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Author Topic: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc  (Read 1846 times)

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Offline Irinc

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Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« on: November 18, 2017, 04:00:31 PM »
Greetings fellow Asur,

the time has come again to assemble the might of the Asur. I will be playing against the Astra Militarum in a Brigade Detachment 1500 points next week on tuesday. My first thought on facing Atstra Militarum was: Alaitoc. I think it will be quiet entertaining watching all those Mon´keigh hitting their targets on a 5+ or even worse on a 6+.
I will be bringing 1 Battalion Detachment and 2 Spearhead Detachments for my delicious cheese fondue.

The list:


++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [22 PL, 425pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

The Path of War

+ HQ +

Autarch [4 PL, 77pts]: Forceshield, Shimmerplume of Achillrial, Star Glaive

Farseer [6 PL, 105pts]: 4. Executioner, 6. Mind War, Shuriken Pistol, Singing Spear

+ Heavy Support +

Dark Reapers [4 PL, 81pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Reaper Launcher

Dark Reapers [4 PL, 81pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Reaper Launcher

Dark Reapers [4 PL, 81pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Reaper Launcher

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [15 PL, 325pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

The Path of War

+ HQ +

Farseer [6 PL, 100pts]: 2. Doom, 3. Fortune, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Heavy Support +

Support Weapons [3 PL, 75pts]
. Support Weapon: D-cannon

Support Weapons [3 PL, 75pts]
. Support Weapon: D-cannon

Support Weapons [3 PL, 75pts]
. Support Weapon: D-cannon

++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [38 PL, 734pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

The Path of War

+ HQ +

Illic Nightspear [4 PL, 80pts]

Warlock [2 PL, 35pts]: 1. Conceal/Reveal, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops +

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 60pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Avenger Shuriken Catapult

Dire Avengers [3 PL, 60pts]
. 4x Dire Avenger: 4x Avenger Shuriken Catapult
. Dire Avenger Exarch: Avenger Shuriken Catapult

Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

+ Elites +

Wraithguard [11 PL, 225pts]: D-scythe, 5x Wraithguard

+ Dedicated Transport +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 154pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Twin Shuriken Cannon, Vectored Engines

++ Total: [75 PL, 1484pts] ++


The plan is to screen off deep striking units and to keep the distance beyond 12" for the heavy hitters. D-Cannons, Reapers will chew through tanks and flyers as they come within range. Autarch will be the buff-stick for them.
Rangers and Dire Avengers will be camping in ruins and create the 9" range bubble to keep of any deep strikers. Warlocks be foot slogging among them for Conceal.
Farseer with Executioner and Mind War will be with the Wraithguard in the Serpent storming the enemy lines and wreak havoc. Farseer with Doom and Protect will be helping D-Cannons and Dark Reapers to kill off important targets.
Illic is there just for the lulz.

I have a few points left and I might can swap out 5 Dire Avengers for 10 Guardians with a Weapon Platform. My guess is that spirit stones on the wave serpent are overkill. I will be advancing anyway so the -2 to hit is already hard to chew through.

Thoughts?

« Last Edit: November 18, 2017, 04:03:29 PM by Irinc »

Offline Fenris

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2017, 06:26:04 PM »
Willkommen!

A good shooty list, I thing you could spend the last points upgrading the warlock to a spiritseer.
I think the wave serpent will be under a lot o fire, so dropping the spiritstones would not be advised, unless you intend to cast fortune on it.
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Offline The Mattler

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2017, 07:44:29 PM »
[adjusted format]
 
ALAITOC SPEARHEAD
Autarch w/Shimmerplume of Achillrial
Farseer w/Executioner, Mind War, Singing Spear
3 Dark Reapers w/Exarch
3 Dark Reapers w/Exarch
3 Dark Reapers w/Exarch

ALAITOC SPEARHEAD
Farseer w/Doom, Fortune
Support Weapon w/D-cannon
Support Weapon w/D-cannon
Support Weapon w/D-cannon

ALAITOC BATTALION
Illic Nightspear
Warlock w/Conceal/Reveal
5 Dire Avengers w/Exarch
5 Dire Avengers w/Exarch
5 Rangers
5 Rangers
5 Wraithguard w/D-scythes
Wave Serpent a/Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Twin Shuriken Cannon, Vectored Engines

75 PL
1484 pts
It seems like every time you start a thread, I'm already writing a huge post somewhere else about the same topic. XD  You're working at a different game size, though, so I'll say more about this list than I did about the Iyanden one you posted.

The first thing I noticed is that your units are small and numerous, so Fortune won't be particularly helpful on most of them.  Same applies to Conceal.  The only high value target is the Wave Serpent carrying the Wraithguard, but it already has Spirit Stones and Vectored Engines, so it's probably fine.  You could probably get by with only on Farseer, and spend the points saved on other units.  However, Fortune is a better fit on the Wraithguard once they disembark, and considering the range of the Runes of Fate powers, you don't need to rush a Farseer in alongside them.

Speaking of range, I love D-Cannnons, but remember that the AS tanks are likely to be fairly far back, so unless you deploy the D-Cannons aggressively, you might not get a juicy target selection for them.  You might even have to spend a turn or two moving them up the field with a penalty to hit, and at that point you'd be in range of a lot of Lasguns.  The Shimmerplume is great, but it's unlikely that the Autarch will be the closest unit, so you might consider a different item.  Also, you can use the Index to give him a Reaper Launcher, a Lasblaster, or a pair of Avenger Shuriken Catapults so he can contribute some firepower while he's buffing your artillery cluster.

I'd recommend Swooping Hawks for clearing out a bunch of the AS infantry.  Similarly, equipping all of the Dark Reaper Exarchs with Tempest Launchers would shred the enemy infantry, and it lets you keep some firepower while hiding the Reapers if you have to.  However, that might leave you a bit light on anti-tank firepower.
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Offline Irinc

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2017, 03:11:11 AM »
Well The Mattler maybe we should combine our efforts. ;)
 I rearranged my list. I think running so many detachments makes the list a bit too shaky.


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [76 PL, 1500pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

The Path of War

+ HQ +

Autarch Forceshield, Power sword, Reaper Launcher, Shiftshroud of Alanssair, Shuriken Pistol, Star Glaive

Farseer 2. Doom, 4. Executioner, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops +

Guardian Defenders 10x Guardian Defender
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform: Shuriken Cannon

Guardian Defenders 10x Guardian Defender
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform: Shuriken Cannon

Rangers 5x Ranger

Rangers 5x Ranger

+ Elites +

Wraithguard D-scythe, 5x Wraithguard

+ Heavy Support +

Dark Reapers
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher

Dark Reapers
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher

Dark Reapers
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher

+ Flyer +

Crimson Hunter Exarch Two Bright Lances

Crimson Hunter Exarch Two Bright Lances

+ Dedicated Transport +

Wave Serpent Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Twin Shuriken Cannon, Vectored Engines

++ Total: [76 PL, 1500pts] ++

I have much more long ranged power with this list. I can play hide and seek with my reapers for two turns and thin out the enemy infantry lines with 6D6 Tempest Launchers. Wraithguard will be deep striking within the Wave Serpent. Standards will be screening and shoot characters.

Thoughts?

Offline SeekingOne

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2017, 05:11:48 AM »
Hi Irinc!

Sorry in advance, but I have to start with a little rant/plea.

++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [76 PL, 1500pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

The Path of War

+ HQ +

Autarch Forceshield, Power sword, Reaper Launcher, Shiftshroud of Alanssair, Shuriken Pistol, Star Glaive

Farseer 2. Doom, 4. Executioner, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops +
I don't know what kind of application this format from, but can I ask to please not use it? It is hard to read to the point of making it almost unbearable. So many useless junk labels, so many useless blank spaces. For example these:
+ No Force Org Slot +

The Path of War
Why on earth are these labels here?!

Because there are blank lines everywhere, it's hard to distinguish between different sections, as well as between unit entries and section headings. Overall, it's just... so bad.
Here is what a proper list format should look like (thanks Mattler!):

ALAITOC SPEARHEAD
Autarch w/Shimmerplume of Achillrial
Farseer w/Executioner, Mind War, Singing Spear
3 Dark Reapers w/Exarch
3 Dark Reapers w/Exarch
3 Dark Reapers w/Exarch

ALAITOC SPEARHEAD
Farseer w/Doom, Fortune
Support Weapon w/D-cannon
Support Weapon w/D-cannon
Support Weapon w/D-cannon
(...)
75 PL
1484 pts
It's brief, it's clear, it's well-structured, it's concise and it's free of junk.  What's not to like? :)


Now, since I had no choice but to read into your list anyway while preparing this little rant ;), a few comments on the topic.

1. While almost nothing in our codex is distinctly bad (except maybe non-Iyanden Wraithlords and a Wraithknight), our Troops are still not the best in the world. Therefore I'd not recommend using more than the minimum required number of Troops units in any detachment. Points almost invariably can be better spent elsewhere. The only exception to this would be taking a full 20-strong squad of Defenders with the intent to deep-strike it from the Webway. However, this option should be taken as a part of highly aggressive "in-your-face" army, lest the sacrifice of those Guardians is wasted.

2. You don't want to deploy your Reapers on the table. Reliable LoS-blocking terrain to hide them behind may not be available, OR even if it is, it might not be positioned where you want your Reapers to be firing from. And if they are not protected, they can easily be swept off the board in 1 shooting phase.

3. I have no actual experience with Wraithguard in the new codex, so if you have it and they worked well for you then it's fine. But on paper it just seems that taking such expensive units in such a small army is not efficient. Basically, you now have two groups of models - 5xWG and 9xReapers - which all want to be deployed in Serpents, so you ideally need two of those. If go down that route you effectively end up investing ~800 points in these units alone, which is a bit too much for a small force. If you don't take the second Serpent, your deployment will be unreliable and you'll be vulnerable to 1st turn alpha-strikes.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2017, 05:14:32 AM by SeekingOne »
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Offline Irinc

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #5 on: November 19, 2017, 06:59:42 AM »
@SeekingOne I understand you very well.  8) I won’t be posting lists in such format for the future.

1. I’d like to use Guardians as screening units. My guess is that with a -1 To Hit they become quiet durable. (I’m playing Drukhari/Harlequins with a lot of Venoms/Starweaver and I’m used to the modifier).

2. We will be playing in a local GW. I will get the terrain I need for my units. Despite that I always try to build a symmetric board with enough sight blockers and cover for both sides.

3. Wraithguard served me well up until now. I’m not concerned fielding them. Once my Reapers and Crimson Hunters did their job, there won’t be left much to threaten a T6 W3 Unit.

I’ve had the upper hand against Grey Knights Alpha Strike. The lesser I’m worried about AM.  8)

Post Merge: November 19, 2017, 07:31:58 AM
In the future, please use the modify button. Double posting is against the forum rules, and for that reason, the system merged your posts.

Quick update: he will be playing a infantry brigade. How many models will that be?

I think I might get swarmed...
« Last Edit: November 19, 2017, 07:31:58 AM by Irinc »

Offline The Mattler

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2017, 08:04:52 AM »
Well The Mattler maybe we should combine our efforts. ;)
 I rearranged my list. I think running so many detachments makes the list a bit too shaky.
I definitely like your second list more than the first one, and I agree regarding the number of detachments.  Oddly enough, it's possible to get a Brigade at 1500 pts, but I think the Elites slots get a bit clunky for what you'll be trying to accomplish.  I decided to write a list using just a Battalion.

ALAITOC BATTALION
Autarch w/Reaper Launcher, Avenger Shuriken Catapult, Shimmerplume of Achillrial (Warlord: Mark of the Incomparable Hunter)
Illic Nightspear
5 Rangers
5 Rangers
5 Rangers
5 Rangers
5 Wraithguard w/Wraithcannons
5 Wraithguard w/Wraithcannons
5 Swooping Hawks w/Exarch, Hawk's Talon
5 Swooping Hawks w/Exarch, Hawk's Talon
5 Swooping Hawks w/Exarch, Hawk's Talon
4 Dark Reapers w/Exarch, Tempest Launcher
4 Dark Reapers w/Exarch, Tempest Launcher
4 Dark Reapers w/Exarch, Tempest Launcher
Wave Serpent w/Twin Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Cannon

81 PL
1500 pts
6 CP

Technically, the only units you need to deploy on the table are the Reapers in the Serpent and the Autarch, but in matched play this list needs to deploy 8 units, so you can choose from among the Rangers and Illic to meet that requirement.  Remember that the Autach can't try to gain CP if he's in the Serpent or as reinforcements, which is why I chose the Shimmerplume instead of the Shiftshroud.

The entire list should be in firing range on Turn 1, with the Wraithguard deploying via Webway Strike.  The Wraithguard and Reapers can pop a couple of tanks, the Hawks and the Reaper Exarchs start tearing apart the infantry, and the Rangers, Illic, and the Autarch snipe the officers.  If you go second, you should be able to keep the Wave Serpent and its precious cargo alive with Lightning Fast Reactions, which in turn helps preserve the nigh-invisible Autarch cowering behind it. XD


« Last Edit: November 19, 2017, 10:02:22 AM by The Mattler »
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Offline Irinc

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2017, 03:16:30 PM »
I definitely like your second list more than the first one, and I agree regarding the number of detachments.  Oddly enough, it's possible to get a Brigade at 1500 pts, but I think the Elites slots get a bit clunky for what you'll be trying to accomplish.  I decided to write a list using just a Battalion.

ALAITOC BATTALION
Autarch w/Reaper Launcher, Avenger Shuriken Catapult, Shimmerplume of Achillrial (Warlord: Mark of the Incomparable Hunter)
Illic Nightspear
5 Rangers
5 Rangers
5 Rangers
5 Rangers
5 Wraithguard w/Wraithcannons
5 Wraithguard w/Wraithcannons
5 Swooping Hawks w/Exarch, Hawk's Talon
5 Swooping Hawks w/Exarch, Hawk's Talon
5 Swooping Hawks w/Exarch, Hawk's Talon
4 Dark Reapers w/Exarch, Tempest Launcher
4 Dark Reapers w/Exarch, Tempest Launcher
4 Dark Reapers w/Exarch, Tempest Launcher
Wave Serpent w/Twin Shuriken Cannon, Shuriken Cannon

81 PL
1500 pts
6 CP

Technically, the only units you need to deploy on the table are the Reapers in the Serpent and the Autarch, but in matched play this list needs to deploy 8 units, so you can choose from among the Rangers and Illic to meet that requirement.  Remember that the Autach can't try to gain CP if he's in the Serpent or as reinforcements, which is why I chose the Shimmerplume instead of the Shiftshroud.

The entire list should be in firing range on Turn 1, with the Wraithguard deploying via Webway Strike.  The Wraithguard and Reapers can pop a couple of tanks, the Hawks and the Reaper Exarchs start tearing apart the infantry, and the Rangers, Illic, and the Autarch snipe the officers.  If you go second, you should be able to keep the Wave Serpent and its precious cargo alive with Lightning Fast Reactions, which in turn helps preserve the nigh-invisible Autarch cowering behind it. XD

That is quiet a funny list. Problem: I don´t have that many Swooping Hawks. Also, I have to use my Hemlocks to field the Crimson Hunters. So I rearranged my list once more. According to what I know he will be fielding around 100 Soldiers + a few Tanks and 1-2 Artillery Pieces. No Celestine!

List 1.2:


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP [1162pts] ++

Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc: Fieldcraft

+ HQ +
Autarch [103pts]: Avenger Shuriken Catapult, Forceshield, Mandiblasters, Reaper Launcher, Shimmerplume of Achillrial, Shuriken Pistol, Star Glaive
Farseer [100pts]: 2. Doom, 3. Fortune, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade
Warlock [35pts]: 1. Conceal/Reveal, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops +
Guardian Defenders [200pts]: 20x Guardian Defender
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform: Starcannon
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform: Starcannon
Rangers [60pts]: 5x Ranger
Rangers [60pts]: 5x Ranger
Rangers [60pts]: 5x Ranger

+ Elites +
Wraithguard [225pts]: D-scythe, 5x Wraithguard

+ Heavy Support +
Fire Prism [165pts]: Crystal Targeting Matrix, Twin Shuriken Catapult

+ Dedicated Transport +
Wave Serpent [154pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Twin Shuriken Cannon, Vectored Engines

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP [338pts] ++
+ HQ +
Illic Nightspear [80pts]

+ Heavy Support +
Dark Reapers [86pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher
Dark Reapers [86pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher
Dark Reapers [86pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher
++ Total: [1500pts] ++

Since most of my army will have a -1 to hit he has to come into close range. Until that point most of his units will be gone. His tanks and artillery pieces won´t do much damage, since he has to hit me on a 5+ at the best. Dark Reapers, Fire Prism and the Star Cannons will do the heavy lifting. Wraithguard will be thrown against his valuable units (whatever that might be). I will be fielding the Fire Prism again. Hopefully this time it will do better.

If I sort out the points I could field a unit of 10 Wraithguards with Cannons in deep strike to ruin his day. That´ll be 30 Wounds on Toughness 6 and a 3+ to chew through.

Thoughts?

Offline Partninja

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2017, 05:54:30 PM »
I might consider something else over the lone Fire Prism. Like days of old, you really need to take 2-3 or none.

Offline Irinc

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Re: Play testing Craftworld Attribute: Alaitoc
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2017, 03:55:10 AM »
Fellow Asur, victory has been claimed once again. I only lost 2 Models during course of the battle which lasted for 2 rounds. My focused firepower crippled his army very fast.

My list was:


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [75 PL, 1500pts] ++

+ HQ +

Autarch [4 PL, 103pts]: Avenger Shuriken Catapult, Forceshield, Reaper Launcher, Star Glaive
Farseer [6 PL, 100pts]: 2. Doom, 4. Executioner, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

+ Troops +

Guardian Defenders [9 PL, 200pts]: 20x Guardian Defender
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform: Starcannon
. Guardian Heavy Weapons Platform: Starcannon

Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger
Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

+ Elites +

Wraithguard [11 PL, 225pts]: D-scythe, 5x Wraithguard

+ Heavy Support +

Dark Reapers [4 PL, 86pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher
Dark Reapers [4 PL, 86pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher
Dark Reapers [4 PL, 86pts]
. 2x Dark Reaper: 2x Reaper Launcher
. Dark Reaper Exarch: Tempest Launcher

+ Flyer +

Crimson Hunter Exarch [9 PL, 175pts]: Two Bright Lances
Crimson Hunter Exarch [9 PL, 175pts]: Two Bright Lances

+ Dedicated Transport +

Wave Serpent [9 PL, 144pts]: Shuriken Cannon, Spirit Stones, Twin Shuriken Cannon

++ Total: [75 PL, 1500pts] ++

Craftworld Trait was Alaitoc.

My opponent fielded a infantry heavy list. He also had 2 Leman Russ, 2 Basilisk´s and 3 Sentinels a few mortar squads and some psykers.

Deployment was number one on the list, Spearhead. It came in quiet handy for me.The Wraithguard with D-Scythes was able to get in range from turn 1 on. They did great work! They started by crippling a Gattling Leman Russ inflicting him 7 wounds. A few shot from the Dark Reapers and 4 Starcannon shots finished him off. The Dark Reapers Exarch´s Tempest Launchers were devastating. On Turn 1 I wiped a whole Squad of Mortars with just two of them. Crimson Hunters did very well too. I think they have their place in Alaitoc. The stacking buffs on the hit modifiers helps them staying much longer effective.
Rangers and Guardians did again their job: disrupting deep strikers and blocking out flankers + long range fire support. My Rangers actually killed a psyker!
The Craftworld Attribute is a banger. As it has been already theorized, the hit modifier diminishes considerable armies like Astra Militarum. Hardly any wounds came through.

It was a very pleasing match for me. My opponent instead was bewildered to watch me doing all my stuff. After all he was amused too and motivated to improve his list. We will play again some time in the future.

 8)

Next up ist Ulthwe.


 


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