News: No news is good news...

Login  |  Register

Author Topic: Navigators  (Read 1544 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline icn1982

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 17
  • I *LOVE* 40k Online!
Navigators
« on: February 9, 2010, 06:48:56 AM »
Hi

I was looking into the background of Navigators and came accross this:

"THE PATERNOVA
The Paternova is the leader of all Navigators and the most powerful of all his kind. The Paternova may live for up to a thousand years. When he dies all the existing Heirs Apparent begin to change - they begin to grow even larger and stronger. Their gill structure becomes fully functional allowing them to survive in hard vacuum as well us underwater or in normally poisonous environments. Most important, they start to fight.
They are drawn to combat with each other, building up a pitch of aggression that eventually overrides all other considerations. As Heirs Apparent are killed those who survive change even more until finally only one remains alive. It is this vastly changed and extremely powerful individual who becomes the new Paternova.
The Patenova lives in the Palace of the Navigators which lies on Earth in the centre of the zone held by the Navis Nobilite. Following his accession, the Paternova never leaves the palace. The existing staff, soldiery and other retainers of the palace are replaced by those drawn from the Patemova's own House. The chief amongst his servants is the Paternoval Envoy who becomes a High Lord of Terra and sits on the Senatorum Imperialis.

The role of the Paternova is an obscure part of Navigator biology although no-one doubts its importance. The Paternova is described as the guiding father whose powers transcend the warp itself.

During the interlude between the reign of one Paternova and another, all Navigators other than Heirs Apparent suffer a considerable reduction in their powers. Their ability to navigate the warp is impaired, warp journeys become longer, ships are unexpectedly lost, and younger Navigators may lose their abilities completely. As soon as the new Paternova is installed the powers of Navigators are restored. However, not all are restored to the same degree. Navigators belonging to the same House as the Paternova find their abilities enhanced, as if their blood relationship were enabling the Paternova to transmit his powers more effectively. Navigators belonging to the House of the old Paternova lose this benefit, and so individuals may find their powers impaired."

Reading this, I started to wonder if it was actually the Patemova who provided the Astronomicon (sp?) and not the Emporer on the Golden throne - especially as the navigators were created before the Emporer became intured to the Golden Throne.

What are others opinions?

Ian

Offline The Ecclesiarch

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1218
  • Country: gb
  • Be Pure, Be Vigiliant, Obey!
  • Armies: Forces of the Imperium, Da Boyz, CHAOS.
Re: Navigators
« Reply #1 on: February 9, 2010, 09:43:41 AM »
BLASPHEMY >:( DIE ;D Well that aside and from what i do know about the Navis Nobilitie the navigator familys are actually older the Imperium and many of them are mutants, mutation among navigator familys is tolerated because the Imperium needs to make use of them, a bit like the way they tolerate Ratlings, Ogryns and Salamanders. I think probably the astronomicum makes navigation through the warp a bit less random and alot more reliable but the signal definately comes from the Emperor and not the rulers of the Navis Nobilitie.
+++ Ecclesiastical Proverbs +++
Blasphemy cries out for purgation from the faithful.
Blessed are the war makers.
By Bolter and Flamer we purify the faithless.
Hate sanctifies faith.
Anger and Hatred are mankind's highest virtues.
Let he who would be without sin cast the first grenade.
To be bigoted is human, to be unrepentant of thy bigotry is divine.
Tolerance is ignorance.
+++ Scribe Jack Hanson, Terra +++

Offline icn1982

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 17
  • I *LOVE* 40k Online!
Re: Navigators
« Reply #2 on: February 9, 2010, 09:51:33 AM »
The Navigators are believed to be genetically engineered during the dark age of technology:

"The Great Families of the Navis Nobilite are uniquely composed of a particular form of human mutant called a Navigator. The mutation is not a spontaneous or natural one, but rather the result of genetic engineering conducted in the distant past during the earliest history of the Navigator Houses. This engineering created the Navigator Gene that distinguishes Navigators from ordinary humans."

combine that with how navigator powers are weakened when a leader dies until the new one is appointed, and that if it is a result of genetic engineering, then surely it would make sense that there would be an inbuilt method to guide them.  Combine that with the fact that the leader never leaves his palace.

Starts to make you wonder.

BTW - Blasphomy, com ere an say dat so I canz bash you wiv my choppa   ;)

Offline The Ecclesiarch

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1218
  • Country: gb
  • Be Pure, Be Vigiliant, Obey!
  • Armies: Forces of the Imperium, Da Boyz, CHAOS.
Re: Navigators
« Reply #3 on: February 9, 2010, 06:52:42 PM »
Where did you come by the info about the Navis Nobilitie Paternova? Sounds like old fluff to me but i would be interested to know if its from White Dwarf or what. Its interesting that the Navigator familys predate the Imperium by thousands of years, i know they have a fair degree of autonomy from the Imperium and cant be bossed about quite as easily as all the other Imperial institutions. Still i wouldnt go as far as to say that a Paternova even compares to the Emperor in power.
+++ Ecclesiastical Proverbs +++
Blasphemy cries out for purgation from the faithful.
Blessed are the war makers.
By Bolter and Flamer we purify the faithless.
Hate sanctifies faith.
Anger and Hatred are mankind's highest virtues.
Let he who would be without sin cast the first grenade.
To be bigoted is human, to be unrepentant of thy bigotry is divine.
Tolerance is ignorance.
+++ Scribe Jack Hanson, Terra +++

Offline Kage2020

  • Knower of Things
  • Ancient
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6998
  • Country: us
  • Mar a tha, mar a bha, mar a bhitheas vyth go bragh
Re: Navigators
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2010, 12:22:47 AM »
I believe those materials come from WD 139/140.  I always forget which bits come from which WD, but they're some of the more "important" and informative articles that WD has produced.

With that said, I personally think that it is a stretch to suggest that the Patnernova is responsible for the Astronomican.  It seems that the description is more in keeping with the idea that they influence the ability of the Navigator to "see" the Astronomican, or rather the warp, rather than generating the Astronomican itself.

Kage

Offline Rems

  • Lazerous Penguin
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1039
  • Country: au
Re: Navigators
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2010, 12:46:34 AM »
err gill structure?

i was alaways under the impression that navigators were humans with a 'warp eye mutation'. the description given there is very bestial.

this sounds like very old fluff, almost as though they were not clearly defined yet. for example there is no mention of the 3rd (warp) eye.


Offline Kage2020

  • Knower of Things
  • Ancient
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6998
  • Country: us
  • Mar a tha, mar a bha, mar a bhitheas vyth go bragh
Re: Navigators
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2010, 12:56:29 AM »
There is no mention of the third/pineal eye because the posters have not included those materials.  Suffice to say that it is there in the original articles.  Further, even the most recent materials on Navigators are basically copy/pasted from the originals...

...Okay, not so much the information from the Rogue Trader RPG. :D

Kage

Offline icn1982

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 17
  • I *LOVE* 40k Online!
Re: Navigators
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2010, 05:00:02 AM »

Offline Kage2020

  • Knower of Things
  • Ancient
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6998
  • Country: us
  • Mar a tha, mar a bha, mar a bhitheas vyth go bragh
Re: Navigators
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2010, 11:31:51 AM »
Wow, it's amazing what can find its way onto Dark Reign.  Suffice to say, however, that is an abridged version of the full article that was originally published in WD139/140.

:D

Kage

Offline LordDarigarn

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 121
Re: Navigators
« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2010, 08:54:29 AM »
It might have been released previously, but this material was released (word-for-word) in one of the Inquisitor supplements - as I aquired the file form the old Specialist Games website before it was closed, I don't know what Fanatic issue it would have been, but the Inquisitor was being featured in WD through issues 252-259 (off the top of my head, I have an old collection of WDs going back to WD200).
Quote from: BubbaMack
Besides, there is nothing more fun then pounding down a full squad of Marines in their all beloved power armour with a bunch of clowns in tights!! ;D

Amen to that.

Offline Colonel_Kex

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 128
  • The Emperor protects
Re: Navigators
« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2010, 09:31:17 AM »
navigators = higlanders?

i think one of the reasons for the Paternova not to leave the palace is that he needs to be heavily guarde, such an idividual must be a top assassination target.

i do have my doubts about the paternova being the provider for the astronomicon since it states that some navigators still retain their ability to navigate the warp. what i do think however is that his precens strengthen the astronomican making it easier to navigate.

maybe he's a part of the emperors soul reborn and they fight amongst themself to find a worthy vessel for his powers?

Offline Kage2020

  • Knower of Things
  • Ancient
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6998
  • Country: us
  • Mar a tha, mar a bha, mar a bhitheas vyth go bragh
Re: Navigators
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2010, 10:11:18 AM »
I think that the text is quite clear that it is not the Paternova that provides the Astronomican, only that whomever happens to be the Paternova somehow improves the abilities of the Navigators within their genetic line.  No suggestion is made as to how this might be possible, though I wouldn't be surprised if they were somehow going down the Dune route.  (Or even trying to mix it up by making it all Bene Gesserit with racial memory and empowerment.)

Again, not improving the Astronomican, but improving the basic abilities of the Navigators of their line.

I also have strong doubts that the Paternova is any part of the Emperor's soul, or that the Paternova is an avatar/daimon (deliberate spelling of that last) of the Emperor or Star Child.  Then again, what's one more "conspiracy theory," as Irandura would have it? ;)  (And it's certainly no worse than speculating whether the Soul Binding might also be a means of either extending sections of the Many Mind of the Emperor, or as a means of perpetuating said entities "overwatch" on the Imperium.  Perhaps it's just as crazy, though?  :D)

It would be interesting to speculate a mechanic by which the Paternova's abilities enhance those of their line, though. :D

Kage
« Last Edit: February 11, 2010, 10:12:37 AM by Kage2020 »

Offline praetorian1

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 500
  • Who ordered you to die!
Re: Navigators
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2010, 05:55:14 AM »
maybe it could be considered like the synaspe the tyranids use    ???

though this whole gill thing confuses me, i always thought that navigators were ethier frail and small or standard human size
if anyone can shine some light on this id appreciate it

and then it talks about them fighting also, would they be psychic fighting like in the ravenor books (i would htink so)
Time is not made out of lines. It is made out of circles, that is why clocks are round.

Offline Koval, Master Verispex

  • 40kOnline's Care Bear of Tanks | The Velvet Glove of Fated Tenderness and Ambition
  • Ancient
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3270
  • Country: gb
  • Well, that was unexpected...
  • Armies: Imperial Guard (Indelvian 190th Mechanised)
Re: Navigators
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2010, 06:41:38 PM »
though this whole gill thing confuses me, i always thought that navigators were ethier frail and small or standard human size
if anyone can shine some light on this id appreciate it
Well, they are mutants...

Quote
and then it talks about them fighting also, would they be psychic fighting like in the ravenor books (i would htink so)
Actually, the jury's still out on whether Navigators are even psychic, much less capable of psychic duelling, so I'm inclined to think it's got something to do with inter-house politics more than anything else. Backstabbing, conspiracies, that sort of thing.

Offline Kage2020

  • Knower of Things
  • Ancient
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6998
  • Country: us
  • Mar a tha, mar a bha, mar a bhitheas vyth go bragh
Re: Navigators
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2010, 07:07:03 PM »
The jury isn't really out.  They have psyker-like abilities and, at least in Dark Heresy, are considered pyskers for all intents and purposes.  It seems that they are as much psykers as the Webway is a part of the warp, which is to say they are... and are not. ;)

Gotta love the GW 'fluff' every now and again.  :-\

Kage

 


Powered by EzPortal