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Author Topic: [2000] Grey Knights + Astra Militarum {Competitive}  (Read 1234 times)

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Offline Akaitsuki

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[2000] Grey Knights + Astra Militarum {Competitive}
« on: February 19, 2016, 02:45:04 AM »
Which of these would you find more challenging to defeat with your take on all comers list?

List 1

2000 Pts - Codex: Grey Knights Roster - 2000 - NSF + AD [AM] - Pask

: Nemesis Strike Force (8#, 850 pts)
   1 Librarian, 165 pts (Melta Bombs; Warlord)
      1 Domina Liber Daemonica

   1 Terminator Squad, 460 pts
      1 Terminator Justicar (Nemesis Warding Stave)
      4 Grey Knight Terminators (Nemesis Daemonhammer)
      1 Land Raider Redeemer (Multi-melta)

   1 Nemesis Dreadknight, 225 pts (Personal Teleporter; Heavy Incinerator; Heavy Psycannon; Nemesis Greatsword)

: Allied Detachment (19#, 1150 pts)
   1 Leman Russ Command Squadron (HQ) [Mil], 520 pts
      1 Knight Commander Pask's Leman Russ Punisher [Mil] (Heavy Bolter Spoonsons)
      1 Leman Russ Vanquisher [Mil] (Lascannon)
      1 Leman Russ Vanquisher [Mil] (Lascannon)

   1 Veteran Squad (Troops) [Mil], 160 pts
      9 Veteran [Mil] (Meltagun x3)
      1 Veteran Sergeant [Mil]
      1 Chimera [Mil] (Heavy Flamer; Multilaser; Heavy Stubber)

   1 Leman Russ Squadron (Heavy) [Mil], 470 pts
      1 Leman Russ Battle Tank [Mil]
      1 Leman Russ Battle Tank [Mil]
      1 Leman Russ Demolisher [Mil]

Total Roster Cost: 2000

List 2

2000 Pts - Codex: Grey Knights Roster - 2000 - CAD [GK] + AD [AM] + Executioner

: Combined Arms Detachment (14#, 1240 pts)
   1 Grand Master, 205 pts (Warlord)
      1 The Soul Glaive

   1 Terminator Squad, 190 pts
      1 Terminator Justicar (Nemesis Warding Stave)
      2 Grey Knight Terminators
      2 Grey Knight Terminators (Nemesis Daemonhammer)

   1 Terminator Squad, 190 pts
      1 Terminator Justicar (Nemesis Warding Stave)
      2 Grey Knight Terminators
      2 Grey Knight Terminators (Nemesis Daemonhammer)

   1 Nemesis Dreadknight, 225 pts (Personal Teleporter; Heavy Incinerator; Heavy Psycannon; Nemesis Greatsword)

   1 Nemesis Dreadknight, 225 pts (Personal Teleporter; Heavy Incinerator; Heavy Psycannon; Nemesis Greatsword)

   1 Nemesis Dreadknight, 205 pts (Personal Teleporter; Heavy Psycannon; Nemesis Greatsword)

: Allied Detachment (16#, 760 pts)
   1 Leman Russ Command Squadron (HQ) [Mil], 600 pts
      1 Knight Commander Pask's Leman Russ Punisher [Mil] (Heavy Bolter Spoonsons)
      1 Leman Russ Executioner [Mil] (Plasma cannon Spoonsons)
      1 Leman Russ Executioner [Mil] (Plasma cannon Spoonsons)

   1 Veteran Squad (Troops) [Mil], 160 pts
      9 Veteran [Mil] (Meltagun x3)
      1 Veteran Sergeant [Mil]
      1 Chimera [Mil] (Heavy Flamer; Multilaser; Heavy Stubber)

Total Roster Cost: 2000

Offline Spectral Arbor

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Re: [2000] Grey Knights + Astra Militarum {Competitive}
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2016, 07:02:05 AM »
Hi Akaitsuki,

Welcome to the site. I very rarely play against GK, and when I do my opponent doesn't usually use Dreadknights. Do you have any pointers on how you expect the armies to play?

The mixed Battle Tanks and Demolisher is less effective than just 3 BT's, due to range issues.

Squadrons of tanks are quite vulnerable to suddenly disappearing. A handful of krak grenades or a dedicated melee unit [looking at you, Assault Terminators] will delete them. Same deal with high RoF, mid strength shots, like Scatter Bikes.

For that reason, I'd suggest the 2nd list is less vulnerable, more mobile, and probably the better TAC list.

Offline Akaitsuki

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Re: [2000] Grey Knights + Astra Militarum {Competitive}
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2016, 11:54:28 AM »
Hey thanks for the welcome Spectral Arbor.

As for how I expect the armies to play.

List 1 is pretty much a Tank rush because you know...Tanks are cool. I expect it to be very strong with lots of AV14 rushing the opponent down, with a Dreadknight and Terminators inside to deal with units trying to assault the vehicles. I don't intend to play this list as a gunline at all that's why the demolisher and Paskinsher vehicles having shorter range within their squadrons shouldn't be a problem. Basically the Battle Tanks and Vanquishers nail targets that are too far away so that no shooting phase is wasted.

That's 7 AV14 vehicles, in this edition with enough range that facing superior mobility isn't a problem.

List 2

This list is also a rush but a bit differently the 2 tanks will rush to support the dreadknights who will shunt first turn to be right in the opponent's face being an immediate threat. The terminators deep strike in and support where needed.

Offline Spectral Arbor

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Re: [2000] Grey Knights + Astra Militarum {Competitive}
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2016, 08:15:21 PM »
My two most frequent opponents are now Eldar and Necrons. Eldar Guy favours Scatter Bike CAD + Wraith Host. At 1850 points, I think he ran 17 D-Weapons. Maybe more. That AV 14 = big point sink, at that point.

Necrons are as Necrons do. They'll have trouble glancing you down, but it will happen eventually, regardless of the AV. After that, it's White Scars with Knights, or DA [bike heavy] with Knights... After those, it's Tau.

So yeah, those Russ don't do too well in the Survival department. Nature of the changing beast, but mobility just crushes them, in my experience. It's hard to gain LOS, for me. We tend to use a lot of terrain though, I could probably whine my way into less terrain.

Anyhow, your range = non-issue. Range is overrated, coming from a long-time Guardsman in this edition. Warp Spiders can move 23.5 inches, on average, and can still fire at about the 16" mark.  Further in one turn, if you shoot at them. Scatter Bikes? Long range, and if you threaten them up close they fly away. Necrons can embark and deploy from zooming fliers... that's pretty damned mobile. Tau are roughly as mobile as Guard, but most of their units don't suffer firepower penalties for moving. And then they jump or jink. :)

Your first list is good if your opponent can't flank / surround you. Otherwise, you're cooked. Even then, 1 Imperial Knight > 3x Leman Russ. You'd be better off taking Knights instead of Russ squadrons.

Offline Akaitsuki

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Re: [2000] Grey Knights + Astra Militarum {Competitive}
« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2016, 04:25:31 AM »
solid breakdown, that was a useful read. I'll keep all that in mind.

I play all those army listed myself so im not a complete stranger to them, but it's great to have more perspective on my list's potential flaws and weaknesses thank you.

As for your final comment about just having more dreadknights that puzzled me because 'isn't that what the second list is for?' it forgoes russes in favor of knights pretty much.

Offline Spectral Arbor

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Re: [2000] Grey Knights + Astra Militarum {Competitive}
« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2016, 11:21:10 AM »
Ah, I was unclear. I meant Imperial Knights. Double-Tap Battle Cannon or Rend-o-Matic Cannon. Or both. :)

 


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