Topic: Space Wolves Legion, one of the smallest?

[Swamp Rat]

I was just wondering if the Space Wolves had one of the smallest Legions, seeing as how they only split into the Space Wolves and the other (I can't remember the name) one. Now, looking at the fluff in the Codex, the most amount of Wolves in the chapter will be roughly around 2600, including auxillaries like Iron Wolves and Wolf Priests. But thats the modern day chapter, does anyone know any numbers for the other Space Wolves chapter? If we assume it has a similar set up, then theres around 5200 Space Wolves, would there have been any massive differences when it was a Legion?

[Lachdonin]

The Space Wolves were not One of the smallest, they were The smallest legion.

The general range for the numbers of a Legion runs between 10,000 and 100,000, depending on the source and the Legion in question, so for Wolves i would assume that their numbers would be below 10k. The exact number, however, has never been given.

Bear in mind also that, initially, the Space Wolves had no successor chapters. This was only changed later, and I've heard 1-2 for the second founding, and maybe a handful since.

[iChuckles]

The Space Wolves were not One of the smallest, they were The smallest legion.

Depends when you're talking about. At one point the Emperor's Children were by a looooooong way the smallest Legion.

[Lachdonin]

And at one point the Raven Guard were almost wiped out, rendering them the smallest. However, on the whole, and at the peak of their power, the Space Wolves were still considerably smaller than other legions in comparable states. An almost destroyed legion, or a legion still being populated are not, in my mind, relevant examples, as using the same logic you could argue that the Ultramarines were one of the smallest chapters as long as you took your figures from directly after the battle for Macragg.

[Benis]

The Space Wolves were not One of the smallest, they were The smallest legion.

A source for this claim would be nice.

Bear in mind also that, initially, the Space Wolves had no successor chapters. This was only changed later, and I've heard 1-2 for the second founding, and maybe a handful since.

They only had one successor chapter, the Wolf Brothers who has been disbanded due to genetic instability.

I would say the reason Space Wolves are so small (for a legion) today is due to the fact that they have decreased their rate of recruitment to make sure that they are not considered to be a legion sized threat. Considering the dangers Blood Claws go through to become initiates it probably isn't much of a problem to make sure your population does not rise to a threatening level for the Space Wolves.

[Deloth Vyrr]

Didnt the Thousand Sons only have 1000 members?

[Benis]

Didnt the Thousand Sons only have 1000 members?

Initially yes, but when Magnus was found they were able to use his genetic material to stabilise the legion's gene-seed and produce successful Initiates.

[iHymirl]

I was just wondering if the Space Wolves had one of the smallest Legions, seeing as how they only split into the Space Wolves and the other (I can't remember the name) one.

The reason the Space Wolves didn't split into chapters had nothing to do with their size or number of fighting men, it was directly because Leman Russ told Guilliman to take a long walk off a short pier at the suggestion of spliting his legion up and didn't follow what all the others did.

As to size bear in mind that the modern size of the Space Wolves isn't automatically the same as what it was at the time of the heresy. Its quite likely that they have less numbers than they used to.

As to the smallest it would have varied depending on which time you looked at it, the Ravenguard and Salamanders where horrifically mauled in the heresy and the Iron Hands wheren't doing massively well either. As far as I'm aware there aren't any refereces to the Space Wolves being noticably less numerous any of the other legions.

[Irandrura]

Depends when you're talking about. At one point the Emperor's Children were by a looooooong way the smallest Legion.

At their founding, there were two hundred Emperor's Children. You are correct. At that point they were the smallest by far.

And at one point the Raven Guard were almost wiped out, rendering them the smallest.

I don't believe we have any solid figures on what they were reduced to then. It might not have been less than two hundred. I would imagine it was not. The entire Legion could not have been sent into battle at Istvaan.

and at the peak of their power, the Space Wolves were still considerably smaller than other legions in comparable states.

What's the reference for this? I can't remember reading anything on the size of the Space Wolf Legion.

[Horus, former a Dark Lord]

i think we'll never know the exact number of Wolves.
Simply because the following exchange is common of their mindset:
Functionary: Hello, I'm from the Imperial census. We're here to count the number of Warriors you have under the Codex Astartes.
Logan Grimnar: That's nice. Bugger off.

[Koval, the Overfiend]

As to the smallest it would have varied depending on which time you looked at it, the Ravenguard and Salamanders where horrifically mauled in the heresy and the Iron Hands wheren't doing massively well either.

Think there was a source a while ago (can't cite it, it might have been in either the current Codex: Chaos or the previous one, or it might've been in an old WD) that suggested that there were five Space Marines left out of those three Legions, or at least out of however many from those Legions had gone to Istvaan.

[Benis]

It is mentioned in Codex: Chaos Space Marines edition 3.5:

The details of what has become known as the Istvaan V Drop Site Massacre are vague, for only a handful of Space Marines survived.

I've always seen it as hyperbole but, compared to their original size, it must have felt like they were only a handful left.

[Sir_Godspeed]

Compared to their original sizes, even several hundred up to a few thousand remaining marines of each legion would be absolutely devastating.