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Offline magenb

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Generalist 1500 CWE
« on: June 15, 2017, 09:01:56 PM »
1 x Illic
2 x 10 Guardians as screening units for DR/Illic
2 x 9 Scorpions including Exarch
1 x 6 Shinning spears with Exarch with star lance
2 x 5 Dark Reapers with Exarchs
1 x Hemlock

Just shy of 1500, I could split the Spears into 2 smaller units, gain another star  lance and still be in limit.



Offline SeekingOne

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2017, 11:06:59 PM »
Really cool list!
It totals up to just 1422 pts though, did you miss some wargear?

Id really love to try it out - be it not for the fact that the only models out of this list that I have painted and battle-ready are 5 Reapers :D

Not sure about Illic though. Imho, it would be more efficient to just take a basic Autarch and stick him with Reapers to give them rerolls of 1s.
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Offline Partninja

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2017, 11:41:15 PM »
Illic can snipe out characters, where the Reapers/Autarch can't. However, I feel he's best used with a min unit of Rangers to tack on a few more wounds per round of shooting.

I'd actually replace Illic with a Warlock Skyrunner to conceal the Shining Spears.

Might want to list the overall point costs if math needs to be checked. I've realised I've pointed a few things wrong after initially making my own spread sheet.

Which detachment are you using?
« Last Edit: June 15, 2017, 11:44:45 PM by Partninja »

Offline Saim-Dann

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2017, 04:02:11 AM »
Hey Magenb!
Looking through your list and I'm hearing the suggestions of a couple forumites echoing between the lines. Good on ya, mate. Am keen to read how you go wielding it. I agree with Partninja about a few rangers Screening Illic. Is there enough spare points?

Offline SeekingOne

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2017, 06:43:32 AM »
I'd actually replace Illic with a Warlock Skyrunner to conceal the Shining Spears.

In terms of efficiency, that would be a decisively suboptimal thing to do. If you take a Warlock Skyrunner to conceal the Shining Spears, its point cost will only be even remotely justified if you use him to conceal at least 13 of them. With just 6, points will be better spent elsewhere.
I fight against Chaos and for Order, because it means fighting for Life against Death. There is no other battle truly worth fighting.

"If it's not for a tournament then play whatever it is that you like. Without the pressure of having to utterly destroy your opponent it opens up alot more opportunity to have fun." - Lazarus

Offline magenb

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2017, 06:53:46 AM »
HQ     88
Troops    200
Elite    342 - found a problem there
Fast    270
Heavy   360
Flyer   211

1471


Patrol detachment.
All the others need 3 of something :(

I find rangers too random and even then low volume to be useful.

Offline SeekingOne

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2017, 08:31:36 AM »
Troops    200

Scatter laser platforms?!
I fight against Chaos and for Order, because it means fighting for Life against Death. There is no other battle truly worth fighting.

"If it's not for a tournament then play whatever it is that you like. Without the pressure of having to utterly destroy your opponent it opens up alot more opportunity to have fun." - Lazarus

Offline Partninja

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2017, 01:40:41 PM »
I'd actually replace Illic with a Warlock Skyrunner to conceal the Shining Spears.

In terms of efficiency, that would be a decisively suboptimal thing to do. If you take a Warlock Skyrunner to conceal the Shining Spears, its point cost will only be even remotely justified if you use him to conceal at least 13 of them. With just 6, points will be better spent elsewhere.

Based on statistics and number crunching I guess.

My reasoning is I have to take an HQ, and I want my small important unit to be as durable as possible (without taking more, as large bike squads are very unweildy in my experience).

Offline Lord of Winter and War

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2017, 06:48:42 PM »
I'm thinking you might want to find a way to shove in another HQ and troops choice to run the +3 command points detachment. After playing a couple of games, having command points is a fantastic way to help mitigate bad rolls, and I burned through 6 command points pretty quickly when I played.


I'm A bit surprised to see no transports, as elder vehicles are super versatile as they have the fly-keyword, so can retreat from combat and still shoot. A great way to soak up overwatch and tie up enemy shooting units/ vehicles so they cannot shoot.
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Offline magenb

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2017, 03:28:43 AM »
I'm A bit surprised to see no transports, as elder vehicles are super versatile as they have the fly-keyword, so can retreat from combat and still shoot. A great way to soak up overwatch and tie up enemy shooting units/ vehicles so they cannot shoot.

Sure, but I can take unit decent sized scorpions unit for the cost of that transport. For me overwatch against scorpions is about 60% chance of nothing happening, go the extra unit is very handy :)

The units I'm taking now longer need transports because of some of the changes to the rules. For example Turn 1 deepstrikes or the fact I'm most likely going second (most enemies will move toward me in their turn), so I'm planning on going 2nd, not very fluffy for an Eldar army I know :(

From my perspective as CWE I will only take a transport if I need to send heavy hitters like FD or wraithguard into the back line.  There are some rather interesting cases for Ynnari and transports now thanks to Ynnead's Will though and of course DE and transports is now scary as I found out the hard way.







Went up against a 1500 point DE list, which had 6 raiders and 1 venom. The net effect is very fast units that put out a lot of shots, spreads out anti-tank weapons. While the Raiders are killable, they still can soak up a considerable amount of fire and unlike a lot of other transports can actually be handy in CC. Opened topped is just boss.

DE are now, surprising resilient, and power from pain is amazing. If you go up against them, playing defensively against them is rather risky as they just keep getting better.

Hemlock's are sooo good at soaking up fire and still dish out a good amount of damage, they don't out right kill things, but they do a fair wack so another unit could finish them off. Highly recommend them.

For the record it was still a close game, but the DE won from victory points. Xenos vs Xenos as I suspected is really enjoyable, great fun.



The new rules have some very, very odd wordings, such as the rules for shooting ranges only requiring 1 model to be in range, I would expect to see an FAQ soon as it is easy to abuse, think Horde conga lines lol.






Make use of you full charge distance against transports and remember the consolidation move, you can effectively lock some of them in close combat or simply prevent over from being able to disembark...


Illic died first turn, since the anti-tank in the DE for was so dispersed, some of it went his way.. he got vaporised. So yeah I think the Autarch on skyrunner would have been a better option.

Archons are crazy good for their points, no more instant death, so they can take a pounding.

All in all, I'd say its not a bad list, one that I'm likely to run again with the Autarch.

Offline SeekingOne

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #10 on: June 17, 2017, 04:54:41 PM »
Invaluable info magenb, thanks a million for posting this up.

Also tried Hemlocks today, proxied two of them with my CHs in a 2k list  - and they are just fantastic. Interesting thing, if you provide enough target saturation for the enemy's AT, you can even afford to forgo casting Conceal and throw Smites with them instead, making them even deadlier.
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Offline Lord of Winter and War

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2017, 06:28:41 PM »
Quote
Sure, but I can take unit decent sized scorpions unit for the cost of that transport. For me overwatch against scorpions is about 60% chance of nothing happening, go the extra unit is very handy 

The units I'm taking now longer need transports because of some of the changes to the rules. For example Turn 1 deepstrikes or the fact I'm most likely going second (most enemies will move toward me in their turn), so I'm planning on going 2nd, not very fluffy for an Eldar army I know

From my perspective as CWE I will only take a transport if I need to send heavy hitters like FD or wraithguard into the back line.  There are some rather interesting cases for Ynnari and transports now thanks to Ynnead's Will though and of course DE and transports is now scary as I found out the hard way.

Fair enough. I find that the vechiles with the fly keyword are all fantastic, as they can leave combat and still shoot.

For Ynneads will, it's not that great. The only models with that ability are the three triumvirate characters, not all Ynnari.

Quote
The new rules have some very, very odd wordings, such as the rules for shooting ranges only requiring 1 model to be in range, I would expect to see an FAQ soon as it is easy to abuse, think Horde conga lines lol.

Keep in mind, shooting is done on a model by model basis. You still need the individual weapons for each model to be in range to shoot, but you can shoot different models in a single unit at different targets (as long as they are in range).


Dark elder are really good. They have great transports, are quite tough, and have some fantastic firepower. I think they might be one of the scarier armies in the growing meta.

Quote
Illic died first turn, since the anti-tank in the DE for was so dispersed, some of it went his way.. he got vaporised. So yeah I think the Autarch on skyrunner would have been a better option.

Was he not near any units? How did he get picked out and shot?
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Offline magenb

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Re: Generalist 1500 CWE
« Reply #12 on: June 17, 2017, 09:09:49 PM »
Was he not near any units? How did he get picked out and shot?

Bad deployment on my part, but he would not have contributed much to the game any way. DE didn't get out of the transports unit forced too.


 


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