Topic: 1850 list for my first tourney

[BlackDraco]

'Alo! I've got my first tourney in about a week now, and my buddies and I have been practicing with our 1850 armies. The tourney is going to be straight up Seek and Destroy kill everything matches. My first list I've made seems to be doing fairly well against my buddies (who play Tau, Space Marines, and Chaos SM) but I've been somewhat unhappy with the performance of my monolith. My gauss flux arcs never seem to make a dent in anything and the P. Whip always seems to scatter stupidly. It might be just crappy rolling the last few games, but I've been thinking of swapping out the Mono for Hvy. Destroyers, given that those low Armor Saves really take a stupid amount of Warrior/Immortal shots to get through. Here's my original list

List 1 1849 out of 1850
2x12 Warriors
2x6 Immortals
8 Scarabs w/ D. Fields
4 Destroyers
3 Wraiths
1 Monolith
1 Lord w/ VoD, Rez Orb
1 Lord w/ Des. body, Phylactery (sp), Rez Orb, Chrono.

Normaly the Destroyer lord and the Wraiths go play with wussier ranged units, the scarabs go make trouble somewhere, and the VoD lord sits with everyone else as they march up the field, VoDing if they get in combat. The Monolith is kept in reserve and deep strikes hopefully in the middle of their forces and does mean things. Here's the changes I've made:

List 2 1850 out of 1850
2x13 Warriors
2x6 Immortals
8 Scarabs w/ D. Fields
4 Destroyers
3 Wraiths
3 Hvy. Destroyers
1 Lord w/ VoD, Rez Orb
1 Lord w/ Des. body, Phylactery (sp), Rez Orb, Chrono, D. Field. ( I know it's a crappy upgrade, but c'mon! I was 5 points away from exactly 1850. I had to do it!)

It seems to me that the Hvy. Destroyers would take care of pesky Terminators/Broadside suits etc. better than a Monolith would. Thoughts about the Hvy Destroyers that would aid me in my decision before GW gets another $75 from me?

Also I've been trying to think of how to group the Heavies. 3 groups of 1 a piece, a group of 2 and a group of 1, or one big group of 3? Thoughts on that?

[TheGreatAvatar]

Also I've been trying to think of how to group the Heavies. 3 groups of 1 a piece, a group of 2 and a group of 1, or one big group of 3? Thoughts on that?

Three units of one keeping them together as if they were a unit.  Your apponent needs three different units attacking to bring down all three HDestroyers.  Eventually they will combine into one unit via WBB.

[Halfpast_Yellow]

I actually like the first list better... But, have you considered this, taking your first list as a base:

4 Destroyers Removed

2x12 Warriors
2x6 Immortals
8 Scarabs w/ D. Fields
2 Heavy Destroyers
1 Heavy Destroyer
3 Wraiths
1 Monolith
1 Lord w/ VoD, Rez Orb
1 Lord w/ Des. body, Phylactery (sp), Rez Orb, Chrono.

It's sort of a compromise between your two lists, but actually the strongest one I think. You're getting all the tactical goodness of the monolith, the useful Heavy Destroyer weapons, and still retain supporting AP4 firepower from the 12 Immortals.

I was going to say a warscythe is better than a Chronometron, but then I remembered my Destroyer Lord with a Warscythe and his 3 Wraith buddies got run down by Sisters of Battle in my last game. How useful that would have been then! Oh well, hindsight is 20/20 I guess 

I also wouldn't deep strike the Monolith every game, unless you are facing railgun tau or Imperial Guard or something. It's too useful sucking up firepower and/or teleporting guys around from the get go. You can make the call on it every game 

[BlackDraco]

All three armies I've been playing against make liberal use of Lascannons/Railguns hence me deep striking it in. To be honest I don't think I'm using the Monolith to its best ability and by that same token I think I'm discovering the Mono doesn't mesh with my playstyle. The way I figure is I already have a Rez Orb back by the phalanx, and parking it near or behind for teleporting/WBB stuff means it'll mainly be too far away to use Gauss Flux and my force will be too close to risk using the P. Whip. So I'd be paying 235 points for extra WBB rolls on one unit a turn. Whereas if I deep strike in the middle of crap, it gets a few shots in before it gets lascannon'd to death or everyone moves away from it's slow butt.

Halfpast's list does look pretty mean, but the destroyers to me are well worth the points. 12 36" S6 shots are just super de duper for popping transports or taking out mean ole tanks. And I guess that was my main complaint about the Mono. I was using it offensively and not happy with the performance, but its strength does not lie in it's weapons alone, hence me leaning towards HvyDes. I think I've kinda answered my own question here 

And about the Warscythe - personally, I don't see the value of paying +10 for what seems to me to be a sidegrade. Here's how I view the fighting ability differences of a Lord with a Staff and with a Warscythe

Staff                               Warscythe
Ass3 S5 Ap3                     +d6 armor pen., ignores invunerable saves.

I don't think I've ever sent my lord to go punch a tank so the extra armor pen. does not factor in for me. Tha boils down to ignore inv saves or a nifty Marine killing assault weapon. Personally, I'd save 10 points and use the Staff o doom!

[Halfpast_Yellow]

From what you've said in your post I'd definitely go without the lith and use your second list then, with 1x1x1 Heavy Destroyers...

Guess it's just different experiences with the Warscythe. My Destroyer Lord gets use out of it all the time, he's popped quite a few tanks, beaten down dreadnaughts (extra fun!), and a pleasing highlight was running through a Sisters HQ and retinue with 2+ and 3+ invul saves. (they got their revenge in another game though, as in the post above).

I think theres more stuff out there that fears a warscythe than one would first think. A nice thing is that the Wraiths that go with him are also often useful against the same targets, like indirect ordinance tanks and defilers, Dreadies, the full assortment of chaos nastys, Terminators, Wyches, and HQs.