News: No news is good news...

Login  |  Register

Author Topic: Deathmarks the new auto include?  (Read 3159 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Herm_777

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 57
  • I *LOVE* 40k Online!
Deathmarks the new auto include?
« on: May 30, 2013, 01:48:28 AM »
With the Tau's riptide and the eldar's wraithknight  and smaller cousins on the horizon, I find myself looking to deathmarks and the nearly obligatory despairtek more and more. Is this the general sense of the community or do you think that destoyers and strength 7 spam is enough to handle the new uber MC trend of late.

Offline Idaho

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 667
  • Country: 00
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2013, 09:59:31 AM »
The Necron Codex is blessed with multiple methods to bring down such beasties so I don't really believe there are any auto includes, though Deathmarks are good choices.

I take 6 Heavy Destroyers in my lists and find their range, reach and firepower a great boon. The best of it is most opponents will shoot Wraiths, Barges and Ghost Arks before them with their heavy weapons that can reach them, which means you can get a few barrages on opponents each turn.

Alternatives include using Wraiths to kill them or just tie them up (a Destroyer Lord is quite a cruel choice too), a trio of Spyders, saturation of fire from Tesla  (not ideal) or just ignore them. That's right, ignore the big monkey. Necrons vehicles are less scared of such constucts firepower so you can often weather that large blast even if it is S8.

Of course distraction helps as if you can put a few Heavy Destroyers shots on it you can force your opponents to protect themselves.

Offline prot

  • Infinity Circuit | KoN Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1041
  • Country: 00
  • Prot ZA113
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #2 on: June 3, 2013, 08:51:34 PM »
Deathmarks were a decent choice before but I agree as these new units come out, it becomes a little more tempting.

Pairing them up with a cryptek with Harbinger of Despair and the Abysmal staff make a good combo that can be ugly for your opponent to assault.

Also look towards Apoc for even greater use. Apoc is around the corner it looks like, and there's a new Khorne piece on the cover that looks possibly like another multi-wound unit. (Just guessing though) But even so, Apoc is decent for units like Deathmarks. I actually have used them in several games if I have a spare pile of points, but I often face nasty Nid lists with multi Tervigons so it's always plausible I'm going to need them.

Eventually I don't think we'll see too many Wraithknights/Riptides, etc ,because these units are so adept at taking them down and I think we may see a (temporary ????) shift towards these units as big/tough/multiwound units come into play. (Even Eldar are getting incentive with Illic Nightspear and Pathfinders.)

For the record I have over 10 Deathmarks that I have actually used in multiple units to take advantage of the mark for death ability, but that's just me being goofy.

Offline BritishBill

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 164
  • I *LOVE* 40k Online!
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #3 on: June 4, 2013, 12:42:21 AM »
I am regularly taking 3 units of 6 or 7 deathmarks in my games. The rules for marking an opposing target really favors multiple deathmark units and I don't feel the competition in the Elite slot is all that great. Whilst use against riptides and wraithknights is certainly tempting, I think we do have other units that can deal with these. I find the best use of deathmarks is for taking out foot slogging troops which they generally do with ease.

Offline prot

  • Infinity Circuit | KoN Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1041
  • Country: 00
  • Prot ZA113
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #4 on: June 6, 2013, 03:20:55 PM »
Wow! How big are your games?

Offline Idaho

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 667
  • Country: 00
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #5 on: June 7, 2013, 12:43:12 PM »
I am so tempted to drop one of my Heavy Destroyer trios for a unit of Deathmarks. The extra infantry are useful in my list but the target saturation might just keep my remaining Heavy Destroyer unit alive.

It's hard because I really enjoy the benefits of 6 S9 shots a turn.

Offline prot

  • Infinity Circuit | KoN Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1041
  • Country: 00
  • Prot ZA113
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #6 on: June 8, 2013, 10:38:58 AM »
When 6th edition first came out and preferred enemy became what it is, I started out with a 6th ed list that featured a Destroyer Lord that would bounce between multiple destroyer, and heavy destroyer units.

It was very effective for what it was.... but man was it expensive. While some opponents were devastated by this setup, some simply laughed at it. Eventually I came to replace the effectiveness of the heavy destroyers with Annihilation Barges which also alleviated AV13 targets by saturating the field with this type of unit.... I do miss destoyers though.

I came to enjoy the Deathmarks. I just counted mine up, I only have about 10 built, but I proxy some in once in a while for the double squad Marked for Death combo special. But to be honest most frequently I run them as described above, one unit of 9 with a Cryptek. They add something that I really like against a few different types of opponents.

Proxy it out for a game. See if you like it. It may not be for you, but at the very least I'd say it's a very fun thing to try. I love dropping them in my opponent's turn if they aren't embarked. They're just beefy snipers but it makes everyone really change their plans when they see these things come down in their turn. It has a weird mental effect on some opponents. lol

Offline Idaho

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 667
  • Country: 00
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #7 on: June 8, 2013, 11:57:44 AM »
I think I will. 180pts gets me a healthy 8 Deathmarks and some change. I can't use Crypteks since I don't have an Overlord, but I still think 8 Deathmarks jumping in will put pressure on something and net me a kill if I'm careful. If I can rapid fire, I might even enjoy them after their Marked squad is dead (rapid fire sniper shots equals potential for rends!).

Consider me convinced to try them. :)

p.s. are you Prot from B&C?

Offline prot

  • Infinity Circuit | KoN Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1041
  • Country: 00
  • Prot ZA113
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #8 on: June 8, 2013, 10:54:59 PM »
I think I will. 180pts gets me a healthy 8 Deathmarks and some change. I can't use Crypteks since I don't have an Overlord, but I still think 8 Deathmarks jumping in will put pressure on something and net me a kill if I'm careful. If I can rapid fire, I might even enjoy them after their Marked squad is dead (rapid fire sniper shots equals potential for rends!).

Consider me convinced to try them. :)

p.s. are you Prot from B&C?

I hope they work out. There's no doubt in some situations you may struggle to find true value in them, but still I like them.

p.s.
Yes, I am. I thought you knew that Idaho of BnC. ;)  But I've played 'crons (and eldar) forever. Crons since they were crappy pirates with egyptian head dresses and just small lists of space pirates.  Eldar I'm about ready to give up on. I'm going broke filling out all my armies. Time to pull back!

Offline Idaho

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 667
  • Country: 00
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #9 on: June 9, 2013, 12:46:44 PM »
Necrons have always been a favourite of mine too so I'm wondering other boards too. :)

I should have a game next week so I can try out 8 Deathmarks (the exchange from Heavy Destroyers gives me enough points for couple extra Immortals too).

Offline prot

  • Infinity Circuit | KoN Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1041
  • Country: 00
  • Prot ZA113
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #10 on: June 9, 2013, 01:29:47 PM »
Cool. Make sure you let us know how it goes. Good luck!

Offline BritishBill

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 164
  • I *LOVE* 40k Online!
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2013, 11:51:02 PM »
Prot,

You asked how big my games were to be able to afford 3 groups of 6 deathmarks, the answer is 1850 points. The rest of my list includes two Doom Scythes, two Night Scythes with 7 Gauss Immortals in each, two squads of 6 tesla immortals, overlord with orb and sempiternal weave, royal court of 5 crypteks, 4 with Eldritch lances and 1 with a Veil, and three individual heavy destroyers.

I start with the overlord joined to the royal court and the three heavy destroyers on the table, in hiding, hoping to get second turn. Because they are ever living the possibility of wiping out the overlord and the crypteks in two turns is remote. Everything else is now coming in through reserves.

Overall, I think this is pretty balanced and I have been pleased with the way it works. I feel the other Elite troops really don't cut it and are both twice the points cost of deathmarks. I also know that I am not taking good advantage of our fast attack slots which may well be our most versatile, but the heavy destroyers with preferred enemy make really good snipers, if you lose one (except for first blood) it is not a big deal and it uses up an organisation slot which allows me to field the reserves I have described. So far I have been lucky in not losing deathmarks in deep striking accidents and when my reserves come on, you can rather dictate where the conflict is going to be.

Offline prot

  • Infinity Circuit | KoN Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1041
  • Country: 00
  • Prot ZA113
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2013, 09:02:11 PM »
Hey BritishBill,

I'm not one to criticize how you use your 'crons. I think it's great you can fit 3 squads in, and like we've been saying it might make more sense than ever with all these mutli-wound high toughness models coming out.

I too have been playing a lot of 1850 lately and I have 2 x 5 man squads that I usually deep strike on my opponent's turn. They're not expensive enough to totally ruin my game if they goof up, but they can be annoying to my opponent. I wanted to use a cryptek trick with the Abysmal staff for killing things on a 2+ but I don't have the heart to use extra Night Scythes.

Two Doom Scythes is really interesting. I have also been using 2 x Heavy Destroyers. It's been up and down. I was taking a lot of destroyers originally because they were so good before this codex. But I kinda got bored of them... still a fair unit though imo.

Right now I'm fielding Anrakyr and I wanted to put him in a command chariot for his MITM power but I chickened out and put him with Pyyreahns (sp?)

I find it interesting you put the Gauss Immortals in Night Scythes and put your Tesla on the ground. Any reason for that? Or just because you want the Gauss getting in rapid fire asap?

I personally have trouble giving up my dual Annihilation Barges that I've been using for eons. But I am considering some Praetorians I packed up way back in 5th. They might just be something I'm willing to take a risk on, but for now the 2 x 5 Deathmarks have that spot and my assault is quite light in this list.

Offline BritishBill

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 164
  • I *LOVE* 40k Online!
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2013, 11:55:45 PM »
Hello Prot,

Please don't think I was in any way offended by your post, and if that came out in my belated reply, I do apologize.

I have also tried a variety of lists, including Destroyer Spam. The difficulty I have is by the time you have included the obligatory fliers, and the death marks, you have used a lot of points to really get into the fast attack slots. If I am going to bring variety into the list I need to drop some deathmarks and probably go down to the 2x5 that you mention. I can see an argument that that is optimum to allow you to mark a couple of tough to crack nuts and then move on. Compared to what I am fielding, that is saving 152 points, that is not to be sneezed at !!

With respect to putting the gauss weapons in the fliers, this is to be able to double tap when you come in, it is also to be able to get close to vehicles if I need the gauss to destroy these. However, I do have other options with the heavy destroyers, the eldritch lances and the Doom Scythe Death Rays.

The army I am having most trouble with at the moment is Tau, particularly when allied to Eldar with a Farseer with guide and Prescience. Their ability to fire on the turn your fliers come in and be guided is a real pain.

Any way, I think Deathmarks definitely have a place in our lists although I could believe I am over using them !!

Offline prot

  • Infinity Circuit | KoN Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1041
  • Country: 00
  • Prot ZA113
Re: Deathmarks the new auto include?
« Reply #14 on: June 14, 2013, 08:51:00 AM »
No worries BritishBill, I think we're on the same page.

I know I play enough of the armies that include high toughness/mutliwound that the cheap, multisquads of Deathmarks make some sense... they are just cheap enough imho to make a presence.

Tau are nasty to everyone. I also find IG a pain as the range difference usually causes me a few turns of painful gap closing (I don't play with 5 flyers personally... so I move a lot.)

Eldar? I don't know yet; I haven't played against them, but I do see multi-Tervigon Nid lists quite a bit and they're nasty.

I gotta be honest one thing that changes the mechanics of some of my issues is still my old pal Imotek. He's expensive and it's not always the lightning, but the Nightfight that makes it work and I may go back to him.

For tonight I have a Anrakyr and 2 x 5 Deathmarks in my list. We'll see how that goes... I don't know who my opponent will be.

 


Powered by EzPortal