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Author Topic: 1500 points against tough Necrons  (Read 717 times)

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Offline Geometer

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1500 points against tough Necrons
« on: March 5, 2015, 04:44:11 PM »
Hey guys,

I'm looking for advice on how to fight against the new Necron Codex. First things first, I reactivated my forumaccount after about 12 years and it still exists :o so I wouldn't consider myself a newbie. After finding a nice gaming group in my area I had to face a nice guy and his Necrons. My last game with him was like the most boring game of Warhammer I have ever played since nobody killed any of the opponents stuff in reasonable time.

At the end of turn 3 I killed 1 Vehicle (that one shot S10 Large Blast thing) and his HQ on Chariot while he managed to shoot 1 squad of 10 man dire avengers and both of my Wraithlords.
It was like this: i had 3 maelstrom objectives and he had 3. He drew better  cards  and won. The game took ages since we both barely lost and models.

My List last game was:
Quote
Eldar (Combined Arms detachment, Primary detachment)

---------- HQ (2) ----------

Spiritseer (70 points)
- Shuriken Pistol, Witch Staff

Spiritseer (70 points)
- Shuriken Pistol, Witch Staff

---------- Troops (2) ----------

9x Dire Avengers (117 points)

9x Dire Avengers (117 points)

---------- Elite (1) ----------

6x Fire Dragons (277 points)
- Wave Serpent (Twin-linked Scatter Laser, Shuriken Cannon, Holo-fields)

---------- Fast Attack (2) ----------

5x Warp Spiders (95 points)

6x Swooping Hawks (96 points)

---------- Heavy Support (4) ----------

Falcon (160 points)
- Scatter Laser, Shuriken Cannon, Holo-fields

Falcon (160 points)
- Scatter Laser, Shuriken Cannon, Holo-fields

Wraithlord (165 points)
- 2x Flamer, Ghostglaive, 2x Bright Lance

Wraithlord (165 points)
- 2x Flamer, Ghostglaive, 2x Bright Lance

___________________ ___________________ ________
1492 points

It's worth to mention that we play on a casual level. I don't even have a wraithknight (and I will never buy one! Ugly model) and just one Serpent (sure I could proxy a falcon as Serpent nobody would care/notice).

The Guy fielding necrons had something like:

1 HQ chariot
1 resurecting transporter with 10 warrior
20 Terminator warrior squad wirh special character (sometimes the invul guy, sometimes the "combatdrug" guy)
1 Illum Zar style Tank
10 meele infiltrating guys with a stupid amount of attacks
2 smaler vehicles with sole random guns (some s7 shots, some AP 2/3 shots)
2 jump pack guys with las cannons

If I remember correctly. For me it looks like a quite casual list but all these 13/13/11 vehicles and warriors who are nearly impossible to kill I don't know what units work good against his necrons.

For our next Game I'm considering this list, what do you guys think?

Quote
Eldar (Combined Arms detachment, Primary detachment)

---------- HQ (5) ----------

Spiritseer (70 points)
- Shuriken Pistol, Witch Staff

Spiritseer (70 points)
- Shuriken Pistol, Witch Staff

Spiritseer (70 points)
- Shuriken Pistol, Witch Staff

Karandras (230 points)

Baharroth (195 points)

---------- Troops (2) ----------

10x Dire Avengers (130 points)

10x Dire Avengers (130 points)

---------- Elite (2) ----------

8x Fire Dragons (211 points)
- Fire Dragon Exarch (Fire Pike, Fast Shot)

8x Striking Scorpions (176 points)
- Striking Scorpion Exarch (Scorpion's Claw, Scorpion Chainsword)

---------- Fast Attack (2) ----------

6x Warp Spiders (114 points)

5x Swooping Hawks (105 points)
- Swooping Hawk Exarch (Sunrifle)

___________________ ___________________ ________
1501 points

I really love to field the Phoenixlords. Baharoth could be a very nice tank for the Hawks who are probably very strong against his high AV vehicles and might kill some Warriors with their large AP x blast. His xinch Blind test and the exarchs blind Rifle might help alot due to the extreme low initiative. Even in Melee the Phoenixlord can blind/kill some stuff and protect the hawks until they can hit&run out of combat. This squad might help me alot and i'm very much looking forward to field them.
The spiritseers are supposed to join the Dire Avengers and Fire Dragons to give 2+ cover saves (and all the other shenanigans) which necrons cant really break as far as I see it. I might change the firedragons for Wraithguard (just imagine Toughness x with 2+ saves :) ).
Scorions with karandras are supposed to counter Melee threats and/or kill the Necron Warrior squad.
Warp Spiders are an obvious choice really.


What else would you guys suggest? Would you make some changes to the list without writing a complete new one?

Edited for stats to comply with GW's copyright rules - Iris.
« Last Edit: March 5, 2015, 06:14:20 PM by Geometer »

Offline magenb

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Re: 1500 points against tough Necrons
« Reply #1 on: March 5, 2015, 06:03:26 PM »
Welcome back :) I'm in a similar boat as you as I've started playing again.

I think you have too many points in HQ, the FD on foot are unlikely to reach their target and more than likely get killed before they can get in range.

Have a read through the new rules for the Wave Serpants (WS), they are not just a transport any more :).
Check out the new bladestorm rules too :)

I love War Walkers, they let you get a lot of S6 firepower in (laser lock goodness) at range. Against Necrons, I would consider taking a brightlance instead of the starcannon as you will face av13.

For me, I have found this works OK as a base for 1500

10 x DA in WS TL-Scatt, TL-Shuriken-cats, Holo (Could also swap out for Guardians with Scat)
10 x DA in WS TL-Scatt, TL-Shuriken-cats, Holo (Could also swap out for Guardians with Scat)
5 x FD in WS TL-Scatt, TL-Shuriken-cats, Holo
7 x Warp Spiders
3 x War Walkers, Scatt+Starcannon(or Brightlance)

Offline Grizzlykin

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Re: 1500 points against tough Necrons
« Reply #2 on: March 5, 2015, 06:53:19 PM »
to me there is waaaaaaay to many hq in this list ><

i would rather get farseer than spirit seer in that list as you don't have any wraith in.

to be able to think up a list i would like to know what model you hown if you don't mind.

regarding the falcon i think that might be nice to keep some in but i would change the scater for bright lance. then to had more anti tank fire power i would have both falcon loaded with fire dragons, or have some wraithguard somewhere. if you do, then keep a spirit seer stick him with them and get everything in a serpent.

For the anti infantry ... huum necron are pretty thought T4/5 if i recall correctly, so if you want to get ride of them your warp spyder might be a very good bet. they have low initiative right? and they are generally pretty slow. you warp spyder fire a s7 the enemy they fire at are low init charcter, so you should use them to take out the normal necron warrior i think, warp jump them close then fire then run then jet pack move away you should be able to do some pretty good dammage and if you get yourself in cover you should be pretty survivable.

i kinda like hawk but i'm reallly not sure this a good idea. neither are scorpion in my opinion. As far as i remember necron have some reallly nasty cac unit. so i would prefer to avoid this at all cost if possible. threrefore i would not run those two unit listed up here.

keep the avenger in my opinion that's a good bet. if you get a farseer or two you can get some guide or/and fortune of and that will help a LOT!  I think... I hope... if you do take one of those i personnally like to go for a psychic focus with all spell in runes of fate, but that's just me so don't give it to much attention.

...

...

I can't think of anithing else right know so i'm leaving this like this i will come again if anithing pop in my mind ^^ 

well i'm not here since long but since you've been away let me say, welcome back^^
The Grizzly's Arvandor Craftworld!

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Offline Geometer

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Re: 1500 points against tough Necrons
« Reply #3 on: March 5, 2015, 07:45:55 PM »
Thanks for your input so far!

You guys value spiritseers so little? I mean the best thing with them is that you can attach them to any squad and pump them with Psi. Like increasing Saves, giving shroud (safe thanks to psycic focus), restoring HP for characters, reducing armor of Warriors (imagine Dire avengers firing on armor 5+ warrior!), making Fire Dragons way faster, Horrify can be handy too. And with 3 of them you have a good pool to choose from.

Instead of the Scorpions (which might infiltrate in the enemy deployment zone - the necron guy tends to place everything quite close) what would you take as a Melee counter? I think the Scorpions could take most of these flayed ones out. So infiltrating or deploying (perhaps with spiritseers when they get Enhance or Empower) as counter.

In my opinion (hadn't much time to try) the spiritseers are the way to play aspect warrior heavy lists. Well thats just a side note, have to figure stuff out first ;)

Your advice to use bright lance is an obvious choice, I thought the same but had like NO success with that. I had 4 Bright Lances and 2 Pulsars which is quite some punch, sure bright lances on the falcons should have been better. Thats why I'm looking for different approaches. Might also be bad luck ofc.

But yea I should try to squeeze a Farseer in for the Dire Avenger (I suspect they will do the heavy lifting, because ppl often dont shoot them. U know they are just troops) and Fire Dragons/Scorpions.


What kind of models do I have? No War Walkers unfortunately, no Wraithknight. But everything else (unfortunately just 6 Warp Spiders, and 7 Hawks).

I've edited your post to put the names of some of the powers in.  It's best to avoid writing out the rules from GW's books to avoid unwanted attention from their legal department.  Take a look at our forum rules for further details: http://www.40konline.com/index.php?action=rules - Iris.
« Last Edit: March 6, 2015, 05:12:40 AM by Irisado »

Offline magenb

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Re: 1500 points against tough Necrons
« Reply #4 on: March 5, 2015, 08:30:27 PM »
Psykers have not worked out for me. Sure there are some great abilities but they are random.

Swooping hawks are great for assaulting mechs, but once that's done they are not very useful against T4/5 targets, so they are a one trick pony against Necrons.

Laser lock helps the brightlances, you still need a bit of luck to Pen, otherwise you need to flank the mechs, which is easy enough to avoid.


Shining spears could also work out for you, Warlock's on Jetbikes are rather expensive point wise but also work against mechs.
« Last Edit: March 5, 2015, 09:18:03 PM by magenb »

Offline Partninja

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Re: 1500 points against tough Necrons
« Reply #5 on: March 6, 2015, 07:37:05 AM »
It isn't that Spiritseers are not valuable, it's that you have so many points tied up into characters (some expensive ones too) in your HQ section. It's not leaving you any bulk to work with.

As someone who plays both Eldar (My largest, and favorite army) and Necrons I can offer some advice.

Using weapons that negate their infantry armor save makes a huge difference. AP2-3 will negate one of their saves, making it harder for them to stay up. Dark Reapers, Star Cannons, and lots of Bladestorm weapons.

Target priority is also key. Meltas, Wraith Cannons and Lances should target the Ghost Arks first so they can not resurrect fallen models.

Offline davethemadorc

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Re: 1500 points against tough Necrons
« Reply #6 on: March 6, 2015, 08:55:22 AM »
a necron list with no wraith ? ;)

the trouble is point for point he probably outnumbers you whichever way you break [shots / bodies]

not a fan of 'stacking' armies just to beat one enemy - but experimenting in a friendly way isnt going to make enemies !

spirit seers are not brilliant against high LD enemy as psychic shriek isnt going to work. for a point tax id stick a farsser or two on a bike and be done with it - or run them on foot with the avengers oif it feels better

realise you might  be playing 'with wot u got' ... but spiderz are far better than hawks in almost all roles, and if you are stacking v necron themn the bright lances are the way to go where you can - possibly even on the WAVZ - they will at least keep him honest

necrons really dont like it in their faces so maybe some scorpions would help out  - two units of 5 for the price of one phoenix lord !


 


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