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Offline funkyfellow

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Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« on: December 22, 2009, 06:01:12 AM »
Ello ello! So after much help and deliberations from fellow Alaitoc players a few months ago I finalized my list and began playing with it! Painting is still in progress (the goal is to be ready by the end of April) But I have had some wonderful games with them. Anyhow here's the list!

HQ

Avatar of Khaine

Farseer /w Runes of warding, spirit stones, doom, fortune, singing spear

Elites

8 Harlequins /w Death Jester, Shadowseer, Troupe Master with power weapon, 6 kisses

8 striking scorpions /w exarch, power claw, shadow strike, stalker

Troops

5 Rangers

5 Rangers

10 Dire avengers /w exarch, dual catapults, bladestorm

6 Guardian jetbikes /w warlock, embolden, singing spear, 2 shurrican cannons

Fast Attack

7 Warp spiders /w Exarch, Dual Spinners

Heavy Support

3 War walkers /w Shurrican Cannons

Wraithlord /w Brightlance, Wraith Sword

Wraithlord /w Brightlance, Missile Launcher

Deployment's goal is to form a phalanx with the avatar and wraith lords in the front, avengers with the far seer behind them and the harlequins and jetbikes covering my flanks. The warp spiders normally deepstrike and war walkers outflank. Rangers deploy on home objectives and hold. The scorpions are a trump card and are deployed depending on my opponent, either outflanking, infiltrating with the pathfinders, or guarding a flank in the phalanx.

As the game progresses the phalanx ponders across the board to engage the enemy shooting at priority targets, rangers pin what they can and target monstrous creatures, going to ground when shot at. Warp spiders and Warwalkers are fantastic surprises for my enemy, normally getting rear armor on a tank and taking it down or decimating a squad (fantastic when they both appear on the same turn) after which they harass the enemy and distract him from the phalanx barreling down on him along with the scorpions (unless they stayed with the phalanx).

Near the end of the game, unless i am facing a close combat army, my phalanx arrives at the objective and proceeds to assault, the combined might of a bladestorm /w doom + all my lovely cc units and monstrous creatures usually ends the fight for all but the most hardened units.

I'll eventually post a battle report so you can see the tactics in detail, theres more to it than what I described, but for the most part its worked extremely well for me. My toughest games so far have been against guard. The lack of antitank at the beginning of the game and the gunline nature of the guard gives me a hard time getting close, but at my local club mostly everyone plays mech and thus build their lists to counter it, giving them a harder time against me!

The list is designed to be both fluffy and competitive and so far has a 7-0-0 streak! Though theres been a few nail biters! I'm slightly worried how it will fair against my friends mech tau army though, he's in Afghanistan at the moment so we haven't had a game in awhile, but I think I'm gonna have an up hill battle with that one!


Offline Irisado

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2009, 06:45:29 AM »
Alaitoc lists are very awkward in fifth edition, because it is hard to make an effective list whilst remaining true to the background, but I think you have done a good job here.

Given your win ratio, and the fact that this army has been assembled and you are painting it, I'm not going to make very many suggestions, so I will stick to areas which strongly concern me, rather than pick up on every minor detail.

Not giving the first Wraithlord an EML seems very strange.  Your don't have enough anti-tank as it is in this list for the points value you are playing in my opinion, so I really do recommend giving that first Wraithlord an EML instead of its Wraithsword, since you need two Wraithlords equipped in this manner in my experience to bother opposing vehicles.

The Dire Avengers could work quite well as a pin, which would involve giving the Exarch the Power Weapon, Shimmershield and Defend combination, but if you feel you have your infantry line covered defensively by taking two assault units, that's fair enough.

My last point concerns the Jetbikes, since I don't know how you manage to keep them from being shot to pieces.  Given that the true line of sight rule makes them hard to hide behind cover, and that they are rather brittle, I just cannot see how they survive in an all infantry list, so if they are working for me you, please enlighten me on how you manage to get them to perform well in this list, because I cannot see how they fit on the face of it  :).

Everything else looks solid enough, and you certainly have a very good assault force.

I hope that helps.
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Offline Preedy1978

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2009, 07:05:32 AM »
 I like this list a lot. *thumbs up* there's a few points I'd like to point out, although Irisado has nailed most of them pretty much succinctly:

 Wraithlord with BL and Sword: This guy is dual purpose, and that's really a bad way to go with any Eldar unit. Either get him an EML, or lose the BL completely- maybe give him a Shuricannon instead if you really want a mounted weapon? Either way is good, just don't go for the inbetween here :) Used with just a sword (or with a shuricannon as well) then you have a unit that could easily accompany your Avatar- twice the CC potential here.

 I like the rest of the army a lot, although with two squads of rangers, perhaps one of them should get the upgrade to pathfinders- the extra points do pay dividends, especially if you can make that squad a little larger.

 Perhaps Scatter Lasers for the Walkers too? That way you have the option of NOT outflanking with them, as the situation demands- either way, they get that increased range and an extra shot, and are still reasonably priced. Just a suggestion really here though and not urgent- Shuricannons are still a good choice.

 
 Against Tau, I'm afraid, however, you will struggle. You really do need a more mechanised force to really get at them from the outset. Tau shooting is just too overpowering to resist for a footslogging Eldar force. Your only chance would be to outflank/deepstrike anything and everything you are allowed to, be extremely aggressive, and hopefully distract your opponent enough to force him into making mistakes- although this is more hoping than any tactical finesse. One exception is those rangers/pathfinders. They really do annoy the Tau- especially Pathfinders, who get that lovely bonus save in cover. Sure, they can counter this, but then they have to expend that on the small unit of pathfinders, taking the heat off of your other units.


 All this aside- I really do like this list. Nice and fluffy, and it  always makes me smile seeing Harlequins in a list- maybe I'm just too fond of them.

Offline Dunedain

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2009, 08:22:50 AM »
Looks good, and definitely keps with the army theme. overall, i'd rate it 9-10.

The jetbikes puzzle me though. I don't see how to really fit your tactics and they cost a fair amount of points. 

They could probably be swapped for a more hard hitting unit that would support your phalanx better, like another squad of striking scorpions. or you could just exchange them for a couple guardian units to add numbers and supporting firepower.

An EML on the lance/sword wraithlord would be a good idea. You need all the anti tank you can get, as a pair of vindicators or something like that is really going to screw up this list bad if they survive the whole game.
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Offline Gutstikk

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2009, 09:20:48 AM »
Haven't seen an Alaitoc list with reports of huge success in a while, so I'll take the time to do a review!

Background: .75
While you've done a great job picking a theme and following it, and have discussed the strategic goals as well as the environment it's playing in [a tournament environment], I'd like to see a bit more light shed on the mostly mechanized opponents you're facing and why it seems their lists have difficulty handling yours. This is more for the benefit of others reading the list who may want some insight to dealing with vehicles in the currently vehicle-heavy climate. Apart from that though the list seems to encapsulate the units and the fast guerilla style of Alaitoc rather nicely, and the tactical/strategic writeup is much appreciated. It would be interesting to hear what the tables in your tournament environment look like, and if the missions are standard missions or specialized ones.

Composition: 1.0
The army utilizes units from across the Force Organization chart, and the units show a fair amount of variety [I actually find it refreshing to see the wraithlords outfitted a little differently from each other]. It's good to see an emphasis on units filling complimentary/supplementary roles without too much duplication; while harlies and scorps are both useful at close combat, and have defenses against shooting, the style of combat and defenses are different enough that an enemy can't rely on a single mode of damage delivery. The KP and scoring unit balance is exactly right.

Utility: .75
You've managed to specify the function of the units clearly enough in your tactical writeup that referencing the list vs the writeup gives a clear picture of what each unit should be doing during each game phase. For the most part, it seems you've favored upgrades that add to the primary function and avoided those that add a secondary role, which from the utility perspective is ideal - where your units are filling secondary roles generally it is one that is included in their base price. Not too sure about the death jester, and while a wraithsword can be nice to have in close combat the brightlance will tend to be at odds with the option to run, so there's some tension there. You don't seem to be overtasking your units with your described strategic approach, with most units having a single goal in a single round. Without the total unit cost it can be difficult in the case of the harlequins to know if you're fielding 8 or 9 - 9 is more optimized for morale than 8, and in the case of the warpspiders, the points spent on the extra two shots might possibly be better spent elsewhere. Minor points you may wish to consider.

Flexibility: .75
True to the Alaitoc theme your army has a wide variety of deployment options while still adhering to the main strategy the force wishes to execute; striking this balance can be quite difficult to do but here I think it's been handled very well. The model count can be a little deceptive due to the presence of several monstrous creatures but might still be a little bit low with the emphasis placed on quality resilient units, but the ability to deny small arms fire can be quite helpful and in the end it seems a wash. The balance of shooting to assault elements is handled very nicely, the redundancy of unit roles is, as mentioned above, executed well without resorting to mere duplication to an unhealthy degree. Not a whole lot of mention is given to the secondary functions of your units in your writeup; while they have options available to them it might be nice to see them addressed [even if you don't make use of the secondary functions too frequently]

Ingenuity: .75
You've explained your main strategy in detail, and addressed a good foil to it with the discussion of enemy gunline armies. A little more detail in how you handle the bad matchups might be helpful. You've done a good job describing most of the combos and synergies available to your army, as well as some of the more unusual things you might be capable of. Of particular note is the total lack of gravtanks, making use of go to ground, planning an army with a trump card built in [and described as such], and the anticipation of what an enemy can do to rain on your parade.

Total score: 4.0/5.0
This score indicates the above army list and corresponding writeup represent a well-thought battle plan with pains taken to ensure the appropriate tools for the job are selected without relying too much on extensive upgrading. You've stuck to a theme, but you've also made it work for you. This list serves as an example of a very good Alaitoc force, when the list is coupled with the explanation of how to make it work.

Offline Fenris

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2009, 12:59:10 PM »
One of the best list I have seen in a while, I would rate it 9/10.
I would probably have dropped bladestorm on the avengers, upgraded the lord from BL+sword to BL+EML, and dropped 1 spider in favor of powerblades and withdraw.
Net cost = 2pts less.
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Offline Gutstikk

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2009, 01:35:44 PM »
Depending on how their played though, powerblades and withdraw doesn't necessarily make any sense. One of the nice things about this list is that more or less just about every point is spent doing what the unit does best.

I'd prefer scatter+EML rather than BL+EML, or shuriken cannon + sword, for the swordlord. But honestly the EML isn't gonna pull a whole lot of AT weight compared to some other options.

Offline Irisado

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2009, 02:31:34 PM »
But honestly the EML isn't gonna pull a whole lot of AT weight compared to some other options.

No, it's not, I agree, but it is the only way of making a pair of Wraithlords effective against vehicles with AV12 in my experience, and given that there are a fair few of those around, I think it's essential to equip both Wraithlords with the EML and Brightlance, otherwise they are really going to struggle to deliver the necessary anti-tank performance in my experience.
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Offline Dunedain

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2009, 04:25:53 PM »
Th trick with EmLs and other str8 weapons is to use them in numbers.  Thats why it's a good choice for the falcon, and also why it's a good choice for wraithlords because they can field multiples of them.

is one EML going to dent a AV12 vehicle? Possibly, but generally not. is four going to have a much bigger chance of success? yes.

Plus, with the high BS of the wraithlord, it makes more sense to take lots of guns, as they have a higher chance of actually hitting the target.
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Offline Brute3792

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #9 on: December 23, 2009, 07:16:17 PM »
one of the lists i use looks alot like this one, and it has worked out very well for me. i see you have stumbled upon the realization that "hey! there ARE non mech eldar lists that work!" congratulations. i would recommend basically what Fenris said. also, i would lose the walkers in favor of making the rangers pathfinders.
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Offline funkyfellow

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #10 on: December 23, 2009, 10:29:09 PM »
Thanks for all the fantastic replies guys! I wrote up my post later in the night for me and was a little tired so I'll clarify my selections and tactics some more for those who have questions!

First off is the death jester, I put him in the harlequins for a few reasons, the predominant one because I like the model and feel it fits the theme of the list. But other than that for ten points I get a shurrican cannon that also pins to shoot with while my army advances, adding to the possibility of pinning a squad my rangers a shooting at (so far I have had excellent luck with pinning, though certain armies can ignore this handy little tool)

I didn't upgrade my rangers to pathfinders because their goal is not to harm the enemy, besides the odd monstrous creature or pinning shots at vulnerable targets. Instead they're main goal is to hold the objectives near my deployment zone, while the pathfinder upgrade offers the +1 to cover save it can be imitated by sending my rangers to ground.

The jetbikes where included in the list to address a major problem it has: the lack of mobility. They generally hide behind the main force, attracting little attention until it closes in where they will contribute to the fire power of my avengers and then turbo-boosting away in the endgame to contest an objective or even control a far off ignored one! Also with the singing spear and shurrican cannons they have a remarkably large threat range to tanks. (+ they look spiffy in the Alaitoc scheme!)

While I would enjoy having defend on the avengers, I just can't give up bladestorm. It makes the avengers even better at what they do and can be crucial when facing hordes of close combat troops, thinning the numbers before my assault. Also through deployment I am able to adequately hide the avengers from assaults until the end of the game. As for tarpitting I feel the list doesn't need it, other than the jetbikes everything surrounding the avengers is CC oriented and more than capable of holding an enemy for the rest of the army to deal with.

Using the warp jump on the spiders I have yet to see them hit close combat (though I admit there are situations where I would want them in it) thus I haven't shelled out the points for withdraw and blades, also since there's only seven of them I would want to add more to the squad to have a chance at cc. (in lower point games I have used 8 spiders /w withdraw and blades + an Autarch to great success)

The reason I have shurrican cannons on the walkers is because they're cheap, while it does limit them somewhat to always depending on outflanking, it has worked well. I have had bad flanks before but I don't overly depend on them showing up at the right time at the right place (though when they do the game shifts dramatically to my favor)

Now for the wraithlord, while I agree it would be better with a missile launcher it also costs more points than I can spare. Now the wraithsword has actually saved my bacon a few times, since my lords pair up with my avatar they actually will end up in melee most of my games supporting my avatar in an assault or even managing to assault a vehicle!(usually Dreadnaughts) while 3 attacks on the charge isn't awe inspiring they are str 10 hits One of my favorite tactics with the lord+avatar tag team is attacking retinues with them. The avatar has a higher initiative and attacks first usually wiping out a large portion of the squad, then the wraithlords attack, with the lower amount of models in the unit I can allocate a wound or two the hq, this is where being able to re-roll to hit is important because one unsaved wound from a wraithlord = dead character for the most part.

The biggest thing keeping my squishy troops alive is the threat of the avatar! Now my opponent has to kill my squads to the last to make them run + the fact he is such a large and frightening target my opponents direct more fire power at him than they should. Also through my deployment and movement almost everything in my army has cover saves at all times, I even have tricks of giving my rangers +2 cover in the open if there no objectives in cover.

Dealing with tanks can be an issue at the start of the game, I've faced mech guard twice now and they're been incredibly close games, while my opponents focuses on taking care of my wraithlords (the obvious anti-tank in my list) I'll position my jet bikes, warp spiders(through deep striking), and war walkers(outflanking) to take care of side/rear armor on squadrons! I'm ballsy with deep striking my warp spiders, and while things have gone south, when it works it works its game breaking! Deep striking behind a vehicle squadron has made more than one of my opponents cry!

My biggest problem with mech has always been with their mobility compared to mine. I counter this through careful deployment of my units and objectives, I have to make them want to go where I want them to stand a chance.

In kill points this becomes harder as the squishier parts of my army become larger targets. I generally try and keep everything together and hide my rangers in the phalanx. I'll wait on committing my resources to fight unless I can nab a kill point without taking a reprisal and patiently get into position. On turn five I'll initiate as many close combats and pour all my firepower into select targets and hope I either cripple my opponent or hope the game ends.

Of course there's more to it than that but this post is already getting quite large and I'm running out of time.

Thanks for reading guys! Any more thoughts?


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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #11 on: December 24, 2009, 08:50:35 AM »
The jetbikes where included in the list to address a major problem it has: the lack of mobility. They generally hide behind the main force, attracting little attention until it closes in where they will contribute to the fire power of my avengers and then turbo-boosting away in the endgame to contest an objective or even control a far off ignored one! Also with the singing spear and shurrican cannons they have a remarkably large threat range to tanks. (+ they look spiffy in the Alaitoc scheme!)

All I can say is that you are doing a better job than me at hiding them from opposing fire, but if they work for you, then by all means keep them, as you have explained how you use them, and if this tactic works for you, that's good enough for me  :).  I have just one point I would like you to clarify regarding the Jetbikes.  I assume that you have seven in total (the Warlock being the seventh), as otherwise you could not take two Shuriken Cannons.  Is this the case?

Quote
Now for the wraithlord, while I agree it would be better with a missile launcher it also costs more points than I can spare.

This is easily solved in view.  If you were to drop one Warp Spider, you would have enough points to take an EML on this Wraithlord, and I think this would be a very worthwhile exchange, as your anti-tank in this list really is a bit weak in my opinion and could so with being strengthened.

Quote
Now the wraithsword has actually saved my bacon a few times, since my lords pair up with my avatar they actually will end up in melee most of my games supporting my avatar in an assault or even managing to assault a vehicle!(usually Dreadnaughts)

Their primary role, however, is shooting opposing vehicles.  If you wanted to take assault Wraithlords, then it would be better to give them Wraithswords, dual Flamers and no heavy weapon whatsoever in my few, and run them forward with the Avatar (and assault units) to form the Monstrous Creature tag team.  I don't recommend that option in this army though, since it would leave you devoid of ranged anti-tank, which is already the major issue with this list, hence why I strongly advise adding that second EML.

Quote
Dealing with tanks can be an issue at the start of the game, I've faced mech guard twice now and they're been incredibly close games, while my opponents focuses on taking care of my wraithlords (the obvious anti-tank in my list) I'll position my jet bikes, warp spiders(through deep striking), and war walkers(outflanking) to take care of side/rear armor on squadrons! I'm ballsy with deep striking my warp spiders, and while things have gone south, when it works it works its game breaking! Deep striking behind a vehicle squadron has made more than one of my opponents cry!

Warp Spiders are not that great against tanks, even when targeting them from behind in my experience, although they can pull off some spectacular results on occasion, due to the sheer number of shots they fire.  Deep Striking, however, is very fickle, hence why I think you need both those Wraithlords to be equipped with an EML and Brlghtlance, because, at the moment, if the Wraithlord with the two heavy weapons falls in the first or second turn, you could be in very hot water indeed against a list with a high proportion of vehicles.

I agree with the other points that you have made, and you are obviously well versed in playing the Eldar.  I do, however, strongly recommend that you have a re-think about the Wraithlord issue, as it's only one very small change, which I think balances out your heavy support, and gives you just a little bit more in the way of anti-tank firepower, which this list could do with in my view.

I hope that helps.
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Offline funkyfellow

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #12 on: December 24, 2009, 10:08:04 PM »
Quote
I have just one point I would like you to clarify regarding the Jetbikes.  I assume that you have seven in total (the Warlock being the seventh), as otherwise you could not take two Shuriken Cannons.  Is this the case?
Yes the group consists of 6 Guardian jet bikes and a warlock on a bike, thus a seven man unit. So far hiding them hasn't been as much of a problem, i use the mobility of the jetbikes + my monstrous creatures and terrain to effectively block line of sight half the time, and through careful movement presenting "juicier" targets for my opponents (such as my avatar, though my oppoents might catch on to this soon). But for now they seem to be working for me.

I'll have totest your suggestion with the spiders and wraithlord, though I am a little nervous of the change. I feel my warp spiders really need those 2 extra shots and the extra body to be performing as well as they have been for me. If I had the points I'd definitely want an 8 man squad, that seems to be the sweet spot for em.

Offline Partninja

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #13 on: December 24, 2009, 11:34:00 PM »
This is quite a nice list. I would be more inclined to run the Rangers as a squad of 10, but two separate squads targeting the same unit would give the same effect. Also it would keep the wounds to one unit or the other.

I usually prefer to max out my CC units as well as spiders (They're my favorite unit but they haven't seen much action as of late). However with your list you really can't pull the points from anywhere else. Same with the sword-lord. I'd want to get a EML/BL combo on him.

The only thing that could be dropped is the spiders to move the points around to the rest of your army but the spiders are adding quite a bit to your list. I love them as well so I wouldn't suggest dropping them.

Not having maxed units of 10 (other than DAVU Falcons) is just one my OCD quarks. However with this list it seems like it works due to the MC's magical "fire magnet" properties.

I'm currently working on a mixed list similar to this based off my Iyanden army. You've given me some ideas :) It's hard to get everything I want/need into 1500-1750 pts games.

Offline 29+12

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #14 on: December 26, 2009, 10:08:12 AM »
I'm slightly worried how it will fair against my friends mech tau army though, he's in Afghanistan at the moment so we haven't had a game in awhile, but I think I'm gonna have an up hill battle with that one!

In my, I'll admit fairly limited, experience with the tau I've found that running Scorpions with a Fortuneseer through cover next to the Avatar is a fairly effective way of reaching their line with enough punch to smash it. Don't know wheather that will work against a mechanised army though =S

Another thing would be to not get too distracted by his tanks early in the game, his hammerheads esp. can only inflict one wound on one of your MCs a turn. If you can eliminate his CMD squad then all of your infantry will benefit and remember your str8 AT weapons instakill them.

One last piece of advice, never ever ever underestimate the amount of pain a single squad of fire warriors with rifles can inflict on your Avatar!

Offline OneMeanChicken

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2009, 11:11:35 PM »
Well speaking from a Mech Tau players point of view I would have to say if I saw this army I would love to play against it!

The theory of how good your scorpions with fortune would be doesn't matter to mech tau. They are faster then you. They can move 12 inches with EVERYTHING and still fire at full so your scorpions should never see assault. You may get to their broadsides if you infiltrate... but against you infantry heavy list the tau player will probably not care...

Also note if he uses markerlights and plasma the fortune wont matter. If he wants scorpions dead he will kill them. Too many people think cover is a cure all against tau.... Silly elves.

Avatar follows the same problem. Yes that melta gun hurts..... my shield drones... And if your 12 inches from one of my tanks I have already screwed up. But I have killed many an avatar with firewarrios and burst cannons.. they pose little threat.


I like your army as a hole but being a Tau mech player I see a ez turkey shoot there... Your just too slow for an eldar. The spiders and walkers will be my first target, and the walkers will die first turn they are in no problem, the spiders will suffer enough wounds to make then worthless.. After that its just run and gun... Shoot up one side and flank you. Done it many a time to armies like this. no doubt I will lose a few squads in assault but being MUCH faster then you I will be able to pick and choose the assaults... Which is always a major advantage.

you need speed. I can see armies like Dark Eldar, Tau, and maybe Ork speed armies smashing up that list. And if your saying you will be playing mech tau and if he is any good he should mop up your army.

If it were me and I saw your list I would have a sigh of relieve before the game even started. No offense but I am speaking from a blue skin perspective.

My other army is Eldar also and one thing tau doesn't like are wave serpents FYI. But as an eldar player tau is always one of my hardest fights. Fortunately the other local tau player does more of a gun line so it makes it a little ezer.

Pinning would be irritating but you still cant pin tanks.

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Re: Rate my 1850 Alaitoc List
« Reply #16 on: December 30, 2009, 11:10:51 AM »
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The theory of how good your scorpions with fortune would be doesn't matter to mech tau. They are faster then you. They can move 12 inches with EVERYTHING and still fire at full so your scorpions should never see assault. You may get to their broadsides if you infiltrate... but against you infantry heavy list the tau player will probably not care...

I do believe that your units count as moving if they disembark ergo your pulse rifles would only be able to shoot 12" also if i remember correctly you can't move everything 12" a turn as you can't embark, move then disembark on the same turn. I might be wrong with these rules though, I'm currently not at home and can't check in the rulebook.

Also the manner in which you write suggests that you're not taking into account the size of the board nor the experience of the player. An experienced player will certainly have ways in which to corner your fishes and because your things aren't fast they can't jump across the lines like Eldar skimmers

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Also note if he uses markerlights and plasma the fortune wont matter. If he wants scorpions dead he will kill them. Too many people think cover is a cure all against tau.... Silly elves.

again you are considering him moving exactly like you want and not applying pressure anywhere else, also you are assuming you have enough markerlights deployed, that they haven't moved since last turn, that they are in range of the scorps, that they have line of sight to the scorps, that there are no other higher priority engagements in need of markerlight support and that enough of them hit. Oh and also that you have plasma near enough, with LOS, in range etc etc etc.

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Avatar follows the same problem. Yes that melta gun hurts..... my shield drones... And if your 12 inches from one of my tanks I have already screwed up. But I have killed many an avatar with firewarrios and burst cannons.. they pose little threat.

again in a vacuum and assuming he does exactly what you want.

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The spiders and walkers will be my first target, and the walkers will die first turn they are in no problem, the spiders will suffer enough wounds to make then worthless..

They won't be on the table from turn one and probably not turn 2 either.

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And if your saying you will be playing mech tau and if he is any good he should mop up your army.

Again what if the OP is a vet, I'm sure hell be able to use his list effectively enough to give even an experienced Tau player a bit of a challenge and not just be mopped up.

I'm not saying that the Eldar will win or that it would be an easy fight. I'm just saying that the Tau won't deff. win. You need to consider many things before you can say that. You can however say that you think this list will naturally have trouble with mech tau builds due to lack of speed and then offer some constructive criticism in how to improve it. After all you are an Eldar player as well so you should know what units would help this list or clever little tactics you could use.

Your reply just seemed a little on the harsh side, the OP already said he thinks the mech tau will give him trouble so there was no need to emphasize this fact and tell him he's got no chance.

 


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