Topic: 2000pt Waveserpent Spam

[Tweedz]

I have always been a fan of vehicles in any army I play, so I was quite happy to see that my favorite playstyle from 6th might make a comeback. Here is my first attempt at a vehicle-heavy list.

I am debating the use of Fuegan and the hemlock, but as of right now I have not come up with a better use of the points.

Battalion Detachment:
HQ:
Warlock: Witchblade
 
Troops:
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
 
Dedicated Transports:
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines
 
Flyer:
Hemlock Wraithfighter: 2 Heavy D-scythes
 
Spearhead Detachment:
HQ:
Fuegan
 
Elites:
5x Fire Dragons: Exarch, Firepike, Fusion guns
5x Fire Dragons: Exarch, Firepike, Fusion guns
5x Fire Dragons: Exarch, Firepike, Fusion guns
 
Dedicated Transports:
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines

Total: 2001 pts

Post Merge: June 22, 2017, 03:52:43 AM
In the future, please use the modify button. Double posting is against the forum rules, and for that reason, the system merged your posts.Annnnd I just noticed that a battalion requires 2 HQ.... so I am going to have to free up some points somewhere.

[Blazinghand]

In terms of fitting this list into 2k points, one option is to drop the spearhead detachment and roll everything into a single battalion. Battalion allows for the 2 HQ, 3 Troops, 3 Elites, 1 Flyer, and numerous dedicated transports currently in your list.

Hemlock wraithfighter is currently considered very good, one of the more points-efficient units at our disposal, but I've never played with it so I can't comment.

Another option if you think Fuegan is too expensive is to instead take an foot-Autarch with a Power Sword and a Fusion Gun.

Autarch Pros:
Autarch saves you about 70 points, allowing you to potentially buy another cheap HQ.
Fusion Gun has a similar statline to Firepike, and you'll likely get the shots you want with a transport.
Autarch's Path of Command is better than Fuegan's Unflinching Focus, applying to more models and also to melee.
Autach is reasonably respectable in melee.

Autarch Cons:
Firepike is more likely to get the melta effect
Fuegan is actually quite solid in melee
Fuegan will probably be hanging out with fire dragons anyways so his Unflinching Focus isn't that much worse.
Feugan is quite a bit more durable


I suspect that, despite generally being worse, the Autarch would hold up respectably and free up must-needed points. Fuegan seems fine too.

[SeekingOne]

@Tweedz

Imho, in the context of 8th edition rules that's actually a very solid list overall. I have just a few comments to make:

1. As you noticed yourself, you need 2 HQ for a Batallion detachment. Now, don't forget that you already get 3 command points just for being battle-forged, and then there's +3 points for Batallion. In my experience so far 6 command points is a very solid number, and an extra +1 point from Spearhead is really not worth squeezing an extra detachment into the army. Therefore, as Blazinghand already suggested, I'd merge everything into a single Batallion, instantly fulfilling all requirements.

2. Hemlocks are fantastic (this comes from practice). From the pure efficiency POV, I'd even be tempted to drop one squad of Dragons with their transport and replace them with a second Hemlock. They are good vs enemy flyers, which might be a bit difficult to take out otherwise. The only comparable replacement for a Hemlock is a squad of Dark Reapers.

3. Vectored engines are not worth it imho. Utilising them forces you to Advance, and that imposes -1 hit penalty - but with that many Serpents in your list you want them all shooting at full capacity. I'd only put VE on a Serpent tasked with carrying a highly expensive melee unit straight into the heart of enemy position, where survival of a WS is more important than its damage output.

4. Fuegan might not be the most points-efficient character, but having him at the head of FD is at least very characterful

[Tweedz]

Great call on the detachment guys, not sure why I did not think of that. And it does give me the leeway to play with the list more as I am not required to have 3 groups of dragons. Going off of this, here is the variation I came up with:

Battalion Detachment:
HQ:
Fuegan
Warlock: Witchblade
 
Troops:
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
 
Dedicated Transports:
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones

Elites:
5x Fire Dragons: Exarch, Firepike, Fusion guns
5x Fire Dragons: Exarch, Firepike, Fusion guns

Dedicated Transports:
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines
 
Flyer:
Hemlock Wraithfighter: 2 Heavy D-scythes
Hemlock Wraithfighter: 2 Heavy D-scythes
 
Total: 1964 pts


In this case, I worry somewhat about putting all my dragons in one serpent but from everything I hear and read about serpents, it should get them where they need to be. I have some more points to play with here in terms of adding wargear, heavy weapons, or adding vectored engines back onto the guardian's serpents.


Variation #2 involves staying at 3 guardian squads, downgrading fuegen to an autarch, and then seeing what I can do with the remaining points:

Battalion Detachment:
HQ:
Autarch: Powersword, Fusion Gun
Warlock: Witchblade
 
Troops:
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
10x Guardian Defenders, Catapults
 
Dedicated Transports:
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones

Elites:
5x Fire Dragons: Exarch, Firepike, Fusion guns
5x Fire Dragons: Exarch, Firepike, Fusion guns

Dedicated Transports:
Wave Serpent: Shuriken Cannon, Twin-linked SC, Spirit Stones, Vectored Engines
 
Flyer:
Hemlock Wraithfighter: 2 Heavy D-scythes
Hemlock Wraithfighter: 2 Heavy D-scythes

Heavy Support:
Nightspinner: CTM
Nightspinner: CTM
OR
2x Warwalker: Shuriken Cannon
2x Warwalker: Shuriken Cannon

Total: 1997 pts

[SeekingOne]

@Tweedz
I applaud your solution, this second variant a cool list indeed and I'd be happy to try it myself! Don't have that many painted Guardians though...

In regards to the Dragon WS, depending on the kind of terrain you have available, you can still try and deploy it in cover. A decently sizeable ruin can still contain a Serpent and have it covered from the front.