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Offline Underhand

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Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« on: July 3, 2011, 06:20:55 AM »
My local group is starting a Necromunda Campaign .

This follows several months of suggestion, reasoned argument, impassioned pleas, begging, emotional blackmail, bribery, regular blackmail, threats and finally more begging on my part.

In two decades of involvement in the GW hobby, Necromunda and Mordheim are the games that I have found to be the most satisfying.  I think it's the campaign system that lets you see your guys advance between games, leaving you with more of an investment in the gang. 

A fight between your best melee specialist (who was first recruied as a juve) and the opposing gang leader (who is personally reponsible for killing three of your gangers and injuring several others in earlier games) contains more drama than there is between Imperial Guard Commander X versus Ork Warboss Y.  What happens in this fight now in Necromunda, will impact upon what happens in the next fight and those that follow it.  Each game of fantasy or 40k is much more disposable.

But I digress.

We've set up some alternate campaign rules to add an extra strategic element to the campaign.  It's expected that alliances between gangs will develop over the course of the campaign. 

The campaign rules are basically stock standard with the following changes:

1)  Gang territories are dealt with in a less abstract way. 
2)  The territories are represented on a hexagonal map. 
3)  Each hex represents a territory of the gang.
4)  Each gang has 5 territories, and there are six neutral, high value, territories in the middle of the map waiting to be claimed.
         -  Each gang has five hexes, they border two hexes of a rival gang, two hexes of a second rival gang and two hexes of the neutral territories.  One hex has no borders, and is protected from attack.

5)  In order to gain income, a ganger must be assigned to a territory.
6)  Gang leaders and Heavies are allowed to work territory.

7)  A gang member cannot take part in an attack or a defence of a territory if they are assigned to a territory that does not border the territory in question.
8)  If a territory is attacked, and does not have a gang member assigned to it, then:
          a)  the attacker gets to choose the scenario;
          b)  set up their entire gang second; and
          c)  infiltrate 3 guys before the start of their first turn.
9)  If a territory is attacked, and does not have a gang member assigned to it, and does not have any gang members assigned to its adjacent territories, then it is automatically lost to the attacking gang.

10)  Any spare gangers who are not assigned to a territory are available to take part in any battle.
11)  All scenarios include the gang fight special rule relating to capturing a rival gang's territory. 

12)  If a gang moves into a neutral territory unopposed, then any other gang may elect to challenge them.

13)  Vents and tunnels allow the gang controling them to attack a territory up to two hexes away.

14)  Each campaign has a turn, and each player elects where to move by dropping their move into a hat.  The games get fought according to the order they are drawn out of the hat.  After each fight, each player can reassign their gang members to territories.  Injuries and experience are resolved between battles.  Income is resolved at the end of the campaign turn.

15)  Gangs can increase past 20 members.  A gang is allowed an extra member for each territory past 20 it controls
       (there are 36 territories total on the map, so whoever holds more than 20 territories is well and truly on their way to winning the campaign.)

16)  The campaign ends when either only one gang is left, either through killing, desertion or surrender.

17)  If a defender voluntarily bottles out, then they automatically lose the territory they are defending.

The effect of this will be (I think), that in the early stages, gangs will attack with all but two of their members and defend with all but one.  A slight advantage to the Defender.

I would appreciate peoples thoughts - particularly if anyone has tried anything similar.

I should probably mention that all the gangs we are using are the standard house gangs.  I think ratskins/scavies/arbites/spyrers/redemptionists could fit into the mix relatively easily by simply turning any territory they capture into neutral territory.

[gmod]Click "Attachments and other options," check the box next to, "Don't use smileys." Now, your 8th point won't look like ! -Mr.Peanut[/gmod]
« Last Edit: November 24, 2012, 08:21:09 PM by Mr.Peanut »

Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #1 on: July 6, 2011, 06:14:52 AM »
We have six gangs.  Territories are as follows:


Cawdor
Escher
Delaque
Van Saar
Orlock
Goliath


Cawdor (Me):

I border Escher to the North with an Old ruins and some Vents.  The Escher Territories are Old Ruins and a Guilder Contact - the Guilder contact is closer to the middle of the map.

To the East, I have a slag) and another lot of vents.  They border the Goliaths territory consisting of a gambling den and a settlement.
I have an isolated Vents to my South West.

I have the neutral territories of a Workshop and a Spore Cave to the North East.

I am dirt poor - income of 25 creds per turn.

Escher:

In my view, Escher are arguably the best gang (Van Saar being the other contender).  They have access to swords from the beginning, which makes them deadly in combat from the start, and their access to Agility, Combat and Stealth skills all complement each other to deadly effect.  They can get into combat fast, without getting shot and kick a lot of ass once they get there.  They are a gang to watch out for in any campaign. 

Additionally - the player who is playing them is competitive in personality and  (apparently) an experienced Necromunda player, even though he never played a single game of 2nd edition 40k.  Games against these girls will be tough.

Another problem - their territories:  Old Ruins, Guilder Contact, Guilder Contact, Spore Cave and a Holestead.  They will be rolling in cash. 

A good gang, a good player, and an excellent selection of territories - that is a dangerous combination, and I really wish I didn't share a border with him.
They border me (Cawdor) to the south, Neutral territories (Workshop and Friendly Doc) to the East and Delaque (Old Ruins and Vents to the North East)

Delaque:

The Northernmost gang on the map.  Delaque are the gang I have played least against.  They are a shooting gang which, I get the impression, are most effective against other shooting gangs.  An Agile Combat Gang like Escher or Cawdor will destroy them in melee from the midpoint of a campaign.  Delaque gangs don't concern me - but on the other hand, I don't think I've ever played against a good Delaque player.

The guy playing them is an experienced Necromunda player, but hasn't played a game in more than ten years.  He played a amphetamine parrotload of 2nd edition 40k though so (like me) a lot of the rules, statistics and calculations are second nature to him, which should sit him in good stead.  He's never played Delaque though, and actually bought the models just for this campaign (used to play Van Saar).  Not a lot to be worried about here.

His territories consist of:  Old ruins and Vents to the South West (bordering Escher), a Friendly Doc, which is isolated, and a Guilder Contact and a Workshop to the South East which border Van Saar territory.  The Vents and Guilder Contact border a Friendly Doc and a Workshop.

A good player, but playing with an unfamiliar gang.  A good selection of territories.  Hemmed in by Escher and Van Saar.  He'll have his hands full.  I doubt I'll have to deal with him.  He'll want to strike some big blows early before the uperior skill sets of the Eschers and Van Saars outclass him.

Van Saar:

I think most people would say that the Van Saar are the strongest gang.  Escher are definitely stronger earlier, but over the course of a long campaign (which this probably will be), the Techno skills of the Van Saar will mean that their gangers will have access to lots of high quality weapons (including special weapons) which won't be jamming or overheating.

The player is inexperienced though.  He's played a fair bit of Mordheim, but I doubt he understands the value of those techno skills - a lot of new players get tempted by shooting skills over techno.  Van Saar normally worry me, and I try to target them early if I can (which isn't an option here, because he is diametrically opposite me on the map), but in this case I think I can let the Delaque player take care of him.  If I ever come across him, it won't be until the late stages.

He has a reasonable selection of territories:  Vents ( which are isolated), Old Ruins and A Drinking Hole bordering the Delaque to the North, and a Slag and a Settlement bordering the Orlocks to the South.  He borders a neutral workshop and Spore Cave to the South East.

A very good gang, but an inexperienced player (who isn't much good at 40k either).  Okay territories, but nothing special.  His lack of experience will hurt the development of his gang, which will knoble the effectiveness of the Van Saar.

Orlock:

The one advantage that the Van Saar player has is that he has another inexperienced player next to him - the Orlock player.  Orlocks.  What can I say - okay in combat if they get there.  Okay at shooting, and they don't run.  They are a static army that shoots well, and defends well.  Resilient, but not a very dynamic gang.  A good choice for a new player.  Hard to really beslubber up with them.  Orlocks don't scare me.

They have a pretty good selection of territories:  Old Ruins and a Workshop bordering the Van Saar to the North, Isolated Tunnels (the only Tunnels on the map), and Mine Workings and a Settlement to the South, bordering the Goliaths.  Tunnels are a valuable tactical asset.

The player is a new player, using converted Catachan guardsmen for his gangers.  He is inexperienced, but an okay 40k player.  His biggest advantage is that his territory borders the newbie Van Saar player to the North and the completely inexperienced Goliath player to the South.

Goliath:

Goliaths.  The close combat gang which isn't actually any good at getting into close combat.  Very easy to deal with.  Hands down the weakest gang.
My god, is Muscle a amphetamine parrotty skillset.  It's a close combat based skill that isn't as good as Combat, which the Goliaths get anyway.  Some of the Muscle skills actually make the ganger less effective in combat.  I have never seen a Goliath gang be a realistic challenger for winning a campaign.

He has an interesting territory selection.  He has a settlement and Old Ruins to the North East on the border with the Orlocks.  He has an isolated Settlement.  To his west, on the border with my Cawdor, he has another settlement and a Gambling Den.

Three settlements.  He's not going to have to spend much on recruitment.

The player is the youngest and least experienced in the group (15, I think).  He's also the least experienced in 40k, having only been introduced to the hobby about a year ago.  I've seen him play 40k, and he isn't much chop.  He is not the type of player whose skill will overcome the inherent weakness of his gang.  The worst player with the worst gang.  I'm not worried by having him as a neighbour, and I think that I'll actually have to go easy on him to not wipe him out early.

Thoughts:

Cawdor:  A mid tier gang together with Orlock and Delaque.  Where they rank within the mid tier depends on the terrain set up.  The more terrain/cover, the better for the close combat gangs. 

They have a decent skill selection - Combat is good, with most of the selections being very helpful.  Combat is even better when coupled with several of the Agility skills such as Leap and Sprint.  Ferocity is the most underrated skill set in the game.  It's a flexible skill set which grants a lot of reliability to a gang. 

Cawdor's biggest disadvantage is their lack of access to close combat weapons.  The only CC weapon available to them without sacrificing rare trades are knives.  Why that is the case for a close combat oriented gang is utterly beyond me.

That wouldn't normally be too much of a problem since I can just buy a bunch of swords following the first campaign turn, but since I have such crappy income, that might not be possible - all the more important that I grab a nice territory on turn one.

Cawdor's biggest advantage however partially makes up for their lack of close combat weapons.  That advantage is their access to hand flamers.  It's an automatic strength 4 hit, potentially hitting more than one target.  Coupled with the 3 vents territories I control, it's a game winner.  Maybe a campaign winner.  With a handflamer, even a juve  is a pretty scary prospect.

My god do I have a amphetamine parrotty territory selection.  3 vents, a slag and an old ruins.  that's 25 creds per turn, which will drop down to zero if I have 10 models in my gang.  I can't believe that a beslubbering slag is my best money earner.   I am going to have to move fast early to pick up some new territories which I can actually make money off.
On the plus side, 3 vents will definitely give me a lot of flexibility during set up.  For a close combat gang, anything which lets me get closer to the enemy without getting shot will help.  I would have liked at least one of them to be tunnels, but vents will do.


« Last Edit: July 13, 2011, 09:37:50 AM by Underhand »

Offline Angrygreek

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #2 on: July 7, 2011, 03:36:04 PM »
This could actually work nicely with those plastic hex campain map thingies that GW put out a number of years ago. Necromunda is by far my favourite of the specialty games, and the map idea seems like a good one. A gang's turf becomes less abstract. I like it even more if each territory has a set map for it (set the terrain up the same time you fight in that zone), that way gangs can become familiar with the terrain and how to use it to their advantage.
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Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #3 on: July 9, 2011, 10:51:14 AM »
That will probably happen to an extent by default since we will be playing on the same four 4x4 tables each week, with the same terrain pieces (I think my local GW is one of the largest in world - it has about 12 6x4 tables and several more 4x4 tables, plus a few other painting/modeling tables). 

It should be pretty easy to set up the terrain the same way each time.  I'll probably leave it up to the individual players though, since some of them are new to Necromunda and setting up terrain will help them think about the game a bit more.


Offline Perigrine

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #4 on: July 9, 2011, 01:12:50 PM »
Sounds like a pretty cool campaign you have set up there. You'll definitely have to keep us updated on how it goes on.

I've always been interested in necromunda, however I'm not really a huge fan of the models, also kinda hard to change your gangers when they upgrade gear and what not as most necro mini's are single piece pewter are they not?

Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #5 on: July 9, 2011, 08:09:03 PM »
The original lines were all single piece (except for some of the heavy weapons guys, who required assembly).   

Several of the gangs now come in boxed sets with the hands empty so you can custom fit your gang.  Converting them after they upgrade over the course of a campaign is still a pain in the ass though. 

Luckily, I've never played with a WYSIWYG fanatic, so that's never been too much of an issue for me.  As a courtesy, if the model doesn't actually have the weapons it's fitted out with (Cawdor models are sorely lacking in melee weapons), I stick a loose weapon from my bitz-box to its base, so no one gets caught by surprise.  I think its unreasonable to expect people to cut up their models after every couple of games.

I'm lucky in that I bought all of my Cawdor gangers back in the 90's and have every single Cawdor miniature except for one of the leaders, so I have a pretty decent range of models.  The people I play with are also willing to let me run Redemptionists as counts as Cawdor gangers (I just assume that the higher ranking the ganger gets, the more he starts dressing like a priest of the Redemptionist faith).  They actually work well together if they all have the same paint scheme. 

Orlock gangs are actually pretty indistinguishable from Catachan Guardsmen.  A Catachan Infantry squad and a Command Squad would set you up with a decently sized and well equipped gang. That's what the Orlock player in our group is doing.

Chaos Marauders can also be used to make Goliaths (probably with Catachan heads).  I suspect that the Goliath player in our campaign will end up doing that as soon as he realises that he needs some lasguns.

Heresy miniatures have a really well designed line called Trenchcoat gangers, which are obviously designed to be used as Delaque gangers.

Van Saar are probably the house which gets the toughest run for conversions.  A lot of people use converted Eldar guardians, but I don't know if that works too well.  They look similar, but still not quite right.  I've seen good conversions done with some of the Assassin models.  There are also tons of sci-fi miniatures wearing a suit similar to the Van Saar bodysuits made by other companies.

Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2011, 04:00:17 AM »
I would appreciate people's thoughts:

My Cawdor:

Leader:  Chainsword, Bolt Pistol                      165 creds

Heavy:  Heavy Stubber                                    180 creds
Heavy:  Flamer, Autopistol                               115 creds

Ganger:  lasgun                                               75 creds
Ganger:  lasgun                                               75 creds
Ganger:  Shotgun (manstopper shells)            75 creds
Ganger:  Shotgun (manstopper shells)            75 creds

Juve :   Hand flamer, stub gun                         60 creds
Juve :   Hand flamer, stub gun                         60 creds
Juve :   Hand flamer, stub gun                         60 creds
Juve :   Hand flamer, stub gun                         60 creds

Gang Tactics

The plan is for them to operate as 3 separate teams:

1)  Heavy Stubber, lasgun ganger and lasgun ganger
2)  Shotgun ganger and 2 Juves
3)  Shotgun ganger and 2 Juves.

The leader and the Flamer Heavy set up where needed, but probably more often than not, each going with one of the mobile teams.

The mobile teams deploy from vents close to the enemy, in cover, then run out and flame them.  I have aways used older rules where handflamers are much hader to come by, so I'll be interested to see how this goes.  Depending on how effective that tactic is, I think it might be necessary to house rule down the range of hand flamers to use the old (little) handflamer templates - a full flamer template seems like it might be a bit much when everyone in the gang can have them.

I expect that 2 or three flamer templates for each mobile team should be enough to start forcing bottle rolls very quickly.  My 3 vents should allow me to get close to the enemy early.  I expect that I will be able to get into template range without losing too many gangers, and once I'm in there, the opposition is cactus.
 
I'm low on gangers, but since I won't be earning enough creds to actually make any money in the first turn or two, I don't see that as much of a disadvantage.  With the handflamers, I expect the Juves will advance to Ganger status pretty quickly.  I actually value Juves more highly than Gangers, this campaign is going to last a long time, and the time they spend not being able to earn income won't seem like a long time a couple of months from now.

If I roll skill advances for my Juves, I'll give them Ferocity upgrades until it becomes clear that they are headed towards melee or shooting.  I always take the opportunity to grab a Techno skill if the opportunity arises - theonly exception being with my Leader, for whom I like to try to get Iron Will, if possible.

Campaign Strategy

As far as campaign strategy goes - I need to win my first game and take a 2d6 income territory.  If I don't, I'm beslubbered for the campaign.  I have an Escher gang next to me that has a much better selection of territories, and their player is pretty good.  If I'm broke after the first turn, he will try to snuff me out early.

I have a massive range of territories I can attack due to my vents, which allow me to attack 2 map squares away -  however, I'd prefer to keep my borders tight at this stage and only go after the stuff that's close to me, since the campaign rules make it difficult to defend terrain that doesn't border your own.  That leaves me with a neutral Spore Cave (which the Goliath player can also target), and a Gambling Den controlled by the Goliath player. 

While it is tempting to go after the Goliath Gambling Den in order to not only grab a nice territory, but also take one off an opponent, I'm going to exercise some restraint in that regard.  The player is brand new, and young.  I don't want to go picking on the new kid in the first turn.

That leaves me with the Spore Cave, which might well result in a fight with the Goliath player, but at least he won't be losing a territory when I spank him.

After the first turn, I will spend any extra creds I get to buy swords and some backup pistols.  I'll work my way North after that and target the Escher.  It's a lot easier to deal with Escher early than it is later on after they have skilled up.  Goliath just fall further and further behind as the campaign wears on, so I'll mop them up later.

The Escher should have their hands full fighting the Delaque to be able to pay much attention to me early on (the players actively dislike one another  - I shouldn't have set them up next to each other, but I didn't want the Escher player to have easy access to the newbie players, because he wouldn't hesitate to destroy them).  If I get a solid income base early on, I should be able to slam the Escher, take their very nice territory, let the Delaque deal with the Van Saar, and sweep south East to take out the Goliaths and Orlocks.

Simple.

Offline Numinak

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2011, 04:17:40 AM »
Damn, wish I lived near you. I can't get a Necromunda campain started up for nothing. But your rules seem pretty good, and might make it so I can actualy get people to play. I can even use the map hexes they sell for 40k as the 'underhive' to represent the gang map.
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Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2011, 09:01:51 AM »
First Round:

The First Round of the campaign was interesting.  Every single game was a Gang Fight scenario, to help everyone reacquaint themselves with the rules 

I went to the North East and attacked the neutral Spore Cave.  So did the Goliath.

I'll save the suspense - it was a comfortable victory to me.  He set up with all of his guys spread out in what he later said was an attempt to be able to shoot at anything on the table.   His guys were isolated and had trouble picking themselves back up after I pinned them.  They were also easy targets for both my mobile squads who were able to pick them off piecemeal.  He lost 5 guys and bottled out.  I had both my Lasgun Gangers down at the end of the fight.  An easy win, and the exact type that you expect to get against an opponent playing for the first time.

Man of the match was my leader who took out the Goliath Leader in hand to hand, and dispatched another ganger.  3 Juves inflicted wounds (hand flamers - probably a bit too effective), as did my Flamer Heavy  and a Shotgun Ganger.

The advantage of having such a close ranged gang is that it's really easy to convert Downed Gangers into Out of Action casualties, since they are so close to assault range.

The player did okay considering it was his first game.  I gave him some pointers.  He now understands the importance of having gang members close to each other, both in terms of being able to recover from pinning and providing target priority.  He's also going to grab some Lasguns.

He got banged up pretty bad, but 3 of the were Juves and his leader now hates Cawdor, so he didn't come off too badly.

I didn't have to worry about injuries since only one of my downed gangers went out of action and he rolled a full recovery.

My Stubber Heavy was my disappointment -  out of ammo on the first turn and failed to wound with his single hit.  I alaso went out of ammo on one of the Lasgunners on the second turn, which was pretty bad luck.

Anyway,  got my Spore Cave, so I'm set.

Second Game:

The Delaque player surprised everyone and used his vents to go after the Neutral Workshop which borders my territory to the North East.  This was a strange choice because it leaves that territory isolated and difficult to defend (since Gangers assigned to a territory which doesn't border that territory can't be used to defend it). 
Anyway, the Escher player and I got first dibs at defending it since we border it, and we both accepted.

A three way fight.  I'll tell ya - being able to set up 9 guys at the end of your first turn is a huge advantage in a three way fight.  The Delaque player also had vents, so the Escher player kind of got screwed from the start.

The Delaque player went straight for the Escher player, and the Escher player wanted to at least kill more Delaque than got killed by the Delaque, which allowed me to sweep in and take out 3 Escher Gangers, causing the player to voluntarily bottle out like a Tremultuous O (a smart Tremultuous O, but still) leaving to me and the Delaque player.

He was good.  By the time I got to him, I had already used 2 hand flamers and was down to using Juves with stub guns.  He used terrain really well to make me have to take awkward choices between shooting at Juves or more valuable targets.  I had 2 Juves and both Shotgun Gangers go out of action before my Stubber Heavy managed to redeploy and line up both the Delaque Stubber Heavy and the Delaque Gang leader in the one shot and take them both out.

A close game.  The Escher Ganger was unlucky that he kind of got sandwiched, but man was he ever a mindless fleshy pawn of the Illuminati about it.  He whined about every single line of sight call, and we ended up having to get a staff member to adjudicate on the game.  He also whined about the power of handflamers even though they only caused one wound the entire game (I can still see his point though - they really take the finesse out of the gang when Juves can use them - we're gonna have to nerf them).

Anyway, I won, so  I got the Workshop, which was an unexpected bonus.  We also agreed that when fighting a 3 way game, the value of both opposing gangs, divided by 2 is the calculation for underdog score.

The end of the game was interesting.  I captured the Delaque Heavy.  He had a Heavy Stubber and a stub gun - 190 creds.  19% of the value of his gang in one shot.  At this stage in a campaign, that's close to being a gang killer.

Now this was a strategy decision.  The Delaque palyer showed that he had skill, even with a new gang.  He might even be better than me - and not to be a complete teen-pop sensation here or anything, but while I consider myself to be no better than in the top 20% of 40k players, I reckon that I'd be in the top 5% of Necromunda players (so yeah - maybe 7th best in the world overall) - so the guy has some skill, and is therefore a future threat.  But he conducts himself  as a gentleman, is a worthy opponent, doesn't deserve to be crippled by an unlucky postgame roll.
 
And holy amphetamine parrot do he and the Escher Ganger ever hate each other's guts like snake on a planes.  While the Delaque are there, I'm not going to have to worry about the Escher coming after me.  He can also keep the Van Saar occupied (more about them in a bit). With the Delaque in fighting shape,  I can wait another couple of turns, fight some soft games against the newbies to teach them a bit about the gang and then turn around and go after that whiny little Escher amphetamine parrot.

I agreed to give him back his Heavy, with all equipment for free, on the basis that he owed me a huge favour. 

He actually shook my hand.

Otherwise:

The Van Saar attacked the Neutral Workshop which bordered the Delaque.  The Delaque won and added a Workshop to their territories.
The Orlocks went after the Neutral Spore Cave which shared a border with the Van Saar and won.

The Escher went after the Neutral Friendly Doc which they shared a border with the Delaque, which the Delaque player elected to step in and contest.  It was a short game with the Delaque player unluckily failing his first bottle roll on the second turn after accidently shooting one of his own Juves.

I don't think I've ever heard as much smack talk before, during or after a game.  The Escher player did not take his previous loss (or  the mountain of amphetamine parrot the Delaque player gave him about it) well at all.  He enjoyed every second of his victory.  And every second of the rest of the afternoon that he kept bragging about it to everyone in the store.  About a game that 95% of them don't even realise exists.

Good times.

Here's the map at the end of the first campaign turn:


Cawdor
Escher
Delaque
Van Saar
Orlock
Goliath

« Last Edit: July 13, 2011, 05:55:32 AM by Underhand »

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2011, 11:17:20 PM »
Just quietly, I'm very much enjoying reading about your Necromunda campaign. I always wanted to try it myself, but ended up playing a lot of Mordheim (the Fantasy equivalent).  I hope you keep giving entertaining reports!
...a spiffified whizz-bang unit of Much Destruction that'll get whored like crazy in WD and kill a million Monoliths in the release batrep
Lomendil's pick for the new DE dex. Not quite, but we have a 'dex now!

Well played, TW.  By well played, I of course mean god damn your traitorous ways.

Do love Diplomacy!

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2011, 12:32:37 AM »
Yeah, this is really cool... I love hearing about it as I'm a big Necromunda fan (though I've never given as much thought into strategy as you obviously have - for example, I love playing Goliath [though I do admit their skills suck] if only to give MST Space Mutiny inspired names such as "Big McLargehuge", "Brute Hardnose" and "Beef Manhandle").

Any chance you could get a copy of the map and post it up?  I'm having a hard time envisioning the loayout of territories.

Incidentally, something I did that's a lot of fun when fighting over tunnels/vents territories is to lay the various pieces flat on the game table, with only some raised sections.  Basically, only that terrain is passable - everything else is walls (and thus blocks LOS).  Does make for some very interesting, clausterphobic games - be sure to put some long corridors (but make them flankable) as otherwise shooting gangs are hosed.  You may need to come up with some alternate rules for tunnels/vents when fighting IN tunnels/vents, as the ones in the rule book don't make much sense (and may be too powerful/weak if essentially 90% of the map is at ground level).

Anyway, look forward to hearing further how it goes.


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Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2011, 05:51:40 AM »
Quote
Any chance you could get a copy of the map and post it up?  I'm having a hard time envisioning the loayout of territories.

 
Done.  Wish I'd done it from the start, it would have saved me a lot of writing in that second post.

It's good to hear that people are enjoying it.

Quote
Incidentally, something I did that's a lot of fun when fighting over tunnels/vents territories is to lay the various pieces flat on the game table, with only some raised sections.  Basically, only that terrain is passable - everything else is walls (and thus blocks LOS).  Does make for some very interesting, clausterphobic games - be sure to put some long corridors (but make them flankable) as otherwise shooting gangs are hosed.  You may need to come up with some alternate rules for tunnels/vents when fighting IN tunnels/vents, as the ones in the rule book don't make much sense (and may be too powerful/weak if essentially 90% of the map is at ground level).

I was thinking of using Space Hulk terrain for vents or tunnels games, but what you suggested is a good idea and might wrk really well with some of the terrain pieces we have.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2011, 06:05:21 AM by Underhand »

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2011, 02:58:19 PM »
Space hulk terrain would work great (I didn't/don't have any), especially if combined with the regular stuff for changes of elevation in the tunnel/vent.

Thanks for the maps - they help a lot.  The only thing I would change is to put thick black borders around the outsides of the starting territories of each gang (so, not there they border their own territories, but where they border enemies/neutrals).  That will really help tell who is gaining/loosing, and which gangs are simply migrating.

Anyway, look forward to reading your next installment - incidentally, this is the first thread I've ever asked for thread notification on in my 5 or so years here. 8)

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Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #13 on: July 16, 2011, 08:58:03 PM »
Here's where my gang is at after a single campaign turn.  And it is glorious:

Abraham: Leader:
M   WSBSS   T   W   A   I    LD Skills
4453411 48Nerves of Steel     -  Both good upgrades.  Toughness is always useful and BS will always get used.  I would have preferred +1Ws, but BS is fine.
Jacob: Heavy:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
4343411 37+1BS is the exact upgrade you want on a Heavy.  I never roll BS upgrades on my Heavies.  This makes me very happy. +1T is also always good.
Isaac: Heavy:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
4433311 37Medic   - +1WS is a decent upgrade fo a flamer heavy since he'll be getting close to the enemy.  Medic is always handy.
Hezron: Ganger:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
4333311 38 -       -  +1 Ld.  Meh.  He'll stick with a Lasgun and stay out of fights.
Ram: Ganger:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
4333311 37Armourer  - Always good to have an armourer in the Gang.  He'll stay up the back too.
Boaz: Ganger:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
4333311 37Specialist, Old Battle Wound  - Hell Yeah! That's 2 flamers in the gang now.  That will allow me to upgrade Isaac to a ranged heavy weapon down the track, if I feel like it.
Uriah: Ganger:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills/Injuries
4333311 37Killer Reputation, Arm Wound  -  Meh.  Might come in handy later depending on what other upgrades he gets.  He'll stick with the shotgun for now.
Abijah:  Juve:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
43333123 6Impetuous, Nerves of Steel  - A Juve no longer.  All good upgrades.  He'll stay with one of the close assault teams.
Asa: Juve:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
4333421 46Impetuous  - 2 games in and this little bastard has turned into quite the little combat monster.
Amon: Juve:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
4233311 56True Grit  - I like True Grit, but +2I is pretty sucky. +1BS is always handy. 
Josiah: Juve:
M   WSBSS   T   A   W   I    LD Skills
4223331 37Parry - I rolled the +2A first, so I decided to go with a Combat skill after that, and got Parry, which is nice.  Even with WS2, this guy will be a handfull in close combat.

Overall I'm pretty happy with the upgrades.  The most beneficial are the +1BS to my Stubber Heavy (if the Flamer heavy had got it instead, I would have swapped their weapons), and the Specialist upgrade to Boaz.  The Specialist upgrade is really helpful to any Gang, but will be of particular benefit to my Gang now that we have huseruled handflamers down to using the old small sized 4" template.  That will let me use my 90's edition Redemptionist Flamer Deacon model. Sweet.  Like I said before - if you get the chance to roll on the Techno skill table, particulalry if you aren't Van Saar, then you should take it.  Because of that, I now have a Specialist, an armourer and a medic - all of which are good upgrades.

Thanks to that 3 way game we had (underdog bonus of +9xp), all of my Juves are now Gangers, so I was able to get income from all of my territories (185 altogether, which translates down to 65).  I purchased a flamer and two swords leaving me with 5 creds in the stash.  The swords go to my flamer heavy (who will get targeted by enemy close combat troops and Josiah, the Juve with the 3 Attacks and the Parry skill (man, I hope he gets a WS upgrade at some point).

Overall, I like where I'm sitting.  I would have liked to have a couple more gangers get upgrades that would see them on the way to becoming close comat specialists, but I an't complain about my Heavy getting BS4 and getting a specialist.  My plan to take a lot of Juves and have them advance quickly worked out just great, and they are all (except Amon) on their way to surpassing my starting gangers.

Strategy for next turn:
That Gambling Den to the East is too nice to pass up.  The only players that share a border with it are the Goliath and the Orlocks, who are both the least experienced players.  The rules we have are that the fist dibs on defending a neutral territory are that the players who border it get to defend it, and only after they have passed up the chance, does someone else get to have a go at it (which would be a courageos decision due to the rule preventing gangers who are assigned to a territory more than a single tile away being able to take part in the defence of a territory, making it difficult to defend (maybe 5 gang members would be available).  Anyone who drops their name into the hat to attack it, will also take part in the fight.

I reckon, that if I broadcast my intention to go for the Gambling Den, the Goliath player won't attempt to attack it (he''ll go after the Orlock Mine Workings), and probably won't even put his hand up to defend it. 

I'll crush the Orlock player easily.  In fact, I'll probably have to hold back to not embarrass him (arrogance makes me feel awesome).  Due to that 3 way game between me, the Delaque and the Escher, I have a way higher gang rating than the Orlock - He only has 8 gangers after one of them died last game, and he's loaded them up with grenades and meltaguns and all sorts of stupid overpriced stuff.  It would actually be a bad choice for him to even try to defend against my attack.

I should stress - it's not like I'm victimising the new kid or anything - it's a neutral territory that is up for grabs - it's not like I'm stealing his lunch money or anything.

The only drawback to that plan is that it will stretch me out pretty thin.  If the Escher player goes after my Old Ruins to the West, then I won't have many guys to defend against it.  But, I don't think that's likely - he'll go straight for the Delaque like he's on Jihad.  It's not like the Old Ruins are a tempting target or anything either.  even if I were to lose them - so what?  10 creds per turn - not much of a loss - once I have the Gambling Den, I'd prefer to have that extra ganger searching the trading post anyway.

After next turn, regardless of anything else, I need to bring in some new recruits - numbers count in Necromunda, and 11 guys isn't many.  Normally, I would recruit one Juve per turn, but this time I had to seize the chance to get the flamer as quickly as possibe, and swords are simply a mandatory item for a close combat gang.

I'm looking good.

« Last Edit: July 16, 2011, 09:03:32 PM by Underhand »

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2011, 02:24:51 AM »
Those are the awesome upgrades.

And I don't think the +2I is as bad as you make it out, especially when combined with the +1BS.  Give him a lasgun or autogun, and put him on the tallest thing you can find - with I 5 you have little worry of him falling to his death, and chances are the extra height will help you get lines of sight that you might otherwise not be able to cover.  Such a tactic also combines nicely with true grit. Plus, with all those vents, its easy to get him there.   

And wow, I've never seen a leader get 3 upgrades in 2 fights before...


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Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2011, 03:50:38 AM »
Quote
And I don't think the +2I is as bad as you make it out, especially when combined with the +1BS.  Give him a lasgun or autogun, and put him on the tallest thing you can find - with I 5 you have little worry of him falling to his death, and chances are the extra height will help you get lines of sight that you might otherwise not be able to cover.  Plus, with all those vents, its easy to get him there.

Maybe.  It's useful for pinning too, I guess - not a bad combination with True Grit.  I'd still prefer just about anythig else except leadership.

Quote
And wow, I've never seen a leader get 3 upgrades in 2 fights before...
My leader has 122xp - he started off with 62, got 24 from the first fight (10 for winning, inflicted two wounds on the enemy and rolled a 4 for xp), the second, he inflicted 3 wounds, got 10 for winning, 9 for the Underdog bonus and rolled a 6).  So he's on his way.  The Underdog bonus from the three way fight is what makes the difference.  It's also the benefit of using small unit tactics - the other gangers pick off the nasty targets, and he runs in and dispatches the softer ones in Hand to Hand.  I really would have preferred if he'd got a CC increase instead of those others - Leaders are best when they are close to the rest of your gang so that they can provide the leadership bonuses, and since most of my guys will be running forward to the enemy, any extra CC ability would help nicely.

Anyway - onto round 2:

Campaign Movement:

Here is the map at the end of turn 1:




Cawdor
Escher
Delaque
Van Saar
Orlock
Goliath


I elected to go East towards the Gambling Den.  I told the Goliath player ahead of time as a courtesy so that he would have the option of spending his attacking move to go after a softer target (like the Orlock) rather than waste it in a fight against me.  He thanks me for the heads up and tells me that he was planning to go after the Orlock anyway.  A good kid.  The Orlock player is a few years older, and is tough enough to eat his vegetables.

Escher:
The Escher player went first and attacked the Vents of the Delaque palyer.  The fight was an absolute slugfest.  It ended well after both sides should have voluntarily bottled out.  The Delaque finally bottled out with only their heavy and a ganger still standing.  The Escher had their Leader and four gangers (all wounded) on their feet.  Both sides would have generated about 70pts worth of experience each just from wounding each other.

Delaque:

The second fight was between the Delaque and the Escher, with the Delaque going after he Escher Spore Cave.  That fight wasn't so close.  The Escher player hired a Scummer and a Ratskin Scout and simply rolled the Delaque.  The Ratskin scout infiltrated and took out the Delaque heavy (the guy I ransomed) in the second turn and it was pretty much over from there.  Delaque are better in the mid to late part of the campaign, once their stealth and shooting skills kick in.  The Escher, with their swords can make mince meat of most gangs early on if they can get in close, which they were able to do this time after the Stubber Heavy was taken out.  The Escher took the Delaque vents.

The rule is that if you attack someone and lose 3 times as many caualties as you take, then you get to pick which territory you lose - unless your opponent attempted to attack you in the same turn, in which case they get the option of choosing between the territory chosen by the defeated attacker or any other territory bordering the attacker.

Van Saar:
The Van Saar player went after the Delaque workshop (the previously neutral one) and got slapped down.  It was a scavengers scenario though, so he still came out alright in the end.

Orlock:
The Orlock player went after the Van Saar Settlement to his North and the players elected for a Gang Fight.  The Orlock player got the better of the first couple of turns due to both good dice rolling and having just about every single advance he's rolled so far either being a +1BS or a shooting skill, whereas, the Van Saar player has been pretty spread out (and hasn't yet discovered the value of Techno skills - which is to everyone else's benefit).  The Van Saar player voluntarily bottled out with 4 of his guys down, leaving the Settlement to the Orlock.

Goliath:
The Goliath player surprised me by going for the Orlock Settlement.  He told me later that he did this because:
 1.  The Orlock player is a softer target than me, and he backs himself against him;
2.  He wants to build up territories which aren't bordering mine;
3.  Settlements -Woohoo, free Juves!
4.  Why get into trench warfare in the middle of the board when there are easy pickings on the outside?
5.  The Orlock player isn't even close to being a serious contender for this campaign and deserves to be put out of his misery at the earliest possible opportunity so he can stop wasting everybody's time.

Huh.  Okay.

Anyway, the Goliath player dusted up the Orlock player.  I gave advice to the Goliath player, and the Delaque player gave advice to the Orlock player.

Goliath vs Orlock games always take me back to my earliest games of Necromunda (they were what came in the box).  Simpler times.  A good game.  Anyway - the Goliath won for the exact same reason that I beat the Orlock - numbers.  The Goliath palyer is a good study, and he's really enjoying the game.  He says he already understands the weaknesses of the Goliath (Muscle -ugh), and that he intends to buy either an Escher or Van Saar Gang after this campaign.  The Goliath have 13 models in their gang, the Orlock have 8 - it was only ever going to go one way .

The Orlock leader (meltagun guy, lol) was the first to go, and it was all downhill from there.  The only Goliath gang member to go down was a lasgunner (the kid learnt to buy lasguns after the first fight).  3 Orlock down, 1 Goliath, and the Orlocks bottled out.

I went last, and I went straight for the Gambling Den.  Both the Orlocks and the Orlocks elected to defend it.  I had thought the Goliath would let it go, but no matter.

Third Fight:

Gang Fight scenario.  The Delaque player advised the Orlock player and the Escher player advised the Goliath player (but encouraged them both to double team me).

Easily the toughest game so far.  The Orlock, at this stage, are a weak gang overall, but are good at shooting.  They would be easy to outflank and overwhelm with my gang due to their lack of numbers.  With the Goliath present (and not attacking them), they can castle up a bit more and let their Heavy and their lasgun marksmen pick me off, while their less useful gangers soak up the bullets due to the old 2nd edition rules which require you to shoot at the nearest target.

The Goliath on the other hand, due to their lack of mobility are the easiest gang to pick off as they try to get close.  There is also little to lose by getting into a shooting match with them because they shoot only slightly better than Orks.  Nevertheless, once they actually get into close combat, they are pretty tough (better than me at this stage - the kid has gone for combat skills), and they don't run.

Altogether, I was up against an enemy which had a pretty good ranged component and a solid, if ponderous close attack component.  But I had 2 flamers and 4 hand flamers.

My ranged group (Heavy Stubber and 2 lasgunners) took out one Orlock and Goliath throughout the course of the game and spent most of their time pinned or down.  That was due to the superior Orlock ranged firepower.

My close combat teams did a lot better - they tore the throat out of the Goliath.  In turn 3, the first team took down 3 Goliath, in turn 4 the second team took down 2 and my leader took down another one.  In turn 5, I lost two of my guys and took out their leader, a ganger and a juve, causing them to bottle.

At that point, it was my gang of 6 (Leader, flamer heavy, flamer specialist, and three gangers against 6 Orlock (Leader, Heavy Stubber, Lasgun Marksman, Lasgun Rapid Fire, Lasgun Rapid fire, Lasgun BS4 and Autogun BS4), with a half a table to get across - and Necromunda only has M4 too.  And I was out of ammo for my hand flamers.

This is where the weakness of handflamers becomes apparent.  In a two gang fight, Handflamers (even with our house rules which greatly reduce their range), are an okay investment - if you get into range (which is easy enough with vents, agility skills and a bit of finesse) then you have a single shot at a better than 50% chance of smoking an enemy ganger - so it's an even trade for 25creds.  However - when you are up against two opponents, suddenly that one shot factor comes into play. 

I had burned all 4 of my handflamers on the Goliath player (and handed him his own arse in doing so), and had taken out 3 of his guys - a modest to average result, and was left with only stubguns to deal with the superior shooting of the Orlock.

A bit of a bloodbath.  I lost my leader and both gangers before I managed to sandwich half his gang between both flamers and send Josiah into close combat with his Heavy, causing them to bottle out.

In the end, I got the territory, and a amphetamine parrot load of exp for my gang . . . but I don't like how it looks from here.  Before this game, I had everyone except the Delaque palyer running scared of me  - it was only due to the urging of the Escher player that either the Orlock player or the Goliath layer decided to stand against me, and even then, only as an alliance. 

During the game though - even when I ws concentrating on fighting against the Goliath, there were some tight moments where it could have tipped either way (such is the dramatic nature of Necromunda).  In this game, both of the newbies drew some blood - and its obvious that they have made friends with the Escher player (no doubt their mutual interest in pokemon, Justin Beiber, or whatever the hell it is that the kids are into today has allowed them to find some common ground despite the Escher player being a complete prick). 

After the Goliath had bottled out, the Goliath player was over the other side of the table advising the Orlock player how to beat me (the kid can work out probability in his head like a snake on a plane). They  walked away from that fight feeling like they had won (which the Escher player was telling them they had).  Any animosity that there might have been between the Orlock towards the Goliath for taking his settlement is gone.  Those two are stuck together like glue now.  It's good to see positive emotions being generated from one end of the campaign map to balance out the pure hatred and ill will at the other end between the Escher and Delaque, but it doesn't necessarily bode well for me.

I forsee the exact same fight happening in the next round - Cawdor versus Goliath and Orlock.  Both of them will attack the Gambling Den.  I won't bother with income from the slag and Old Ruins - I'll stick extra guys to the west of my area, and beslubber it if the Escher want to try to take my Old Ruins.

Thoughts:

It's all down to that Escher player - he is pissed about losing that 3 way in the first round (people who know nothing about Necromunda are giving him amphetamine parrot about it) - he's stuck between me and the Delaque player, and if we ever cobine against him, he's beslubbered.  His only option is to organise some sort of resistance against us from the other players, and he's managed to get some traction with the Orlock and Goliath.  With both of them slamming into me, each turn, he can concentrate on the Delaque - and now that he has their Vents, that will get a lot easier.

In case anyone needs an image to put in their head - the Escher player bears a striking resemblance to the actor who played Joffrey in the Game of Thrones series by HBO.  He shares certain personality characteristics as well.

I'm actually worried about what the Escher can achieve with Vents.  He's talking about stocking up on handflamers because 'they're so OP' (which isn't true with the house rule reducing their range), but I don't think he will - seeing him advise the Orlock player, and seeing him play against the Delaque, I think he will use them as a combination of sniper/melee/melee and plonk all three of them down together.  The little rather unsavoury chap, what-ho old bean? knows how to deploy properly in Necromunda, and I've never seen him make too many mistakes in 40k (used to play Chaos Marines, now plays Space Wolves).   Against the Delaque, he put that Ratskin scout in the exact best location to take out the Delaque Heavy.  My 3 vents gave me a massive advantage over everyone else (it's the vents which accentuated  the value of the hand flamers - on their own the hand flamers aren't that fantastic), that advantage will be sharply reduced against the Escher next time we fight.

I'm definitely winning this campaign at the moment, but I get the feeling that while I might have gained a valuable territory in this round,  I think I might have galvanised my neighbours against me.   Time will tell.

This is the map at the bottom of turn 2 (with lighter shades of colour for the newly gained territories):



Cawdor
Escher
Delaque
Van Saar
Orlock
Goliath

« Last Edit: July 17, 2011, 05:28:27 AM by Underhand »

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #16 on: July 18, 2011, 10:50:10 PM »
You may be in danger of having expanded too fast too early. Maybe you can get the Van Saar on your side?
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Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2011, 06:06:56 AM »
Quote
You may be in danger of having expanded too fast too early.
I think you are right, in that I'm definitely a bit overstretched at the moment, but I also think that I didn't have much other choice.  I had to go after some high earnining territories early to compensate for my worthless ones.  If I'd hung back, I would have just ended up with less money and less experience for my gang.  Even if I lose that Gambling Den next turn, at least I'll have gained a turn's income from it, and denied it to someone else for a while.

The main disadvantage of expanding so fast is that I've painted a target on my back.  The Goliath and the Orlock are definitely going to double team me, and there is always the possibility that the Escher might turn on me at any second. 

I would have been better off last turn if I'd gone for the Goliath Settlement instead of the Neutral Gambling Den.  That would have left me with much more defendable borders and would have made it harder for the Orlock to commit numbers against me next turn.

Hindsight.

Quote
Maybe you can get the Van Saar on your side?
Good suggestion - that's what I was going to do. 

Unfortunately, the Van Saar player has been banned, possibly permanently from the store.  He's a South African expat, and get's riled up easily and the store managed to finally decipher his accent and worked out what he was talking about when he started ranting about the "Facking Blecks".  So he's been told to beslubber off for a while, and we had to delay turn 3 of the campaign while we work out what to do about him.

We might just declare his territory off limits for a turn, or have someone sub in for him.  Either way, I'm kind of beslubbered since if he isn't there, then there won't be anyone to attack the Orlock from behind, since the Delaque player is pretty sprawled out at the moment, and if we do replace him, it will probably be with one of the mates of the Goliath, Orlock or Joffrey, who won't be any help to me at all.

So basically, it looks like I have to decide between asking the store management to let in apartheid appologist back into the store or having my arse kicked for a couple of turns by some little upstarts who were barely even born when the game came out.

. . .

You know - the Van Saar guy was really just voicing a personal opinion about the internal politics of his homeland - it wasn't like he was necessarily expressing a view on race relations in general.  I mean - unless you've actually been there, it's kind of hard to judge someone when they're having a bad moment . . .

Principles, schminciples.  I want to win this thing.

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #18 on: July 26, 2011, 12:43:11 AM »
Very nice campaign rules.  I've been toying with the idea of trying to run a Necromunda campaign at my local GW for a few years, but I just haven't had the time.  I might look at using a modified version of these rules if/when I get around to starting that campaign.

Something that might be cool would be to have the neutral territories controlled by the Enforcers.  A 7th player (or the campaign organizer, if they're not participating in the campaign) could control the Enforcers to fight off "gang incursions" into neutral ground.  This way you wouldn't have random other gangs fighting them.

To encourage players to attack each other instead of going after the neutral territories early on the Enforcers could also be allowed to field a full squad of 10 men, regardless of the value of the opposing gang.  Or give them access to a Chimera-like "SWAT Van" for extra support.

Offline Underhand

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Re: Rules for a Necromunda Campaign
« Reply #19 on: July 26, 2011, 05:37:03 AM »
I actually thought about doing something like that but eventually decided against it.

The advantage of having the middle empty is that it encourages everyone to dive in and butt heads.  If the middle was already occupied (particularly if occupied by a strong force), then it would greatly cut down on the chances of a player ever fighting anyone but a next door neighbour, which might get a bit repetitive for a while.

There would also be the problem of whoever was playing the Enforcers having to play five or six games per week while everyone else only plays once.

I'm toying around with introducing some other gangs now, since there are other people in the store taking an interest.

It might be interesting to just drop an enforcer gang onto one of the map tiles and have them move about randomly (with modifiers based on stuff like who controls the adjacent territories and how much they are worth).  Regular outlaw gangs could just be bolted onto the edge of the map somewhere, and spyrers could go anywhere.  I haven't come to a concluded view yet.

 


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