Topic: [1500] Barbed Strangler Army 6

[Akaiyou]

1500 Pts - Tyranids Roster - Tyranids - 1500 - Barbed Strangler Army 6

HQ: Warriors (4#, 238 Pts)

1 Hive Tyrant @ 131 Pts
Adrenal Glands +1 WS; Toxin Sacs +1 St; Twin-linked Barbed Strangler

3 Warriors @ 107 Pts
Extended Carapace +1 Save; Toxin Sacs +1 St; Scything Talons (x3); Deathspitter (x2);

Barbed Strangler (x1)

Elite: Warriors (9#, 321 Pts)

3 Warriors @ 107 Pts
Extended Carapace +1 Save; Toxin Sacs +1 St; Scything Talons (x3); Deathspitter (x2);

Barbed Strangler (x1)

3 Warriors @ 107 Pts
Extended Carapace +1 Save; Toxin Sacs +1 St; Scything Talons (x3); Deathspitter (x2);

Barbed Strangler (x1)

3 Warriors @ 107 Pts
Extended Carapace +1 Save; Toxin Sacs +1 St; Scything Talons (x3); Deathspitter (x2);

Barbed Strangler (x1)

Troops: (40#, 520 Pts)

   8 Ripper Swarm @ 104 Pts
      Toxin Sacs +1 St

   8 Ripper Swarm @ 104 Pts
      Toxin Sacs +1 St

   8 Ripper Swarm @ 104 Pts
      Toxin Sacs +1 St

   8 Ripper Swarm @ 104 Pts
      Toxin Sacs +1 St

   8 Ripper Swarm @ 104 Pts
      Toxin Sacs +1 St

Heavy Support: (3#, 421 Pts)

   1 Carnifex @ 125 Pts
      Twin-linked Barbed Strangler

   1 Carnifex @ 148 Pts
      Enhanced Senses +1 BS; Barbed Strangler; Venom Cannon

   1 Carnifex @ 148 Pts
      Enhanced Senses +1 BS; Barbed Strangler; Venom Cannon

Total Roster Cost: 1500
Model Count: 56
Wound Count: 160

Theme: Bring mass stranglers to the table.

Strategy: anti-infantry ranged support.

Ok this variation is one of my favorites because it's just fun to use ripper swarms every now n again. Unlike the other lists this one isn't as well balanced and effective because well...ripper swarms < gaunts in more ways than one. However it can still be very rewarding it's a bigger gamble but can pay off greatly.

Pros:

• Ripper Swarms can damage vehicles with ease. Str 4 with 4 attacks per base on the charge is amazing. Plenty glancing results to disable damn near any vehicle.
• Ripper Swarms tie up units pretty well and can cause a lot of damage with str 4.
• The barbed strangler provides great support for rippers as they can pin units at range and prevent them from shooting at the ripper swarms to ensure they make it over to the enemy lines
• 40 Swarm bases won't go down easy
• Great survivability in terrain
• No need for synapse

Cons:

• Rippers can't fleet
• Vulnerable To Blast and Instant Death
• Demands terrain to ensure safety
• Tyrant & Carnifexes are vulnerable going base

Feel free to comment but keep it above the belt.
Pics of the List

[FifthWindDieGermanator]

You are forgetting the most important con.

2/3 of the time, it is impossible for you to win a game.

Ripper Swarms cannot score, as they are Swarms. The best you can hope for (and, admittedly, you would do a good amount of the time) is Draw, assuming you are not doing KP missions. Also, if the Opponent can bring out any kind of Ordnance or Blast Weapon, especially if it causes Instant Death, your Rippers will dissapear fast. Which would give your opponent alot of Kill Points all on its own.

[Akaiyou]

You are forgetting the most important con.

2/3 of the time, it is impossible for you to win a game.

Ripper Swarms cannot score, as they are Swarms. The best you can hope for (and, admittedly, you would do a good amount of the time) is Draw, assuming you are not doing KP missions. Also, if the Opponent can bring out any kind of Ordnance or Blast Weapon, especially if it causes Instant Death, your Rippers will dissapear fast. Which would give your opponent alot of Kill Points all on its own.

I'd have to disagree with the 2/3 losses bit. This list is definetly not as refined but not that weak. I personally am not an 'objective' player I am to destroy call it my hive personality. And i can simply challenge their position on objectives and fight them out. In any case the table is wide i dont really need to bunch up my swarms (and a wise man definetly woudlnt) knowing that they are vulnerable to blast. Plus i get to see my opponent's list before the game starts so i can know better if i should just run them loose or head for the hills a.k.a terrain to bask in a 2+ cover save after going to ground if need be.

i'd say 1/3rd of the games are a near guaranteed loss/draw

and the other 2/3rd is winnable as long as you push your strategic limits and know your place (a.k.a don't mob up out in the open when you know your opponent has a str 6 blast out there)

thats why i like this limit is much harder to win with it really makes you think of how to find the best way to defeat the enemy.

[FifthWindDieGermanator]

i'd say 1/3rd of the games are a near guaranteed loss/draw

No... I don't think you understand what I am saying.

There are three missions in 5th ed. One of them uses Kill Points. This, you can win. The other two uses Objectives, anywhere from 2-5. In order to capture those objectives, you must have non-swarm, non-vehicle Troop choices. You have none. The best you could even hope for in an Objective game is a Draw, by contesting the objectives, which all of your units can do. I don't call that 1/3.

[Akaiyou]

ah i see what you mean now. so my mistake in my wrong interpretation I thought you meant depending on what im fighting.

Mmmm i dont really care about the mission objective as i've said before I just aim to kill things off which has been toned down by GW as in 4th edition I would completely ignore objectives and just rush and kill everything in sight.

Even tho toned down in 5th the tactic still works since killing everything earns you an auto-win no matter what. So i'd play the exact same way I would in a Kill Point oriented mission and just do my best to kill off every enemy on the table. Hell he can only have a max of 6 troops anyway so if i can get rid of them, then objectives go out the window and it becomes a grind fest which is what I want.

True my play style may seem rather straight forward and linear to some, but it does pay off if you bring enough force to kill the enemy off entirely.

[srintuar]

Mmmm i dont really care about the mission objective as i've said before I just aim to kill things off which has been toned down by GW as in 4th edition I would completely ignore objectives and just rush and kill everything in sight.

Even tho toned down in 5th the tactic still works since killing everything earns you an auto-win no matter what. So i'd play the exact same way I would in a Kill Point oriented mission and just do my best to kill off every enemy on the table. Hell he can only have a max of 6 troops anyway so if i can get rid of them, then objectives go out the window and it becomes a grind fest which is what I want.

True my play style may seem rather straight forward and linear to some, but it does pay off if you bring enough force to kill the enemy off entirely.

Sounds to me like a guaranteed way to lose every game.

[Akaiyou]

Mmmm i dont really care about the mission objective as i've said before I just aim to kill things off which has been toned down by GW as in 4th edition I would completely ignore objectives and just rush and kill everything in sight.

Even tho toned down in 5th the tactic still works since killing everything earns you an auto-win no matter what. So i'd play the exact same way I would in a Kill Point oriented mission and just do my best to kill off every enemy on the table. Hell he can only have a max of 6 troops anyway so if i can get rid of them, then objectives go out the window and it becomes a grind fest which is what I want.

True my play style may seem rather straight forward and linear to some, but it does pay off if you bring enough force to kill the enemy off entirely.

Sounds to me like a guaranteed way to lose every game.

Play me once and i'm sure I can change your mind, as I have to so many.
There's a good reason why GW changed mission rules to be more objective oriented. I aim to annihilate and I win through wipeout most of the time.

[srintuar]

Play me once and i'm sure I can change your mind, as I have to so many.
There's a good reason why GW changed mission rules to be more objective oriented. I aim to annihilate and I win through wipeout most of the time.

You dont even have any fast moving units.

All I have to do to guarantee a win is put one or two objectives in a place where you have no LOS, then plomp down a small troop unit and wait.

We might not even fire a shot all game: ive got no incentive to do anything other than hide.

[Akaiyou]

Play me once and i'm sure I can change your mind, as I have to so many.
There's a good reason why GW changed mission rules to be more objective oriented. I aim to annihilate and I win through wipeout most of the time.

You dont even have any fast moving units.

All I have to do to guarantee a win is put one or two objectives in a place where you have no LOS, then plomp down a small troop unit and wait.

We might not even fire a shot all game: ive got no incentive to do anything other than hide.

lol if that's your strategy I think it's you who won't be winning many a game. I just need to be within reach of the objective to contest it and deny you the 'objective' victory. Who ever said I need to shoot you?
and if I have no line of sight to you, that means you have no line of sight to me.

I dunno why you think not having 'fast' units is a problem, i field 'slow' units if u wanna call 'em that all the time and win and hell now i can 'run' making it even easier and more survivable to get within reach of just about any objective that i want to target.

really maybe your strategy may work in some archaic way against certain opponents but I just don't see it working against me as I'd bring my A-game to the table considering that I already know and admit that this is definetly a tougher list to win games with. but wiping out enemy troops is a guaranteed way to ensure that the game drops down to a fight fest. and if i can't kill the troops early then i'll contest every objective

[srintuar]

Think of it this way:

I need one unit to survive near any uncontested objective, and thats a win.

You need to kill every last model. 

It should be easy to grok why im at an advantage.

[Akaiyou]

Think of it this way:

I need one unit to survive near any uncontested objective, and thats a win.

You need to kill every last model. 

It should be easy to grok why im at an advantage.

oh you definetly have the 'scoring' unit advantage im not arguing that.
what im debating is that rule wise that's not that big of an advantage because there's so many ways that i can contest any objective you try to claim by simply pressing forward towards them.

the most troops YOU can bring is 6 so 6 scoring units and usually bringing lots of troops means less points to spend on other army list choices which most players tend to not do. And even if they do bring a lot of troops that's only works to MY advantage because guess what? My whole list is anti-infantry so you see how I cover that weakness?

So yeah I do agree you and any opponent i face has an advantage otherwise I woudlnt say that winning is a pain with this list if you aren't on-point with how you plan your strategy. But what im arguing is that unlike what you said i wont be losing every game because you either take a lot of troops and make it easier for me to shoot you or u take a low number and make it easier for me to get rid of the few ones u take.

Show me a non-mech list that would be a '100% guaranteed' win over this list and then i'll consider the possibility of total defeat.

[srintuar]

If you really think so, maybe you should playtest it a few times on objective missions.

Or take it to a tournament.

good luck.

[Akaiyou]

i have play tested it, and i haven't participated in any tournaments because of unpainted models in my army but im in the process of fixing that and taking on other in official matches.

I'll let u know how far this list makes it then.

[Lord Alliben]

Play me once and i'm sure I can change your mind, as I have to so many.
There's a good reason why GW changed mission rules to be more objective oriented. I aim to annihilate and I win through wipeout most of the time.

Hmmm, that's how I have won every single game I've won with Nids so far. We seem to be good at wiping people off the board by turn 5 or so, don't we? I've only had a couple of draws (both at tourneys) and no losses in the last 6 months or so. I almost always wipe people by turn 5. Is this what usually happens with you, Akaiyou?

i have play tested it, and i haven't participated in any tournaments because of unpainted models in my army but im in the process of fixing that and taking on other in official matches.

I understand that problem. My LGS is one store hosting an 'Ard Boyz tourney and they don't require painted armies this time. I'm pretty excited as I haven't painted a few of my squads yet. Definitely let us know how your tournaments go. You've posted a lot on the tyranid forum. I'm eager to see how well you can play against real opponents. (My only tough matches are in tourneys, hence the undefeated streak.)

[Akaiyou]

Play me once and i'm sure I can change your mind, as I have to so many.
There's a good reason why GW changed mission rules to be more objective oriented. I aim to annihilate and I win through wipeout most of the time.

Hmmm, that's how I have won every single game I've won with Nids so far. We seem to be good at wiping people off the board by turn 5 or so, don't we? I've only had a couple of draws (both at tourneys) and no losses in the last 6 months or so. I almost always wipe people by turn 5. Is this what usually happens with you, Akaiyou?

i have play tested it, and i haven't participated in any tournaments because of unpainted models in my army but im in the process of fixing that and taking on other in official matches.

I understand that problem. My LGS is one store hosting an 'Ard Boyz tourney and they don't require painted armies this time. I'm pretty excited as I haven't painted a few of my squads yet. Definitely let us know how your tournaments go. You've posted a lot on the tyranid forum. I'm eager to see how well you can play against real opponents. (My only tough matches are in tourneys, hence the undefeated streak.)

Yeah I agree tyranids are really good at wiping out opponents which IMO is very befitting to what the army should be like fluff wise. "The Great Devourer" right?

in 4th edition I'd win 85% of the time by slaughter by 4 or 5. losing only when I play tested 'fun' lists or if it was an opponent that played me very often and knew what kind of strategies I use to win. And among the people i defeated included a lot of the vets and tourney players who frequented my local store, and none ever won or got a draw against me.

in 5th edition im still yet to play in store games because im still play testing a lot and trying to build armies that are strong within the confines of the new rules but in my play test games of which i've played about 6 - 9 games, i've only lost 2 and won all others by wipeout.

admittedly tho we had a lot of rules wrong and so thats why i dont really count play testing games as wins since it's just practice to adjust and learn. But that still tells me that we still have the power to keep winning through ignoring objectives and just going for the kill.

which is why i think i still have a good chance to win. by good i mean better than 50%.

[Lord Alliben]

"The Great Devourer" indeed. Haha.

I guess people still don't know how to fight me even though I play something close to the same list every time I go there. I'm the only Tyranid player who regularly plays with the other guys, though, so maybe they just don't get used to Nids when they're so busy fighting ork and marines.

We almost never play objectives. It never really matters in my games. The most troops I've ever lost were 2 squads of termagants.

[Lucky_Jackal]

Play me once and i'm sure I can change your mind, as I have to so many.
There's a good reason why GW changed mission rules to be more objective oriented. I aim to annihilate and I win through wipeout most of the time.

You dont even have any fast moving units.

All I have to do to guarantee a win is put one or two objectives in a place where you have no LOS, then plomp down a small troop unit and wait.

We might not even fire a shot all game: ive got no incentive to do anything other than hide.

I agree. All I got to do in hold my objectives for 4 or 5 turns then I win.

=|

It doesn't matter what army your oppent ueses. If they got half a brain they would just hold all the objectives.

Tau, SM, Gaurd just have to stay in cover and out of LOS. You then have to move into there LOS and out of cover to shoot them off the objective.

If you playing a army with alot of drop units (Like Gaurd and SM agien) they can deep strike behind your lines. Then they take YOUR objectives!

If play other nids a Genestealer shock player would get a boner after seening your list! lol

The only way you can "win" is to contest every objective. This might be a "fun list" to play. But to expect it to win? This is probly one of the only nid lists I've seen were SM and Guard drop lists would be very effective agiest.

Last turn he ueses the improved comms on his tanks witch and probly sitting there being shaken. The Rerolls bring in a DS dropGaurd unit on one of the objective you "ingored". He wins.

[srintuar]

Jackal is correct.

The enemy could hide/move fast/come in from reserves.

Basically, avoid fighting then land themselves all over one objective at the end.
and they are liable to take second turn, to deny you a last chance.

You wont be able to do much about it. Its hard to wipeout a whole army that basically avoids fighting.

[Akaiyou]

Play me once and i'm sure I can change your mind, as I have to so many.
There's a good reason why GW changed mission rules to be more objective oriented. I aim to annihilate and I win through wipeout most of the time.

You dont even have any fast moving units.

All I have to do to guarantee a win is put one or two objectives in a place where you have no LOS, then plomp down a small troop unit and wait.

We might not even fire a shot all game: ive got no incentive to do anything other than hide.

I agree. All I got to do in hold my objectives for 4 or 5 turns then I win.

=|

It doesn't matter what army your oppent ueses. If they got half a brain they would just hold all the objectives.

Tau, SM, Gaurd just have to stay in cover and out of LOS. You then have to move into there LOS and out of cover to shoot them off the objective.

If you playing a army with alot of drop units (Like Gaurd and SM agien) they can deep strike behind your lines. Then they take YOUR objectives!

If play other nids a Genestealer shock player would get a boner after seening your list! lol

The only way you can "win" is to contest every objective. This might be a "fun list" to play. But to expect it to win? This is probly one of the only nid lists I've seen were SM and Guard drop lists would be very effective agiest.

Last turn he ueses the improved comms on his tanks witch and probly sitting there being shaken. The Rerolls bring in a DS dropGaurd unit on one of the objective you "ingored". He wins.

You do realize I would have taken a look at his list before the match and prepared for such a situation in a suitable manner right? take that into account and then think of how you'd counter every strategy you just mentioned if you knew exactly what the strategy would be employed against you.

and then you have your answer as to how I would 'hope' to win amidst such impossiblities.

by the way I solved the cover issue i guess rippers arent as small as i thought they were, the rule says they only need to partially cover ANY part of the body to grant a cover save to the warriors. lol and luckily the legs count as part of the body and the ripper swarms can cover that pretty easily have a look at the pics of the list.

Jackal is correct.

The enemy could hide/move fast/come in from reserves.

Basically, avoid fighting then land themselves all over one objective at the end.
and they are liable to take second turn, to deny you a last chance.

You wont be able to do much about it. Its hard to wipeout a whole army that basically avoids fighting.

Only an idiot would field this list and not bring their A-game. I'd take advantage of EVERYTHING that i can. This includes setting up, seeing my opponent's list prior to any dice being rolled and also setting up terrain conveniently.

I dunno why ppl ignore the facts that you have a certain level of control about how the game is set up and that you SHOULD set it up as much as you can to your own convenience.

If we are playing with enough terrain for them to 'hide' and avoid being shot then it's simple i'll send every single ripper straight into 'that' terrain and let 'em smoke 'em out if i have no LOS neither do you lol and i haev 4 MC guarding my rear i dare a foo to deep strike behind me. I dare them!

I think that you guys are making it way more impossible than it actually is. Either that or you don't give yourself enough credit for having enough tactical sense to overcome things that you know are coming.

[srintuar]

Well, we'll wait for your batrep.

Remember to post pictures too