Topic: Which army list is better?

[The Ecclesiarch]

I just want to get your opinion on which army list you think is better, which one would you rather play?
My choices are based on the models that I have available to me, but any other suggestions over things I could change are welcome.

Army list 1.
H.Q.
Librarian Drago with Nemesis warding stave 200pts.
Psychic powers: Hammerhand, Might of Titan, The Shrouding, Warp rift. 
(with Terminators)

Elite.
10 Purifiers with x4 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Incinerators,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 258pts.
(in Landraider)

Troops.
10 Grey Knights with x6 Nemesis force halberds, Psybolt ammo, x2 Psycannons,
Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 285pts.
(Deep Strike)

10 Grey Knights with x6 Nemesis force halberds, Psybolt ammo, x2 Psycannons,
Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 285pts.
(Deep Strike)

7 Terminators with x2 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Nemesis force weapons, x1 Incinerator,
Terminator Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 290pts.
(in Landraider Crusader)

Heavy.
Grey Knight Dreadnought with a Heavy flamer, Nemesis doomfist, Searchlight, Twin-linked Lascannon 156pts.

Grey Knight Land Raider Crusader with Multi-melta, Psybolt ammunition 270pts.

Grey Knight Land Raider with a Searchlight 256pts. 

2000pts.

Army list 2.
H.Q.
Librarian Drago with Nemesis warding stave 200pts.
Psychic powers: Hammerhand, Might of Titan, The Shrouding, Warp rift. 
(with Terminators)

Elite.
10 Purifiers with x4 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Incinerators,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 258pts.
(in Landraider)

Troops.
10 Grey Knights with x6 Nemesis force halberds, Psybolt ammo, x2 Psycannons,
Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 285pts.
(Deep Strike)

10 Grey Knights with x6 Nemesis force halberds, Psybolt ammo, x2 Psycannons,
Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 285pts.
(in Stormraven)

5 Terminators with x2 Nemesis force halberds, x2 Nemesis force weapons, x1 Incinerator,
Terminator Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 210pts.
(in Landraider Crusader)

Fast Attack.
Stormraven Gunship 205pts.

Heavy.
Grey Knight Land Raider Crusader with Multi-melta, Psybolt ammunition 270pts.

Grey Knight Land Raider with a Searchlight 256pts. 

1969pts.

With list 2 I have some points left to play around with.

[High Grandmaster smithmyster666 of the Grey Knights]

As always the first point of call is to question why you have upgraded the strike squads with NFH's, for their cost they are a massive waste on a 1 attack base model.

[WisdomLS]

I would agree that the Halberd are overpriced on the strike squads but perhaps you are using the old metal models giving you little choice in weapon option.

If you are using the old models then perhaps investing in Crowe would be something to consider as he would allow you to field more purifiers as troops and they are a much better fit for the equipment the old models come with.


Back to the two lists, I think I prefer the triple threat of the second list, it throws alot of hard stuff straight at the enemy and dares them to deal with it. The only change I'd make would be to swap the terminators + Libby into the stormraven, it'd get them right to the enemy quicker and also the libby would give the raven a 3+ save when going flatout which it is gonna need.

[The Ecclesiarch]

Thanks for the replies. List 2 it is then.
I am using the old models and there's no way that im going to convert them or buy new models...
*sigh* I think you're right, I am going to have to use Crowe.
Anyway, here's the new list.
I thought id reorganize my squads on account of using Crowe and whats available to me.

Grey Knights Wardens.
H.Q.
Castellan Crowe 150pts.

Troops.
10 Purifiers with x5 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Incinerators,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 260pts.
(in Landraider)
 
10 Purifiers with x5 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Psycannons,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 300pts.
(Deep strike)

10 Purifiers with x1 Daemon hammer, x5 Nemesis force halberds,  x1 Incinerator and x1 Psycannon,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 275pts.
(in Landraider)

6 Terminators with x2 Nemesis force halberds, x2 Nemesis force weapons, x1 Incinerator,
Terminator Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 250pts.
(in Stormraven)

Fast Attack.
Stormraven Gunship with Ceramite plating, Mindstrike missiles (not sure what weapons to use) 205pts.

Heavy.
Grey Knight Land Raider Crusader with Multi-melta, Psybolt ammunition 270pts.

Grey Knight Land Raider with Searchlight 256pts. 

1970pts.

This new list leaves me with 30pts spare.
What do you guys think?
What weapons do you think I should give my Stormraven?

[WisdomLS]

Sorry to throw a spanner in the works but Purifiers can't deepstrike.

So those extra 30 points could be nicely invested in a rhino for that squad.

Another thing to consider is finding points for another additional rhino/Razorback perhaps by dropping a couple of dudes from one of the squads.

This additional vehicle can be used either as a crowe taxi or it would allow you to combatsquad more effectively and thus give you a bit more tactical flexability.

Other than that a pretty solid purifier hammer list.

[The Ecclesiarch]

What about this?

H.Q.
Castellan Crowe 150pts.

Troops.
10 Purifiers with x5 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Incinerators,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 260pts.
(in Landraider)
 
10 Purifiers with x5 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Incinerators,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 260pts.
(in Landraider)

10 Purifiers with x5 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Psycannons,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 300pts.
Transport.
Rhino 40pts.

6 Terminators with x2 Nemesis force halberds, x3 Nemesis force weapons, x1 Incinerator,
Terminator Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 250pts.
(in Stormraven)

Fast Attack.
Stormraven Gunship with Ceramite plating, Mindstrike missiles, Twin-linked assault cannons, Twin-linked Multi-melta 205pts.

Heavy.
Grey Knight Land Raider Crusader with Multi-melta, Psybolt ammunition 270pts.

Grey Knight Land Raider 255pts. 

1990pts.

I was thinking.
I could drop a Terminator and have an extra Razorback,
or I could turn my Stormraven into a meatgrinder by giving it Twin Heavy bolters, Twin Assault cannons, Hurricane bolter sponsons & Psybolt ammo...just a thought.

Should I keep this list the way it is, or opt to drop a Terminator so I can either upgrade my Stormraven into a meatgrinder from hell or have another Razorback?

[WisdomLS]

I'd keep the stormraven as is, you already have an over abundance of anti-infantry firepower adding even more to the mix at the expense of a TL Multimelta is not a good idea.

I love the incinerators but think you'd do better if you changed a couple to psycannons (model collection allowing).
Keep the incinerators on the crusader squad, as they will always be plouging forward but maybe change a couple that are in the other landraider squad into psycannons as this squad is more likely to be hanging back allowing their vehicle to shoot more or perhaps combat squading to spread the wealth.
2 Psycannons in a deckchair squad guarding your objective and the other half having 2 incinerators charging out of a landraider seems like a good option to be able to use.

Too get the points for the psycannons you'd have to drop a single mastercrafting and the Psybolts from the landraider.
Even if you don't want the psycannons you should drop the LR's psybolt upgrade as it stops the hurricane bolters being defensive weapons meaning you have to sit still to fire all your guns, a crusader is best rolling forward pouring fire as it goes.


Other than that the list looks good to go 

[The Ecclesiarch]

It shouldnt be too hard for me to get a few extra heavy weapon guys.

H.Q.
Castellan Crowe 150pts.

Troops.
10 Purifiers with x5 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Incinerators,
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 260pts.
(in Landraider Crusader)
 
10 Purifiers with x5 Nemesis force halberds, x2 Incinerators and x2 Psycannons.
Knight of the flame with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 280pts.
(in Landraider)

10 Purifiers with x5 Nemesis force halberds, x4 Psycannons,
Knight of the flame with Daemon hammer 295pts.
Transport.
Rhino 40pts.

6 Terminators with x2 Nemesis force halberds, x3 Nemesis force weapons, x1 Incinerator,
Terminator Justicar with Master-crafted Daemon hammer 250pts.
(in Stormraven)

Fast Attack.
Stormraven Gunship with Ceramite plating, Mindstrike missiles, Twin-linked Multi-melta 205pts.

Heavy.
Grey Knight Land Raider Crusader with Multi-melta 265pts.

Grey Knight Land Raider 255pts. 

2000pts.

Thanks a lot Wisdom

Just another minor question. What other weapon would you put on the Stormraven besides the Twin-Multi-melta, Lascannons or Plasma cannons?

[WisdomLS]

I'm not a big fan of the plasma cannon on stormravens and due to your list being supergood at killing infantry I'd be inclined to take the lascannon for added anti-tank, with its range, the height of the raven and its PotMS you'll always have something good to shoot at.

The assault cannon is good also but I think you've got those bases covered already.

[The Ecclesiarch]

Thanks again Wisdom, you're awesome

[High Grandmaster smithmyster666 of the Grey Knights]

i personally 1 up for the plasma cannons on the SR, i use them and they serve me very very well, they provide a very nice template vs terminators and are a great wepaon for punishing an enemy who clumps his troops together too tightly (i once burned out 12 necron warriors due to their grouping)