

Also looking for a color scheme for the rest of my army. I might go yellow/blue, but I'm really not sure. I would perhaps do a more desert yellow and have a strong Egyptian theme running through the army. What do you think?

I'll also do some battle reps with 1500-2000 points lists, I think.

Cheers, S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 20, 2009, 12:18:24 PM
I think a desert yellow Egyptian theme would be a very very cool take on the Iyanden colour scheme.  Very original and potentially beautiful.  Id love to see that.  One of my fave Eldar artists has painted their Falcons in a desert yellow theme and its astounding... il try and find the pic for you.

Welcome back to 40k and welcome to the PoC
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 20, 2009, 04:59:56 PM
@Sludge-City: Hi and welcome both to the POC and to 40K (again) - Taking a break from time to time seems to be a cycle some players go through, it certainly happened to me a couple of times. I shall add your name to the rank of our depleted numbers, may your posting prove fruitful.
For any question or help not related to the POC, feel free to PM me and I shall do my best to help you, if anything else, post away in the POC or in the relevant Eldar boards!

About painting and color schemes, listen to Valar, he's our chief Bonesinger (painter) and a VERY good one at that (need to put you some pressure, hey Valar?). ;)

As for posting pics of models/armies, THIS (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=152155.0) thread is the place to do so, but pics of your Iyanden force may also be posted in the POC. Batreps are always welcome (with eagerness) and should be posted in the Battle Report board, although I always link up such scriptures to the POC front pages.

Welcome aboard! :)

@Valar: Your batrep is very good some far, very entertaining, I like the narrative style, waiting for you to finish it before cluttering your thread. Keep it up!

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Simmoski on June 21, 2009, 10:00:25 AM
Hi Guys,

I have been lurking around the 40KO forums for a while now and would like to put in my app for joining the Iyanden PoC.  I have been playing 40 since 94, on and off like most people.  Started with the old trusty Marines, but I became bored with them, and too many people play them.  I started collecting Eldar late in the the 3rd and due to other commitments had to have a break. I then started playing again late in the 4th, even entered a low level tournament for the first time. I have recently come back from another break as my regular game crew fell apart.  We have since reformed, and immensely enjoying the 5th.

Currently sitting on close to 6000 points of Eldar i decided to keep aspects warriors as their traditional colours, and with the help of Valar's paining tutorials i have managed to get a start on my vehicle color scheme.

Currently I own

2 Autarchs (one on EJB)
3 Farseers (one on EJB, Conversion in progress)
1 Avatar
all the PL (the models are just hot!)
10 Fire dragons
10 Harlequins
10 Banshees
6 Scorpions
10 Wraithguard (with Spiritseer)
15 Dire avengers
12 Jetbikes (plus a warlock mounted jetbike, Conversion in progress)
34 Guardians  (2x16 both with hwp and warlocks)
5 Rangers
5 Shining spears
6 Swooping Hawks
3 Vypers
5 Warp Spiders
5 Dark Reapers
2 Falcons
1 Fire Prism
3 War Walkers
3 Wraithlords

The next lot i buy will probably be filling out my Aspect warrior squads, another 10 wraith guard, and another box of Dire avengers, Bladestorm and mounting them in a Serpent is just too good a combo.

I will post up pictures as soon as I can figure out how to maintain a good focus on my wife's camera.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on June 21, 2009, 12:41:58 PM
I've been working on the 'Egyptian theme' for my army.

I had a "lightbulb" moment with a Wraithguard I was testing on.

This old boy popped into my head...
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi42.tinypic.com%2F10def4w.jpg&hash=7b33120a5dca2d6a25ab05259b6be987c483be07)

And a while later I had come up with this...
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi43.tinypic.com%2Fop7its.jpg&hash=d0782b53d444545521ddb194c9ad9c5e43d18e1d)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi40.tinypic.com%2F23m0cnp.jpg&hash=c8be5780e5b9e03645a8865e50b14093ba6bb846)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi42.tinypic.com%2F25i17c3.jpg&hash=eab3f52d124bc051981a1a57c383826e59156a87)

Now, the freehand isn't the greatest in the world, but I think with practice it will come a lot better. Not a bad start though, IMO  :D

I am not sure about what color to do the Wraithcannon. I would do bone, but I am going to do the ribbed areas with a drybrush of bone (as you can probably see in the pics above), so I think the weapon needs to be a different color, maybe NMM gold...what do you think?

Comments & critique very welcome,

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on June 21, 2009, 01:36:34 PM
The head and shoulder area looks great... show us the rest please...

and the free hand is pretty good actually, and as you said, it will only get easier and better with practice.

Cheers.. that was unique and very refreshing.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 21, 2009, 02:56:16 PM
Like I said, an Egyptian themed Iyanden army would be a thing of beauty.  Thanks for proving me correct on that  ;) absolutly stunning Wraithguard and what a way to implement the tutankamun death mask into your scheme... its inspired.

Pretty well painted too I should add!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on June 21, 2009, 03:17:31 PM
Aww *shucks* thanks :)

The rest is WIP as we speak. I'm just gonna blend the rest of the body like the front of the head and drybrush the 'ribbed' areas with bleached bone, then deal with the matter of the wraithcannon.

Not sure what, if any, detail to add to the rest of the model. I'll probably try some freehand glyphs on the tabard, other than that...not sure :P

Thanks again, S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sanctjud on June 21, 2009, 04:58:21 PM
Dustbucket Eldar... Thousand Sons Wraithlord.
Lawl.

Nice and clean though.  You thinking of freehanding a face on the wraith's head?

My 7 Cents.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on June 21, 2009, 05:11:31 PM
Thanks :)

Quote from: Sanctjud
You thinking of freehanding a face on the wraith's head?

Well, I would love to do a faint gold 'etched look' face on it, but my painting skills are nowhere near up to the task of that, heh.

Quote from: Sanctjud
Thousand Sons Wraithlord

Good idea :P I might try 'plasticarding' either a headdress or a wraithguard collar for my wraithlords. Could look cool :D

More pics of the WG coming tomorrow, and I'll do a step-by-step of the next one I do.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 21, 2009, 06:41:44 PM
Good paint job Sludge_City, that's sure feels refreshing, we want to see that Wraithguard and a Wraithlord finished with these colors!

Quote from: Sanctjud: Always There Behind You When Soap Is In Your Hand. on June 21, 2009, 04:58:21 PM
Dustbucket Eldar... Thousand Sons Wraithlord.
Lawl.
Yes, then he can play pure TS and use 'count as' Eldar models to kick some PM's arses around. :P

@Simmoski: Aaah, an old hand from 2nd ed then, welcome aboard Simmoski, back to W40K, to 40KOnline and to the Iyanden POC. That's an nice list of models you have there, sure make for some diverse list possibilities, and we sure want pictures when you can. :)

So, starting up anew to 5th ed then... Have you made some games so far, and what is the pts level your group usually play?

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Simmoski on June 21, 2009, 06:53:31 PM
I have played 6 games so far,  1x 500 point 3-way, 1x 750, 2x 1000, 1x 1250, 1x 1500.  my 2 most likely opponents are ork and tyranid players.  Went into GW and had a quick 1k pt game against a staff member.  He fielded a nasty nurgle demon army.  Ended up being an annihilation game with the spearhead board. Only thing that really sucked about it is his whole army was deep striking in, and i ended up with first turn.  Ended up with him winning.

@ S_C The WG look fantastic, I love them. Nice colors.

Pictures as promised, and yes i know my basing can do with alot of work, still stuck in the basic tabletop way of basing (so 90's isn't it?). I'm not the best painter but i will get better with practise  :D


(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi883.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fac40%2Fsimmoski81%2FIMG_2315.jpg&hash=a9d04575807a43ab0d89aa8014558f4358069869)
General overview of the army

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi883.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fac40%2Fsimmoski81%2FIMG_2316.jpg&hash=35d5af9b6611470a171f13f5620098051e82a97e)
My farseer

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi883.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fac40%2Fsimmoski81%2FIMG_2318.jpg&hash=7c40b1cd53b2d09e88a88751bcda216a16cfa995)
My Wraithguard and Spiritseer

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi883.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fac40%2Fsimmoski81%2FIMG_2321.jpg&hash=2c4efb6546319e7ff8956d1b73e9a156953f4dc8)
Scorpions

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi883.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fac40%2Fsimmoski81%2FIMG_2322.jpg&hash=a592d2cf5993a994977c942ff88dcfde1a0c8185)
Fire Dragons (2nd or 3rd edition models, cant quite remember)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi883.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fac40%2Fsimmoski81%2FIMG_2324.jpg&hash=813e9767416eafe3dae1964b129bbd4490ae8046)
Wraithlord with ScatLas and Wraithsword (painted before i had run into this message board)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi883.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fac40%2Fsimmoski81%2FIMG_2325.jpg&hash=46f8b0ce2d6cd31b9384dbb67a9b8f5316c2998b)
'The Valar Inspired Wave Serpent'
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on June 22, 2009, 05:34:30 AM
That stuff isn't bad, mate! At least you get things painted :P

I have a habit of getting behind on my painting...bad concentration span 'n' all that  ::)

Keep ze pics coming ^_^

Edit: Thought I'd add a pic of my newly converted Wraithlord. Some of the greenstuff needs a bit of filing down, other than that it's pretty much done.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi43.tinypic.com%2F27ybg9t.jpg&hash=196bcef5aa7d678757f51d1937b01d33a81eb8a9)

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 22, 2009, 09:12:48 AM
@Simmoski: Good work there, and I agree with S_C, you do get your things painted... I just tend to procrastinate a lot...

Oh, the Fire Dragons are the 3th ed models.

@Sludge_City: Good conversion of that oop Wraithlord, metal tend to be much harder to work on than plastics. I take that the loincloth is painted and greenstuff? Or metal and unpainted?

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on June 22, 2009, 09:33:02 AM
The loincloth is actually the back part of the Greater Demon of Tzeentch's cloak.
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.atomik.nl%2Feshop%2Fuploaded_files%2Fimages%2Fgreaterdaemonoftzeentchbox.gif&hash=317ae418507b9f102228f87b8cfe4c209a49fc7e)
I think you can just about see it in this pic.

I might do a bit more work on the 'lord. I was thinking of bending his right leg at the kneecap to a ~100o angle and have it standing on a rock. Fits the 'pointing' pose a bit better, I think.

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 22, 2009, 10:13:55 AM
Quote from: Sludge_City on June 22, 2009, 09:33:02 AM
The loincloth is actually the back part of the Greater Demon of Tzeentch's cloak.
Yes, we can make it out a bit, thanks. A good find there, that loincloth... I wonder if more 'spare' Wraithlord sized loincloths like these can be found in the GW (or other) model's range? Any of you have an idea?

Quote
I might do a bit more work on the 'lord. I was thinking of bending his right leg at the kneecap to a ~100o angle and have it standing on a rock. Fits the 'pointing' pose a bit better, I think.

S_C
Mine is done like this:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2FAll%2520Eldar%2FDSC00688.jpg&hash=4b874cd863b509fda986a1b9ea0ed941616daf52)(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2FAll%2520Eldar%2FDSC00690.jpg&hash=9b8d290c168c8a0f9f76165dc26eb0f1b4bad49a)

@haunt: As per your demand, there is the 'tweaked version' of your list that I would use myself:
Quote from: haunt on June  4, 2009, 01:37:24 AM
Eldar: Mial' Wei 1750

HQ: 365 pts
Avatar [155]
Eldrad [210]

TROOP: 693 pts
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Dire Avenger x10 [167] Exarch, ASC x2, Bladestorm, Defend
Wave Serpent [130] TL-Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stone, Vectored Engine

ELITE: 290 pts
Fire Dragon x8 [160] Exarch, DBF, Crack Shot, Tank Hunter
Wave Serpent [130] TL-Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stone, Vectored Engine

HEAVY: 400 pts
Wraithlord [120] Wraithsword, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
Wraithlord [120] Wraithsword, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
Fire Prism [160] Holo, Spirit Stone

TOTAL = 1748

Mine version, changes in yellow:

Eldar: Starky's Tweaks - 1750 pts

HQ: 365 pts
Avatar [155]
Eldrad [210]

TROOP: 698 pts
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Dire Avenger x10 [172] Exarch, Powersword/Pistol, Bladestorm, Defend
Wave Serpent [130] TL-EML Cannon,, Spirit Stone (removed V-Engines

ELITE: 285 pts
Fire Dragon x8 [145] Exarch, DBF, Crack Shot (removed Tank Hunter)
Wave Serpent [140] TL-EML, Shurican upgrade, Spirit Stone (removed V-Engines)

HEAVY: 400 pts
Wraithlord [120] Wraithsword, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
Wraithlord [120] Wraithsword, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2
Fire Prism [160] Holo, Spirit Stone

TOTAL = 1748

First, I basically removed Vectored Engines on the Serpents to get more versatile AT/anti-horde firepower in the form of EMLs on the same Serpents - I do not believe in the value of Vectored Engines in 5th ed, not for the pts we pay for, Thus, removing a wee bit of resilience in exchange for fore firepower.

Second, I got rid of Dragon's Tank Hunters, as I believe that it is overkill anyway, and the two twin linked EMLs make up for the slight drop in AT capabilities, especially if the list end up facing some light vehicles like DE or Orks where you want to pop these from range.

Third, I added the Powersword/Pistol to the Avenger Exarch, reasonning that if you are going to take Defend you may as well go all the way and actually give the squad a chance to win/draw a CC (Doom would help a lot), especially given the low amount of power weapons in the list.
Also add some versatility and staying power - If you find yourself in that particular situation, Eldrad can join the Avengers, meaning more power weapon attacks, Fortune and Doom to make the unit as resilient to shooting as a Council if in Cover, and very tough to shake in CC if the unit doesn't face an overflow of power weapons, especially if the Avatar is nearby.

Alternatively, teh Avengers could get rid of Defend and stay with the Dual Catapults for a 20 pts of goodies to spend elsewhere.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Simmoski on June 22, 2009, 07:10:15 PM
Since picking up the hobby again about 5 weeks ago, i have managed to paint 20 guardians, a wave serpent, 10 wraithguard, and 10 fire dragons.  Not bad considering the amount of time i actually get to paint (2 hrs a day when i got to work and maybe 4 -5 hrs on a day off).  Right now working on another wave serpent, (its missing in the general army pic).


So I am about to challenge the same dude at GW to another game (Friday afternoon).  I was told by the manager he will more than likely field the same army again. I'll post a copy of my last army which got wiped out. I'll try to remember what he had.

Simmoski's 1000pt quick list

Farseer [120] - doom, guide, Spirit Stones

Dire avengers [167] x10- Dual ASC, Bladestorm, Defend
Waveserpent [130]- TL EML, ShuriCan
Wraithguard [396] x11 - Spiritseer, Conceal

Wraithlord [155] - BL, EML.


From memory he had

Greater demon (Great Unclean One)
Daemon Prince
7 Nurgling bases
3 units of plague bearers
Soul Grinder.

Unsure of what he was hitting me with in CC but my wraithguard managed to get in range of his charge, and i couldn't get any saves what so ever.  WL got a penetrating hit on the soulgrinder in my turn 2 and destroyed it, but not before he charged my waveserpent taking it off the board.  The nurglings soaked up bladestorm, only 1 base left with one wound on it in the end.  Wraithlord didn't do much, other than take down the GUO, and get held up in CC with plague bearers, allowing the prince to charge. I made a few vital mistakes, but thats what getting back into the game is all about, learning the new rules, and having fun.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 24, 2009, 12:21:27 AM
Heya all,

I had been busy working 6-7 days a week lately. I have a friend that is getting into the game and had asked me about 40k. He's curious about all the armies. I have not tried to persuade him to our cause since he's new and I think I will let him borrow some of my armies to fiddle with and figure out on his own.

He wants to play against me and I thought I might ask our POC's opinion of the force I am bringing.

1k Iyanden Trainer
HQ
Farseer Anisa [150] Fortune, Guide, RoWard, RoWit, Stone
Joins the Bone Wall, Fortunes and Guides.
Troops
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
This wall should last till the end of turn in this low point value game.

Storm Guardians x12 [140] Warlock, Enhance, Flamer, Fusion gun
+ Wave Serpent [130] EML, Stone
More of a All-Purpose mobile support unit.
Heavy
Dark Reapers x3 [182] Exarch, Tempest, Crack Shot
My anti-MEQs. I have always thought of using a Fire Prism here.

So is this too much for a beginner to face? He has only watched me play games meaning he has a bearing in the game just doesn't know what to play.

@Starrakatt:
Thanks for sharing your tweak and yes, I did use it in that version before as of late (last 2 months.) :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Simmoski on June 24, 2009, 01:53:10 AM
this advice is coming from a newbie so disregard if you want, but i thought i would at least get an opinion out there.

The best way i found to get into the game is rather than playing a pitced battle from the beginning, is just play small combat squad type missions, give it some narrative and have some fun while explaining.  The guys at m local GW (and i am assuming most GW stores around the world) get right into this sort of thing, and are almost the best bet.  It is how i got into it all those years ago.  Once confident one the general idea, then pick up an army and go for it.

In regards to the list, I am assuming that your friend is going to be playing your marine army? Hence the anti-MEQ?

Not that i have much experience with eldar vs marines in the 5th, but from what i understand, the TL - Scatter lasers instead of an EML on your serpent would be your friend. Strength 6 with 4 shots, and an ability to reroll misses on a BS of 3, turns those pesky marine 10man squads into something that looks like it might break and run away.  If you have the points go the whole hog, get the TL-Starcannon.  No saves there with an ap of 2.  (- On a side note, it mentions in the eldar codex that the starcannon is a heavy 2 template. So is this ruling still effective or not, cause i can see alot of fun with a tl starcannon and fireprism ripping up a battle field.) 

Storm guardians - i havent used much so i can't really comment.

Another problem that i can forsee with the list, is that there is only one vehicle making it an extremely big target.

Reapers im not sure, i myself havent got alot of use with them yet.  but you did say something about a fire prism.  Personally i rate them, equip it with a holofield and you have a chance at keeping it on the board if he gets a lucky shot off.

Now i know its meant to be a friendly intro game, but i am a bit competative. I have been burnt so many times before by cheesy army lists, so i adopted the same almost cheesy apperance, whilst maintaining my theme.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 29, 2009, 03:36:30 PM
I thought Id update the PoC with what Ive been doing recently

The Dire Avenger Exarch
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906095.jpg&hash=6d4f65aeb55d60d6fc174500636ef6f9dd7c11db)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906096.jpg&hash=082ca2afc3b20896af3ffe12c7c4858bc7050b58)

The completed Wraithlord
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906092.jpg&hash=3e6ee11a047764782462483fd40abc2aeae31597)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906091.jpg&hash=a804af945acf8b132be1b505e7588176c123b705)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906093.jpg&hash=e76f840a3817655005a4acf8303843716f0d6abf)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906094.jpg&hash=d0cdf5c44673ddca9681f99fcc80aa3b88082b10)

A magnestised flying stand
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F290609.jpg&hash=5442d64b0a8ab8da4099fc99bef67f9c98331186)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906097.jpg&hash=4d573898c7408f09abe9208b4747a301aa9eeea0)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906098.jpg&hash=6c36bb961d05b59b5335ac1b10702c2d4c7c76f6)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2F2906099.jpg&hash=d73cd22963c12e64b46ced91ff31b5ffb0a55e22)

The Waveserpent!!

Tell me what you think.....

It seems 40KO automatically resizes the images... which reduces their quality which is a real shame!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on June 29, 2009, 05:17:59 PM
That's real good work Valar, as always. Is that the same (still unfinished at the time) Wraithlord you use in your batrep? The EML's holding strap is a great addition, as is the running pose, but I am repeating myself. Old age...

The Avenger is great, although I am a bit miffled of opinion about the yellow faceplate, each his/her own I guess, but thw shading/highlighting is of your usual quality, so great. I would have gone with a black rail/top barrel for the Catapult myself, but again each his own. ;)

Serpent is good too, although I feel it misses something... Need to go take a look of your first to compare.

   Starky

P.S. WHERE ARE THE WRAITHLORD'S FLAMERS!?!

P.P.S. You can get a bigger image by right clicking the pic and select the 'show image' function.

Or make thumbnails, like this (hit the quote button to see how I did it - or PM me):
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2Fth_2906099.jpg&hash=66ec4f6fe19a1bfcf5488ad5d28014fdc529db3b) (http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d199/marvinio/2906099.jpg)

Edited for idiocy.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on July 1, 2009, 12:16:48 PM
Start of the Battle for the Sword of Heidar 2 is up now click here (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=185771.0) for it.

It proves to be a good read of what was a very hard fought battle.

and Can you believe it Starky?? With over a year of promising you a battle report you get 2 in two weeks!!! AMAZING!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 1, 2009, 01:00:26 PM
Quote from: Valar on July  1, 2009, 12:16:48 PM
Start of the Battle for the Sword of Heidar 2 is up now click here (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=185771.0) for it.

...and Can you believe it Starky?? With over a year of promising you a battle report you get 2 in two weeks!!! AMAZING!
I am AMAZED and jump around in glee. :o

Thanks Valar, but now it seems that the Silver Ghosts will need to take part in that quest. I shall write a batrep soon, the one where that particular Iyanden's retribution fleet followed in the wake of your own force and fell upon these Imperial Grey Knights - It seems that the Chaos activities on that world have been noticed by more eyes that Eluraisal could have guessed.

Farseer Rabbadun will communicate with you soon, for now they must engage... We shall be at your back, just in case.

   Starky

P.S. Hey people, if any of you want a customised variant Iyanden banner (different color, text, inversions, new icons and whatnot) just ask and I'll see what I can do for you. ;)

Some samples:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KO%2520Avvies%2FPOCbanner1.jpg&hash=a99d969cc33fa330f844452e5c862417a44a28a3)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KO%2520Avvies%2FIyandenbanner3-1-1-3.jpg&hash=228b7a03e85687395fa5948e4a155eb524a0217f)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi184.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fx187%2FStarrakatt%2F40KO%2520Avvies%2FIyandenbanner3-1-1-2A.jpg&hash=ec5e44d01d5e026c840131ab4123987e269553f7)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 1, 2009, 06:31:48 PM
@ Starky

Sure, I want one that has Iyanna Arienal looking deep and a wraithguard construct nearby.  :D
-----------

I had been toying around on a list, mind I get any of you or all of your inputs and suggestions?

HQ
Na' Nular (ancient farseer) [210]
Yriel [155]
Usage: Ancient Farseer and Yriel in the Enhance Wraithguard squad as usual 2 Fortunes and maybe doom on something if anything.
Troops
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Dire Avenger x10 [287] Exarch, ASC x2, Bladestorm + Wave Serpent - Scatter Laser, Stone
Jetbikes x6 [152] Shuriken Cannon x2
Jetbikes x6 [152] Shuriken Cannon x2
Usage: Wraiths march and take the fire from everything or hold middle ground objectives, if possible enemy objectives are taken.

Elite
Fire Dragons x7 [254] Exarch, DBF, Crack Shot + Wave Serpent - Scatter Laser, Stone
Usage: Tank hunting or MC killing

Heavy
Prism [160] Holo, Stone
Prism [160] Holo, Stone
Prism [160] Holo, Stone
Usage: These are the money shots hoping the rerolled shots or being far away enough is more than good for these guys. I like S10 AP1 Blast templates.

--------
Any thoughts is good to read and see, Ard Boyz is still some time and tweaking is best done before the tourney not at the tourney. lol

Hopefully, I'd be able to grab someone's camera and take some pics.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on July 2, 2009, 02:13:14 PM
How about something more like this.

HQ 816
210 ~ Big-E
155 ~ Yriel
306 ~ 10 Warlocks; 2 Emb, 2 Enh, 1 Dest, 2 Spears
145 ~ serpent; BL's and stones

Elite 226
113 ~ 6 Fire Dragons; ex with DBF and CS
113 ~ 6 Fire Dragons; ex with DBF and CS

Troops 968
152 ~ 10 DA; Ex with DAC and BS
145 ~ serpent; BL's and stones
130 ~ 10+1 Stormies; 2 flamers, lock has Dest and spear.
145 ~ serpent; BL's and stones
396 ~ 10+1 Wraithguard; Spiritseer has conceal.

Heavy Support 490
180 ~ Falcon; EML, hf, and stones
180 ~ Falcon; EML, hf, and stones
130 ~ Wraithlord; Wraithswordsword and Starcannon

2500pts, 14 KP's, 3 Scoring Units, 62 figures

I know its not 100% Iyanden; but I think it has merit, some Iyanden touches, and might well be a serious contender if used well.

Cheers.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 2, 2009, 07:46:52 PM
Gonna give them both a try and thanks for suggest moc065.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 2, 2009, 09:37:14 PM
So...I'm at my local GW...some dude comes up to me and is like "OMGosh are you on 40KO?!". I'm like "Yeah".

Turns out it was PanzerDragon recognising me by my egyptian WG from pics on here! Small world ;D

On the subject of egyptian WG I have one complete with pics on a camera which is with my parents on holiday. So...when they get back I will upload pics here. I would love some feedback on it.

<pics coming. watch this space>

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: PanzarDragon on July 3, 2009, 06:52:08 AM
haha it is indeed a small world x3
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Two Hawks on July 3, 2009, 07:03:29 AM
Just thought I'd let you all know I am still around.
Just been busy working 12-15 hr days 6 days a week. So I haven't had much time to do anything. I am going to play in our Ard boyz tourney next Sat. though. I'm taking off whether my job likes it or not. Gotta get some stress relief.
@ Valar: very nice work.
@ Simmoski: good job.
As for for everyone else keep doing what you are doing by keeping our craftworld going. It's nice to see new members.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 3, 2009, 09:23:18 AM
Well, I took my Iyanden out on a challenge against a NidZilla player. Her had seen my list previously and he insisted we play with our lists as is without tweaking for an opponent. He had seen me take on a Tau force and suggested my list was not up to taking on Zilla with so few models and limited mobility. He fielded the usual seven monsters and some stealers that I knew were going to try and outflank me.

Iyanden 1500

Farseer Chaeli  (Eldrad) 210 (joined with wraithwall)
Yriel 155 (joined mounted wraithguard)

5 Wraithguard 364
1 Spiritseer, Singing Spear, Enhance
Wave Serpent, TL Missile Launchers, Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones

10 Wraithguard, 399
1 Spiritseer, Singing Spear, Conceal

5 Dire Avengers, 60
Falcon, BL, Spirit Stones, Holofield 190

Wraithlord, Scatterlaser, Wraithsword,  2x flamers 120

1498
Models: 28
KP 8

I decided to keep my Wraithwall central and bring in the DA and mounted WG from reserves when I saw how he was setting up. I was afraid of his Flyrant truth be told. IO knew it was going to get close and personal quickly. I decided I would spank him and and any Carnis with mindwar and some nice rerollable saves.

In fact the game went pretty well. The stars as expected were Yriel and Eldard. Eldard took on carnis, flyrant et all and Yriel was a beast against the monsters. My problem as I expected was getting charged by stealers and Carnis together. I needed to get off shots aginst the stealers before the charge and the range of my WG hurt. Still and all at games end we each held an objective thanks in part to tank shocking stealers off the last objective and baiting my opponent and causing him to lose focus on the what he needed to win the game.

I'm hoping to use Yriel again with my five WG in the serpent. As long as the big E can fortune them, they are one tough nut capable of both assault and shooting. Damn the range though. To get close enough to fire puts you in charge range each time , even with careful placement of the WS.

In the end I was rather pleased though holding an objective with a last turn rush with my DA. My central squad of WG bit the bullet and were tarpitted easily keeping them off the objective but my mounted WG were able to contest.

The weakest link was the WL but he was not terrible as he at least did some SL damage and the was able to inflict a few wounds in cc before exploding. I think my smartest ploy was keeping away from the stealers until I had attacked the MCs. This at least mitigated the damage and let me set up for the inevitable charge. FEx and Tyrant shooting really is bad -or maybe my opponent just rolled badly. My real problem was cc which in the end resulted in a draw.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 3, 2009, 09:33:55 AM
Taking bugs with your list as is sure was a challenge, I think that Destructor over Enhance could have made things easier to get rid of the Stealers though - Well, that's why I always favor the power for my Flyguard.

Facing a lot of MCs zooming at you at the same time is kinda unerving, especially since you KNOW that your Wraithgurd will get only ONE volley in before getting assaulted. In any case, congrats for having pulled at least a Draw, it could have been far worse. :D

P.S. Did you try to get these stealers with a Doom/Eldritch Storm combo?

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 3, 2009, 10:17:48 AM
Eldrad used his mind war and fortune pretty much every turn. I think my opponent actually made a mistake in outflanking the stealers. It gave me the time to set up away from a quick assault. I probably should have used Storm but I confess I did not. Yriel bomb and Spear did the most damage though with Eldrad a wonderful back up.

As for the destructor - we were not allowed to alter our lists so I played it as it was against the Tau. I would not field 28 models against large bugs as a rule, lol. And yes, I was lucky and pleased with the draw. Would have been nicer to win though.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 3, 2009, 11:47:15 AM
Were you able to Synapse Hunt? If you were able those Wraithcannons will work wonder v Carnifexes even with that high amount of Wounds, since a 6 will take em out without Synapse in the area.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 3, 2009, 03:05:26 PM
I went after the Flyrant early. Wraithcannons work well but you only get a single volley. Relistically this is not the best match up for my list but really every game is tricky playing with so few models on the table and only two scoring troops.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 3, 2009, 03:43:12 PM
Ok, as promised. click thumbnails for larger images.

Egyptian-themed Wraithguard:
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Wraithguardfrontright.jpg&hash=a3eba0c770a45ac40ddf76e7c895ec0940b84b14) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Wraithguardfrontright.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Wraithguardfrontleft.jpg&hash=c92ec4f1cd61fddf1aadc9282e416c67b25ed535) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Wraithguardfrontleft.jpg)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Wraithguardbackright.jpg&hash=2f2d778f92a87de504a94d02df9174e48d57bfaf) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Wraithguardbackright.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Wraithguardbackleft.jpg&hash=1a92d7e852e77643a4df1e8529747fb125db8c1a) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Wraithguardbackleft.jpg)

Also adjusted my Wraithlord's right leg. This pose is a bit more natural than two straight legs.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Wraithlordconversionfront.jpg&hash=3504915aec03231f88d794331e83c5f2f63ae2de) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Wraithlordconversionfront.jpg)

And started a plastic Yriel conversion. I need to work on his cloak (gonna take all the GS skills, if any, I have!), and give him a topknot in his hair.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Yrielconversionfront.jpg&hash=50ba7680ba550aa0b332bb300283531c268b8f32) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Yrielconversionfront.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Yrielconversionback.jpg&hash=2ee808d1a6f5296380ae00368ea369c9bcf1d3b6) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Yrielconversionback.jpg)

Cheers, S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 4, 2009, 09:08:37 PM
That's some good paintjob you did there S_C, I like the concept a lot, keep it up - I wanna see a full squad of these, along with a WL or two.

BTW, the Wraithlord itself is much better like that, more dynamic.

As for the Yriel lookalike, seems a good start so far. I'd say the model will need a loincloth and/or some ribbons to make him more impressive, possibly making the base a bit higher to give him height, keep up the good work. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 11, 2009, 07:34:56 AM
Didn't wanna resurrect an old thread in the Army lists section (and it doesn't warrant a new thread), so I will post my tweaked 2k list here.

I played an 'Annihilation' game against Space Wolves 13th co. on Thursday. Here's what I used:

HQ 365 pts
- Yriel - *** pts
- Eldrad - *** pts

Elites 516 pts
- 8 Harlequins w/ Kisses, Shadowseer, 2 Fusion Guns - 226 pts
- 8 Fire Dragons w/ Exarch, DBF, Crack Shot 145 pts
- Wave Serpent w/ Spirit Stones, TL-BL - 145 pts

Troops 593 pts
- 10 Wraithguard w/ Spiritseer, Conceal, Singing Spear - 399 pts
- 10 Guardian Defenders w/ Scatter Laser, Spiritseer, Embolden, Singing Spear - 134 pts
- 5 Dire Avengers - 60 pts

Fast Attack 0 pts

Heavy Support 525 pts
- Falcon w/EML, Spirit Stones, Star Engines, Holo-Fields - 195 pts
- 3 War Walkers w/ 2x EML each - 210 pts
- Wraithlord w/ Wraithsword, Scatter Laser - 120 pts

Total - 2000 pts

As you can see I swapped out the 5-man WG squad for 8 FDs and 2 more harlies (w/fusion guns).

Anyway, the match went great (for me). Aside from making a mistake with my harlies in turn 1 and getting wiped out by some flippin dogs (!), I had my opponent down to a Space Wolf Lord in 4 turns. Guided EML WW out-did themselves once again - coupled with the FDs makes for one lethal combo!
Now I am using FDs I am thinking I should swap out the Falcon for a Serpent. Save a few points and I can switch the weapons around a bit (so FD/WS isn't 2 AT units in 1 kill).

Aside from pwning Space Wolves, I have been making an Eldrad conversion for a 'counts as' model.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Eldradconversionfront.jpg&hash=bb31f34d3bbe149e15b3fc6ef91856caf97251c3) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Eldradconversionfront.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_Eldradconversionback.jpg&hash=50810e4e22d2e9314918edc910eb1531d02114c4) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=Eldradconversionback.jpg)
(click images to enlarge)

Just got a bunch of resin bases through from Scibor so I'm gonna go have fun with them ^_^

Later, S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 11, 2009, 08:32:03 AM
Yes, I guess the list is much meaner in the AT department with Fire Dragons - Guided Walkers? Meaning you played the waiting game and forced him to come at you, that's usually good when Wraithguard and Harlies are involved.

By mistake, you mean got First Turn assaulted? Tsk-tsk... :D

The 'Count As' Eldrad is nicely done, simple but very effective for a new look Farseer, I think that failing finding a (reasonnably priced) Bonesinger on e-bay, I may end up doing mine like your's thanks for the inspiration S_C.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 11, 2009, 10:34:29 AM
So the process has begun to detaily Wraithguard. I painted up the head a bone with green fading, added runes to the front and will finish off the bases as well soon ...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Fwg1b.jpg&hash=b456ccab1d4029152c61209c197935a0ff18dab4)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Fwg1f.jpg&hash=1c52ad1e986d1eb31d5cc8ac8a49a192a03081d4)

What do you guys think? The plan is to do the heads quite glossy along with stones, keep the bodies mat finished and add some static grass to the bases.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Zorb on July 11, 2009, 02:47:37 PM
Quote from: bebe on July 11, 2009, 10:34:29 AM
What do you guys think? The plan is to do the heads quite glossy along with stones, keep the bodies matt finished and add some static grass to the bases.

The lighter parts and the gems look good, but I'm not thrilled by the work done on the blue.  It looks too homogeneous, since you have the same pattern on the lighter areas.  The symbol on the sash looks very good, too.  I think I see what you were going for with the glossy paint on areas other than the gems, but from my end it just makes it look wet and slippery.

I actually like the bases as you have them now - the "bleak landscape" base emphasizes determination and general bad-assity a lot more than static grass would.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 12, 2009, 10:24:25 AM
My picture taking is not the best without a light box and a really good camera but the blue ( it is actually gray with highlights) looks better up close. I finished the first one now - pictures above and added glowing rocks to the base rather then static grass. I now have to finish detailing the remaining twenty-five. Then the four WLS, then the five vehicles and then my DA. I'll be busy!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 13, 2009, 11:02:07 AM
Been working on magnetizing my plastic Wraithlord...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_DSCF2102.jpg&hash=be6a24b8fa375dbad4a8459554ddb557549d8c12) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=DSCF2102.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_DSCF2104.jpg&hash=33ba2dec4e88331c9f3bf00a7c8d5b36dbdcc786) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=DSCF2104.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_DSCF2103.jpg&hash=fe098b689b47f6f39df977523b14f07a56eb346e) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=DSCF2103.jpg)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_DSCF2105.jpg&hash=eede4fdda018c1e5fd111125fe3361719021d668) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=DSCF2105.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FEldar%2520pics%2Fth_DSCF2106-1.jpg&hash=5291cf9696f6a6aaedc087cdbe3e75f26dcbf157) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/Eldar%20pics/?action=view&current=DSCF2106-1.jpg)
click images to enlarge

Magnets on both shoulders, the right arm flamer, and the right arm shoulder joint.

The resin base is from Scibor's range (http://www.sciborminiatures.com/en_,shop.php?group=73). The 'Ruins' set to be more precise. Looks nice :D

Starting work on a couple of Wave Serpents and a Falcon soon. Pics coming when they're done. Need it to stop flippin' raining before I can spray more though  ::)

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 13, 2009, 11:58:43 AM
@bebe: Seems to be nice work, but as you said yourself the lighting is not very good, care to make some new pics when you got time? Other than that, seems you have managed some interesting 'wraithbone' look for the WG.

Sludge_City: Nice bases indeed... :D

I like the sword on shoulder arm, first time I've seen that. Other than that, the pose may superficially look static but for here I get a 'watchful slow walk but ready to react' feel of it - slightly dragging right leg and inclination of the body, and the slight head tipping.

The Brightlance is nothing special though, some modeling or adding of details/banners/bits could help making it look meaner, but same goes with the lord itself, I guess it isn't quite finished?

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 13, 2009, 08:44:42 PM
@Starky -
Quote from: Starrakatt on July 13, 2009, 11:58:43 AM
Sludge_City: Nice bases indeed... :D

I like the sword on shoulder arm, first time I've seen that. Other than that, the pose may superficially look static but for here I get a 'watchful slow walk but ready to react' feel of it - slightly dragging right leg and inclination of the body, and the slight head tipping.

That's exactly the look I was going for :D Wandering down the battlefield...occas ionally blasting a few things...sword drawn at the ready! I'm glad you noticed :)

Quote from: Starrakatt on July 13, 2009, 11:58:43 AM
The Brightlance is nothing special though, some modeling or adding of details/banners/bits could help making it look meaner, but same goes with the lord itself, I guess it isn't quite finished?

Yeah, I've not added the "frilly bits" like banners/ribbons yet. Going to paint them separately to get a cleaner paint job on the 'lord.

@bebe -  I like the color scheme of your WG. It seems like the paint is quite streaky, though. Maybe it looks different to the eye than to the camera lens.
By the way, I love the green crystals on the bases! Very well executed reflections on the 'guard.

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 13, 2009, 08:59:52 PM
Quote
@bebe -  I like the color scheme of your WG. It seems like the paint is quite streaky, though.

Thwere are green 'streaks' quite deliberately running through the face and wraithcannon to imitate the structure and look of bone. I'm actually pleased with the effect myself. The base color was the same as the body and was slowly worked to look like actual bone. I was looking for a rather bleak and dramatic look at once and the glowing green was added as I always felt wraithguard somewhat haunted. I think when all the army is done up to match it will be more striking. 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Zorb on July 14, 2009, 12:37:17 AM
Quote from: Sludge_City on July 13, 2009, 11:02:07 AM
Been working on magnetizing my plastic Wraithlord...

When magnetizing these things, be careful that your magnets have enough friction and strength that they will stay where you want them to.  Mine are just a shade on the weak side - they are strong enough to hold the arms and such on, but "action" poses are often pretty fragile.  Strangely enough, the piece that gives me the most trouble is the head.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: PanzarDragon on July 16, 2009, 06:35:49 PM
Well i just played my First game tonight against an imperial guard player. I wont go to much into details but WOW, i knew the Wraith guard were going to be resistant but to this extent? they waded through everything he could shoot at them and STILL came out of the game nearly intact! Looking forward to more games with theses guys! ill make a small report of it next time perhaps.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 17, 2009, 01:07:56 AM
@ Panzardragon:

Yes, they're very resilient, you just need to be aware of what not to get close or get attacked by. (i.e. TH/SS, PF, Power Weapon or MC) Power Weapons you might survive since most of the time they need 6s to wound.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 17, 2009, 03:47:20 AM
Quote from: PanzarDragon on July 16, 2009, 06:35:49 PM
Well i just played my First game tonight against an imperial guard player. I wont go to much into details but WOW, i knew the Wraith guard were going to be resistant but to this extent? they waded through everything he could shoot at them and STILL came out of the game nearly intact! Looking forward to more games with theses guys! ill make a small report of it next time perhaps.
Oh, they CAN die to shooting, it is just extremely hard to achieve, especially if you complicate the oponent's task by keeping them in 4+ Cover. Be wary though, there's some good AP3 weapons shinny toys in the IG Codex that ignore Cover (Chemical Cannon, Medusa mortar, maybe others) that can RAPE the Wraithguard, these should always be prirority targets if you face them.

Quote from: haunt on July 17, 2009, 01:07:56 AM
@ Panzardragon:

Yes, they're very resilient, you just need to be aware of what not to get close or get attacked by. (i.e. TH/SS, PF, Power Weapon or MC) Power Weapons you might survive since most of the time they need 6s to wound.
And Rending units, or units that have a great many power weapon attacks like Banshees or some SM Veteran squads.

Heh, this evening I watched a SM vs IG game and the IG player had a combined squad of 20 Guardsmen with Powerfist Comissar and 2 Powerfist Sarge in cover sitting on an Objective: They raped a Terminator squad gunning for them in CC - that's seven STR6 powerfist attack/Turn, enough to put the hurt even on Wraithguard, so you need to be wary of even IG if they try some of these combo.

Now imagine a CC geared IG Command Squad: Senior Officer, Comissar, Sarge and Priest, all equiped with Powefists/Eviscerator: 10 Powerfist attacks with re-rolls (priest). Ouch. IG CAN counter hard in CC, just don't let them. ;)

And congrats on the WIN PanzarDragon, nothing better than a nice victory to start an army. I shall be waiting for this batrep. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: PanzarDragon on July 17, 2009, 04:26:44 AM
hehe thanks guys, i am aware that they wont survive certain but when this guy pulled out 105+ guardsmen plus 3 russ' i though they would never survive it but they weathered about 3 turns of solid shooting from everything and only lost 5 so im still impressed, it at least showed me that you cant submerge these guys with low strength fire.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 17, 2009, 03:09:51 PM
I also saw them die horribly when Fortune wouldn't work because of a pesky Psychic Hood or Runes of Warding, so I always make sure that the Farseer can pull it off and always take Runes of Witnessing - I rolled enough 11s and 12s on two dice to learn that LD10 isn't perfect, that's the only way to be (almost) sure. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 17, 2009, 03:15:52 PM
Small update on my Yriel conversion. He's been in my case for the past two weeks, so I figured he could do with some work on him.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2Fth_DSCF2110.jpg&hash=f0ecea5b256eb7994befb2c287b6837dbb5f857b) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/?action=view&current=DSCF2110.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2Fth_DSCF2112.jpg&hash=3c05e84e03d04217a43b6bf7eeccca708fea962d) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/?action=view&current=DSCF2112.jpg) (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2Fth_DSCF2113.jpg&hash=3c62a079ae25295a289ce1543a2f4c23a4d03f83) (http://s597.photobucket.com/albums/tt52/sludge_city/?action=view&current=DSCF2113.jpg)
click images to enlarge

Milliput is very nice to work with for a base for Greenstuff. Much more pliable and smooths off great with a bit of water.

Once the cloak is finished I will be doing a sash and a coat (hopefully) with various ribbons around the place - all with Greenstuff, since it's better for fine detail. I will also make some detail on the cloak with GS.

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on July 18, 2009, 08:31:33 PM
Great work there Sludge_city, he looks great and certainly would pass for yriel.

Especially like the robe section.

Cheers.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 18, 2009, 11:35:47 PM
Thanks, moc! I'm going to try and keep a regular update on this mini - paint and all.

S_C

P.S. >100 posts now ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 19, 2009, 12:05:20 PM
Hey, nicely edited banner Sludge_City, and welcome to your brand new (and well earned) Guardianship, same with Spiritwarroir [all clap-clap], may you both serve Iyanden proudly - Btw, we would be in need of some accurate pilots/gunners for these undermanned Falcons, pray take your pick... ;)

AS for the Autarch, good job there, your in for some good looking Yriel stand in. Keep us updated on the progress, including painting once you're there.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 20, 2009, 09:11:59 PM
Here's one for you all.

Since I saw the UK GT coming up in November, I've been pondering attending.

Do we think a 1500 point Iyanden list would have any chance of standing up to some of the 'power' lists out there (nob bikers/dual lash/etc)?

People tell me "Only seer council of doom can defeat the mighty nobz". Surely this is not true. If we put our heads together a competitive wraith list might fall out of the cogs ;)

1500 points is such a tiny amount for Iyanden, though...eek!

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 20, 2009, 10:17:46 PM
I will try to think of something, I am sure we can manage, if not and uber list, at last something very nasty. Back here tommorrow with a list idea. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Simmoski on July 21, 2009, 01:26:40 AM
Sorry i haven't been as active as i would have liked guys,  been busy planning an interstate move, and work.  Sigh how i hate working but something has to pay for all my shinies.  things are looking up as of this week, I even have an upcoming battle with a few friends. Might try and swing a 2 vs 1 mega game, cause we all know how hard it is to field an effective Small Iyanden army.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 21, 2009, 08:26:22 AM
Quote
I will try to think of something, I am sure we can manage, if not and uber list, at last something very nasty

Excellent. I've been very slowly tweaking my 1500 point list and at this stage it has three more models then my 1250 list. Seriously. Getting a nasty build seems beyond my capabilities if I want to field at least 15 Wraithguard and a WL. Now, my list competes but certain 'power builds' are very tough for me to do anything but play for a draw.

Quote
cause we all know how hard it is to field an effective Small Iyanden army

Actually I like my 1000 point list a lot. An Avatar and two WLs make for a nasty little surprise. It is the 1250-1500 point area that really present Iyanden players with challenging games due to the amount of points your WG and Heavy slots consume.  Below 1000 points i do not even bother fielding an Iyanden force. I just play vanilla Eldar.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Simmoski on July 21, 2009, 08:42:58 AM
Quote
Actually I like my 1000 point list a lot. An Avatar and two WLs make for a nasty little surprise. It is the 1250-1500 point area that really present Iyanden players with challenging games due to the amount odf points your WG nad Heavy slots consume.  Below 1000 points i do not even bother fielding an Iyanden force. I just play vanilla Eldar.

in the 1k list do u field a grp of wg as well?

Also one of te boys at my local GW store challenged me to a 1500 pt game for some time in the future. He is playing a nurgle daemon army.

Last time we met he tore me apart.  1000pt spearhead deepstriking game, and he had choice of sides, and chose the most barren side for me to deploy.  the major thing i can remember is that he had some sort of power weapon negating my saves on my WG, which in the end were a poin sink.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: PanzarDragon on July 21, 2009, 08:49:06 AM
I remember seeing an Iyanden army in the american GT not so long ago (again something that inspired me to play them) and even though he didnt win he still went far enough to get mentoned on the site so not bad, he played wraithguard of course, but only 10, the rest were hard hitting units (wraithlords, harlies and other) i can give an exact list as one wasnt on the site and try as i might i couldnt find it anywhere on the internet.

All this to say that yes i think a tournament army with fluff is possible as long as you keep in mind that your not a cookie cutter like nobz are and that you should count on your skil as a player and offside points such as sportsmanship/army painting/fluff and such to help carry you along.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 21, 2009, 09:01:21 AM
Quote
in the 1k list do u field a grp of wg as well?

Avatar 155

10 Wraithguard, 396
  Spiritseer, Conceal

9 Dire Avengers, 152
Exarch, Dual Avenger SC, Defend

Wraithlord, BL, Wraithsword, 2x flamers 140
Wraithlord, BL, EML, 2x flamers 155

998
Models: 24
KP: 5

Its isn't the toughest list at 1K out there but it does fine. I had to drop all transports to make it work, add defend to my DA and rely on a lot of 'running' towards my objectives but it plays well enough.

Quote
he played wraithguard of course, but only 10, the rest were hard hitting units (wraithlords, harlies and other)

I played a very similar 1500 point list for awhile but now play 15 WG which meant dropping my Harlies/Scorps. No question they play a bit better with a solid counter charging squad but I NEED 15 WG to feel Iyanden enough. I'm waiting to see what Starky comes up with. I just might adopt it as an alternate list!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 21, 2009, 09:15:36 AM
Noy at home and no codex, and frankly, we had a party las evening, but nonetheless...

I shall be blunt: I once ran a two WG unit in a low competition level tourney a couple of time in 4th ed, where CC didn't matter as much and where Galncing Hits could still kill a vehicles - WG were far better at the time...
Anyway, the nastiest I could come of with at the 1500 pts level was aproximately this:

Avatar
Fortune+ Guide Seer
WG on Serpent w Destructor Lock
WG as Troop
Pathfinders X 6
Wraithlord X 2

Now Pathfinders aren't as good a choice today with a faster game, Deepstrike and Outflank, nor are the WG as good at AT. I shall be blunt: I believe that WG on Serpent while a nicely themed unit is obsolete as a competitive unit in 5th ed. In 4th it could Score and do it's job relatively well, not so now.

Thus, you are saying meeting problems to get, let em guess, a CC unit in and possibly a mechanised Troop in.

The only way I saee to make a nasty and competitive wraith list at 1500 pts in 5th ed is something like this:

Avatar
Eldrad

Wraithguard X 10

Wraithlord X 2

Between 965 pts and 1010 pts depnding of the WLs configuration, leaving you with around 500ish pts to play with.

Avengers or Stormies on Serpent are around 275-300 pts
Harlequins or Scorpions run between 185-250 pts.

Anotehr alternative is to have Yriel instead of teh Avatar, but I think you are not sold on this, but it is an alternative if you wish to save pts over Eldrad (basically taking him for the double Fortune) as Yriel can stand with the WG or go with teh Serpent.
Or keep Eldar + Yriel and get the cahnce to Fortune the following Harlies or Scorpions - Scorpions with re-rollable cover saves behind Wraithguard are VERY resilient.

In any case,  I highly suggest at last TWO CC hard point in your force, either a CC character - Yriel or Avatar (and Eldard?) and a CC squad around.
And two shooty WL, unless you want to eschew one of the CC character or squad then one should have a Wraithblade.

That's how I see a competitive Wraith list at 1500 pts, although I admit that Eldrad is somewhat out of place but a 'Count As' model could do it. ;)

Quote from: Simmoski on July 21, 2009, 01:26:40 AM
Sorry i haven't been as active as i would have liked guys,  been busy planning an interstate move, and work.  Sigh how i hate working but something has to pay for all my shinies.  things are looking up as of this week, I even have an upcoming battle with a few friends. Might try and swing a 2 vs 1 mega game, cause we all know how hard it is to field an effective Small Iyanden army.
Hey, glad to see you back Simmoski, thought you had forgotten us, but I tend to agree on a point, bills need to be paid...

Keep us informed over that battle, might try to take pics and write a battle report if you feel like it. :)

   Starky

Edit: TRIPLE ninjaed...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: PanzarDragon on July 21, 2009, 06:47:55 PM
Agreed that you need a good base of CC to really pull your weight in a competition, i am liking the idea of playing avatar+WL's could be a sort of eldar version of nidzilla?

Still, ive only played 1 game so far so all i can do is spectulate and theorise sadly ^^'
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 21, 2009, 06:57:08 PM
Eldarzilla can be a scary sight, usually seen with Fortuned Wraithguard and Avatar + 2 or 3 Wraithlords, the remaining of the force either footslogging or a mechanised wing.

The only thing that is sad is that's a list that usually seriously lack of speed/mobility, especially if you decide to invest in a CC unit on top of it. What bebe is gunning for is a proven, tough list, only the Wraithguard on Serpents are subpar as far as competitiveness goes, but the main problem is mainly because of the low pts level - At 1500 pts it is hard to make an Eldarzilla list is very competitive, especially with Wraithguard as Troops, just. too. many. points.

That being said, this kind of list can perform wonderfully, depends of Mission and opponents though (like most/many lists I guess...).

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: PanzarDragon on July 21, 2009, 07:32:47 PM
Once again it comes down to the balence of fluff and power.

you could take 3 WL and use that to justify your colour scheme but i admit it would feel straneg without WG.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 21, 2009, 11:17:40 PM
Eldar-zilla at 1500??

I have a fun list that is similar to the description.

Eldar-zilla 1500
HQ
Avatar [155]
Eldrad [210]
Troops
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Heavy
Wraithlord [125] Flamer x2, Wraithblade, EML
Wraithlord [110] Flamer x2, Wraithblade, Shuriken Cannon
Wraithlord [110] Flamer x2, Wraithblade, Shuriken Cannon

Total = 1502 (You can drop the Enhance for Destructor if you want points under 1500)

What ya think?  ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 21, 2009, 11:35:27 PM
haunt
I tried out the standard footslogging Iyanden list like yours ( well it was near identical ). This list worked better in 4th edition. In 5th edition with so many armies being highly mobile it loses some of its luster. Curiosly I see you run into the same problem I encounter ... 1502 point lists. For some reason the math on Iyanden lists seem to require a list designed for 1497 or 1502 points when using Eldrad/Avatar combo. I do not like the destructor in walking WG squads. You could use a WL with SL/Wraithsword instead of EML/Wraithsword though. I was never really happy with the EML/Sword combo as I'm running the for at least one ot two turns or I'm being charged and then I'm close enough that the SL becomes a better choice.

Quote
What bebe is gunning for is a proven, tough list, only the Wraithguard on Serpents are sub par as far as competitiveness goes

True to a point. I've developed a list with no easy units to take down. I only use two troop slots at 1500 points one being WG and the other DAVU. With a relatively inexpensive Farseer ( RoW and Fortune) and an Avatar as an HQ, and two WLs, I'm left with three choices ...

1. A nice squad of Harlies with VoT which are relatively tough to deal with and target. This is not bad but that means I'm using only one skimmer in my list which makes it a very juicy albeit tough target. I add two small squads in when my list goes to 1750+

2. A full squad of Scorpians in a Wave Serpent. This is actually a decent choice and provides a nice cc punch. Scorpians are at least a bit tougher then Banshees or Harlies and the Serpent can be fitted out to take down infantry, light vehicles or tanks depending on what your WLs are fitted with. In a competitive environment this is hands down your most effective choice. There are too many reasons to list here why Scorpians are the BEST cc unit in the codex when looking for a balanced competitive list.

3. The fluffiest choice of a squad of WG w/ destructor Seer in a Wave Serpent. Now I chose to use this squad in my list because it is very durable and although it cannot claim objectives it can certainly contest them. I used to use Yriel with them but now take the Seer to keep them fortuned and alive. This might seem counter intuitive as you would also want to use the Seer with the Wraithwall but I find a Wraithwall supported by two WLs and an Avatar can handle itself pretty well without being fortuned every turn as long as I use cover properly.

Now you might think WG in a Serpent too expensive but I rely on my opponent making an error in judgment sooner or later and WG will punish mistakes. We see Scorpians used because frankly they are easier to employ and make back their points more consistently. But an experienced player will make good use of a list with no soft targets at all. Mt list has none. No opponent likes to see an advancing wall. Generally they will take the brunt of my opponents resources, leaving my DAVU Falcon and my WG free to eliminate juicy targets.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 21, 2009, 11:48:36 PM
Quote from: haunt on July 21, 2009, 11:17:40 PM
Eldar-zilla at 1500??

What ya think?  ;D
That it's a mean bastard of a list, although limited in scope to taking on mostly elite and not too mobile armies, where it would perform well enough, and gods it is hard to kill! But it shall struggle against most of the 'powerlists' out there - The usual uber CC units can take out the Avatar (even Fortuned) in a couple of Turns without too much damage, leaving the army with very few things that can hit back, and is somewhat CC weak against Fearless hordes (though it could hold these almost indefinitely, especially Fortuned).

So, a dangerous list to use but one that should perform well enough against regular (read local gaming/low level tourneys) IG, T'au, SM, CSM, Deamon Hunters and Necrons, and possibly some Tyranid builds. I may be wrong but that's the feel I have about it in 5th ed. In 4th ed it would have been much stronger...

@bebe: I see your point there, and you may well have had some good results with Wraithguard in Serpent (I also use them and they aren't bad at all), although I tend to use them with a Fusion Gun/Powersword Autarch or some meaner IC like a PL or Yriel but the 1500 pts sure forbid the use of a PL in there. :D
And although it corssed my mind, I never ran the Farseer with the Serpent squad instead of the footslogging one - Maybe I should use the Avatar more often...

All I can say is: YOU are teh one used to deal with your own particular builds and tactics, so if the Serpentguard do it for you then I say go for it! And besides, that's the only way to see how it works in a (possibly) more competitive envirnment than your usual ganinf group. :)

HOWEVER, you must realise that we DO expect a report of that tournament and how your list performed...

   Starky

Damn! Ninjaed again!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 22, 2009, 11:24:27 AM
Quote
HOWEVER, you must realise that we DO expect a report of that tournament and how your list performed

I already wrote one with mounted WG - I would have thought after reading how badly I present batreps that you would have had your fill. My new list is similar and I think a bit more resiliant. It still has its issues with Nids and Orks though.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 22, 2009, 11:46:23 AM
Quote from: bebe on July 22, 2009, 11:24:27 AM
Quote
HOWEVER, you must realise that we DO expect a report of that tournament and how your list performed

I already wrote one with mounted WG - I would have thought after reading how badly I present batreps that you would have had your fill. My new list is similar and I think a bit more resiliant.
Meeeh nooo. If it is too bad/short for the batrep section just post it in the POC, I am not as picky as that board's modship... ;)

A pic of your assembled force (painted or not) and some of the games themselves are often worth their weight in words if you get the opportunit, then a quick resume of the game is enough.

Just saying.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 22, 2009, 09:12:35 PM
Going to try and test this list tomorrow.

[155] Avatar
[100] Fortuneseer, RoWard
[213] 5 WG, Destructor Lock, Spear
[145] - Serpent, BL, SS
[396] 10 WG, Spiritseer, Conceal
[  60] 5 DA
[180] Falcon, EML, Holo-Field, SS
[110] WL, Sword, SC
[140] WL, Sword, BL

Comes to 1499. I might also try with 10 scorpions (in place of 5 WG) and have EML/BL on the 2nd WL.

Only problem I might have with testing tomorrow is actual models. I have 13 WG without 'slotta' tabs waiting to be pinned to resin bases. Might be able to do it all in one day....boring though :P

Watch this space.

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 22, 2009, 10:13:41 PM
You are building my current list that I outlined earlier S_C. I might as well give you the actual list I'm playing. Yours seems fine.

FortuneSeer, Singing Spear, RoWarding 100
Avatar 155

5 WG, DestructorSeer WB 336
Serpent, TL SC, SC, SS

10 WG, Spiritseer, WB, Conceal 396
5 DAVU, Falcon, BL, SS, Holofield, 250

WL, SL, Sword, 2x Flamers 120
WL, BL, Sword, 2x flamers 140

Comes to 1500, 28 Models and 9 KP

Great minds think alike and all. I will get to pictures and a few Batreps when time permits. I'm going to be too busy to get another game in for awhile. Try it with the WG first. I'm curious how well others do with my list.

I've used mounted WG for awhile. The biggest change I made was dropping characters for an Avatar and standard Seer. I was convinced that a 'counts as' Eldard was not needed. As for Yriel - well the Avatar is just a beast attached to the wall. The other change was suggested numerous times by Starky - get a DestructorSeer for the mounted WG. Not a Warlock, mind but I could use a Lock as my Farseer joins them often enough. I've played two games with the new configuration. I have beaten Tau (barely) and ran over a CSM force.

Iyanden lists at 1500 are incapable of being truly nasty. I just hope for a competitive game out of them. Once we go over 1750+ points we can do some pretty mean lists.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 23, 2009, 01:19:07 AM
I think the best suicide squad I had ever used was against Necron Monoliths, while my opponent has some Warriors in Reserve.

Rammed it with my Wave Serpent, vehicle blew up no one got injured. Shooting phase, shot it with my wraithcannons and destroying it. Of course everything else shot at us.  :D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 23, 2009, 11:40:47 AM
So I was busy pinning my WG to resin bases in prep for tonight's testing...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FDSCF2121.jpg&hash=3e7096cdcebfe5ec060b16997c07814ad5bde91e)

...and I got a bit bored. So I made this...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FDSCF2120.jpg&hash=5d56720481d4c3d5281faa1266c090bfba800fd6)

...Avatar conversion! I thought it kinda fit the 'Egyptian Warrior God' theme quite well. Although I might have to wipe that silly grin off his face :P

In other news, I'm going to try and get a game vs. a 'Nob biker' list tonight...should be "fun"  ;) I will post updates on the results here (later tonight, hopefully).

S_C out.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 23, 2009, 12:20:59 PM
Quote from: Sludge_City on July 23, 2009, 11:40:47 AM
...and I got a bit bored. So I made this...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi597.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt52%2Fsludge_city%2FDSCF2120.jpg&hash=5d56720481d4c3d5281faa1266c090bfba800fd6)
Pretty bases... Being oversized for the WG won't get you in trouble at the Tourney though?

Quote
...Avatar conversion! I thought it kinda fit the 'Egyptian Warrior God' theme quite well. Although I might have to wipe that silly grin off his face :P
Interesting. I do not like the horns and grin though... Could a head swap with a GW avatar do?
And if your Greenstuf skill is on par, maybe make some kind of Rune Armor for the model's chest?

Quote
In other news, I'm going to try and get a game vs. a 'Nob biker' list tonight...should be "fun"  ;) I will post updates on the results here (later tonight, hopefully).
Try to make them assault one of your something else than your Wraithguard and Avatar or Wraithlords though - I suggest giving them the Elite WG, the Serpent or Falcon as fodder (try to not make a multiple assault possible), would make the disembarked Wraithguard with their Destructor handy to take some wounds on the Bikers next Turn.

Some maths, Fortuned Avatar, taking the Assault from 10 Bikers + Warboss, 6 Powerklaws including Warboss, unit WS5 with some nifty wargear/option:
20 A, 10 hits, 8.33 wounds, 2.07 wounds from Powerklaws after Fortuned saves.
+ 5 others Bikers, assuming no special CC weapons (Furious Assault): 15A, 7.5 hits, 0.28 wound after Fortuned saves.
Total, 3.33 wounds on the Avatar on the charge. Avatar is likely to distribute 1.17 wound after ++ saves (T5 - wounds on 3+, no Doom), so 0.22 more wounds for NO Retreat.

I highly suggest that you get to assault, if possible along with the twp SwordLords (6 re-rolled attacks that do Instant Death) and attack the Warboss with a WL to try Instand kill him.
All that after a good Flamers/Destructor volley of possible. Just saying. :)

   Starky

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on July 23, 2009, 03:17:17 PM
Nice El-Decievio... reminds me of my own...


(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi188.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz251%2Fmoc065%2F40%2520K%2FNecron%2520WIPs%2FCtan%2Fth_P1230024.jpg&hash=2b9b35573061b192e6832a4d46d4fc7b3588ab68) (http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z251/moc065/40%20K/Necron%20WIPs/Ctan/P1230024.jpg)

Cheers... oh and the bigger bases are not usually a problem; but you should still ask your opponent.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 28, 2009, 07:44:57 AM

My first squad og WG are done but I screwed up the varnish on my second - it went white - so I'm stripping and redoing them. Next up is finishing off my Wraithlords.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP7270483.jpg&hash=4b5fcbeea4aa503dcc6004664ffae1726e671a87)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP7270482.jpg&hash=e007ee102f0c6aa76122349432718b6ca1c2aecd)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on July 28, 2009, 09:24:16 AM
Wow bebe, that's a real good looking units, I am awfully jealous. :D

What strikes me: The lined paint - it really makes for a bonelike, uneven texture, a bit like something grown.
The Wraithcannons' blackened/warp altered muzzles - Yes sir, warp can alter wraithbone!
The crystal glow effect - thats very good work, and green offer a nice contrast with your colors choice.
The gems are very well made and freehand on the loincloth is good too.

Very good models overall. Can't wait until I see one of those Wraithlords. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on July 28, 2009, 09:29:32 AM
Very nice bebe! I really like the contrast of the orange gems with the blue/grey armor.

Careful, you're giving me motivation to get mine done :P

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 28, 2009, 10:15:14 AM
Thank you. I cannot take the credit though. I did the initial assembly, painted the first coat and did some highlites then sent them to James B. ( a really nice guy ) to help me with the Wraithbone effects, the freehand runes and the bases. The color schemes and the initial work is mine of course but without James they would never have looked this good - his highlighting and effects are truly good. The Exarch is almost done and I've finished all the prelimanary work on the WLs. I'll give them to James to finish off too and then post pics as well.

James is a big fan of Iyanden forces so it wasn't difficult to get his help. He will do commisions if any of you are interested and I'm sending him ten WG that are extra models in appreciation so PM me if you are interested and want his email. 

It's almost sad that I don't attend GTs anymore but I gave up tournaments like that a few years ago. Still it is nice to play on Vet's night and good friends get to take them to GTs if they want.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 28, 2009, 11:53:58 PM
Mmmmm, love Wraithguards...  ;) I have to wait to complete the rest of my set, and I'm slowly painting them. I currently have 23 painted, 7 primed and more in the boxes (40) just waiting for me to get cracking again.

I'll try to get some photos done and post them, so all of you can see them.

----

I have a friend who is willing for me to test a new type of farseer (Boneseer) base cost is same as a farseer +20 pts due to the following add ons:

1 ) Allows the usage of Wraithguards as Troops rather than taking Spiritseer upgrades.
2 ) Allows FNP USR on ALL Wraithconstructs within 12 inches.
3 ) May pick one power from the Warlock list but MUST have 1+ Farseer power.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 29, 2009, 07:01:56 PM
second squad with spiritseer ...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP7280486.jpg&hash=eb54c378e74c778446a17366e4407f183a73ee12)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on July 30, 2009, 09:10:54 AM
More nice wraithguard, and a Spiritseer to ge with them (nice ~ now they are Troops) ..

Thanks for sharing.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 30, 2009, 10:40:53 AM
When all is done I'll have spiritseers for every WG squad. I'm considering using a Bonesinger, giving him 'counts as' Eldrad rules and naming him as Farseer Chaeli, my fluff leader of the force. I just sent off my Wave Serpents, Falcons and  Wraithlords to James as I have done all the prelimanary preparation. Last lot had a few mold lines he needed to remove and that made him sad. I hope he likes this lot better.

My final lot will be finishing off my DA, Harlies and Storm Gaurdians. I'll update as work progresses. I have three 1500 lists I toy with and two 1750 lists I use. This means I need about 2500 points worth of nicely painted minis. Eventually I want to do one six man squad of jetbikes with warlock and an autarch but that can wait.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on August 15, 2009, 11:58:27 PM

Well I just schooled playing my strongest Iyanden list. I was challenged by my friend to bring any Iyanden army and slap on some cheese to test his new Cahos list. i decided to bring this ...

Farseer Chaeli, (Eldrad ‘counts as’) @ 210
w/
10 Wraithguard @ 396 Pts
1 Spiritseer, Witchblade, Conceal
Wraithlord; Flamer (x2); Wraithsword; Bright Lance @ 140

Autarch, Powerweapon, Fusion Gun @ 90
w/
7 Harlequins 218
Kisses (X6), Fusion Pistol (X2)
1 Shadowseer

5 Dire Avengers, 205
Wave Serpent, TL Bright Lances, Shuriken Catapults, Spirit Stones

5 Dire Avengers @ 60
Falcon, EML, Spirit Stones, Holofield @ 180

It is a pretty stripped down list with a strong counter charging squiad of Harlies backing up my wall and Eldrad with two squads of DA scooting around out of reserves and aiming to grab some objectives. Seems like a winner on paper.

His list

HQ: 335
Daemon Prince, MoN, Wings, Warptime 175
Kharn 160

Elites: 310
5 Chosen, Flamers(x2), Meltagun(X2), Rhino 155
5 Chosen, Flamers(x2), Meltagun(X2), Rhino 155

Troops: 634
8 Khorne Berserkers, Champion/Power Fist 208
5 Plague Marines, Meltagun(X2), Rhino 170
7 Plague Marines, Flamer(X2), Champion/Power Fist, Rhino 256

Heavy Support: 220
Land raider:  220

1499

So he brings five tanks and a better cc squad then my Harlies coupled with six flamers, six meltaguns and DP and a Land Raider. I couldn't even say it was that cheesy as he has no Lashes and no Oblits and isn't even infiltrarting his chosen. Right?

Care to guess the outcome? I was near tabled by turn four. It was a complete disaster for the Space Elves. I totally let the side down. I knew when his DP destroyed my Ws coming in from reserves that I was in trouible. He aimed his Chosen and the large squad of PMs directly at my Harlies. It was not even a close contest. Ther rest of his force sans DP went after my Wall with his DP managing to get the WS. He then only had to try and box in my Falcon and get anything close to finish me off.

He did not even make any changes to his list to face me off while I was adding elements hoping to counteract what he brought. Of course I never expected the list I faced. But even so had he brought four Oblits and a Lash Prince would I have done better?

I'm starting to feel that WG lists are at a distinct disadvantage facing 5ed mech when your opponent is a fine general. We need FDs in WSerpents, Seer councils and a few other strong elements to face these lists off. I'm not sure Iyanden can get the job done. Not that I have any intentions of fielding a different force. I'm sticking to my guns but we really need a boost to WG abilities. A 12" radius is not enough. Wave Serpents and Falcons are fine but LRs are just plain scary when filled with Berserkers and Kharn.  Without a few Fire Prisms or an FS squad to take them out I'm at a big disadvantage and I haven't enough points in an Iyanden list to fill all my needs. My wall runs me almost 750 points! Even trimming down to regular Seer would cost well over 600 points.

Well, just thought I give you guys some food for thought. How would you tweak your list to face mech Chaos?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 16, 2009, 01:35:14 AM
Sorry to hear of the defeat, but then we all have our bad games from time to time...

As far as your wraithlists being at disadvantage against mech, well I would rather say that 'footslogger' list have that problem, and except for two overpriced skimmers (with no unit of value, except for Scoring duty), both having limited AT firepower, overpriced Wraithguard (12" range is awful in 5th ed) and overpriced Harlequins (Rending nerf + no more Kill Zones) facing a competitive mech list, well, to have had a chance you'd have had to blow that Raider and at least two of the Rhinos before they reached your line and also killed that DP at range.

As it is, I begin to think that Wraithguard CAN do the job done, but as you said, you really need to have some hard hitting units in transports to take the initiative, like Dragons and Banshees, because facing a Land Raider catapult without a reliable mean to take out the Zerkers' ride (or Termies or whatnot) just = dead Wraithguard.

Wraithguard need to get far cheaper or be given a much better weapon in our next Codex or they will just hit the shelve and take dust, as they did in 3th ed where they were awful bad.
As they are, I have more success with them as CC/Scoring bodyguard for a Farseer and a badass IC like Yriel/PL than an actual shooting unit - Farseer+Yriel+Warlock will kill more AV in CC than any shooting from the Wraithcannons, so more often than not I just end up Running them up the field to get in CC ASAP.

As for if the list would have fared better against Lash and Oblits... well, strangely enough I think that YES - Pts spent in Oblits and Lash Prince would have meant less CC power to overwhelm your wall/Harlies in close range/CC and a single Lash isn't very reliable against RoW.

All in all, at 1500 pts I would stay with two Scoring units and use the pts from the scrapped Avengers to get Dragons instead. Better luck next time bebe. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on August 16, 2009, 07:45:29 AM
I've used the PL/Banshee squad, I've played with Yriel many times and still a nicely designed mech Chaos list or a squad of outflanking Terminators with SS/TH (or and big squad of SS/TH terminators) in a SM list is likely to school us if we invest too many points in a Wall. If I dropped wG as scoring troops and put five in a Serpent and added Prisms instead of  WLs I would stand a chance. I could add Yriel then and say ... see it's an Iyanden list!

Honestly, I did not play at my best - I've managed my force more intelligently in the previous few outings - and I rolled pretty bad at times. But these are lame excuses for a Wraithwall that is simply overcosted and gimps your ability to field a highly competitive list. If they were not so pretty, so much fun at times to play and perfect as a foil for those who haven't evolved into full mech havoc yet, I might indeed have to shelf the boys. As it is i'm still winning more than I'm losung so I will keep them around and have fun.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on August 17, 2009, 10:02:02 AM
Quote
I'm starting to feel that WG lists are at a distinct disadvantage facing 5ed mech when your opponent is a fine general. We need FDs in WSerpents, Seer councils and a few other strong elements to face these lists off. I'm not sure Iyanden can get the job done.

@bebe:  Firstly, I empathize with your loss.  On paper though, things looked rather well balanced.  The Chaos list is particularly well rounded but nothing over the top at 1500; he's making best use of what's available in the codex for a Nurgle/Khorne force.  That said, Iyanden lists could handle the job.  I'll have to say (as you admitted later), there may simply have been some generalship and unit management issues - those mental slip-ups we are all prone to every now and again.  Against a good general that makes the slip-ups even more drastic.

Do I think footslogger armies are at a distinct disadvantage in 5th edition?  Heck no.  Personally I think a mixed force works best, but if you craft the list to take advantage of long-range weapons against his mobility and engage at range, mech lists can find themselves facing a steep uphill battle.  I'm surprised the number of brightlances couldn't snap the LR before it got close enough - that and the DP the two obvious clinch-units of the Chaos list as I see it.  <shrug>  I'm sure in a rematch with different terrain and an offering to the dice gods (Tzeentch perchance?) may show a different result.

Quote
Wraithguard need to get far cheaper or be given a much better weapon in our next Codex or they will just hit the shelve and take dust, as they did in 3th ed where they were awful bad.
As they are, I have more success with them as CC/Scoring bodyguard for a Farseer and a badass IC like Yriel/PL than an actual shooting unit - Farseer+Yriel+Warlock will kill more AV in CC than any shooting from the Wraithcannons, so more often than not I just end up Running them up the field to get in CC ASAP.

@ Starrakatt:  Although I won't argue with cheaper or upgraded WG, I can't agree with them being useless, and certainly not back in 3rd edition.  Your success/failure with WG may be based more on playstyle than the unit, just like my successes with them would be different due to a different playstyle; that said, I can't argue with how you use(d) them, to each their own.  Unfortunately, as with all codices that release shortly after a new edition, we face the upgrades in following codeices that "even the playing field" as players start using new toys and units that counter or compete with our previous superiority.  Nothing new here....

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on August 17, 2009, 10:02:42 AM
Quote
I'm starting to feel that WG lists are at a distinct disadvantage facing 5ed mech when your opponent is a fine general. We need FDs in WSerpents, Seer councils and a few other strong elements to face these lists off. I'm not sure Iyanden can get the job done.

@bebe:  Firstly, I empathize with your loss.  On paper though, things looked rather well balanced.  The Chaos list is particularly well rounded but nothing over the top at 1500; he's making best use of what's available in the codex for a Nurgle/Khorne force.  That said, Iyanden lists could handle the job.  I'll have to say (as you admitted later), there may simply have been some generalship and unit management issues - those mental slip-ups we are all prone to every now and again.  Against a good general that makes the slip-ups even more drastic.

Do I think footslogger armies are at a distinct disadvantage in 5th edition?  Heck no.  Personally I think a mixed force works best, but if you craft the list to take advantage of long-range weapons against his mobility and engage at range, mech lists can find themselves facing a steep uphill battle.  I'm surprised the number of brightlances couldn't snap the LR before it got close enough - that and the DP the two obvious clinch-units of the Chaos list as I see it.  <shrug>  I'm sure in a rematch with different terrain and an offering to the dice gods (Tzeentch perchance?) may show a different result.

Quote
Wraithguard need to get far cheaper or be given a much better weapon in our next Codex or they will just hit the shelve and take dust, as they did in 3th ed where they were awful bad.
As they are, I have more success with them as CC/Scoring bodyguard for a Farseer and a badass IC like Yriel/PL than an actual shooting unit - Farseer+Yriel+Warlock will kill more AV in CC than any shooting from the Wraithcannons, so more often than not I just end up Running them up the field to get in CC ASAP.

@ Starrakatt:  Although I won't argue with cheaper or upgraded WG, I can't agree with them being useless, and certainly not back in 3rd edition.  Your success/failure with WG may be based more on playstyle than the unit, just like my successes with them would be different due to a different playstyle; that said, I can't argue with how you use(d) them, to each their own.  Unfortunately, as with all codices that release shortly after a new edition, we face the upgrades in following codeices that "even the playing field" as players start using new toys and units that counter or compete with our previous superiority.  Nothing new here....

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 17, 2009, 11:15:58 AM
Quote from: f.desrochers on August 17, 2009, 10:02:42 AM
@ Starrakatt:  Although I won't argue with cheaper or upgraded WG, I can't agree with them being useless, and certainly not back in 3rd edition.  Your success/failure with WG may be based more on playstyle than the unit, just like my successes with them would be different due to a different playstyle; that said, I can't argue with how you use(d) them, to each their own.  Unfortunately, as with all codices that release shortly after a new edition, we face the upgrades in following codeices that "even the playing field" as players start using new toys and units that counter or compete with our previous superiority.  Nothing new here....

;francois
Hi françois. Well, maybe not 'FAR' cheaper and definitely NOT useless, but as far as 5th ed goes, firepower units have to be very effective or cheap enough, and 12" range in 5th ed suddenly became much less effective with everything becoming faster (Run or more resilient/cheaper transports), outflank and proliferating of Deep Strike (ex: Drop Pod assault), especially as the game have definitely slanted toward CC, making firepower units less relevant - and Wraithguard are that, a short ranged firepower unit.

Not saying that they can't get the job done... on their terms and I continue to win regularly in casual gaming or even against some tourney builds and usually have not too much problems gainst firepower lists either.
The problem is facing heavily mechanised AND CC focused lists which can't be taken down easily from range due to the very nature of wraith armies, which are characterised by low RoF, relative short range and limited access to well needed supporting units to take out or contain these other 'ard' CC units that can munch Wraithguard at breakfast and ask for more (nothing new for you there I'm sure ;)).

But you are right, the focus of threat in that CSM list were the DP and the Land Raider/Zerkers, which seems to have been the downfall of the WG and WL in the end. As for the LR, with three Brightlances I thonk you need to be lucky to take out a Land Raider before it hit your line, that damned 21" assault range...
One BL (0,75% hit - Glance maths)
-> 12,5% Glance
-> 6,25% (after cover/smoke launchers)
-> 1% : Imobilise
Same BL (0,75% hit - Pen maths)
-> 23% Pen
-> 11,5% (after cover/smoke launchers)
-> 5,75% : Imobilise/Wreck/Explode

With three BL, that about 5% chance of getting an Imobilise result and about 11,5% of getting a Wrecked/Explode result, not great and it is why I agree with bebe that an efficient mean of taking it is needed, i.e Fire Dragons as they are our only reliable AT for high AV.
As for CC, well I recently found out that I fared so much better with Banshees than Harlequins, at least they get a decent save against counter attacks and the only reason I think Harlies are still a valid choice for a counter assault unit is due to the points saved for the Serpent with to the Shadowseer...

All in all, I DO NOT say that wraith armies are useless, it is just that it has begun to be much harder to compete with them against the actual metagame that doesn't favorise such builds, and it is probably going to worse as new Codices get released.
But hey! Who said we need to have it easy? :D

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on August 17, 2009, 07:26:08 PM
Quote
But hey! Who said we need to have it easy?
Hurrah.

Quote
I'm surprised the number of brightlances couldn't snap the LR before it got close enough - that and the DP the two obvious clinch-units of the Chaos list as I see it.

I did try and get his LR which meant his DP was unscathed. And in the end I could not stop the LR anyway. That said the chosen in Rhinos were also very unpleasant. I will get rematch against a revised list that we both worked on ...

Daemon Prince, MoN, Wings, Warptime
Kharn
2x 5 Chosen, Flamers(x2), Meltagun(X2), Rhino
7 Khorne Berserkers, Champion/Power Fist, Rhino/Combi Flamer
2x 5 Plague Marines, Meltagun(X2), Rhino
2x 5 Havocs, Flamers(x2), Meltagun(X2), Rhino

Oh look ... no Land Raider ... just seven rhinos, nine flamers and tweelve meltas with the same cc uber units.

Quote
As for CC, well I recently found out that I fared so much better with Banshees than Harlequins, at least they get a decent save against counter attacks

I have found my Harlies generally superior with my Autarch attached. I like not being shot at at range, i like not having to use a Wave  Serpent and I like how they handle tough MCs etc. They can even take out a tank ... Although the LR got too close before the fusions could be used as the Chosen rhinos were blocking my path. The Chosen were very annoying with the two flamers and meltas. Thus the inclusion of those Havoc squads which perform the same task.

Quote
That said, Iyanden lists could handle the job.  I'll have to say (as you admitted later), there may simply have been some generalship and unit management issues

I'm pretty experienced with my WG. I reviewed all my decisions and certainly I would change a few in retrospect. However, my savvy opponent had the means to counter almost any move I could have made. That is what scares me. I really need FDs. But at 1750 I am already down to one WL so i would have to drop a troop choice to fit them in ( I have used mounted WG in the past for taking down problems as well. With this list I should have let the Harlies take the WS very early on and fusioned that LR with triple guns. The problem there is he would only have disembarked and the Chosen would have flamed and gunned them and then the 'Zerkers would have attacked those Harlies and won. That was my other choice. It would have left my BLs to focus on the DP though. Not a great alternative battle plan.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on August 18, 2009, 09:06:22 AM
Quote
With three BL, that about 5% chance of getting an Imobilise result and about 11,5% of getting a Wrecked/Explode result, not great and it is why I agree with bebe that an efficient mean of taking it is needed, i.e Fire Dragons as they are our only reliable AT for high AV.

A likely and reasonable solution at this point level.... of course what to cut is now the million-dollar question.

Quote
Oh look ... no Land Raider ... just seven rhinos, nine flamers and tweelve meltas with the same cc uber units.

In all honesty, I find these lists harder to deal with than ones with a couple of big-block AV 13-14 tanks.  A friend of mine fields an SoB list with as many rhinos and those damned heavy support choice versions.  Along with a Vulkan drop-list, likely the two lists I have the worst time with.  Honestly, I think I'd rather face that revised Chaos list with my DH than my Iyanden.....

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on August 25, 2009, 10:12:49 PM
Well the rematch is done. I decided to play a very sneeky list that relies on speed and mobility. I played a game of 'hide and seek' and attacked only when I knew the odds favored me. My list ...

Farseer Chaeli, Fortune, Doom, Stones, RoWard, Singing Spear 148
Yriel 155 ( sometimes with WG )
w/
6 Warlocks 353
Destructor (X3), Embolden (X2), Enhance (X1), Singing Spear(x1)
 Wave Serpent
  TL Shuriken Catapult, TL Bright Lances,  Spirit Stone

5 Wraithguard 334
Spiritseer, Conceal     
 Wave Serpent
  TL Shuriken Catapult, TL Shuriken Cannons, Spirit Stones
 
5 Dire Avengers 60
 Falcon 195
   Holo-Field, Spirit Stone, EML, Star Engines

5 Dire Avengers 60
 Falcon 195
   Holo-Field, Spirit Stone, EML, Star Engines

It's still Iyanden. I would have used Fire Dragons over WGs if I really wanted to be uber tough but I have to field some Wraithguard or I don't feel quite right. Okay, i knew it was basically a Rhino Rush army. Keep away from the Rhinos until you can isolate a few and then pop and slaughter. Not a very sophisticated plan but workable.

I was lucky enough to have both initiative and a kill point mission. My DA started in reserve ( I gave them star engines to be sure they would not be caught EVER and could contest or grab an objective last turn).

I made the DPs my primary first target. I needed to be sure I could take them away from their backup so I lured them towards my DA and Seer council. They were well ahead of the main force and he was hoping the Chosen could get into position to help them out. One DP split off to chase a DA Falcon ( exactly as I hoped ) as he used this tactic in the first game. My Falcon easily outran him. This gave me the opportunity to use both my mounted offensive squads to cut down the other DP.

He was taken aback a bit as he hoped the DP would tie the council up for at least a second turn and hop\efully take out the Seer. It never happened as I positioned carefully and lost a single WG. Instead they were able to take on a Chosen squad as they entered and dispatched them pretty quickly. WG and Seer Council tandem proved quite a worthy combo.

My Falcons just kept moving away from anything threatening and with no long range AT to deal with my skimmers. My other two skimmers just kept trying to isolate a Rhino here or there. His DP gave up on the DA and was forced to play backup to his rhino squads or watch them get picked apart.

It was still a close game. I couldn't touch his scoring troops protected by the DP and the few shots i got at the DP with my skimmers did not take him down. So I concentrated on KPs and stealing a few objectives while playing 'catch me if you can'.

So a 'dirty' win for Eldar. It was not even close to a massacre. I did learn a few things though.

1) As good as Eldard might hyave been in the list I did not miss him. My Farseer was a bit overdone as is but  (RoWard was a waste) but I like the spear on him. He is better with the spear then the Warlock.

2) Yriel proved quite versatile. By parking my Serpents togey=ther i was able to send hinm off on his own and then allow him to join up with the WG for more punch.

3) Doomed DPs are doomed.

4) My Falcons' EMLs once more failed to do significant damage. It is a measure of my insanity that I keep expecting different results from the same actions. I hold on to the false premise that one day they will be needed and prove their worth ( in a dozen games it hasn't happened yet). Of course, they are modeled already otherwise i would use the Shuri loadouts and save the points.

5) Assaulting out of Wave Serpents is an art form I seem to get better at the more i play. I had to be careful setting up muy dual serpents and I had to be patient. It is very important to have both a shooty and assault element combining attacks. When I attacked with my council i had to be careful that my Seer was not in base to base with the DP ( if I lost him early the game mechanics would have drastically altered and I think my opponent was hoping to sacrifice his DP to take the Seer out.

6) I'm lucky and my opponent fell asleep. He handled game so well i believe he was a bit cocky and made a few early mistakes that I made him pay for. This is the essence of Eldar lists. We are not a powerhouse. We need to play near flawless games in certain circumstances to pull off a win. In game one I was not focused enough on what my priorities were, Game two, I clearly saw what I needed to do in order to win.

Well enough of that now. I like this list albeit light on troops and top heavy in HQ and Elites. Thankfully there wasn't anyone to judge comp (although min squads of PMs are no better than min squads of DA) and two winged DPs are as bad as a Seer Council, no?

Until my next report ...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 26, 2009, 08:58:00 AM
Quote from: bebe on August 25, 2009, 10:12:49 PM
Well enough of that now. I like this list albeit light on troops and top heavy in HQ and Elites. Thankfully there wasn't anyone to judge comp (although min squads of PMs are no better than min squads of DA) and two winged DPs are as bad as a Seer Council, no?
There is that, there is that. :D

Congrats on the Win bebe, seems that you played your list up to it's strengths while minimizing the weaknesses, kudos for that. Also, does that mean you are in for for a third match to determine who's the most badass general/lucky git between the both of you?

Last point: I hate your list - Meaning that it is so out of my style that I'd wonder how to run it. However, I can't disregard the advantages of a mech force, I made significative changes over my usual army and added a third skimmer in my last game... I was astonished how well the list performed over my usual double skimmer team, I'll surely continue exploring that way in the future.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on August 26, 2009, 10:03:29 AM
Quote
Also, does that mean you are in for for a third match to determine who's the most badass general/lucky git between the both of you?

Unlikely. He wanted to know what weaknesses a Rhino rush Chaos list has. He knows now. There just is not enough long range AT to win at the top levels. Also as sad as it is, Oblits rule the heavy slots.

Quote
I hate your list - Meaning that it is so out of my style that I'd wonder how to run it.

Exactly how I felt putting this list together. No WLs or walking WG and I'm die hard Iyanden. I felt a bit cheesy using a Seer Council and two squads of DAVU. However, welcome to 5ed.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 26, 2009, 10:16:45 AM
Quote from: bebe on August 26, 2009, 10:03:29 AM
However, welcome to 5ed.
Thank you. :D

This is a list I strapped together a while ago - Mech Iyanden at your service, but never actually played it, I should try it someday...
Quote from: Starrakatt on December 31, 2008, 01:42:54 PM
LIST 2 (Orange List) - From Starrakatt

HQ: 300 Pts
- Yriel - 155 pts
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Fortune, Doom - 145 pts

ELITE: 670 Pts
- Wraithguard, Warlock W/ Destructor - 210 pts
 + Wave Serpent W/ Twin-Shuricans, Spirit Stone, Star Engines - 125 pts
- Wraithguard, Warlock W/ Destructor - 210 pts
 + Wave Serpent W/ Twin-Shuricans, Spirit Stone, Star Engines - 125 pts

TROOP: 460 Pts
- Dire Avengers, Exarch W/ Dual Catapult, Bladestorm - 152 pts
 +Wave Serpent W/Twin EML, Shurican upgrade, Spirit Stone - 140 pts
- Pathfinders X 7 - 168 pts

HEAVY: 320 Pts
- Fire Prism W/ Holofield & Spirit Stone - 160 pts
- Fire Prism W/ Holofield & Spirit Stone - 160 pts

FAST: 0 Pts
- NONE

TOTAL: 1 750 Pts

31 Models, 5 Vehicles / 11 KP / 2 Scoring Units

Tactics: Keep the enemy at arms length, use the Pathfinder as a bait to attract enemy units and blast these to smitheren when they get near using the Wraithguard, Yriel, Avengers and whatnot, using the tanks to channel charging lanes and protect the bait (Pathfinders) and Avengers.

Alternatively, the Patfinders can be kept in Reserves and/or Outflank to keep clear if the a table deployment isn't the best of options, or even actually keep their heads down and try to kill something! [gasp]

   Starky

P.S. Earlier 'hate' comment was partly sarcasm, I should have added a smiley... Plz don't hate me.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on August 26, 2009, 01:43:20 PM
Quote
P.S. Earlier 'hate' comment was partly sarcasm, I should have added a smiley... Plz don't hate me.

I can't hate you. i was born in Montreal.

So your list looks good although I would run jetbikes over Pathfinders but I HATE Pathfinders  :)

Like every other Eldar list we have to adopt top 5ed. As dearly as I would love to field my walking WG it makes less and less sense once we reach 1500+. There is too much mech and way too many templates out there for them to be effective.

So I'll play my footsloggers in all my casual games but if I'm gearing up I have to go mech. I'm just not competitive otherwise. I have a great 1500 point list with Harlies ( see the first game ) but it just doesn't work well against any vehicle heavy list. GW needs to give us more range on our Wraithcannons. An extra six inches and they become playable again.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 26, 2009, 05:30:18 PM
Quote from: bebe on August 26, 2009, 01:43:20 PM
I can't hate you. i was born in Montreal.
Aaaah, civilisation...

Quote
GW needs to give us more range on our Wraithcannons. An extra six inches and they become playable again.
I tend to agree with you, although I didn't play much against full mech yet, many vehicles DO annoy me.

As for the Wraithguard, that's what we gave them in the Code Redux we're working on in the Eldar Project board - You may want to take a look if you have the time (That's bottom of the main page). Oilishing on Wraithlord goodness just now.;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on August 30, 2009, 01:41:22 PM
Ive put up some old banshees of mine painted in the traditional Valar Iyanden colour scheme up for sale in the trading forum.  I thought you guys would be the most interested out of everyone else on this site so i'l put i link to the sale for you here (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=188953.0)

Pm me if you're interested :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on September 7, 2009, 10:33:16 AM
Going to a five games Tournament this weekend, RT level. Unless I change my mind until Friday, that's the list I'll be using:

HQ: 310 PTS
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Runes of Witnessing, Fortune & Doom - 155 pts
- Yriel - x pts

ELITE: 335 PTS
- Fire Dragons X 6 w/ Exarch, Dragon Breath flamer and Crack Shot - 113 pts
- Harliequins X 8 w/ Shadowseer, Troupe Master (powersword), 7 Kisses - 212 pts

TROOP: 783 PTS
- Wraithguard X 10 w/ Spiritseer, Conceal - 396 pts
- Dire Avengers X 10 w/ Exarch, Powersword/Pistol & Bladestorm - 157 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin Shurican, S.Stone - 110 pts
- Pathfinders X 5 - 120 pts

HEAVY: 330 PTS
- Wraithlord: Brightlance/EML and twin Flamers - 155 pts
- Falcon w/ Shurican, Shurican upgrade, Spirit Stone & Holofield - 175 pts

TOTAL: 1 758 PTS

I know, weird format, don't ask. :D

I know I'm short in ranged AT and that Pathfinders aren't great, but depending on opponent they can have their use (Scoring on Home Objective, Outflanking, KP denial or taking a ride in the Falcon once the Dragons got their job done, or even trying to kill something... Whatever fits) and depending on opponent (hybrid/mechanised), I intend to weather shooting until I get in assault and kill AV in CC with Witchblades, usually easier than with shooting.

Anyway, I'm goin there to test the waters, so to speak... What do you think?

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on September 7, 2009, 11:42:23 AM

I would drop the bladestorm and exarch on the DA and use the points  elsewhere. Sounds a bit heretical, eh. I have stopped using DA Exarchs entirely. I use eight DAs in a serpent for backup dakka ( disembark only when safe ) or DAVU.

Do you really need RoWit on the Seer as well?   

I also question the need of an FD Exarch. Seven Dragons will take down anything and if played with caution need not be killed. How would i change the list?

I would drop the Harlies much as I like them. I would use Banshees in a serpent instead, Five DA in the Falcon or eight in a serpent , seven FD in a serpent or six in a falcon, and my Pathfinders. I would drop RoWit on the Seer. Any extra points can be spent beefing up the weapons on the serpents.

Now, take it all with a grain of salt Starky. you have tons of experience and maybe could use your list better than me. I never go out at that point level without at least three Skimmers and usually four ( unless I'm adding bikes ). 

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on September 7, 2009, 01:08:36 PM
Oi, keep in mind that for the sake of Soft Scores requirement, I need to:
- Have at least 40% in TROOP.
- No more pts spent in a single FOC slot than I spend on Troops.
- No more slots used in each HQ, Elite, Heavy and Fast that I spend on Troops.
- No more than 2 slots used in each FOC.
- Given that I play Eldar, I must assume I'll get docked in soft scores by other players, so the above parameters must be met. ;)

Here are my available painted units, which can be considered as options (assume Exarchs with all options):
- 2 Wave Serpents (friggin' glued turrets - Shuricans - yeah, I know... :-[)

HQ:
- Eldrad (won't take him, will build a 'count as' model in the future...)
- Yriel
- Jain Zar, Maugan Ra, Asurmen, Fuegan
- Avatar
- Autarch (Fusion Gun/Powersword)
- Autarch (Fusion/Powersword/Wings/Banshee Mask)
- 1 Farseer
- 3 Warlocks/Spiritseers

Elite:
- 12 Banshees
- 12 Dragons
- 10 Harlequins (DJ/Shadowseer,Troupe Master, 2 Fusion Pistols)
- (Wraithguard)

Troop:
- 20 Avengers
- 20 Wraithguard
- 12 Guardians w/ weapon platform
- 12 Rangers/Pathfinders

Heavy:
- 1 Falcon/Prism (turret swap)
- 2 Wraithlords
- 3 Shadow Weaver artillery battery
- 10 Dark Reapers

Fast:
- 9 Warp Spiders
- 1 Vyper

Quote from: bebe on September  7, 2009, 11:42:23 AM
I would drop the bladestorm and exarch on the DA and use the points  elsewhere. Sounds a bit heretical, eh. I have stopped using DA Exarchs entirely. I use eight DAs in a serpent for backup dakka ( disembark only when safe ) or DAVU.
I'll look into this, but my dakka is quite limited, so anti horde needs to be afressed.

Quote
Do you really need RoWit on the Seer as well?   

I also question the need of an FD Exarch. Seven Dragons will take down anything and if played with caution need not be killed. How would i change the list?
RoWit are there to stay, I have an uncanny ability to FAIL LD tests... :D

Fire Dragon Exarch w/Flamer is for crowd control/versatility - In my experience, verstility is WIN in a take all comers list. However, you do emit reasonable arguments.

Quote
I would drop the Harlies much as I like them. I would use Banshees in a serpent instead, Five DA in the Falcon or eight in a serpent , seven FD in a serpent or six in a falcon, and my Pathfinders. I would drop RoWit on the Seer. Any extra points can be spent beefing up the weapons on the serpents.
I will also look into this, will come up with an alternative list later.

Points may be an issue, especially for transport, the very reason I prefer Harlies in my point heavy wraith lists. Admitedly, I rarely use Dragons and Falcon at all, so pts could be found if I dropped the Falcon/Dragons combo. However, they are our only reliable mean to take down AV14, for you know quite well how Eldar long range AT sucks...

Quote
Now, take it all with a grain of salt Starky. You have tons of experience and maybe could use your list better than me. I never go out at that point level without at least three Skimmers and usually four ( unless I'm adding bikes ).
Not THAT experimented (played only 1 game all Summer), just spread out over 13 years of playing, and I read mucho tacticas...

Thanks for the advices, I'll take a look and come up with an alternative list or two soon.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on September 8, 2009, 10:20:36 PM

Starting to get my Wraithlords detailed ...

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP9020362.jpg&hash=af140f7f69197a9c8647eb6e0415f057c7450015)

More pics here ...

http://s19.photobucket.com/albums/b162/pheelixkat/eldar/ (http://s19.photobucket.com/albums/b162/pheelixkat/eldar/)

James is doing a nice job on my finished models. It is a good partnershiop. I do the first few coats and assembly, he tears them apart a bit and does the details.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on September 9, 2009, 08:41:38 AM
Wow, that's really good stuff you've got there bebe. I would surmise that this one Wraithlord is only the first of a pair? :)

Oh, and there is a variant list I came up with tonight:

HQ: 310 PTS
- Farseer w/ Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Runes of Witnessing, Fortune & Doom - 155 pts
- Yriel - x pts

ELITE: 405 pts
- Howling Banshees X 10, Exarch w/ Executioner - 182 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Shurican, Shurican upgrade & Spirit Stone - 110 pts
- Fire Dragons X 6, Exarch w/ Dragon Breath flamer and Crack Shot - 113 pts

TROOP: 722 pts
- Wraithguard X 10, Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396 pts
- Pathfinders X 5 - 120 pts
- Dire Avengers X 8 - 96 pts
 + Wave Serpent w/ Twin-Shurican & Spirit Stone - 110 pts

HEAVY: 320 pts
- Wraithlord w/ EML/Brightlance - 155 pts
- Falcon w/ Shurican, Spirit Stone & Holofield - 165 pts

TOTAL: 1 757 pts

Again, I could swap some units around. The advantage of that list over the other is added mobility and better CC unit + delivery, but I lose some dakka, which can become problematic if I face hordes...

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on September 9, 2009, 09:18:10 AM
Eight DA are 96 points. Although your total is correct. I like the list. Yriel will help with hordes, just do not let your wall get tarpited. I would still drop the FD exarch and pout them in a serpent and with the saved points get another WL in there.   
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on September 9, 2009, 09:25:59 AM
I would if I could. As it is, I own only two painted Serpents (third is in construction)... :D

I will have to rely on the's capacity to survice ranged shooting, and hopefully get some side armor shots with it. Besides, in some situations he can taxi the Pathfinders around for Objective grabbing, I think it's tough enough to do that.

Of course, I could completely drop teh Avengers and give the Serpent to teh Dragons, then get more Pathfinders or footslogging Guardians to fill in the third Troop slot, then I'd get the pts to have that second Wraithlord.... :-\

   Starky

P.S. Fixed the 96 pts typo, thanks.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on September 9, 2009, 05:11:42 PM
Quote from: Starrakatt on September  9, 2009, 09:25:59 AM
I would if I could. As it is, I own only two painted Serpents (third is in construction)... :D
Starky
P.S. Fixed the 96 pts typo, thanks.

Ah I know the feeling Starky.... I only have 2 painted serpents aswell and the amount of times i pine for a third its not funny :(

I ran a very effective list today and won two games with it today.  one against chaos the other against guard.  It wasnt very  Iyanden-y if thats a word but it still had elements of it...cant afford 10 wraithguard as troops in a 1000pt game.  Here is the list.

Farseer with doom

6 Howling Banshees - Waveserpent, missile launcher, shuri cannon, spirit stones

5 Fire Dragons and 1 Exarch - Fire Pike, crack shot - Waveserpent, missile launcher, shuri cannon, spirit stones

10 Dire Avnegers Inc Exarch. Bladestorm

9 Dire Avengers inc Exarch Bladestorm

Wraithlord Missile Launcher and Shuri cannon and Flamers.

Total 1001 points.

What I found from this army is that against a tank heavy guard army it can struggle, but then I do not have any more anti tank units in larger points levels so I always struggle with this aspect no matter.  The foot slogging Dire Avengers were very effective, mowing down MEQ and IG sqauds alike and because my opponents knew all to well about blade storm they were a nice distraction allowing my other units to survive. 

At this points level there really is no counter unit to a unit of Howling Banshees in a serpent, and they really shone against units that niether have the fire power or combat prowess to resist them at 1000points I strongly recommend them at this points level. I kept forgetting to Doom their target unit so these would only be more effective in the future.

The wraithlord was a flop only destroying a chimera over the 2 games but that was because of dice rolls nothing else.

The Fire Dragons were also amazing, facing a 1000pt IG army with 3 leman russes and a 1000point chaos army with 3 oblits... they managed to insat-kill all 3 oblits and destroy 2 russes.  Again they seem to be a unit where there is no counter unit to in a 1000point game.

Not much of an analytical report im afraid more of an anacdotal one but still opponent resigning in turn 4 and a 5-0 victory over guard after turn 5 speaks for its self.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on September 14, 2009, 10:34:10 PM
Quote
Oi, keep in mind that for the sake of Soft Scores requirement, I need to:
- Have at least 40% in TROOP.
- No more pts spent in a single FOC slot than I spend on Troops.
- No more slots used in each HQ, Elite, Heavy and Fast that I spend on Troops.
- No more than 2 slots used in each FOC.
- Given that I play Eldar, I must assume I'll get docked in soft scores by other players, so the above parameters must be met.

That is not a bad way to go about it Starky... and Its pretty well what I use unless I am going pure Themed army where I also incorperate the old 3rd Ed FOC as well (even more stringent).

Anyway, Valar has a Titan Head to get painting and showing off to us... so get that list up and ready and PM me... I want to go head vs head once again.. and you can pick your opponent... Tau, Ork, CSM, SM's, Eldar, or Necron....

To get down to 1700pts, I would drop .. Doom, Stones and 1 DA... 57 pts...  as this is the local standard gaming size for me... Nice list overall; but playstyle will be more important than the components, as it does have its week links.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on September 14, 2009, 11:24:09 PM
Quote
I ran a very effective list today and won two games with it today.  one against chaos the other against guard.  It wasnt very  Iyanden-y if thats a word but it still had elements of it...cant afford 10 wraithguard as troops in a 1000pt game.  Here is the list.

You can run WG in a 1000 point list. I do it all the time ...
                                                             
Avatar 155

10 Wraithguard, 396
  Spiritseer, Conceal

9 Dire Avengers, 152
Exarch, Dual Avenger SC, Defend

Wraithlord, BL, Wraithsword, 2x flamers 140
Wraithlord, BL, EML, 2x flamers 155

I just ram my wall up my opponent's arse ... works rather well as it is hard to take down two Wl and an Avatar and a full squad of WG. I often leavbe my DA on an objective with one WL depending on my opponent.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on September 15, 2009, 07:12:14 AM
Quote from: moc065 on September 14, 2009, 10:34:10 PM
That is not a bad way to go about it Starky... and Its pretty well what I use unless I am going pure Themed army where I also incorperate the old 3rd Ed FOC as well (even more stringent).
Yeah, I decided to forego background comp a bit an try to better AT, and yes the list has its shortcomings, but I said to myself: Hey! We shall see...

Thus: There was only 16 players, I talked with the organisers and making a two days tourney is what made it such a low attendance, they won't do it anymore as they usually get easily over 30 subscriptions...

Anyway, I fought a IG reserve/Outflank/Deepstrike w/ 3 Vendetta list and got trashed, I only had three Turn of actual gaming as he made go First, and managed to kill my AT on arrival, so I couldn't kill these pesky skimmers killing me at 48". He got the better part of teh dice gods attention, but had I played well (i.e without mistake) I could have had a Draw, instead I got Massacred. Meh.

Second, I fought hybrid IG (no skimmers/old school). Lets say that the dice favored me this time and I score a relatively easy Massacre.

Third: UltraSMurfs (Redeemer, 2 Vindie, Landspeeder, 3 Rhino/4 Tactical/powerfists/Meltas/Flamers), with old man Calgar himself - I Massacred him, the guy got my 'Best Player to play against' Award.

Fourth game: Necrons (Mono, 2 X 3 Heavy Destroyers, 3 X 10 Warriors, Destroyer Lord/Warscythe/Orb/4++), 6 Wraith and 8 Scarab swarms), I Phased him out in 5th Turn - Massacre.

Fifth (last) game: Fluffy Emperor's Children (2 lash DP, 1 Rhino, 4 X 6 strong tooled up Noise Marines, 2 X 6 lesser deamons, 3 Oblits, Vindie, 3 Termies) - Minor Victory.

Netting me 4th Overall (Lots very good painted armies) and Best General (Hurray!). Report will follow this week in the apropriate board and some pics. :)

@bebe: Yes, I fought some games at 1K with Troop Wraithguard and usually won my games, no losses, a couple of Draws, so it defenitely can be done, opponent rarely having what it takes to kill such a tough unit.
At this level, Wraithguard are a make or break army, very annoying to face when playing KP.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on September 15, 2009, 07:46:41 AM

Congratualtions. IG is not easy to beat. And two massacres. I'm impressed. The Emp Chldren's army somewhat like my old one. Those NMs - were they tooled out with SBs and one Blaster?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on September 15, 2009, 07:52:26 AM
Nay: First IG Massacred ME. I Massacred the second.

Three squads of 6 had a Blastmaster and Sonic Blasters, the fourth was mounted in a Rhino and Powerfist and some kind of ap3 flamer template power. I learned the power of the Blastmaster combined with Lash this game, it wasn't pretty for my Wraithguard... :-\
You have no idea how glad I was to have brought three skimmers to hunt and shut down his Princes/firepower. :D

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on September 16, 2009, 12:51:23 PM
Hey guys, just thought id take the opportunity to show you guys what I've been doing over at the painteddragon... its a 1500 point force for the challenge gareth painting series which takes my army to about 3000points in total.  Would love to know what you guys think :)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot1.jpg&hash=ee2caecc6f94db0d93501e952e2fea90ed15f145)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot.jpg&hash=bf5f852363644c3217f0280642fa8cb288c59bd0)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot11.jpg&hash=e39793cb123f593027264ed9604d12cf8745b2f1)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot10.jpg&hash=8e67cca77221664f01939d4c723fd1ca711f93f9)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot3.jpg&hash=26f4ab2756b6910b8a5450e296ee16136d19b639)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot4.jpg&hash=ea32bcfc90cdc346d6cbf01685c87fc10d6fe8a8)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot5.jpg&hash=9c71f3b977532354aaa08f535ca6438fdc20589d)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot6.jpg&hash=0698c7ab1438a2a9f6b6b5a4be8874a22943d766)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot7.jpg&hash=90f4716c8d04dc7c608b16777f9dadeb61471ebe)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot8.jpg&hash=16e03890832af6a33f96bbbb6f2f25ad3a76ca2e)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot9.jpg&hash=665c8f3071e2c8d3edf462c4e9c6bf8d3e2ff3fa)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FEldarChallengegroupshot12.jpg&hash=17abfc72f297979e7ef2d48faffe15831c97b7d9)

Whaddya think guys?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on September 16, 2009, 01:07:43 PM

I think that is seriously nice, Valar. What did you use for parts for the seer ?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on September 16, 2009, 05:15:50 PM
Wicked looking army... Jaw hits floor, and bounces.

Questions ?
~~You had a spare Falcon to ruin, just for a terrain feature... must be nice.

~~Two bases with nothing on them... WW's I presume.

~~Where is the Titan.

Cheers and thanks for sharing those (can I use the pics within the Guide).
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 16, 2009, 08:42:33 PM
Heya gang,

Having had no time to either post or play a game, I finally got a chance to have a stress relief and grabbing a fluffy army that will play against NEW IG.

This is the list I am bringing:

HQ
Eldrad [***]
Yriel [***]

TROOPS
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance

ELITE
Howling Banshee x10 [192] Exarch, Executioner, Acrobatics, War Shout

HEAVY
Wraithlord [120] Flamer x2, W-Blade, ScatLas
Wraithlord [120] Flamer x2, W-Blade, ScatLas

Total = 2381 (Spare points maybe to exchange certain weapons of the lord for something, or even give a serpent to the girls.)

The idea is to keep Yriel and Eldrad close to each other. Concealed W-guards covers the Enhanced W-guards.

W-lords are to keep everything at bay also as a threat for incoming units.

Banshees, well am having thoughts of replacing them w/ Harlies for better cover of the W-guards.

Any comments or suggestions?? 

Too cheezy or too fluffy??
------
HQ
Eldrad (Its an ancient farseer equal to the name) [***]
Yriel [***]
Warlock Retinue x3 on Jetbike [160] Destructor x2, Embolden

TROOPS
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguards x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance

ELITE
Harlequins x10 [192] Master, Seer, Kiss x9, PW x1

HEAVY
Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
War Walker x3 [210] EML x6

Total = 2499

How is this second list?

Using Harlies + Concealed guards to block TLOS for covers, while having a longer punch w/ AT and mobile template platforms.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on September 16, 2009, 09:12:52 PM

It is definitely not cheesy. It is pretty gutsy taking that against guard. At that point level I would expect to see a lot of cover denying templates heading your way, lots of low AP weaponry and probably a few tricks too. You have zero long range AT. It is fluffy though. I'm curious to see the batrep and the IG list.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on September 18, 2009, 10:53:23 PM
can you stick those warlocks on jetbikes when they are with eldrad?  is it one of those deals where they loose the movement benefits of the bikes?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on September 19, 2009, 09:40:11 AM
Quote from: moc065 on September 16, 2009, 05:15:50 PM
Wicked looking army... Jaw hits floor, and bounces.

Quote
Questions ?
~~You had a spare Falcon to ruin, just for a terrain feature... must be nice.

I did indeed and turning it into terrain means it gets used more than it would have done otherwise

Quote
~~Two bases with nothing on them... WW's I presume.

Indeed, those are the last two Warwalkers I have to do to complete the 1500point challenge.

Quote
~~Where is the Titan.

 ;D The Titan is on my work desk and is still WIP will get working on it soon after the wws, and last 3 wraithguard. Cant wait to get going on it

Quote
Cheers and thanks for sharing those (can I use the pics within the Guide).


Certainly mate, id be flattered... use away :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on September 20, 2009, 09:20:48 AM
Wow Valar, nice to see your (mostly) painted army all in one place. Keep up the good work.
Oh, I'll look at your 1K list/pics and PM you soon with comments. ;)

@haunt: I prefer the second list, it is much more versatile, although I am doubtful of the utility of any footslogger CC unit against IG... But if you go on foot then Harlequins it is for sure.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on September 22, 2009, 08:23:15 AM
One of three wave serpents finally finished

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP9210398.jpg&hash=efe243d9ceef03e417bc9b21f7c879a694bc94dd)

Next up more
Serpents, a Falcon and some exarchs and seers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Seer13 on September 22, 2009, 02:11:05 PM
bebe - can You tell me how you get this blue becouse I need find paint sheme for my Sowers of Tears (but I need newbie friendly color )

I love this serpent great work.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on September 22, 2009, 03:10:17 PM
Quote from: bebe on September 22, 2009, 08:23:15 AM
One of three wave serpents finally finished

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FP9210398.jpg&hash=efe243d9ceef03e417bc9b21f7c879a694bc94dd)

Next up more
Serpents, a Falcon and some exarchs and seers

Sweet.

Nicely done Bebe, now get the other ones done as well, and with that comment I will also send myself to the basement to Paint.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on October 2, 2009, 10:38:05 AM
Fruit salad and overview of my WSerpents and Wraithlords ....

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPA010409.jpg&hash=5b922a22a0b62dc6f7bdc142561c699fd19fa2f4)

Now I need to finish off a Seer and some WG and a Falcon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on October 2, 2009, 05:18:31 PM
Excellent stuff bebe, thank you for showing off sharing with us, its a pleasure for the eyes. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on October 7, 2009, 09:21:22 AM
I finaly got to face some Space Wolves. I pretty much thought that I could play them as I play standard marines but I decided I would go cheesy and just use five Wraithguard and call myswelf iyanden anyway ... okay, so give me a bit of a break. I knew my opponent was out for blood.


Farseer Chaeli, (Eldrad ‘counts as’) 210
Yriel 155
w/
7 Warlocks 361
Embolden (X2), Enhance (X1), Singing Spear(x1), Destructor(X1)
Wave Serpent
TL Shuriken Catapult, TL Bright Lances, Spirit Stone

5 Wraithguard 329
Spiritseer, Singing Spear, Destructor     
Wave Serpent
TL Shuriken Catapult, TL Shuriken Cannons, Spirit Stones, Star Engines
 
6 GJB, 2 Shuricannon 205
Warlock, Singing Spear, Embolden

5 Dire Avengers 60
Falcon 180
   Holo-Field, Spirit Stone, EML

First off, playing at 1500 popints does not favour any Iyanden list. Eldar get better at higher point levels. That said, I never play without my WG so I had my obligatory squad included.

His list

HQ: 245
Njal Stormcaller – 245

ELITE: 255
Lone Wolf, Terminator Armour, Storm Shield, Chainfist - 85
Lone Wolf, Terminator Armour, Storm Shield, Chainfist - 85
Lone Wolf, Terminator Armour, Storm Shield, Chainfist - 85

TROOPS: 495
5 Grey Hunters, Melta, Power Fist, Mark of the Wulfen, Razorback - 160
5 Grey Hunters, Melta, Power Fist, Mark of the Wulfen, Rhino - 155
9 Grey Hunters, Melta, Rhino– 180 ( Njal here)

Fast 210
3 Thunderwolves, Frostblade, Stormshield, Meltabomb - 210   

HEAVY: 295
6 Long Fangs, 3 Heavy Bolters, 2 Lascannons - 155
6 Long Fangs, 5 Missile Launchers - 140


Okay. We play competitive in our group and this guy ( Josh ) wanted to test out some of the new toys available to Wolves. Do you know how tough Lone Wolves are?

Re-rolls to hit with 3 attacks, Eternal Warrior, FNP, 2 Wounds, Storm Shields ... wtf. Three of these guys means that you simply have to avoid them all game and then try and tank shock 'em off objectives late game if you can. They take a lot of dakka to put down and that means you are leaving the rest of the list untouched.

Thunderwolf Cavalry - Thank goodness he fielded only one small squad. Rending and mounts? And a Frostblade/Stormshield and meltabombs? Can that be fair? Its Nob Wolves for the win. Thank goodness he did not have two squiads of these. At 1750 he does and he has a few more GH. I will wait for that match up. At 1750 I can add some Banshees in a serpent to even things up. 

Njal - If you don't get to him quick and if he does not blow up from Runes - well he is trouble for an Eldar list. As you probably guessed he hung around all game. Don't get me started on his late game powers!

I had no options here. My only resort was to play for a draw or a sneeky late win and keep away and never dismount unless I knew I was going to win the assault. I wanted to take out his troops quickly. I wanted to go after some of his squads with my Seer council but had to be sure that the LWs and TWs were not going to be close enough to hurt me ( fortune was negated often and painfully). Everything was difficult terrain,  psychic powers were a gamble and he knew to keep units close by to protect his fragile troops. I did manage to destroy his LF squads eventually - his lascannons could not be left unhindered - but overall I was forced to play a very conservative game.

Result - a narrow loss - he managed to hold one objective and I was unable to contest it. It was a very frustrating game.

Conclusions - If I had gone with my standard footslogging WG and WLs I think I would have been destoyed. Those LWs would eat my WLs for a snack - WS5 plus beastslayer, plus chainfist and Stormshield, plus Eternal Warrior - well you get the idea.

My opponent is a good guy. I now have two lists that I have real problems with - the other being an IG list. I thought Vulcan list were mean and they are but SW has some new tricks that are nasty.


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on October 8, 2009, 09:49:35 AM
Wow, I can't wait to take a good trashing from a SW player, I WANT a reason to complain. I mean, I just... Feel Like It. FLI USR as opposed to FNP.

These Lone Woofies are equivalent to 4 Terminators each as far as killing them goes, 2 if you hit them with Instant Death or Power Weapons. For the cost of 2. And they are much better. Wow, now I almost want to play SW.

Thanks for sharing your demise bebe, it changes from glorious wins and such. Feel free to add more. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on October 8, 2009, 03:07:54 PM

I could share my loss against IG but I won't go into that. Suffice tosay I played a list that had two Deathstrikes and a Manticore and he got them all off.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on October 21, 2009, 07:44:47 PM

Farseer Chaeli done with appropriate wraithbone touches.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPA200422.jpg&hash=919c35738b117b094e56d65d5767c63b6ddf0312)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPA200423.jpg&hash=efe97417583545f7794f740d57bc6c87df614e1e)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPA200424.jpg&hash=8fab1f25b1b6a3361bf896dab944fd919bd5a703)

and  a Warlock 

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPA210426.jpg&hash=c5a9c647787ed7bd7f970c97789cf1adaa757143)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPA210428.jpg&hash=e83fa386d98237b1c1191fc25226b9dde238336a)

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on October 21, 2009, 07:56:52 PM
That is a weird but interesting looking head on that figure... the paint is wickedly well done, (NMM Gold is always a be-atch), and for some odd reason I think the head actually suits the figure.. Well Done.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on October 25, 2009, 09:24:24 AM
Interesting model to say the least and paint is very good as usual. Beaatiful models both. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on October 25, 2009, 10:05:03 AM
Quote
and for some odd reason I think the head actually suits the figure.

I modeled it as a self portrait.

Quote
Interesting model to say the least and paint is very good as usual.

High elf bolt thrower crewman legs
Dragon rider lords torso
Dragon rider lord's helmet with green stuff
High elf silver helm champion sword arm
High elf wizard staff and base decoration - very cool eh.
Lots and lots of green stuff


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on November 9, 2009, 09:35:07 PM
Well James finished detailing my Seer council and more Wraithguard

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPB090437.jpg&hash=1e1d13b0c2844ea9c5b7d48d17baa9f25c6f51d0)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPB090438.jpg&hash=c492f58381a9e757f513f7f414b7a56d66813498)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPB090434.jpg&hash=a44375844d315d476fb73ceddde1a5de633a643a)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi19.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb162%2Fpheelixkat%2Feldar%2FPB090435.jpg&hash=4f5c180bd58aecf64e5d2990baa0950c19e2f967)

More pictures here ...

http://s19.photobucket.com/albums/b162/pheelixkat/eldar/ (http://s19.photobucket.com/albums/b162/pheelixkat/eldar/)

I've just finished putting together and basing my Jetbikes, Dire Avengers and more Warlocks. I'll be letting James detail them next. Stay tuned. Too bad I still can't beat that infernal IG list. 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on November 10, 2009, 06:28:32 AM
What can I say? :D

Thats excellent material, as always bebe, say so to James, so that he knows that people are all 'OoooH!s' and 'AaaaaaH!s' about it.

And I'll ask you to post your assembled & painted army once its done - Say, the one or two of your regular lists. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on November 14, 2009, 08:10:19 PM
Nice work on the figures...

When do we see a Batrep on them ?

Please. Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on November 14, 2009, 11:37:15 PM
Quote
When do we see a Batrep on them ?

Play nice. I've posted lots of batreps on this thread by command of Starky already. These are my iyanden forces, just newly detailed.  I will post more when I have a good story to tell. I have not been on a win streak lately. I got raped by IG ( Deathstrike Missiles and Vendettas carrying demo squads), got hurt by an SW list and thankfully massacred a Tau list to save my pride. I didn't take notes. But I will say briefly that two Deathsrikes and a Manticore with Ig platoons bubble wrappingt them was a tough nut. Once the missiles hit after the Vendettas took out my Wave Serpents and Falcon - the troops including WG and Wraithlords  went 'poof' between those missiles and demo charges. Not pretty. He sent out some penal legion squads and blocked with his Vendettas to slow down the advancing WG  a turn or two, he let a squad of IG be sacrificied and then the Missiles rained hell. Not much was left on the table on my side, lol. The SW list had Rune Priests and a mounted Lord. Even with Runes of Warding it just made my life miserable. Combined with two squads of TW calvary it was a tough match up that I jsut could not overcome with an Iyanden list.

Here is the army I played against ...

Company Command Squad, Autocannon, 60 

Guardsman Marbo 65

Infantry Platoon 300
Platoon Command, 35, GL
Commissar, PW 45
Combined Infantry Squad 2x, 2 Autocannon, GL 125
Special Weapon Squad, 3 Demo Charges 95

Infantry Platoon  255
Platoon Command, 35, GL
Combined Infantry Squad 2x, 2 Autocannon, GL 125
Special Weapon Squad, 3 Demo Charges 95

Penal Legion Squad  80

Veteran Squad 120
Demolitions, 2x Melta

Vendetta Gunship 130
Vendetta Gunship 130
Valkyrie, 2x Multiple Rocket Pods 130

Manticore 160
Deathstrike Missile Launcher 160
Deathstrike Missile Launcher 160

Total 1750

Now the sad part is that I designed the army for myself. In fact I'm currently building a version using Ork models. This one was proxied up using whatever Idg we had lying around (coke can Deathstrikes, et all). It does not look like much on paper - n fact it can be quite random with all those demo charges and the possibility of never firing your 480 points of heavy weapons! But when it works ... watch out. I just wanted to see it played against me by a competent IG vet. Careful what you wish for.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on December 9, 2009, 12:16:16 AM
Hey all,

Seems I got tossed a Nemesis Gauntlet and I went ahead and took it. Its a friend whom I hadn't seen in a while, who has gotten into 40k now, although he plays Tyrannids and Space Wolves. I hope he plays Space Wolves, but its a nemesis, so more than likely the bugs. I will have to confirm this. Thus the list I am thinking of using since it is nemesis is the following:

HQ
Farseer Elerna [100] Fortune, RoWarding

Troops
Wraithguard x10 +1 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguard x10 +1 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance

Elites
Wraithguard x4 +1 [175] Warlock, Destructor
- Wave Serpent [125] TL-Scatter Laser, Spirit Stone
Fire Dragon x5 [97] Exarch, DBF, Crack Shot
- Wave Serpent [125] TL-Scatter Laser, Spirit Stone
Howling Banshees x10 [175] Exarch, Executioner, Acrobatics
(If the chance it is bugs, it will be Scorpions x10 [170] Exarch, Chainsabres)
- Wave Serpent [125] TL-Scatter Laser, Spirit Stone

Heavy
Wraithlord [120] Flamer x2, Wraithblade, Scatter Laser

I can easily swap the Banshees to Scorpions, since the Scorpions it will be 5pts cheaper. The last time he saw me play I was playing Aspect Warriors heavily. This will be a different style for him to see.

The playstyle is the Farseer has RoWarding in case for those Zoans and Tyrants using some funky powers.
Everything else is very basic to see, although I do have my suicide squad also for rushing the Tyrant who might be in the middle and hit it with as much AP2 as possible.

The thought on howling banshees over scorpions might still work, if he does go for genestealers or stealer shock list.

--- A change in plans...

Would this be more prudent?? My corsair list for Iyanden.

HQ
Yriel [***]

Troops
Dire Avenger x5 [60]
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone
Dire Avenger x5 [60]
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone
Dire Avenger x5 [60]
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone
Dire Avenger x5 [60]
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone
Dire Avenger x5 [60]
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone
Dire Avenger x5 [60]
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone

Elite
Fire Dragons x5 [80]
- Wave Serpent [120] TL-ShurCan, ShurCan chin mounted, Stone

Heavy
Fire Prism [120] Stone

Total = 1500

 And maybe add more into it to make it into 1850??
@ Starky:

Can you rate this list?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on December 12, 2009, 09:08:37 AM
I would consider Eldrich storm in list one and in list two I might want to find some flamers ( Storm Guardian squad or two?) Otherwise I rather like the lists.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Pisces_808 on December 20, 2009, 09:47:09 AM

Say hello to the newest recruit of the Iyanden ranks. Me! :P

I've recently decided to switch from Tau to Eldar and Iyanden looked like a good idea. So I began to collect my Wraithguards and Wraithlord. My lists wouldn't be considered pure Iyanden, but the 10WG make it come close (in smaller games). So what more can I tell about myself... I'm from Belgium for those who want to know/care. Still a student, so my Iyanden army is growing relatively slow. Those Wraithguard aren't really cheap.

Anyway, I thought I'd at least give you guys something more then just plain text.
So here is my converted Wraithguard (don't recall posting it on the forum):
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi15.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa398%2FPisces_808%2FEldar%2FWraithlordFR.jpg&hash=6be0abaa54384c576cab4610ecd7a4889dda4cfd)          (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi15.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa398%2FPisces_808%2FEldar%2FWraithlordFL.jpg&hash=2fd8d1edfe1bad9a4538ccc63e3adace1a5d4288)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi15.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa398%2FPisces_808%2FEldar%2FWraithlordBR.jpg&hash=93ce315aa841530b73e62297c4dc6f5df699fef7)          (https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi15.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa398%2FPisces_808%2FEldar%2FWraithlordBL.jpg&hash=23b08a15ca2eebf345f3f15dce496896e7a5e72b)

For some odd reason the pictures became a little yellow. When I've got the time I'll maybe take some new ones, but you get the idea. I've been told that he reminds some people of a Wraithknight (or something along those lines). I'm thinking of changing his gun because I don't know if this combination of arms is really viable. I converted this guy because I really hate how the old Wraitlord looks (and got one as a gift).

Parts that I used:
- full wraithlord
- legs of an old warwalker
- 2 additional brightlances (spear)
- Farsight's sword (a little unorthodox, but it works)

Greetz
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Two Hawks on December 20, 2009, 07:30:56 PM
Welcome Pisces to the wonderful world of Iyanden
@ Pisces - Nice Wraithlord
Good move as in switching to Eldar.
 To all else I'm still around, been working so much, no time to play plus with the holidays it's hectic.
All of our bunch has put a hold on playing till after the new year.

@ Starky: I bought a second TA to rebuild.

Btw: Merry Christmas & Happy New Year to everyone
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on December 21, 2009, 07:17:13 AM
@Bebe: The new IG can be a though nut to crack, sorry to hear about your losses. I can,T say for SW as I haven't faced them lately.

Quote from: haunt on December  9, 2009, 12:16:16 AM
@ Starky:

Can you rate this list?
I much prefer the classic Iyanden theme over Min/Max DA spam if you want my opinion but each his or her own I guess. But, what about making a combo of the two? Drop one of the Wraithguard unti from first list and add up a pair of Avenger units?

I will rate that second list, as it is quite extreme in its own way...

@Pisces_808: Newcomer in the Iyanden POC, I shall add your name as a Civilian, until you reach the mandatory 100 posts for that Guardian Title. New blood is always welcome and this POC have been much too quiet lately... And I am as (if not more) guilty than most others.

Nice centaurian WL too, I've seen it done with plastoc ones but thats the first time with a metal one.

Welcome aboard! :)

@Two Hawks: Hi hear you Two Hawks, I'm in the same boat lately. Glad to see that you're still there. :)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on December 27, 2009, 11:54:04 PM
Here is the link to my Iyanden army I am working out. Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated!
http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=193432.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=193432.0)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on December 28, 2009, 03:35:12 PM
Hi guys

I just recently convinced myself to turn my small eldar army into an Iyanden one despite the protestations of my wallet.

I've settled on the idea of using only one 10 man squad of WG and already have 4 (i had a 500pts Iyanden army back in 3rd ed.) but would like to know if you guys have any tips on how to convert/make some cheap WG models?

Just in case you wanted to know the army I'm building up to here it is (stars mark units i already have/partly have):

Farseer, Fortune, Doom, SS*
Avatar*

DA x10, Exarch, SS & PW, BS* + Serpent, BL, Star engines
WG x10, SS, Conceal*

Scorps x9, Exarch, CS*  + Serpent, BL, Star engines
Banshees x8, Exarch, Executioner, + Serpent, EML, Star engines

WL, BL, EML*
WL, BL, EML
WL, WS

I'm on holiday at the moment but i promise to put up some pictures of my colour scheme when i get back =] (Iyanden but bone instead of yellow)

One last question! Would you guys suggest fortuning the avatar or the WG squad in general?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on December 28, 2009, 09:04:49 PM
Hiya,

Welcome to the POC. My suggestion, rather than Star Engines give that 3rd lord a firing weapon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on December 28, 2009, 09:18:11 PM
Oh the Avatar is cool; but once again I see him as one more MC that could be used elsewhere... Swap Avatar for Yriel (go with a Serpent party or the Wall of Wraithbone)...  Then have Farseer and the WG work with the WL's...

Now your Mobile factor has more punch if you need it (Yriel), while the Anvil is still rock solid.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on December 28, 2009, 09:58:31 PM
I would also suggest Yriel over the Avatar since you have 3 MC already. I would also drop the star engines in favor of kitting the sword-lord with guns. It doesn't even need to be another AT lord as you have plenty with the two AT lords and AT guns on the serpents. So a SL/cannon combo lord would be good. I also would suggest dual cats + BS over SS/OW and BS. They synergize better this way. SS/PW is better used with defend which they won't need as they are in a mobile transport. Other than those small tweaks it's quite a nice list.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on December 29, 2009, 04:51:09 PM
Quote
Welcome to the POC. My suggestion, rather than Star Engines give that 3rd lord a firing weapon.

Ta much =]

The thinking behind the star engines was that my serpents could possibly come in off reserves and boost to where they need to be but actually rethinking that without the autarch reserves would be a bit risky so i might drop them.

Quote
So a SL/cannon combo lord would be good.


As to kitting him out with a gun i was going to run him up next to the avatar hence the lack of. I figure with a Spiritseer i have a maximum separation of the Avatar+Swordlord pair and the twin ATLord pair of about 24" which given they start off at about 6" gives my at least 3 turns worth of running before they get out of spiritseer range.

I'll probably swap around the avatar and yriel a bit to see what works for me but i just love the avatar so much plus it's such a cool model.

Any ideas on the WG convertion side?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on January 29, 2010, 11:42:35 AM
Hello all,

It seems GW has mitigated our strong comeback by placing weapons that pretty much ignores our T rating. Is this a pattern to remove our craftworld or just numbskull ideas of GW?

Thanks.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on January 29, 2010, 01:04:57 PM
Hey sorry about it being a bit late but as promised here are some pics of my growing Iyanden force =]

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi153.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fs229%2FJohn_Wibbly%2FEldar%2FWarlock.jpg&hash=9fc0297f04ad7ffa4d4130b937921e8e061d4988)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi153.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fs229%2FJohn_Wibbly%2FEldar%2FWLFront.jpg&hash=035e965390ee6889b88d11ba84f57d4f7eb5777f)(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi153.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fs229%2FJohn_Wibbly%2FEldar%2FWLBack.jpg&hash=afbf67e56f85de5c6ceda84fb1f34b3c50c22ef4)

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi153.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fs229%2FJohn_Wibbly%2FEldar%2FScorpionFront.jpg&hash=11e93087d7b991c69a700b4f7f887580d87a506c)(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi153.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fs229%2FJohn_Wibbly%2FEldar%2FScorpionBack.jpg&hash=19d3099717b7c3318c18f5ebd68bb0baa0977291)


(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi153.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fs229%2FJohn_Wibbly%2FEldar%2FScorpionExarch.jpg&hash=a3a8ed4821655e695d5682fed068364184249904)

Those are all the ones I've finished so far (6 scorps 1 wl 1 warlock) apart from my guardians who were a rushed job so i didn't bother putting pics of them up.

I've got a squad of DA, farseer and 4 WG half finished however I've got exams coming up so they'll prob be done in 3weeks time. I'll put up pics then =]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on January 29, 2010, 02:33:09 PM
Awesome work. I like the sun-bleached yellow approach you took as apposed to using a bright yellow.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on January 29, 2010, 02:55:00 PM
yea that was mostly chosen due to being super lazy, it's just spray painted white and then washed with sepia ;]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on January 29, 2010, 08:14:23 PM

It  looks really nice non-the- less. I like the WL a lot.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on January 30, 2010, 09:31:19 AM
Thank you, he's the one I'm most proud of. I spent an absolute age getting the blending on his head right but now it looks so natural you can hardly tell I've painted it  :o
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on January 30, 2010, 10:24:00 AM
I think the figures are great, and I only wish more guys would actually take the time to at least do as much as you did... Washes do work for Table Top ready armies in a very short time.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on February 1, 2010, 12:26:48 PM
Thats very good work indeed, I just wish I could get that quality myself. :)

I am sorry for not being very responsive (as most have noticed I'd guess) but lately R/L have its way of keeping me off 40K and 40KO in general, amongst other things. Keep up the good work guys, you're doing great!

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on February 1, 2010, 01:32:02 PM
Quote from: iStomper Starrakatt on February  1, 2010, 12:26:48 PM
Thats very good work indeed, I just wish I could get that quality myself. :)

Almost all my models are simply basecoated with an appropriate colour washed with a ...well wash... of the same colour and then highlighted with either the base coat again or a slightly lighter shade.

my scorpions for example where painted goblin green all over, then washed with a VERY watered down catachan green (would have used a green wash but didn't have one) and then highlighted with scorpion green. When highlighting i start really heavy on one side and fade it out as i go over the segment. You don't want the paint on your brush to be watery so spit>water, it should almost be grainy when it comes off the brush.

Hope that helps, might put up a how to in the paint boards when i do my next model.

ALSO finished painting my farseer now so just the squad of DA's to go then i have a 500pts army all painted =] (then the avatar for 750pts)

___________________ ___________________ _________

Here are some pictures of my farseer i've just finished:

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi153.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fs229%2FJohn_Wibbly%2FEldar%2FFarseerback.jpg&hash=04a311450ea795ace48f4420ad1a5400c6e30e50)(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi153.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fs229%2FJohn_Wibbly%2FEldar%2FFarseer.jpg&hash=6f0742907d2940f52faf4d89a84bbb5438410112)

and you can see my WIP DA and Avatar in the painting chalange thread here (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=196095.40)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 10, 2010, 09:12:00 AM
Well, it looks like I have to partly store my Ghost Army once again. It seems that with so many people playing Nids and Toxin sacs. I have to modify my tactics, until I could get the Ghost Army to be stand against the bug waves.  >:(
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Eltnot on March 11, 2010, 10:03:09 PM
Wraithguard and Wraithlords are still good against Nids, just not when they're about the only thing you're taking.  Wraithlords are fantastic for charging into any unit in the nid army that doesn't have poisoned attacks or is a carnifex.  Which makes them still good choices against Warriors, Trygons/Mawlocs, Tervigons, Hive Tyrants etc which don't have the toughness to reliably wound them.

Wraithguard are great against similar targets where they have about a 50% chance of causing instant death from a squad of just five.  You'll need to field things like Scorpions and Dire Avengers to deal with the hormies running around with toxin sacs, but hey, that's life.

That said, I'm surprised that people are still trying to run mostly pure wraith armies what with the popularity of IG and their ability to put out large numbers of pie plates that are death to Wraithguard.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Simmoski on March 12, 2010, 08:49:30 AM
Well all it is official, I am back with a vengance, Moved 2500 kms north from my old haunt, armies are unpacked and the games are about to begin.  With everything just getting set up again, i am looking at getting some more work done on my various armies.Have a game agains crons coming up in 3 days, list posted on the strat forums.  Look forward to talking to you all soon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Eltnot on March 14, 2010, 07:48:02 PM
Quote from: Simmoski on March 12, 2010, 08:49:30 AM
Well all it is official, I am back with a vengance, Moved 2500 kms north from my old haunt, armies are unpacked and the games are about to begin.  With everything just getting set up again, i am looking at getting some more work done on my various armies.Have a game agains crons coming up in 3 days, list posted on the strat forums.  Look forward to talking to you all soon.
Given that your old haunt was Canberra, I'm assuming that you've moved to somewhere around Townsville or Cairns?
Rockhampton based player here.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Algavinn of the Many Paths on March 14, 2010, 09:05:51 PM
Ahoyhoy all.  I'm laying down the structural organization for article publication now; meaning getting our 'finished' articles into the editorial process and organized for front page release.  SO, I need people to link in PM me your finished and UP TO DATE articles.  This includes those within this PoC's 'finished articles' reference section.

ONLY finished articles, that will be edited for front page publication are to be sent to me.  Those articles still needing to be 'updated' or are in production/revision are not ready for this step. 

Until we get the technical quirks and processes worked out we may still need to send the finished text of the article to the author to submit personally, or whomever the 'lead' contributor/organizer of an article project is to give proper credit without having to edit the code within the database itself...but this is the current step.  I hope to get some links from you all soon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on March 21, 2010, 11:18:11 PM
Sup homies

Recently decided that spending £80 for one unit of troops is beyond ridiculous so I've started work on some convertions of wood elf dryads into WG (saving me a tidy £62). ATM I've only done some basic green stuffing on a test model however life has inconsiderately thrown some mid semester exams in my way so i won't be able to do any more just right now HOWEVER, easter holidays start after this week so I'll have plenty of time then....hopefully.

I'll be updating with pics and asking for ideas soon so stay tuned =]

(also would i be able to double post to bump this thread when i have more pics to add/general updates? obv. this is a moot point if someone answers this but it's more for future reference)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on March 22, 2010, 06:54:41 AM
Don't double post... just let one of us slip a comment in so that you can post legally...

Can't wait to see the pics of this conversion, I have 15 Wraithguard (stock)... but would love to see an alternative for a 3 Wraith Serpent Squad I have in mind.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Aislinn on March 26, 2010, 06:20:41 PM
recently I played a small game against the orks, it was about 500 pts.  I took with me Autarch Adrastos, 10 Striking scorpions, and two Ranger units.  The enemy took some boys, some nobs, and a command unit as well as some koptas.
  I didn't utilize the rangers that much because Adrastos ordered a tactical withdraw of them.  So Adrastos and the scorpions took out the entire ork force.  Very good day for the Eldar of Iyanden.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Simmoski on April 2, 2010, 12:20:50 AM
Quote from: Eltnot on March 14, 2010, 07:48:02 PM
Quote from: Simmoski on March 12, 2010, 08:49:30 AM
Well all it is official, I am back with a vengance, Moved 2500 kms north from my old haunt, armies are unpacked and the games are about to begin.  With everything just getting set up again, i am looking at getting some more work done on my various armies.Have a game agains crons coming up in 3 days, list posted on the strat forums.  Look forward to talking to you all soon.
Given that your old haunt was Canberra, I'm assuming that you've moved to somewhere around Townsville or Cairns?
Rockhampton based player here.


Correct, Townsville it is, and i have just aquired Sundays off so i may eventually be able to head out to the local gaming group day up here :D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on May 6, 2010, 10:13:18 PM
Hello everyone,

I know it has been a while. Busy with RL.

Anyway, I am on a HUGE question at this point. The release of the C: BA and within it has a Librarian Dreadnought. I am rather sure that we can have our Wraithseers and or Wraithlord farseers at this point. Any thoughts and agreeance with me on this? I am sure this really belong to our POC rather than floating out there. :)

Thanks for future replies and retorts.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on May 6, 2010, 10:57:27 PM
Quote
I am rather sure that we can have our Wraithseers and or Wraithlord farseers at this point

Wraithlord Seer? I would love it but we need some sort of Drop Pods for our WLs or a transport for WL and a troop of Wraithguard ... Stormraven like.

Don't hold your breath.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on May 13, 2010, 02:38:44 PM
Hello everyone,

I know I laid claim that I'm placing away my Ghost Army for a while. Yet, here's my list for Ard Boyz and am fixing to play my second trial with it.

HQ
Farseer Na’Nular (Eldrad Equivalent)
Farseer Ruaki - Doom, Fortune, Mind War, RoWard, RoWit, Stone

Elite
Fire Dragons x5
+ Wave Serpent (The Burning Fist) – TL-Scatter Laser, Stone
Howling Banshees x10 – Exarch, Executioner, Acrobatic
+ Wave Serpent (Heaven’s Grace) – TL – BL, Stone

Troops
Wraithguards x11 – Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguards x11 – Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguards x11 – Spiritseer, Enhance

Heavy
Wraithlord – Wraithblade, ShurCan
Wraithlord – ScatLas, StarCan
Wraithlord – ScatLas, StarCan

Total = 2500

I emplace the conceal WG in the front followed by the 2 enhance WG. This is a castle formation and the Wraithlords escorts the WG firing its 2 guns or 1 for Bladelord. The 2 Serpents are nearby in case something bad happens or I need to distract my opponent for flanking manuevers.

If you have any comments, I just fought a Blood Angels Army and got a major victory by destroying the entire army.

Bumping this up and I was unable to get a spot in the Ard Boyz, I just went anyway to see who are the competetions.

Anyway, I just finished a game tonite and will try to post some pics later on too. I used this list against this BA player.

HQ
Farseer Na'Nular (Eldrad equivalent) [210]
Farseer [130] Doom, Fortune, Stone

Troops
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance

Elite
Banshee x10 [187] Exarch, Executioner, Acrobat
-   Wave Serpent [145] TL – Brightlance, Stone
Heavy
Wraithlord [140] Starcannon, Scatter Laser, Flamer x2

Total = 2000

Please do not double post, use the modify button instead.
-Lor.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Two Hawks on May 26, 2010, 11:01:33 PM
So how did it turn out? I like the list, just doesn't seem to be enough heavies for me.
But the price of the troops is where all the point are. So how does three squads of footsloggers do.
I've used two squads and one of them got wiped by a vindicator.
I've thought about getting that third squad.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on May 27, 2010, 09:56:28 AM
Folks (those I fought) tell me that it is rough facing a T6 army, and them trying to take down 1 unit is just close to impossible.


http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=201330.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=201330.0)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Eltnot on July 7, 2010, 08:01:04 PM
Just thought I'd bump these hallowed and ghostly halls back up to the top and put a bit of life into them.

This tournament happened earlier in the year, but I figured I'd post it up to show my current Eldar army.
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3.bp.blogspot.com%2F_qiQAtQLFJ6c%2FS4usE5nSnzI%2FAAAAAAAAAOU%2FIQi0swUoWws%2Fs320%2FP1000924.JPG&hash=23dc88ce11afa73b9e72952f4952caa41e60cfeb) (http://eltnot.blogspot.com/2010/03/quartermaster-qm1.html)
Clicking on the above image will take you to a short report of a tournament that I took them to.  Managed to tie for third place and scored Best Sportsman, so rather happy with their performance, especially when they're just my have fun army.

Also started a thread HERE (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=202411.0) regarding my next Eldar army.  I'd love to hear any input you guys and girls might have on it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 7, 2010, 11:53:56 PM
Good size army there. :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on July 8, 2010, 08:57:08 AM
Great looking army up there.... I love the yellow and bllue ratios as they are not too much of one, without the other... and they look clean (as aopposed to Garish).  That Nid army behind looks funky - I hope you kicked its arse....

In regard to what I see in your army... only one serpent squad of Wraithguard, 1 Wraithlord, and Prince Yriel... to go along with the more stock Eldar stuff... I would have like to see a Wall of Wraithbone in the troops section if you catch my meaning... anyway, its still looks great and I totally understand that tournie lists are different than regular lists (fluff, etc)...

Thanks for sharing... and welcome to the boards

Cheers

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Eltnot on July 8, 2010, 09:17:23 AM
Yriel's not in there, and won't ever be, I have another force currently being collected for him.  I bought the army off a friend as a favour and then touched up some of the paint jobs but most of that work is his.  I like it a lot more then some of the lists fielded here as it seems a more realistic force.  Remember the Eldar despise using Wraithguard and Wraithlords, so my army is filled with guardians as well to make up its fighting force.  Since the Iyanden craftworld is so small, any large confrontation will generally have to involve its guardians as well as aspect warriors and wraithbone constructs.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on July 21, 2010, 05:30:30 PM

List that took 3rd at Ard Boyz LA

Elrad
Yriel

6-8 Harlequins
5-6 Firedragons
5-6 Firedragons

10 Wraithguard
5-6, no exarch, Dire avengers
5-6, no exarch, Dire avengers

Wave Serpent w/ TL Bright Lance x 4

Falcon

2 x Wraithlord w/ Bright Lance, Eldar missile launcher

Semi-mech and not too bad for an Iyanden list. Of course all the internet gurus will scram that WG/WL suck in hard core competition.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on July 23, 2010, 01:01:14 PM
got any links or pics etc so we might see this list in real life... I would like more details, etc... and I think its actualy an ok (even if spammed out a bit) list.

Cheers....
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 23, 2010, 09:21:43 PM
@moc065,

One of these list is what I am taking in a local tourney in my area.

1850pts

Farseer Ruaki [160] Jetbike, Stone, Fortune, Doom
- Jet/locks x4 [210] Destructor, Embolden, Enhance

Farseer Na'Nular (Eldrad equivalent) [210]
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Dire Avenger x7 [141] Exarch, PW + SS, Bladestorm, Defend
- Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone

Howling Banshee x7 [139] Exarch, Executioner, Acrobatics
- Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone
Striking Scorpions x7 [164] Exarch, Claw, Stalker, Shadowstrike

Wraithlord [140] Flamer x2, Scatter Laser, Starcannon

This is a very aggressive list that takes advantage of the opponent's fear of each unit and from there you'll see opportunities in the wavering line as it has to compensate against each unit.

1850pts

Farseer Ruaki [160] Jetbike, Stone, Fortune, Doom
- Jet/locks x4 [210] Destructor, Embolden, Enhance

Farseer Na'Nular (Eldrad equivalent) [210]
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Dire Avenger x9 [152] Exarch, PW + SS, Bladestorm, Defend
- Wave Serpent [125] TL-Scatter Laser, Stone

Howling Banshee x7 [139] Exarch, Executioner, Acrobatics
- Wave Serpent [125] TL-Scatter Laser, Stone

Dark Reaper x5 [217] Exarch, Tempest Launcher, Crack Shot
Wraithlord [120] Flamer x2, Scatter Laser, Wraithblade

This is the other list which is a support as needed, which means a defensive list. I hate to say that it really could get overwhelmed. The first list is a punch you in the nose and keep punching, even with list that has Deathstar units I am sure the council can handle them.

Any suggestion on changes?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: nickthewise on July 24, 2010, 04:25:44 AM
Quote from: bebe on July 21, 2010, 05:30:30 PM

List that took 3rd at Ard Boyz LA

Elrad
Yriel

6-8 Harlequins
5-6 Firedragons
5-6 Firedragons

10 Wraithguard
5-6, no exarch, Dire avengers
5-6, no exarch, Dire avengers

Wave Serpent w/ TL Bright Lance x 4

Falcon
2 x Wraithlord w/ Bright Lance, Eldar missile launcher


The list also had 10 storm guardians with 2 flamers and destructor in a wave serpent with scatter lasers.  Both of the Fire Dragon Wave Serpents had shuriken cannons, while the Avengers had Bight Lances.

The person who placed third is a buddy of mine and I've played against this list (and variants of it) many times - he's been running Iyanden since third edition.

Pretty strait forward strategy - Eldrad, Yriel, Wraithguard, Wraithlord and Harlequins castle up and advance.  Fire Dragons blow open transports and tanks, while the BL Wave Serpents and Falcon offer supporting fire.  Just about everything is good at contesting and controlling objectives. 

It's kind of a pick your poison army - either try to stop the castle running / fleeting towards your front lines, or try to take out the tanks offering support.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 26, 2010, 09:24:20 PM
This is my 3000 pts standing army.

[smg id=3820]
[smg id=3821]
[smg id=3822]

Elder Na'Nular (Eldrad equivalent)
Farseer Ruaki on Jetbike [160] Stone, Doom, Fortune
Warlock on Jetbike x4 [210] Destructor, Embolden, Enhance

Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguard x11 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance

Howling Banshee x10 [191] Exarch Aldra, Executioner, Acrobatic, War Shout
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone
Wraithguard x6 [215] Warlock, Enhance
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone
Wraithguard x6 [215] Warlock, Enhance
- Wave Serpent [110] TL-ShurCan, Stone

Wraithlord [140] Scatter Laser, Starcannon
Wraithlord [140] Scatter Laser, Starcannon

Hope folks are able to see it, and yes, I have been so busy lately or ejust have no inspiration to paint. I will be using this army against 7 other folks in a local fight. One using UM, another a BA list, and of course we're looking at everyone bringing their Deathstar units.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Eltnot on July 27, 2010, 02:00:15 AM
 That's an awful lot of Wraithguard.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 28, 2010, 04:14:56 PM
Just playing with 40 of the 70 Wraithguards I own, while 2 of the 14 Wraithlords in my possession. Yes, I'm almost complete in having 90 WGs 6 Troops and 3 Elites.

Fun times, plus I really love the theme. :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: kasrkin43 on July 29, 2010, 11:55:45 AM
I know this is shameless self plugging but I think of anyone on the boards you guys might like this...

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=203687 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=203687)

tell me what you guys think
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 30, 2010, 12:09:30 AM
I do have a couple of batreps for you to read somewhere there. :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Algavinn of the Many Paths on August 23, 2010, 05:16:30 PM
Greetings my brothers.

I come with announcements of the re-unveiling of our grand article publishing and database system.  We are now accepting and publishing articles once more, so I wished to draw the august attention of the contributors and potential contributors to our official announcement and the new procedures and rules involved.  I encourage and look forward to seeing your great works in the future hit my desk.  Should you have any questions, please do not hesitate to PM or IM me.  Below is the link to our official announcement that you may or may not have seen, which should elucidate most details.

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=204301.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=204301.0)

Cheers.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 28, 2010, 10:23:36 PM
Has anyone seen Starky?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on August 31, 2010, 12:05:04 PM
Starky is alive, although very in-active as of late.

I will try to contact him so that he can contact the POC himself; but I think he has Computer issues still as well as his real life time challenges.

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Fizzics on August 31, 2010, 05:12:40 PM
I was going to read this thread, but all of the yellow on the first page is pretty much unreadable. Any chance of getting it to a normal color?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on August 31, 2010, 05:44:48 PM
Quote from: Fizzics on August 31, 2010, 05:12:40 PM
I was going to read this thread, but all of the yellow on the first page is pretty much unreadable. Any chance of getting it to a normal color?

That's because the forum skin was black when the thread was first created.  You could try asking a moderator to edit the first page by removing the colour tags, as this would return the colour to the default black.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Fizzics on August 31, 2010, 10:59:28 PM
Well that was exactly what I was getting at...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: moc065 on September 1, 2010, 01:23:05 PM
You could also run your cursor over the writing and read it once it changes colour. Or you could change your defualt to be black background (as I have done - because its the cool thing to do, you know).

Honestly there is a reason its in Yellow (Iyanden Yellow to be exact).

In the future you may also find other put writing in hidden areas by choosing a colour of test that matches the background, the Curser Catch does show you their post though, so its not truely secret or hidden.

What is the hardest colour to see. Oh waits lets write something in that colour to annoy people, or in Starkies case, so that its in theme to the bloody thread. PS, its really easy to see Yellow (and some other colours when you use the cool Black background

Cheers
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: The_Carpenter on October 4, 2010, 06:03:13 PM
Have finally finished some models  ;D ... only another 5000 odd points to go :S

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi536.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fff327%2FThe_Carpenter_album%2FIyanden%2520Eldar%2FP1010041.jpg&hash=9743a6872ffa8845680c4ea443285ba25152b449)

What ya guys think?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on January 15, 2011, 03:57:23 PM
Very nice, at least more folks are finishing their army themes.

--------------------------

Happy New Year to everyone in our POC.
-----------------------------

Is Starky busy lately?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on March 30, 2011, 09:47:17 AM
Hi all,

I'd like to be a part of POC Iyanden. As I have roughly 5k of Iyanden it kind of makes sense  ::)
I IM'd the Mod lead on this project but nothing yet.

Once I sort out my camera I'll be posting some of my army and will hope to be posting some Batreps.

I've been playing Eldar on and off for 10 years or so. So I have some good insight into the game.
I'm more of a fun player than a gamesplayer so my lists tend to be more fluffy and balanced than cheesy.

Hope to hear from you all soon!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Algavinn of the Many Paths on March 30, 2011, 11:23:51 AM
Unfortunately Iyanden is the least active of the craftworlds, so it may take a little bit of time for a response.  You'd think with all the ghostwalking technology they'd at least leave an answering machine...or maybe that's me?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on March 30, 2011, 11:41:31 AM
Well my part of our Craftworld isn't completely overrun with Wraiths. I'll keep posting!!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt2 on March 31, 2011, 12:05:59 PM
Welcome back, Val.


Unfortunately, I had been trying to repost back up but my old acct can't get a password change for some reason. If anyone from admin can help me with that.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Algavinn of the Many Paths on March 31, 2011, 12:22:08 PM
Try PMing Kindred about that, he's kinda our ghost behind the machine around here.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on March 31, 2011, 12:22:22 PM
Ha! you're a noooob! 
How Ironic you've been born again on the POC Iyanden page!
Oh wait your going to come back as a Wraithlord and squash me aren't you...  :-\
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt2 on March 31, 2011, 07:36:30 PM
I just tried to pm Kindred and I am unable to send any PM. :(
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Algavinn of the Many Paths on March 31, 2011, 08:27:19 PM
hah, oh yeah I forgot we have a limit on that.  Well just write down what you need from him and I'll send it to him and ask him to contact you as we don't actually have a help forum.  You can also report your own post and ask for an adim to PM you.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on April 3, 2011, 12:39:47 PM
Quote from: haunt2 on March 31, 2011, 07:36:30 PM
I just tried to pm Kindred and I am unable to send any PM. :(

[gmod]Private Messaging is disabled until a certain number of posts are made, due to adbots spamming PM's to users. If you wish to reactivate your old account simply use the password recovery feature. If that doesn't work, copy-paste the addresses of your current profile as well as your old profile into a Report to Moderator comment. If the info matches I can just do a password reset.[/gmod]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt2 on April 3, 2011, 11:09:16 PM
I had been trying and I am not getting it in my Yahoo account. :(
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on April 9, 2011, 02:20:22 AM
I recently posted this, but thought you all could get to check it out.

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=212894.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=212894.0)

Using a themed army in an 'Ard Boyz tournament.

[gmod]I added a description. Users should know what they're going to click on before they click it, not after the fact. -Mr.Peanut[/gmod]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on April 23, 2011, 04:04:56 PM
Guess who's back...  :o

After a long break from the hobby (and the selling of all my models, except eldar) I am back and ready to rock!

I've been bouncing around this forum a bit trying to get up to speed with the current meta for eldar and I'm feeling that the walls of wraith are lagging behind a bit. Am I wrong (I hope so)?

So what's bossing the tabletops these days? Any tips would be great since I'm currently flirting around my model case looking at things to paint :)

Cheers all o/

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on April 23, 2011, 11:40:00 PM
IMHO, Mobile Aspect is still up and very playable just a lot of our tactics and tricks of the trade has to be used, due to the new overpowering of the new codices.

On the other hand, many people are still not into buying expensive wraithguards like I have done. They're still just using from 3 - 10 wraithguards still. I recently rolled out my Ard Boyz Hammer and Anvil and my LGC just don't like it and they keep saying we're still over powering them. The part that I had to use every trick I know in beating their armies don't really come in play, so my take is that my Eldar Army rating is still rank 1 while skill rating is probably around 8 or 9. It just means that many players are still quite overwhelmed by our units and weaponries.

Just to keep you updated Eldar is in the lower ranking of the top 10 armies, IG #1, SW#2, Orks and Nids #3/4, BA#5, as far as I am informed from 1-2 months ago.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on May 1, 2011, 06:11:09 PM
Could I point some of you towards this thread in the Painting Forum and get your opinions? :)

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=213660.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=213660.0)

Cheers

S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Chaplain Swordwind on May 1, 2011, 06:44:31 PM
Your paint looks good.  The Wraithguard sort of reminds me of the Thousand Sons...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on May 2, 2011, 04:39:59 AM
They look very nice mate.  The scorpion doesnt stand apart from it, i was always unsure about doing my aspects in the traditional colours and whether they would stick out but i find if you have certain parts as a universal colour... ie, all weapons the same colour, eyes the same, leathers the same, so all thats different is the colour of the armour.

The Wraithguard could do with a touch more blue but that is my personal taste.

good stuffs
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Sludge_City on May 4, 2011, 07:12:55 PM
Quote from: Valar on May  2, 2011, 04:39:59 AM
They look very nice mate.  The scorpion doesnt stand apart from it, i was always unsure about doing my aspects in the traditional colours and whether they would stick out but i find if you have certain parts as a universal colour... ie, all weapons the same colour, eyes the same, leathers the same, so all thats different is the colour of the armour.

The Wraithguard could do with a touch more blue but that is my personal taste.

good stuffs

Thankies ^_^
I keep adding detail to the scorpion so I'll try and get a pic up asap, but I really need to tear myself away from it and get on with the rest of the squad xD I'm so bad when it comes to painting whole units :(

In other news I found this rather fancy wave serpent...
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.planeteoueb.com%2F_st5%2Fchwxihvc%2FWH40K%2FVENTE%25200210%2FWAVE%2520SERPENT%2FIMG_5435B.jpg&hash=bb6898ac9061922a0cc32e1d981771b8191b8f57)

...and was thinking I might copy/steal/etc the colour scheme for my own serpents (I've never been able to settle on a scheme for vehicles). It looks very airbrushed to me. What do you think? If it is then what are the chances I could pull off the same effect using the Army Painter Desert Yellow spray can?

Cheers! S_C
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on May 5, 2011, 05:56:00 AM
chances of you achieving those effects with a can of spray are close to nil, you would only get a solid colour from the can and wont achieve the gradiation of colour nor the control needed to make specific highlights

I would say that it has definitely been airbrushed, and if you want to achieve the same look you will need to invest in an airbrush too. Although the same kind of outcome can be achieved with a brush and thin paints as described in the waveserpent tutorial I did link in my sig.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- Leaderless ??
Post by: Arquarian on May 9, 2011, 09:47:46 AM
Its a strong colour scheme and I agree I don't think you're going to get any such affect using a gun.

For some reason I always thing the Torii symbol looks better black, hmm...

Edit: It seems our resident leader Starrakatt has ascended into the Dome of Crystal seers. As far as I can make out he hasn't posted in over a year now.

Is there the possibility that someone can take over his duties in steering this POC??
I would volunteer but I'm sure there are many better suiuted guys on here. For exapmle I don't even know how to start a blog!

Can any of the other Mods assist??
(mainly with the leadership crisis but help with the blog thing would also be nice  ;D )
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on May 9, 2011, 10:04:09 AM
We all help out, since our Starky is currently having life issues. Please, don't double post. :(
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on May 9, 2011, 10:25:50 AM
we'll keep this place running smoothly between us and keep it nice and tidy for his return.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on May 9, 2011, 10:34:03 AM
Quote from: haunt on May  9, 2011, 10:04:09 AM
Please, don't double post. :(

Yes I know this  :o but as my previous was of a completely different topic.....

[gmod]Doesn't matter. When posts are that short they should be combined into one like I did for you. Only really long posts should remain in a row.[/gmod]

Ok so the reason I asked as I want to be a little more proactive and contribute a little more to the site in general and to the Iyanden PoC in particular. Can either of you dapper chaps assist with the blog issue?

I'm thinking that if I document the progress of my army build / and manily painting I'd be more likely to actually get on and complete something rather than changing colour schemes every month or so....

 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Orannis on May 9, 2011, 10:45:20 AM
Could I register my interest in joining the POC please? I wasn't sure who to speak to directly so I've left it hanging hear.

I'm a returning 40k player and have decided to pick up Eldar for the first time. I've not played a game in 8 years or so but I'm concentrating on getting my army up to a table top standard before I throw myself into some games. Hopefully in the coming weeks I can post some pictures but just to give you an idea I have mainly stuck with individual aspect colours from the codex with everything else adopting the traditional yellow/blue.

Valar, I must thank you for providing that excellent tutorial for painting a waveserpent. I have shamefully copied it onto all my grav tanks and, though am certainly not an excellent painter, they've ended up looking quite nice. As you can probably tell I don't have a great deal of imagination when it comes to creating my own paint schemes. Probably because I'm terified it'll look naff when I'm done.

Orannis
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- Leaderless ??
Post by: Irisado on May 9, 2011, 03:49:00 PM
Quote from: Chukyu on May  9, 2011, 09:47:46 AM
Is there the possibility that someone can take over his duties in steering this POC??

It is usually the existing Autarch (Spiritseer in the case of the Iyanden POC) who recommends someone to take his place.  This is not possible here because Starrakatt is currently away, so if you want to discuss this issue, I suggest that you consult other POC members to post their view on whether a new Spiritseer is needed (via PM if they don't respond here), and that if this is felt to be the case, that somebody contacts one of the moderators of the Eldar boards (Lorizael is probably you best bet), and ask if this can be arranged.

Quote
I would volunteer but I'm sure there are many better suiuted guys on here. For exapmle I don't even know how to start a blog!

Can any of the other Mods assist??
(mainly with the leadership crisis but help with the blog thing would also be nice  ;D )

Just to be clear that most of the POC leaders (moc and Oink are the exceptions) are not Staff, so I'm not sure why you're connecting them to moderators.  I'm also not sure how the blog issue relates to the POC.  I think that your best bet is to wait and see if others who contribute regularly here feel that the POC needs new leadership, and then proceed from there.

I hope that helps.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on May 9, 2011, 04:06:59 PM
Welcome to POC: Iyanden, Orannis. Just keep posting and you'll eventually be part of the cast.  ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- Leaderless ??
Post by: Arquarian on May 10, 2011, 06:50:46 AM
Quote from: Irisado on May  9, 2011, 03:49:00 PM
I think that your best bet is to wait and see if others who contribute regularly here feel that the POC needs new leadership, and then proceed from there.

That's kinda why I posted here. As far as I'm concerned it looks as though you guys have a handle on things here.
There's not much activity here (relatively), maybe we can do something about that  :)



As for the blog issue, as stated before I wish to contribute to this PoC and to the site in general more and wanted advice as to how best to do that. Should I be asking someone / somewhere else? I can't seem to find advice on other pages and would ask those a little more knowledgable of the site to kindly assist.

Thanks
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- Leaderless ??
Post by: Irisado on May 10, 2011, 07:25:47 AM
Quote from: Chukyu on May 10, 2011, 06:50:46 AM
As for the blog issue, as stated before I wish to contribute to this PoC and to the site in general more and wanted advice as to how best to do that. Should I be asking someone / somewhere else? I can't seem to find advice on other pages and would ask those a little more knowledgable of the site to kindly assist.

Contributing to the POC is covered on the opening pages, so if you feel that there is something that you wish to add, such as a tactical article, painting guide, or something similar, then the place to work on that is the Eldar Project board, and then it can be linked to this thread.

As for contributing more to the site, you need to be more specific.  Assuming this is related to the Eldar, send me a PM about this, and I might be able to help you out.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 3, 2011, 02:51:00 PM
Right then lads,

Im taking part in the 10th 40ko tournament in August... I am thinking I will be taking my Eldar up with me, so what this means is that I need a competitive 1750 point list which is Iyanden themed.

I've never played Iyanden in a competitive setting so this will be a new experience for me and i'll let you all know how it goes.  But like i say I've only played Iyanden in friendly games.... therefore I need your help in creating a competitive 1750 point list.

I have the following models painted ready for use.... but feel free to suggets any units from the dex even if i dont have them as I have until mid august to buy and paint them up.

2 Farseers
10 Howling Banshees and exarch with mirror blades
10 Fire dragons and exarch with fire pike
10 wraithguard 1 spirit seer
10 Dire Avengers and exarch
5 pathfinders
3 waveserpents 2 with missile launcher and shuri cannon 1 yet to be armed
3 Fire Prisms
3 warwalkers
2 wraithlords

thats what i have to work with, whats are your thoughts?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on June 3, 2011, 04:28:02 PM
GUessing hammer and anvil would be the best way to go:

Anvil
Guide/Fortune seer
10WG + Spiritseer
2 AT WL
3 Scatterwalkers

Hammer
Doomseer
Bladesorm DA + WS
Banshees + WS
Dragons + WS

No idea what that would come to but i think aiming for that will give you a good solid list.

ninja edit: keep squa sizes max (appart from teh dragons) and upgrades to a minimum that list comes in at 1800pts exactly =]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 3, 2011, 05:20:16 PM
Yeah hammer anvil is ussually the way I play them...

My only thoughts were what with poisoned attacks from both DE and Tyranid gaunts the super toughness of the WL makes them almost vulnerable and are too expensive to lose to basic infantry and the Arnour 10 of the War Walkers, as much as i enjoy them when equipped with scatter lasers wont last if used as an anvil unit.... they would definitely make a good hammer unit though but fragile, i wonder if 2 prisms would make a more durable hard hitting combo?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on June 3, 2011, 06:04:33 PM
well tbh i was thinking dual prisms but i suppose i just wanted to stick to the good old iyanden WL/WG combo. As you said though its for competitive play. For the scatterwalkers you could hide them behind your WG for a 4+ save which would make them a bit more durable. Oh just remembered you probably need a counter assault unit in there so maybe swap the walkers out for a squad of scorpions? If you do run the prisms then they can take over the anti horde duties of the walkers but without the WLs you'll be lacking some long range AT =/
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 3, 2011, 11:04:22 PM
You're not alone Valar. I am waiting for our LGCT in my area and am using 2 WGT w/ Conceal and 2 DAWS w/ BL, as the basis.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 4, 2011, 03:36:41 PM
My plan is to draw up a 1750 point list at some point this week, tonight ideally but I dont think I have the dex to hand at my missus'.

A sneek preview of one of the extra 2 fire prisms that i'll be adding to the fleet.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FP1010501.jpg&hash=7c5b1daf932ff3be97cf58946a3d10ecdad46527)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FP1010499.jpg&hash=ab25bd965a7ed78ac95491f2493567db9cd6e1a6)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FP1010502.jpg&hash=bfea3dbda5405cabf74fc23cf4dd4cd641f21d2b)
(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FP1010503.jpg&hash=736a444f998cbedc2f3e9b1b4f2753018a401246)

Cant wait to put 3 of these beauties on the table at once... imagine 3 prisms and 3 serpents, cant wait to see how that looks :D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 5, 2011, 08:30:43 AM
IMO, 3 FP is a bit much, but depending on your opponent. I fought a Termie heavy army and made them suffer. My biggest complaint is the 3++ Storm Shields which is cheap for them to have and yet SM players still don't think its fair that they can't survive a blast from a FP.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 6, 2011, 02:31:00 PM
And here is the list I worked out today for the tournament i managed to hit 1750 bang on the nose :)

Please tear it apart, critique it, comment constructively I want to do well :P

its aimed to be a take on all comers and be pretty balanced, its not targeted to anyone specifically although I have borne Grey Knights and Dark Eldar in mind hence the inclusion of runes of warding and the lack of Wraith lords as I dont want to be overly hurt by poisoned attacks.

Farseer, Runes of Warding, doom, fortune, spirit stones 145

10 wraithguard, spirit seer with conceal 396

10 dire avengers, exarch, bladestorm, power weap and shimmer shield 162

waveserpent bright lances, spirit stones 145

10 howling banshees, exarch, mirror blades and acrobatic 187

waveserpent, missile launcher, shuri cannon spirit stones 140

5 fire dragons inc exarch, ttank hunters, fire pike

waveserpent, missile launcher, shuri cannon spirit stones 140

fire prism, holofield, spiritstones 160

fire prism, holofield, spirit stones 160

Total 1750

Oppinions and thoughts please, lets start a fgood discussion on this and get a win for the craftworld at this tourney
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on June 7, 2011, 08:24:31 AM
One thing I noticed pretty much straight away was only two Troops.  Albeit the first is a mighty whop[per for points (WG), the other relies entirely on the WS not getting blown up before it moves them into place and lets them do their thing.  The question I have, and this I do for any list critique, is what are you going to do about Objective missions, particularly your Capture and Control home objective?

It almost looks like a Mech-dar list trying to include a unit of WG.  It doesn't blend for the best efficiencies.

Some things to think about.  How closely tied are you to either the Banshees or the Fire Dragons?

By replacing the Banshees with a unit of 6-8 Harlequins w/ Shadowseer, you have a CC unit to accompany your WG.  The points for the Wave Serpent could net you a unit of Defenders with support platform and Embold-lock to sit on a nearby/home objective and support from a distance; voila, another Troop.  Alternatively, you could possibly accomplish the same by doing similar changes with the Dragons, scrimping elsewhere for points.

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 7, 2011, 09:02:15 AM
Banshees I never leave home without, I dont rate harlequins and the banshees have never let me down they are one thing that must stay.

I do like the potential for guardians with a platform, however I have run them before and because they are such a soft target they get chewed to pieces within the first few turns, they can be an easy kill point and leave an objective unguarded if they flee or die... which lets face it is likely.

Thinking about this, an alternative may be to drop a Wave Serpent in favour of a second squad of Dire Avengers and have both squads foot slogging and supporting the WG?  what are your oppinions on this? 

I do see what you mean about the lack of troop choices, occasionally I run a number of pathfinders as an objective holder, the problem with these in 5th is that everyone gets a damn cover save against their AP1 and AP2 shots which almost cancels out their usefulness.

The FD are in there for reliable anti armour as I run the Fire prisms as an anti infantry anti-tank combo to give flexibility, its an extra failsafe and they are almost a must have as things like Leman Russ/ other big gribbly tanks are about the only thing that can make a mess of concealed wraithguard....

Thoughts?...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 7, 2011, 09:13:02 AM
Quote from: Valar on June  7, 2011, 09:02:15 AM
I do like the potential for guardians with a platform, however I have run them before and because they are such a soft target they get chewed to pieces within the first few turns, they can be an easy kill point and leave an objective unguarded if they flee or die... which lets face it is likely.
Cue Irisado's essay length yet comprehensive comment regarding how to use guardians.......



I find it difficult to incorporate WG into what would normally be regarded as 'standard' Eldar list.
I would say you have roughly 2 options surrounding the decision to keep the Wraithguard as troops.

If you do keep them as troops then I'd say the Avenger option is the best. They are anti-infantry and with the Exarch sporting ss +pw you can hold a unit in combat unti the screaming minxy cavalry arrives. They complement the W/Guard well in my eyes.

But here's an idea from the leftfield. How about using 5 Wraithguard in place of the Dragons. they're just as effective (if not more so ) at AT and they are a lot more durable. something which is more difficult to express is the psychology affect of having a wraithguard unit pop up on a flank. In this case you'll also be able to afford that additional troops choice. Which if not mech'd then could be a jetbike squardon??

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on June 7, 2011, 11:25:27 AM
Quote from: Valar on June  7, 2011, 09:02:15 AM
Banshees I never leave home without, I dont rate harlequins and the banshees have never let me down they are one thing that must stay.

I do like the potential for guardians with a platform, however I have run them before and because they are such a soft target they get chewed to pieces within the first few turns, they can be an easy kill point and leave an objective unguarded if they flee or die... which lets face it is likely.

Thinking about this, an alternative may be to drop a Wave Serpent in favour of a second squad of Dire Avengers and have both squads foot slogging and supporting the WG?  what are your oppinions on this? 

<snip>

Thoughts?...

Your thoughts on the Harlies are certainly not unique.  If they are a must-have, then we look to the Fire Dragons as 'flex points,' arguably not that many in the current set-up.  One thing about using WG as Troops, is that it almost forces you to use a hybrid list - the WG need direct support for a number of things (deal with CC specialists or other Death Star unit a-la Assault Termies or Nob Bikers, rate of fire issues to deal with infantry hordes/multiple targets, and mobility or lack thereof).

Your list certainly could and likely would work 'as-is,' but it faces that key Scoring Unit issue.

As an aside, I can't comment on Irisado's "essay length yet comprehensive comment" because it's been a while since I've had the chance to sit down for two hours.  All joking aside, they have their challenges but can be used with great efficiency is used wisely.  I never fail to field a squad with Embold-lock, largely to support my Wraithlord(s).  It is what it is.

;francois

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 7, 2011, 12:38:20 PM
having never faced assault termies with their 3++ save or nob bikers how would you suggest dealing with them...

and second question how would this list deal with them?

I plan on running a number of practice games where I can replicate certain units such as those mentioned, and face against an army of poisoned attacks to see how this list which historically relies on its high toughness fares.

Im just wondering that if I dropped the dragons, would it spare up enough points for a squad of avengers or Guardians??  BTW i have the capability to field both guardian defenders or storm guardians.


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 7, 2011, 01:27:23 PM
Honestly, I can't seem to find myself to use Guardians be they Defenders or Storm, although I have fully used and abused my Wraithguards. Army composition-type either I have my Wraiths or not I'd rather make my opponent cry foul due to firepower plus mobility or resilience.

With all kinds of units at my disposal, I still have a rough time with Assault Termies, but no matter what my default in dealing with them is Storm of Fury style, i.e. open the vehicle and just keep shooting till they all gone.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 7, 2011, 04:35:44 PM
I guess it will just be a case of making them take enough saves until they eventually fail enough of them, maybe 2 units of bladestorming avengers backing up the Wraithguard would do the trick.

At the end of the day, i am the sort who will sacrifice efficiency for character, I am thouroughly an Iyanden player, not having a troop choice of 10 WG is not an option for me. Even if it may restrict what other options i have at my disposal.

I also want to present as good looking an army as possible and after digging up my old guardians and seeing how they were painted has put me a little off the idea of using them :P

I may have to buy another bpx of Dire Avengers and play test the crap out of them and my fire dragons... im used to the list that i have put up but i have never used 2 footslogging units of DA in a game before :S
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 7, 2011, 05:24:39 PM
Quote from: Valar on June  7, 2011, 04:35:44 PM
At the end of the day, i am the sort who will sacrifice efficiency for character, I am thouroughly an Iyanden player, not having a troop choice of 10 WG is not an option for me. Even if it may restrict what other options i have at my disposal.

Good for you! I like to see people with a little heart behind the game. There are enough rules lawyers and cheese meisters around in my opinion. (most of them tend to be snotty 'nagers, I must be getting old...)

Troops choice Wraithguard it is with supporting Dire Avengers.
Give us a sneak peak at the updated list. 


As for Assault Terminators. S6 spam, spam and more spam. Force the saves, they have to fail at some point.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 8, 2011, 04:31:45 AM
This is the way I see it...

I can either...

drop the fire dragons and replace with a cheap unit of Dire Avengers and have 2 units of DA running around in waveserpents (keeps 3 WS in the list)

Keep the fire dragons, but drop the wave serpent that the current squad of DA are in, and use those  points to buy a second squad of Dire Avengers (drops to 2 Wave serpents in the list)

I wont post the revised list until i've worked out which option.  Both options have their advantages and disadvantages which I think would be helpful if we discussed.

I will keep you all informed when i start the play testing and see how the list performs. will do write ups of each practice game.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 8, 2011, 06:12:31 AM
If it were me I'd go for the second option. The Wraithguard really need some close support. the last thing you want is to be bogged down in CC by a throwaway gaunt hoarde or scarab swarms.

This does only leave you with 2 Serpents which is not ideal though.....


As an aside do you find the Holo-fields on the Prisms necessary?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 8, 2011, 10:00:38 AM
The holofields are what make our tanks survivable, without them they are merely AV12 targets.  I would be very reluctant to lose the holo fields because these have saved my bacon so many times, i know they eat up 70 points but if the tanks survive the game they can more than easily make their points back i find :)

I cant myself decide between my 2 options, i see the disadvantages in both and struggle to justify losing the Fire Dragons, maybe its just im stuck in my ways but the dragons have always served me well... apart from one rather memorable occasion when they killed 9 of 10 necrons only to have 8 of them stand back up through res orb to rapid fire and kill all but 1 of my dragons who then fled :( tough luck eh?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 8, 2011, 12:12:53 PM
That isn't tough luck that is the stuff of legends! albeit for the other guy, not you. I'm sure he's still telling that story.

But I think I suggested option 2, namely...

Quote from: Valar on June  8, 2011, 04:31:45 AM
Keep the fire dragons, but drop the wave serpent that the current squad of DA are in, and use those  points to buy a second squad of Dire Avengers (drops to 2 Wave serpents in the list)

Another thing just hit me, Tank Hunters and Fire Pike? not the usual set up but this works for you?
I tend to think that a unit whose standard gun is a melta weapon shouldn't need any help with tank hunters. If it don't blow in the turn you shoot, it ain't meant to be  8) Of course you can always assault with the melta bombs! (a lot of people forget about the melta bombs)

But I guess you and I play Dragons differently.

Holo-fields I find too expensive on the Prisms. I normally make sure one is always obscured and the other one gets a cover save. I twin link the beams almost all the time. Only when facing Nid hordes (or if I ever face the Gweeen Tide!) do I shoot both pie plates.

Back on topic, I'd go for keeping the dragons, having 1 DA squad assist them in the mech wing and the other on foot supporting the GUARD.

This will leave your Mech wing vulnerable though. Lose one of those Serpents and your battle plan will start to unravel.


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 8, 2011, 01:09:18 PM
Quote from: Arquarian on June  8, 2011, 12:12:53 PM
That isn't tough luck that is the stuff of legends! albeit for the other guy, not you. I'm sure he's still telling that story.

But I think I suggested option 2, namely...

Quote from: Valar on June  8, 2011, 04:31:45 AM
Keep the fire dragons, but drop the wave serpent that the current squad of DA are in, and use those  points to buy a second squad of Dire Avengers (drops to 2 Wave serpents in the list)

Another thing just hit me, Tank Hunters and Fire Pike? not the usual set up but this works for you?
I tend to think that a unit whose standard gun is a melta weapon shouldn't need any help with tank hunters. If it don't blow in the turn you shoot, it ain't meant to be  8) Of course you can always assault with the melta bombs! (a lot of people forget about the melta bombs)

But I guess you and I play Dragons differently.

Holo-fields I find too expensive on the Prisms. I normally make sure one is always obscured and the other one gets a cover save. I twin link the beams almost all the time. Only when facing Nid hordes (or if I ever face the Gweeen Tide!) do I shoot both pie plates.

Back on topic, I'd go for keeping the dragons, having 1 DA squad assist them in the mech wing and the other on foot supporting the GUARD.

This will leave your Mech wing vulnerable though. Lose one of those Serpents and your battle plan will start to unravel.

The only real reason that i run the fire pike is because i thought it looked the cooler of the 2 weapons on the exarch.  Tankhunters i can do without i dont mind dropping that as you are right you can assault with the melta bombs, and i hadnt forgotten that :P

You mention it there, and this is why im reluctant to drop the 3rd serpent, with 2 if they start to go down then the synergy that i depend on starts to fall apart, battle plans fail and the army can get picked apart unit by unit. 

Im thinking perhaps if i drop both holofields, tank hunters and find some extra savings throughout the list then perhaps i can find enough points to squeeze in a unit of DA without dropping anything~??? i mean just those 3 things save 85 points already, there must be more fat to trim elsewhere... can you see any?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on June 8, 2011, 01:14:24 PM
Just on the specific matter of the Firepike, apart from the fact that it looks great, it actually can be used opportunistically.  When combined with Crack Shot, you can use it to snipe vehicles which have fired smoke, or skimmers which have moved flat, while the extra half range can catch out an opponent from time to time.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 8, 2011, 01:18:48 PM
You know, i had never thought about using crack shot like that.... thats genius and oh soo obvious now that you have mentioned it, im kicking myself for not having thought of it sooner.

I'd love to have some thought on this list from you Irisado if you'd care to contemplate it :)

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on June 8, 2011, 01:36:14 PM
Quote from: Valar on June  8, 2011, 01:18:48 PM
You know, i had never thought about using crack shot like that.... thats genius and oh soo obvious now that you have mentioned it, im kicking myself for not having thought of it sooner.

It's an idea that I picked up through a discussion with somebody else here, but I can't remember who now.  It occurred during some kind of brainstorming session about ways in which the Firepike is useful, because, on paper, it doesn't look that useful, but in practice, there are some ways to make it pay off for you.  It's also not an expensive upgrade at all, so even if you don't manage to make much use of it, you don't have to fork out a lot of points for it.

Quote
I'd love to have some thought on this list from you Irisado if you'd care to contemplate it :)

You have to remember that Wraith lists are not my speciality, and I'm not a tournament player in any way, but I'll offer some suggestions:

On the whole, I think that the list is pretty solid.  I like the idea of all the low toughness units being protected by Wave Serpents, as this renders a significant proportion of small arms fire redundant in the opening turns.  While, therefore, there are attractions to adding supporting infantry units, such as Guardians and Striking Scorpions, you would need to add both units, and possibly two Guardian units, in order to have enough low toughness models to prevent one unit from being hammered by focused fire through being the only low toughness unit not mounted inside a transport.

Fire Prisms are a bit hit and miss in my view.  If you're using them to carpet bomb infantry, then they should work well, but their accuracy is questionable for an anti-tank role.  As for the upgrades, I don't think that Holofields or Spirit Stones are particularly necessary, but in my case, this comes from the idea of the carrot.  By dangling the carrot of Fire Prisms without upgrades in front of your opponent, the plan is to get him/her to target them with multiple heavy weapons, and give your Wave Serpents a much easier time.  This is more likely to succeed if your Prisms inflict a substantial amount of damage early in the game, so think about targeting units that they should be able to blow significant holes in early on if you want this idea to have a chance of working.  There is no guarantee that it will work, but it's an idea you way wish to experiment with.

The final points are all relatively short, and are as follows:

1. I'm not convinced that one Brightlance is really worth it.  If you think that you need Brightlances, I suggest taking two.

2. Giving the Fire Dragon squad's Wave Serpent anything more than a Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stones gives your opponent more reasons to shoot at it.  Given how high a priority target it is likely to be, I don't recommend that you mount two weapons on it.

3. The Dire Avenger Exarch needs Defend if they're going to act as assault support for the Howling Banshees, or act as a pinning unit.  It's far too useful an upgrade to pass up in my experience.  The alternative is to replace the Power Weapon and Shimmershield with the Dual Avenger Catapults and go for the shooting only option.

4. The choice between the Mirrorswords and Executioner is difficult, but I prefer the latter, as it means that the unit is less dependent on Doom, which can be useful if you want to try to win a combat in your opponent's turn (in which case you would not normally cast Doom on the target unit), rather than your own.

I hope that helps.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 10, 2011, 05:43:08 AM
Cheers Irisado, some of what you said really made sense with me.

The waveserpents protecting the low toughness is why i am soo very reluctant to lose any waveserpents, i have had experience like you say of having 1 unit of DA unprotected and they just get blasted out of the game... what a waste!

The fire prisms i tend to use to shoot up infantry units and big gribblies, in desperate times i will target them at tanks but that again is why im soo reluctant to lose the FD in favor of more DA...  they add such a vital reliable anti tank unit, i can count on these to remove 1 tank per turn approx which i cant count on the fire prism to do.

Brightlance dropped, i have 2 WS with Missile launcher and shuri cannon upgrade... FD loadout i was thinking shuricannon turret, shuri catapult underslung, its cheap and it should reduce their target priority a little.

Thinking about it defend would be very useful should the DA act in a support role of the WG.  Reducing each models attacks by 1 would really help the WG out with tarpitting the unit and slowly munching through them...  unfortunately i dont have anything in this list to deal with single powerfists hidden in squads which would cause no end of problems for the WG.... perhaps if i drop the holofields and some other upgrades here and there i could pick up a cheap farseer with mindwar.


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on June 10, 2011, 07:13:11 AM
Quote from: Valar on June  7, 2011, 12:38:20 PM
having never faced assault termies with their 3++ save or nob bikers how would you suggest dealing with them...

and second question how would this list deal with them?

I plan on running a number of practice games where I can replicate certain units such as those mentioned, and face against an army of poisoned attacks to see how this list which historically relies on its high toughness fares.

Im just wondering that if I dropped the dragons, would it spare up enough points for a squad of avengers or Guardians??  BTW i have the capability to field both guardian defenders or storm guardians.

Sorry it took so long ot get back on this one.  Real life has literally taken over my life in the past 2 months.

Some points about Nob Bikers and most other 'Death Star' units out there.  Most are high Toughness, heavy armour backed with an Invul save or FNP for kicks and giggles.  Most have good mobility and use multi-wound shenanigans to compensate for wounds taken.  Most armies have their own way of dealing with them, be it tar pits, their own 'Death Star' unit, etc.  Eldar have a number of options.  Lots of S6 fire forces lots of saves, in which the weight of odds will come to bear, eventually.  Eldar mobility is pretty key, allowing you to manoeuvre away/around/through.  The problem with Wraithwalls is that they are vulnerable to these units for a number of reasons.  Low mobility means they can't get away.  Low number of attacks means that even if they strike first in Initiative order, they have relatively few non-power weapon attacks.  High Toughness helps but more times than not you're facing powerfists/klaws/poison/'power weapons' (including Eldar singing spears etc), which still likely wounds and kills on a 2+.

The key to using WG (with or without WL support) is to ensure that your supporting units are available and ready to interdict or assist as soon as they hit these units.  Common tactical teaching says never hit enemy strengths with your own strongest unit hoping for the best.  WG aren't by any stretch a 'DS' unit, for the reasons I've explained above.  But you don't need your own to counter them.  Skimmers make great blocking units (this takes practise) as they escort the WG up the field, blocking assault lanes, etc.  DS unit in a Land Raider?  Lance it or sacrifice the FD to get them into the open.  Nob Bikers?  Whittle them down in shooting and try your hand with the Banshees.  My personal unit for dealing with Nob Bikers has always been 6 Warp Spiders, Exarch included.  I also keep my Harlies near to the WG.

These are all great on paper, yet rather useless until you try putting it into practise and see if/what works for you.  Off-hand, the list has the ability to 'handle' DS units.  The only issue is that you've limited yourself to 2 Scoring Units, both of which are by design committed to moving up the field to engage the enemy.  Some guys are perfectly fine with this, notably Marine-based armies, but they get to split some of their squads as required.  For Eldar it may require a little more refinement at army comp stages.  This is particularly true if playing Capture and Control.  From the looks of the list, I'd be thinking you were abandoning your own Objective to force my hand on my own; if not, you're leaving the WG, a huge points investment, sitting out of the battle.

You've haad some other great advise regarding your list thusfar.  Give the list a shot.  I'm firmly of the opinion that the list is largely an extension of the player.  I won't slag a list because I wouldn't see myself getting much out of it.  It's a composite thing, the player being the last and often forgotten component.  Wraith armies are a particular and oft-times peculiar breed.  Their players are not too far from that mark (myself definitely included).   ;)

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on June 10, 2011, 07:58:04 AM
Quote from: Valar on June 10, 2011, 05:43:08 AM
Thinking about it defend would be very useful should the DA act in a support role of the WG.  Reducing each models attacks by 1 would really help the WG out with tarpitting the unit and slowly munching through them...

Remember that Defend only applies to attacks against the Dire Avengers, not against other models fighting in the same combat, so it wouldn't directly benefit the Wraithguard.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 10, 2011, 08:53:08 AM
I'm guessing the DA will be in close support of the WG but and here's a question. and sorry I don't have the codex to hand right now but

If the DA and the WG were both engaged with an enemy unit would defend affect the enemy in base contasct or only against attacks nominated against the DA??

A bit of a moot point as the whole point of the Defend enabled DAs is to keep the WG out of CC. Something which really shouldn't be too much of a problem as the DA are more mobile (thanks to fleet) than the WG.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on June 10, 2011, 09:06:10 AM
Quote from: Arquarian on June 10, 2011, 08:53:08 AM
If the DA and the WG were both engaged with an enemy unit would defend affect the enemy in base contasct or only against attacks nominated against the DA??

That's clearly answered in the entry for Defend in the codex, and the forum rules don't allow me to quote it directly, but if you look at my post above, it should give you a pretty good answer to your question until you get a chance to look at your codex  :).
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 10, 2011, 09:13:04 AM
Yep, I thought it might. I'll have a look tonight but I'm sure it was a base to base issue rather than allocation of attacks but Irasado, you are quite reliable in these matters.  Still I'll have a look ion the Codex tonight and get a beetr understanding of the matter (as clearly I'm lacking)

However, its still a moot point don't you think?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Orannis on June 14, 2011, 10:18:24 AM
Following a recent splurge on wraith goodies I'm trying to put together a new list. I realise it's unlikely to be that competetive but I hope it's not completely naff. Let me know what you think.

HQ

Eldrad 210

Yriel 155

Troops

10x Wraithguard
Sprit Seer w/ Conceal 396

10x Wraithguard
Spirit Seer w/ Conceal 396

Heavy Support

Wraithlord w/ SL 110

Wraithlord w/ SL 110

Wraithlord w/ SL 110

Total: 1487

Main drawbacks I can see is lack of ranged anti tank coupled with slow footslogging and getting bogged down in CC. What are your thought guys?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on June 14, 2011, 12:11:25 PM
Unless you're fighting Cityfight rules, this list has some serious issues; namely lack of manoeuvre, lack of firepower, and to a certain degree wraithsight.

Eldrad and Yriel are two heavy-point choices for 1500 points.  I'd limit it to one or the other, better yet just a bare bones farseer.  You don't have the points to spend on two characters.

Wraith Units:  5 Wraith Units in a 1500 point list is overkill.  For fun games, sure, why the heck not.  You'd likely be best limited to something like 1 Wraith Unit per 500 points, or 1 at 1000 points plus 1 per 500 points thereafter.  If terrain is sparse, I'd say Conceal will do you well enough, but Enhance would be better served with a decent terrain set-up and supporting units screening incoming fire.  On that note, you have pretty much a 6 inch movement phase.  Any army with separation and a fireline will need 2-3 turns of shooting to take care of most everything.  If mobile, they simply play keep away.  If choppy, they can swarm pretty easily - envision playing a Nid/Ork swarm, one big scrum in the middle somewhere.

Supporting Units:  There are 4 areas you need to consider when army list building.  For Iyanden players, this is a concious effort and pretty much a do-or-die checklist.  Address the following:  lack of manoeuvre/mobility; lack of dedicated CC ability (no, the WLs do not count, even with a wraithsword); lack of firepower (high strength, long range, AT, particularly number of shots/turn); wraithsight.

I won't say the list won't work, may even be a fun list to run.  Does it suffer from some frightening short-comings?  <shrug>  I'd have to say yes, but don't let that stop you!  ;)

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on June 14, 2011, 06:11:08 PM
Quote from: Orannis on June 14, 2011, 10:18:24 AM
Following a recent splurge on wraith goodies I'm trying to put together a new list. I realise it's unlikely to be that competetive but I hope it's not completely naff. Let me know what you think.

HQ

Eldrad 210

Yriel 155

Troops

10x Wraithguard
Sprit Seer w/ Conceal 396

10x Wraithguard
Spirit Seer w/ Conceal 396

Heavy Support

Wraithlord w/ SL 110

Wraithlord w/ SL 110

Wraithlord w/ SL 110

Total: 1487

Main drawbacks I can see is lack of ranged anti tank coupled with slow footslogging and getting bogged down in CC. What are your thought guys?

Eldrad is an Ulthwe special character. So unless you plan to use him as a counts as you should probably go with a normal Farseer. It will also save you a lot of points to get extra goodies on the Wraithlords.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Orannis on June 15, 2011, 03:06:42 PM
Thanks for the feedback guys.

I took Eldrad for the double fortune on the concealed wraithguard. Yriel was really there because I:
 a) needed at least one person who could do some damage in combat but I couldn't afford a decent harlequin squad
 b) fluff

I appreciate that it's way overkill to have two characters in a list this size and drawing from f.desrochers comments about addressing the weaknesses in the list I've made a new one. I'm loathe to put any wave serpents in because if I did I could only afford one or two and I think they'd be the focus of too much fire and would be shot down early leaving my force splintered. Instead of using transports I've put in other footsloggers and more manourverable infantry.

HQ
Farseer
RoW
Fortune (Doom may be more appropriate now) - 100

Troops

10 Wraithguard
Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396

6 Guardian Jetbikes
Warlock w/ jetbike and embolden - 182

Elites

8x Harlequins w/ kisses and Shadowseer - 206

Fast attack

7x Warp Spiders
Exarch /w Dual spinners - 171

HS

Wraithlord /w BL - 130

Wraithlord /w BL - 130

3x War walkers /w SL - 180

Total  - 1500 on the nose.

This has a good mix of units which I THINK deal with all the issues and keeps a somewhat Iyanden theme throughout. I'd stress I'm not looking for a tourney list, just something that won't get decimated every game and provides a challenging play.

'Quins hang behind WG and pop out if anything trys to assault.
WW can outflank or just hang back and shoot.
Spiders can DS and harry any exposed flanks
Long range AT with WL and close range with WG
My main concern is the GJB. Bit fragile and only picked them as they are mobile and can be hidden to be used as last minute objective grabbers or to hold my own in cover.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Aireoth on June 15, 2011, 06:04:13 PM
Your going to get a challenge, I've played a very similar list locally (albeit 1750pts) and regularly get my bum handed to me on a silver platter. Wraithguard are just too many points tied up in one unit, plus the lack of objective holders are going to hurt you. Lords have always been ok, not great, but ok. My walker wing is spectacular same config as yours. I dual farseer. Field dire avengers on foot, with bladestorm, and shield them as I move up. It isn't perfect, but 18" range 3 shots helps even things out before the CC.

You need fortune for the guard, or they will die in droves.

Your trying to be a bit of a gun line, and your going to get out shot by almost every other army. Wraith guard will get one good turn of firing if your prepared, then be in CC. I like the theme, but I think your going to get tabled by anyone fielding Angels, Wolves, or a decent IG list.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on June 15, 2011, 07:02:44 PM
Quote
HQ
Farseer
RoW
Fortune (Doom may be more appropriate now) - 100

Troops

10 Wraithguard
Spiritseer w/ Conceal - 396

6 Guardian Jetbikes
Warlock w/ jetbike and embolden - 182

Elites

8x Harlequins w/ kisses and Shadowseer - 206

Fast attack

7x Warp Spiders
Exarch /w Dual spinners - 171

HS

Wraithlord /w BL - 130

Wraithlord /w BL - 130

3x War walkers /w SL - 180

Total  - 1500 on the nose.


I'd say you have the basis for a solid enough list to have some really fun games.  Dependant on your playstyle and the terrain, you should be able to advance to midfield and really engage enemy units.  The only real change you should look at is swapping a Warp Spider and get yourself two shuricans for the GJB squad.  They remain fragile, but now they have some teeth. as well.

Take it for a whirl for a few games without changing the list to see how things work out for you.  I'd be interested to see how things go.

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Orannis on June 16, 2011, 04:43:26 PM
Once again cheers for the input guys.

I realise anything involving wraithguard is going to prove a challenging play, especially at lower points levels. I can see what you mean about having to make a much more concious effort to build a synergised list, WG are not one of these units you can just shoehorn into a standard list and expect it to work. I'll get myself some harlequin models and let you know how it goes!

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 23, 2011, 02:29:02 PM
Playing a full Ghost Army takes a lot of patience and on-the-go-tactics. There's much fear and frustrations that would come from your opponent; you should take advantage of it and feed on it as it will help you, for him to make much mistake.

Ghost Army = Mainly a wraith army with the minor add-ons like farseers, maybe an autarch (highly doubtful but been done before), warlocks and spiritseers.

Patience = foot-slogging army

Fear and frustrations = your opponent having problems trying to do much damage to just 1 unit let alone multiple units of wraithcannons

So just have fun, you don't have to use it in competetions, if you do you're the under dog and could win it because everyone isn't expecting it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on June 24, 2011, 09:01:33 AM
Avengers with full tarpitting equipment is still a good combination with Wraithguard, regardless, because it presents two undesirable choices to your opponent.  They can either swing at the very tough Wraithguard, or attack the seemingly softer Dire Avengers but lose a major portion of their attacks to do so.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 30, 2011, 07:08:03 PM
Hello all,

Since I have plenty of time in my hands at the moment, I've been thinking of using this list for a surprise appearance;

Strike of Wrath

HQ
Na'Nular [Eldrad equivalent]
Farseer Irlan [85] Fortune

Troops
Dire Avengers x10 [162] Exarch, PW+SS, Defend
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone
Dire Avengers x10 [162] Exarch, PW+SS, Defend
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal

Elite
Howling Banshees x10 [187] Exarch, Executioner, Acrobatic
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone

Heavy
AT- Lord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
AT- Lord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
AT- Lord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML

Total = 2498

- Hard units in the center to threaten anything everything who wants melee combat.
- With so many range AT, it should cripple Land Raider Armies.
- 13 KP at this point level and everything will be hard press into doing concentrated fire as soon as possible be to try and suppress my Fortune capability.
- I don't really have anti horde other than mitigate the most powerful entity with Mind War. Or get them hit by wraithcannons. Or my dual-flamers from my AT-Lords.

Please check if I may have forgetten something to think or rethink of something in this list. Thanks in advance. Yes this will be used in the local tourney and train for possible Ard Boyz.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 4, 2011, 09:44:45 AM
It's a solid list but at this points level if you face Orks or Nids then I'd say with some certainty there will be a hoarde element to their army which you're going to struggle against.

The guy with the Geanstealer army will *LOVE* you. All those juicy high toughness units to rend.

That aside I think you will strike the fear of God in most if not all IG and Marine Armies.

A hunkered down Tau Gun line is going to be pretty difficult for you also. They'll take out the Serpents and then concentrate firs on the next nearest thing.

Have your thought about the Wraithseer?? One of his powers greatly assists in moving I believe. Then again if you're playing in a tournement who you be alowed to use him...

I'd be very interested to see how this works out...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on July 4, 2011, 10:19:34 AM
I thought you all might appreciate a look at these on this thread.

This is a group shot of the 5 skimmers that I am running in my 1750 list for the 40ko tournament this August.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FP1010527.jpg&hash=4b42b1ec0dff84349beaf4757253d50eaffa62e7)

I have another fire prism to add to these, a 3rd WraithLord (unsure which armament to go with here) and 2 revenenant titans to add next month.  Im slowly working my way towards a force that I can use for some Apocalypse battles.  Ive never played Apoc before.

I eventually plan to add 3 night spinners and 3 warp hunters from FW to this list.

After that I think i will wait a little while before I start adding more troops since I desperately want new models for jetbikes and wraithguard before I expand further.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 4, 2011, 10:47:59 AM
Quote from: Arquarian on July  4, 2011, 09:44:45 AM
It's a solid list but at this points level if you face Orks or Nids then I'd say with some certainty there will be a hoarde element to their army which you're going to struggle against.
Thanks, so far the list of armies 1 Nids, 2 Orks, 1 Tau, 2 Guards and the rest are 7x MEQs plus my Eldar.

Quote from: Arquarian on July  4, 2011, 09:44:45 AM
The guy with the Geanstealer army will *LOVE* you. All those juicy high toughness units to rend.

That aside I think you will strike the fear of God in most if not all IG and Marine Armies.
I know the guy also has Ymgarls in his list, so we'll see.

Quote from: Arquarian on July  4, 2011, 09:44:45 AM
A hunkered down Tau Gun line is going to be pretty difficult for you also. They'll take out the Serpents and then concentrate firs on the next nearest thing.
Not afraid of this fool, since he has played against me and seen mainly my Aspect Warriors and he's trully afraid of Wraithcannons.

Quote from: Arquarian on July  4, 2011, 09:44:45 AM
Have your thought about the Wraithseer?? One of his powers greatly assists in moving I believe. Then again if you're playing in a tournement who you be alowed to use him...

I'd be very interested to see how this works out...
Unfortunately, Wraithseer isn't allowed in the tourney.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 4, 2011, 11:07:51 AM
Quote from: Arquarian on July  4, 2011, 09:44:45 AM
Have your thought about the Wraithseer?? One of his powers greatly assists in moving I believe. Then again if you're playing in a tournement who you be alowed to use him...

I'd be very interested to see how this works out...
Unfortunately, Wraithseer isn't allowed in the tourney.
[/quote]

 :(  :(  :(

D-cannon nastyness would have been fun....

Still good luck. Where is the tourney taking place?? at 2500 points that going to be an Epic long day....
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 4, 2011, 02:36:19 PM
We'll find out, since it's on 16th from 10AM - 8PM, at least that's the time block for all tables and according to what I heard they have all 16 spots filled.

So we'll figure it our soon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: beltenebros on July 14, 2011, 05:23:00 PM
Quote from: Valar on July  4, 2011, 10:19:34 AM

This is a group shot of the 5 skimmers that I am running in my 1750 list for the 40ko tournament this August.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fd199%2Fmarvinio%2FP1010527.jpg&hash=4b42b1ec0dff84349beaf4757253d50eaffa62e7)


beauty! very nice paint job - i find yellow very difficult to work with! love em! would like to see your wraithlords ...

Edit: For your consideration ...

My first foray in to the 'Iyanden' craftworld. Very much a fan of the WG/WL models ... in fact that is what got me to start an eldar force. Also, I like using units no one else seems to find value in (pooping hawks)...

My 1500 pt list.

HQ - Yriel (155)

HQ - Farseer Beltenebros [Eldrad equivalent] (210)

TROOP - 10 Wraithguard, Spiritseer w/Conceal (396)

TROOP - 5 Pathfinders (120)

TROOP - 5 Pathfinders (120)

FAST - 8 Swooping Hawks, Exarch w/Sunrifle, Skyleap, Intercept (215)

HEAVY - Wraithlord w/Bright Lance, 2xFlamer (130)

HEAVY - Wraithlord w/Bright Lance, EML, 2xFlamer (155)

Total: 1501

Feedback appreciated ...

Please don't double post. A modify button is ready and waiting the call of duty.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 14, 2011, 06:08:57 PM
Nice list, very few folks that I know uses Pathfinders with wraiths. I'm intrigued by your fast attack being Swooping Hawks rather than Warp Spiders. Between the 2 the spiders last longer in the field than hawks.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 15, 2011, 08:30:30 AM
I use Swooping hawks in my Iyanden Eldar, my current 1000pt list is:
Farseer with guide, Runes of Warding and Singing spear 109pts
6 Wraithguard with spiritseer with conceal with singing spear 259pts
10 Dire Avengers including exarch with defend, power weapon and Shimmersheild 162pts
3 Gaurdian Jetbikes with shurikan cannon 76pts
5 Swooping Hawks including Exarch with Hawks Talon 127pts
Wraithlord with Brightlance, Eldar Missile launcher, shurikan catapult and flamer 155pts
Wraithlord with Eldar missile launcher and 2 flamers 115pts
total:997pts
And so far My Hawks have done well each game, I find them paticually good in objective games, their rate of fire, even with s3 and their grenades being enought to either kill or brake an objective holding troop unit  :)
EDIT:Has anyone else had success with wraithswords on lord in non avatar list? Also, what are the opinions of the different options on the lords in an Iyanden force? I already use bright lance+eml as a tank hunter, but was thinking of either EML with Starcannon or Starcannon with Scattler laser for transport and marine hunting (the S6 good for transports, the AP2 and number of shots being good against marines.) Whilst swords look cool, only 2 attacks on th wraithlord does hamper the usefulness I think
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 15, 2011, 06:14:04 PM
IF you like Hawks and have success then use them, I did state I was intrigued that is all.  ;)

As for wraithswords, yes I have used them and successfully destroyed a few monoliths and LRCs with them due to the reroll.

Wraithlords are used either as infantry mower or AT not multi-role.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 16, 2011, 08:49:04 AM
So EML+Brightlance for anti tank duty, and would Scatter laser+Star cannon be good against infantry? both have range 36", S6, and the starcannon can kill marines and termis from a further distence then wraithguns, the number of shots from the scatter laser should force a fair few saves as well, whilst agianst hoardes both have enought shots to maul cut their number down, and their range+S means in a pinch they can be used to target transports, I feel the wraithseer may make the starcannon on wraithlords good since it inflicts a penalty on cover saves from wraith shooting ;D .
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 16, 2011, 10:21:00 AM
This is MY list of Wraithlord load-outs:

Default: (IF am not using specialty lords this is the load-out.)

Wraithlord - Flamer x2, Scatter Laser + Starcannon

Yes, this is a great infantry mower 36" range and moving forward this gives you 2 - 3 salvo and then engage in melee.

AT-lord - BL + EML

Sword-lord - Wraithblade + any weapon

Wraithseers = only used in friendly games not in competetive games. The D-Cannon would be devestating.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 20, 2011, 05:15:10 PM
any advice for Iyanden in escalation leugues? (not sure on that spelling) It's staring at 500pts and my idea is:
farseer Valindil Kyouraku with Guide and runes of warding 100pts
Dire avengers 5: 60pts
Gaurdian jetbikes 3 66pts
Wraithlord with EML and Brightlance 155pts
Wraithlord with Scatterlaser 110pts
485pts
any advice for this pts level?
I also may have a 1000pts game against a necorn player (either that or a 1500pt game with my thousand sons :P ) but I would like to use my Eldar for it, but am wondering, what's the best things for countering necron? I only have 6 wraithgaurd (I have had bad luck on ebay recently :( )
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 20, 2011, 05:32:59 PM
You better recheck all the point value for your league, since Iyanden or Ghost Armies will not fit in your point value as it is.

I barely got it done in my escalation where 750 pts base + a 500 pts + a 250 pts blocks. Of course in this point value it can be done properly.

I suggest to make block values on what you can have in your idea about your army then solidy it.

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 20, 2011, 05:15:10 PM
any advice for Iyanden in escalation leugues? (not sure on that spelling) It's staring at 500pts and my idea is:
farseer Valindil Kyouraku with Guide and runes of warding 100pts
Dire avengers 5: 60pts
Gaurdian jetbikes 3 66pts
Wraithlord with EML and Brightlance 155pts
Wraithlord with Scatterlaser 110pts
485pts
any advice for this pts level?
I also may have a 1000pts game against a necorn player (either that or a 1500pt game with my thousand sons :P ) but I would like to use my Eldar for it, but am wondering, what's the best things for countering necron? I only have 6 wraithgaurd (I have had bad luck on ebay recently :( )

Get rid of the jetbikes
add 4 more DA and the second Wraithlord a Starcannon.

Countering Necrons you use CC (Howling Banshees) and kill the Necron Lords and anything that has the word Necron leave some of the rest.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Looshkin on July 20, 2011, 08:50:28 PM
Quote from: haunt on July 20, 2011, 05:32:59 PM
Get rid of the jetbikes
add 4 more DA and the second Wraithlord a Starcannon.

Countering Necrons you use CC (Howling Banshees) and kill the Necron Lords and anything that has the word Necron leave some of the rest.

I may be totally wrong here, but he may need the jetbikes as a 2nd troop choice. If the FoC is being ignored, then I agree with your suggestion to drop them.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 20, 2011, 10:36:38 PM
My apologies I meant to just get another set of DA, but I did state to find out more about the actual rules since I don't think its just 500 points.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 21, 2011, 02:08:50 AM
It is 500pts, standed FOC, several other players as well as me (necrons, chaos, and other eldar players) have asked if the FOC could be lifted for 500pts, but no, the FOC in place, I have a bad feeling the 500pt level will see a lot of various loyalist marine victories .....  mind you it's going up to 1500pts in about 3-4 weeks, have no idea how I will be able to afford the wraithgaurd for it...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 21, 2011, 07:20:03 AM
At 1500 points level I find a squad of 5 Guard with accompanying Warlock ( I give him Enhance but Destructor is probably a better option) in a Wave serpent really frustrates enemies when you out flank them.

This requires them toi divert a part of their offensive force to nullify your guard. There are obvious drawbacks as this squad is expensive and of course vulnerable to massed CC attacks. I add a special character in here, normally Yriel but I'm toying with the idea of a Phoenix lord; Jain Zhar or Maugan Ra,  to take his place (damn that T3 and insta death). 

This is a bit of a points sink and the rest of your army has to benefot this plan. It is fun though, if not terribly competative.....

I wouldn't even consider using a unit of Wraithguard until 1500 points to be honest.
At 500 points I'd say you can go one of two ways:
Biel Tan-esq Aspect warrior heavy lead by an Autarch
or Ulthwe-esq, cheap seer and guardian heavy.

dependant on your play style really.....
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 21, 2011, 09:00:34 AM
That hampers things. I'll post an old 500 point army of mine.

Farseer - RoWard, Fortune

DA x5 - Exarch
+ WS - TL ShurCan, Stone
DA x5 - Exarch
+ WS - TL EML, Stone

This should help as base units and modified later. No wraiths of either kind, since the points value mitigates due to cost of the wraithguards.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 21, 2011, 04:56:00 PM
hmmm, you've not got may troops, obviously and a SMurf squad with a missile launcher is going to ruin your day.

if you're going down the Aspect warrior route I'd plumb for troops a little more hardy. Scorps have a decent save, as do Reapers, who at this points level do well. a stand alone squad of three will serve well against a foot slogging Marine player. 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 22, 2011, 03:20:55 AM
problem, when it comes to heavy support, I love wraithlords and tanks (especially the warp hunter, really want one.) but am htinking of getting some scorpians (love the models) but am looking on ebay for metal, I prefere it, and the new finecast ones are very expensive for the chance of miscat and air bubbles.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 22, 2011, 04:28:20 AM
Firstly if you get a duff Finecast model simply take it back to the GW shop and they'll replace it.
We may all be-atch and maon about their 'coroprate' outlook but they do have very high quality standards and I've always found that they will replace faulty minis.

Wraithlords will kill in smaller games as many armies will lack enough firepower to take them down.
The Warp hunter is a great model I'll be wanting one of those <That's a hint for you Father Christmass>

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 22, 2011, 06:10:49 AM
has anyone had experience with a warp hunter in Inyanden forces? I imagine warp hunter with holo feilds, 2 wraithlords and a wraithseer and a unit of 10 wraithgaurd with spirti seer could be hard for most opponents to deal with.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 22, 2011, 08:20:33 AM
Unless you're playing over 2000 points its going to be difficult to put a credible army on the field like that. We're talking almost 800 points in those 5 units already.

I've not played witht the warp hunter (yet) but I see it as a support tank to assist in an aspect wave assault kind of role.

anyone else here have any experienve with the Warp hunter in an Iyanden army??
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 24, 2011, 03:14:55 AM
Finally fought a DE army, yet I felt it was an old army I used to play Wyches and Kabalites. The new Dex is quite vicious and easily handles my Ghosts (either WG or WL.) I'll post again soon.

PS: My Ard Boyz list came in 3rd, if I had paid more attention I could have almost came in 2nd in the warm up.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 25, 2011, 07:34:57 AM
What's the best Close combat support unit for an Iyanden force (the list is mostly foot, with perhaps a warp hunter in bigger games.)? whichever one they are I would run them right behind the wraithgaurd, and then either use them to intercept units that would assault the wraithguard, or to help the wraithguard if they get charged (they are so tougth they last, but they can't kill that much, meaning they get bogged down)Banshee's ahve power weopns, but are more fragile then scorpions, ad would have problems wounding anyone T4 or higher, and have less Attacks then the scorpions (the scorpions could try drowning 3+ save models under weight of attacks. Harliquins have an invun save, kiss and a deathjester (giving some ranged support) but only have the 5+, at the moment I am leaning towards scorpions, any advice?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on July 25, 2011, 08:50:01 AM
There are a number of factors to take into account here, but for some general remarks, I recommend that you take a look at the following threads:

Are Harlequins worth it? (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=205563.0)
Counter assault units: Comparing Striking Scorpions and Harlequins (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=196726.0)
Striking Scorpions versus Howling Banshees (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=193617.0)

Please don't post in them though, as they are all rather old.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on July 29, 2011, 12:23:59 PM
After my continued misfortune on ebay on getting more wraithguard (I may have recenty got £400, but £8.80 per model is way to much) I have been thinking of trying other troops choices if I want to do larger games, whilst at the moment I am using dire avengers and jetbikes, and having experimented with rangers, I want to know what Iyanden players think of defender gaurdians, paticually thee support weapon and warlock that should go with them. EDIT: Just thought, could the defenders use the warlocks BS skill on the weapon platforms? I know you can use them for one a weapon in a support weapon battery, but not sure onthe defender squad.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on July 29, 2011, 08:09:55 PM
Warlocks can not fire the heavy weapon in defender squads. I don't have my codex at the moment, but I believe it states something to the effect of the Guardians or the "Guardian crew? fire the weapon. A Warlock, not being a member of the "Guardian crew" or a Guardian himself means he can not fire it. I am unsure of the wording, but very sure they can not fire the weapon.

Due to their low BS, it is generally best to take a scatter laser for the higher amount of shots. Using two in unison is a decent bit of long ranged fire support.

As for the Warlock, Generally embolden is best to ensure they don't fail morale tests. Conceal can be useful if you play on tables with little terrain, but I find that unless they are in cover (4+ cover save) or being screened by another unit (walkers, wraithlords, another Guardian squad) they are not being used optimally anyway. The other powers are rather useless given a defender Guardians purpose. If you are close enough for destructor, you are close enough for assaults and will get swept away easily in CC. Guardians are terrible in the assault, and still bad with enhance (even on Storm Guardians).

TLDR version:
-Warlocks can not fire the weapon in a defender squad
-Scatter laser is generally the best weapon to take due to low BS
-Warlock should take embolden to help with morale checks on a moderate to low LD value.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on August 4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
Ah that's a shame.. had the old metal weapon platfrom with either brightlance or starcannon, but don't paticualy like the old scatter laser, so will either have to get a modern platform or try to get the modern scatter laser onto old platform..
For 1500pts, I was thinking of this list:
Farseer with Fortune and runes of warding 100pts
troops :
10 Wraithguard and spiritseer with conceal (that has saved my wraithguard so many times) 396pts
10 Dire Avengers including Exarch with power weapon ans shimmersheild with defend 162pts
3 Gaurdian Jetbikes with Shuriken Cannon 76pts
10 Guardians with scatter laser, Warlock with singing spear and Embolden 129pts
Fast Attack:
10 Swooping hawks including Exarch with Hawk's Talon and Intercept 237pts
Heavy Support:
Wraithlord with Brightlance and Eldar Missile launcher 155pts
Wraithlord with Scatter laser and Star cannon 130pts
Warp Hunter 115pts
1499pts what do you think about it?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 4, 2011, 09:03:31 AM
Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
Farseer with Fortune and runes of warding 100pts
Standard default HQ choice for Wraith-base army, I would rather get rid of the GJB and grab Eldrad and walk the Dire Avenger behind the Wraithguards for cover and Eldrad can Fortune both units.

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
troops :
10 Wraithguard and spiritseer with conceal (that has saved my wraithguard so many times) 396pts
Love using this default for my Wraithtroops the other one is with Enhance. IMHO finding cover is easier than it is to surprise your opponent in CC with an exceptionally fast and better WS unit.

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
10 Dire Avengers including Exarch with power weapon ans shimmersheild with defend 162pts
Good unit for an all-rounder, since they can tarpit TEQs and be surprised due to the invul saves in melee.

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
3 Gaurdian Jetbikes with Shuriken Cannon 76pts
Too few to really be in the open, so this becomes a hiding last minute contesting unit or also known as a pot-shot unit since it does have a Shuriken Cannon in the unit.

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
10 Guardians with scatter laser, Warlock with singing spear and Embolden 129pts
10 Guardians (D) w/ a SL platform is about the same as using a 3 GJB with the exception that you can reroll the LD due to Embolden. I had hope more Guardians and can survive a bit longer remember this guys are wearing cardboards not paper like orks.

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
Fast Attack:
10 Swooping hawks including Exarch with Hawk's Talon and Intercept 237pts
With the explosion of the new codexes I would rather suggest Warp Spiders for Torrent of Fury effect, instead of  the hit it S3 or be able to demolish LRs or LRCs, since you have wraithguards and AT Lord.

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
Heavy Support:
Wraithlord with Brightlance and Eldar Missile launcher 155pts
Good AT Lord and its a pretty common sight lately. I'm sure you're using dual flamers for both lords, right?

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
Wraithlord with Scatter laser and Star cannon 130pts
I like this standard WL as a lawn mower for a lot of things. The AP2 should reduce a small unit of TEQ.

Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on August  4, 2011, 03:21:26 AM
Warp Hunter 115pts
1499pts what do you think about it?
Not sure about this since its an IA unit and hasn't been approved to any games even in my area.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on August 4, 2011, 04:01:55 PM
yeah, both lords have twin flamers, I'm not taking Eldrad, since I am trying to be fluffy (in both him being Ulthwe, and well, dead.) plus I like farseer models as well, that's kinda my reasoning on the hawks, that and they have done me well in past games (apart form against grey knights) the jetbikes I do use tham as last minuete objective grabbers and pot shoters (several people find the eldar jetbike rule really anoying  ;D ) the main unit I was not sure on was the gaurdians, weapon and warlock abilities, might it be an idea to drop something to give him spiritseer to help support the wraithlords?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 14, 2011, 12:24:32 AM
I'm proud to tell you all that my Ghost Warrior Army placed 2nd, short summary:

Round 1: Eldar v Necron - FB (Massacre)
Round 2: Eldar v IG (Mech mainly anti SM.)- Draw +2 for both
Round 3: Eldar v Tyranids - Massacre +2

Placing was 67, 60 and 52 for the points, IF ONLY I had a Major Victory on Round 2.  ;D

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=216800.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=216800.0)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 20, 2011, 08:04:56 AM
Hi fellow Iyanden dwellers, undead and other filthy Xenos threading this consecrated POC.

Its been a while. To say the least. Ahem...

I've been reading the thread, starting with the last I posted and it looks like the POC has been alive and kicking, and this is good. New faces and old faces surfacing in, I'll see to add those who asks into the POC's list of dutiful warriors, welcome all! :)

However, real life and the dreadful unavailability of that thrice cursed device called a computer, which I was told is required to roam the internets, has made my responsive capabilities in here difficult, and, after the PC problem being solved lately, I am sad to announce that I've been out of the 40K loop for more than a year now...

Having lost (for now) the interest of playing and enjoying 40K, I hereby resign and step down from the lofty heights of Spiritseerness, and step down to be an advisable Wraithlord if/when I am online and participating.

That being said, the Spiritseer place must be filled, least predators and scummy villains try to profit from our Craftworld's apparent lack of guidance... Which is NOT the case, given the leadership and participation demonstrated by many, but for the unobservant it could very well look that way, thus.

Given my lack of input and knowledge of who is generally active and contributing, so I may be better to leave the choice of a new Spiritseer unto your capable hands. Personally, I would nominate Valar for his forthright and lingering presence in the POC and his dedication, but others may see it differently, I shall leave it up to you all.

@Valar: I am sorry about your article for moc065's Starting Up with Eldar, I didn't get to it immediately and then lost all data when my computer died, I hope you kept the article and the pics and strongly suggest you post them to moc for him to add it. ;)

@Haunt: Yes its been a while, been doing fine enough, though I got through a kind of burn out, but all's fine now, got real busy in RL, mostly dropped 40K, only allowance I made was to buy the new DE Codex for the background material, keep up the good work!

@Text color: Some of you have been raising the yellow text color issues, I'll see if I can remember how to code and change it back to something readable.

To all, keep it up and kick some Xenos' arses for me!  8)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 20, 2011, 09:15:34 AM
Welcome back and wish better days for ya.

Well RL does come and haunt us from time to time.  ;D Yet, there are a couple of us who can pick up the slack a little, due to our activity. Our POC should be fine.  ;)

I might be bringing another Iyanden type list to Round 2 around 25 - 30 wraithguards.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on August 21, 2011, 05:26:00 AM
Anyone got any advice for highlighting yellow on clth parts of a model? On the hard lines (for example, gaurdian armour) I have found orange works well, but on the robes of the farseer and warlocks I'm not that keen (it just looks..off for some reason) any advice?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 21, 2011, 08:33:59 AM
Using Golden Yellow, Sunburst Yellow, on top of White or Bleached Bone this should show your yellow without an orangy undercoat like color.

BTW, I've posted the last parts of my Ard Boyz Result.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Two Hawks on August 21, 2011, 09:49:17 PM
I second the spiritseer choice for Valar.
 Starky hope your situation plays out. It is good to take a little break once in a while.
Everyone, just keep kicking butt.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 22, 2011, 08:22:18 AM
Quote from: Two Hawks on August 21, 2011, 09:49:17 PM
Everyone, just keep kicking butt.
I certainly hope so!!

We may be now get floored on a regular basis in competitive 5th ed gaming, but its not like we're losing living bodies anyhow, we'll patch up or build more Wraith warriors, HA!

Bonesingers, get to work!

...tadada... tadadada... traldadada...  8)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on August 22, 2011, 09:06:48 AM
Sorry to hear about your circumstances Starky, its certainly made a noticeable difference to the PoC without you for the past year.

Unfortunatley i dont think i have that article either anymore as I had a hard drive get corrupted not too long ago and i think i lost alot of things i had done/ was working on :(

I am pleased that you would nominate me for the role of spiritseer and take charge of this thread, but at the same time it is a shame to see you step down. 

Should other members of the PoC agree with Starky then i am willing to step up.  If no one objects would you please send me a PM Starky with details of the hand over so i can be up to speed and take on any projects you may have had in mind for this thread?

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 22, 2011, 09:58:55 AM
Its kewl, if you headed the POC, Valar. In any case, I might be using my list again for second round of Ard Boyz. Any opinion?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on August 22, 2011, 12:24:56 PM
I vote Valar to take the helm so to speak, he's basically been done the job in the shadows anyway and he seems willing.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 22, 2011, 05:54:32 PM
Quote from: Valar on August 22, 2011, 09:06:48 AM
Sorry to hear about your circumstances Starky, its certainly made a noticeable difference to the PoC without you for the past year.

Unfortunatley i dont think i have that article either anymore as I had a hard drive get corrupted not too long ago and i think i lost alot of things i had done/ was working on :(
I may have the army pics somewhere on photobucket, or maybe you still have them yourself? Writing the article again shouldn't be a big thing, since its to be within a one page frame... So dunno, I'll take a look and see if I can dig them up.

Quote
I am pleased that you would nominate me for the role of spiritseer and take charge of this thread, but at the same time it is a shame to see you step down. 

Should other members of the PoC agree with Starky then i am willing to step up.  If no one objects would you please send me a PM Starky with details of the hand over so i can be up to speed and take on any projects you may have had in mind for this thread?
Like others have said, you about already did the job this past year, I'm sure you'll do fine. And no worries, I'll be breathing down your neck. :P

I didn't have any particular project for the POC at the time, still don't, sorry for that, but 40K inspiration is barely starting to trickle in now, you'll have to give me some time.
Now, what I would suggest is, keep the current POC running, at least until 5th ed get laid on the chopping block and the 6th miraculously appear to save us all. After that, a new, up to date POC thread may be in order, one that will be under your direct control. More power to you!
I would say better wait for the next Eldar Codex but it may take a while yet, so it'll be your call there.

Now, of course, you won't have control over the frontpages if you decide to do it this way, though I'd be happy to act at your bidding to modify and add/remove stuff, so again, your call.

I'll send you a PM shortly for details and suggestions.

   Starky :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 22, 2011, 07:27:16 PM
Wanna use my BatRep as a source for proof that Ghost Warrior Armies can control battlefields? You can rate the list too, since it has proven itself.

The sad part of this was that the army is a revision of an old army list of mine from back in my heydays. (That was back in the 90s.)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 23, 2011, 08:32:44 AM
Oh, we can still win... But generally speaking, we aren't on par with 5th dexes. Skill is still a big part of the game though, not only Codex stats, so kudos for pulling up victories. ;)

As a matter of fact, I thought of maybe something akin to a project for the POC (and all Eldar players in general)... I'll gather my thoughts about that and may post it or leave it into Valar's hands, but thats for a lter post.

ALSO: Not having been here for a while, I would surmise there are some batreps that must have been written (I'm looking at you Haunt) where Iyanden forces have been fielded. It would be nice if someone from the POC would undertake to gather the links and post them all together, so the main page can be updated and so we can have a nice discussion about them. Just saying. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 23, 2011, 12:25:28 PM
Well, it seems a buddy of mine wants to find out the strength of a Ghost Warrior Army and I obliged to use this army.

3k Eldar v CSM

HQ
Na'Nular [Eldrad]
Farseer Ilyan [115] Jetbike, Fortune
+ Warlock x4 [200] Jetbike x4, Enhance, Embolden

Troops
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal?/Enhance?
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance

Elite
Wraithguard x5 [210] Warlock, Destructor
+ Wave Serpent [125] TL-SL, Stone
Wraithguard x5 [210] Warlock, Destructor
+ Wave Serpent [125] TL-SL, Stone
Howling Banshee x10 [182] Exarch, Executioner
+ Wave Serpent [125] TL-SL, Stone

Heavy
Wraithlord [155] BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] BL, EML

This is the second list I am retooling:

HQ
Na’Nular [Eldrad]
Farseer Tial’shea [125] Stone, Fortune, Mind War

Troops
Wraithguards x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguards x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguards x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance

Elite
Wraithguard x5 [215] Warlock, Conceal
+ Wave Serpent [145] Stone, TL-BL
Wraithguard x5 [215] Warlock, Conceal
+ Wave Serpent [145] Stone, TL-BL
Howling Banshee x10 [182] Exarch, Executioner
+ Wave Serpent [145] Stone, TL-BL

Heavy
Wraithlord [155] Flamers x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamers x2, BL, EML
War Walker x3 [120] SC x6

Total = 3000

- I kinda have an idea of what he luvs to field.
2 DP
GD
2 Noise Marine Units, Plague Marines, Defiler, Oblits, Zerkers, Possessed
And whatever else he can try to field against me, prolly summoned Demons.

- Any suggestions or is this too much to field against him? Last we fought he only fought 20 wraithguards. Do you think he would feel ovewhelmed? Oh, and that last time he didn't know how to react against the wraithguards and seer councils.

PS: I'll see what I can do about the BatReps. I don't it's that many yet, until the whole 40k players see a Ghost Army has been walking around.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Orannis on August 24, 2011, 05:42:25 AM
Finally got my Wraith section up and running. Apologies on the photo quality, it was taken with a phone.  They're all still WIP with much more highlighting and detailing to be done but I'm happy enough putting them on the table as they are. Now I just have to get a game in with them.

(https://www.40konline.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1096.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg321%2Fdjappleby%2FIMAG0024.jpg&hash=fab744232dfb04f347f2666e3c3611f9bfb6d15e)

I've posted a couple of other shots of my army in the main thread in the Eldar board if anyones interested. You can probably spot my Valar "inspired"/plagerised WS at the side so thanks to him for a great painting guide it helped me loads.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on August 24, 2011, 05:43:56 AM
I’ve been thinking a lot about the Iyanden lists both past and present and it is generally accepted that Iyanden is not competative. I’m not a cheese win at all costs but here I’m willing to have a go.

People say when army building you can’t mix fluff and cheese and expect to win a tourney well lets prove them wrong! I’m always up for a challenge and hopeful to engage the POC here I’d like to propose we all stick our heads together and try to create the ultimate Iyanden Badass list to take on all comers and win tournements.

Hopefully this will also spurn additional comments and thoughts regarding how to build a competative list, squad level tactica and general strategy all for the benefit of Iyanden players the world over.  After the list is ready we all go away playtest and report back on how it did.
Ok so first off a few rules. These are all fully negoatiable and open for discussionas this is meant as a community thread and not merely my ideal.

Points limit: as I mostly remember the 40K GT is 1500 point5s therefore our army should reflect this

Iyanden fluff choice and no proxies. If we wanted to build an ultimate Eldar badass list I'm sure Eldrad would be in their somewhere but as the purpose of this is to build a Iyanden theamed army I’m going to suggest we stick to what we know / have.
 
Wraiths. At 1500 points I would think there has to be more than just a token wraith unit. I’m going to suggest 10 wraithguard and 1 Wraithlord as a minimum. I know this will clip our wings a little points wise but I think something along these lines is required to maintain the Iyanden theme.

To summeries we’re making an Iyanden cheese fest list wth a distinct Iyanden theme running through it.
Points: 1500
Special characters: Iyanden only
Min 10 Wraithguard
Min 1 Wraithlord.

Ok lets discuss these parameters first and when we’re alll happy with these we can begin to colour inside the lines and make the list....
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on August 24, 2011, 08:28:29 AM
@Haunt: Your Wraithbone Wall lists are quite something for sure :P

@Orannis: Looks pretty neat from where I stand, though I'm not the expert painter here, taht'd Valar. Keep up the good work and keep us updated? And maybe hit us with a list?

@Arquarian: I've been on a handful of tourneys with 1500 pts themed Iyanden lists, mostly in the first half of 5th ed, and usually held my own pretty well (think that there are some old batreps in the front pages links, not sure), and managed Best General with a 1750pts list 2 years ago - YEAH ME!

Anyhow, and as you kinda stated yourself, fitting a WG and a couple of WL in there seriously limits one's composition... From what I remember, there is what I used, more or less as a core:

HQ:
Mandatory Fortuneseer

ELITE:
5 WG in a Wave Serpent & Destructor Lock
Small squad of Harlies with Death Jester

TROOPS:
10 WG & Conceal Lock
5-6 Rangers/Pathfinders

HEAVY:
EML/Scatter Wraithlord
EML/BL Wraithlord

FAST: ---

To fill up the remaining points, I would put in a Defender Squad, add Yriel, Avatar or a PL (Maugan Ra with teh Harlies or walking with the Wraithguard was awesome) or a cheap CC/Melta Autarch (nice to drop with Serpent WG and target something else), or go for a Vyper or two.
Edit: Ohyeah, getting the cheap, 70ish pts fusion/powersword Autarch, one could get a Wave Serpent in for teh Guardians, because lets face it, having only ONE vegicle sucks in 5th ed.

That being said, I never filled the 3 Heavy slots at that level to escape being (too much) dunked in comp. Did well enough in most tourneys, always more wins than losses, but never had the hitting power to totally wrecks other armies and score Massacres, and thus get first place, but still came close with 2nd and 3th places eventually.

But then, maybe I suck. :P

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on August 24, 2011, 12:30:04 PM
Many states that Ghost Armies are great for non-competetive, yet most folks don't want to collect a wraith army due to its price cost in putting together. Most folks don't have that kind of money immediately, yet they are the same people who wants one and love seeing one in the battlefield. Of course their argument is that they have better choices to grab for its cost.

Players don't understand that folks who has Ghost Armies have:
1.- Decided they don't want anything else.
a.] They think its a powergaming army (IF they only knew that it takes more skill to play this than the others.)
b.] They just love the fluff.

2.- They have been playing for a long time and have gathered and played the rest. <-- I belong here.

Does Ghost Armies can compete?? The answer is already in front of everyone. We can compete and probably even pull upsets like I have done. SoB, Necrons, SM, CSM, Tau and Tyranids (non-toxin sac) are easy prey to us. Even certain GK builds cry against our resiliency. I(n order for our units to fall prey they have to shoot with everything and still or mostly wound on 6s (50 - 75%), 5+ (30 - 45%) and 4+ (10 - 20%) of course the last 5 - 10% are heavy weapons. Tau and IG are the only ones that don't really fall in these categories.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on September 3, 2011, 06:51:50 AM
@ Orranis, glad you found the painting guides useful, they look good, makes me want to get a few more wraithlords painted up, we'll see what happens with that.

@ Arquarian, keep us updated with your quest t omix both competitive and fluffy aspects into a solid Iyanden list.  I feaar with more and more poison weapons about wounding automatically on 4s etc the competivieness of high toughness iyanden lists is slowly drawing to an end.  Although that being said i played recently at the 40KO UK tournament and placed 6th out of 30 with 2 wins and 2 draws. Could have been 3 wins if on game had gone on past turn 5 oh well.  I will post some summaries and photos of that and detail the list I used for it at 1750 points level.

On a good note about our Iyanden lists, we have the fire power and ability to tear through grey knights despite how recent their dex is i found the grey knights to have nothing that was able to threaten my units and mine could tackle his with ease. Dark eldar with all their splinter shots however is a different story.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 3, 2011, 11:21:12 AM
Btw, the Semi Final Scenerios are horrible and anyone coming in without more than 6 scoring units is probably not gonna massacre at all. It got me cursing GW about it for a whole day and a half (prolly still am.)

Anyway, forgive me guys IF I don't use our Theme List and use something else just to get to the FINALS or try too. Then again I might just go ahead and use Eldar anyway.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on September 5, 2011, 03:38:52 AM
Any advice against Necrons and marine hoarde lists? whilst I have never played necrosn before, I may have a game against them soon, and the marine hoarde...just tore me apart, swear his thunderfire has a rabbits foot or something... also, has anyone noticed the crazy compitition over wraithguard on ebay?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 5, 2011, 04:29:54 AM
Wraithguard have always held their price on e-bay. generally speaking you'd be lucky to find any short of the full price. However if you're patient you'll catch some when no one is looking. I recently picked up 2 for £9 (about $12)

@Valar. Well done in the 40KOL comp. I'm looking forward to reading all the bat reps and stories fro mthe daty. Im hoping to make an appearence next year. I wanted to go this year but had a diary conflict (how gay lame did that just sound!)

EDIT:
Ok so I found this slightly old and quite rough list. It can serve as a starting point me thinks.
here goes.....
   
HQ
Farseer         
          Spirit stones, Runes of warding, Fortune, Guide
            
            
Troops            
5 Dire Avengers
          Exarch, Shimmersheild + power weapon, Bladestorm, Defend,
Wave Serpent; T/L EML, Spirit stones
            
6 Dire Avengers         6
   Exarch, Shimmersheild + power weapon, Bladestorm, Defend
Wave Serpent, T/L EML, Spirit stones
            
            
Elites            
5 Wraithguard         
   Warlock, Spiritseer, Destructor
Wave Serpent; T/L Shuricannons, Spirit stones
            
5 Wraithguard
   Warlock, Spiritseer, Destructor
Wave Serpent; T/L Shuricannons, Spirit stones
            
         
Heavy Support            
WraithLord; Bright lance, EML
            
            
Falcon; Spirit stones, Holo-fields, scatter laser
            
Falcon; Spirit stones, Holo-fields, scatter laser



Hordes will have trouble as will DE as the list is mech. (poison weapons hold no fear over vechicles :D )
There's pleanty of AT through out the list. CLEARLY it is way down on boots on the ground.

The Wraithlord looks out of place in a mech list initially but if you figure in that he will be hanging back and supporting the Avenger DAVUs and will have a Farseer in support too.....

Well its a start. What do you guys think? Is Mech the way to go?


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 5, 2011, 08:03:33 PM
@Zara -
As a Ghost Army specialist you shouldn't be afraid of a horde of S4 v your T6 with Fortuned saves. Dealing with them you should utilize your counter assault unit (Hope its Banshees, but I've seen folks rely on Scorps v MEQ.) Your AT-Lords should dispatch vehicles or cripple LRs.

@Arq -
I like the list as what you call a foundation army list, otherwise it is rather small and having 10WG is always a plus in my book as most folks have 5 - 10, I'm an exception to the rule along with a few others. I wouldn't dare to change anything until you're able to use it in a fight, so GL.

- Now my dilemma, as you all have either read or heard the new scenerios for Ard Boyz Semi. I'm so befuddled and confuse as to which army to use.

1- DA - Death Raven list combined Bikes and Termi Troops.
2- DA - Full Ravenwing List, nothing but troops tons of scoring units.
3- Khan and Shrike list, 61 bikes, 6 Attack Bikes and 1 jump infantry.

4- Eldar - Ancient Wall

HQ
(e) Na’Nular [Eldrad]
(e) Fortune-seer Ilya [85]

Troops
Wraithguard x10 [396] – Spiritseer, Conceal
(e) Wraithguard x10 [396] – Spiritseer, Enhance
(e) Wraithguard x10 [396] – Spiritseer, Enhance
Guardian Jetbike x3 [76] Shuriken Cannon
Guardian Jetbike x3 [76] Shuriken Cannon
Dire Avenger x7 [116] Exarch, ASC x2, Bladestorm
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone

Elite
Striking Scorpions x5 [143] – Exarch, Shadowstrike

Heavy
War Walkers x3 [180] Scatter Laser x6
Wraithlord [155] BL, EML, Flamer x2
Wraithlord [155] BL, EML, Flamer x2

Total = 2499

- I'm so concerned that I only have 6 scoring units and 3 of them are rather small and weak in my eyes.
- While IG can have tons of scoring unit up to 32 or 36, while SM can have 12 or 15 - 18 w/ Pedro Kantor.
- Any suggestions or crtique in my Eldar Army??
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 6, 2011, 05:44:46 AM
@haunt

I haven't seen the 'Ard Boyz criteria but with regard your Eldar dilema on the troops front. Did you contemplate swapping the Jetbike squadrons for defender guardians? they can baby sit 'home' objectives and have the Wraithlords and scatter walkers as support.


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 6, 2011, 06:42:17 AM
I have and defender Guardians are not my options to babysit objectives since those objectives are terrains for 3rd scenerio, king of the hill center of the board 2nd scenerio, while bringing a messenger for the 1st scenerio.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 6, 2011, 09:58:30 AM
I have no idea what you just said.....
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 6, 2011, 05:57:46 PM
Guardians are too soft and can't hide properly as a hidden unit Best done with a smaller unit and can avoid nasty stuff.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 7, 2011, 04:51:21 AM
Of course this is a tactical debate but on the one hand you have 2 x 3 man units of jetbikes on the other roughly 20 guardians 2 wraithlords and 3 warwalkers.

I know which one I'd be picking...  ???

I cann see what you're trying to say but 3 man jetbike squads are only good for running away and potentially stealing / contesting objectives in the last turn.

If you're unlucky with the end of game roll (if you have that of course in 'Ard boyz) then they will die horrilbly and it will all be for nothing. As the unit(s) will play no real part in the battle it just seems like a bit of a waste to me...

But that's just my opinion

Quote from: haunt on September  6, 2011, 06:42:17 AM
I have and defender Guardians are not my options to babysit objectives since those objectives are terrains for 3rd scenerio, king of the hill center of the board 2nd scenerio, while bringing a messenger for the 1st scenerio.
.

Just out oif interest, what does this mean? I get the first two. obj is some terrain (not in your deployment zone??) inj the second, middle of the field for the third. but what's all this about a messenger???
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 7, 2011, 08:10:02 AM
Follow this link to read it.

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1960055a_Ard_Boyz_Semi-Final_Scenarios_09-06-2011 (http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1960055a_Ard_Boyz_Semi-Final_Scenarios_09-06-2011)

That is the messenger scenerio and you need to bring the messenger across the board to get 500 pts while getting him killed is ok, but getting him to live by the end of the game gives you a bonus point for the tally.

The scenerios this time around is awful, since they pushed everyone to a different army.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 7, 2011, 10:00:47 AM
ah I see, all is clear now, although to be honest getting on (out of 30 :o ) wraithguard from one edge to the other doesn't seem like such a big prospect.

I see what you mean with the need to have numerous troops choices. I'd go for the wraith wall myself. It may not be as manoeuverable as the bike lists but anyone trying to takew out taht many wraithguard is going to have a hard time doing that AND trying to complete their missions.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 7, 2011, 11:38:06 AM
IF this wasn't competetion I'd field this for giggles:

HQ
Na'Nular [Eldrad]
Fortune-seer Ilya [85]

Troops
Wraithguards x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguards x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguards x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Guardian Jetbike x3 [66]

Elite
Wraithguard x4 [175] Warlock, Destructor
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone
Wraithguard x4 [175] Warlock, Destructor
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone

Heavy
Wraithlord [155] Flamers x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamers x2, BL, EML

Total = 2499

- With this army, I should be able to shock my opponents on the amount of Wraithguards on the battlefield and its VERY fluffy.

- I can change the WS-TLBL to TLSC and place 5 wraiths instead of 4 in each vehicle.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on September 7, 2011, 02:52:43 PM
Been experimenting with an airbrush working out if my scheme is doable with an airbrush to cut down on the hours and hours of layers it takes for one behicle.  Hopefully if i get it down then I can start churning out more vehicles for the forces of Iyanden.

Pics to come later :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 7, 2011, 03:05:47 PM
You should take a look at my latest wishlisting and I think we could really use it.

"As our role should expand a little and make it diverse, less we all join the dead as others has said."
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 8, 2011, 05:01:57 AM
@ Valar, please let us know how you get on and if the process is viable.

Also will you be using the GW spraygun or a electric version.....
To me the GW one seems a little flimsy
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 8, 2011, 06:51:54 AM
My wishlist got cut and moved to The Forge. You'll see it since its active.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on September 8, 2011, 04:00:54 PM
@ Arquarian, it is definitely feasible but a little fiddly getting the blends in the right place to match where the brush painted ones have the blends, high lights and shadows. Getting the strong colour of the yellow is much easier with the air brush because of its very even coverage.  What cannot be done on the airbrush though is the final few highlight stages which are fine lining and feathering that fine line into the rest of the yellow.  That still requires brush work.  I think i will hand paint the blue areas because masking off the yellow well enough is hard due to the curves and i can risk the smallest chance of blue seeping onto the finished yellow and ruining the whole model.

And im not using the GW spraygun, nooo, that thing is awful.  Im testing out my new harder and steenbeck airbrush and it works well.  Although just a side note, avoid mechrite red like the plague, it killed my previous airbrush and when i tried it on this it did the same thing but for some very quick and thorough cleaning out.

Will try and get pics of some step by step before i start on the blue if the weather picks up
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 9, 2011, 05:57:44 AM
Valar your Iyanden yellow is the stuff of legends therefore we bow to your greater talent. I'm a lazy painter and I'm probvably going to stick to my 3 layer technique plus the finelining.

I may well conside the spray gun option for all my wraithguard though as these tand to take me forever to paint....

As for the GW spraygun I though as much that and the cost of a semi decent spraygun is whats putting me off at the moment.

Like I said I'm a lazy painter so if the gun is going to cut me some corners I my very well look into it.


Just out of interest mecharite red is a foundation paint right? is that why it ruined your last gun??
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on September 9, 2011, 02:07:41 PM
yeh it is a foundation so that probably has some bearing on why it ruins air brushes, even though i thinned it with a tonne of thinnner
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 15, 2011, 09:55:10 PM
A question to ALL of you wraith fans. IF a 10 man squad of wraithguards w/ a conceal lock is hard to kill, how will you feel when 40 of them are on the battlefield and waiting for you to move them off a hill? This doesn't include the 3 AT-Lords behind them.

Would you feel a strong desire to remove them in CC or Shooting? Would you even dare assault them and get bogged down in a one sided melee?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Algavinn of the Many Paths on September 16, 2011, 12:10:07 PM
Unless I had substantial power weapons, with that much of my opponents army (unless I was a CC dedicated army like orks or tyranids) being very short range firepower and not very mobile, I would have no motivation to close on him.  I would take down his big boys first from range and then just pepper away at wraithguard until the game was over.  I may not whipe the army and it may not be the most stimulating game ever, but 40 wraithguard are very non-threatening unless you are somehow forced to give them a hug.  Granted this comes from a mobile Eldar or marine player, but any ranged army is going to be generally happy about having at least several turns to blow you up before facing reprisals and will likely deploy to make you walk as far as possible as long as a territorial objective is not in play.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 16, 2011, 12:16:23 PM
I'd agree.

If I were toting mass Frost blades + Fists/poison weapons/rending claws then have at you!

Otherwise target the AT lords first, then stand 13" away and shoot you to death.

Very boring game, would probably end on a draw.

An IG Gunline would love you from behind with your clothes on.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 16, 2011, 05:31:34 PM
So which of these list is better??

Eldrad
Fortuneseer [85]

Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Conceal
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Dire Avenger x9 [140] Exarch, ASC x2, Blade
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone
Dire Avenger x9 [140] Exarch, ASC x2, Blade
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone

Howling Banshee x10 [192] Exarch, Executioner, Acro
+ Wave Serpent [145] TL-BL, Stone

Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML

Or

Eldrad
Fortuneseer [85]

Wraithguard x10 [399] Spiritseer, Conceal, Spear
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
GJB x3 [76] SC
GJB x3 [76] SC

Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML

Or

Eldrad
Fortuneseer [85]

Wraithguard x10 [399] Spiritseer, Conceal, Spear
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance
Wraithguard x10 [396] Spiritseer, Enhance

Harlequin x6 [152] Troupe Master, PW, Shadowseer, Kisses x5

Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
Wraithlord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML

- Any opinion or suggestions?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Algavinn of the Many Paths on September 17, 2011, 02:00:43 AM
Excuse the length, late at night, end of the week, no desire to work, and watching some good Netflix.




If I had to choose one I'd go with the top, but I'm not a fan of the dire avengers in that situation.  In my mind if you are going to split a force between either slow moving units and fast moving units, or close range units and longer range units, I like to choose a foundation for the army that is one type.  For you this is wraithguard and wraithlords, a slow moving but very resilient and powerful force that is mostly short range.  So most of the damage your army is capable of is slow and close, so you should plan to destroy your enemy with that type of force, with the rest of your army (here the dire avengers and banshees) should take care of the threats your main body cannot, or supplement it.  Most of the time your opponent will have no incentive to attack your foundation, the waveserpents are resilient but if they are taking all the fire from a ranged/mobile army, it's not much of a match.  If you attack aggressively with these elements they may take out some important targets depending on your opponent, but will go down.  If you play defensively with them to be reactionary against any CC/close fire targets they may be more useful, but if you face any ranged army the conclusion will be the same as the other army layouts...your opponent will just shoot at you until the game is over. 

I really don't want to sound like I'm picking on the Iyanden or footslogging style unjustly, but while they are potentially successful lists, many armies will have some advantages over you.


So let's be productive.  If you have a army made exclusively of close range or CC units without transport the only way to destroy the enemy is to close on them, or have them close on you.  If they are a CC or close fire army, they will come to you and you make your stand.  If they ranged you either close on them slowly and hope you don't die before reaching them with enough of your force to damage them, ooor you hope to have enough cover to hide behind and make the game very boring as both sides just sit there hoping the other comes out to play.  If you play against a mobile army, you’re left with the previous option; taking up the best position possible and hiding while you wait for them (hopefully in hard cover where they can’t see you until they get close enough to be attacked, on objectives, etc.).  So in a fully static/slow list you know your options are to sit in place, or advance even though it’s not a benefit.  Your enemy coming to you is the best result, but if they come to you the game is either boring or they mean to kill you up close anyway.

So to approach this, having some mobile units gives you a lot more options.  You do have the range of your wraithlords to work on vehicles or MC’s while they advance, but that’s very little boom boom for this size of list (it does obviously help and count in mind for target priority, taking down those earthshakers (or what not) that will rip your expensive tin cans apart on the slog over).  In your second and third lists the jetbikes give very little mobile fire, and the harlequins aren’t really worth taking.  Either they advance footslog style and are a very easy target, or they counter-attack when your army gets approached up close (which most armies wont want to) and while they are good in CC wraithguard aren’t bad themselves so without being able to at least seek out the opponent at mid range and attack via a transport, they’re just a liability. 

On account of these points I wouldn’t say those two lists are worth taking.  So back with the first list.  The dire avengers and banshees do make it so if an army (or a portion of an army) comes close you certainly do have the power to hit something pretty hard, but like I said before, if they go off against an army by themselves they will get pummeled and die and you return to the above scenarios with nothing more than a footslogging/static army, on account of them having to get up close to do their damage (even though they are mobile).

My suggestions?  Well that would depend on what else you have available in your list.  With this army the only units you have to take down hard targets (vehicles…like leman russes, earthshakers, fire prisms, etc.) will be your wraithlords (limited firepower, only 3 targets which aren’t hard to take down from range with these sized armies) or your wraithguard, but most tanks won’t come that close to give you the option.  One of the biggest threats to your army at range? Tanks. 

Regardless of the potential hard targets you may face, my suggestion would be trying to pull in a bit of mobile firepower in support of your slow speed/close range foundation.  Waveserpent based units like the dire avengers and banshees are definitely useful (not to mention their serpents), but including ranged fire in the form of fire prisms (I highly suggest one of these for its versatility and range), falcons, vypers, etc. that will at least let you reposition some firepower and take down some of your opponents more threatening units, or harass him.  I’m not saying to move into a mechanized Biel-Tan army or harassment Saim-Hann but having this mobile firepower supplementing the foundation of your army will help motivate your enemy to get close, and even if he doesn’t you’ve done some damage without dedicating hundreds of points into the maw of your opponent.



So what do you have available and is there a particular target you’re planning for?  A style of play you want to go for?  Do you really want to stay slogging, or would you consider a more static approach (potentially adding warwalkers, support platforms, and mobile fire support), or maybe mounting your wraithguard (since the list has waveserpents anyway) with added close firepower/cc like your avengers and banshees, or mobile firepower.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 18, 2011, 12:18:19 PM
Well, gang with over 60% people playing MEQs I fought the following:

Tau = Minor Victory (Ran out of time and the guy was a great guy. He ONLY killed a Wraithlord and 2 wraithguards from different units.)

This is when it went awry and I mean I was paired a player who would have been paired against an IG list while I would have been paired to a BA player of the store (I would have owned him.) Instead:

Swarm Tyranids = Loss ( Consolotary, I gave him a massacre when it would have been but a minor win, since the store cheated me of my opponent. I say this due to my opponent's score at the time. I have 16 pts and the BA has 15 points while the IG has 13 points and the nids has 12 points.)

After:

Mech IG (Spearhead) = Loss.

I know this is in the wrong place but it would have been a page since I felt robbed of the event.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Aislinn on September 19, 2011, 04:55:14 PM
Hey all!  I am glad to report I am back in the eldar gaming.  Been out for a while, but tried them out again on Saturday I believe?   anyhow, I was allied with Deathwing, but ended up killing the Chaos by myself in the end.  The game ended with the Chaos conceding as I shot all his useful CC troops and immobilized all his heavy tanks.  All my ally did was tie up the CC units for a few turns and take out a few of the berzerkers. 
   My list was the Outcasts of Iyanden, led by Maugan-Ra:

2x5 pathfinders-240pts

10 Rangers-190 pts

Maugan-Ra-195pts

Total-625 pts

All in all very effective and the transport tanks were destroyed/immobilized, and the heavy tanks had no weapons/immobilized.  there was really only one squad left at the very end of the table. 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Khorne25 on October 7, 2011, 04:40:44 AM
Hello all,
Im starting an Iyandem themed army soon - models etc are on their way.
Its certainly not my first project but this will be interesting.

A quick question: do you paint your aspect warriors in their aspect shrine colours or Iyanden's colour scheme?

Ill be starting my own thread soon on my Eldritch Raiders/Iyanden army.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on October 7, 2011, 04:54:33 AM
The first rendition of my Iyanden army had all the aspect warriors painted in the craftworld colours of yellow and blue.  IT looked good and the whole army was very coherant.

My current Iyanden army has the aspect warriors all painted in their aspect colours, or a variation of their colours.  I prefer how this looks and it keeps things interesting when paointing as its not all the same colour.

However it all comes down to your personal preference and what you want to paint and think will look good.  There is no right or wrong way to do it.  Only your preference.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on October 7, 2011, 04:58:30 AM
My Iyanden army's aspect warriors retain their aspect colours but with a Iyanden touch that suits. i.e. scorpions helmets are yellow, Warp spider back packs yellow with large Iyanden rune in Dark blue etc..

However I keep the Exarch's fully in the aspect coplours as they have totally given themselves over to their chosen path and the crtaftwolrd no longer means as much to them... that's my take ion it any way.

Like Valar says its a good break from all that yellow. And by God you're going to get fed up pf painting all that yellow!

but by keeping the Iyanden theme in the aspect squads it ties in the unit to the rest of the army.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on October 7, 2011, 08:47:44 AM
I just play with the Iyanden background in mind, I have my own color pattern, but as the above, I prefer having the Aspect Warriors in their traditional colors, for pretty much the same reasons.

Also, would you want to switch Craftworld or eventually want to try a new color pattern, keeping to traditional colors is a way to save you a lot of work, but that's me. ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Khorne25 on October 8, 2011, 06:15:12 AM
Thanks for the input. Started my own thread on the Corsairs/Iyanden mix.

Could I please be placed on the roster for the POC? Thanks.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on October 8, 2011, 07:00:37 AM
I'll add your name as a Civilian but that doesn't give any custom Title, this usually come with forum participation, generally posting and contributions, expect to have your Guardian status after a 100 post or so, welcome aboard.  ;)

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on October 21, 2011, 08:38:46 AM
For those with access to the Project Boards, the following is a link to the Iyanden in 5th Edition article.  Largely done, the final parts (Army Lists and Painting Guides) remain open.  I'd ask anyone interested to hop on over and have a glance.  Feel free to critique or provide additional insights.  I'd appreciate some different takes on Army Lists and Painting Guides for Iyanden.

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=180077.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=180077.0)

;francois
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on October 25, 2011, 06:48:33 AM
Francois its great. A really good insight into the Craftworld.

when I eventually learn how to post links to er... post i'll use it to to inform the noobs.

but I have learned how to embed photos! and so for my 999th post I give you...

My Wraithseer!!

(https://www.40konline.com/MGalleryItem.php?id=4343)


Edit: Hang on wait, where's the picture? D'oh!
what an anti-climax...

Just finished the base coat....

(https://www.40konline.com/MGalleryItem.php?id=4344)

I believe we're going to see all this nice Forgeworld stuff in Imperial Armour 11 when it comes out (last I heard was November....)

I don't think we'll see the likes of the Wraithseer in the new codex, that's toomuch to ask for  ;) possible some more falcon varients though *cough* warp hunter *cough*

[gmod]Fixed broken image tags. -Mr.Peanut[/gmod]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on October 25, 2011, 11:58:42 AM
Just finished the base coat....

(https://www.40konline.com/MGalleryItem.php?id=4344)

I believe we're going to see all this nice Forgeworld stuff in Imperial Armour 11 when it comes out (last I heard was November....)

I don't think we'll see the likes of the Wraithseer in the new codex, that's toomuch to ask for  ;) possible some more falcon varients though *cough* warp hunter *cough*

[gmod]Fixed broken image tag. -Mr.Peanut[/gmod]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on October 25, 2011, 12:16:28 PM
Long as they change the poxy D-cannon rules, seriously the thing can instagib a carnifex one 6th of the time but it struggles to tickle a rhino?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Khorne25 on October 25, 2011, 01:26:54 PM
Thats a serious awesome wraithseer! I was thinking of geting one.

No battle experience yet?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on October 25, 2011, 06:04:14 PM
No battle experience yet, ill bust it out when its painted.

picking up on what 29+12 said I think the D-cannon rules need a little tidy. I mean between the Wraithcannon, D-Cannon and the warp hunters own D-cannon  I would think the rules need a little streamlining but I guess that's for a different thread.  I suppose that the rules for the Wraithseer adn the warp hunter are after all experimental so.....


ps thanks to Mr Peanut for the image tag fix.  :-[
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Khorne25 on October 25, 2011, 06:22:23 PM
By the way, where did you hear about IA11 coming out next month?
That makes me very excited indeed.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on October 26, 2011, 06:45:55 AM
I think I read it on the rumours board that IA11 was scheduled for release next month BUT DONT QUOTE ME.....
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on October 26, 2011, 11:29:54 AM
Quote from: f.desrochers on October 21, 2011, 08:38:46 AM
For those with access to the Project Boards, the following is a link to the Iyanden in 5th Edition article.  Largely done, the final parts (Army Lists and Painting Guides) remain open.  I'd ask anyone interested to hop on over and have a glance.  Feel free to critique or provide additional insights.  I'd appreciate some different takes on Army Lists and Painting Guides for Iyanden.

http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=180077.0 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=180077.0)
W00T ;francois, finally completed the thing, gratz!

I think it is fairly complete and a very good reference tool for any Iyanden player, excellent work IMHO, will add it to the POC's Link's for easy access from members - Thank you. :)


@Valar: Good stuff there, can't wait to see it fully painted! Keep us updated, [salivating] and maybe treat us with a batrep using the shinny new model/rules? [/salivating]

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on October 26, 2011, 02:32:01 PM
@ Starky, I think your stealing the credit from arquarian, its his painting on the wraithlord, i havent posted an update of yellowness for a little while due to cracking through my blood angels. 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on October 26, 2011, 03:29:16 PM
Ah Ha!!!  My painting got confused for Valar's!! Surely I've made it in the world now!

although to be honest this is just the base coat and I think it was the model rather than the paint job that Starky was salivating over.

What can I say, I'll try my best to do it justice!
And I promise you shall be taking picture the first time I field him!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on October 26, 2011, 05:42:29 PM
Darn! I'm slipping, old age I guess, shame on me. :

Due credits to Arquarian there. ;)

Pictures? Yes, pictures, we expect no less... But better sharpen your quill my friend, we want to know how you spank your opposition!

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on October 27, 2011, 05:49:17 AM
I shall indeed!

However just my luck the guy will nail the mighty Lord on the first turn  :(
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on October 29, 2011, 08:38:36 PM
Sorry, if I had been MIA lately, I have been busy looking for a job and not having one makes you motivated when you have 2 kids to feed. :)

My friends tested my list against their broken lists of GKs and BAs. They found their lists floundering against the most toughest Footslogging Eldar list they have ever faced and couldn't recover after 3rd turn have come around.

The army was a FULL Ghost Warrior Army, 40 WG, 3 WL, 2 x3 GJB w/ SC. I used a special tactic of "Concealed Wings" with a backup in case a unit gets to whittled down.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on October 30, 2011, 01:26:54 PM
Quote from: haunt on October 29, 2011, 08:38:36 PM
Sorry, if I had been MIA lately, I have been busy looking for a job and not having one makes you motivated when you have 2 kids to feed. :)
Totally understandable. ;)

Quote
I used a special tactic of "Concealed Wings" with a backup in case a unit gets to whittled down.
Which would be? And gratz for the win. :P

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on October 30, 2011, 07:21:33 PM
Concealed Wings = Three lines of WG unit with the first having Conceal blocking for 3 other WG units with Enhance.

First line = Conceal WG
Second line = 2 Enhance WG (side by side)
Third line = Enhance WG (Fall back unit for special characters.)

Wraithlords are beside the 1st and 2nd lines.

GJB = ALWAYS on reserve.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on October 31, 2011, 09:26:37 AM
Its a good tactic! If you have 40 Wraithguard of course  ;D
but I don't  :'(

Still it looks as though the marines had a hard time getting through all that Wraithbone.

Out of interest how many points did this come to, 2k?
And what was the Seer council made up of?



Ps what did you feed the kids to in the end?
but in seriousness I hope everything works out for you and your family.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on October 31, 2011, 05:36:16 PM
2500 points, no seer councils...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 1, 2011, 01:19:43 PM
Oh right. SC = Shuri cannons on the GJBs then I guess.

So I guess the HQ was a mandatory Fortuneseer ??
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on November 8, 2011, 06:34:10 PM
Considering that GK was supposedly the baddest cat of them all and same as BA.

GK killed 2 AT-Lords, 7 WG, 1 spiritseer and a fortuneseer, but lossed everything else due to being afraid of the fortuned WG.

Ghost Army annihilated most of the vehicles and wiped out the mon-keighs to the last man. The vehicles if it isn't blown up its immobilized and with no weapons.

BA, Sanguinary Guard army can't think of a way to approach my Ghost Castle, then again with 40 wraithcannons near each other. There wasn't a way for a Sanguinary Guard army to handle a Full Ghost Army of my magnitude.

Both players were mad in the end, yet bowed to the fact that I was cheated in the Semi-Finals by the internal staffing.

That was then and I won't ever game over there.  ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 9, 2011, 03:01:05 AM
Good for you Haunt.

I think these uber specalised armies are overatted myself, although I have to admit I've only ever kids who run GK or bA and they tend to go for the over-the-top shiny expensive stuff and don't pay enough attention to poroper army composition.


Here's a well overdue updated on the mighty Wraithseer, Gerald.

(https://www.40konline.com/MGalleryItem.php?id=4363)

Link was broken and page was displaying incorrectly, so I've fixed it, but it won't display your picture now.  I've called a Global to help out, as they're good at fixing these things, so hopefully your picture should be restored soon - Iri.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on November 9, 2011, 03:59:26 AM
Which is the best weapon for a wave serpant in an Iyanden army? it will be carrying either dire avengers, gaurdians or posibly a seer council depending on the size of the game, am not sure how to magnitise it (no idea where I would get the magnets) and was thinking either eldar missile launcher or scatter laser.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 9, 2011, 06:38:38 AM
The EML is good for a longer ranged role and would suit you if you plan to use you assault later in the game.

If you plan to get up front and personal then the Shuricannon is better suited to the scatter laser as the range is no longer an issue and the lack of AP on the scatter laser nerfs the AT ability when shooting at side armour or light vehicles.
It's also cheaper  :D

As for the magnets you're looking for 'rare earth magnets' a simple google search will get you to a supplier.
As for where they go take a look at the stickies on the Konvershum forum for some really good step by step guides.

Hope that helps!
 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on November 9, 2011, 12:23:04 PM
IMHO, I have been using mainly TLBL due to 5th being vehicle heavy and with a BL you get the I popped that LRC with Termies or Immob it and become a bunker for folks. Since the newer armies has something against melta +2d6. I've gotten sick of my fragons dying due imbalance crap rules. Imagine our skimmers now against Crons.  :-\ Talking about our pricing needs to go down now.  ;) We won't see our new dex till 6th comes out.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 9, 2011, 12:27:24 PM

Fire Dragons have always been fry then die. I've always prefered using Wraithguard for this role.
BLs are good but expensive if they're twin linked fair enough but not on my War Walkers. BS4 sucks with single shot weapons.




Ps My picture came back woohoo! scrool up to see my (half finished) Wraithseer!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on November 9, 2011, 01:40:43 PM
Beautiful Arquarian but Damn you for making me want one so very badly.  My wallet is angry at you!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 9, 2011, 05:42:15 PM
I live to upset your wallet  ;D

I know the pic isn't great (thanks to Iri for sorting the code  :D  :D ) but what's your view on the highlights?

I think I need to do a really fine extreme highlight with skull white, just to really bring out the extreme edges.

Or will this spoil it?

Also I think I should bring out the blisters more with a watered down bleached bone. good idea?

Ps. I've named him Gerald aka "the Jezza" don't now why, it just felt right  :P
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on November 9, 2011, 07:16:42 PM
leave the highlights as they are now.  You def dont want to be doing a pure white highlight on this as it will make the model look either chalky or Tron like neither of which is good in my eyes. You have what looks like a very nice yellow there already, last thing you want to do with yellow is work it beyond a point with which you are happy, because then mistakes or a change in oppinion are impossible to un do.

The blisters, im not sure what you mean about watered down bleached bone.  I personally paint every last one of them as a gem on mine but thats part of my schem and taste.  I like it how it is at the moment, like i said above dont go trying to add more to it if you are happy with it as is.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on November 9, 2011, 07:18:30 PM
I'll get mine finished and painted, although it's a scratch build Wraithseer. :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 9, 2011, 07:39:07 PM
Quote from: Valar on November  9, 2011, 07:16:42 PM
leave the highlights as they are now.  You def dont want to be doing a pure white highlight on this as it will make the model look either chalky or Tron like neither of which is good in my eyes. You have what looks like a very nice yellow there already, last thing you want to do with yellow is work it beyond a point with which you are happy, because then mistakes or a change in oppinion are impossible to un do.

The blisters, im not sure what you mean about watered down bleached bone.  I personally paint every last one of them as a gem on mine but thats part of my schem and taste.  I like it how it is at the moment, like i said above dont go trying to add more to it if you are happy with it as is.

Thanks Valar, that's exactly what I needed to hear. I'll go ahead with the rest of Jezza and his little headless friend and re visit if I need to.

next up then I'll start on the blue washes for his face plate and some blue blending for the wraithspear blade. The D-cannon muzzle and the haft of the spear will be granite grey which will fit in with the rest of my army.

for the face plate I'm looking for a real depth to the colour so I was thinking of many many blue washes. Any better ideas?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on November 9, 2011, 09:35:46 PM
Quote from: haunt on November  9, 2011, 12:23:04 PM
IMHO, I have been using mainly TLBL due to 5th being vehicle heavy and with a BL you get the I popped that LRC with Termies or Immob it and become a bunker for folks. Since the newer armies has something against melta +2d6. I've gotten sick of my fragons dying due imbalance crap rules. Imagine our skimmers now against Crons.  :-\ Talking about our pricing needs to go down now.  ;) We won't see our new dex till 6th comes out.

Why on Earth would you pay for the price of two weapons just to twin-link one?  It's a far better option to take a heavy weapon and a wraithsword, or to take two heavy weapons.  If you're tank hunting, take a brightlance and an eldar missile launcher.

Edit: Added quote for context.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on November 11, 2011, 08:59:13 PM
I had not been using Falcons as of late, but the whole question was revolving around the Wave Serpent, and it can only have a main weapon, and why would you need to change the TL-Cat. The problem that had plagued me since the new codex is the Falcon's BS score, am rather not impressed with it. In order to make it a much better contender I have to stick a Guide-seer with it. This isn't even including the points you have to spend on the upgrades. A serpent on the other hand makes folks upset as they use heavier weapons and with little result against it.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 29+12 on November 14, 2011, 09:34:35 AM
Quote from: Arquarian on November  9, 2011, 07:39:07 PM
for the face plate I'm looking for a real depth to the colour so I was thinking of many many blue washes. Any better ideas?

If you're talking about shading it you could just use watered down chaos black to shade up from black to w/e you want. The watering down btw is not to dilute the colour but just to make it easier to blend. I used that technique for my WL a fair few pages back....i'll try and find the post quickly.

[Edit] Here it is: http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg2405127#msg2405127 (http://www.40konline.com/index.php?topic=159677.msg2405127#msg2405127)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 14, 2011, 11:19:10 AM
I can't see the pic right now but I'll check them pout when I get to my own Pc.

hmmm, I'm not sure black is the way to go and to be honest I wasn't thinking about blending.

Multiple layers of washes give the colour a real depth, as if you're looking through blue glass.

EDIT: I managed to see the pic and I see what you've done but like I said I'm looking to create the perception of depth in the paint. I think you can only really get this from applying many many layers. I'll be back it "Gerald" tomorrow night so I@ll hopefully have a picture or two to post come Wednesday.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: kalivann on December 10, 2011, 05:09:06 PM
I might be a few years to late but im up for joining, Although I represent Yriel's Eldrich Raiders am I still qualified ?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on December 12, 2011, 08:10:53 PM
You are certainly welcome to our POC. Iyanden is Iyanden be it named something else or the same.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Khorne25 on December 17, 2011, 09:05:04 PM
Quote from: kalivann on December 10, 2011, 05:09:06 PM
I might be a few years to late but im up for joining, Although I represent Yriel's Eldrich Raiders am I still qualified ?

Woohoo another eldritch raider!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: kalivann on December 18, 2011, 06:54:09 PM
Yeah I love the fluff behind them although I don't paint them in the traditional scheme I'm doing more of a gold color on most of my models with some red mixed in.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on January 6, 2012, 05:47:56 AM
Hi Guys,

I've been away for a while giving my Space Wolves a boost prior to IA11 coming out as both Eldar and space Wolves are in the book.

So it is here I thought we could discuss the implications of IA11: the Doom of Mymeara as there are changes to our Ghost armies...

namely the Wraithseer Rules are fully published and are slightly changed from those issued in the experimental rules. Biggest change is that the power Deliverance now grants Feel No Pain to and single Wraith unit within 6" of the W/Seer. The wraithseer is sanctioned for use in the 40K game and for use in both the Corsair list in IA11 and Craftworld armies....

There is a new Apoc formation, the spirit hosty (I think this is actually a revamp of the old spirit host found in Apoc) which includeds the Wraithseer and greant s the formation to outflank.

Slightly off the Iyanden main list but in a Corsair army you can pick 1 CWE elite unit as a corsair e;ite choice. The Corsair Prince allows upto 3 units in the entire army to deep strike. You guessed it. Deep striking Wraithguard!!!!! I actually drooled when I realised you could do this.


What are your thoughts....



Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Two Hawks on January 12, 2012, 04:49:31 PM
I've been wanting a Wraithseer but didn't know if the guys at my LGS would let me use it. Now since it's sanctioned i think i'll get one. I like his look and the rules.
Deep strike WG that would be awesome. I can already see the look on my friends' faces. "Your doing what with them(WG)?"
I play wolves too so I guess I need to get IA11. Hopefully ther's some good stuff for them too.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on January 13, 2012, 06:18:14 AM
Unfortunately besides some pretty pictures of Bran Redmaws Great Company the only addition game wise if the Rules for Bran Himself....

still There's a pic of the Bran model floating around somewhere and he looks pretty awesome. I hope they do a model for "The Redmaw"

Back on thread the Wraithseer is an awesome if pricy Character but I think he'll figure heavily in Spirit hosts of 2k and over. You could include him at 1500 at a push but he is worth his weight in gold wraithbone for some of his abilities to boost other wraiths around him.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on January 24, 2012, 08:50:34 PM
The problem of taking the Prince is that you lose the wraithseer, since you'll use a farseer or instead Eldrad. Many of my friends stated they hate my armies due to the sheer amount of wraithguards and just testing my lists on them. They have a different view of Eldar.

They have no respect to other players, who play Eldar except for me that's the take of everyone in my area. Since we played an Apoc game and surrendered after the beating they took after an hour and a half. They used 3 warhounds and a couple of baneblades/shadowsword, along with the normal stuff.  ;)

Brought a huge spirit host (just 50 wraithguards [not my full 70] and 10 wraithlords), an aspect assault wave (small just 3 serpents) and accompanying them were phantom titan and 1 warlock titan, and 2 full sunstorm squadrons (12 fire prisms).

I'll ask my friend to post my army as he took pictures and I am no good at that stuff..  :(
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on January 25, 2012, 05:13:53 AM
Quote from: haunt on January 24, 2012, 08:50:34 PM
The problem of taking the Prince is that you lose the wraithseer, since you'll use a farseer or instead Eldrad.

Erm, not necessarily....

You don't have to take Eldrad, or a farseer in fact. the list I have in mind runs the Wraithseer alongside the Avatar. With 3 Wraithlords I'm going for max MC  8)

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Aireoth on January 25, 2012, 03:16:10 PM
I have to say, I love the look on peoples faces when they realize that this squishy Eldar army has 3 Wraithlords and a Seer, plus a group of Wasps (count as troop choices, though I heard rumor IA11 changed this, still waiting on my copy so until I see it, thats how I'll play it). Not so squishy now!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Khorne25 on January 25, 2012, 06:50:36 PM
Quote from: Aireoth on January 25, 2012, 03:16:10 PM
I have to say, I love the look on peoples faces when they realize that this squishy Eldar army has 3 Wraithlords and a Seer, plus a group of Wasps (count as troop choices, though I heard rumor IA11 changed this, still waiting on my copy so until I see it, thats how I'll play it). Not so squishy now!

Wasps for CWE have normal WW BS and are Fast Attack choices.
Wait till you get your IA11. Should be soon no? Got mine last week - second batch.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on March 7, 2012, 03:22:05 AM
Yes, I am still alive and I have been working hard at my new job and also participating with my Eldar Armies in many battles. Hope with time permits, I'll post a full compliment day fight and maybe an APOC battle.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on April 18, 2012, 03:30:34 PM
So how are people finding the Wraithseer? I am thinking of ordering one (alas poor student loan, I knew ye well :P ) I'm thinking one using deliverance on 10 wraith unit with spirit seer with fortune supported by a Farseer with Fortune would be incredibly tough, plus the wraithseer would be a good combat suport unit if they get charged by anything they can't really handle.
I've just had a thought, what would you guys say where the most common/likely aspects for Iyanden to field post Tyranid attack?
Dire avengers would still be the most common as their shooting is arguably the best against Tyranids, whilst all of the Fast aspects (Hawks, Spiders and Spears) would also be fairly common in comparison as there mobility and speed would have allowed them better to avoid and fight the Tyranids more effectively whilst Dark reapers I reckon would have become rare due to their slow speed and that fact there rate of fire would not have been enought to save them (They may have been able to shoot down bigger beasties, but the hordes of gribblies would have overrun them).
I'm not sure on how Banshee's and scorpians would have faired, on the one hand, they would proberbly have taken heavy losses, on the other more of them may have been trained (do eldar choose their path? can Farseers attempt to "guide" individuals onto a certain path?) to help the wraith Guard. Also, has anyone had an Iyanden vrs Tyranids game?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Two Hawks on May 2, 2012, 11:14:28 PM
I played a game a few weeks ago,ended up losing but I lasted 5 turns. I took an Avatar, Karandras w/ scorpions they faired okay against the right group.
Avatar(last to fall) fought his big guys. I did take reapers(5) w/o an exarch they did good until they got outflanked in turn 3. I did take hawks they didn't fair that well they ended up scattering close to a squad of 20 hormagaunts. I took a serpent w/ avengers didn't care for them really. Guardians w/ BL platform for Hive Tyrant. Pathfinders also for heavy hitters.
I have played Iyanden against them, just can't get enough models on board unless it's 2500 pts or more.
Even though I lost, it was still a great game. Definately learned from it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on May 3, 2012, 04:03:59 AM
I now really wish there some tyranid players in my club, the few games against them I have had against them in the past with my other armies were fun, and it would be thematic to play them. How did you find our iconic units such as Wraithguard and wraithlord fair?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on May 9, 2012, 01:41:36 AM
Honestly, our wraithguards and wraithlords are not meant to take on horde units that can wound them on 4+, meaning you can fight orkz but not horde nids or dark eldar wych army. Any other army would be having a great time getting pummelled byt guards and lords.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on July 15, 2012, 02:09:55 PM
Ok so it seems that silence has fallen accross this once glorious craft world.  It is time for the seers to re-enrgise the wraithbone constructs and breath an eerie unlife back into this forum!

So 6th Edition Iyanden?  How this could work?

I see a positive boost for Iyanden armies in this edition and here is why:

Avatar speaks for itself

Farseers ( access to the new psychic powers of divination and telepathy will help buff our already tough units and maximise the effectiveness of our shooting.  Blessings will be difficult if not impossible for other armies to close down)

Wraithseer (FW only unit I know but an interesting and fluffy choice, adds another monstrous creature into our ranks and maybe wishlisting but as and when our new dex comes around I would suspect to see it as an option)

Wraithguard are just as tough as before but now with a nice touch for overwatch just to cause a little more damage when being charged as we all know how these can get bogged down.  An interesting touch with this unit though is that warlocks are now characters meaning his wounds could potentially be precision allocated, a nice chance to remove the powerfists from a unit as its these which will put the hurt onto our high toughness units.  Fortune and conceal will be just as effective as before if not a little more effective (for us) due to cover saves as a whole being reduced.  Keeping a Farseer near enough to these units could pay off if lucky enough with the psychic powers roll and can get the wraithguard firing overwatch at their regular BS.

Dire Avengers i think will be our aspect of choice, they have I think increased their durability with the addition of overwatch makes this an interesting unit.  I intend to run perhaps 2 units in Waveserpents as drive by shooters.  Shooting units in transports have not been reduced in effectiveness unlike our assault choices.

I used to run howling Banshees as my cc support unit but I think they have now had their time and probably wont see much of 6th :(  Will be looking for a replacement unit.

Pathfinders may now make a nice addition to this list.  I think as a whole this army now plays even more slowly than before what with all the fast armies out there having been made faster.  Now I think a static unit of pathfinders is a good choice to add some firepower to the list, those precision shots aimed at plasma, fists, lascannons etc (all the things that threaten our high toughness) and remembering that any of our precision shots become Ap1 this sniping unit becomes a brilliant addition

Wraithlords have received a nice boost with hammer of wrath, which will be golden in assault with vehicles. The fact he now causes fear is a nice touch, so against low Ld armies he will likely be fighting against enemies which are very unlikely to be able to hit in return :) This video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWl23bObGdo#) says alot.

At games above 2000pt we can take an extra FOC, i cant remember off the top of my head what restrictions this has but I believe it opens up 3 extra Heavy slots... can anyone say 6 wraithlords? (not inc a wraith seer?) very cool fluffy list

So my intentions....

Get a unit of 10 pathfinders painted up, find a replacement to Banshees (open for suggestions) Finish up a 3rd wraithlord and wraithseer...

I want to run an Eldarzilla list for some fun games....  Avatar, wraithseer, wraithguard, Pathfinders and 3 Wraithlord (more at higher point games)

What are other Iyanden players thoughts early on in 6th ed?

[mod]Please don't describe the rules, it's against the forum rules - Iris.[/mod]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on July 15, 2012, 10:33:11 PM
In place of Banshees, I suggest working some extra points for Shining Spears.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on July 15, 2012, 10:43:00 PM
Shining Spears haven't been much improved in 6th edition.  The new rules for Lances/Spears benefit them slightly in subsequent turns, but their charge has still been neutered from what was previously underwhelming.  Striking Scorpions are still a decent choice, and Precision Strike might actually make the chainsaber option worth taking.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 15, 2012, 11:15:30 PM
Iyanden or Ghost Armies in 6th Ed.

First of ALL, it is great to see other folks other than me psyched into using this edition to its full advantage.

Let’s begin:

1- We lossed our CC support choice as the go to unit our Howling Banshees, granted their still no slouch in melee. The problem is that when we’re talking about wraithguards; our opponents are sending their murder squads (e.g. terminators) that have the best armour saves.

In order to mitigate this we need to reinvest our CC support points for harlequins and their kisses. Anything that has rending or AP2 in melee would be great. The unfortunate part not many has this.

2- Being our weapon is one of the best quality AP, it is now also better in cracking armor. Yes, against toughness it is still one of the few weapons that can ignore FNP on a particular magic number otherwise it is the same as anything else.

3- Folks assaulting a wraithguard unit become a deterrent; no one likes to get hit by a weapon than can kill non-eternal outright. Yes, even flyers might get taken into the warp.

4- Higher point value games became a sight to behold. (Yes, I get to field my Wraithseer along with 6 Wraithlords and maybe an Avatar to boot.)

5- People might have to re-evaluate their warlock powers. (The key words are Invisible/Invincible Wraithguard squad.)

6- Wraithlords are still a primary/secondary choice for getting their smaller brothers out of a pickle.

That’s all I got for now.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on July 16, 2012, 12:11:18 AM
Quote from: Mr.Peanut on July 15, 2012, 10:43:00 PM
Shining Spears haven't been much improved in 6th edition.  The new rules for Lances/Spears benefit them slightly in subsequent turns, but their charge has still been neutered from what was previously underwhelming.  Striking Scorpions are still a decent choice, and Precision Strike might actually make the chainsaber option worth taking.

Skilled rider + jink + fortune makes them as durable as seer councils at range. The fact that they now have a flat increased toughness is awesome. Much more viable now compared to what the other assault units have going against them. They won't need a transport, and have an excellent threat range. Hitting vehicles at WS with their high strength makes them very versatile as well. In one mission, they are also scoring. That is A LOT more notable changes IMO.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: kyle vp on July 21, 2012, 02:09:35 PM
I've been running hq heavy. (eldrad + baharroth).    Fairly effective.  I haven't been going for invisibility, because the rest of the powers are just so underwhelming.   (unless I get everything I'd want out of the other power set).

I'm looking forward to 2500 & 3000 point games. I haven't played any and I have a list I reeeealy want to try.  I put more jetbikes in my army, and have been considering a seer jetbike council.  If it weren't for the low model count that would result in for iyanden, I'd have done it already.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Ogma Cermait on July 28, 2012, 06:49:50 AM
Quote from: Valar on July 15, 2012, 02:09:55 PM
Ok so it seems that silence has fallen accross this once glorious craft world.

Yup.  It seems as quiet as the grave.

I am SO Impressed by how all you Iyandenites stay true to the fluff, even here!!!!

 ;)

Now something semi-serious.  After watching a game recently and reading more fluff about Craftworld Iyanden's determination to survive at all costs after the Tyrannid invasion, I'm now pondering how to play a Ghost Army (especially as I have a gloriously rich yellow calligraphy ink which would simply look amazing on Wraithguard & Wraith Lords).

My quandry lies in choosing HQ options.

The tournament I want to use as an opening campaign for my Golden (not so) Horde is allowing Forge World lists & troops, so all of a sudden the Wraithseer is a valid option.

I was originally considering running an Avatar (using the FW version with the spear) and a Farseer, but now I have the old '3 into 2 won't go' conundrum.

So which two have the best synergy, are reasonably points efficient & would be the most fun to play - for my opponents as much as myself?

Many thanks.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on July 28, 2012, 10:01:43 AM
Well the old 3 into 2 conundrum may not apply depending on your points value as at 2000points you can now take a second FOC which opens up potentially 4 gw slots!

Now I was thinking of having some fun with this and running a wraithseer, avatar, farseer, wraith guard and 6 wraithlords (as well as the required troop slots) :D

As it stands regarding your question the wraithseer psychic powers aren't anything to write home about. I've always run a farseer for the fortune capability in conjunction with conceal and this works flawlessly every time but I suggest you playtest each unit you want to try a few times and find what works for you
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 29, 2012, 03:50:56 AM
Would you believe that I'm playing the following experiment right now:

HQ
Wraithseer - D-Cannon
Eldrad

Trp
Wraithguard x10 - Singing Spear, Conceal
Pathfinders x5

Hvy
AT-Lord
AT-Lord

HQ
Wraithseer - D-Cannon
Bel-Annath

Trp
Wraithguard x10 - Singing Spear, Conceal
Pathfinders x6

Hvy
AT-Lord
AT-Lord

Total = 2493

- I'll give result soon, since the battle is on Wednesday. AT-Lord always have dual flamers, while both character hqs are in wraithguard squads.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Ogma Cermait on July 29, 2012, 05:22:47 AM
Thanks for the replies.

To put my request into context, the tournament in question is 1750pts.

I'm leaning towards Wraithseer & Farseer (and Eldrad is a possibility) at the moment, but that's not exactly written in stone.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 30, 2012, 04:46:50 AM
Quote from: haunt on July 29, 2012, 03:50:56 AM
Would you believe that I'm playing the following experiment right now:

HQ
Wraithseer - D-Cannon
Eldrad

Trp
Wraithguard x10 - Singing Spear, Conceal
Pathfinders x5

Hvy
AT-Lord
AT-Lord

HQ
Wraithseer - D-Cannon
Bel-Annath

Trp
Wraithguard x10 - Singing Spear, Conceal
Pathfinders x6

Hvy
AT-Lord
AT-Lord

Total = 2493

- I'll give result soon, since the battle is on Wednesday. AT-Lord always have dual flamers, while both character hqs are in wraithguard squads.

I'm not sure you can do this as you can not take another Farseer in the same army as Bel-Anath.
I understand that they are in different FOCs but isn't this the same army?  Probably needs a clarification....

Secondely, I would have thought with all the MCing going around that vechicles would be easier to cut down in cc. (you also have 10 Wraithcanons) would leaf blower Lords be better? If you face Dark Eldar in any numbers you're going to suffer.  In fact any horde army may un-stick you...
 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: kyle vp on July 31, 2012, 03:13:20 AM
This is the list I've been fiddling with.  It changes after every match, but this is what I currently have.  Feedback is welcome.   I swap out a bit to fit a wraithseer if my opponent will let me, but usually they don't, so I stick with my swooping hawk contingent.


 2000 points total
HQ:
Eldrad - 210
Baharroth 200

Elites:
Harlequins 186
- 5 troupe w Kiss
- Shadowseer w Kiss
- Death Jester

Troops:
Wraithguard X10 & Spiritseer w Destructor 391 pts
Jet Bikes X6  & warlock 205  pts
- 2 cannons
- Warlock w jetbike, spear, Embolden
jetbikes X3 76 pts
- 1 cannon
Rangers X5 95 pts


Fast Attack
Warp Spiders X 6 + 1 Exarch w Dual Death Spinners 196 pts
 - withdral
Swooping Hawks X4 + Exarch X1 132 pts
 - skyleap

Heavy Support:
Wraithlord 120 pts
- Wraith Blade & scatter Laser
Wraithlord  135 pts
- ELM & scatter laser
Weapon Battery 50 pts
- D-Cannon



Everything should be reasonably durable being the idea. 

While the jetbikes lack the hard durability, they are very mobile.   I try to open a hole for them to hide in on the first round if possible.   Quick, and troops.   Lack of troops I'm finding to be a huge issue for us in 6th.  you can't hold enough objectives with 2 squads of wraithguards.

Lords &: The lords are kitted to primarily deal mass fire, with the added benefit of being able to light tank. (or heavy if need be w/ the elm)

D-cannon: Always been in my list, but more may be coming.  They are very durable now that the guardians w/ it get a toughness comparable to a wraithlord!

Hawks & Baharroth.  They serve two purposes.  Primarily givng me some mass ae firepower by dropping pie plates as often as possible.   This tends to shore up the weakness with horde armies a bit.  (so does the d-cannon)  They don't present a target when doing this, and it seems to be their primary role.  In the case of nasty av 14 vehicles that I can't get my guard close enough to, they solve it for me as their 2nd purpose.   For a 3rd role, Baharroth will join my wraithguard to get them withdraw.   

Warp spiders: General protection for whoever needs it.  highly mobile,  Good fire power, they have gotten my wraith guard out of more than one mess, and can keep your Jetbikes covered at the same time if need be.   <3 withdraw.   I try to leave them locked in h2h until the end of my opponents turn, If I can do so directly in front of my wraithguard, even better >:)

Harlequins: In the event of CC they are brokenly powerful at the moment.   They are what I used in 5th too where most people went scorps or banshees,  I've always loved these models because they offer the same difficulty to kill from range as the rest of my army, Forcing my opponents to brave the wraithguard if they wish to attack.  keeping them in front of my wraith guard which are in front of my lords, and when you can't shoot from long range... It makes me smile.

Eldrad:  New powers hangs with the wraithguard usually.

My list has morphed quite a bit in the 2000 point games.   But really only exchanging for other units that I field in 2500 point games.



Thoughts?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 31, 2012, 05:24:13 AM
Personally I really like the list.
It has a lot of flexibility, is still relatively fluffy too.

You've covered a lot of bases which is good. I think it will be a hard army to face as your oppo will not really be able to have a pre determined counter to it therefore the initiative granted nby your tactical flexability should be a big bonus for you.

You've also got some great models there. This army will look every impressive on the battlefield.

Eldrad I'm not a fan of (controversial I know!) I would have plumped for either the Avatar just to scare people, or Yriel for some extra CC meanness.

D-cannon making a return to lists. Can't wait to field my own 3 gun battery!

I've not run Harlequins before, why does no one take the Troupe master?

And does your 'friend' really not let you use your Wraithseer?




Good list, want to see batrep pictures...
Arq.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: kyle vp on July 31, 2012, 11:33:13 AM
Yea. I know right?   No one around here is big on forgeworld. Sad for me as I used to love apocalypse.

I find the troupe master to be points I don't really have, and you don't get much for it.

Eldrad just gives so much more durability to the wraith guard.  In a larger game I swap him out for a farseer on a jetbike with a small council >:)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 31, 2012, 12:15:14 PM
I think, and correct me if I'm wrong here, but playing defensively suits the inclusion of Eldrad, where as offensively a CC monster (A-Tar / Yriel) is the order of the day...

of course theres more to it I know...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: kyle vp on August 2, 2012, 11:55:10 AM
 I played a couple games with this army.  I ran with baharroth because the wraithseer was not welcome.  The swooping hawks and baharroth Were crazy valuable vs. tau.  I won a very decisive victory, and he conceded at the end of turn 5.  Eldrad took new powers and the 4+ invuln he was able to consistently give the wraith guard was crazy valuable.   It certainly increased their durability vs tau more than rerolling the 3+ saves.   I would not have won were it not for the hawks pie plates.   Baharroth was marked as my leader, which was probably not wise as he would be considered killed if he was off the table when the game ended.   We were at 5-2 at the end though, so it wouldn't have mattered.

My second game was vs dark eldar.  I played horribly.  I deployed all spread out with weak units in scouting positions.   I placed my terrain in ways that gave clear firing lanes and no bulk fortification to hide a clumped army behind.   My wraith lords were out in the open.   He obliterated me.   I conceded on turn 3.  There were a few rule discrepancies that facilitated his victory.  For example, he was charging me out of transports that moved 12".   I was pretty certain he couldn't, he was sure he could, and it was getting late so I just gave it to him.   I believe I need more long range anti tank in the army.   2 wraith lords with elm & scatter lasers would do it.... or perhaps bright lances & scatter, or bright lances and ELM's?   The whole -6" range to all weaponry when firing at any of his stuff was brutal vs wraithguard.  A potent enough ability that I'm unsure how to beat a dark eldar army with a troop of wraithguard in my army.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on September 3, 2012, 06:03:14 PM
So how are people finding the Spirit hosts in 6th? I have been hesitant to use eldar after a game with my Thousand sons against my friends ELdar with allied tau, and it just felt the eldar were put through a shredder...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on September 3, 2012, 07:28:15 PM
One of my favorite lists this edition contains Eldrad, Avatar, 10x scoring Wriathguard, 2x scatter laser Guardians, 2x Wraithlords, and scatter laser warwalkers. It has been pretty effective so far.

Like all things Eldar, finesse and synergy are key.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 5, 2012, 08:36:42 AM
Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on September  3, 2012, 06:03:14 PM
So how are people finding the Spirit hosts in 6th? I have been hesitant to use eldar after a game with my Thousand sons against my friends ELdar with allied tau, and it just felt the eldar were put through a shredder...

The problem is that folks don't know what is the reliant power for support in the edition. As for me Conceal is awesome again especially that covers are mainly 5+ from most things except a few that are usually starting at 4+ cover.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on September 7, 2012, 07:52:43 AM
I like conceal because it lets me use the Wraithguard in open spaces, places that would otherwise be very exposed for other units. They can take objectives a lot easier that way.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on September 7, 2012, 07:44:24 PM
I generally don't take conceal. Using the 25% rules (25% table has terrain, and 25% in cover rules), and the way setting up the table works now, you shouldn't ever not be getting a 5+ cover save from SOMETHING.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 8, 2012, 12:31:11 AM
Honestly, I like conceal but my default secondary is enhance. You should have seen or heard Necron players complaining about me using conceal, shroud and stealth in some games, coz their Imhotep becomes useless against me robots, while their robots get mauled.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Nologik on September 18, 2012, 01:49:34 AM
For me conceal is an absolute must on my WG, being in the open is not an option without conceal. And now that you can isolate units to deny their cover save, rockets will tare right through them. So conceal is an absolute must for me.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on September 18, 2012, 05:45:34 PM
I'm curious what boards people are playing on, and what other units they are fielding. 25% terrain (Don't have to be IN the terrain piece to get cover) and an intervening unit (usually Avatar and/or Wraithlords) have always given my WG a cover save anyway.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dev Null on September 18, 2012, 06:42:09 PM
I'm playing most of my games in a league down at the local game shop, so terrain can be a bit haphazard.  I doubt we're ever close to 25%, and if you don't get in early, you get a lot of crappy low barricades and such.  We're working on more, of course, but it can be hard to pull people away from their armies.

My response is using the patented Wraithguard Mobile Fortification.  Big long line of Wraithies with Conceal and Fortitude in front (curling around a bit to protect the flanks,) with things like Harlies skipping along behind until its charge-time.  That cover save for shooting through another unit is really quite nice.  It has a tendency to clump my points up a fair bit though, so it works out better in the scenarios with fewer objectives.  Relic Football is totally our favorite game.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on September 18, 2012, 07:11:30 PM
I usually place at least one objective out in the open aswell, where I know my Wraithguard can tread with a cover save relatively safely while the opponent will be punished severely if he tries anything.

I like the idea of Harlequins using the Wraithguard as a way to get a 2+ cover save. How has that worked out for you, though? From the little I've played, nothing dares to come within 18" of the Wraithguard (6" move, 12" shoot). Even if they could, not many close combat specialists can tackle Wraithguard out of the blue!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dev Null on September 18, 2012, 08:11:06 PM
Well keep in mind that I'm relatively new to the game, and I'm playing with a mix of old boys and other newbs.  As I start to hit the same opponents, I fully expect someone - probably one of the more experienced players - to say "Hang on... why don't we just stay away from those guys" at some point.  And then I'll have to mix up a new list.  (Hopefully by then I'll have some other stuff painted...)

That said, everyone so far seems to have something they reckon is hard as nails in CC.  And when they get sick of bouncing shots off of Fortuned armour saves and high toughness of the WG, they get frustrated and decide to smash them with deep striking power-fisted termies or some such.  Then the WG shoot them half full of holes and the Harlies pop out and eat the rest.  Not the best tactic, of course, which is why I expect it to stop happening, but given the sheer amount of ranged fire I've seen those WG shrug off, I can well understand the frustration taking hold.  I haven't faced many tank-heavy armies yet - I imagine they'll shoot me full of holes before I get close.

Keep in mind that the Harlies aren't entirely shackled to the WG line.  They can use their fast movement to jump over to nearby area terrain, which does the job just as well.  Harder to Fortune them at that point, of course, but I tend to do that sparingly anyways, preferring to Guide a second shooty unit instead, or Mind War someone troublesome.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 19, 2012, 01:13:16 AM
Quote from: Atnas on September 18, 2012, 07:11:30 PM
I usually place at least one objective out in the open aswell, where I know my Wraithguard can tread with a cover save relatively safely while the opponent will be punished severely if he tries anything.

I like the idea of Harlequins using the Wraithguard as a way to get a 2+ cover save. How has that worked out for you, though? From the little I've played, nothing dares to come within 18" of the Wraithguard (6" move, 12" shoot). Even if they could, not many close combat specialists can tackle Wraithguard out of the blue!

These statements ring true, as most cc units that can handle WG are genestealers, assault termies even MCs have to think about assaulting these guys due to their S and T with a MEQ save.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on September 19, 2012, 05:04:00 AM
With the new changes to Fearless, I don't even have to be afraid of WG crumbling. They'll have to kill every last one of them. Of course that's not very good news for the Farseer or anything, but still!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on September 19, 2012, 06:18:20 AM
And the counter attack by the Harlequins will really throw a spanner in the works. It would either take quite a concerted effort to shift them or a bold general to lead troops against that.

As for the Seer getting caught in the assault you can always place him in the Harle squad at the rear. THe WG then take the charge and in the subsequent move phase take the seer out of the harle unit brefore they charge in. Everybody's happy.  ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on September 19, 2012, 12:22:07 PM
I've been playing around with a few lists, but a few things have come out as relative constants:

- My Wraithguard formation includes Eldrad, 10 x WG and supported by 2 x BL-armed WL and a nearby unit of Harlies.  Everything else is kind of plug-and-play, but two BL-armed Wave Serpents seems to add the most flexibility.

- 10 x WG with Fortune and Guide makes a pretty tough nut for most to crack.
- 10 x WG scares any amount of vehicle movement
- Nearby WL are a heavy deterrent
- Nearby Harlies scare people (a little less so now that they must go Init 1 if going through terrain)

Use the remainder of the list to create a manoeuvre and/or fire support section and push forward.  They will take a huge amount of punishment.  I use my Wave Serpents to support the advance and Tank Shock/block avenues of advance (going from needing 6's to hit to 3 due to WS1 hits HARD) also helps limit the amount of incoming fire (particularly targeting anything S8+, rending, etc).  I've not bothered to play with the powers in the BRB; thinking that will have to change tomorrow night during our LGS 40k night.

My 1850 list (top of my head):

Eldrad
8 x Harlies w/ Kisses and Shadowseer
10 x WG w/ Enhance-seer
10 x Defenders w/ Embold-lock and EML
1 x WS w/ BL turret
10 x Avengers, Exarch w/ Bladestorm, PW/SS
1 x WS w/ BL turret
5 x Reapers, Exarch w/ Fast Shot, EML
1 x WL, two flamers, BL
1 x WL, two flamers, BL

That's 4 BL shots and 3 EML shots per turn.  Includes 3 Scoring Units, as well as 4 units with T8/equivalency with 3 wounds/HPs.  So far, so good.


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dev Null on September 19, 2012, 05:10:40 PM
Quote from: f.desrochers on September 19, 2012, 12:22:07 PM
- Nearby Harlies scare people (a little less so now that they must go Init 1 if going through terrain)
Shadowseer - without whom Harlies should never travel - gives them Hallucinogen Grenades, which are Plasma Grenades, which ignore the I penalty for charging through difficult.  Right?  Thats what I've been playing - hate to think I'm doing it wrong...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on September 19, 2012, 05:15:24 PM
The rules for Plasma grenades are explicitly stated on the second page of the main rulebook FAQ (http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1490286a_40K_Rulebook_v1.pdf).
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on September 19, 2012, 07:45:46 PM
Quote from: Dev Null on September 19, 2012, 05:10:40 PM
Quote from: f.desrochers on September 19, 2012, 12:22:07 PM
- Nearby Harlies scare people (a little less so now that they must go Init 1 if going through terrain)
Shadowseer - without whom Harlies should never travel - gives them Hallucinogen Grenades, which are Plasma Grenades, which ignore the I penalty for charging through difficult.  Right?  Thats what I've been playing - hate to think I'm doing it wrong...

Quote from: Irisado on September 19, 2012, 05:15:24 PM
The rules for Plasma grenades are explicitly stated on the second page of the main rulebook FAQ (http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1490286a_40K_Rulebook_v1.pdf).

LMFAO. <facepalm>  Was at work when I typed that and totally fixated on the FAQ for the BRB (page 3), which talks about models ignoring difficult terrain still fighting at Init 1; totally fanned on the plasma grenades.....

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on September 20, 2012, 08:34:41 PM
I know this is off the current toppic, but i was wondering if anyone has done any heavy modeling or converting of the new finecast wraithguard.

I dont need more of them by any means, but if they are easy enough to work with in the fine cast, I am def going to get some.

Wraithguard are beautiful minis, but they've always needed some serious posing help.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on September 21, 2012, 11:02:59 PM
Why not make it 100? Do you ever get to use all of them at once? What do you do besides different paint jobs to make them unique and different frome one another?

Ive found that converting metal wraithguard to kneeling positions and the like is both time consuming and somewhat exhausting. Ive decided to get those resin ones eventually, but am still interested in hearing about them from anyone who has worked with them.

May the flame never be extingushed!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on September 29, 2012, 08:27:00 PM
It's hard to convert these metal wraithguards as the weapon is part of the mold on the figure. ALL 3 poses.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on October 21, 2012, 10:45:54 AM
Not sure if i am going to get scolded for this, or if maybe these links belong in a different thread,  but i have a feeling you gents will appreciate these. Also, i am not even sure im posting these links correctly!

 Mobile Photobucket (http://m1358.photobucket.com/albumview/albums/Cabelus/2012-09-22_22-41-09_578_zps7c02a904.jpg.html?o=29&newest=1)

 Mobile Photobucket (http://m1358.photobucket.com/albumview/albums/Cabelus/2012-09-22_22-41-18_536_zpsff07fb3c.jpg.html?o=34&newest=1)

 Mobile Photobucket (http://m1358.photobucket.com/albumview/albums/Cabelus/2012-03-04_15-44-29_173_zps3bcff44e.jpg.html?o=27&newest=1)

 Mobile Photobucket (http://m1358.photobucket.com/albumview/albums/Cabelus/2012-02-12_17-50-51_119_zps811af34f.jpg.html?o=24&newest=1)

These are my warp spectres, (count as either warp spiders or shadow specters) wraithlock/mini wraithseer, and my home made wraithguard conversion. All use some real parts and some sculpting.

I LOVE WRAITH UNITS!!!

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on October 21, 2012, 12:58:43 PM
They look promising, but the images are so tiny that I can barely make it out! Can you upload them in a bigger size you think?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on October 21, 2012, 06:25:32 PM
When i get home to a real computer, i will totes try to make those images bigger.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on October 30, 2012, 09:40:59 PM
I'm thinking of dusting off my eldar (and Proberly repainting them, wishing Iyanden wasn't yellow, but I love the fluff :P) and I am wondering how people are using the the psychic powers, are they keeping with ours or going for the rule book ones (such as the fresher who joined my gaming group, and his tau or ultramarines all ways have a fully kitted out far seer with pathfinders when ever he plays me, despite knowing we are a casual list he goes all out taking the cheesiest list because that is what a GW staff member told him to do at a uni gaming club.)
I'm also wondering how people generally think of swooping hawks this addition as well.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on October 31, 2012, 12:02:58 AM
Honestly, good ol' Fortune works and at least it isn't random, my second choice is Guide and then maybe Doom and or Mind War.

At least this way, I know what I have and control the field as much as I can.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on November 1, 2012, 03:57:17 PM
That's good, my farseer will properly stay the same as always then :P
I am curious about how 6th has effected our HQ's, and am curious about people's thoughts,especially their opinions of second HQ's
Also thinking of using some fire dragons, but they may be a bit redundant when I have the wraithguard. I'm thinking an ash white grey for the armour with either yellow or orange on the helmets, not sure what to do the guns, possibly a bronze to tie them in with my other aspect warriors, buy am thinking of  stripping those :P
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 2, 2012, 07:44:42 PM
Playing against a Dark Eldar tomorrow, this is going to be hopeless. 10 Wraithguard and 2 Wraithlords are going to get munched extremely quickly. That's a problem with playing an Iyanden style list, automatic loss against the darker kin. Any advice? I'm considering using this game as a chance to skip on all Wraith units entirely and just see how that goes, but it feels a bit like cheating since then I wont be using an all-comers list while he will be. On the other hand, with my Wraith units, it wont be a game at all since he'll just walk over roughly 800 points with his normal troops.

If I do take my Wraithwall list... how can I mitigate the damage? =/
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on November 2, 2012, 10:21:51 PM
This is actually the better times to use the bait and ambush tactic, 1 unit of wraithguards and then the rest are just storm guardians and don't forget good ol Avatar or Yriel along with his corsairs, lol.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 3, 2012, 05:06:48 AM
I can't help but feel that your post is sort of lacking in real tactical meat here :P

My Wraithguard are troubled, but they've got fortune and numbers to help them out. No, it's the Wraithlords that are in real deep amphetamine parrot! With so few wounds and relatively low save they'll be eaten alive. How the heck am I going to deal with this matchup?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on November 3, 2012, 06:01:35 AM
Possibly drop/swap a couple of wraithlords for swooping hawks, warphunters/falcons/vypers? I must admit I aonly run two wraithlords as I love my War hunter, as long as you keep the theme of Iyanden and everything's painted okay it should be good.
I'm actually looking forward to when I get my eldar repainted/ready and I can face against the local dark eldar player, my Swooping hawks should be godly against him :P
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 3, 2012, 03:51:34 PM
I'm not actually looking for advice on what to swap out, since that means I wouldn't have a problem. I only design and play all-comers lists since tailoring my list to upcoming battles is a bit unfair if the opponent doesn't do it, or even knows my race. It's also the best way to learn how to play the game better since then you can't always take all the best things all the time (something you can't do in a tournament, for example).

Anyway, I decided to weather the storm with my Wraithguard and to try and rely on their armor save + fortune while the Wraithlords were going to be kept waaay back to make sure I minimized their exposure.

It almost worked. However, he had 2 flyers and I couldn't hit them or even glance them to save my life (brought them both down to 1 HP each, but the flickerfields and poor rolls took care of everything else) so they unloaded their missiles all over the place. While I was extra heavy on troops while I played, I didn't have the means to oust his troops off his and the game ended turn 5 with him holding one more objective.

Not an unwinnable game, but definitely stacked in his favor. I really need anti-air, poison wasn't quite as important.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on November 3, 2012, 05:39:21 PM
Ouch, that is what I feared when I saw the flyer rules, that unless you took your own or dedicated anti air units, you would be toast, I know GW skew the rules to drive sales, but what they have done with flyers  just strikes me as rather unscrupulous.
I guess the best thing would be to ignore flyers, tey can't win if there toops have been blasted from the game.
I must admit, I have recently started list tailoring, as one of the freshers started doing it, when ever he faced necrons, it would be pure tau, against my Thousand sons, his "all rounder list"  seems to gain kitted out farseers and pathfinder allies.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 3, 2012, 06:40:43 PM
They come loaded with some heavy guns, the Razorwing Jetfighters carrying among other things 4 Missiles with perfect stats to kill Guardians (S, AP and Blast template wise) and 2 Dark Lances. Can you really 'ignore' that?

Can you really 'ignore' 2 of those?

Not really. This is a big weakness of my list however, since it features few models capable of skyfire or a high rate of fire to counter the forced snap shots. I was lucky enough to get both Guided Guardians and Guided Wraithguards within range (granted, there was only 3 Wraithguard remaining at that point :P) and still my dice would simply not allow them to be taken down. Rendered my Wraithlords useless aswell since their rate of fire is so low.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on November 3, 2012, 07:52:07 PM
Not really I guess :( That is a problem. Wave serpents wit Scatter lasers may be good against flyers just for the fact tey are twin linked with  shots. I am dreading when any of my gaming club's players bring flyers in..
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 3, 2012, 08:26:52 PM
Scatters don't do the work against AV12 fliers.

My solution will be to ally in a Dark Eldar Void Raven. It has fantastic anti-tank weapons with its Void Lances, and is just a step up above getting glanced on S4 weapons.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on November 4, 2012, 07:33:01 AM
Was tinking of getting some dark eldar to use as allies for both my thousand sons and iyanden :P
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 5, 2012, 05:39:25 AM
Quote from: Atnas on November  3, 2012, 08:26:52 PM
Scatters don't do the work against AV12 fliers.

My solution will be to ally in a Dark Eldar Void Raven. It has fantastic anti-tank weapons with its Void Lances, and is just a step up above getting glanced on S4 weapons.

For sme reason a lot of people on this forum seem to forget us Elader have some pretty good flyers of our own. The Nighwing is a great AA/AT weapon and the Phoenix is a great ground attack aircraft.

Also the FIRESTORM is an awesomne AA tank. Go and convert a Falcon into a Firestorm and watch the debris fall...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 5, 2012, 06:07:40 AM
The Nightwing is expensive, has the same AV and HP as a War Walker (!) and doesn't really do a whole lot of shooting. If I am lucky it can kill off a flyer the turn it arrives, but statistically, it doesn't. Having a flyer that is going to be killed off by anything with skyfire/intercept before it arrives, or risk having it be glanced to death by Bolter fire is not a very good idea.

The Phoenix is awful as anti-air, it's meant to shoot things on the ground. It's also waaay too expensive and fragile aswell. If I wanted things on the ground killed, I could take 2 Fire Prisms for the same price as 1 Phoenix Bomber with greater effect. It's not very good against tanks either, firing few shots that can threaten high AV.

The Firestorm is also not very impressive. It costs a ton and still cannot give a reliable result againat AV12 flyers (which are very common).
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 5, 2012, 06:18:12 AM
So you're complaining you can't shoot down flyers, I give you 2 units which do precisly that and you don't want to take them. Suit yourself.

Quote from: Atnas on November  5, 2012, 06:07:40 AM
The Nightwing is expensive, has the same AV and HP as a War Walker (!) and doesn't really do a whole lot of shooting.
The reliability of flyers is that there are only selected weapons can shoot at them with any really effect, therefore comparing the HP and AV between ground and air assets is simply daft. Plus the Nightwing puts out 2 lance shots and 6 S6 shots all of which are AA. There is simply nothing better in the Eldar list for AA. 

Quote
The Firestorm is also not very impressive.
I managed to kill 5 Flying MC's in one game but you're right, that's not all that impressive  ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 5, 2012, 06:30:11 AM
I'm complaining about not being able to shoot down flyers, and you give me examples of things that are overcosted and not very good at shooting down flyers. Of course I am not satisfied.

Quote
The reliability of flyers is that there are only selected weapons can shoot at them with any really effect, therefore comparing the HP and AV between ground and air assets is simply daft.

I'm not comparing a War Walker to a Yhwh-condemned Nightwing, but since we aren't allowed to make outright stat reveals I had to liken it to something. A single War Walker and a Nightwing share the exact same AV and HP, the point being that the Nightwing is paper thin. Massed S4 shooting (or god forbid, S6 shooting) will blow it out of the sky... and so will ANY other flyer, or model with skyfire/intercept. The Nightwing will not survive a single round if the enemy has any anti-air whatsoever.

Quote
Plus the Nightwing puts out 2 lance shots and 6 S6 shots all of which are AA. There is simply nothing better in the Eldar list for AA.

That's exactly my point, though. There is no better AA for our lists and that's troublesome because 2 Lance shots and those S6 shots are not sufficient to bring down enemy flyers that unlike the Nightwing, very often has AV12 and HP3. On average, you'll inflict roughly 1,5 HP against them per round of shooting. For a flyer that is supposed to be exclusively air superiority, it does this very poorly.

Quote
I managed to kill 5 Flying MC's in one game but you're right, that's not all that impressive

Anecdotal evidence isn't evidence at all, and I seriously doubt your claim here. Are you implying that the Firestorm shot them all down by itself? It, with its Skyfire Scatter Lasers with crap AP killed off several flying MCs with fully intact armor saves? When you wound on a 4+? And your opponent somehow let you do this, without trying to bring it down at all? One would think that with 5 Flying MCs, he'd be a bit more considerate about killing off AA. I mean, on average the Firestorm inflicts 1 wound against a MC flyer that has a 3+ save (be it armor or invul).

Either your opponent was really, really terrible or you are grossly exaggerating the game. Either way, the Firestorm is overly priced for what it does. Against an AV12 fighter, on average it managed 1 Glancing hit per round of shooting. Not good at all, in fact that's awful. I can definitely see it being a threat against AV10 flyers, but against AV12 (and that's what I mainly struggle against) it doesn't do jack.


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on November 5, 2012, 07:09:28 AM
I can see why you have the moniker you do.

No the Firestorm did not kill 5 Flying MC's, on its own. But like all Eldar armies it works well with the rest of the army to bring about an Eldar victory.

Not really sure any of us can give you any real advice with your current state of mind other than for you to go back to playing with your Ultramarines.

Hope that helps

Arq.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 5, 2012, 07:54:37 AM
By being realistic about our anti-air options you tell me to go play Ultramarines? Grow up. Eldar has serious anti-air problems and Forgeworld isn't solving them. You've got to give me some  statistics, or anything more tangible than "The Nightwing is good against flyers because that's what the description says". I need real numbers! How is the Nightwing good anti-air if it can't deliver the punch statistically, on average?

The Firestorm, for example. On average it does 1 wound to a monstrous creature. How does that contribute a whole lot? If you Doom the MC, you do 2 wounds. For the cost of 3 War Walkers, I'd expect a lot more out of it .What's worse, if you guide 3 War Walkers they become both better anti-air and anti-ground then the Firestorm!

It's simply not good enough for its cost =/ If it was cheaper I'd be more favorable to it.

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on November 5, 2012, 08:09:57 AM
[mod]Let's stick to arguing the point and not the personalities please. There's no need to make any personal comments on either side when debating the effectiveness of units.[/mod]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on November 6, 2012, 04:29:16 AM
I'm thinking of possibly getting some Dark eldar allies, I'm thinking Archon and incubi in a venom or raider, some warriors in a raider, and some scourges and the fighter would be good alround support for a craftworld list especially in anti air/anti terminator roles.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: cabie22 (Thread-Jacker) on November 17, 2012, 10:36:35 PM
Got to say i agree with arq. The way i have always viewed eldar units is that they suck individually, but somehow overall when combined with the rest of the army, they work. Use powers, psycic or otherwise. Use agis lines. Alternatively, be patient and wait for teh new hawtness. *super shrug* dont really know what to tell you bro..... wish list?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 5thHorseman on November 19, 2012, 12:04:35 AM
New Iyanden list I've been kicking around would like some feed back.  Thanks!

HQ
Farseer : Power, Spear Jetbike
Farseer: Power, fortune, spirit stones, RoWarding, Spear, Jetbike

Troops
3 G. Jetbikes with SC
3 G. Jetbikes with SC

10 Wraithguard, Spirit seer, conceal

Heavy Support:
Wraith Lord SC, SL
Wraith Lord SC, SL

Fast Attack
5 swooping hawks

--Allies--
Archon: Huskblade, shadow field

Troops
10 Kabalite Warriors: Blaster, Splinter Cannon
10 Kabalite Warriors: Blaster, Splinter Cannon

Elites
4 Incubi : Klaivex

Transports
Raider: Dis. Cannon, Flicker Fields
Raider: Dis. Cannon, Flicker Fields
Venom: SC

Heavy Support
Razorwing: SC
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on November 19, 2012, 03:37:38 PM
What points limit is this? 2000? I think the list looks fantastic, very potent! May I suggest swapping your two Farseers for Eldrad, however? It's going to be cheaper, you'll put out the same amount of powers and if you hadn't noticed, due to his crystallizing body (I imagine?) Eldrad actually has the same toughness as a Farseer on a Jetbike. Of course, you lose the mobility of the two Farseers you have, but your list has remarkably little Eldar units anyway and therefore the buff spells that has short range don't matter much... and Doom can be used from almost anywhere on the battlefield to the benefit of everyone else.

Is the SC on the Wraithlords a Star Cannon or Shuriken Cannon? If it's a Star Cannon I say go for it, but if it's Shuriken Cannons I suggest an upgrade to either EML or Star Cannon. While they are certainly kept cheap your way, Wraithlords are slow and really want that 36" (or higher) on their weapons.

I'd try to find the points for an Exarch + Intercept on the Swooping Hawks. I realise they are a cheap anti-vehicle option, but the Exarch can use his BS to throw a good haywire grenade before charging. Intercept will pretty much guarantee the vehicle kill, while hitting vehicles on a 3+ may result in some missed hits when you need them the most (not to mention 1's on the Haywires).

I'd buy Flickerfields and Night Shields for your Razorwing. Why? Well, with Flickerfields he'll never have to really go into Evade and with Night Shields, you can dodge vehicles or fortifications with Interceptor more easily (a Quad Gun is 48" for example, but 42" gives you extra space to enter the battlefield on).

To finance these changes I'd completely drop your Incubi. I don't think such a small squad (led by the Archon or not) is capable of anything worthwhile. Perhaps Trueborn with Blasters could serve you better?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: 5thHorseman on November 19, 2012, 10:45:54 PM
yep it is a 2k list can't believe I forgot the total points. I have a couple other variations that are rattling around in the old brain box.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dread on November 27, 2012, 09:35:01 PM
Coming in a little late on this conversation, but, I do play both armies and have not yet done allies. But if you were to use allies, the razorwing and the voidraven bomber would be excellent for taking care of pesky flyers. I have been trying to find a happy medium myself. Get tabled with both armies all the time. I like my void dragon as well as my nightwing but the DE ones seem to survive better. I'm gonna try a Saim Hann with DE back up mainly for reavers, too bad I can't mount a character on a reaver jetbike, hmmph!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Aislinn on January 14, 2013, 07:36:18 PM
Hey guys!  I haven't been paying for a while cause of work and stuff. Now i am trying to get back into it.   I have tried a few armies in the new rules, bit not really liking close combat. I am looking into different armies to try, but want to know how the trusty ghost warriors have fared in the new rules. I have yet to try them out myself but i am thinking they would do Better than most. Thanks for the support!
   -Aislinn
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on January 15, 2013, 01:08:16 AM
Honestly, as a Ghost Army user I find the new rules helps more than hinder. Like I try to get terrain usage alomg with warlord traits
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Atnas on January 15, 2013, 08:23:23 AM
The new rules have mainly helped them. Wraithguard have become a lot better!

- Fearless no longer means you "crumble" if you lose combat, you just pass the LD test. Makes them more durable in assaults (often they are forced upon you).
- Glancing can now kill vehicles, so the Wraithguard became even more reliable when used against tanks.
- Potential Night Fighting at the beginning of all scenarios means the Wraithguard become more durable first turn due to stealth/shrouded.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on May 12, 2013, 08:22:59 PM
Well gang,

It seems I have gotten a gauntlet thrown at me by my friend whose codex has just been revived (Tau), and he wants an Eldar General to face him. Who can keep up with his army.

I'm bringing this army against him and please comment or suggest, do remember I have played this against Tau before and annihilated their army.

HQ
Farseer Na’Nular (Eldrad) [***]
Farseer Ruaki [125] Stone, Fortune, Guide

Troops
Ranger x6 [114]
Wraithguard x10 [496] Conceal-Seer
Wraithguard x10 [496] Conceal-Seer
Wraithguard x10 [496] Enhance-Seer
Wraithguard x10 [496] Enhance-Seer

Heavy
AT-Lord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
AT-Lord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML
AT-Lord [155] Flamer x2, BL, EML

Total = 2498

- Deploy Ranger in the middle and keep firing till wraiths are in better range.
- Lords will cover fire and take-out vehicles or Broadsides.
- Otherwise it gets in front of the wraiths we just turn the wraithcannons on.

PS.

Found out he'll bring his 2 Riptides against my army.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on May 13, 2013, 05:59:57 PM
How have you found the wraithlords with Eldar missile launcher and brightlance? It might be my luck, but he never does anything, even rhinos he cannot handle whilst my Wraithlord with scattler laser and starcannon is wrecking infantry, bringing down fliers, hammering light vehicles and tanks.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on May 13, 2013, 06:06:38 PM
Quote from: ZarathustraSuicuine on May 13, 2013, 05:59:57 PM
It might be my luck, but he never does anything, even rhinos he cannot handle whilst my Wraithlord with scattler laser and starcannon is wrecking infantry, bringing down fliers, hammering light vehicles and tanks.

If you're only fielding one, then that's why you're not getting anywhere.  You need two or three for them to work, especially in the anti-tank role.

Incidentally, there's nothing wrong either with going down the route that you've outlined, providing you're only interested in dealing with AV11 or lower, and infantry.

Haunt: Your list is way too spammish for my tastes.  I think that you're spending so many points on Wraithguard that you're really going to suffer in missions which require mobility.  I think that more unit variety, particularly in the form of mobile deep striking units like Warp Spiders might be helpful, since these could start off the board, and come in where needed to keep your opponent on his toes.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on May 13, 2013, 07:25:19 PM
I run one of each with a warphunter, neither have died, it's just that the as a tank hunter he never seems to do much, and I am thinking of either switching him ot the scatter/star cannon format or swapping his bright lance for a scatter laser.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on May 14, 2013, 05:22:32 AM
If I understand correctly, you have one Wraithlord configured with an EML and Brightlance, and the other equipped with a Starcannon and Scatter Laser.  Assuming I'm correct, then yes, I don't see any value in continuing to field the anti-tank Wraithlord for the reasons which I mentioned in my previous post.  On that basis, I recommend converting this one to the Scatter Laser and Starcannon combination too, since the plasma missile isn't good enough against infantry in my experience to warrant keeping it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on May 14, 2013, 11:34:49 PM
ZarathustraSuicuine: AT-Lords are ONLY great when field in multiples, as long as you have points for them. Default (Dakka) Lords are awesome, its what I usually field spamming S6 shots all around.

Why I'm using AT-Lords is to punish multi-wound models that are T4 and are not Eternal Warrior, also it bypasses FNP.

Irisado: I know what you mean, trust me. As I have played for so long I usually have support fires from other sources. My friend trashed talked our Eldar and am just returning it in kind on the battlefield.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on May 15, 2013, 07:08:54 AM
That is annoying... whilst taking multiples of something should increase their effectiveness, it should not be necessarily for them to do their job.. and that is the one wraithlord that I stuck on the weapons :/
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Lachdonin on May 20, 2013, 05:12:42 AM
A little something for the Ghost Warriors... It seems Iyanden is (probably, these are still rumours despite looking absolutely authentic) getting a supplement straight out of the gate with the new Eldar. It will contain background, scenarios, colours/heraldry and some additional rules for using an Iyanden army.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on May 20, 2013, 07:08:05 AM
I have seen the cover for the Iyanden supplement.  Guess who's getting a special publication with special rules that will encourage more Wraithlord and Wraithknight sales!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Lachdonin on May 20, 2013, 07:27:27 AM
Quote from: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on May 20, 2013, 07:08:05 AM
I have seen the cover for the Iyanden supplement.  Guess who's getting a special publication with special rules that will encourage more Wraithlord and Wraithknight sales!

In before Wraithguard are $50 a box for 5?

Seriously though, i think the idea of supplements has potential for GW, particularly with their accelerated release schedule (as i stated elsewhere, at this rate they'll be done with the armies, and need a new edition to keep things rolling, by next summer). It would allow them to give treatment to specific forces like the Craftworlds and some of the Chapters (particularly ones which only slightly differ from the Codex) as well as some well known Guard regiments.

That said, it could also be something they blow catastrophically, such as the Craftworld Codex (I'm Eldar, and i don't miss those days...) by making the armies in the supplements simply better than the codex, or by pricing the supplements too high, or by making them only Digital (Oh, wait...).

As with alot of things GW does, i think this has great potential... But it will probably backfire terribly.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on May 20, 2013, 11:29:49 AM
I thought I'd head over here as soon as I saw the supplement cover, work must got in the way!


I like the look of the Wraithknight but I do believe its suffering from the typical GW release pants post and piss poor paint job syndrome that we've come to recognise all too frequently of late.

I love the fact Iyanden are getting a supplement that's really brightened up my day.  And yes I think this is a good idea to flesh out the 40K universe. I just hope GW stick to it long enough to be worth while.


I'm looking forward to seeing the new Wraithblades. Disappointingly unimaginative name but you can't have everything can you.


My Eldar have been sitting on the shelf for far too long and Now, unlike what happened with the CSM codex, I'm actually excited to be fielding them again!

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on May 24, 2013, 05:32:05 PM
Quote from: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on May 20, 2013, 07:08:05 AM
I have seen the cover for the Iyanden supplement.  Guess who's getting a special publication with special rules that will encourage more Wraithlord and Wraithknight sales!
From what I read about rumors, the 'supplement' is going to be only about fluff, not actual gameplay.

I could be wrong though, heh.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on May 25, 2013, 05:26:02 AM
Anyone else annoyed the stock studio color is Sain ham's?  Really does not look good on well.. most of them, and in regards to the wraith units they just look so better in it (prime example, look at the wraithguard, and look at the one with a pair of swords and in Iyanden colors, so badass).
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on May 25, 2013, 06:19:22 PM
No, thats not what annoys me.... what annoys me is that the models they have painted in traditional Iyanden colours are terrible.  I thought these were Eavy metal painted quality paint jobs but no every single Iyanden paintjob in the new WD is total poo!  I dont think that  their slapdash paintjobs do these new models any justice... especially the beautiful flyers in thier flat yet somehow garish rendition of Iyanden.

Lets just save the traditional scheme for the pro's eh GW?  ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Starrakatt on May 25, 2013, 06:39:00 PM
Quote from: -V- on May 25, 2013, 06:19:22 PM
No, thats not what annoys me.... what annoys me is that the models they have painted in traditional Iyanden colours are terrible.  I thought these were Eavy metal painted quality paint jobs but no every single Iyanden paintjob in the new WD is total poo!  I dont think that  their slapdash paintjobs do these new models any justice... especially the beautiful flyers in thier flat yet somehow garish rendition of Iyanden.

Lets just save the traditional scheme for the pro's eh GW?  ;)
Get them to hire you! :P  Maybe their color schemes seems so bland because most of their painters are 'paint by numbers professionals' and not really miniature artists?

You know you gonna have to paint us one of these Wraithknight, Valar saucetm, mmm?

Hey ho, how comes you didn't get that Spiritseer Title and kick me down to Wraithlord btw? Admit it, you've been scary lazy. Tsk-tsk, tickle-tickle.

   Starky
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: bebe on May 29, 2013, 07:02:37 PM

I have put my Iyanden aside for so long i forgot what they looked like. I brought them out twice in 6ed - for DE/eldar wraithwall shenanigans. Worked well. But fortune is now random, it is trickier relying on any powers, so I will have to wait and see ... I need to see the restrictions for using them as troops as well.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: edamame on May 29, 2013, 09:53:19 PM
Quote from: bebe on May 29, 2013, 07:02:37 PM

I have put my Iyanden aside for so long i forgot what they looked like. I brought them out twice in 6ed - for DE/eldar wraithwall shenanigans. Worked well. But fortune is now random, it is trickier relying on any powers, so I will have to wait and see ... I need to see the restrictions for using them as troops as well.

According to leaked Codex documents, Wraithguard will still be available as troops if you take a Spiritseer.

I think I'm definitely going to start stripping paint on my current army and go for a Iyanden theme with a bit of DE pirateness.

As for DE/Wraithwall combos, Wraithscythes are nasty, and I imagine a Baron Sathonyx & WG combo will be even more deadly than before.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on June 1, 2013, 09:18:27 AM
Is anyone going to be using wraithseers at 1000-2000pts size games anymore? Between wraithsight going and spiritseers being needed for wraith troops and farseers being Lv3 for 20 melta bombs, they do kind of seem in bit of pickle, though I will still try one I am not sure how well it will work.
Have swapped out my lance/missile launcher lord for a swooping hawk squad with talon exarch (Not sure on any of the abilities just yet), a vyper with scatter laser (though may give a starcannon or bright lance a try) and holofields on my warphunter in 1000pts. I m looking forward to when my wriath blades are finished though :)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 2, 2013, 06:48:17 PM
Well, I have been looking at my lists and prolly my theme army will and IF my LGS will allow me to bring it for display at the least will be this:

HQ
Farseer
Spiritseer

Troops
Wraithguard x10
Wraithguard x10
Wraithguard x10
AT-Wraithlord
AT-Wraithlord
AT-Wraithlord

Elite
Wraithblade x10 (under construction as we blog)
Wraithblade x10 (under construction as we blog)
Wraithblade x10 (under construction as we blog)

Fast
Hemlock Wraithfighter (under construction as we blog)
Hemlock Wraithfighter (under construction as we blog)
Hemlock Wraithfighter (under construction as we blog)

Heavy
Wraithknight (under construction as we blog)
Wraithknight (under construction as we blog)
Wraithknight (under construction as we blog)

Just gotta get a suc... meant a believer to help me build them all.  ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on June 3, 2013, 05:03:44 AM
Spiritseers don't shift Wraithlords anywhere at all sadly, they just make wraithguard and wraithblades troops.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Lachdonin on June 3, 2013, 04:00:58 PM
Iyanden - A Codex: Eldar Supplement. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmaykUjsBPM#ws)

A confirmation for the Ghost Warriors that the supplement is NOT going to just be heraldry, stories and artwork. Looks like supplements may well be back in.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on June 3, 2013, 07:23:55 PM
You really thought that GW would release a $50 book for some reason other than selling more Wraith kits?

Don't panic, most of the "classic" Farseer powers are Primaris powers.  Fortune and Guide are among them, I'm not sure about the others (Mind War remained neutered by the Focused Witchfire rules ... because Eldar just aren't that good at Psychic powers).
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 4, 2013, 12:04:19 AM
Hopefully my classic list will make a comeback, since I TRULLY like have 5 Spiritseers in place of 1 and they all can join a wraith guard/blade unit, as each is an independent character of their own right.  ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: ZarathustraSuicuine on June 4, 2013, 06:15:03 AM
Who does GW get to do the music? It's quite nice music there :P
I'm hoping it is affordable though...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: -V- on June 4, 2013, 07:54:47 AM
Well I did have a go at writing up a version of my Mech- Iyanden list that I so love but I got stuck with about 306 points left over from 1750.  I figured not to get too hung up about it as I could wait for the supplement in a few days time.  Anyways here is as far as I got

Spirit Seer

waveserpent TL shuricannon and Shuricannon upgrade. Holofield spirit stones
Waveserpent TL missile, shuricannon, holofield spirit stones
Waveserpent TL missile, shuricannon, holofield spirit stones
6 Wraithguard
6 wraithguard
5 wraithguard - d scythes (spiritseer goes here)
2 Fire prism, holofield spirit stones

total was 1444 and wasnt sure how to spend that last 306.... The thought of hawks or scorpians was quite appealing as was a 20 strong guardian squad with 2 platforms or a few small jetbike squads but I really couldnt decide which way to go.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 4, 2013, 08:49:50 AM
Wait for the Iyanden book, you'll like it and you might end up scrapping your list and rebuild it. Coz I have to redo mine.  ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on June 4, 2013, 08:02:51 PM
Definitely wait to see what buffs the Iyanden codex gives, but Swooping Hawks may be a solid choice.  They're still too expensive, but Lasblasters get more shots now.  You could get Warpspiders but they're also a short ranged unit, adding something with high mobility, more reach, and enough volume for anti-infantry fire is what the list needs.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 5, 2013, 12:03:28 AM
Shadow Council is MUST, expect that. A few more changes in the force org too.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Partninja on June 9, 2013, 11:35:39 PM
Can anyone offer any suggestions on books/other literature that goes into more detail about Yriel and his time as an outcast with his Eldrich Raiders? I want learn more about this. In 4th and 5th edition my army went under the guise of a Yriel corsair army to account for my dominantly red w/black paint scheme and abundance of skimmers as to not lose points at tournaments with composition points. In my haste to get my models tourney ready I never bothered to really look up the proper color scheme or any real back ground on Yriel's Eldrich Raiders. It never cost me any points, but I am more into the hobby aspect of things now. My tastes have changed and I field more mixed lists. I REALLY want to paint my new Wraith models yellow and slip them in with my Yriel corsair models.

Any help the more fluff oriented members can give would be much appreciated.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 11, 2013, 04:59:55 AM

The new Iyanden book has a metric ton of fluff on Yriel.


other (less expensive sources) can be found online. Particularly Lexicanium. that has a section on Yriel and his Eldritch raiders.


As for Yeirls colours, they are a variation on the Iyanden colours. namely blue fatigues and yellow helmets (similar to Alitoc actually) Yriels personal bodyguard have all yellow with black tiger like stripes. you'll see in the pictures ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 12, 2013, 12:16:48 PM
Just tooting my horn, our Spiritseer is kinda like the Boneseer I was suggesting back then, Warlock Power and kinda like a Farseer Power too. And my Ghost Warrior Assassin = Wraithblades. Woot..  ;D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on June 12, 2013, 12:43:52 PM
The ability to shoot and run stuck out at me the most because it is so unorthodox and was championed for years on EldarOnline and 40kOnline as a whole.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Katamari Damacy on June 13, 2013, 03:49:46 AM
Damn i was so looking forward to this book but i just learned, that Mat Ward is the author. I wont be going into the Ward hatred here as this would be too easy. The stories of Eldar being butchered at the hands of his superawesome Space Marines is reason enough for me not to buy this. In case every other craftworld gets a book i might get this one for having a complete collection (in case the others are written by someone who has a clue about fluff) but other than that, no thanks. Very disappointing.  :'(
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 13, 2013, 05:08:18 AM
Talk about judging a book by its cover!


I suggest you read the book before passing judgement. Its full of fluff which is really a collection and expansion of the tid bits we find in other sources. There's some interesting elements to be used in more organised games and campaigns.  And of course there's a few rules for fielding a pure Iyanden Wraithwall army.


GW have clearly yanked Matt Ward's choke collar and brought him in line.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Katamari Damacy on June 13, 2013, 06:09:47 AM
Quote
GW have clearly yanked Matt Ward's choke collar and brought him in line.

Not sure about this. His 6th edition demon codex is rather new and seeing that he thinks it's ok to have a solitaire being possesed by some random slaanesh demon and tear half the craftworld apart (sic!), i'll have to pass. I will have a look at 'Iyanden' when it's available on scribd but i certainly wont blindly spend those bucks on something i mainly want for fluff, when it's written by the satanic fluff-[mutilator] himself.  >:(


[gmod]Only you can prevent sexual assault figures of speech. -Smoky The Bear (Mr.Peanut)[/gmod]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 13, 2013, 06:17:16 AM
Wow you got some proper Ward hate going on!


Well I have the supplement and Its pretty good. Its not value for money but then hardly anything GW produces these days is. I like the book but then again I have a large Iyanden army and love the fluff so anything that engorges my hobby is a plus for me.


Just out of interest what is it about a Slanesshi daemon possessing a Solitaire you didn't like. A Solitaire does play the part of Slannesh in the Masquerade and his soul is already forfeit to Slannesh...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Irisado on June 13, 2013, 08:25:16 AM
[mod]Let's not get into a debate about Slaanesh Daemons and Solitaires in a thread dedicated to Iyanden please. The background board would be a much better place for such a discussion.[/mod]
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 13, 2013, 10:22:09 AM
Good point Iris.  My point was that it's not a deviation from the already well established fluff.  But yes this is a conversation for the Herlequin baord where's it more relevant.


That aside my main point stands, that the book is not a bad one and certainly should not be degenerated before reading it.


Back on to the book I've yet to really make a Iyanden list using the supplement but it looks as though our traditional Wraithwall lists just got uber.
the Primaris power doing what it does and the sheer variety in weapon load outs our wraith can have make our lists competitive.


I'll be looking to include Gerald my Wraithseer for extra naughtyness... 


 
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 13, 2013, 11:47:32 PM
I'd watch and pause the vid-ad for Iyanden and think about it. I just can't give more specs without anything else.  :(

Otherwise, I was told I was powergaming by some of the local players and none of them want to play..  :(

(A few) Said lets schedule (06/22) a game and I'm bringing out a chunky amount of a Ghost Army, they said field what I wanted to field, and 3 players where gonna go up against me with a combine force equivalent to my points.

A summary of what I'm bringing:

Shadow Council x5 [350 pts]

Wraithguard x30 [960 pts]
Wraithblade x30 [960 pts]
Wraithguards x15 w/ D-Scythes [630 pts] inside AT-Wave Sepents x3

Wraithfighters x2

Brightlords x2
Wraithknight x1
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 14, 2013, 06:21:09 AM



I'm always taken back when people accuse Eldar players of power gaming considering the long years of darkenss we've had to put up with having such a amphetamine parrote codex ion the past I think we're owed some time in the limelight.


Anyway this is probably the case where they haven't figured out our weaknesses yet and are claiming everything is overpowered.


Your list Haunt looks great. However tactiically would be not be good to plit up the two 10 man squads into 2 x 5 mand squads each, purely for tactical flexability?


The only reason we used to take squads of 10 is because we had to to make them troops.


Also unless I'm mistaken you haven't included any HQ choices...


Also (again) are you uising the codex list of the Iyanden supplement?

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 14, 2013, 08:37:29 AM
Absolutely, Iyanden Shadow Council + unsure of what else to bring at the moment Wraithseer?? Iyanna?? Eldrad?? Yriel??

It would be 3 units of 5 Wraithscythes inside Wave Serpents Serpents kitted out to go into enemy lines and make some folks -hit their pants while the foot slogging part of the army is closing and running during shoot phase. Once 2nd turn starts it becomes a field fest of clearing for my army, wraithfighters will terrify units off board. The 3 heavies should be able to provide much fire support.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Katamari Damacy on June 14, 2013, 08:55:09 AM
Hm, to be honest, this looks like a one-trick-ponyish army to me. If you'r facing 3 opponents at the same time, things could get ugly, considering there will be 9 HS units vs. your 3. Also if one of your opponents brings poison weapons, that will be pretty much the end of your proud Iyanden Force.

Just to make it clear as i may misunterstand something here: you're gonna field 75 Wraithguys?!  :o I didn't think someone on this planet would own more than... 20-30 or so  :P How many points are we talking about here? 5k?

If i were you i would insist on some sort of limitation in terms of FOC that your opponents may use. I don't see how this armylist could beat 3 guys at the sime time.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 14, 2013, 09:35:31 AM
Kat D has a point but it must be taken in context and for that we need to know the armies you're likely to face Haunt.  Even so unless you're facing 3 Kabalite heavy DE armies you're not going to have insurmountable issues. after all you're always get your 3+ save Vs poison weapons.


You do have those serpents which which to ruin a DE armies day. Their Venoms and Raiders will fall like flies from the shock prow shooting attack.




I totally believe Haunt has 75 or even more Wraithdudes. He's what I aspire to  ;D




I would definitely agree that an FoC limitation on your enemy is needed. Imagine going against a Leman Russ batallion.
than again with the sorts of points were talking about you're in double FoC limit any way and possibly in the realms of Apoc?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 18, 2013, 11:50:07 PM
Have to recount my point value once again due to new codex for my whole list...  :'(

Anyway, am facing BA, SM, and GK each around 3k each. I am allowed a second FOC. I took a Seer Council on JB w/ Farseer x2 and , gonna show some of the new kids, How to use a Death-Seer, IF I roll it. Btw, I will try to get a BatRep on this.

@Kat:

Btw, I do have 76 old Wraithguards (metal) in the small bases. I'm trying to convince some of my friends to help me put together 30 wraithblades (Axe and Shield)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dread on June 19, 2013, 03:55:27 AM
Can't wait to see the report huant. I should have one or two up my Monday night or Tuesday. Bringing the wraith. Let y'all know soon.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 21, 2013, 07:04:31 PM
Rules for Eldar v Space Marines as follows:

SM Rules:

1 - They're not allowed a 2nd FOC ally, as ALL 3 of them are Allies for the purpose of the battle.
2 - ALL 3 SM are allowed 1 less from 2 from the following slots (Elite, Fast and/or Heavy Support)
3 - As this is a Xenos Assault they're allowed to emplace terrain support (ie Aegis Defense Line or whichever one, but ONLY 1 per army, yes, they can have 3 for ALL 3 of them.)

Eldar Rules:

1 - Simplicity at the forefront, you're allowed to use your army and can have a 2nd FOC ally or detachment.

Otherwise everyone Have Fun!!!

- I saw 2 Fortress of Redemptions being built by DA (Ravenwing Army) and GK (Paladin Army). The BA is a Mech Force (Lots of Razorbacks.) Fun times for me.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dread on June 22, 2013, 03:54:47 AM
That sounds like fun Haunt. One of my best buds just got me a Wraith Knight, OH Boy, what a model. Now I have to re-do my list for sunday and Monday. I own 20 metal Wraithguard(which I just mounted on termie bases), 5 D-sythe and 5 blades. Gonna see what I can do in a 2k with 2 lords and him. Also going to do my best at getting a great bat rep up.

Ha I own a fortress too.Hmm, the possibilities.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Rakshasa72 on June 25, 2013, 01:08:11 AM
So I screwed up and purchased my Iyanden Codex from the iTunes store only to find out that I can't read it on my PC (I hate Apple).  I guess I should have check it out in advance but, the whole lack of availability of the book in hard copy from GW was very frustrating and confusing to me.  I guess I'm just out the $40 USD for the book if I cannot read it.  Anyone know if it's still possible to buy a physical copy of the Iyanden Codex from somewhere?  Also is it possible to gift my copy of iTunes copy of Iyanden Codex to someone that can use it?
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dread on June 25, 2013, 01:21:50 AM
Hey  Rakshasa72, it shows to be available on their web site still. The hard copy, for $49.50 US, for a supplement, sheez!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Rakshasa72 on June 25, 2013, 01:30:49 AM
It has a entry on the GW website but, it says it's no longer available for me.  I couldn't actually order it.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dread on June 25, 2013, 03:18:55 AM
Sorry you had to go thru that. It is really sad that we would have to pay to get more rules for a certain craftworld. I see with the possible future releases of supplements for Eldar giving us other characters, models and rules as well. It is upsetting to a lot of other players that seeing us getting sup's that they feel left behind such as Nightlords, Iron Warriors and the like. I was wondering why we didn't get the Wild Riders chieftain but now think that is to come. I see new sculpts of aspects when Beil Tan is released. Hopefully in the future they will put things in a better perspective for their loyal gamers and come back to that way of thinking.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: f.desrochers on June 26, 2013, 08:49:04 PM
I foolishly assumed that it would only be available online from GW Direct Order.  Sixty bucks Canadian, plus tax of course.  What raised my eyebrows was the ridiculous twenty dollars for shipping. 

Right. Out. Of. Her.

One day before my supplement arrives at my doorstep, my local games shop gets five of them.   :o

Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 26, 2013, 10:14:06 PM
Just finishing up on my BatRep from the weekend, since it has quite a load of fun times. Just to let you all know, I won and my friends HATE Ghost Armies already, now I made them even more madder at us.  ;D

Yes, I fought 3 Fortress of Redemptions, 2 Storm Ravens, along with Drago and his Paladin Army.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dread on June 26, 2013, 11:46:28 PM
Nice one Haunt. Good to hear, they don't much like my Ghost army here either. HAHA
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Rakshasa72 on June 27, 2013, 01:21:33 AM
I think I'll do some calling around tomorrow to see if I can find a local shop that has a copy of the Codex.  I have to wait until I get paid in a few days before I buy it anyway.

In the mean time I've been taking what information I know from various locations on the web to try and make up some lists.  The problem I'm running into is the high costs of the Wraith Units.  I made a no points limit "Dream" list and it came out over 5000 points.  That's not very practical.  Of course I had 2 Wraith Knights in that list so I may have been pushing it.  Another problem I'm having is trusting the Wraithguard on foot.  Even with the speed boots they get from the Iyanden Codex it still seems prudent to mount them in a transport.  just so they can get to where they need to be.

The other list I did was 2500 points but, I ended up lining out a bunch of the wraith units just because there are so many cheaper ways to do some of the same things with other units.  In the end I only ended up with 1 each token units of 5 Wraithguard in Wave Serpent, 5 Wraithblades in Wave Serpent and, 1 Hemlock Wraithfighter.  Not very fluffy for Iyanden but, I'm not planning on using Iyanden colors anyway.  I'll probably either use the Iyanden rules to make a "counts as" army for one of the other Craftworlds or brew my own color scheme up.

I really want to try and make a "Psychology" list that takes advantage of the synergy between the Hemlock Wraithfighters, Spiritseers and, various Pinning and Morale roll inducing weapons.  This also means I want to try and field Fearless units because it seems like the Hemlock has some potential to backfire if not used properly.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dread on June 27, 2013, 03:02:19 AM
Quote from: Rakshasa72 on June 27, 2013, 01:21:33 AM
I think I'll do some calling around tomorrow to see if I can find a local shop that has a copy of the Codex.  I have to wait until I get paid in a few days before I buy it anyway.

In the mean time I've been taking what information I know from various locations on the web to try and make up some lists.  The problem I'm running into is the high costs of the Wraith Units.  I made a no points limit "Dream" list and it came out over 5000 points.  That's not very practical.  Of course I had 2 Wraith Knights in that list so I may have been pushing it.  Another problem I'm having is trusting the Wraithguard on foot.  Even with the speed boots they get from the Iyanden Codex it still seems prudent to mount them in a transport.  just so they can get to where they need to be.

The other list I did was 2500 points but, I ended up lining out a bunch of the wraith units just because there are so many cheaper ways to do some of the same things with other units.  In the end I only ended up with 1 each token units of 5 Wraithguard in Wave Serpent, 5 Wraithblades in Wave Serpent and, 1 Hemlock Wraithfighter.  Not very fluffy for Iyanden but, I'm not planning on using Iyanden colors anyway.  I'll probably either use the Iyanden rules to make a "counts as" army for one of the other Craftworlds or brew my own color scheme up.

I really want to try and make a "Psychology" list that takes advantage of the synergy between the Hemlock Wraithfighters, Spiritseers and, various Pinning and Morale roll inducing weapons.  This also means I want to try and field Fearless units because it seems like the Hemlock has some potential to backfire if not used properly.

Trusting them on foot? Well just from my experience lately, my 10 man units with cannons do alright. The other day I got lucky and got my spiritseers powers that make them +1 save and conceal, IT WAS GREAT, MWAHAHA! I put my D-scythes and blades in serpents or take them around thru cover. The nice thing about them is their toughness. I hope you will not be discouraged in trying them out before don't try. I am having a hard time not fielding my wguard. Been trying to get back to my jetbikes but just love the wraith's.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on June 28, 2013, 11:27:57 AM
I used to run 10 on foot regularly and they did just fine.  Now with seer support you can buff them in all sorts of ways!  Get the running up the field and see your enemies cower in fear!
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on June 29, 2013, 05:12:58 PM
Btw, just a suggestion don't do what I did to my friends. I used 10 Spiritseers = 2 Maxed out Shadow Councils plus 90 pts worth of Gifts (4 items) of Asuryan.

They allowed my list since it is a theme list, so do be careful.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 1, 2013, 05:28:58 AM
That's two pretty expensive units. But other than the points cost, why shouldn't you do it??
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Rakshasa72 on July 1, 2013, 08:17:47 AM
After spending about 5 hours the other night trying to get the iTunes Iyanden supplement to work on one of my Dad's old iphones, I finally realized it only works on an iPad.  My Dad offered to lone me his to read it but, instead I opted to ask for a refund from the iTunes store.  Fortunately Apple granted me a refund.  So now I'm back to searching for a hard copy. 

Someone at GW really needs to be verbally abused over the bungled release of this book.  It seems to me they sorely underestimated demand and, didn't think to offer a wider release of the E-book.  The main Eldar Codex E-book is available on both Kindle and Android.  The Iyanden supplement was exclusive to iPad.   It just seems kind of weird or bad business practices to restrict access to game rules in such a way. 

I've been playing around with some list that use the Spiritseers and Remnants of Glory but, I wanted to wait to see the Gifts of Asuryan.  To see if there is better options.  I don't know if some of the lists I've been making will work with the Iyanden supplement rules.  A down side with Spiritseers losing Conceal from their psychic list is they don't offer as much to synergize with other then Wraith units.

At any rate until I find a hard copy I'm not going to be able to make a final decision on what my army list will look like.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 1, 2013, 10:42:06 AM
IF I said I have an extra copy, what would we hear/read??  ;D

@Arq -

I was running around with a 2+/4++ saves, Furious Charge + Battle Focus, furious charge rules removed this is due to having 2 Spiritseers in my unit of Wraithblades.

Please don't spell out the rules outside of rules debates, it's against the forum rules on copyright - Iris

@Iris - I wasn't using as such. Didn't mean to sound it, I meant was Empower.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Satanic Joker Jester on July 2, 2013, 05:34:10 PM
this kinda sums up how i feel about the Iyanden supplement...

Link removed, owing to it containing breaches of GW's copyright - Apologies, but we can't be seen to be linking to such sites - Iris.

I'm still glad it came out, but I think it might have been a quick cash grab/test for GW.

Other than that, Going to be having some good ol Eldar MC fun again! :D
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 15, 2013, 12:50:16 PM
It seems like there are more and more people trying to fail-play Iyanden in my area. These are same people asking for advice from me, yet they play Iyanden as a close combat end-all-be-all army. Hopefully this is just a phase like before.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Thaldin on July 15, 2013, 08:07:57 PM
It could also be a great chance to educate players new to Iyanden ;)
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 16, 2013, 07:15:02 AM
Quote from: haunt on July 15, 2013, 12:50:16 PM
It seems like there are more and more people trying to fail-play Iyanden in my area. These are same people asking for advice from me, yet they play Iyanden as a close combat end-all-be-all army. Hopefully this is just a phase like before.

Sorry, what?  People are playing Iyanden to intentionally lose games??
That doesn't sound right...
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: haunt on July 16, 2013, 06:41:18 PM
They want to play Iyanden without knowing the pros and cons of the army. I won't nit-pick on them as they know who controls the fate of Eldar in my area.  ;D

They want to be part of my Craftworld, and yet they're losing streak is only broken when I make a slight adjustment on their game-play, otherwise I will keep hearing them lose and have a fit of disappointment.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Mr.Peanut (Turtleproof) on July 16, 2013, 09:36:09 PM
Doesn't this happen every time a new Codex is released?  People see every permutation of army composition as the ultimate when it first comes out.  What can beat an army of Terminators!  An entire army with Pain Tokens and Poison weapons!  A horde of laser weapons and ordnance!  This is the unstoppable solution!  It is the same when someone sees a plethora of Toughness 6 models- new and improved for 2013 with options for close quarters and close combat gear.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Arquarian on July 17, 2013, 04:45:46 AM
All the many facets of Eldar are hard to play, it took me ages to get tor grips with how to play them. That why I keep coming back to them, as they're so enjoyable and challenging to play.  All you can do Haunt is to offer small advice. Most people will have to make the mistakes themselves in order to progress.


Iyanden were always very hard to play as our troops were so expensive and tactically inflexible that our army lists were very predictable and our tactics equally so.  Now with all the choices and added flexibility people are wanting to try out new things which at time won't work.


Patience.


Arq.
Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: BritishBill on July 18, 2013, 11:49:43 PM
So I have been trying to play an Iyanden army for some time. Since the new Codex has been published I have been doing OK, winning some losing some and feel I am still learning with my army. This is the list I am playing at the moment at 1850 points.

Farseer.
Spiritseer.
Wraithguard with scythes
Wraithguard with wraith cannon
Wraith Blades with axe and shield
5 man Ranger Squad
Two Wave Serpents with scatter lasers, schuriken cannons and holofields.
Wraith Knight with Sun Cannon and one Scatter laser (I love this build)
One Exarch Crimson Hunter with Star Cannon
Two Crimson Hunters

This comes to 1850 exactly.

Comments.

1) This does not feel like an Iyanden list, it is a Mechdar list with wraith troops.
2) I find that as soon as the wraiths get out of the transports, they get whittled down and I am struggling to maintain sufficient troops for objectives.
3) I am finding it difficult to effectively use wraiths and wave serpents because of the short range of the wraiths and fact that the movement of the transport is limited if you want to get your wraiths out of it.

I find difficulties with the wraiths against Helldrakes and Plasmer touting Obliterators. I find difficulty with the Crimson Hunters against Tau armies that bristle with Interceptor models. I've worked out the way to handle Drop Podding Sternguard is to leave everything off the board except the Wave Serpents and the wraiths inside and allow the Wraith Knight to come in and kill them all on his entry to the board. (Did I say I love that Laser Locked Sun cannon)

I am expecting to slightly change the list, eliminating the farseer, changing the Wraith Scythes to Wraith Cannon, take swords with the Wraith Blades and add another Wave Serpent. That way all Wraith units start in Wave Serpents. But this is still more of a Mechdar list than an Iyanden list.

So my questions are

1) What would you do with this list, how would you play it to get the best out of it.

2) At the 1850 points level, what lists have you found that work well and how do you play them to get the best out of them.

Looking forward to your responses - especially from Haunt !!


Title: Re: POC: Iyanden --- The Ghost Warriors
Post by: Dread on July 19, 2013, 12:29:28 AM
It is a sound list. I usually take an autarch with fusion gun and the flame blade and put him in with 5 wraithblades with axe and shield (power unit). Spiritseer, 2 units of 10 wraith guard w/cannons (objective takers), wraithlord (ah the character) and wraith knight ( the brute) and if possible 5 wraithguard (another objective taker as well as unit killers) with D-scythes and at least 1 crimson hunter ( a must against CSM). Depending on points of course. Serpents in bigger games but most of this in my lists. Sometimes great and terrible things to my opponents and sometimes I get slaughtered, ehh, dice rolls. Farseer sometimes, kinda go back and forth between him and autarch. Hope this helps.