Topic: 51st State or Federal Europe

[Spirit of Kurnous]

this is aimed more at UK people but anyone else can join in too:

If you had to choose between the two which would you rather Britain was a part of?
A) A Federal European State
B) One of the United States of America

subject to laws/constitution of each obviously.

There is no option of neither because I want to know if push came to shove which you'd choose and why.

[Chuckles, The Space Marine Clown]

Europe, cause the EU is neither more nor less bureaucratic than the USA, but has more interesting component states.

[The GrimSqueaker]

If Britain was to become part of the US and follow their governmental system, what happens to the commonwealth countries who still have the Queen as head of state? There's a constitutional crisis and a half.

[Alexander's Son]

 I would say Europe... There are other countries to have kings and queens as well as heads of the state as IK has and the problem there is (about kings/queens) with the European Constitution they are making is about to be solved if it isn't already...

 And because UK is nearer to Europe than it is to US! Oh yes and let us not forget who were from the first people who went to the American continent, besides Spain, France, Portuagal, and who were opposed to the American Liberation...

[Dux Aurelius Elysius]

Europe.  Largely because the voting population in Europe aren't quite so easily misguided as it appears apparent that the America one is.  Plus they're basically our neighbours so it'd be more useful, plus there's a greater depth and variety of culture to partake in.  I don't think it would help the balance of power and stability in the world if America gained yet more power, whereas a stronger Federal EU could be used to bring together European countries along with remind America that they can't be full time playground bully.

And frankly, American beer is piss, whereas German and Dutch beers have a little eloquence to themselves.

[Vespasian Swiper]

Hate to say it...

But America, mainly because I believe I have more in common with the American's I've met than the French...

I personally find Brussels infuriating and would prefer the US system to the Europeans - who tend to have very major mood swings at times...

Is an invasion of France out of the question...

[The GrimSqueaker]

But America, mainly because I believe I have more in common with the American's I've met than the French...

You mean more in common with those from Utah than the French I assume? As since you're breaking down the EU to its constituent states you should do the same for the US. Maybe South Carolina? 

[Frescadude]

But America, mainly because I believe I have more in common with the American's I've met than the French...

You mean more in common with those from Utah than the French I assume? As since you're breaking down the EU to its constituent states you should do the same for the US. Maybe South Carolina? 

That all depends on where you are in South Carolina.  There is plenty of diversity in the states just like in Europe.  Overall, I think the EU is a better choice because of geography.

[Seer Fox]

Chalk up another one for Europe.

I'm quite fond of our little corner of the globe, all told, so it wouldn't be a terrible thing to do. But that, alas, would not make it an easy thing to do. Everyone speaking their own languages makes things difficult as far as relations go...

Ciat,
Seer Fox

[Spirit of Kurnous]

hmm alot of pro-europe people here.  considering they have never really done anything good for the UK and most their stuff seems biased against us I am definately anti-europe.  they pass stupid laws, they would take back our rebate to give to lazy french farmers and have that damn crazy European Court of Human Rights which lets anybody get away with almost anything as its their human right, prisoners can even sue jails or burglars can sue homeowners for hurting themselves breaking into a house.

I believe we have more in common with the US than with the rest of europe, and we are on alot friendlier terms with the US than alot of europe.

unfortunately if you go by various sources in the UK one of Tony Blairs last acts may be to sign us up to the european constitution, you know the one that most countries who got to vote for it chucked it out, seems we dont get that option so we may be part of a federal europe before we know it.

[Granite Slam]

@Kelayatrene: Yes..... Because the US doesn't have any problems with stupid lawsuits........ *ahem*

   As much as I dislike the EU in its present form I would rather see the UK be absorbed into it than the US. The disparity of interests within the EU would, I feel, actually help to create a more balanced form of government than that which is available within the US. Basically, if the UK were to join the US it would be joining a country as a state (or possibly 3) which would merely fit into what is already there. If the UK were to join a Federal Europe then there would need to be the creation of this Federal Europe first by the members that were to found it and we would then have some ability to shape the system under which we would be ruled. But this is really a strange topic for debate because we need to choose between a current running system and a hypothetical one of which we do not know the proposed details. Given a free choice I would vote C (neither) but ah well....

-S

[Spirit of Kurnous]

but we are on the way to a federal europe anyway.  this european constitution maybe the door being opened on it  

[Seer Fox]

but we are on the way to a federal europe anyway.  this european constitution maybe the door being opened on it  

Aaaand *SLAP*

You don't know that, and we ALREADY have a european constitution, but it's outdated due to more member states being involved than before. So stop kicking a fuss up over nothing, the damn laws are going to apply to everyone, so I'm sure that French-Kelayatrene and Swiss-Kelayatrene will be crying just as much as you are anyway.

Ciat,
Seer Fox

[Spirit of Kurnous]

French one will just ignore it

[Alexander's Son]

 Naaaahhhh.... I used to say that for Greek people. Noone actually asked us about the European Constitution and though it was voted for us, by the people we elected, so from us!

 And yes it is outdated since new countries have entered the European Union and some will enter as well... so after the final countries enter EU then they will again change the Constitution and make it mandatory for every European country in the EU...

[Ashman]

Another for Europe here. Mainly for the reasons listed above. However, I'd like to add food to the equation. I'd definately prefer to eat European food more often than US food (of course, talking about stereotypical foods here ).

CM

[Leeroy Jenkins]

EU hands down.

Why cant we just stay on our own as an independent island as convection currents in the mantle had in mind?

[Chuckles, The Space Marine Clown]

Because the OP did not give abstaining as an option.

Care to explain your choice or are you just going to leave it there as borderline spam?

[Leeroy Jenkins]

oh ok...

USA is already a lot more messed up than we are in terms of crime (I dont know too much about the US but im sure there are other political problems over there) and we are two seperate countries, what applies to them may not apply to us, furthermore one would lose a sense of patriotic pride as Britain (which was the greatest world superpower up until WW2 and has had such a richer history than America) would then be just another state ruled over by foreign men (yes I am aware a Scot is going to rule England but hopefully hell be booted soon) who know very little about Britain (I think it was George Bush who was speaking to a Welshman and he said something along the lines of 'What state is Wales in?'. + I think a lot of Americans practice jindoism and have stereotypical views of Brits as drinking tea and all having butlers called Jeeves, when really they should call us a country of hooligans! Also, lots of people I know take a bad view of Americans and some Americans online are just plain racist soo... <<ends long rant>>

[Vespasian Swiper]

Hmm...

Even after this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCkYfYa8ePI

I still would rather have the US as our overlords, as long as we managed to get a say that we kept the NHS and our traditions. Under Europe I fear we'd all be merged into an open boundaries nation with smaller nationalist sects in each country and a right royal mess when it comes to representation.