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Offline Irisado

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #400 on: May 25, 2017, 12:38:07 PM »
Unit-by-unit deployment is not a big deal.  Lots of GW games have used that down the years on and off.  It's just different from recent trends.  It's no problem from my perspective.

I'm also happy that the game has been reduced to five turns.  A faster game in terms of the rules and five turns means that it may be possible to play two full games in one afternoon.  This sounds like progress to me.
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Offline Grand Master Lomandalis

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #401 on: May 25, 2017, 01:10:52 PM »
Missions:
Yuck, unit by unit deployment >:( Now we can't go and fetch a snack or visit the bathroom while the other player is deploying :(
A balanced system that was used prior to 5th.  It gives a chance for both players to deploy in a reactive manner.  Now you're not going to have an instance where the first player deploys to cover all avenues, only to have their opponent castle on one side and allowing them to focus their strength on a weak flank.

To top it we now only have 3 missions instead of 6 and not the most fun of them:
- 4 obj + slay the warlord. (the D3 for slaying the warlord will likely be a tiebreaker  >:()
- King of the hill, albeit random hill.  :'(
- Take and hold 4 obj.  :(
That was one scenario that they showed...

Shortening the game to 5 game turns instead of 6, undermines the claims about faster games. This is very sad.  :'( very missleading.
Most games these days are decided by turn 4 or 5.
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Offline The GrimSqueaker

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #402 on: May 25, 2017, 01:15:09 PM »
Call me a radical yet wouldn't it be fairly easy to agree with your opponent to just add another turn if you both wanted to?
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Offline Wyddr

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #403 on: May 25, 2017, 01:30:16 PM »
I definitely think unit-by-unit deployment is balanced. It does take longer, though. It's a chess game before the chess game. I think it will be fun, mind you, but it's going to probably eat almost as much time as the pre-rolling does now.

And, also, nobody can walk away during deployment and get a sandwich now. You gotta be on your game the whole time. (and this has it's good points and bad points. The bad point being...no sandwich.  :-\)

Offline Grand Master Lomandalis

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #404 on: May 25, 2017, 01:44:13 PM »
The bad point being...no sandwich.  :-\
That's it, deal broken!  I am quitting Warhammer forever!  How can one live without a sandwich?!?
If there is anything that recent politics has taught us, it is that quotes taken out of context can mean what ever you want them to.
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Offline The GrimSqueaker

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #405 on: May 25, 2017, 01:47:12 PM »
In the near deserted wastelands of the Antipodes, we managed to bring food and more importantly booze to the table in small chilly bins. Alas, such technology has been lost since the Fire Nation invaded.
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Offline Wyddr

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #406 on: May 25, 2017, 01:50:54 PM »
In the near deserted wastelands of the Antipodes, we managed to bring food and more importantly booze to the table in small chilly bins. Alas, such technology has been lost since the Fire Nation invaded.

Oh suuure. Next thing you know you're gonna expect us to just "decide" to play another turn with some kind of "gentleman's agreement."

This is how,Rome fell, you know. Exact same thing.

Offline Lorizael

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #407 on: May 25, 2017, 03:18:22 PM »
Turn by turn deployment is fine; used to it in AoS, and it's how it was done in 40K for years.
It's cool that there are so many missions- more options the better. Definitely happy that Maelstrom is staying. Maelstrom is probably the single greatest thing to ever be added to the game. :)

Offline Roboknee77

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #408 on: May 25, 2017, 03:34:44 PM »
And, also, nobody can walk away during deployment and get a sandwich now. You gotta be on your game the whole time. (and this has it's good points and bad points. The bad point being...no sandwich.  :-\)

Why have there been no sandwiches when we played, Wyddr?  Did I miss that part in the rulebook?

Offline The GrimSqueaker

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #409 on: May 25, 2017, 03:54:48 PM »
I've reached out to GW to see if they'll clarify the sandwich dilemma in an upcoming FAQ. Until we hear from them about this and possibly other bakery related issues we should probably move on.

What about those Orks, eh?
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Offline Roboknee77

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #410 on: May 25, 2017, 04:19:26 PM »
Dem Orks are lookin' shinier!  I really hope they let some of the more shooty Orks, like Lootas or Flash Gitz, have a slightly better BS than same old stat line for all Orks.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2017, 04:24:46 PM by Roboknee77 »

Offline Partninja

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #411 on: May 25, 2017, 05:18:10 PM »
I do wish that they would get rid of this unnecessary Eternal War and Maelstrom division of missions.  I've never understood why it was introduced in the first place and it has always seemed like a tier of complexity the game doesn't need in my opinion.  That said, since I'm planning to avoid matched play, it ought not to pose a problem for me.

I do like the wide range of missions which have returned for narrative play.  I recognise a lot of those from fourth edition.  This is a very positive move.

It's doesn't need to be complex at all. My LGS just decides if we want to do Maelstrom or Eternal and roll for those specifically. We usually play Maelstrom, as the tactical objectives make games much more compelling since your objective can change every turn. "Normal" Eternal war games are good if you just want a more relaxing game (They can usually be played faster as well).

Offline magenb

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #412 on: May 25, 2017, 05:18:32 PM »
Fixed game length sucks, the games that actually made it to the roll to continue stage, were because they were close matches and it forced some hard choices to be made.

There is waaay to much control given to the player who wins the first roll. They pick, the mission, deployment type, who deploys where. I guess the unit by unit deployment is a trade off.


Any one else notice that Orks can have multiple Saves... I wonder if this is an Ork only thing or if it army wide.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2017, 05:51:41 PM by magenb »

Offline OD from TV

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #413 on: May 25, 2017, 05:32:18 PM »
I really hope they let some of the more shooty Orks, like Lootas or Flash Gitz, have a slightly better BS than same old stat line for all Orks.
I wouldn't bet too highly on it.  It's enough of a godsend (or rather Gork/Mork-send) that there's a return of the true Mob Rule.  The Ork bog standard for ages is that they can't hit the broadside of a barn while inside of the barn, and so long as there aren't multiple nonMSU units testing to see if they're lucky enough to only take an extra D6 wounds or retreat (yeah the horror of 7th edition Ork is over!), I'm a happy camper without any bonus.

Although it is interesting to note that the Feral Ork side list from 3rd Ed Chapter Approved did have better BS boyz.  In fact 2nd Ed did have BS 3 Orks with access to Plasma and since 8th is practically 2nd all over again [heretical thoughts detected.  heretical thoughts purged.  long live GW]. Joking aside, while it'd be cool for them to get that buff, I'd rather they didn't.  Any buff that would have such dramatic difference would likely come with a price hike, and I'm hoping that won't be the case because for footslogger Orks to be a thing again, they need to be cheap as chips.

No matter what 8th is gonna bring, I know I'm going to enjoy at least a honeymoon period with it.  Sure this month I've seesawed back and forth on fears and hopes, baited breath on any scrap of info to wanting to smash the computer to bits because I don't want to know 8th even exists; but at the moment I'm hopeful and can't wait for my Orks to finally have non broken rules again err to try the new version of my horrible game addiction I've been stuck on for more than half my life.

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Offline Fenris

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #414 on: May 25, 2017, 07:25:26 PM »
@Wyddr: Why don't you tell us YOUR opinions about the 8th edition news instead of coming down on others?
I get the impression that you are not interested in playing the game wether it is 40k or chess, you just want to play mind games.

@GML & Irisado: The unit by unit deployment, is not the end of the world.
However there are several reasons not to use that mechanic. Have you considered MSU armies vs armies with very few units. The few unit armies will essentially always deploy first.

Call me a radical yet wouldn't it be fairly easy to agree with your opponent to just add another turn if you both wanted to?
Nope, not during a game in a competitive setting.
Also why would I buy rules when I have to invent them myself anyway, why reinvent the wheel?
Furthermore it's a matter of game balance.
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Offline The GrimSqueaker

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #415 on: May 25, 2017, 07:37:27 PM »
Nope, not during a game in a competitive setting.
Also why would I buy rules when I have to invent them myself anyway, why reinvent the wheel?
Furthermore it's a matter of game balance.

the Udders of Thoth. You'd also note I did say if both parties agreed. You're not prohibited from doing so. The only issue there would be you. Adding a turn is hardly reinventing the whole game but please continue in this fashion, it is rather amusing as I'm sure others will agree.   :)

The issue with differing unit numbers for deployment between armies was taken care of as early as Space Marine. It's not a new issue and the mechanics are already well worn in. We've been here before.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2017, 07:45:29 PM by The GrimSqueaker »
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Offline faitherun (Fay-ith-er-run)

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #416 on: May 25, 2017, 08:22:09 PM »
I am surprised no one has caught onto this yet...

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A Big Mek with a Kustom Force Field gives nearby Ork units a 5+ invulnerable save against shooting attacks. And by the way, you can take BOTH of these saves!
Warhammer 40,000 Faction Focus: Orks – Warhammer Community

SO!

Is that an ork special thing or are we going back to Armor then inv save? (Then FNP??)
So, what your saying is it's not your fault you look stupid by using words you don't get?
Flawless logic.

Offline Grand Master Lomandalis

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #417 on: May 25, 2017, 10:25:55 PM »
I thought they mentioned earlier that it was either Armour Saves or Invulnerable Saves, and that you had to choose just as you do now.  What they may be saying is that the 6+ save they are referring to can be taken in addition to their armour save.  So they may be taking the FNP mechanic and returning it to save status.
If there is anything that recent politics has taught us, it is that quotes taken out of context can mean what ever you want them to.
Well I always liked the globals...
I knew I had fans!!!

Quote
"Dark Angels are Traitors" is the 40k equivalent of Flat Earthers.  You can provide all of the proof you want that says otherwise, but people just can't let it go...

Offline The GrimSqueaker

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #418 on: May 25, 2017, 10:31:26 PM »
They're referencing rules added by heroes so it's more an individual added bonus. Snipe the bastard and it all changes.
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Offline Grand Master Lomandalis

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Re: Eighth Edition News
« Reply #419 on: May 26, 2017, 12:47:36 AM »
I have a feeling we are going to see more sniper units being taken to take pot shots at characters.  If the points stay the same, 140pts for 10 sniper scouts with Camo Cloaks doesn't seem like a bad idea.

I already know my LGS is increasing the points value of our game nights from 1850 to 2000pts, so I may do something I have never done before - buy scout models.
If there is anything that recent politics has taught us, it is that quotes taken out of context can mean what ever you want them to.
Well I always liked the globals...
I knew I had fans!!!

Quote
"Dark Angels are Traitors" is the 40k equivalent of Flat Earthers.  You can provide all of the proof you want that says otherwise, but people just can't let it go...

 


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