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Offline Koonitz

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The Chain of Command
« on: December 13, 2004, 03:02:09 AM »
As some of you are aware, we have been planning a form of Military Chain of Command for the Guard forum to provide a bit of an authentic feel to the forum and to provide a bit more order. I expect this to be a fun addition to the forum atmosphere and life.
To assuage any fears that this will only compound the issue of Elitism on the board, I shall take measures to ensure it will not. First and foremost, is that, since Elitism is against one of the rules of the board, it shall be grounds for demotion. I shall ensure Elitism is a large hit against one's record in that regard as well. In addition, any breaking of the rules still bears with it the normal consequences concerning the forum as a whole. Now that that's out of the way....


The Chain of Command shall be a semi-formal ranking structure within the Imperial Guard forum. Outside the Guard forum, it shall hold little to no weight. Within the Guard forum... It'll probably hold the same amount of weight officially. The only real benefit of rank will be within the Chain of Command itself. Rank will hold no weight concerning anything outside the Chain of Command. You break a rule, you face the consequences like anyone else.
Rank in the Chain of Command shall be displayed in one of two ways, depending on the reaction from those above myself:
1) As titles in our forum names itself, such as "Lord Moddissar General Koonitz". Name changes will be done by the account owner once a promotion is approved. I do not prefer this method as this is an option freely open to confusion and false claims by new folk and unscrupulous persons.
2) One's custom title shall be edited to show proper rank as it evolves. This will have to be put through me to request it from the admin to have it changed. This is the preferred option, and I hope the higher ups will approve it. This way, anyone can retain whatever rank they want in their names, but official Chain of Command ranks will only be achievable through official means (IE: Through me).
We'll see how it will be in due time.


The ranks will be as follows:

Trooper
Corporal
Sergeant
Lieutenant
Captain
Major
Lieutenant Colonel
Colonel
Major General
Lieutenant General
Marshall
General
Lord General
Warmaster

The rank of Warmaster shall, for now, be held by Grim Stalker, as it is, for now, his forum for such time until he fully relenquishes it to 40kO... Any discussion from hereon in shall be stated in terms assuming Grim shall play little to no role in the upcoming months of the forum life. If, however, he does return, he has full authority and power over and above even myself concerning decisions (Though, if you read this Grim, I strongly advise you discuss it with me first upon your return until you reacquant yourself with the forum).

I am, however, egotistical enough to take the only Lord General slot. I shall be the only Lord General until such time as I step down from moderating the forum.

The rank of General shall be held by one person per army type.
a) Infantry Company
b) Armoured Company (This includes Armoured Battlegroups)
c) Mechanised Infantry
d) Drop Troops
If another list comes to mind, ask me if it deserves official status with a promotion of one of their players to the rank of General. This is also subject to change upon the release of new lists.

The ranks of "Major General", "Lieutenant General", and "Marshall" shall be made equivalent and shall have up to three per General (one of each title). These shall be the "Seconds in command" so to speak. I shall also accept a single person of this rank to be my Second in Command, reporting to me directly above the Generals. I shall refer to this rank level as "Marshall" as it is easier to type, however any of the three may be held as per stated guidelines.

Any rank between Lieutenant and Colonel may have as many members as are accepted/promoted to it. There shall be no specific army designation to anyone of this rank, unless the person wishs to state an army preference in their profile through normal means.

Any rank below Lieutenant shall be freely available, and likely will not be displayed in custom titles. Anyone who is accepted for a Commission shall start at Lieutenant.


Promotions and Demotions shall be handled through formal means. Those of rank General or above have the authority to grant promotions to worthy individuals without higher consent. I expect proper discretion from my Generals in this matter. Do not choose unwisely.
Anyone of rank "Major General", "Lieutenant General", or "Marshall" may make requests to a General or myself for someone's promotion and it shall be looked into.
Anyone of lower rank may request someone's promotion, or heck, feel free to point out good or bad deeds to me so that I may add it to my file for future reference. Any attempt to point out one's own good deeds will be taken as attempting to inflate one's own status and looked upon as not wholely positive. Any request by one of rank Colonel or below for one's own promotion will be marked negatively in their file.
Any promotion or demotion should be followed by proper paperwork to myself so that I may add it to my files.

I expect all members of the Chain of Command to follow the forum rules as is expected of them normally. As well, I expect them to hold the utmost respect to the Imperial Guard, Our Holy Lord Emperor, and ALL members of the forum, whether they be members of the Chain of Command or not.
I also expect everyone part of the Chain of Command to respect it in anything concerning the Chain of Command.
Properly abiding by these commandments will lead to good standing within the Chain of Command. Failure to abide will lead to either demotion, or even removal from the Chain of Command all together. Anyone falsly displaying rank above their station shall be dealt with accordingly. Displaying rank below their station runs the risk of making it permanent. Again, I expect proper discretion from my Generals in this matter.


Filling in the ranks shall be done in two phases, per-say.
Phase one, which will happen now, will be myself choosing Generals for the four currently open positions. I only have ideas on who would be good for one or two sections. If you feel someone is worthy of the position, feel free to petition it to myself in private. Also, for those that currently display ranks in their names, petition to me in private, and I shall see about allowing you into the Chain of Command at that or a similar rank (If it is not above Colonel).
Once Generals have been chosen, I shall allow them to decide on if/who they wish to fill in their "Marshall" positions.
Phase two will everything after Phase 1, once we get this thing underway.

I think that's basically it. Anything else that is left unsaid I'm sure is covered by one's general knowledge on real life military rank structure.

Once things are up and running, I will have expectations from my Generals, and all Marshalls. Also, once I have chosen my own Marshall, any paperwork that is to go to me, may to go to him as well, and I expect him to process it and file it to me accordingly.

And last, while this is intended to be a fun addition to the Guard forum, I expect as much integrity in this as one would expect form the real thing. In other words, let's take this somewhat seriously, and try not to be as lazy about it as we are about painting models... *smirks*

I also expect people to respect my request for anything that is to be filed to me in private, and to do so by sending me a private message. I do not want to see rank requests in public.

I now leave it open to discussion. Please feel free to discuss it here.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2004, 03:09:43 AM by Koonitz »
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Offline Koonitz

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2004, 03:22:18 AM »
Update: Rasmus has given me an informal thumbs up on the idea of making it a Custom Title rank structure. This is a good thing. He has, for now, given me a negative on providing me the power to edit custom titles myself, as the work to allow that would be too difficult for now. However, it is possible, if it is deemed worthwhile.
For now, all requests must go through me, and then I shall process them accordingly.
"I like to think of this lovely place as my home. Now you wouldn't even think about upsetting me in my home, would you? Of course you wouldn't. So do what I say, when I say, and I won't get upset. I do bad things when I'm upset."
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Offline Sr. Commissar Gribb

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2004, 03:41:21 AM »
Good Stuff Koonitz.

I suggest That I be placed in charge of the Commissariate as it's own rank system that works side by side with the new rank system.

Being as a Commissar title is not something to be taken lightly, I suggest it only be available to those who are eligible for a commission to lieutenant. Upon promotion to Commissar Cadet, candidates will have to prove themselves by:

practicing Discipline (not going onto other boards and flaming)
Strength (defending the IG to the last; from the lowest ratling to the biggest battle tank)
and Insight (being helpful to other members as well as to the officers of the board).

I think that by forming more structure to the Commissariate, maybe I can transform it to something greater than it is now.

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Offline Karl Eller

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2004, 04:11:39 AM »
Ok... so could you sum that up in laymens terms as to what it'll mean to us? Will I still get to keep my Colonel-Commissar rank?

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Offline Sr. Commissar Gribb

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #4 on: December 13, 2004, 04:33:32 AM »
I would assume If I selected you for a position as a Commissar and the Upper Echelon Officer Board determined you were worthy of a dual rank that you would be able to keep your title.

Being that dual titles are very VERY rare in the realm of 40k, I dont know how likely this will be. You would have to realise that it would probably prohibit you from promotion beyond Colonel and that it would give you no special privileges as a Commissar.
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Offline Captain F. Bunny

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #5 on: December 13, 2004, 04:35:48 AM »
What I have been getting from these guys is that, as a reward for being good board civilians on board 18, we get commissions for Lieutenant rank and up(:P too much starship troopers) and we can choose our ranks below Lieutenant(dunno how the commissarate works, I presume one would be a [your rank here]-commissar?, so Eller wouldn't keep his rank unless he is commissioned?). We will also be getting some definitive experts in IG organisations, Infantry Company, Armoured Company (including Armoured Battlegroups), Mechanised Infantry, Drop Troops, (koonitz, perhapse you should make the difference between SAFH and Light/Jungle infantry?)

On the selection process, koonitz chooses generals who choose their Major General/Lieutenant General/Marshal (all equivilant) the Major General/Lieutenant General/Marshals will suggest people for promotion/demotion and the generals will then make the call. All changes will be notified to koonitz. Chain of command is as in real life.

I say, good on you koonitz, a fun and original feature for members of this board. Methinks it'll be funny watching the SM's, Inquisition, Eldar etc. try to copy us  ;D
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Offline Sr. Commissar Gribb

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2004, 04:52:58 AM »
I would say that non-commissioned rank could be determined by simple post count.

IE:

Junior Enlisted
Trooper: 0-59 posts
Corporal: 60-149
Sargeant: 150-299

Vet NCOs
Master Sargeant:  300-999
Sargeant Major: 1000+

Special exception could be made for special positions like First Sargeant/Color Sargeant etc. which would be chosen from NCOs
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Offline Wargamer

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2004, 06:11:55 AM »
Well like I said, I'm strictly Naval for now (playing Gothic far too much...)

However, I suppose I should also have a Guard rank... I suggest using the same system as my IG commander Fireseed does... and make me a Captain.

Reason? Simple: I'm high up enough to give orders, yet low down enough to stay in the field.

The basis of this is that the men will follow me through thick and thin, whilst high command pray to the Emperor that the enemy have decent Snipers...

Of course, should you be mad kind enough to consider me worthy of a higher rank, I will accept... but only if the rank does not require me to wear a monacle, or sit behind a desk, or attend briefings, or do paper work, or do any work, or be followed around by Grenadiers, or polish my armour, or clean my uniform, or prevent me from blaming everything I do on Corporal Hicks, or put me in close proximity to Commissars, or put me in close proximity to Whiteshields, or force me to spend all day with people who are fatter than a Carnifex and twice as ugly...

Edit I: The Phantom Edit: Keeping with my current Navy fetish... Marhsall could work, as it is also an RAF rank, it is fair to assume the Navy has Marshalls as well...

Edit II: The Attack of the Edits: Maybe we should give anyone of "Newbie" rank the IG rank of Conscript/Whiteshield...
« Last Edit: December 13, 2004, 06:22:20 AM by Wing Commander Wargamer »



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Offline Sr. Commissar Gribb

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2004, 06:21:08 AM »
True enough.
Koonitz will pick a good rank for you.

I would also suggest you hold a special office as the experimental codex master
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Offline Wargamer

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2004, 06:24:10 AM »
Hmm... maybe, but it needs a nice, IG feel...

...Tac Logis? Codicifier?



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Offline Sr. Commissar Gribb

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #10 on: December 13, 2004, 06:25:03 AM »
perhaps.

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Offline Wargamer

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2004, 06:31:51 AM »
Edit III: Coming out soon...: I seem to have this amazing ability to fail to read anything but the first post on a topic... my idea is removed.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2004, 06:33:52 AM by Wing Commander Wargamer »



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Offline Captain Leonidas

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2004, 06:34:13 AM »
Whaaaat ? Only one marshal rank ? How about Field Marshal, Grand Marshal, Marshal of The Right, Marshal of the Left, and Gate Marshal ?
Signature Pending Update :P

Offline Wargamer

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2004, 06:39:05 AM »
I think the most important part of all this is that Post Count is not important. Anyone above "Newbie" rank should be able to achieve virtually any rank. This represents promotion based on skill, as well as experience. After all, you could have all the experience you want at being a grunt soldier, but that doesn't mean you can command entire companies, or even armies...



Was a General of the Imperial Guard, now more of a freelance Captain sort of thing. Ish. Keeping the rank pins though, they look nice.

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Death to the fake Harlequins!

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Offline Sr. Commissar Gribb

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #14 on: December 13, 2004, 06:59:18 AM »
my thought was to make enlisted positions based off post count.

this way- a lowly trooper or corporal could be given a commission if needed and become an officer thereby skipping other ranks.

Those that resign their commission would be reduced to what their post count dictates.
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Offline Wargamer

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #15 on: December 13, 2004, 07:20:34 AM »
Ow! Geez! Who the hell hit me over the head!?

...Oh! It was an idea! An Idea just struck me!

*Medics arrive for when a Commissar invariably shoots me for making bad puns.*

You know about this concept of us having Custom Titles based on rank right? well... how will this work for those who already have Custom Titles?

Take me (my ego needs it. ;)). I have a Custom Title (Codex King), and a Position (Historian). How will the IG rank be incorporated? Will it replace my "Post Count" rank, be a second Custom Title, or just put into my Username?



Was a General of the Imperial Guard, now more of a freelance Captain sort of thing. Ish. Keeping the rank pins though, they look nice.

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Offline Sr. Commissar Gribb

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #16 on: December 13, 2004, 07:49:37 AM »
This is what i've come up with for the structure of the ranks

Warmaster Stalker is at the top

Lord General Koonitz reports to him.

directly behind the lord general is Me (as the senior commissariate advisory), Koonitz's handpicked "marshall" or 2nd in command, 2 Generals of his choosing and his staff which contains special appointments (such as Morale officer and Color Sargeant)

Koonitz's marshall and generals each have their pick of 3 "Colonels" or Senior Officers who in turn adopt Junior officers from a pool. They may have up to four Jr. officers a piece.

In total this makes for 45 Officer positions in the IG board in addition to the Commissar Positions. Those without commission hold an enlisted rank.

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The most dangerous thing on the battlefield is a junior officer with a compass and a map.

Offline Koonitz

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #17 on: December 13, 2004, 11:35:45 AM »
I don't have much time, but I'll say this. I don't want to start splitting up the ranks any further than those found in the Primer and therefore listed here in my original post. Any more and it would start to get confusing, and may be more work than it's worth to maintain. Hence the lack of considerable detail of structure below the Colonel rank, as well. It could be more work than it's worth, especially since I'm already going to be doing the work of promotions and whatnot, due to the custom title thing.

I'd be willing to accept the extra detail on the Colonel rank, but right now, I don't really want to as there's no real reason for it. Anyone of rank Lieutenant through Colonel really don't have any different powers between each other. The Marshalls work directly for the Generals therefore have the trust of the Generals (being handpicked and all) and as such suggestions will be more readily accepted. Besides, those of rank Marshall shouldn't have enough work to worry about having subordinates.

The Commissariate is fine. I'll delegate the work of the Commissariate to Gribb, as he said... Again, any necessary titles/changes in titles due to promotion or whatnot is to be done through me.

Before anyone askes, I have requested that the higher ups ignore any requests for changes in custom titles in relation to the Chain of Command that do not come from me.
"I like to think of this lovely place as my home. Now you wouldn't even think about upsetting me in my home, would you? Of course you wouldn't. So do what I say, when I say, and I won't get upset. I do bad things when I'm upset."
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"It is not my responsibility to prove you are wrong. It is your responsibility to prove you are right."
-Koonitz

"The next time you decide to stab me in the back, have the guts to do it to my face."
- Captain Malcolm Reynolds

Offline Lt. Pinard

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #18 on: December 13, 2004, 02:58:36 PM »
OK so the ranking system won't be in ours names right?
so does that me i have to take my Lt. out??
i remeber reading somthing bout PMing you if you have a rank in your name so that means i have to ask you if i can keep my Lt.
also what do you want in the pm, just can "i keep my rank" or do you want a good reason for it?

and if you want a reason what kind reason are you looking for
« Last Edit: December 13, 2004, 03:18:21 PM by Lt. Pinard »

Offline Cutlass442

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Re: The Chain of Command
« Reply #19 on: December 13, 2004, 03:16:49 PM »
Where is the Cosmic Serpent?  He should be the Drop Troop General/Admiral Thing.  Siegler or I should be his assistant or whatever, IMO.  I don't know of any other major DT players on these boards...

I am still confused about how we actual acquire our rank.  Do I PM you?  Then, do you change my title (I.E. Colonel Berkowitz) or is it a signature-based thing?
« Last Edit: December 13, 2004, 03:22:12 PM by Colonel Berkowitz »


 


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