Topic: swooping hawk tactics

[syth773]

swooping hawks are one of the few aspect warriors i dont own (shining spears being the other).  i thought they were pretty horrible in the old codex but now they've become a lot more appealing.  i use warp spiders a lot, and i really love em, they dont have the range of swooping hawks but with the assault move they can usually stay out of assault range and possibly be able to duck behind cover.  their armor save is nice and with S6 weapons they rip apart most infantry even without any AP.  they also make a nice delaying unit with assalting and then getting out of combat with hit and run (or you can finish off a unit you shot up with the exarch's power blades).

so im wondering what can the swooping hawks do that's superior to the warp spiders.  i rather not take both at the same time as they are rather costly but i'd just like to hear some tips from other people.  i already see the possibilities with deepstriking them in (and droping their template) and then shooting up something but i wanna see any original ideas from other people.

[Iron_Wolf]

The large blast template anywhere on the board is definitely a benefit
Also, the ability to do this a few times in a game with skyleap is also good.

Other than that, I'm not sure, only been playing Eldar for a week, lol

[flipONE]

Hawks really, really, REALLY eat through Light Infantry . Guard, Nids, Orks, DE, and other Eldar are somewhat susceptible to Hawk Fire + Grenade Pack, even without Doom.

Hawks really start to shine when Doom is put on an opposing unit. Coupled with an Exarch's Sunrifle, and even Marines start to fall to Hawk firepower (weak but plentiful), and if its Orks or Nids they just eat it.. They also have Fleet, which allows them to move 12", d6" run and still charge. Not as useful against infantry (due to low STR), but with Haywire Grenades and Intercept, the Hawks can put an end to any vehicle quickly.

My favorite tactic with Swooping Hawks "ok, Exarch has Sunrifle, thats 6 shots." Opponent: "WTF, 6 shots".

[SKEETERGOD]

The Hawks have haywire grenades, they are the best landraider killers we have.  With a squad of six with the intercept power they are guaranteed 2 glances and two penetrating hits (and two misses) often times taking the Landraider out of the game.

Unfortunately they succumb quickly in close combat, so try to avoid getting them charged. 

[Big Bad Wolf]

Definitely the grenades is the huge difference imo.  Most people forget that they can assault vehicles 18" so they're usually left alone out in the middle of nowhere, and then end up right on a vehicle smokin it down.  Also, I've noticed mine have had a little added survivability because now when I deep strike them, I make them run so they are a lot less susceptible to just gettin killed as soon as they deep strike.  I try and drop them in between a few pieces of cover and then try to run into it for a cover save and so far its worked great. 

[Straker]

EDIT: no longer agree with my old strategy in from 4th in 5th...why was this thread dug up anyways?

[Swarmish]

Skyleap is a great power.  Why hate it?  I can't even see it being cheesy or abused - if thats where you were going.  It's not hit and run, but it's the next best thing.  I will agree that it is not necessary, but against hordes that outnumber you 3 to 1 (or more) - it's a must have.

To the OP:  Hawks are surprisingly good.  What makes them stand out to me is their versatility.  I use them to harass initially, but them find them as decent tank killers in a pinch.  And if they get into CC, they can jump out next turn.   Just don't use them as WS replacements!  Use them together - yikes...

[Big Bad Wolf]

sorry I should have clarified... I love using the haywire grenades, not the grenade pack + leap yoyo crap.  Thats a waste of points imo.  I was referring to their ability to lay down really good cover fire to low T models or assault vehicles with the haywires from 18" away

[flipONE]

sorry I should have clarified... I love using the haywire grenades, not the grenade pack + leap yoyo crap.  Thats a waste of points imo.  I was referring to their ability to lay down really good cover fire to low T models or assault vehicles with the haywires from 18" away

Why would you consider Grenade pack a waste of points if you're using them for anti-light infantry? Not every army you fight is going to require the use of the Haywires, and Skyleap adds a great tactical option that you don't HAVE to use. Oh yeah, remember Hawks have fleet their assault range is 18" + d6".

[HeroZero]

I can't say that I think yo-yo'ing is the best tactic in the book for Hawks, but there was the comment that I had passed back to me from my opponent when I explained it to him in the last game I used Hawks.

    "you mean you can put them on the board and remove them again in your movement? I'll never able to shoot them then! And a Large blast template?!? Sick."

That was the quote. It goes to say that a total unit denial in certain missions can make a huge difference. And with the new deepstriking table make it a lot easier and safer to get them on the board. As well as the possibility to bring them down on top of mission objective, for contesting purposes.
As a side note the opponent was IG so the template was really scary to him. So it can be taken with a grain of salt.

Just my thoughts.

Zero

[Straker]

I'm just saying I think you get much more points worth not using it -- and when I use my hawks in cc, I want them to stay there (as I only cc devastators, etc). And yes, whoever mentioned versatality is exactly why they are awesome -- they can do anything

[Rorin]

Skyleap can really save you games sometimes, as manteioned it gives versitality. Apart from that you can just go up if things go badly, and then you have saved a killpoint (in annihilation), against some armies you dont want the hawks on the groud cos they will just get assaulted/shot to bits and then its nice to drop a pie plate and go back up

But myabe i should try to start with them on the ground fro once, they can always go up again later...

[syth773]

start out with hawks on the table, if you deepstrike they can only come in on turn 2 on a 4+, but if you skyleap turn 1 they automatically come in turn 2.

[moc065]

Well yes and no... If they start on the table they certainly can Skyleap and return on turn 2: but they still roll to enter as per Reserve rolls (thus the Autarch is so handy still).

PS... Swooping Hawks have several viable tactics depending on the enemy you face, and they are about equal to Warp Spiders although they work in a much different manner.

Here are the tactics I use with Swooping Hawks.
--- 1st turn assaults on Vehicles: set-up forward but behind serious cover, while knowing that your enemy will have first turn and will want to advance in order togain LOS on you. If he advances at all then you can move, fleet and assault his vehicle.
--- Mass shooting and assaults on IGEQ enemies.
--- Pie Plate drops using Skyleap for Horde and/or IGEQ armies.
--- VP denial and Mission Objective contest...

All of these tactics can be used while starting the Hawks on the table, and in those rare cases that I start them off the table, it is normally because there is simply not enough terrain to give them good options on turn 1.

CaHG

[Kimster]

the box of swooping hawks just comes with the talon, how do you represent if you take a power weapon ot the sunrifle? I would like to take the sunrifle but there's no second weapon or larger weapon to replace the normal lasblaster
can anyone help me?

[Gutstikk]

Start off by paying the points for the Sun Rifle, inform your opponent you are testing it out. Once you determine which you like better you can do a simple conversion if you want the sun rifle, or leave it alone if you want the talon.

Since there is no official version of the weapon it is pretty much entirely up to you, so long as it doesn't look exactly like the Talon - and that only really matters at tournaments.

I still prefer the talon myself. Though I've been starting to think about that power sword...

[Erethrin]

skyleap is really useful to contest a objective . put them in reserve and deepstrike on the objective in the last turn ... now if only last turn wouldnt be random
:

[finoro]

the box of swooping hawks just comes with the talon, how do you represent if you take a power weapon ot the sunrifle? I would like to take the sunrifle but there's no second weapon or larger weapon to replace the normal lasblaster
can anyone help me?

Not sure if it is still produced but try looking for the Classic range Exarch. It would only be available direct order from GW or ebay.
He has three lasblasters tied together with string AKA Sunrifle!

For Lasblaster + Power weapon you neet to find a left hand+sword from somewhere and replace the pointy finger. Hawks Talon and Lasblaster are quite similar looking so no need to change that. Dire Avengers come with a basic looking sword that you could just glue on at the hip but that wont look as good as him actually swinging the sword.

[RezZzeD]

I think I've posted this before in another thread, but I use my Hawks as an Autarch bodyguard.  I field an Autarch with Fusion Gun and Power Sword, Banshee Mask and Wings.  I can DS him if I want to, pop a vehicle with the Fusion gun, if it doesn't pop, skyleap him out.  I get the use of Intercept for an autarch, plus he adds some strength to a swooping hawk assault.  He gives the +1 to reserves (technically +2 cause I field another Autarch with my Spiders).  And all this time, if I use skyleap, I get a template.  I had a 5 man squad of hawks take on a Tau HQ in a crisis suit with FNP in a gun fight and lay waste to him.  I think they sky leaped twice, dropping templates on his stealth suits. 

Just because you have skyleap doesn't mean you need to use it every turn.  Just consider it a way to get across the board really quickly or to get out of a nasty place.